Manchester Arena blast : 22 dead and several dozens injured

[shaz619]

So heartbroken seeing all the family's post pictures of missing children on social media

 

[90MPH]

I think people also need to also realise IS want to cause division and disharmony with such a cowardly attack.

I just hope the Police locate the terrorist cell/group quickly before another attack happens, highly doubt this attack was made and then carried out alone.

 

[90MPH]

So heartbroken seeing all the family's post pictures of missing children on social media

My nieces and cousins go to these type of pop concerts so it could have been them on another day.

So disgusted at these fanatics who carried it out and so sad for the victims. RIP.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I think people also need to also realise IS want to cause division and disharmony with such a cowardly attack.

I just hope the Police locate the terrorist cell/group quickly before another attack happens, highly doubt this attack was made and then carried out alone.

IS is a misnomer. You don't build a state by running people down in trucks or blowing up a concert hall. These people are little more than homicidal trolls. They don't deserve to be given some sort of purpose even one as pathetic as causing division and disharmony.

 

[90MPH]

IS is a misnomer. You don't build a state by running people down in trucks or blowing up a concert hall. These people are little more than homicidal trolls. They don't deserve to be given some sort of purpose even one as pathetic as causing division and disharmony.

They have been smashed from the air in the last 18 months in both Iraq and Syria - Iraq they have nearly been wiped out barring their last stand in Mosul.

So now they are retreating and have been carrying out all these attacks in Europe to tell the world they are still alive. These Desperate fanatics are either directly carrying them out or inspiring local radicals of the same mindset.

This will go on for a few years because they don't have to make bombs, just using a vehicle is enough for them.

I think our politicians understand this and are making responsible statements.

 

[SandyB]

They have been smashed from the air in the last 18 months in both Iraq and Syria - Iraq they have nearly been wiped out barring their last stand in Mosul.

So now they are retreating and have been carrying out all these attacks in Europe to tell the world they are still alive. These Desperate fanatics are either directly carrying them out or inspiring local radicals of the same mindset.

This will go on for a few years because they don't have to make bombs, just using a vehicle is enough for them.

I think our politicians understand this and are making responsible statements.

Isn't this precisely ISIS'es success mantra.?

They've managed to put terrorism on the cloud !!!

You don't need to keep constant communication with your leaders like in Al Queda, no need of frequent meetings or status reports, just download necessary propaganda and make do with whatever that's available in your surroundings and cause whatever harm you can. It's working like a make it yourself home recipie, with the ISIS providing nothing more than the list of ingredients.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Isn't this precisely ISIS'es success mantra.?

They've managed to put terrorism on the cloud !!!

You don't need to keep constant communication with your leaders like in Al Queda, no need of frequent meetings or status reports, just download necessary propaganda and make do with whatever that's available in your surroundings and cause whatever harm you can. It's working like a make it yourself home recipie, with the ISIS providing nothing more than the list of ingredients.

In that case they should change their name to IT because their goal has become Islamic Terrorism, but of course they won't do that because that is a very different objective to building a state. So no, I don't agree that it's their success mantra, at least not one they have claimed.

 

[shaz619]

My nieces and cousins go to these type of pop concerts so it could have been them on another day.

So disgusted at these fanatics who carried it out and so sad for the victims. RIP.

Be careful bro.

Absolutely shattered, I can't get myself to leave the house today; feel so depressed.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

My nieces and cousins go to these type of pop concerts so it could have been them on another day.

So disgusted at these fanatics who carried it out and so sad for the victims. RIP.

Mine too. I can't imagine how the families of the victims are feeling right now. We are lucky we live in a country which still cares about it's citizens, I can imagine there's a lot of places where this is just how they live.

 

[Swashbuckler]

Heartbreaking to see photos of worried/distraught parents, how it must hurt to see their precious children caught in this mess. We need to unite and speak in one voice, using this event to further our political agenda/ideology won't help anyone. ISIS is 100% anti Islam, they have killed more Muslims globally than any other organization. They are a bunch of homicidal maniacs and ISIS is a mad man's asylum. Strength to the people of Manchester and hope we get rid of this evil in the near future. I read news reports about Muslim cab drivers driving all the people in the are for free and Gurudwaras opening their doors for food and comfort. So many nice people around, these 0.01% pigs don't represent Islam or humanity...there are too many decent folk in the world who will stand tall and give the maniacs a befitting response.

 

[Syed1]

Inna lillahi wa inna illahi raj'ioon...


Unfortunately most of the deceased would be young teenaged girls with their whole lives ahead of them

 

[SpiritOf1903]

As per above, it wouldn't be very hard to persuade a deranged individual to commit such acts. Our security services need to be more vigilant.

At a pop concert. The country is just recovering from the Westminster atrocity.

 

[90MPH]

Mine too. I can't imagine how the families of the victims are feeling right now. We are lucky we live in a country which still cares about it's citizens, I can imagine there's a lot of places where this is just how they live.

