Is MS Dhoni assured a wicket-keeping or #6 spot in a all-time ODI XI?

[jeetu]

Gilchrist was pretty good ODI opener but he lacked consistency with big scores.

Below is the table of players with min 10 centuries as openers.

[table= class: grid, align: center]
[tr][td]Player [/td][td]Inns [/td][td]Ave [/td][td]SR [/td][td]100 [/td][td]50 [/td][td]100 ratio [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]HM Amla [/td][td]150 [/td][td]50.75 [/td][td]89.36 [/td][td]25 [/td][td]33 [/td][td]16.67 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Q de Kock [/td][td]82 [/td][td]44.03 [/td][td]94.42 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]14.63 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]RG Sharma [/td][td]79 [/td][td]53.49 [/td][td]88.75 [/td][td]11 [/td][td]20 [/td][td]13.92 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]DA Warner [/td][td]94 [/td][td]44.27 [/td][td]96.36 [/td][td]13 [/td][td]16 [/td][td]13.83 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SR Tendulkar [/td][td]340 [/td][td]48.29 [/td][td]88.05 [/td][td]45 [/td][td]75 [/td][td]13.24 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]S Dhawan [/td][td]89 [/td][td]44.45 [/td][td]92.55 [/td][td]11 [/td][td]21 [/td][td]12.36 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]TM Dilshan [/td][td]176 [/td][td]46.04 [/td][td]89.08 [/td][td]21 [/td][td]34 [/td][td]11.93 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]ME Waugh [/td][td]141 [/td][td]44.06 [/td][td]76.74 [/td][td]15 [/td][td]32 [/td][td]10.64 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]HH Gibbs [/td][td]182 [/td][td]35.69 [/td][td]82.86 [/td][td]18 [/td][td]24 [/td][td]9.89 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]MJ Guptill [/td][td]122 [/td][td]45.56 [/td][td]88.91 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]27 [/td][td]9.84 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]ME Trescothick [/td][td]122 [/td][td]37.37 [/td][td]85.21 [/td][td]12 [/td][td]21 [/td][td]9.84 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]CG Greenidge [/td][td]120 [/td][td]45.39 [/td][td]64.65 [/td][td]11 [/td][td]31 [/td][td]9.17 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Saeed Anwar [/td][td]220 [/td][td]39.98 [/td][td]79.93 [/td][td]20 [/td][td]37 [/td][td]9.09 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]CH Gayle [/td][td]245 [/td][td]39.11 [/td][td]86.07 [/td][td]22 [/td][td]46 [/td][td]8.98 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]WU Tharanga [/td][td]165 [/td][td]34.44 [/td][td]74.95 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]27 [/td][td]8.48 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]SC Ganguly [/td][td]236 [/td][td]41.57 [/td][td]73.59 [/td][td]19 [/td][td]58 [/td][td]8.05 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]NJ Astle [/td][td]186 [/td][td]34.89 [/td][td]72.72 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]37 [/td][td]7.53 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]G Kirsten [/td][td]175 [/td][td]41.8 [/td][td]72.25 [/td][td]13 [/td][td]45 [/td][td]7.43 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]ST Jayasuriya [/td][td]383 [/td][td]34.61 [/td][td]92.48 [/td][td]28 [/td][td]66 [/td][td]7.31 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]DL Haynes [/td][td]237 [/td][td]41.37 [/td][td]63.09 [/td][td]17 [/td][td]57 [/td][td]7.17 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]ML Hayden [/td][td]147 [/td][td]44.3 [/td][td]78.7 [/td][td]10 [/td][td]33 [/td][td]6.80 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]V Sehwag [/td][td]212 [/td][td]36.49 [/td][td]104.7 [/td][td]14 [/td][td]35 [/td][td]6.60 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]AC Gilchrist [/td][td]259 [/td][td]36.5 [/td][td]98.02 [/td][td]16 [/td][td]53 [/td][td]6.18 [/td][/tr]
[tr][td]GC Smith [/td][td]193 [/td][td]38.1 [/td][td]80.94 [/td][td]10 [/td][td]47 [/td][td]5.18 [/td][/tr]
[/table]

 

[Vayuu]

Well, he still won a WC in Australia for his country despite him not being so good in that format allegedly. Were Kapil to get in ahead of him in a ODI XI who cares, Test's are the ultimate format anyway.

