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India v England | 4th Test | Ahmedabad | March 04 -08 | Pre-match Discussion

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India should wipe out England in the final test as well.

Axar Patel looks to be a solid bowler, uses pace and line effectively thought he's not a square turner of the ball. He's a smart bowler, and it will be interesting to see if he can get chances when Jadeja is in the mix. Perhaps India might play all 3 (Axar, Jadeja, and Ashwin) in home games, thought I don't see Axar playing ahead of Jadeja. It's a shame, he's a very good bowler.


India's pacers have not had much to do, so if they pick up a few wickets it would do them well ahead of the WTC Final.

India's batsmen need to get in the mix of runs, and they should ideally get some runs in the final test match.

A one-sided series, and a convincing hammering for England awaits.
 
mastimasti said:
At no point in India's tour of Asia have Stokes, Broad, Anderson and Ali played together....yet this would be their strongest side. Serious re think needed at the ECB.

Also, India will be shovelling sand from the beach for this pitch haha
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I was a big Moeen Ali fan. He is a stylish batsman and a very smart spinner for a SENA one. Plus guy oozes class off the field. He has the x factor and the ability to win games with bat/ball, be it tests, odis or T20Is.

That said, he lacks mental fortitude to extract most out of his skill. If he had a mental strength like Stokes, he would have been an automatic choice anywhere for England.

Right now, it seems as if his career might be finished. Such a pity.
 
The lone Ranger said:
You're talking as if Wasim Akram was never given rest? You have to think about player's workloads these days compared to what it was back then.
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Lol he was not given rest he was not picked because of his lack of penetration in home conditions
 
Kingpin786 said:
Lol he was not given rest he was not picked because of his lack of penetration in home conditions
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We are talking about Bumrah here, one of the best bowlers in the world. Even in the first test, he took 4 wickets at 27. And now he's opted out due to personal reasons. May not even play the ODIs.
 
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Unrelated fun fact, Wasim Akram was not only rested but even dropped, in 2001. He was desperate to break Kapil Dev's record but PCB didn't listen to him. [MENTION=151969]The lone Ranger[/MENTION]
 
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BreadPakoda said:
Unrelated fun fact, Wasim Akram was not only rested but even dropped, in 2001. He was desperate to break Kapil Dev's record but PCB didn't listen to him. [MENTION=151969]The lone Ranger[/MENTION]
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I don't think this is true, but happy to be proved wrong. Do you have access to any articles or corroborating statements from either Akram or the PCB?

Akram simply wasn't fit enough to last a full test match after the tour to England in 2001. In any case, Kapil Dev's test record was utterly irrelevant by then as Courtney Walsh had gone on to take 500 test wickets.
 
BreadPakoda said:
Unrelated fun fact, Wasim Akram was not only rested but even dropped, in 2001. He was desperate to break Kapil Dev's record but PCB didn't listen to him. [MENTION=151969]The lone Ranger[/MENTION]
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Fun fact waseem was at twilight of his career around 34to 35 years of age not like 28 years old Indian condition dependent bowler
 
BreadPakoda said:
We are talking about Bumrah here, one of the best bowlers in the world. Even in the first test, he took 4 wickets at 27. And now he's opted out due to personal reasons. May not even play the ODIs.
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Out of 4 wickets 3 wickets came when damage was done on the other hand Archer who too is not having a good series still picked 2 wickets upfront with new ball. Anderson has looked better than bumah in this series picked more wickets at better average .Ollie Stone has also picked 4 wickets at better average
 
https://fb.watch/3ZxHlNl-yN/
What a wonderful Rey by Viv Richards .must watch above video

I am a little confused about the question really because there seems to be a lot of moaning and groaning about the wicket that they were playing on,” Richards said in a video posted on his Facebook page.

Ok just felt that the ones who are moaning, in my opinion, should realise that there are times that you’re going to get a seaming track, a ball that is basically jumping off a good length and everyone thinks that’s a problem for batters,” he reasoned.
 
