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Is Babar Azam cut out for Test cricket?

Kohli said:
Has had an extended run, but still fails.

It's just a matter of time before he's shown the way

Good LO player tho
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He has played couple tests in few venues so far. His first trip in Aus, NZ and WI was not that great, but first trip is always hard. He did play one good knock in NZ.

If he plays 10 tests in UAE then we can see how he performs. Total 9-10 tests are not enough when bulk of it came during the first trip to many venues.
 
Rana said:
By one knock it means a knock that will give him the confidence to kick start his Test career as a runs compiler on dead flat wickets with a strike rate of 55-60 at an average of 60 as well. He clearly has the ability to be that good on these sort of tracks, far better than everyone else in Pakistan. Yes, I agree that he may not have the same ability outside Asia. But the management would be stupid to drop him for someone else. He will come good very soon
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Confidence was never his problem (it's Shafiq's). Babar's problem is picking the right ball to play shots. That skill can only be learnt by playing on the green pitches in domestic FC, where mediocre bowlers average in the twenties.
 
Some responses on this thread are hilarious. People believe that Babar should be given a long run because he is an ATG who is not performing. ATG or not, player inclusion must depend on current form.

These are probably the same people who ran to sell their shares in the stock market when Nawaz was disqualified and their own interests were involved.
 
Babar has all the tools to succeed in test cricket. Age is on his side and he will break all the batting records for Pakistan. I will be extremely dissapointed if he ends his test career with an average of less than 50.
Haris on the other side will average 55-60 even after missing his peak 5 years.
 
kingusama92 said:
A person's knowledge of Test cricket and player development starts to show with such threads.

After 9 Tests

Babar Azam: 27.25 AVG

Hashim Amla: 22.47
Jacques Kallis: 23.21
Steve Smith 29.00

Viv Richards: 30.30
Younis Khan: 31.00
Inzamam Ul Haq: 31.84
VVS Laxman: 32.00
Kumar Sangakkara: 33.31

I'm guessing you'd kick these guys to the curb too? :))
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Yes but compare these averages to their ODI averages you will not see a big discrepance as these batsmen were struggling to find their feet.

If he's successful in one format but crap in the other, almost averaging half of his ODI average. Then it means he is not cut out for the format rather than what you are trying to imply above
 
And loool steven smith started off as a leg spinner tail ender... you're gonna compare BA to that :))
 
waleed88 said:
Yes but compare these averages to their ODI averages you will not see a big discrepance as these batsmen were struggling to find their feet.

If he's successful in one format but crap in the other, almost averaging half of his ODI average. Then it means he is not cut out for the format rather than what you are trying to imply above
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Babar after 9 Tests: 27
Amla after 9 Tests: 22
Viv after 9 Tests: 30
Kohli after 9 Tests: 34

Babar after 31 ODIs: 54
Amla after 31 ODIs: 59
Viv after 31 ODIs: 54
Kohli after 31 ODIs: 45

Should've dropped Viv, Amla and Kohli for good then and there... Hafeez and Malik level tullay-baazs....
 
Who should replace him? Does anyone know of another young batsman with good potential who can take Babar Azam's place right now?
 
waleed88 said:
Yes but compare these averages to their ODI averages you will not see a big discrepance as these batsmen were struggling to find their feet.

If he's successful in one format but crap in the other, almost averaging half of his ODI average. Then it means he is not cut out for the format rather than what you are trying to imply above
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:))

When we talk about ODIs, you say his average (50+) is high because of the WI innings.

When we talk about Tests, you change your mind and use the same average to show a "discrepancy" in formats.

Legend.
 
Abdullah719 said:
Babar after 9 Tests: 27
Amla after 9 Tests: 22
Viv after 9 Tests: 30
Kohli after 9 Tests: 34

Babar after 31 ODIs: 54
Amla after 31 ODIs: 59
Viv after 31 ODIs: 54
Kohli after 31 ODIs: 45

Should've dropped Viv, Amla and Kohli for good then and there... Hafeez and Malik level tullay-baazs....
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Wrecked.

:))

I was going to make the same post.
 