So true, I don't think they anyone envisaged these nutters targeting teenage kids.
But such is their warped mind they don't see any line not to cross.

 

[90MPH]

Isn't this precisely ISIS'es success mantra.?

They've managed to put terrorism on the cloud !!!

You don't need to keep constant communication with your leaders like in Al Queda, no need of frequent meetings or status reports, just download necessary propaganda and make do with whatever that's available in your surroundings and cause whatever harm you can. It's working like a make it yourself home recipie, with the ISIS providing nothing more than the list of ingredients.

I don't even them a terrorist group as such but warped radical religious fanatics with no political purpose other than power to control.

 

[s28]

US news agencies have named the 'suspect' arrested by Manchester police in connection with the attack but not the 'suicide bomber' but seem to be conflating the two

 

[MMHS]

Very sad incidence; may Lord mercy on the departed souls & give strength to the family. Terrorism has no race or religion, neither the victims.

 

[s28]

This homeless man went to people's aid, i think there is a crowdfund going on for him and the kids

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">'We had to pull nails out of children's faces': Steve, a homeless man who was sleeping near <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Manchester?src=hash">#Manchester</a> Arena, rushed to help young victims <a href="https://t.co/dyxzZpal0Q">pic.twitter.com/dyxzZpal0Q</a></p>— ITV News (@itvnews) <a href="https://twitter.com/itvnews/status/867001780193898498">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[SandyB]

In that case they should change their name to IT because their goal has become Islamic Terrorism, but of course they won't do that because that is a very different objective to building a state. So no, I don't agree that it's their success mantra, at least not one they have claimed.

Imagine some one making a good dish from a Gordon Ramsay recipe . If it turns out good can Gordon claim it as his ?..

That seems to be exactly what ISIS does now. They need to keep extending the narrative that they are well and alive and developing ..

Whether innocent muslim's get demonized and and profiled in not there concern. From whatever I understand about their ideology they want the whole muslim world to go into "Us vs Them" mode and fight to the end ..

 

[SandyB]

I don't even them a terrorist group as such but warped radical religious fanatics with no political purpose other than power to control.

In the end its always about power man !

But their success lies in how well they mask this intention .

Like the poor 15 souls who left for Syria from my state (Kerala, India) found out. Though they were all supposed to fight for the ummah, these ISIS arabs coundn't bring themselves to fight amongst dark south indians, and chose to put them for toilet cleaning and such household chores..

So much for the Global Caliphate.

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en"><p lang="und" dir="ltr"><a href="https://t.co/f1FdXykONx">pic.twitter.com/f1FdXykONx</a></p>— EL4C (@EL4JC) <a href="https://twitter.com/EL4JC/status/867009457573814272">May 23, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[MMHS]

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] -

I won't go to usual debate - those who are responsible, doesn't represent any civilized community or religion.

But, I have a question to you, since you lived in Manchester at similar time I was in London. It's long back, still I can recall that London was probably the most protected city in Earth - from terrorism to neuclear attack. While British Poilce, MI6 & SAS are the most efficient operators in their field, which more or less accepted by almost everyone. Last time, when I went to London with my wife, I got a bit nervous - weather they have a camera in my bed room or not London & Manchester is probably the best protected City in world against counter terrorism with 3d scanners, digital sensors & secrets police - in fact they almost stripped even my baby upto diaper at Heathrow, despite her parents having Canadian PR & herself being a Canadian passport holder (probably for my first name).

Having said that - 21k people is not a mass for entry checking - Manchester arena should have enough gates to check everyone entering the arena with proprep scanning - it shouldn't take more than 2 hours for entire crowd. They do it at Metro Toronto Convention Centre, which is situated at the heart of one of the safest city in western world.

Still, some goons could take enough explosives (probably C4, I am not an expert, but it's not a mobile phone for sure) to blow 23 people & injure 100+. Whatever gross picture I have seen, it's not the job of a hand granade or Molotov cocktail that one can torch with a beer can. These people could take that explosives, enjoy the beauty & sounds of Aryana Grande & then blew them selves with few others. It's not that someone has stabbed few people or has strangled someone with bare hands.

This raises few questions to my dumb mind just before the election of British permanent, which might see several surprise results this time -

1. Dahes (ISIS) or whoever is responsible, developed a technology that can transport mass destructive explosives in a capsule as small as a ring stone or button, that can bypass the 3D image scanning.

2. OR, they are sold such technology by intellectual people (a bunch as a whole) whose stock market fluctuates with certain deals done by a President with a tyran king.

3. There are Isis (or whoever responsible) people in British internal security system, which allowed the goons to clear the security checkpoints with few KG of RDX

4. The terrorists came with the event management group under cover, or part of Grande's consurt team - shifted the explosives long before the security checking started; but then, either they cleared the airport or collected the explosives somewhere within Manchester - either way, No. 3 comes in mind.

