India's Muslims fear for their future under Narendra Modi

[desirous of desire]

How many muslims were killed in east pakistan?

How many ahmedis and Shias are killed in Pakistan?

Why are Ahmedis running to Lanka?

In which country terror attacks are frequently killing muslims?

In which country drones bombed muslims?

Justifying the atrocities of hindus committed against Muslims in India ?
You always do that by typing these 3 to 4 lines in almost every response.
Of course you would not utter a word over the plight of Indian Muslim but will jump in excitement to argue with Pakistanis.

Here is a fitting respons:
In which country do the people loathe toilets.
In which country people are considered untouchables ?
What about XYZ....?
Basically just a random slur.

 

[USaqaf]

Ridiculous assertion, believe me i'd know as nowhere else on Earth could I profess atheism than in India and not have 2 craps given.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Ridiculous assertion, believe me i'd know as nowhere else on Earth could I profess atheism than in India and not have 2 craps given.

Hindu extremists have issues with Muslims not athiests. Muslims ruled over them for centuries, athiests didn't.

Also you can be an atheist openly in Europe, North America and various other places around the world. What are you smoking?

 

[USaqaf]

Hindu extremists have issues with Muslims not athiests. Muslims ruled over them for centuries, athiests didn't.

Also you can be an atheist openly in Europe, North America and various other places around the world. What are you smoking?

Well i meant when i visit India, I've never really had a problem, I've had more church types irritate me in the US.

I know it's popular in Pakistan to say "Muslims" ruled over India for centuries. This is only partially true, but this trope is primarily used to rile up the Hindus.

To give you an example, Kerala, Orissa, Bihar and majority of UP was never ruled directly by a Muslim. Bengal was ruled by a Nawab , however the majority of jagirs were in the hands of Hindu upper caste zamindars who completely controlled tax revenue. So it was the Nawab who was technically at the mercy of the landowners.

Back to the topic, in my opinion Congress is worse for Muslims in the long run, just look at 70 years, Muslims were almost perpetually kept in poverty and education levels are abysmal. Just goto historic Muslim areas, Fatehpur Sikhri, Agra or Lucknow, Muslim poverty levels are alarming, and these places were ruled by non BJP politicians till very recently. What have they done for Muslims?
Nothing, just use them like puppets.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Well i meant when i visit India, I've never really had a problem, I've had more church types irritate me in the US.

I know it's popular in Pakistan to say "Muslims" ruled over India for centuries. This is only partially true, but this trope is primarily used to rile up the Hindus.

To give you an example, Kerala, Orissa, Bihar and majority of UP was never ruled directly by a Muslim. Bengal was ruled by a Nawab , however the majority of jagirs were in the hands of Hindu upper caste zamindars who completely controlled tax revenue. So it was the Nawab who was technically at the mercy of the landowners.

Back to the topic, in my opinion Congress is worse for Muslims in the long run, just look at 70 years, Muslims were almost perpetually kept in poverty and education levels are abysmal. Just goto historic Muslim areas, Fatehpur Sikhri, Agra or Lucknow, Muslim poverty levels are alarming, and these places were ruled by non BJP politicians till very recently. What have they done for Muslims?
Nothing, just use them like puppets.

They ruled what they thought was worth ruling and fighting for. Even many areas under Hindu control were only present because they made deals with Muslims. You dont have to rule every single inch of land to be the overall ruler of the lands.

Congress didn't have dozens of their party member spouting hate against Muslims on a reguarl basis. India is a 3rd world country poverty is the norm. What people want first is security and to feel safe. All these media outlets are reporting the fears of the Muslims in India, it's not made up for any agenda as claimed by some of our resident BJP suppoters.

Congress may be terrible too but they are not as hate filled as the BJP who are nothing less than extremits. How anyone can deny this is strange.

 

[USaqaf]

Congress may be terrible too but they are not as hate filled as the BJP who are nothing less than extremits. How anyone can deny this is strange.

One can deny this because it's not true, period.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Haha! And that prompted your first post in this thread ? You could not find a word to say about the plight of Indian Muslims prior to my post. I felt sorry for Indian muslims in my post and you found in it something thrown towards you so became passive aggressive. There is a difference between feeling good and being thankful over avoiding something but i cant expect from you to understand this.Anyway it does not matter what your opinion is for me. What matters is your opinion about the suffering of Muslims in India for which you cant utter a word.

Indians surely use the word "expose" more often than anyone else. Thats straight from arnab goswami's dictionary.

Nice way to feel sorry about someone by being thankful that you are better off than them. Better not to utter anything than gloat about your own good fortune over someones misery.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Ridiculous assertion, believe me i'd know as nowhere else on Earth could I profess atheism than in India and not have 2 craps given.

The assertion wasn't about atheists though. Not really sure how you feel it is relevant. What am I missing?

 

[desirous of desire]

Nice way to feel sorry about someone by being thankful that you are better off than them. Better not to utter anything than gloat about your own good fortune over someones misery.

Better to do something for Indian Muslims than trying to correct someone online but of course you will keep on spouting rubbish here.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Better to do something for Indian Muslims than trying to correct someone online but of course you will keep on spouting rubbish here.

I dont want to do anything for indian muslims. I just feel sorry for them and feel thankful that I am more fortunate than them.

 

[desirous of desire]

I dont want to do anything for indian muslims. I just feel sorry for them and feel thankful that I am more fortunate than them.

Yes its unfortunate to be born a muslim in India atleast you admit it.

 

[Gharib Aadmi]

Well i meant when i visit India, I've never really had a problem, I've had more church types irritate me in the US.

I know it's popular in Pakistan to say "Muslims" ruled over India for centuries. This is only partially true, but this trope is primarily used to rile up the Hindus.

To give you an example, Kerala, Orissa, Bihar and majority of UP was never ruled directly by a Muslim. Bengal was ruled by a Nawab , however the majority of jagirs were in the hands of Hindu upper caste zamindars who completely controlled tax revenue. So it was the Nawab who was technically at the mercy of the landowners.

