In last 4 years, how many runs had a team scored in 50 overs to be able to defend it?

[W63L35]

Chart below shows the 1st innings scores in ODIs from 2015 to 2018 played in England. Only completed innings (50 overs) are listed.

Simply put.....

If the team scored greater than 321: Won 12 - lost 2.
If the team scored 298 - 321: Won 3 - lost 5.
If the team scored less than 289: Won 0 - Lost 10.

So the teams scoring less than 322 runs in the first innings have a losing record of:

Won: 3
Lost: 15


Still hopeful that Pakistan will win more than 3-4 matches in this WC?

Let's thank Inzi for selecting Malik, Hafeez and Imam!

 

[Chokli]

Who would be in place of Hafeez, Malik and Imam?

 

[W63L35]

@Mods
Please fix the title of the thread.
Replace "year/ year" with "years"

 

[W63L35]

Who would be in place of Hafeez, Malik and Imam?

Great question......
That also needs to be answered by Inzi Bhai..... who never played/tried the batmen who could score at a S/R of more than 75. Had he tried a few, I would have gladly answered your question.

 

[Cric1234]

Who would be in place of Hafeez, Malik and Imam?

Akmal Khushdil and another batsman with 90 plus strike rate.

 

[Ronaldo7]

Yes. Still hopeful. The plan is to bowl the other team out quickly and chase the target.

 

[W63L35]

Yes. Still hopeful. The plan is to bowl the other team out quickly and chase the target.

I love optimistic people who always see glass 1/2 full!

 

[Major]

funny how OP wont critisize sarfraz

 

[Ronaldo7]

I love optimistic people who always see glass 1/2 full!

We only need 1/2 "flukes" and 4 wins against lower ranked teams to go through. So isn't my optismism justified?

 

[adzzy786]

funny how OP wont critisize sarfraz

I’m still trying to understand the title

 

[W63L35]

funny how OP wont critisize sarfraz

Sarfraz was NEVER a specialist batsman like Guilchrist, Dhoni, DeKock etc before he got selected for Pakistani ODI team. If team management/selectors want him to play at #6 as a batsman, then that is their fault. His primary skills are keeping and captaincy.

Malik, Hafeez and Imam are being selected are specialist batsmen. They need to prove their worth to the team. Sarfraz is already 2 skills ahead of all three of them.

If Sarfraz is removed from captaincy, I would want a better batsman that Sarfraz behind the stumps.

 

[Chokli]

I’m still trying to understand the title

your post made me laugh more than it should have but the OP made a mistake.

@Mods
Please fix the title of the thread.
Replace "year/ year" with "years"

 

[W63L35]

We only need 1/2 "flukes" and 4 wins against lower ranked teams to go through. So isn't my optismism justified?

Which 4 lower ranked teams?
Which other 1/2 wins?

 

[Chokli]

Which 4 lower ranked teams?
Which other 1/2 wins?

West Indies, Sri Lanka, Afghanistan & Bangladesh

One or two wins against England, Australia, India, South Africa, New Zealand

 

[Major]

Sarfraz was NEVER a specialist batsman like Guilchrist, Dhoni, DeKock etc before he got selected for Pakistani ODI team. If team management/selectors want him to play at #6 as a batsman, then that is their fault. His primary skills are keeping and captaincy.

Malik, Hafeez and Imam are being selected are specialist batsmen. They need to prove their worth to the team. Sarfraz is already 2 skills ahead of all three of them.

If Sarfraz is removed from captaincy, I would want a better batsman that Sarfraz behind the stumps.

Sarfraz was selected in the team due to wicket keeping and his batting.

WOrld Cup 2015 is the best example of it. There was hue and cry that he was a better batsmen and should play.

Rizwan is a better keeper and batsmen

 

[Justcrazy]

Sarfraz was NEVER a specialist batsman like Guilchrist, Dhoni, DeKock etc before he got selected for Pakistani ODI team. If team management/selectors want him to play at #6 as a batsman, then that is their fault. His primary skills are keeping and captaincy.