5. It can be an accident with gas deposits, electric spark or some miracles I can't imagine

6. It's done by a 3rd party serceat service/agents that are equally skilled & equiept to pass the security checking & conduct such proficient demolishing job for someone's vested interest.


I would appreciate proper spirited response from you in this regard; because I had been at Anfield, (probably 35 km West of this arena) few years back when terrorism wasn't such a big threat - still they scanned me as if I was a gang star. What RDX, they forced me to leave my extra Coke can, so that I don't crash it on someone's head.

PS: writing from mobile after long weekend, so pardon my English.

 

[SL_Fan]

All up around 120 injured according to latest reports.

59 people were taken for treatment at eight hospitals across Greater Manchester. A further 60 were treated as 'walking wounded'.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Imagine some one making a good dish from a Gordon Ramsay recipe . If it turns out good can Gordon claim it as his ?..

That seems to be exactly what ISIS does now. They need to keep extending the narrative that they are well and alive and developing ..

Whether innocent muslim's get demonized and and profiled in not there concern. From whatever I understand about their ideology they want the whole muslim world to go into "Us vs Them" mode and fight to the end ..

But then they should change their name and their primary goal to one of terrorism. I think this distinction is important because I had some interaction with the original Caliphate group that used to be known in the UK as HT, then later rebranded as Al Muhajiroun. I thought they were idiots, but even they didn't publicly espouse violence because for them there was no point unless it was with a view to victory.

"Them vs Us" isn't victory and running people over in trucks isn't going to establish a caliphate. So then where do they get off calling themselves IS? Their tendency to claim every desperate act of isolated rage only rubber stamps their impotence. If they called themselves the Jokers and their goal was to kill Harvey Dent I would take them more seriously to be honest.

 

[Adil_94]

sickening attack no surprise from the I.S followers. I.S have repeatedly urged their supporters to carry out domestic attacks by any means necessary. And they finally have attacked young children. No surprise with them being humiliated on the battlefield they will resort to these tactic more and.more

 

[khalil1986]

Shocking news and very saddening, the sooner the world is rid of all these fanatics the better.

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

Rip

 

[s28]

SO the suspect is named. British man of Libyan origin. 'Known to authorities' i.e. the Intelligence Services should have been keeping an eye on him but allowed him to gather bomb material and kill and injure kids.

Questions at some point will need to be asked about why our Intelligence Services fail so many times when they get all the resource they need

 

[troodon]

Live updates: Manchester Arena terror attacker named as Salman Abedi

https://www.yahoo.com/news/live-upd...rande-concert-manchester-arena-000236450.html

 

[HitWicket]

SO the suspect is named. British man of Libyan origin. 'Known to authorities' i.e. the Intelligence Services should have been keeping an eye on him but allowed him to gather bomb material and kill and injure kids.

Questions at some point will need to be asked about why our Intelligence Services fail so many times when they get all the resource they need

Or perhaps instead they succeed in foiling 100s of attacks like this and the odd one is just going to get through.

 

[Junaids]

I will post more later - I'm at a meeting in California.

But the Libya connection is spooky.

Firstly, because I went to school in Fallowfield.

Secondly, because when we stopped living above my parents' GP surgery in 1977 we rented it out. Generally to university students. Some of whom were Libyan.

 

[Junaids]

So now with the identity of the assailant, that's twice in a week that the Americans have blabbed classified information.

The first example being the Israeli IS intelligence.

That's very unfortunate.

 

[Robert]

The name Salman Abedi has been mentioned by Sky News. 22 years old, Manchester born.

 

[shaz619]

Manchester Police: We won't tolerate hate against any section of our community.

Chief Constable Ian Hopkins added: "Part of our response has seen us arrest a 23-year-old man in connection with the attack and we have also carried out two warrants, one in Whalley Range and one in Fallowfield that included a controlled explosion to enable safe entry.

We understand that feelings are very raw right now and people are bound to be looking for answers.

However, now, more than ever, it is vital that our diverse communities in Greater Manchester stand together and do not tolerate hate."

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/akhbar">@akhbar</a> 1of most prominent members of Al-Abedi tribe was gen Abdul Fatah Younis. Khadaffi supporter, then joined rebels, then killed by jihadists.</p>— Jenan Moussa (@jenanmoussa) <a href="https://twitter.com/jenanmoussa/status/867062224996708353">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[s28]

Vigil in Manchester now

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Huge crowd outside Manchester Town Hall for vigil <a href="https://t.co/fE23A6SgAM">pic.twitter.com/fE23A6SgAM</a></p>— Catrin Nye (@CatrinNye) <a href="https://twitter.com/CatrinNye/status/867062743601434625">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[James]

Or perhaps instead they succeed in foiling 100s of attacks like this and the odd one is just going to get through.

Agree, they have a very strong record. Arguably amongst the world's top security services. There was no major attack for 12 years prior to Westminster.

Our security services have to get it right every time but the terrorists only have to get it right once.