Back to the topic, in my opinion Congress is worse for Muslims in the long run, just look at 70 years, Muslims were almost perpetually kept in poverty and education levels are abysmal. Just goto historic Muslim areas, Fatehpur Sikhri, Agra or Lucknow, Muslim poverty levels are alarming, and these places were ruled by non BJP politicians till very recently. What have they done for Muslims?
Nothing, just use them like puppets.

Majority of UP was ruled by Muslims, that was the heartland of the Muslim empire. The reason why the Muslims in that area are poor now is because the Middle Class and Upper Middle Class Muslims came to Pakistan, during partition. Thats why in Pakistan the Urdu Speaking Population is the most educated and prosperous community. They settled predominantly in Karachi, and Urdu Speakers are the majority there. My family came from 4 different cities of Uttar Pardesh during partition, and seeing what the CM of UP thinks about Muslims makes me extremely grateful to my grandparents for leaving.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Justifying the atrocities of hindus committed against Muslims in India ?
You always do that by typing these 3 to 4 lines in almost every response.
Of course you would not utter a word over the plight of Indian Muslim but will jump in excitement to argue with Pakistanis.

Here is a fitting respons:
In which country do the people loathe toilets.
In which country people are considered untouchables ?
What about XYZ....?
Basically just a random slur.

As long as we have less crimes, rapes and killings than our neighbours and other countries it is perfectly fine. At least thats what some posters here think.They try to indirectly justify this by bringing in other countries and remind everyone of how life could have been much worse.

Funny thing is most of them don't even live in India now and will most probably never come back.

 

[cricketjoshila]

You mention Shias, Ahmadis and Esat Pakistanis as if you want to welcome them yourself to India which is of course commendable. That would really put Pakistan to shame.

Is Pakistan welcoming Indian Muslims to Pakistan?

Btw East Pakistan is today a separate nation because of India.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Hindu extremists have issues with Muslims not athiests. Muslims ruled over them for centuries, athiests didn't.

Also you can be an atheist openly in Europe, North America and various other places around the world. What are you smoking?

Muslim rule ended 200-300 years back. Only few like you seem to be living in that era.

Muslim extremists around the world have problems with hindus, christians, jews, buddhists almost every religion.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Justifying the atrocities of hindus committed against Muslims in India ?
You always do that by typing these 3 to 4 lines in almost every response.
Of course you would not utter a word over the plight of Indian Muslim but will jump in excitement to argue with Pakistanis.

Here is a fitting respons:
In which country do the people loathe toilets.
In which country people are considered untouchables ?
What about XYZ....?
Basically just a random slur.

Basically you have no answer to the fact that muslims in Pakistan whether divided or undivided faced atrocities.

 

[Itachi]

Majority of UP was ruled by Muslims, that was the heartland of the Muslim empire. The reason why the Muslims in that area are poor now is because the Middle Class and Upper Middle Class Muslims came to Pakistan, during partition. Thats why in Pakistan the Urdu Speaking Population is the most educated and prosperous community. They settled predominantly in Karachi, and Urdu Speakers are the majority there. My family came from 4 different cities of Uttar Pardesh during partition, and seeing what the CM of UP thinks about Muslims makes me extremely grateful to my grandparents for leaving.

So.... Your perception is based upon one state for the whole India?

 

[Itachi]

Two nation theory is not about Pakistan and India.. Its about hinduism and Islam.

I'll repeat my question again. Since there was liberation of east Pakistan, did two nation theory based upon Hinduism and Islam failed?

Why Muslims in east Pakistan felt discriminated by west Pakistan?

 

[BreadPakoda]

Two nation theory is not about Pakistan and India.. Its about other religions and Islam.

Corrected.

 

[Gharib Aadmi]

So.... Your perception is based upon one state for the whole India?

No I was responding to why that poster said Muslims in UP are poor. I gave the reason that it was due to the Middle and Upper Middle Class Muslims came to Karachi during partition.

 

[marlonbrowndo]

Do u live in india? Do u talk with people ? Do u meet hindu or muslims here? Or do u just watch news and make it a fact?

Yes there is some bias against muslims and there always has been but it isnt just one way ,both are partly at fault.

People do not fear muslims beacuse they r muslims and they follow islam , most people have fear of masses of muslims when they r in majority they dont give anyone any right ,let it be indian gullies ,nation itself or any other countries in world , yes there are rights they r on papers.

Many parts in india it is seen when muslim majority in area is achieved it gets really hard for any other and mostly hindu religion to openly express themselves ,they r threated and harrsed at such lengths they r forced to leave those areas . Many people already know this fact

Now i want to state that ofc not all muslims are bad , some are just too good but people often starts discriminating like not letting a muslim rent a house in hindu area beacuse they r feared same will happen. they fear it will be a beginning of a collapse . Once when i asked a guy in my society why did he denied a muslim couple his house (for which a lot of fuss was created and police often visited afterwards ) he answered me ," agar inko apne society me ane diya to baki log bhi musalmano(gujarati for muslims) ko ghar bechne lagenge aur dekhte hi dekhte hamare purane shahibag ke muhalle jesa ho jayega jaha hame ghar bechna pdega" and i wad shocked to see him think this way. And once or twice i see this kind of minset in hindu society

India is the only country where hindu religion thrives , you seriously ask why thry behave this way when they r feared?

I dont support any of bajrangdal or any radical support that is ofteen highlighted in pp too much as if thats the only hurdle muslims face , in news papers i read most muslims face descriminations like i mentioned above rather than violence but here on pp it is showed as if muslims are kept on edge of blade. Anyone trying to defend this is like saying those radical islamiv terrorists in pakistan are the face of the religion! But we know its not ,the same way thugs of bajrangdal and other goons are not face of hinduism and owaisi and zakirnaik are not face of indian muslims.

