Is Rishabh Pant getting pigeonholed into a finisher role?

[giri26]

Ever since the Indian World Cup squad was announced, the one thing which has been in constant discussion is the omission of Rishabh Pant from the 15. Yes there have been talks about Ambati Rayudu missing out as well but Pant has been the favourite for everyone and the noise has only got louder. I agree that Pant is an amazing talent. A supremely talented batter who has impressed one and all within just a year of playing Test cricket but his omission is valid for what the team management is scouting for.

Pant is a brilliant young player and for sure is the future of Indian batting in all formats. The one thing though I am not that convinced about is everyone trying to fit him into a finisher role. A finisher role in LO format requires two completely different skill set to be effective. One while batting first providing the required impetus to get the team to a good total and two is while chasing playing at a right pace to finish games for your side. While I agree that Pant can easily fit into the former when the team is batting first , he I am afraid is not there yet as a finisher while chasing.

While Pant is the replacement for Dhoni in the limited overs format, we should not take it literally and expect him to do what Dhoni does so effectively. Dhoni was different, when he came in, it felt as though he was always meant to be a finisher. Within a year he was winning games for the country chasing some big totals with mature head on his shoulders. Pant isn’t there yet and needs time before he can get there.

That’s the reason I feel he missed out on the selection as well for the World Cup. In the current scenario, the best value you can get of him in the LO format is at the top of the order. He can bat at number 4 or even open the batting in the future. Effectively he can be the floater in the batting line up can be used based on the situation of the game. That will give him the freedom to go after the bowling without the pressures of trying to preserve his wicket. He is just 21 and trying to pigeonhole him into a role where he isn’t that comfortable yet is completely destroying his potential and his ability to effectively contribute to the team’s success. While the experts are right about his potential their premise for the argument is wrong. We could see the effect of the same in the recently concluded Australian series where he was trying things he wasn’t comfortable doing. We need to give him space and provide him with the freedom to express himself as we have done in the Test format.

I am not saying Pant can never be a finisher in ODIs, he will get there in the future, but he isn’t there yet.

-Giri26

 

[RamLakhan]

Nobody can become a finisher within 10-20 matches (or 2-3 years) of their career! Even Dhoni took few years to be called like that! What you mean by calling finisher is - he has to bat lower down the order from No.5 perhaps, that's where the role of "finisher" comes into play! This is a position where you will have to sometimes play innings like 40(14) coming in at 45th over of the innings batting first OR 55(40)* chasing 80 of 55 balls! OR it can also be a case of 110(125) coming at 117/4 after a collapse in the 25th over! OR even 85(65) coming at 225/4 in 37th over (steadying the ship with calculated risks) OR 38(36) chasing 320 coming at 256/7 after 38 overs (typical Dhoni like sucking the pressure without messing with super heroics)...

So this is what you call a finisher role where you can be relied upon to handle so many situations in different ways with different approaches & different gears! So finisher is not necessarily like someone who plays a cameo innings at the end consistently (even a late-order batsman or tailender can do this job!) So you cannot rely upon a newcomer to suddenly get into the team & handle this tough job! Even somebody like Ajay Jadeja became some kind of finisher towards the end of his career and that's after he batted in so many batting positions (even as opener in the beginning of his career) and gained experience handling so many situations, so many opposition, pitches, etc! Same thing goes with Dhoni... So Dhoni the finisher, Rohit the opener, Kohli the best batsman, Bumrah the No.1 bowler, Jadeja the fielder, all will take some time!

You may also question why some of the top-order batsmen/openers drop themselves down and handle this finisher role! Well their role is different, their role is more like setting up the game for the team (and hence avoiding the "finishing" task itself...!) So they develop themselves (take years for that) to play in that way and be successful in that! So it will be totally unfair to ask them to switch their role into a different one! Actually the ones who couldn't adjust to top-order batting will gradually fall into finishing role (like A.Jadeja) and vice versa also at times (like Rohit Sharma who was tried at No.4 to No.6 for some years!)

Finishing job tests a lot of your mental strength/pressure-handling/situation-handling, waiting-game! While Top-Order is more of testing your skills/technique handling the new ball, taking advantage of powerplay, setting the game, taking initiative... Finishers have the advantage of handling softer ball, spread field, tired bowlers/fielders...

So you need to give time sometimes to find out where they actually fit in... If you force someone to do a specific thing and don't trust them enough then you will not get the BEST out of them and will eventually lose them as a player itself on the whole! Hence A.Jadeja & R.Sharma had to handle a different role just to stay in the team & learn the actual basic (the game itself! The international cricket! Top-Order or Middle-order/Finishing comes later on!)

So, in Pant's case, what we urge is, he should play as much international cricket possible to learn the trade quickly (it is so fascinating to see how he is fast-tracked in Tests! But we know what's hindering him in LOIs...) So give him some years he will automatically fall into one of the two roles eventually! If you keep waiting for Dhoni to retire OR the openers to fade out, then he will go nowhere! So play him in whatever batting position available as of now (If it is No.4 or No.5 or whatever and don't be harsh if he doesn't "finish" the match as such, as I explained there are 5 to 10 varieties of match-scenarios for a finisher to handle! For the moment let him handle 2 or 3 varieties to start with! Even the great Dhoni has lost at least 4 to 5 of these varieties today!)

We are asking for his inclusion only because we don't Yuvaraj, Raina, Prime-Dhoni kind of batsmen in our middle-order! He can definitely play as a specialist batsman in the team (Srilanka in the past, and England currently have multiple WKs in their playing XI... Even India has DK ) So no issues in having Pant as well... England's modern trend of framing team is stacking up with multiple alrounders! I think in future we will see players developing multiple skills/alround abilities to stay in the selection hunt with fierce competition, so I feel sorry for people who think Pant should be not in the team because he is a Wicket Keeper!