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Round of applause breaks out as this group of men carrying placards march into Albert Square <a href="https://t.co/UsVoKEOG6L">pic.twitter.com/UsVoKEOG6L</a></p>— Chris Slater (@chrisslaterMEN) <a href="https://twitter.com/chrisslaterMEN/status/867057108268834820">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[TSA321]

It was awkward in the office this morning.

 

[Junaids]

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] -

I won't go to usual debate - those who are responsible, doesn't represent any civilized community or religion.

But, I have a question to you, since you lived in Manchester at similar time I was in London. It's long back, still I can recall that London was probably the most protected city in Earth - from terrorism to neuclear attack. While British Poilce, MI6 & SAS are the most efficient operators in their field, which more or less accepted by almost everyone. Last time, when I went to London with my wife, I got a bit nervous - weather they have a camera in my bed room or not London & Manchester is probably the best protected City in world against counter terrorism with 3d scanners, digital sensors & secrets police - in fact they almost stripped even my baby upto diaper at Heathrow, despite her parents having Canadian PR & herself being a Canadian passport holder (probably for my first name).

Having said that - 21k people is not a mass for entry checking - Manchester arena should have enough gates to check everyone entering the arena with proprep scanning - it shouldn't take more than 2 hours for entire crowd. They do it at Metro Toronto Convention Centre, which is situated at the heart of one of the safest city in western world.

Still, some goons could take enough explosives (probably C4, I am not an expert, but it's not a mobile phone for sure) to blow 23 people & injure 100+. Whatever gross picture I have seen, it's not the job of a hand granade or Molotov cocktail that one can torch with a beer can. These people could take that explosives, enjoy the beauty & sounds of Aryana Grande & then blew them selves with few others. It's not that someone has stabbed few people or has strangled someone with bare hands.

This raises few questions to my dumb mind just before the election of British permanent, which might see several surprise results this time -

1. Dahes (ISIS) or whoever is responsible, developed a technology that can transport mass destructive explosives in a capsule as small as a ring stone or button, that can bypass the 3D image scanning.

2. OR, they are sold such technology by intellectual people (a bunch as a whole) whose stock market fluctuates with certain deals done by a President with a tyran king.

3. There are Isis (or whoever responsible) people in British internal security system, which allowed the goons to clear the security checkpoints with few KG of RDX

4. The terrorists came with the event management group under cover, or part of Grande's consurt team - shifted the explosives long before the security checking started; but then, either they cleared the airport or collected the explosives somewhere within Manchester - either way, No. 3 comes in mind.

5. It can be an accident with gas deposits, electric spark or some miracles I can't imagine

6. It's done by a 3rd party serceat service/agents that are equally skilled & equiept to pass the security checking & conduct such proficient demolishing job for someone's vested interest.


I would appreciate proper spirited response from you in this regard; because I had been at Anfield, (probably 35 km West of this arena) few years back when terrorism wasn't such a big threat - still they scanned me as if I was a gang star. What RDX, they forced me to leave my extra Coke can, so that I don't crash it on someone's head.

PS: writing from mobile after long weekend, so pardon my English.

Nowadays I only spend a few weeks in England each year, so I am perhaps not the best qualified person to answer.

I think our security services are wonderful, starting with the Police, whose unarmed state I am deeply proud of.

I think that there are two main models of defence against terrorism, and that we and the Israelis have decades more experience than our American friends, but have chosen different models.

You are really espousing the Israeli model. Layer upon layer of intrusive security, and aggressive racial (and religious) profiling of the identified "group" of interest. In the U.K. that would mean massively lengthened security processes but would also risk alienating decent British Muslims, who would all be treated as potential suspects.

But we pride ourselves on being a tolerant, integrated, multi-cultural society, and we don't want to end up like that. It would feel as if we had already lost.

Most educated British people want excellent intelligence combined with as little visible racial profiling as possible and the least obtrusive security possible. And most people I know live in a post-religious condition, and consider formal religious education/instruction to be the underlying danger here.

Most of us in Britain - and Australia and New Zealand, but NOT the USA - consider religious faith to be a bad thing, because it fosters dogma over reason, adherence over questioning, and makes people have an identity based upon their religion rather than their wider community.

To me, whether you are a (Czech Moravian) Lutheran in Bolton or a Pakistani Muslim in Bradford, your identity and community should be the Britain in which you live. But if you think of the Pakistani taxi driver from Bradford who drove to Glasgow to murder an Ahmadi grocer last year, his identity was clearly based upon his beliefs and not in his wider community.

 

[Junaids]

It was awkward in the office this morning.

It shouldn't be and needn't be.

Don't avoid the topic or you look bad.

I'd be saying "that was so disgusting, wasn't it? These people are animals."

As soon as you do that the people around you know that you are in no way part of the problem. They'll like and respect you more, not less.

 

[Adil_94]

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] so it wasnt Pakistani Bradfords doing after all. I am a Bradfordian of Pakistani origin and im not a terrorist nor am i a terrorist sympathiser. So u can tick me n my friends and family off your list.