Common people mostly treat others with respect and muslims do have rights they enjoy in india .there may be no other country in world where muslims being in minority can become president of india of beloved superstars of televisions and national sports, this is where it shows you people domt generally discriminate.

All religions are different and they always descimimate against each other. U just cant stop it. Let it be pakistan where u ll use excuse like its islamiv majority so we can understand that.in india they say its secular there shudnt be any.but through is its everywhere and in india there are laws that protects u aginst such descrimination and btw muslims in india enjoys second highest minority previlage after dalits ,where there are over 100 other minorities.

Truth is we cant keep everyone happy, this world is bad it depends on us what facts we want to make our truths , we choose it.

Classic victim blaming. You are the same as the racist Americans who say black people are partly at fault for racism. Sick

 

[Gharib Aadmi]

I have met a decent amount of Indian Muslims (Gujarati, hyderabdis and south Indians). The idea that they are living in "fear" is greatly overblown, situations like lynchings for eating beef is rare, you have a greater chance of getting into a car accident than dying due to that.

From what i have been told tho is that in recent years that more and more right wing politicians in order to win elections have been openly attacking them. This is not a fringe, you have mainstream right wing politicians in high positions doing this. Politicians wherever they are in the world only care about winning the election. Its not personal, they will say what they have to say.

However the reason that it is so effective going after Muslims is because in the Hindutva ideology religion and culture must originate in India (which for them includes all of South Asia including Afghanistan), otherwise its foreign. So Sikhism which is around 450 years old is a religion of the soil, but Islam which has been in the subcontinent for over a 1,000 years is foreign. It can be a million years but it will still be foreign. This is why Muslim Kings who were born and bred in the subcontinent are called invaders and colonizers, cities that they built from scratch are being proposed to be renamed, their contribution in art, poetry, cuisine, architecture overlooked.

The best option for Indian Muslims is too not restrict themselves to voting for Congress, and if there is a decent BJP candidate to consider voting for them. If Muslims start to vote for BJP they will have to tone down their rhetoric. They should also improve their education rates, esp female ones. This will make them more prosperous, as well as lower their population growth rate, which should decrease fears that they are trying to intentionally increase their population.

 

[desirous of desire]

Basically you have no answer to the fact that muslims in Pakistan whether divided or undivided faced atrocities.

I may or may not have any answer but i know your answer to any sort of criticism i.e. what about this and what about that in your country...

 

[desirous of desire]

I'll repeat my question again. Since there was liberation of east Pakistan, did two nation theory based upon Hinduism and Islam failed?

Why Muslims in east Pakistan felt discriminated by west Pakistan?

did they wish to merge with India ?

 

[CricketCartoons]

Yes its unfortunate to be born a muslim in India atleast you admit it.

But their misfortune is not useless, as it gives a reason for people like you and me to be thankful that we are better off than them.

 

[Itachi]

did they wish to merge with India ?

You are asking a question to avoid answering.

I'll repeat again.

Since east and west Pakistan did disintegrated and became independent countries, the two nation theory based upon religion has failed.

You agree or disagree? Kindly answer in yes or no.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Muslim rule ended 200-300 years back. Only few like you seem to be living in that era.

Muslim extremists around the world have problems with hindus, christians, jews, buddhists almost every religion.

Hindus havent managed to conquer the world thats why.

Anwyway, dont run off and quote something else. You have no credibility.

Try again.

There are dozens of media outlets from around the world saying the same thing. Are they all lying?

Ok, you always bring up the UN. Why not accept this.

United Nations (UN) human rights chief Michelle Bachelet warned India on Wednesday that its "divisive policies" could undermine economic growth, saying that narrow political agendas were marginalising vulnerable people in an already unequal society.

"We are receiving reports that indicate increasing harassment and targeting of minorities – in particular Muslims and people from historically disadvantaged and marginalised groups, such as Dalits and Adivasis," Bachelet said in her annual report to the UN Human Rights Council
https://www.firstpost.com/india/un-h...s-6208261.html

Is she lying too?

The chap was selling beef, perhaps I missed it where it states he was killing killing animals less than 14 years but the thugs who attacked must be aware of this and you to, so please point it out?

Btw Indian posters have lost all credibility on this forum imo, as none of you will respond to the thread of your dear ModiJI's comments regarding radar, clouds, emails, digital cameras. Modi is a liar and so are his supporters, obvious to all.

 

[shaaik]

Indian Muslims are the most tolerant and submissive people, you can find anywhere in the world.
Like sheep in the slaughterhouse, they don't react or revolt, when someone among them is getting lynched or burnt alive.
They watch the butchery with their stony eyes, silently. Their clerics tell them to exhibit "sabr"(Patience). They don't have leaders. They dont have any political party of their own. They are among the poorest of poor Indians. They don't have big holdings. All what they have are few old, ( Mughal Era) mosques and over filled graveyards. Their educational institutes are being targetted and shut. Their NGOs are being banned. Areas where they live have no amenities. For example : In Ahmedabad, 3 lac Muslims live in a big slum with no health centres and no schools. This condition of Muslims is prevalent all across the North, West and East India.
With such underprivileged, weak and poor Muslims living in their midst, what doest the RSS fear for. Such a weak "enemy" should be taken pity of. But RSS is not content with the pitiable condition of Indian "Mulla". That is what Fascism is all about. Why did Hitler gas Jews at Auswich. What fears did he have from them ? None.
By creating a Paranoia for them among the Hindus of India, Modi is playing with the fire.
Time will come, when Indians will curse RSS for sowing seeds of hatred the way some Germans are cursing Nazis. But then it will be too late.