Kapil led from the front in 83 wc and changed the course of final first by taking catch of Richards which was an amazing catch and then knocking one of the settled bat later on.

 

[Bilal7]

He will, in my all-time ODI XI:

1) Sachin Tendulker
2) Hashim Amla
3) Ricky Ponting
4) Viv Richards
5) AB de Villiers
6) MS Dhoni (wk)
7) Imran Khan (c)
8) Wasim Akram
9) Saqlain Mushtaq
10) Glenn McGrath
11) Joel Garner/Mutthiah Muralitharan

Invincible team. Two openers with 70+ centuries between them and an ability to bat long at a great SR. Three destructive middle-order batsmen follow who can dominate the best of attacks and cut through the total. A couple of finishers with match-winning innings in WC finals follow who will get the team over the line by hook or crook, if the previous five haven't.

The bowling attack is made up of five absolute legends. Pace, swing, seam, bounce, accuracy, tenacity, guile, reverse, doosra, yorkers, huge spin and anything else that an ODI bowler may need will be available when these five bowl as a unit. They are captained by arguably the greatest cricket captains of all-time who led a much, much inferior team to an ODI WC win.

Glorious.

 

[Teshi98]

He will, in my all-time ODI XI:

1) Sachin Tendulker
2) Hashim Amla
3) Ricky Ponting
4) Viv Richards
5) AB de Villiers
6) MS Dhoni (wk)
7) Imran Khan (c)
8) Wasim Akram
9) Saqlain Mushtaq
10) Glenn McGrath
11) Joel Garner/Mutthiah Muralitharan

Invincible team. Two openers with 70+ centuries between them and an ability to bat long at a great SR. Three destructive middle-order batsmen follow who can dominate the best of attacks and cut through the total. A couple of finishers with match-winning innings in WC finals follow who will get the team over the line by hook or crook, if the previous five haven't.

The bowling attack is made up of five absolute legends. Pace, swing, seam, bounce, accuracy, tenacity, guile, reverse, doosra, yorkers, huge spin and anything else that an ODI bowler may need will be available when these five bowl as a unit. They are captained by arguably the greatest cricket captains of all-time who led a much, much inferior team to an ODI WC win.

Glorious.

Great team but positions of amla imran and saqlain are debatable.
Imran was a great captain but so were dhoni and ponting. He does not gets in team based on captaincy alone and in odis kapil was a better player than him.

 

[Sidilicious]

Tendulkar
Haynes
Ponting
Viv
Kohl
MSD (c)
Klusener
Shakib
Wasim
Warne
McGrath

Someone beat this team.

 

[Sachin136]

Tendulkar
Haynes
Ponting
Viv
Kohl
MSD (c)
Klusener
Shakib
Wasim
Warne
McGrath

Someone beat this team.

One of those is not like the others. You will have a hard time getting 20 overs from Klusener and Shakib.

 

[CricFan2012]

Gilly made his debut in 1996, and Dhoni in 2004. I suppose in a span of 8 years, all the ATG bowlers vanished from the face of the earth?

All ATG bowlers retired 2007-2008.

Gilly faced more years of ATG bowling than Dhoni, 8 years is a lot of cricket matches against Wasim, Waqar, Saqlain, Pollock, Donald, while dhoni didnt even face half of them, and i havent named all the bowlers even

 

[FreePalestine]

What about AB De Villiers?

 

[The_Odd_One]

Great team but positions of amla imran and saqlain are debatable.
Imran was a great captain but so were dhoni and ponting. He does not gets in team based on captaincy alone and in odis kapil was a better player than him.

Saqlain is arguably the greatest ODI spinner of all time.

 

[IndianWillow]

Kapil Dev does not belong in an all time great ODI. He was a very effective bowling allrounder, but he did benefit from a long career, significant exposure and representing a side that did not have a great deal of competition for him.

I do not know enough of Imran's exploits in ODIs, however, i would not choose him as captain. Better captains have played the game, better captains play the game.