Abdullah719 said:
Babar after 9 Tests: 27
Amla after 9 Tests: 22
Viv after 9 Tests: 30
Kohli after 9 Tests: 34

Babar after 31 ODIs: 54
Amla after 31 ODIs: 59
Viv after 31 ODIs: 54
Kohli after 31 ODIs: 45

Should've dropped Viv, Amla and Kohli for good then and there... Hafeez and Malik level tullay-baazs....
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Hahahaha, 9 test matches, but 31 ODIs, how can you prove they took place in the same time? Hashim Amla was known to be a delayed induction in ODIs was initially just a test batsman... While Viv is a complete different era.

Kohli was also struggling in Tests and ODis when he started
 
kingusama92 said:
:))

When we talk about ODIs, you say his average (50+) is high because of the WI innings.

When we talk about Tests, you change your mind and use the same average to show a "discrepancy" in formats.

Legend.
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Yes discrepancy is there, for his supporters who are bias who believe his average is a true reflection of his talent, while infact he is just utter garbage and has no place in a test playing XI, he is only there because of his past ODI exploits which can't hide the fact that he is pathetic at the most level that is required from a test cricketer.
 
I think fans who don't want to see the faults with their favorite batsman will find any justication for it when its been proved that he is struggling against any top flight team whether it be West Indies or Srilanka. HIs ODI exploits (despite the bias of playing West Indies) are still acceptable by Pakistani standards (where Hafeez and Malik are mainstay). He will only need to bash West Indies once a year to stay in there. But his tests exploits are a different story altogether
 
For a player who has been a continuous induction since September 2015 in ODIs, and a continous induction in test matches since last year, he has done pretty poorly considering even a retiring Misbah and Younis Khan have outperformed him, while Shafiq has scored a fighting 100 vs Australia, speaks volumes about him as a batsman, who is probably down the Umar Akmal road after he also performed against the Newzealand side some 8 years ago.
 
waleed88 said:
I think fans who don't want to see the faults with their favorite batsman will find any justication for it when its been proved that he is struggling against any top flight team whether it be West Indies or Srilanka. HIs ODI exploits (despite the bias of playing West Indies) are still acceptable by Pakistani standards (where Hafeez and Malik are mainstay). He will only need to bash West Indies once a year to stay in there. But his tests exploits are a different story altogether
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Fans aren't delusional and accept his output has to improve.

But you can see the future and know that he will be a Hafeez/Malik level batsman.

:salute
 
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Abdullah719 said:
Fans aren't delusional and accept his output has to improve.

But you can see the future and know that he will be a Hafeez/Malik level batsman.

:salute
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Yes because they are ODI specialists with no place in the longest format. The stats suggest he is not made out for test cricket, like his 2 ODI teammates.
 
waleed88 said:
Hahahaha, 9 test matches, but 31 ODIs, how can you prove they took place in the same time? Hashim Amla was known to be a delayed induction in ODIs was initially just a test batsman... While Viv is a complete different era.

Kohli was also struggling in Tests and ODis when he started
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This is still such a useless point.

A delayed ODI selection strengthens the point of player development. Imagine if Hashim Amla/VVS Laxman were dropped after 9 tests.

They'd never get a chance to play in ODIs let alone use the format to build confidence.

Their careers would be finished because Waleed88 had no patience or eye for talent.

As for the averages...

ODI Average AFTER Playing 9 Tests

Jacques Kallis: 37.17
Inzamam Ul Haq: 36.51
 
waleed88 said:
Yes because they are ODI specialists with no place in the longest format. The stats suggest he is not made out for test cricket, like his 2 ODI teammates.
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Stats suggest the same for Viv, Amla and Kohli. These are just three random names that I checked, there will be tons more if anyone actually wastes time checking.

But then again, this discussion is a waste of time too. ;-)
 
kingusama92 said:
This is still such a useless point.

A delayed ODI selection strengthens the point of player development. Imagine if Hashim Amla/VVS Laxman were dropped after 9 tests.

They'd never get a chance to play in ODIs let alone use the format to build confidence.

Their careers would be finished because Waleed88 had no patience or eye for talent.

As for the averages...