Malik, Hafeez and Imam are being selected are specialist batsmen. They need to prove their worth to the team. Sarfraz is already 2 skills ahead of all three of them.

If Sarfraz is removed from captaincy, I would want a better batsman that Sarfraz behind the stumps.

I agree , Sarfaraz is not good enough to be in the playing XI.

Pakistan should have thought out of Box , maybe make Abid Ali keep. He has been keeping regularly in List A games. Instead of Sarfaraz add a batting all rounder. The overall strength of team will improve

 

[W63L35]

West Indies, Sri Lanka, Afghanistan & Bangladesh

I don't see us winning aal 4 matches.

One or two wins against England, Australia, India, South Africa, New Zealand

Given the 4 year history (OP), will Pakistan score 322+ runs against any of these teams if batting first? Or even chase ....320+ scores?

 

[W63L35]

Sarfraz was selected in the team due to wicket keeping and his batting.

WOrld Cup 2015 is the best example of it. There was hue and cry that he was a better batsmen and should play.

which clueless captain and selectors labelled/selected Sarfraz as a "batsman"?

Rizwan is a better keeper and batsmen

better Batsman, yes!
better Keeper, no!

 

[ElRaja]

Chart below shows the 1st innings scores in ODIs from 2015 to 2018 played in England. Only completed innings (50 overs) are listed.

Simply put.....

If the team scored greater than 321: Won 12 - lost 2.
If the team scored 298 - 321: Won 3 - lost 5.
If the team scored less than 289: Won 0 - Lost 10.

So the teams scoring less than 322 runs in the first innings have a losing record of:

Won: 3
Lost: 15


Still hopeful that Pakistan will win more than 3-4 matches in this WC?

Let's thank Inzi for selecting Malik, Hafeez and Imam!

View attachment 90726

so what your saying is if we dismiss the opposition for under 289, victory is guaranteed

 

[W63L35]

so what your saying is if we dismiss the opposition for under 289, victory is guaranteed

For that you have to also look at how many times Pakistan has been able to chase 289 in the 2nd innings.

History only indicates the probability/likelihood of what's is going to happen...or might happen!

Pakistan very well might chase it.... but upsets do also happen.

 

[Arsalan Pro]

I don't see us winning aal 4 matches.



Given the 4 year history (OP), will Pakistan score 322+ runs against any of these teams if batting first? Or even chase ....320+ scores?

What if we don't let them score this much?

Remember that, Pakistan didn't allow England, South Africa and Sri Lanka even cross 240 when they were batting first, last time Pakistan played here in England.

 

[Chokli]

I don't see us winning aal 4 matches.



Given the 4 year history (OP), will Pakistan score 322+ runs against any of these teams if batting first? Or even chase ....320+ scores?

Pakistan should be able to in one of the matches

 

[Titan24]

As mentioned these stats dont consider batting teams being bowled out which Pak did against SRL and Eng in CT 17 while SA was 8 down in 50 overs for 219 runs but due to rain and Pak innings wasnt completed.

So if Pak can bowl oppositions out then you never know.

 

[Ronaldo7]

West Indies, Sri Lanka, Afghanistan & Bangladesh

One or two wins against England, Australia, India, South Africa, New Zealand

[MENTION=2344]W63L35[/MENTION] this.
Optimism*

 

[Ronaldo7]

Pakistan should be able to in one of the matches

If they can't even do that then it's a given that they don't deserve a spot in the semis.

 

[ElRaja]

For that you have to also look at how many times Pakistan has been able to chase 289 in the 2nd innings.

History only indicates the probability/likelihood of what's is going to happen...or might happen!

Pakistan very well might chase it.... but upsets do also happen.

the unstoppable force versus the immovable object, looks like some history will be made either way

 

[topspin]

West Indies, Sri Lanka, Afghanistan & Bangladesh

One or two wins against England, Australia, India, South Africa, New Zealand

I don't see us beating WI because I reckon their batting will overpower Pakistan.

 

[Chokli]

I don't see us beating WI because I reckon their batting will overpower Pakistan.