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BreadPakoda said:
Unrelated fun fact, Wasim Akram was not only rested but even dropped, in 2001. He was desperate to break Kapil Dev's record but PCB didn't listen to him. [MENTION=151969]The lone Ranger[/MENTION]
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Kapils record had been broken by then right?
 
If the same test was played as a day test but with pink ball on the same pitch, the effect would not have been quite the same.....I guess the result would still be the same
If the same test was played as day test but with red ball on same pitch - the results would be the same.
Where the difference is , is in the extra lacquer on the ball and the night conditions which are cooler and hence impart greater zip of the wicket.
Joe Root himself said it was not turn that defeated Eng but the pace off the wicket.
By no means was the wicket dangerous or pose any grievous threat of injur to a batsman, so please stop the 'its a poor pitch' jamboree.
Some people have said that if Akshar Patel has got so many wickets, this is a lottery/Bunsen burner etc...End of the day, he was good/talented/special enough to land his balls on one spot, on a length, on repeat....that takes special ability - plz give credit where its due.
The fact is this narrative that India prepares/doctors/sabotages wickets is pure hokum...as long as the BOUNCE is EVEN it don't matter if it turns from first day... but having said that the amount of turn should not increase as the days go by. If the BOUNCE is EVEN u need ability to survive and prosper , the same as a green mamba in headingley, jo-berg or wellington or a bouncy one in Durban, perth, Gabba or Kingston.
Imho real nasty wickets are ones that spin square and the bounce is uneven - for eg poona test 2017 or the entire saf series in 2015....
we've prepared bouncy wickets read Dharmshala - 2017 vis aus-4th test and won....howe ver that does not fit the narrative of certain mindsets - neither will the fact that India won fair and square in Aus on their pitches and the same asterix markers went missing.
And lastly, india also scored 49 without loss in the second innings on that same pitch...
If we had lost, there would not have been such a hue and cry...
End of the day, India deserved to win....all the best for 4th test...
 
Last Monetarist said:
I don't think this is true, but happy to be proved wrong. Do you have access to any articles or corroborating statements from either Akram or the PCB?

Akram simply wasn't fit enough to last a full test match after the tour to England in 2001. In any case, Kapil Dev's test record was utterly irrelevant by then as Courtney Walsh had gone on to take 500 test wickets.
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I do.

https://www.espn.com/cricket/story/...m-dropped-training-squad-pakistan-look-future

Akram said he will fly to Pakistan tonight to ask about his future. "It's disappointing but I will keep going as I just want to do my best for my country," he said. "I badly want to pass Kapil Dev's (wicket's total of) 434 so I still want to carry on playing."
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Kingpin786 said:
Out of 4 wickets 3 wickets came when damage was done on the other hand Archer who too is not having a good series still picked 2 wickets upfront with new ball. Anderson has looked better than bumah in this series picked more wickets at better average .Ollie Stone has also picked 4 wickets at better average
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Duh, so India should pick Anderson instead of Bumrah? Like how dense can you be? Bumrah is India's best bowler, and no he wasn't dropped like you've been repeating here.
 
Robert said:
Sir Viv’s English is better than this. I think it is made up. Balls don’t jump off a length on a grassy pitch.
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He also praises Indian pacers. :bumrah :viv

<iframe src="https://www.facebook.com/plugins/video.php?height=476&href=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fivivianrichards%2Fvideos%2F250679073219718%2F&show_text=false&width=214" width="214" height="476" style="border:none;overflow:hidden" scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen="true" allow="autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; picture-in-picture; web-share" allowFullScreen="true"></iframe>
 
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The pitch will be same and spinning. However, I believe a lot of the dismissals were also because of the pink ball used. The batsmen missing straight ball, which skidded off the pitch, was the pink ball

So this test is unlikely to get over in 2 days and toss might be essential
 
Definitely a turner.