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A City United tonight <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Manchester?src=hash">#Manchester</a> <a href="https://t.co/Fj1U0qi1xw">pic.twitter.com/Fj1U0qi1xw</a></p>— Angela Rayner (@AngelaRayner) <a href="https://twitter.com/AngelaRayner/status/867088475786498052">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[James]

It was awkward in the office this morning.

Bit of a sombre mood for sure.

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Amazing <a href="https://twitter.com/LongfellaPoet">@LongfellaPoet</a> Tony Walsh "Mancunians in union, delivered it all..." <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/manchester?src=hash">#manchester</a><a href="https://t.co/idyUnoDg6A">pic.twitter.com/idyUnoDg6A</a></p>— Faisal Islam (@faisalislam) <a href="https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/867090408156934145">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[SpiritOf1903]

No Bradfordians have been found guilty of any terror related offences .. just possession or viewing of materials. Dewsbury, Leeds buy not Bradford.

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The impulse to make Muslims collectively guilty is driven by an urge to collectively punish Muslims, which is a war crime.</p>— CJ Werleman (@cjwerleman) <a href="https://twitter.com/cjwerleman/status/867103484092440576">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[enkidu_]

RIP to the victims. Deliberately attacking children is very vile and something some have mastered in recent years, but the fact that it's done by the child of Libyans who were granted refugee status (apparently ?) make it even more nauseating : they gave him a decent life, and he thanked them back by sending their children' body parts.

 

[MMHS]

Nowadays I only spend a few weeks in England each year, so I am perhaps not the best qualified person to answer.

I think our security services are wonderful, starting with the Police, whose unarmed state I am deeply proud of.

I think that there are two main models of defence against terrorism, and that we and the Israelis have decades more experience than our American friends, but have chosen different models.

You are really espousing the Israeli model. Layer upon layer of intrusive security, and aggressive racial (and religious) profiling of the identified "group" of interest. In the U.K. that would mean massively lengthened security processes but would also risk alienating decent British Muslims, who would all be treated as potential suspects.

But we pride ourselves on being a tolerant, integrated, multi-cultural society, and we don't want to end up like that. It would feel as if we had already lost.

Most educated British people want excellent intelligence combined with as little visible racial profiling as possible and the least obtrusive security possible. And most people I know live in a post-religious condition, and consider formal religious education/instruction to be the underlying danger here.

Most of us in Britain - and Australia and New Zealand, but NOT the USA - consider religious faith to be a bad thing, because it fosters dogma over reason, adherence over questioning, and makes people have an identity based upon their religion rather than their wider community.

To me, whether you are a (Czech Moravian) Lutheran in Bolton or a Pakistani Muslim in Bradford, your identity and community should be the Britain in which you live. But if you think of the Pakistani taxi driver from Bradford who drove to Glasgow to murder an Ahmadi grocer last year, his identity was clearly based upon his beliefs and not in his wider community.

Thanks Junaids.

I was reading a Military virtual strategy report few months back, which states that Britain is the most difficult country to invade or trans-pass. You can erase UK from global map with nukes (or those fantasy tremors..), but invading Britain or trans-passing the British shores are impossible by any armed force in world. Small, isolated, island country with extremely favorable terrain to defend any air or naval attack & the best in class Radar/scanning system which virtually can track/locate even a bird entering her majesty's land. Then the intelligence mechanism - professionalism, multi level chain of command, integrity & efficiency - it's almost impossible to inside trade British internal security system. One of my distant grand father was in Bangladesh (PAK) police & he retired as a top officer of the police intelligence department. This old man (passed now) had several training with Scotland Yard & he studied for sometimes in some UK Police academy - till his last few days, he used to tell us about the skills, proficiency & professional integrity of Royal Police.

My point in this regard - is it so easy that such a large scale operation at the heart of Britain's 2nd most important city can be done by an average hot head Moravian or any Muslim at Bradford? This is not a shoot out or that Nice like incident - neither it's a hostage situation & it'snot even comparable to a hot head Taxi driver murdering a grocer. The job is clearly done by a professional group, who waited till the show ended & they can make maximum damage, so that the impact is prolonged & devastating. These people wanted to hurt Britain (& their sentiment, targeting young people) - this is during the time, when internal security must be at highest alert - just before election, US President is on a major middle-east trip that should determine the next US (& it's allay's) policy on middle-east & with Muslim states, while Russia probably needs one last "motivation" for their final assault in Syria.

I am not trying to protect anyone, or not supporting any cause, but don't think it's so straight forward, that you are telling. Even if the guy mentioned is a British born, Manchester local - where did he get the explosives & how he took it inside?

 

[s28]

Yes it's great that they passed on that training to Osama bin Laden etc

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A potted history of ‘Britain’s Collusion with Radical Islam’. Introduction to my Secret Affairs <a href="https://t.co/hV27yZl1Kc">https://t.co/hV27yZl1Kc</a> <a href="https://t.co/8x9zSyaGDt">pic.twitter.com/8x9zSyaGDt</a></p>— Mark Curtis (@markcurtis30) <a href="https://twitter.com/markcurtis30/status/866288279464935424">21 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[KingKhanWC]

RIP to all victims and condolences to the family.