 

[Itachi]

Indian Muslims are the most tolerant and submissive people, you can find anywhere in the world.
Like sheep in the slaughterhouse, they don't react or revolt, when someone among them is getting lynched or burnt alive.
They watch the butchery with their stony eyes, silently. Their clerics tell them to exhibit "sabr"(Patience). They don't have leaders. They dont have any political party of their own. They are among the poorest of poor Indians. They don't have big holdings. All what they have are few old, ( Mughal Era) mosques and over filled graveyards. Their educational institutes are being targetted and shut. Their NGOs are being banned. Areas where they live have no amenities. For example : In Ahmedabad, 3 lac Muslims live in a big slum with no health centres and no schools. This condition of Muslims is prevalent all across the North, West and East India.
With such underprivileged, weak and poor Muslims living in their midst, what doest the RSS fear for. Such a weak "enemy" should be taken pity of. But RSS is not content with the pitiable condition of Indian "Mulla". That is what Fascism is all about. Why did Hitler gas Jews at Auswich. What fears did he have from them ? None.
By creating a Paranoia for them among the Hindus of India, Modi is playing with the fire.
Time will come, when Indians will curse RSS for sowing seeds of hatred the way some Germans are cursing Nazis. But then it will be too late.

I am just surprised veteran posters forming their opinion after reading a few isolated incidents and then calling whole India unstable.

The social construction differs greatly from place to place. A concept that seems to out of comprehension for pak ppers.

 

[USaqaf]

Indian Muslims are the most tolerant and submissive people, you can find anywhere in the world.
Like sheep in the slaughterhouse, they don't react or revolt, when someone among them is getting lynched or burnt alive..

Really?
Sure look submissive here...

https://twitter.com/gauravstvnews/status/1132271345213952000?s=09

 

[CCAD]

Hindus havent managed to conquer the world thats why.

Anwyway, dont run off and quote something else. You have no credibility.

Try again.

There are dozens of media outlets from around the world saying the same thing. Are they all lying?

Ok, you always bring up the UN. Why not accept this.

United Nations (UN) human rights chief Michelle Bachelet warned India on Wednesday that its "divisive policies" could undermine economic growth, saying that narrow political agendas were marginalising vulnerable people in an already unequal society.

"We are receiving reports that indicate increasing harassment and targeting of minorities – in particular Muslims and people from historically disadvantaged and marginalised groups, such as Dalits and Adivasis," Bachelet said in her annual report to the UN Human Rights Council
https://www.firstpost.com/india/un-h...s-6208261.html

Is she lying too?

The chap was selling beef, perhaps I missed it where it states he was killing killing animals less than 14 years but the thugs who attacked must be aware of this and you to, so please point it out?

Btw Indian posters have lost all credibility on this forum imo, as none of you will respond to the thread of your dear ModiJI's comments regarding radar, clouds, emails, digital cameras. Modi is a liar and so are his supporters, obvious to all.

Hindu’s don’t have a desire to conquer other lands or propagate their religions superiority around the world. They are content with their own lands and if people join their religions they’ll welcome them. But don’t feel the need to propgate it. I know alien concept for likes of you.

 

[CCAD]

I have met a decent amount of Indian Muslims (Gujarati, hyderabdis and south Indians). The idea that they are living in "fear" is greatly overblown, situations like lynchings for eating beef is rare, you have a greater chance of getting into a car accident than dying due to that.

From what i have been told tho is that in recent years that more and more right wing politicians in order to win elections have been openly attacking them. This is not a fringe, you have mainstream right wing politicians in high positions doing this. Politicians wherever they are in the world only care about winning the election. Its not personal, they will say what they have to say.

However the reason that it is so effective going after Muslims is because in the Hindutva ideology religion and culture must originate in India (which for them includes all of South Asia including Afghanistan), otherwise its foreign. So Sikhism which is around 450 years old is a religion of the soil, but Islam which has been in the subcontinent for over a 1,000 years is foreign. It can be a million years but it will still be foreign. This is why Muslim Kings who were born and bred in the subcontinent are called invaders and colonizers, cities that they built from scratch are being proposed to be renamed, their contribution in art, poetry, cuisine, architecture overlooked.

The best option for Indian Muslims is too not restrict themselves to voting for Congress, and if there is a decent BJP candidate to consider voting for them. If Muslims start to vote for BJP they will have to tone down their rhetoric. They should also improve their education rates, esp female ones. This will make them more prosperous, as well as lower their population growth rate, which should decrease fears that they are trying to intentionally increase their population.

You make a very good point about muslim votes, the fact majority of them don’t see beyond congress despite them doing nothing for Muslims in 60 odd years. BJP understands that it doesn’t matter what we do Muslims will vote for congress anyway so don’t even try to win their votes.
Politics at its worst.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Hindu’s don’t have a desire to conquer other lands or propagate their religions superiority around the world. They are content with their own lands and if people join their religions they’ll welcome them. But don’t feel the need to propgate it. I know alien concept for likes of you.

I wouldn't hold that against KKWC, being brought up under a monotheistic faith he is naturally going to think as such; my religion or you go to hell, spread our religion, we need the most numbers etc.... If I grew up with a monotheistic faith, I would think the same way..... IMO religions are the main curse to man kind, any religion for that matter..

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Hindu’s don’t have a desire to conquer other lands or propagate their religions superiority around the world. They are content with their own lands and if people join their religions they’ll welcome them. But don’t feel the need to propgate it. I know alien concept for likes of you.

How could Hindus propagate their religion? It has always adopted modern thought or religion of the time then called it Hinduism. It is like saying Hindus invented plastic surgery or the internet, you can claim it, but how many people outside of India will swallow that?

 

[Romali_rotti]

How could Hindus propagate their religion? It has always adopted modern thought or religion of the time then called it Hinduism. It is like saying Hindus invented plastic surgery or the internet, you can claim it, but how many people outside of India will swallow that?

Captain, I am a little confused here, are you suggesting Hinduism adopted Islam when the invaders came and called it Hinduism ? Sorry I am lost for words at your post, please educate me of what you are saying here...

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Captain, I am a little confused here, are you suggesting Hinduism adopted Islam when the invaders came and called it Hinduism ? Sorry I am lost for words at your post, please educate me of what you are saying here...