Dan Lawrence needs to play, survived the most balls in the second test. England's best available player of spin after Root.

Not convinced about Bess, he's easy meat for Indian batsmen. Stone bowled very well in the second test. If Bess plays, then Stokes needs to bowl a lot more. Anderson/Stokes - pace, Root/Leach/Bess - spin

My team for tomorrow:

Crawley
Sibley
Lawrence
Bairstow
Root
Stokes
Pope
Foakes
Stone/Bess
Leach
Anderson
 
Looking for a good test match here which would atleast last till 5th day lunch. The previous match was a farce irrespective of which ever way we want to spin it. Not many Indian fans, including myself enjoyed one bit of that win.
 
Devadwal said:
Yes everything is made up . Only England fans & cricketers are right .lol
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Well, this one at least has heard Sir Viv speak many times and he doesn't make basic grammatical errors as per that post.
 
Captain Joe Root says England's batsmen "shouldn't be scared" of the pitch or India's bowlers in the final Test in Ahmedabad starting on Thursday.

England, 2-1 down after losing the previous two Tests, have not made a total higher than 178 in their past five innings.

"The most important thing is we go into it full of confidence," said Root.

"We should have no scars from the last two Tests and play in a controlled but fearless way."

England's two defeats - by 317 runs in the second Test in Chennai and 10 wickets in the third Test in Ahmedabad - have been engineered by India's spinners, who took 36 of the 40 wickets on pitches offering plenty of assistance.

Batting was especially difficult in Ahmedabad, with the third Test over in two days and only two players reaching 50.

Root said the surface for the fourth Test, to be played on the same ground but this time during the day and with a red ball, looked "similar" to the pitch from the day-night third Test, when a pink ball was used.

While the pitches have been a source of debate in the media, Root reiterated that his team had never "moaned" about them.

"Everyone's opinion on what is a good wicket is different," he said.

"As players, all you can do is make sure you play what is in front of you better than the opposition. That is our challenge for this week."

India captain Virat Kohli said he "didn't understand" why the pitches had come into such focus.

"There's always too much noise and conversation around spinning tracks," said Kohli, whose team will reach the World Test Championship final if they avoid defeat.

"If you win a Test on day four or five no-one says anything, but if you win in two days everyone pounces on the same issue.

"What's the idea behind continuing this narrative and what purpose does it serve to continue this one-sided conversation?"

India will be without fast bowler Jasprit Bumrah, who left the squad for personal reasons.

England are likely to recall off-spinner Dom Bess after he was overlooked for their past two Tests.

That would mean at least one of pace bowlers James Anderson, Stuart Broad and Jofra Archer being omitted, with the prospect of others from that trio being rested as part of England's rotation policy.

There are fewer possibilities when it comes to altering the batting line-up, Rory Burns and Dan Lawrence having been dropped for the third Test, although tinkering with the order is an option.

The England camp has been affected by a sickness bug, but Root said all the players had trained, with two members of the backroom staff the worst affected.

"I've managed to get over some Dehli belly, or Ahmedabad tummy," Anderson told the Tailenders podcast.

"It will be unlikely that we go in with the same balance of team, so that would mean more spin."

BBC
 
Seems like kohli and a few others seem to think poor tracks and 2 day tests are acceptable. Supposide win at all costs attitude, if india are such GOAT team why the need to doctor wickets?
 
Amjid Javed said:
Seems like kohli and a few others seem to think poor tracks and 2 day tests are acceptable. Supposide win at all costs attitude, if india are such GOAT team why the need to doctor wickets?
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Well, because every nation has a distinct flavor of wickets. When you go to NZ, would you be surprised if you get a seaming wicket?
 
The wicket looks decent subcontinent wicket this time around. Expect the team batting first having best chance to win the game.
 