The threat level now says another attack is either imminent or in progress. Let;s hope this is just paranoia.

 

[90MPH]

RIP to all victims and condolences to the family.

The threat level now says another attack is either imminent or in progress. Let;s hope this is just paranoia.

Doubt it, not if they haven't apprehended the bomb maker.

 

[idrizzy]

....

The job is clearly done by a professional group, who waited till the show ended & they can make maximum damage, so that the impact is prolonged & devastating.

Maximum damage to about 150 people? In my eyes that's small scale compared to damages that a single individual can do - in fact I find it ironic that more damage could be done if there was an 'incident' during the rally (as shown in pics above) where people have come together than the initial impact.

If it were so 'professional' I'd expect a grander stage, is all. My friends have been to numerous concerts (in the O2) with bags and rarely have them checked when entering the concert. If anything it was a cowards job with minimal thought going into the act. I don't know the end goal for ISIS, but if they wanted to show intent it would be a constant threat or devastation. Maybe they try to do this but our security is top notch that it doesn't allow for it, or maybe when things are 'going good' they decide to undergo a terror attack. Hard to know exactly.

 

[shaz619]

RIP to all victims and condolences to the family.

The threat level now says another attack is either imminent or in progress. Let;s hope this is just paranoia.

Stay safe bro

 

[Junaids]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A potted history of ‘Britain’s Collusion with Radical Islam’. Introduction to my Secret Affairs <a href="https://t.co/hV27yZl1Kc">https://t.co/hV27yZl1Kc</a> <a href="https://t.co/8x9zSyaGDt">pic.twitter.com/8x9zSyaGDt</a></p>— Mark Curtis (@markcurtis30) <a href="https://twitter.com/markcurtis30/status/866288279464935424">21 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

So you are actually blaming the victims because their grandparents were disadvantaged northern citizens of a colonial empire?

 

[Junaids]

@s28
This attack took place less than a mile from St Peter's Square.

Which was the site of the 1819 Peterloo Massacre. Which took place when we northerners had the cheek to ask for democratic representation.

We consider ourselves to be victims too of the people who built the Empire.

So it doesn't sit well for us to be accused of having our colonial chickens come home to roost.

 

[s28]

I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about

 

[MMHS]

Maximum damage to about 150 people? In my eyes that's small scale compared to damages that a single individual can do - in fact I find it ironic that more damage could be done if there was an 'incident' during the rally (as shown in pics above) where people have come together than the initial impact.

If it were so 'professional' I'd expect a grander stage, is all. My friends have been to numerous concerts (in the O2) with bags and rarely have them checked when entering the concert. If anything it was a cowards job with minimal thought going into the act. I don't know the end goal for ISIS, but if they wanted to show intent it would be a constant threat or devastation. Maybe they try to do this but our security is top notch that it doesn't allow for it, or maybe when things are 'going good' they decide to undergo a terror attack. Hard to know exactly.

Is this so easy to find/smuggle high explosives in U.K.? My point is - one can bring a Kalashnikov & brush fire few people, one can high jack a bus & run over the crowd, but can one bring such explosives in a concert hall?

 

[idrizzy]

Is this so easy to find/smuggle high explosives in U.K.? My point is - one can bring a Kalashnikov & brush fire few people, one can high jack a bus & run over the crowd, but can one bring such explosives in a concert hall?

Well, sure. Since it happened. And according to this report, bags weren't checked:

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/news.s...looked-very-suspicious-before-attack-10889847

Which goes back to my point that it's a lot more cowardly than professional.

 

[SandyB]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Amazing <a href="https://twitter.com/LongfellaPoet">@LongfellaPoet</a> Tony Walsh "Mancunians in union, delivered it all..." <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/manchester?src=hash">#manchester</a><a href="https://t.co/idyUnoDg6A">pic.twitter.com/idyUnoDg6A</a></p>— Faisal Islam (@faisalislam) <a href="https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/867090408156934145">23 May 2017</a></blockquote>
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Wow! Such powerful lines !

I couldn't get all of the cultural/historical references, but he sure struck such an inspiring tone. You see that from the reactions of all the people with him, mainly priests of different religions.

 

[Yossarian]

So you are actually blaming the victims because their grandparents were disadvantaged northern citizens of a colonial empire?

Not read the book, but only read the quotes posted above. Going by those quotes, there's no mention of the victims "grandparents were disadvantaged northern citizens of a colonial empire" but seems the writer to be accusing recent governments (including the current government) policies as being the major contributing factors. Not saying that I agree, or disagree, with these statements, but simply correcting the (incorrect) interpretation you are presenting to that quote.

 

[Major]

Among the dead is an 8 year old girl. Really feel devestated.