Not wholesale adoption, perhaps I worded it badly. Indians have readily adopted aspects of culture and thought from outsiders throughout history, and nothing wrong with this. There is a running joke about Indians then claiming that it was Indian all along. Don't take my word for it, Indians themselves say it.

 

[chacha kashmiri]

How could Hindus propagate their religion? It has always adopted modern thought or religion of the time then called it Hinduism. It is like saying Hindus invented plastic surgery or the internet, you can claim it, but how many people outside of India will swallow that?

Krish, the trimurthi are all legitimate symbols of Hinduism and Christianity
And then obviously you have the kalki avatar and the house of Abraham

 

[Romali_rotti]

Not wholesale adoption, perhaps I worded it badly. Indians have readily adopted aspects of culture and thought from outsiders throughout history, and nothing wrong with this. There is a running joke about Indians then claiming that it was Indian all along. Don't take my word for it, Indians themselves say it.

Comedy is all good and all, reality is that; Hinduism allowed other monotheistic faith's flourish on Hindu lands, that itself shows its greatness. As you are aware in most muslim countries if the scenario's were reversed with Hinduism trying to spread it's message, this could be considered blasphemous...

 

[Technics 1210]

Not wholesale adoption, perhaps I worded it badly. Indians have readily adopted aspects of culture and thought from outsiders throughout history, and nothing wrong with this. There is a running joke about Indians then claiming that it was Indian all along. Don't take my word for it, Indians themselves say it.

Never fails! Brilliant show!

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Comedy is all good and all, reality is that; Hinduism allowed other monotheistic faith's flourish on Hindu lands, that itself shows its greatness. As you are aware in most muslim countries if the scenario's were reversed with Hinduism trying to spread it's message, this could be considered blasphemous...

I have no problem accepting Hinduism has some genuine aspects of wisdom and great truths, whether adopted or homegrown, but for me real truth has to be universal not limited to one particular land or race. This is why I feel Buddhism is met with more enthusiasm abroad, as it feels less exclusive to foreigners.

 

[chacha kashmiri]

I have no problem accepting Hinduism has some genuine aspects of wisdom and great truths, whether adopted or homegrown, but for me real truth has to be universal not limited to one particular land or race. This is why I feel Buddhism is met with more enthusiasm abroad, as it feels less exclusive to foreigners.

Buddhism in Myanmar, Sri Lanka and Tibet etc has taken a turn for worse at the minute
Hardly a model recipe
The Buddhists need to shred their tag of being haranguing towards local natives

 

[shaaik]

Comedy is all good and all, reality is that; Hinduism allowed other monotheistic faith's flourish on Hindu lands, that itself shows its greatness. As you are aware in most muslim countries if the scenario's were reversed with Hinduism trying to spread it's message, this could be considered blasphemous...

But , I think one can't adopt Hinduism as a religion because you are Hindu only if u r born a Hindu. please correct me if I am wrong..

 

[shaaik]

I am just surprised veteran posters forming their opinion after reading a few isolated incidents and then calling whole India unstable.

The social construction differs greatly from place to place. A concept that seems to out of comprehension for pak ppers.

Whatever I have written above is mostly from the experience I have had while living in India (out-side kashmir). I still remember while once on a college tour to India, every shop we would go to we were referred to as Pakistanis as may be we looked different to them . This is 2006 I am talking about .. I have lived and studied in that society for good 8-9 years and have had friends both Hindus and Muslims, some of the closet hindu friends would actually tell it on my about the Indian Muslims that these people just can't be trusted, these Indian Muslims are everything that is wrong with India.They Muslims are Indians from outside but Pakistanis from inside. These are some of the things that I am a witness to..

Indian Muslims on the other hand would have nothing to say in their defense but to abuse Paksitan and Pakistanis just to prove to their fellow Indians that they are one among them but they still wouldn't trust them.

I say a sheep in a slaughterhouse gives a much tougher time to a butcher than the Indian Muslims...

 

[Romali_rotti]

But , I think one can't adopt Hinduism as a religion because you are Hindu only if u r born a Hindu. please correct me if I am wrong..

No sir, not correct, Hinduism is a way of life more than a religion, anyone can choose to be a Hindu...

 

[Itachi]

Whatever I have written above is mostly from the experience I have had while living in India (out-side kashmir). I still remember while once on a college tour to India, every shop we would go to we were referred to as Pakistanis as may be we looked different to them . This is 2006 I am talking about .. I have lived and studied in that society for good 8-9 years and have had friends both Hindus and Muslims, some of the closet hindu friends would actually tell it on my about the Indian Muslims that these people just can't be trusted, these Indian Muslims are everything that is wrong with India.They Muslims are Indians from outside but Pakistanis from inside. These are some of the things that I am a witness to..

Indian Muslims on the other hand would have nothing to say in their defense but to abuse Paksitan and Pakistanis just to prove to their fellow Indians that they are one among them but they still wouldn't trust them.

I say a sheep in a slaughterhouse gives a much tougher time to a butcher than the Indian Muslims...

Which places of India you stayed?

 

[slipcatch]

Indian Muslims are the most tolerant and submissive people, you can find anywhere in the world.
Like sheep in the slaughterhouse, they don't react or revolt, when someone among them is getting lynched or burnt alive.
They watch the butchery with their stony eyes, silently. Their clerics tell them to exhibit "sabr"(Patience). They don't have leaders. They dont have any political party of their own. They are among the poorest of poor Indians. They don't have big holdings. All what they have are few old, ( Mughal Era) mosques and over filled graveyards. Their educational institutes are being targetted and shut. Their NGOs are being banned. Areas where they live have no amenities. For example : In Ahmedabad, 3 lac Muslims live in a big slum with no health centres and no schools. This condition of Muslims is prevalent all across the North, West and East India.
With such underprivileged, weak and poor Muslims living in their midst, what doest the RSS fear for. Such a weak "enemy" should be taken pity of. But RSS is not content with the pitiable condition of Indian "Mulla". That is what Fascism is all about. Why did Hitler gas Jews at Auswich. What fears did he have from them ? None.
By creating a Paranoia for them among the Hindus of India, Modi is playing with the fire.
Time will come, when Indians will curse RSS for sowing seeds of hatred the way some Germans are cursing Nazis. But then it will be too late.