ODI Average AFTER Playing 9 Tests

Jacques Kallis: 37.17
Inzamam Ul Haq: 36.51
Click to expand...

You better get T20I averages ready next. :srt
 
He hasn't done too well in FC averaging sub 40 Shafiq had similar stats in FC Shan averages 35 in FC you can't expect to pick batsmen just on technique or otherwise and expect top class performance in tests generally they will struggle to better their performance in FC.
Babar is younger however and should improve however he looks scratchy whenever he plays test cricket compared to ODIs and T20Is.
 
kingusama92 said:
This is still such a useless point.

A delayed ODI selection strengthens the point of player development. Imagine if Hashim Amla/VVS Laxman were dropped after 9 tests.

They'd never get a chance to play in ODIs let alone use the format to build confidence.

Their careers would be finished because Waleed88 had no patience or eye for talent.

As for the averages...

ODI Average AFTER Playing 9 Tests

Jacques Kallis: 37.17
Inzamam Ul Haq: 36.51
Click to expand...

Yes Inzamam was inducted on the side on the basis of his performances in the World cup, and he was a clear failure throughout the tournament... more deserving players like Asif Mujtaba got dropped despite scoring 50s against England while INzamam had to be moved down the order (I'm not sure he was performed that series) but he was pretty poor throughout that English series (somewhat similar to Babar's run against Aussie)
 
Abdullah719 said:
Stats suggest the same for Viv, Amla and Kohli. These are just three random names that I checked, there will be tons more if anyone actually wastes time checking.

But then again, this discussion is a waste of time too. ;-)
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Exactly which is why these comparisons are null and void to Babar Azam as they don't imply anything
 
kingusama92 said:
This is still such a useless point.

A delayed ODI selection strengthens the point of player development. Imagine if Hashim Amla/VVS Laxman were dropped after 9 tests.

They'd never get a chance to play in ODIs let alone use the format to build confidence.

Their careers would be finished because Waleed88 had no patience or eye for talent.

As for the averages...

ODI Average AFTER Playing 9 Tests

Jacques Kallis: 37.17
Inzamam Ul Haq: 36.51
Click to expand...

Point is they were atleast dropped once to make way for someone else, and a little bit of a bench don't hurt anyone. These names came back better than ever, and its high time our golden boy finds some bench comfort as he has lost all credibility as a starting XI name
 
waleed88 said:
Yes Inzamam was inducted on the side on the basis of his performances in the World cup, and he was a clear failure throughout the tournament... more deserving players like Asif Mujtaba got dropped despite scoring 50s against England while INzamam had to be moved down the order (I'm not sure he was performed that series) but he was pretty poor throughout that English series (somewhat similar to Babar's run against Aussie)
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Inzi actually made 2 hundreds just before the 1992 WC, albeit against SRL. He was slotted at 3 in early stages but later moved to 6.

Babar needs to fix his numbers, but thelogic you are putting here doesn't make sense at all. His ODI average excluding WI (don't know why - they are a better ODI side than SRL in Tests away from home) is still over 40, probably close to 45/85 stats.

No excuses, but I didn't like moving him to 5, so that Masood can be accommodated as opener & Asad can be promoted at 4. His 91* should have sealed No. 3 spot until someone better is found.
 
Score some runs in first class cricket before you get into the international test team. Sack masood and babar and play fawad and usman who actually deserve to be in the team. Stick to loi babar azam.
 
He can't be blamed.its the management who are acting childish.
Anyone with half cricketing knowledge can say he's not suitable to TEST AS OF NOW. They have FC going on, allow him to play there. Rather, they are playing and spoiling the team and even spoiling his confidence. Let him stick to LOIs till 2019.

Should play 2 seasons of FC and make a return.
 
Until he improves his game against spin I don't see him performing consistently enough to cement his spot in the side.
 
And people were saying he could walk into Indian middle order.Cant even score against SL lallu bowlers whom our boys manhandled at their own home.Forget about Indian team, he wont even get a place in Kerala Ranji squad.
 