Iamcoolwhiz said:
Well, because every nation has a distinct flavor of wickets. When you go to NZ, would you be surprised if you get a seaming wicket?
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Apart from the one series against india many years ago ive never otherwise seen NZ doctor wickets as regularly as india does.

Yes spinning tracks are ok to an extent however the pitch shudnt be crumbling and breaking up after 1st day like it did in 3rd test in this series. It was pretty much a day 5 pitch used on day 1. It makes me laugh how defensive all indian fans are getting and dont have decency to be honest and say the pitch was a shambles.
 
WhenSultansBowled said:
I was a big Moeen Ali fan. He is a stylish batsman and a very smart spinner for a SENA one. Plus guy oozes class off the field. He has the x factor and the ability to win games with bat/ball, be it tests, odis or T20Is.

That said, he lacks mental fortitude to extract most out of his skill. If he had a mental strength like Stokes, he would have been an automatic choice anywhere for England.

Right now, it seems as if his career might be finished. Such a pity.
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What mental strength does he lack? He toured Asia, had to be quarantined in SL for almost 2 weeks on his own....that's tough and he comes back and provides England's best performance in the 2nd test.

Have you bought into the initial media reports that he wanted to leave India?

root and the rest of management has apologised for their comments and they were wrong (read: a lie). Ali has the same capacity to get back to England and spend time out of the bubble as Stokes, Buttler, Bairstow etc etc etc...they all used that so does Ali. Just curious what makes him mentally weak?
 
I guess Eng will be all charged up and wanting to prove a point or two....
Several of their key players are due - read Bairstow, Stokes Pope
For India Need Gilli to get a big one - 7 tests old - he's promised a lot but hopefully his temperament plays along and he does not feel the need to hoick into the next post code....
Che Pu and Jinks are due....big time
VK - is consisistent and in good touch even in Adelaide but needs a big one....
I guess JazzBoom will be replaced by either Umesh or Siraj, donot forsee any other changes...
Hopefully, this series is the making of the hitman as an opener...
For the life time members of the 'India always doctors wickets/underhandedly cheats to win/home wins/xyz abc' gang, the
BOUNCE WAS EVEN
in the last test. I guess it will be same in this match as well....so lay off the slagging.....
Go Indiaaaaa:jimmy
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">NOW LOADING ██████████████] 99%<br><br>Round 4 &#55357;&#56613;<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WTC21?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WTC21</a> | <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/INDvENG?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#INDvENG</a> <a href="https://t.co/rYFTjQkpae">pic.twitter.com/rYFTjQkpae</a></p>— ICC (@ICC) <a href="https://twitter.com/ICC/status/1367090185893146628?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 3, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
hitthestump said:
Bitter? Hmm, i'm quite grateful that Pakistan's test wins at home aren't coming under the scrutiny that India's have in this series. It's nicer to win when you're not having to cheat to get there.
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Come on. Pakistan prepared a low slow spinning track against SAF bowling attack. Why no track with Pace and Bounce with Grass on it ?
 
hoshiarpurexpress said:
Come on. Pakistan prepared a low slow spinning track against SAF bowling attack. Why no track with Pace and Bounce with Grass on it ?
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Nothing to do with the pitch Indian team and curators want to create but since you are discussing, 24 wickets were taken by pacers in Rawalpindi. Nortje took a 5fer, Hasan Ali took a 10fer and Shaheen took a 4fer. It wasnt at all a spinning track rather a pretty good one with every aspect of the game in play. Obviously Pak wasnt going to replicate Cape town but it was a pretty good pitch with bowlers (Pacers and spinners) and batsmen from both sides coming into play.

I personally dont have issue with teams wanting home advantage with tracks but match should ideally go around 4th and 5th day unless one of the team plays really poor cricket. Pitch being really difficult to bat on at the very start or becoming really unplayable as the days go by is not an ideal scenario. Indian cricket team is good enough in my opinion to do well in surfaces which are better prepared than the last one so really no point in going for such extreme surfaces.
 
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