I think Pakistan will win, their batting will fail that day

 

[Mp812]

I don't see us winning aal 4 matches.



Given the 4 year history (OP), will Pakistan score 322+ runs against any of these teams if batting first? Or even chase ....320+ scores?

With the team west Indians have announced, that's a huge hurdle in game 1

 

[MMHS]

Good stats, but there is another side also - we need to check how many times teams have scored 300+ batting first. It's definitely a concern that too many 300+ scores had been chased in ENG, but PAK can go to other route as well - keep the target below 275 and chase it.

In ENG, ODI scores are getting ridiculously batting dominant, which I think will be normalized a little in this WC. What I have noticed, most teams don't play their best possible/available attacks in bilateral series, rather tend to rest key bowlers, which won't be the case in WC, hence my hunch is anything between 275-300 will be competitive for most teams (to defend) and 300+ will give the defending side an edge. In CT as well, average scoring per game was lower than this table suggests. I am more concerned that this PAK batting line-up might try to force their way to a 319 sort of total and end-up at 256/9 ......

Batting first, PAK should look to bat out 50 overs at a decent rate through-out and try to reach 275+, then bowl to get 10 wickets at lower cost - squeezing batting side with score board pressure or negative bowling isn't PAK's game - every time it'll back-fire. Bowling first, team has to operate as a 10 wicket game, rather than 50 overs game - don't see PAK chasing even 275 on most occasions. What Sarfraz did on 26th SEP 2018 should be a catalyst for PAK's usual bowling/fielding tactics, if they had learned the lesson. Batting line-up doesn't have blasters, but it can always try to keep a decent RR through-out 50 overs and post a dependable total, which isn't happening for few selfish players holding on key spots, and they are being backed by everyone in charge.

 

[Hawkeye]

Good stats, but a bit out of context and don't tell the whole story.

What was the average score in CT 17?

I recall reading it wasn't even in the 300s.

Also, Hafeez, the guy you've been calling out, was the key player who made us win the final and accelerated at the end.


Point is, only Hafeez, Babar and Haris are our dynamic players who can play at a good strike rate.

Yes, Malik, Imam and particularly Sarfraz are pure accumulators, and do not have the ability to begin with.

 

[wasiqwaqar]

Good stats, but a bit out of context and don't tell the whole story.

What was the average score in CT 17?

I recall reading it wasn't even in the 300s.

Also, Hafeez, the guy you've been calling out, was the key player who made us win the final and accelerated at the end.


Point is, only Hafeez, Babar and Haris are our dynamic players who can play at a good strike rate.

Yes, Malik, Imam and particularly Sarfraz are pure accumulators, and do not have the ability to begin with.

thats why all scores below 299 were chased down

 

[The_Odd_One]

Busts the myth that if somehow Pakistan can score more than 280 runs then the bowlers are capable to defend that total.

 

[Usman]

[MENTION=2344]W63L35[/MENTION] if Pakistan's chances are so minimal, how did they beat the whole world to the Champions Trophy?

I get the point you're making and yes, ideally our batters would have better strike rates. However cricket isn't played on paper at the end of the day and I do think we are a team capable of winning games, even when on paper we shouldn't.

 

[W63L35]

[MENTION=2344]W63L35[/MENTION] if Pakistan's chances are so minimal, how did they beat the whole world to the Champions Trophy?

The same way we won 2009 T20 World Cup when almost everybody performed well above their normal/average capabilites.

Then, there is an animal called "upset" in sports. Upsets do happen.
1983 - India caused a huge upset by winning a World Cup. So did Sri Lanka in 1996.
So I am not saying Pakistan can not win. I am saying, if Pakistan needs to win, they will have to play well above their normal play levels..... and it will be an upset.

[MENTION=2344]W63L35[/MENTION]
I get the point you're making and yes, ideally our batters would have better strike rates. However cricket isn't played on paper at the end of the day and I do think we are a team capable of winning games, even when on paper we shouldn't.

Yes, even a child will tell you that cricket is not played on the paper, it is played on the cricket pitch...... but a lot of people intentionally (or unintentionally) ignore the fact that stats on the paper get transferred from the cricket pitch.