I believe it is already too late.

Every major news outlet have acknowledged that Modi ran his campaign on anti-Muslim rhetoric.

 

[Abdullah719]

“You don’t deserve to live in India,” 4 Tablighi Jamaat members recount near-death experience during mob attack in Maharashtra

Mumbai: “Tum Hindustan mein rehne ke laayak nahi ho, tum yahan nahi reh sakte.” These were the words of the assailants who allegedly beat Suhail Tamboli, Aslam Ather, Sayyed Layak, Nizamuddin Qazi on the night of 16 September in Beed’s Hol village in Maharashtra.

Talking to TwoCircles.net, the Tablighi Jamaat members said that they were travelling to Ambajogai village from Dharur for their friend’s funeral when the car they were travelling in developed a glitch and they had to halt.

Suhail Tamboli and Sayyed Layak went to get water for coolant and parked the car.

Meanwhile, two men on a bike arrived at the spot where their car was parked and for no reason started verbally abusing Aslam and Nizamuddin, and as per them, “used filthy language against our community.” The men were wearing skull caps and Kurtas.

The Jamaat members politely tried to deal with the situation but within a span of a few minutes, the men made a call and six more men arrived at the spot, armed with sticks.

“They certainly intended to kill us that night,” said the 34-year-old Suhail Tamboli. “They also pulled our beards and threw our caps,” he added.

The incident took place at around quarter to ten and went on for the next forty minutes. The police arrived at the site an hour later.

“One of them smashed a brick twice on my head and kept hitting me with a stick till it broke,” said Suhail. “I thought I’m going to die that night.”

Aslam Ather, 24, was waiting near the car when the incident took place, “They hit me with punches and sticks,” he said. “I ran away and saw them hitting others mercilessly. I was too scared,” he added.

“It felt like we were their enemies for a long time. We were clueless for why they were constantly hitting us,” said Sayyed Layak. “They were not ready to listen to us at all. Before we could speak anything they started hitting us with bricks,” the 38-year-old said.

Sayyed and Aslam successfully managed to escape the site and hid in the nearby farm. “We fled to the farm but we were watching. We could not rescue them, all of us would have been killed then,” said Sayyed.

“They kept hitting us till we fell on the ground and kept kicking our chest and head. I fell unconscious after that,” said Suhail.

The assailants damaged the car after beating them and left. “We heard them saying ‘they are dead’ to other boys and left,” Aslam said.

Aslam and Sayyed made calls to their village and informed them of the incident after which Suhail and Nizamuddin were taken to Ambejogai Government Hospital.

However, an FIR has been registered on 17 September at Yusuf Wadgaon Police Station under Section 307 (Attempt to murder), 324 (Voluntary assault with weapon), 323 (Punishment for voluntarily causing hurt), 147 (Punishment for rioting), 148 (Punishment for rioting and armed with deadly weapon), 149 (Individual of unlawful assembly guilty of offence committed in prosecution of common object), 405 (Criminal breach of trust) and 527 (Imprisonment for lifetime)of IPC.

According to API Anand Zote of Yusuf Wadgaon Police Station, two assailants namely Narayan Dhanraj Ghuge and Rahul Tukaram Ghuge among six have been arrested presently.

http://twocircles.net/2020sep19/439062.html

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

A moment of silence for all the patriotic Indian Muslims who voted for BJP.

Lol.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

“You don’t deserve to live in India,” 4 Tablighi Jamaat members recount near-death experience during mob attack in Maharashtra

Mumbai: “Tum Hindustan mein rehne ke laayak nahi ho, tum yahan nahi reh sakte.” These were the words of the assailants who allegedly beat Suhail Tamboli, Aslam Ather, Sayyed Layak, Nizamuddin Qazi on the night of 16 September in Beed’s Hol village in Maharashtra.

Talking to TwoCircles.net, the Tablighi Jamaat members said that they were travelling to Ambajogai village from Dharur for their friend’s funeral when the car they were travelling in developed a glitch and they had to halt.

Suhail Tamboli and Sayyed Layak went to get water for coolant and parked the car.

Meanwhile, two men on a bike arrived at the spot where their car was parked and for no reason started verbally abusing Aslam and Nizamuddin, and as per them, “used filthy language against our community.” The men were wearing skull caps and Kurtas.

The Jamaat members politely tried to deal with the situation but within a span of a few minutes, the men made a call and six more men arrived at the spot, armed with sticks.

“They certainly intended to kill us that night,” said the 34-year-old Suhail Tamboli. “They also pulled our beards and threw our caps,” he added.

The incident took place at around quarter to ten and went on for the next forty minutes. The police arrived at the site an hour later.

“One of them smashed a brick twice on my head and kept hitting me with a stick till it broke,” said Suhail. “I thought I’m going to die that night.”

Aslam Ather, 24, was waiting near the car when the incident took place, “They hit me with punches and sticks,” he said. “I ran away and saw them hitting others mercilessly. I was too scared,” he added.

“It felt like we were their enemies for a long time. We were clueless for why they were constantly hitting us,” said Sayyed Layak. “They were not ready to listen to us at all. Before we could speak anything they started hitting us with bricks,” the 38-year-old said.

Sayyed and Aslam successfully managed to escape the site and hid in the nearby farm. “We fled to the farm but we were watching. We could not rescue them, all of us would have been killed then,” said Sayyed.

“They kept hitting us till we fell on the ground and kept kicking our chest and head. I fell unconscious after that,” said Suhail.