Her mom is in a comma and doent even know about her childs death

 

[SandyB]

But then they should change their name and their primary goal to one of terrorism. I think this distinction is important because I had some interaction with the original Caliphate group that used to be known in the UK as HT, then later rebranded as Al Muhajiroun. I thought they were idiots, but even they didn't publicly espouse violence because for them there was no point unless it was with a view to victory.

I don't think the ISIS cares about the nitty gritty of such things. They work like a global MNC like Coca Cola or Microsoft. Like how these brands attach themselves to everything from sports, education, charity, protests or movies just to obtain BETTER BRAND VISIBILITY .. IS similarly doesn't care what they are attahed to , as long as their brand is being referenced, and is spreading among peoples thoughts , they see that as a victory.

"Them vs Us" isn't victory and running people over in trucks isn't going to establish a caliphate. So then where do they get off calling themselves IS? Their tendency to claim every desperate act of isolated rage only rubber stamps their impotence. If they called themselves the Jokers and their goal was to kill Harvey Dent I would take them more seriously to be honest.

Well people are buying it aren't they ? Lone wolf attacks have increased in number.

I don't think all of these attackers may be hardcore Caliphate supporters. many would be deranged/unstable/psychotic by nature or upbringing. Just like the kids who shot up Columbine high school or the usual lone gunman attackers.

But IS or the caliphate is such a great cause for them to be attached to !

We've often heard during wars about great soldiers with humongous killcounts or about Police officers who are all too willing to use extreme torture to suppress criminals or garner evidence.

People like these seek out CAUSES that give a certain level of legitimacy to their cravings. Killing/hurting/hating someone out of insecurity or sadism doesn't sound as great as doing it in the name of GOD or RELIGION.

 

[HitWicket]

Is this so easy to find/smuggle high explosives in U.K.? My point is - one can bring a Kalashnikov & brush fire few people, one can high jack a bus & run over the crowd, but can one bring such explosives in a concert hall?

The explosives didn't get into the concert hall though, they made it to the foyer, presumably just about the area where ticket and security checks would've been done.

 

[boomboomcheema]

Manchester attack: Gurdwaras offer food and shelter, Muslim drivers give free lifts



Stories of random acts of kindness are emerging in the wake of the Manchester terror attack, with many people and Sikh temples offering free food and rooms for the night.

As hundreds of people fled Manchester Arena following the explosion, taxi drivers began taking people to safety.

Driver AJ Singh said he tried to help wherever he could.

“I’ve had people who needed to find loved ones. I’ve dropped them off to the hospital. They’ve not had any money, they’ve been stranded,” he told Channel 4 News.
“And it’s then that people were requesting taxis but they didn’t have money.

“It was at that point that I made the decision that money isn’t everything in life and we’re part of Manchester and we need to do our part to make sure these people get home safe and sound,” Rotheram said.

At least 22 people were killed and 59 others injured when a lone suicide bomber set off a bomb at the Manchester Arena after US pop star Ariana Grande concluded her concert last night.

http://m.hindustantimes.com/world-n...-free-lifts/story-Y1Ad2vVEY2NaD0jezlDjOP.html

Amid all the negativity, there's some good news.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I don't think the ISIS cares about the nitty gritty of such things. They work like a global MNC like Coca Cola or Microsoft. Like how these brands attach themselves to everything from sports, education, charity, protests or movies just to obtain BETTER BRAND VISIBILITY .. IS similarly doesn't care what they are attahed to , as long as their brand is being referenced, and is spreading among peoples thoughts , they see that as a victory.



Well people are buying it aren't they ? Lone wolf attacks have increased in number.

I don't think all of these attackers may be hardcore Caliphate supporters. many would be deranged/unstable/psychotic by nature or upbringing. Just like the kids who shot up Columbine high school or the usual lone gunman attackers.

But IS or the caliphate is such a great cause for them to be attached to !

We've often heard during wars about great soldiers with humongous killcounts or about Police officers who are all too willing to use extreme torture to suppress criminals or garner evidence.

People like these seek out CAUSES that give a certain level of legitimacy to their cravings. Killing/hurting/hating someone out of insecurity or sadism doesn't sound as great as doing it in the name of GOD or RELIGION.

I don't know any brand that wants to attract negative attention, or pitch themselves to psychos or deranged losers. Certainly the likes of Coca Cola or Microsoft don't. In fact Coca Cola or Microsoft would probably be delighted if Pepsi or Apple embarked on such a self destructive path.

I'm sorry but it just makes no sense, and to try to justify those tactics by saying it's working because it attracts those type of lunatics is a strange explanation for the workings of a supposed 'Islamic State'.