 

[Chokli]

[MENTION=2344]W63L35[/MENTION] if Pakistan's chances are so minimal, how did they beat the whole world to the Champions Trophy?

T20 2009 and CT 2017 were both extremely short tournaments.

You only needed a few good days to win the whole thing.

Will Pakistan have as many good days for a prolonged tournament? They can but it'll be in the latter half of the tournament where they have to fight like cornered tigers, pun intended.

 

[jani_nasir]

Yes But.

Chart below shows the 1st innings scores in ODIs from 2015 to 2018 played in England. Only completed innings (50 overs) are listed.

Simply put.....

If the team scored greater than 321: Won 12 - lost 2.
If the team scored 298 - 321: Won 3 - lost 5.
If the team scored less than 289: Won 0 - Lost 10.

So the teams scoring less than 322 runs in the first innings have a losing record of:

Won: 3
Lost: 15


Still hopeful that Pakistan will win more than 3-4 matches in this WC?

Let's thank Inzi for selecting Malik, Hafeez and Imam!

View attachment 90726

Yes but notice a couple of things:

1. its mainly been England with scores of 321 in that list, with NZ close second. Makes sense because it is their home conditions
2. Pakistan being the only Asian team to score more than that in that list, with Malik and Hafeez

So I agree with your analysis, but also keep in mind, we don't have replacements for Hafeez, Malik and Imam.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Interesting topic. It has some variables involved though. Pitch, opposition, conditions, importance of the match (like it is dead rubber or not). It is still an useful study to plan a ball park strategy.

 

[W63L35]

Is this from an official site?
Coz SA ain't above Aus and Nz ain't below Pak.
Odds have changed as well in the last 7 days.
Nz and sa were well above pak.
Both were 8/1 whereas pak was 12/1. Now Nz is 12/1, Sa is 10/1 and Pak is still 12/1. This shows that the last spot for the semis is VERY OPEN. Pak have a legitimate chance.

I googled WC 2019 betting odds, and I picked them up from the first one that showed up!

 

[Ronaldo7]

I googled WC 2019 betting odds, and I picked them up from the first one that showed up!

Fair enough.

 

[topspin]

I think Pakistan will win, their batting will fail that day

I would agree if only we had a world class bowling attack but unfortunately it's quite average. Spin attack is very poor as well.

 

[Smudger]

OP is just a stat freak. WC matches are not normal matches. Its about which team handles pressure better. If that was the SA would have won atleast 2 wc but this hasnt happened as they cant handle pressure. I think Pak can beat SA and Eng as they have phycological edge over them.
Pak squad which is selected is the best from the group of players available in the country. Now instead of crying over stats you should just relax and look forword to the main event

 

[W63L35]

373/3................. and the trend continues!

5th highest score in the list from OP above!

 

[sam_ahm]

ODIs have lost their charm thanks to the ICC and have only become a longer version of T20s. If 350 is going to be the par score at the WC and wickets are only going to fall by chance, then I'm sorry, this format will soon be dead.

 

[W63L35]

ODIs have lost their charm thanks to the ICC and have only become a longer version of T20s. If 350 is going to be the par score at the WC and wickets are only going to fall by chance, then I'm sorry, this format will soon be dead.

With increasing Runs Per Over and Decreasing S/R...... still number of ODI played are increase.

 

[The_Odd_One]

But but but the way Australia chased those scores was because the team did not have the main bowlers. With Shaheen and Hassan, no team will score 280+ against them.

 

[W63L35]

4 ODI innings in England since the thread was created....

all of them above 350.
Team scoring 361 and 358 lost!

 

[Adijazz1706]

Pakistan scoring 360 in 2 consecutive matches shows how dead the pitches are, might as well play on the motorways

 

[W63L35]

Pakistan scoring 360 in 2 consecutive matches shows how dead the pitches are, might as well play on the motorways

Then we should have been selecting horses for the courses!

By the way, we lost 5-0 to Australia also ... where the pitches were not roads.