Dingolfy said:
And people were saying he could walk into Indian middle order.Cant even score against SL lallu bowlers whom our boys manhandled at their own home.Forget about Indian team, he wont even get a place in Kerala Ranji squad.
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Discussion was about ODIs, perhaps you missed that part. :msd
 
Kohli said:
They already gave him an extended run. I think he debuted last October. A year in cricket without being dropped. 5 series, at same position mostly. Despite that averages 28, and even today got out on 28.
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lol Pakistan were simply Pakistan today..they somehow found a way to lose.
 
absolute disaster; I was never in favour of his selection of even test squad and I have been proven correct yet again :bow:
 
He should play at 6, not Haris. Haris already looks the part but Babar should be put down to 6 to let him develop.
 
Babar deserves backing. He’s clearly a very talented batsman and if he gets dropped he could go the Umar Akmal route...

It’s only a matter of time before he starts firing.


Anyway... it’s not like we have many other options in the batting department....
 
babajee said:
Babar deserves backing. He’s clearly a very talented batsman and if he gets dropped he could go the Umar Akmal route...

It’s only a matter of time before he starts firing.


Anyway... it’s not like we have many other options in the batting department....
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That is a loser's attitude. A winner would go to domestics and come back even better after getting dropped. If Babar Azam goes Umar's route, then he probably didn't deserve to be in the team in the first place.
 
asfandyar said:
That is a loser's attitude. A winner would go to domestics and come back even better after getting dropped. If Babar Azam goes Umar's route, then he probably didn't deserve to be in the team in the first place.
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Better for him to learn whilst playing in test matches than rotting in domestics. He hasn’t been great but has shown glimpses of his potential so far. I’d give him the next test series before judging whether to drop him or not because as i said before, the alternatives don’t look too great.
 
babajee said:
Better for him to learn whilst playing in test matches than rotting in domestics. He hasn’t been great but has shown glimpses of his potential so far. I’d give him the next test series before judging whether to drop him or not because as i said before, the alternatives don’t look too great.
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How much do/did you learn while giving your exams?
 
I can't wait until Babar has the spreadsheet clan ducking for cover. As soon as he got his 1st century in ODIs, more followed. The same will happen in tests.
 
Hasan123 said:
I can't wait until Babar has the spreadsheet clan ducking for cover. As soon as he got his 1st century in ODIs, more followed. The same will happen in tests.
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That's why test cricket is the toughest and purest format of the game, not all good limited over players have it in them to succeed at the highest level.
 
ToeCrusher2 said:
That's why test cricket is the toughest and purest format of the game, not all good limited over players have it in them to succeed at the highest level.
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True but Babar will come good in tests. He needs to be more confident and back his ability.
 
ToeCrusher2 said:
That's why test cricket is the toughest and purest format of the game, not all good limited over players have it in them to succeed at the highest level.
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But there is no major technical fault in his game to suggests he cannot succeed at test level.

Someone like Guptill who is one of the best ODI batsman in the world struggles in the test format because his bat is drawn from the off side making him vulnerable to anything that moves away or short pitched- lack of time.
 
I have had a lot of time for babar but he needs a hundred in the next game. Nothing less will do
 
waleed88 said:
Yes for a country who is 9th in Test rankings if I'm not wrong. We are clearly headed in that direction since we can afford so many chances to BA
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And it paid off big time, became the first EVER batsman to score twin hundreds at Headingley. Sabr ka phal etc...

Anyway Babar is not immune to criticism but some of your points go a bit beyond that.
 
I personally think it would be best to stick the current batting line up. Babar clearly has a lot of potential and its best we stick with him. Either keep at No.5 or put him down to No.6. Since this was just the first test after Mis-You I wouldn't be too hard on Pakistan but still they should have batted better in the second innings.
 
Abdullah719 said:
And it paid off big time, became the first EVER batsman to score twin hundreds at Headingley. Sabr ka phal etc...

Anyway Babar is not immune to criticism but some of your points go a bit beyond that.
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That is an exception. Should anyone who keeps failing not be dropped for the 1% chance that it pays off?

Babar looks like a solid batsman and should definitely be persisted with, but that's not a good example.
 
Abdullah719 said:
And it paid off big time, became the first EVER batsman to score twin hundreds at Headingley. Sabr ka phal etc...