The assailants damaged the car after beating them and left. “We heard them saying ‘they are dead’ to other boys and left,” Aslam said.

Aslam and Sayyed made calls to their village and informed them of the incident after which Suhail and Nizamuddin were taken to Ambejogai Government Hospital.

However, an FIR has been registered on 17 September at Yusuf Wadgaon Police Station under Section 307 (Attempt to murder), 324 (Voluntary assault with weapon), 323 (Punishment for voluntarily causing hurt), 147 (Punishment for rioting), 148 (Punishment for rioting and armed with deadly weapon), 149 (Individual of unlawful assembly guilty of offence committed in prosecution of common object), 405 (Criminal breach of trust) and 527 (Imprisonment for lifetime)of IPC.

According to API Anand Zote of Yusuf Wadgaon Police Station, two assailants namely Narayan Dhanraj Ghuge and Rahul Tukaram Ghuge among six have been arrested presently.

http://twocircles.net/2020sep19/439062.html

It happened in a non-Bjp state so BJP can't be blamed.

That will be the response.

 

[CricketCartoons]

It happened in a non-Bjp state so BJP can't be blamed.

That will be the response.

bjp can be blamed if the assailants were affiliated to bjp and it doesn't take any action. but that is only half of the story. law and order is state subject, and with the secular coalition ruling they must take action otherwise blame goes to them, whoever the culprit was. This same secular coalition has shiv sena as a member whose mla had forced fed a muslim during ramzan a couple of years ago, among other incidents. But let us not ask questions of this coalition and only talk about bjp.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

bjp can be blamed if the assailants were affiliated to bjp and it doesn't take any action. but that is only half of the story. law and order is state subject, and with the secular coalition ruling they must take action otherwise blame goes to them, whoever the culprit was. This same secular coalition has shiv sena as a member whose mla had forced fed a muslim during ramzan a couple of years ago, among other incidents. But let us not ask questions of this coalition and only talk about bjp.

Yes... Desh mein bjp ne halla macha ke rakha hai..

Arresting Muslims under draconian laws and then getting owned later...

Or attacking Muslims every other day...

Lets not focus on that but talk about the nitty gritty details pertaining to specific cases assuming everyone is giving a free pass to the shiv sena thugs.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Yes... Desh mein bjp ne halla macha ke rakha hai..

Arresting Muslims under draconian laws and then getting owned later...

Or attacking Muslims every other day...

Lets not focus on that but talk about the nitty gritty details pertaining to specific cases assuming everyone is giving a free pass to the shiv sena thugs.

What an extreme right wing logic like the one used by islamophobes. to strengthen their case against a particular case involving muslims, they bring in issues from other places, even foreign countries.
they say exactly the same thing which you are doing. i guess sooner or later, everyone turns a right winger

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

What an extreme right wing logic like the one used by islamophobes. to strengthen their case against a particular case involving muslims, they bring in issues from other places, even foreign countries.
they say exactly the same thing which you are doing. i guess sooner or later, everyone turns a right winger

Oh i am sorry I didn't dot all the Is and check all the Ts before making a point about a huge problem in our country which has normalised all this behavior.

I thought maybe me posting here for 7 years would make ppl get the context.

And since you insist, yes focus is on givt to take action failing which same outrage will be directed at them.

They did arrest shiv sainiks a few days back for attack on naval officer... Lets see if they take any action now.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Oh i am sorry I didn't dot all the Is and check all the Ts before making a point about a huge problem in our country which has normalised all this behavior.

I thought maybe me posting here for 7 years would make ppl get the context.

And since you insist, yes focus is on givt to take action failing which same outrage will be directed at them.

They did arrest shiv sainiks a few days back for attack on naval officer... Lets see if they take any action now.

You quoted an article and made a comment on the specific incident (that it will be defended as it happened in a non bjp state), and now you are saying that you were making a general comment and not this particular incident.

I can't assume for your knowledge, doesn't matter if you post for 1 day or7 years. being from madras you may not be aware of the hindu muslim problem in maharashtra, which pre dates not just 1992 but 1947.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

You quoted an article and made a comment on the specific incident (that it will be defended as it happened in a non bjp state), and now you are saying that you were making a general comment and not this particular incident.

I can't assume for your knowledge, doesn't matter if you post for 1 day or7 years. being from madras you may not be aware of the hindu muslim problem in maharashtra, which pre dates not just 1992 but 1947.

If hindu Muslim problems were that much of an issue pre 1947 you would think the Muslims would have migrated to their nearest Muslim land mass, which I assume was probably Bangladesh. I think you may be exaggerating problems at time of partition in Maharashtra.

 

[CricketCartoons]

If hindu Muslim problems were that much of an issue pre 1947 you would think the Muslims would have migrated to their nearest Muslim land mass, which I assume was probably Bangladesh. I think you may be exaggerating problems at time of partition in Maharashtra.

Many did in 1947. The final alignment happened in 1992 when muslims moved to muslim areas. You must be aware of even muslim bolly celebs finding it difficult to rent in non muslim areas. Anyone who thinks hindu muslims were living in relative peace and things turned bad post 2014 does not know anything about maharashtra.

 

[CricketCartoons]

If hindu Muslim problems were that much of an issue pre 1947 you would think the Muslims would have migrated to their nearest Muslim land mass, which I assume was probably Bangladesh. I think you may be exaggerating problems at time of partition in Maharashtra.

Read this: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...nal-riots-in-a-decade/articleshow/7986633.cms

Maharashtra had the most communal riots in a decade 1998-2008 when it was ruled by the secular congress coalition. Don't be fooled by the india experts here, who only want to portray that indians were peaceful till bjp came and turned them into bigots.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

You quoted an article and made a comment on the specific incident (that it will be defended as it happened in a non bjp state), and now you are saying that you were making a general comment and not this particular incident.

I can't assume for your knowledge, doesn't matter if you post for 1 day or7 years. being from madras you may not be aware of the hindu muslim problem in maharashtra, which pre dates not just 1992 but 1947.