 

[majiz]

Manchester is my hometown, and I grew up in the shadow of Irish Catholic terrorism there. No one religion has a monopoly on terrorism.
.

ira never targeted civilians in the same way ISIS do, they certainly never would have blown up a music concert. also they weren't 'catholic terrorists' it was more a war over sovereignty and statehood. don't get the obsession with bringing up the IRA, it just isn't the same

 

[Junaids]

ira never targeted civilians in the same way ISIS do, they certainly never would have blown up a music concert. also they weren't 'catholic terrorists' it was more a war over sovereignty and statehood. don't get the obsession with bringing up the IRA, it just isn't the same

What do you think the 1987 Enniskillen bombing was?

More to the point, the miscarriages of justice which happened to the Guildford Four and Birmingham Six were both for pub bombings.

I was woken up by the 1974 M62 bombing in my bed in Gomersal.

I'm the first to agree that IS are monsters who target innocent people. But while I've plenty of time for the likes of Bobby Sands, the IRA often targeted civilians.

Not children, but civilians.

Also the IRA and Sinn Fein are not simple nationalist movements, which is why they are almost universally despised in the Republic of Ireland. The name Sinn Fein symbolised liberation a century ago in Dublin, but now is associated with terrorism and gangsterism.

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">A Muslim man and Jewish woman prayed together at a makeshift memorial in Manchester <a href="https://t.co/n8Sv3keaCY">https://t.co/n8Sv3keaCY</a> <a href="https://t.co/unkYRqt1JC">pic.twitter.com/unkYRqt1JC</a></p>— CNN (@CNN) <a href="https://twitter.com/CNN/status/867438172044754946">24 May 2017</a></blockquote>
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[Bilal7]

Good on Manchester to respond with such positivity. Really hope the fall-out from this is not any more bloodshed and hatred once the initial shock dies down. Condolences to the dead and their families, truly a sad, sad tragedy.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Inna lillah e Wa inna eleh rajeoon.


Very very Sad :'(


UK is more Muslim than many Muslim Countries and this :'(


Heart Breaking :-/

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] we are with you

 

[Gabbar Singh]

Someone just wore this on live tv tonight (ch 4 news) at a memorial of sorts for the attack victims. I don't care what it spells out because in what world is wearing a grenade and gun on your top appropriate at a time like this?

 

[Yossarian]

ira never targeted civilians in the same way ISIS do, they certainly never would have blown up a music concert. also they weren't 'catholic terrorists' it was more a war over sovereignty and statehood. don't get the obsession with bringing up the IRA, it just isn't the same

IRA
1974 Birmigham pub bombings
21 killed and 182 injured.

1972 Aldeshot bombing
7 killed

1972 Bloody Friday
9 killed 130 injured

1987 Enniskillen
11 killed 63 injured.

Above are just a few examples.

During the NI troubles, there were 3,568 deaths, of which 1,879 were civilian deaths caused by both sides in the conflict.

You need to read up on history a bit.

 

[s28]

Shocking : The Times - "MI5 Were Warned"

This is going to be a MASSIVE scandal now. Hillary was threatened with being locked up for simply having emails on a private server. Theresa May's cuts to Police force and incompetence has led to kids deaths!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">THE TIMES FRONT PAGE: "MI5 was warned" <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/skypapers?src=hash">#skypapers</a> <a href="https://t.co/ciOvSKR7FU">pic.twitter.com/ciOvSKR7FU</a></p>— Sky News (@SkyNews) <a href="https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/867507419676585986">24 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[s28]

This is shocking video footage. A Manchester cop telling Theresa May to her face that her cuts to the Police Force would endanger National Security. The blood of 20 kids is on her hands.

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">In 2015 this policeman told Theresa May her cuts to police numbers would endanger the public. She didn't listen. <a href="https://t.co/2MHIEj5wvS">pic.twitter.com/2MHIEj5wvS</a></p>— Daniel Blake's Vest (@WarmongerHodges) <a href="https://twitter.com/WarmongerHodges/status/867510744811745284">24 May 2017</a></blockquote>
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[Gabbar Singh]

Shocking indeed, heads need to roll.

 

[Gabbar Singh]

Theresa May to tackle Donald Trump over Manchester bombing evidence
Prime minister will raise concerns at Nato summit that intelligence leaks from the US have damaged investigation

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-trump-over-manchester-bombing-evidence#img-1

 

[s28]

This is Manchester but also this is Britain.

Note the spirit to sing together and a very poignant song but also the reserved British thing of not wanting to make a scene in public

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Goosebumps! The amazing moment Manchester crowd joins in with woman singing Oasis - Don't Look Back in Anger after minutes silence <a href="https://t.co/Cw4mOq8yde">pic.twitter.com/Cw4mOq8yde</a></p>— Josh Halliday (@JoshHalliday) <a href="https://twitter.com/JoshHalliday/status/867686062440796160">25 May 2017</a></blockquote>
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[SpiritOf1903]

Time to make hay Corbyn!. Tories are an unmitigated disaster for our nation.

 

[Salman]

Someone just wore this on live tv tonight (ch 4 news) at a memorial of sorts for the attack victims. I don't care what it spells out because in what world is wearing a grenade and gun on your top appropriate at a time like this?

Is that a man?