Anyway Babar is not immune to criticism but some of your points go a bit beyond that.
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Anything before the word 'but' is meaningless.
 
West Indies cricket has a total of 6 domestic teams, we have 4 times the no.4 of teams playing in the domestic competition. Which means 4 times the player vying for that one spot. West Indies have no option but to play those names coming from those 6 teams... Pakistan has more options, and should pursue them, because the demand for those same spots is higher. 1 player getting a chance to play 10 test matches is an example of luxury and nepotism that should not be afforded, because there are 7-8 names that could easily replace/bench him. If you are not doing that you are doing injustice to the other 7-8 names who deserve to be called up on merit in place of this failure.

IN Pakistan's scenario, those are too many chances afforded to a player who is not good enough for this level of cricket.
 
Whatever he has learnt in batting for longer format, he'll forget everything if he is sent back to master QEA. His only realistic chance is to learn it in the middle.

His FC average is <40, so I don't think it's going to jump to 50+ just by playing "domestics". It doesnt happen so easily. Besides, what I understand is his main problem is focus - can't keep it more than few overs. Didn't see today's dismissal, but 1st innings dismissal won't happen to a school cricketer to that ball, if he was focused enough to realize that was last over of the day.

I don't think, playing 60-70 overs FC innings will help much in this regard - some how, somehow he has to bat for 10 hours in a Test, be it against Afghans or Irish or whoever; it'll be different after that.
 
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Agreed with [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION]

Guns are on a young batsman who needs backing, While no question over so called seasoned Asad Shafiq?
 
This golden boy treatment for Babar Azam needs to end. If he doesn't fire by the end of this series, he should be replaced. It's as simple as that.
 
He should not be an automatic selection.

Give him one more test and if he does not click, he can warm the bench.
 
Worst selection in our test team for the last two years. Wasted 10 tests on him, we had so many better batsmen waiting in the ranks
 
Can't wait for all the haters to be proven wrong. Such a talent and people are writing him off after 10 matches.

He will be a huge success in tests- people need to calm down.
 
He is in the team just based on all of the hype around him.

Mediocre as hell.
 
mak36 said:
Can't wait for all the haters to be proven wrong. Such a talent and people are writing him off after 10 matches.

He will be a huge success in tests- people need to calm down.
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At the moment, all of his lovers are being proven wrong. :))
 
He needs a break from the test format and focus on ODIs
 
Although I have no liking for Fawad Alam ,kind of hate his batting but I don't think he can do worse than Babar.
 
He needs to understand that its test match and not odis. His technique is fine but his temperament isnt there yet.

Needs to to dropped for now.
 
Beyond my understanding how such a talented guy can be so poor in Test cricket. Even in T20s and ODIs he plays proper shots so why can’t he do that in Test cricket like Root, Smith, Williamson and Kohli. Must be some mental issue. Had he been an Afridi, Maxwell or Pollard I would have understood his failures but this is a straight bat guy.

Should be dropped and play alot of FC cricket.
 
mak36 said:
Can't wait for all the haters to be proven wrong. Such a talent and people are writing him off after 10 matches.

He will be a huge success in tests- people need to calm down.
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It is not a question of love or hate; there is no need of going to those extremes, but the question is, does Babar deserve to be dropped from the Test team? At the moment, undoubtedly so. However, this doesn't mean that he doesn't have the potential to be a good Test player in the future.

People need to tone down their rampant fan-boyism at times. Babar is severely undercooked at F/C level at this stage and Test cricket is not a platform where you will teach a baby to walk.

At the moment, he belongs in domestic 4 day cricket and not Test cricket.
 
mak36 said:
Can't wait for all the haters to be proven wrong. Such a talent and people are writing him off after 10 matches.

He will be a huge success in tests- people need to calm down.
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The haters don't need to wait though :srini
 
Babar trying to prove as much as he can, that he's not a test bat, as of now. But Mickey can't see.

He needs to play at least 2 seasons of FC.
 
I called it a while ago that he doesn't have the temperament for test cricket but his fans came and gave us stats for other players after 10 matches. 🙂
 
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