Kapil was ranked #1 ODI allrounder for nearly a decade. He was exceptional in ODIs. He was unlucky to be playing in an era when he didnt have a suitable bowling partner, so the pressure he created at one end often got released at the other end, allowing the batting team to prosper more often than not. No great bowler does really well if he goes without a decent support at the other end. For most of his peak, Kapil had to battle home pitches not conducive to pace, inadequate bowling support, and little vacation ( he nearly played every test and ODI India played during his era, regardless of whether he was fit or not). He got thru this handicap in ODIs but in tests consistent lack of good support can really hurt any bowler. Some of his finest bowling spells like his 9/83 at Ahmedabad against WI went in vain for such reasons. Full context is needed for analyzing any player.

 

[ToeCrusher2]

Tendulkar
Jayasuria
Ponting
viv
kohli
Dhoni (c)
Symonds
Kapil/Kluesner
Wasim
Warne
Mcgrath

This is the greatest ODI team ever, look at the batting depth, look at the bowling depth.

 

[Rightarmfast]

All ATG bowlers retired 2007-2008.

Gilly faced more years of ATG bowling than Dhoni, 8 years is a lot of cricket matches against Wasim, Waqar, Saqlain, Pollock, Donald, while dhoni didnt even face half of them, and i havent named all the bowlers even

Thanks for confirming Amir, Asif , Shoaib Akhtar have been pedestrian bowlers. I echo your thoughts btw!

 

[The_Odd_One]

Jayasuriya
Tendulkar
Viv
Kohli
Bevan
Dhoni
Symonds
Akram
Saqlain
Garner
McGrath

 

[mubidoda]

Dhoni matches 301 runs 9700 avg becomes 32.11 as compared to gilli matches 287 runs 9600 avg 33.44 dhonis avg is high becoz of not outs where as gilli was openr and had played on tracks where the ball was swinging so much that if dhoni would have played on those tracke he wouldnt have scored more than 4000 runs

 

[anoop]

Dhoni matches 301 runs 9700 avg becomes 32.11 as compared to gilli matches 287 runs 9600 avg 33.44 dhonis avg is high becoz of not outs where as gilli was openr and had played on tracks where the ball was swinging so much that if dhoni would have played on those tracke he wouldnt have scored more than 4000 runs

You are wrong. Dhoni has played 302 matches but only 260 innings. Gilchrist has played 287 matches but 279 innings.

Gilchrist - 279 innings 9619 runs avg 34.47
Dhoni- 260 innings 9737 runs avg 37.45

Even without Not outs dhoni has scored more per innings than Gilchrist and this is more impressive as he bats down the order. Mostly he has batted at no. 6 in his cricketing career till now.

 

[Teshi98]

Dhoni matches 301 runs 9700 avg becomes 32.11 as compared to gilli matches 287 runs 9600 avg 33.44 dhonis avg is high becoz of not outs where as gilli was openr and had played on tracks where the ball was swinging so much that if dhoni would have played on those tracke he wouldnt have scored more than 4000 runs

This is not a solid atlrguement. Not only has dhoni played lesser number of innings which automatically makes his average per innings more than gillly but atleast 10 percent of his innings include not more than 20 balls . And gilchrist would always get to bat as he was the opener. I think that comparing fron this view can only be done for players having identical roles in matches.

 

[jeetu]

1. Amla
2. Tendulkar
3. Richards
4. Kohli/ABD
5. Bevan
6. Dhoni
7. Flintoff
8. Akram
9. Saqlain/Warne
10. Garner
11. McGrath

 

[bujhee kom]

SRT
Gilly+
Viv
Ponting
ABD
Bevan
Shakib
Akram
Saqlain
Lee
McGrath

Perfect!

 

[IndianWillow]

Dhoni matches 301 runs 9700 avg becomes 32.11 as compared to gilli matches 287 runs 9600 avg 33.44 dhonis avg is high becoz of not outs where as gilli was openr and had played on tracks where the ball was swinging so much that if dhoni would have played on those tracke he wouldnt have scored more than 4000 runs

The 'not outs' argument has been busted many times. Not a valid one for ODIs. Else you would be having dozens of #6 batsmen averaging 50+. Why only the likes of Bevan and Dhoni managed to remain not out? Dhoni not as good a test batsman as Gilly but in ODIs Dhoni does not technical flaws and can bat under diverse conditions.

 

[IndianWillow]

Gilly has only one game. Bang Bang bang. Dhoni can bat in many gears. Build an innings, revive a collapse, steer a chase, and slog and smash big as well.