Obviously the point being that since bjp fans defend pretty much everything, this should be an easy answer cos it's not bjp ruled state.

And yes it matters how long a poster has been posting. Cos if we go by that, we cud have avoided this discussion since u obviously know what I meant..

Or u cud have asked me whether I'm giving shiv sena a free pass and I would have said no... And that would be it.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Obviously the point being that since bjp fans defend pretty much everything, this should be an easy answer cos it's not bjp ruled state.

And yes it matters how long a poster has been posting. Cos if we go by that, we cud have avoided this discussion since u obviously know what I meant..

Or u cud have asked me whether I'm giving shiv sena a free pass and I would have said no... And that would be it.

Are you so much wary of bjp supporters that you write a preemptive post for a post that may come in future from a bjp supporter. If you wanted to avoid this discussion, you could have just responded to posts that are actually posted. However this discussion was not futile and an important point way made about the communal atmosphere about maharashtra, and you are better informed now.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Are you so much wary of bjp supporters that you write a preemptive post for a post that may come in future from a bjp supporter. If you wanted to avoid this discussion, you could have just responded to posts that are actually posted. However this discussion was not futile and an important point way made about the communal atmosphere about maharashtra, and you are better informed now.

Yes, we can't make any casual posts..... lest we be blamed of being wary of bjp supporters.

Every point must be perfectly analyzed and blame must be precisely directed or else there's an agenda at play or its ignorance (willful or otherwise).

I did explain my stance in the very second response to you.

But here we are still discussing...

 

[Swashbuckler]

If hindu Muslim problems were that much of an issue pre 1947 you would think the Muslims would have migrated to their nearest Muslim land mass, which I assume was probably Bangladesh. I think you may be exaggerating problems at time of partition in Maharashtra.

Maharashtra is one of the most communally polarized states in India, apart from Hindi belt you have western India and coastal Karnataka which are Sanghi hotbeds. Bengal and Assam in East slowly getting there, part of Sangh's long term vision. RSS HQ is in Nagpur, Maharashta and many of their ideologues are from Maharashtra. Golwalkar, Savarkar, Godse (murderer of Mahatma Gandhi) all from the erstwhile Bombay Presidency, current RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat is from that state. RSS is dominated by Chitpawan Brahmins. Forget RSS/BJP, you must be aware of Shiv Sena, Bal Thackeray, Mumbai underworld, 1992-93 riots/blasts?

Political opportunism for Congress and NCP to ally with Shiv Sena. That party is more subdued now and may change its ideology in the future but a long way away from redemption.

 

[Gabbar Singh]

The way certain senior members of the ruling BJP view Muslims is shocking, I don’t know how any decent person, in good faith, could defend such behaviour. Thought things may have been different after Modi got elected and as time went on but I don’t think much has changed for the better.

 

[cricketjoshila]

It happened in a non-Bjp state so BJP can't be blamed.

That will be the response.

Atleast look up the source of this article. What is its credibility? Why do most of the times these victim stories fall flat in the court of law despite the case being in a opposition ruled state.

Just visit that website, its anything but credible.

I can post many many articles from such kind of mushroom websites.

 

[CricketCartoons]

current RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat is from that state.

Mohan Bhagwat is a right wing liberal. Some examples of what he has said in recent times:

On environment: Nature should be nurtured, not just consumed.

On rabid nationalism: Swadeshi doesn't mean boycotting all foreign products.
Citizens responsible for country. Can't blame britishers.

On tableeghi jamaat: One community should not be blamed for actions of a few.

Gays, transgenders, an integral part of society.

Don't want any power center except the constitution.

Guess who was another right wing liberal? MK Gandhi. Mohan Bhagwat is even more liberal than mohandas.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Maharashtra is one of the most communally polarized states in India, apart from Hindi belt you have western India and coastal Karnataka which are Sanghi hotbeds. Bengal and Assam in East slowly getting there, part of Sangh's long term vision. RSS HQ is in Nagpur, Maharashta and many of their ideologues are from Maharashtra. Golwalkar, Savarkar, Godse (murderer of Mahatma Gandhi) all from the erstwhile Bombay Presidency, current RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat is from that state. RSS is dominated by Chitpawan Brahmins. Forget RSS/BJP, you must be aware of Shiv Sena, Bal Thackeray, Mumbai underworld, 1992-93 riots/blasts?

Political opportunism for Congress and NCP to ally with Shiv Sena. That party is more subdued now and may change its ideology in the future but a long way away from redemption.

Which RSS Sarsanghchalak is a chitpavan Brahmin?

So north and west are sanghi. East is becoming sanghi. In south Karnataka is already sanghi and bjp vote share has increased in telengana.

Poor you, entire country is becoming sanghi, what will you do? Request imran khan to make a free dravid nation, just like you said pakistanis shouldn't think evil of south Indian, as they have nothing to do with the indo pak issues?

 

[Swashbuckler]

Which RSS Sarsanghchalak is a chitpavan Brahmin?

So north and west are sanghi. East is becoming sanghi. In south Karnataka is already sanghi and bjp vote share has increased in telengana.

Poor you, entire country is becoming sanghi, what will you do? Request imran khan to make a free dravid nation, just like you said pakistanis shouldn't think evil of south Indian, as they have nothing to do with the indo pak issues?

No, I will ignore extremists like you. Pathetic excuse for a human being, don't quote me.

 

[Abdullah719]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Listen to these words<a href="https://twitter.com/TOIIndiaNews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@TOIIndiaNews</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/timesofindia?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@timesofindia</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/TOILucknow?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@TOILucknow</a> <a href="https://t.co/RsRXcbhT9s">pic.twitter.com/RsRXcbhT9s</a></p>— Urooj Khan TOI (@UroojkhanTOI) <a href="https://twitter.com/UroojkhanTOI/status/1309213794011410436?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 24, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>