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Selectors did the right thing by excluding him. Its a world cup not some kitply cup where you are going to rest your main players like Karthik or Dhoni and play noobs like Pant.

Let him learn to keep and play responsibly first. The way he batted against West Indies in that ODI series gave an impression that he lacks game awareness and will most likely go for a glory shot and get out.

 

[RamLakhan]

Selectors did the right thing by excluding him. Its a world cup not some kitply cup where you are going to rest your main players like Karthik or Dhoni and play noobs like Pant.

Let him learn to keep and play responsibly first. The way he batted against West Indies in that ODI series gave an impression that he lacks game awareness and will most likely go for a glory shot and get out.

Karthik was rested for like 2-3 world cups Nobody will learn to play responsibly as soon as they hold bat in their hand!

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Karthik was rested for like 2-3 world cups Nobody will learn to play responsibly as soon as they hold bat in their hand!

Whats the problem then? Let Rishabh Pant rest for 2 World Cups too.

 

[Tyler Durden]

I don't understand what's all this hype about this hack Pant? A terrible WK, a terrible fielder, and a batsman who lacks temperament to construct an innings and play according to the situation. But I'm reading a thread about him being a Finisher for Team India! Even the Indian forums do not overhype this hack to the moon like some folks on PP do.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

Is finishing the only damn thing left in cricket. Why can't he be a middle order batsman?

 

[Chokli]

Doesn't seem like an ODI player.

Should focus on Tests and T20s

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

When was the last time karthik played role of a finisher in odi.?
FGS karthik avgs 30 in odis, he is a ttf.
He maybe a better wktkeeper than pant but do people really think that MS will miss a match. His fitness standards are so high that he rarely gets injured.
Karthik is just on a free vacation.

 

[Hasan123]

Selectors did the right thing by excluding him. Its a world cup not some kitply cup where you are going to rest your main players like Karthik or Dhoni and play noobs like Pant.

Let him learn to keep and play responsibly first. The way he batted against West Indies in that ODI series gave an impression that he lacks game awareness and will most likely go for a glory shot and get out.

So players aren't allowed to develop? Fail once and drop them forever.

 

[Mamoon]

Pant is an outrageously gifted player. India are very lucky to have him. The Indians who are writing him off as a hack deserve Karthiks and Parthiv Patels.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

So players aren't allowed to develop? Fail once and drop them forever.

That logic applies to every player in the world. Don't act like you never wanted someone to get out of your team after watching him play and fail in few innings. I am sure you would happily give more chances to Bilawal Bhatti and Hammad Azam because I find them special?

 

[cricketworm]

Pant is an outrageously gifted player. India are very lucky to have him. The Indians who are writing him off as a hack deserve Karthiks and Parthiv Patels.

I agree. He can demoralize any bowler in the world and change the course of the match. Pandya is similar, but Pandya has the greater temperament. Post KwK gate, looks like Pandya's temperament has even improved.

Pant's throwing away wicket is a worry but not unexpected worry. Kid is very young, MSD wasn't the keeper the way he is at the moment. It took him a while before he became very good level. Pant needs to be given that benefit of the doubt.

Pant in test side is even more dangerous for the opposition than his limited over contribution at the moment. thanks to India's great top 4.

Pant will be number 1 pick in all formats post-MSD's retirement, and rightly so.

 

[cricketjoshila]

He is 21 and he is a very gifted batsman. His mental game will mature with age.

Some Pakistani posters on PP called him a Tullaybaaz after his 1st 2 tests. Pant now avgs 49 in tests with hundreds in England and Australia. I wonder if any wk batsman from Asia has achieved that. Sanga may have done so but he quit wicket keeping.

The ability to dismiss the talent of Indian players, is unparalleled in a few posters here.

 

[topspin]

He is 21 and he is a very gifted batsman. His mental game will mature with age.

Some Pakistani posters on PP called him a Tullaybaaz after his 1st 2 tests. Pant now avgs 49 in tests with hundreds in England and Australia. I wonder if any wk batsman from Asia has achieved that. Sanga may have done so but he quit wicket keeping.

The ability to dismiss the talent of Indian players, is unparalleled in a few posters here.

I think you'll find his biggest critic is actually Indian.

FYI I rate Pant highly.

 

[troodon]

Ideally Pant should come in at 2 down or 3 down. To continue the momentum during middle overs. Pant is not a finisher. He is fickle as a batsman due to his approach. He can finish innings, but i would prefer him to play 20-30 overs every ODI. If he clicks, then its match over for the opposition.

 

[Ab Fan]

In all seriousness, Pant is like a left-handed Sehwag. Dangerous, outrageously gifted but at times can throw his wicket playing reckless shot.

He deserved to have been part of the WC19, given, India already had a guy like MS Dhoni who has unmatchable game awareness. Pant batting behind him can play his natural game without taking much pressure and also would have been pleased to share the playing XI with MSD during the WC.

 

[Hasan123]

That logic applies to every player in the world. Don't act like you never wanted someone to get out of your team after watching him play and fail in few innings. I am sure you would happily give more chances to Bilawal Bhatti and Hammad Azam because I find them special?

I wanted Hammad Azam to be given a run of games after initially seeing him play. He helped us a win a game against West Indies. He showed good temperament and was dropped after that series.


A player like Pant will come good. Stroke makers like Pant take a little while to develop, they just need backing.

He averages 49 in tests. Clearly has the talent. You have just made your mind up after 1 game last year.