Minorities in Britain - The Pakistani Community (1966)

[TSA321]

 

[SpiritOf1903]

British Pakistanis are victima of their own pride. With other South Asian communit9esz notably Bengalia and Punjabi, it's very close knit but nationally they have organisations for their betterment and it has succeeded given their high levels of entrepreneurship.

There's the British sikh association which is hugely influential for example which is why for such a small community, it is heavily overrepresented in the media.

 

[TSA321]

There's the British sikh association which is hugely influential for example which is why for such a small community, it is heavily overrepresented in the media.

Are they? I haven’t noticed...

 

[irfan]

Have not watched it all yet,presumably this doc includes future Bangladeshis as Pakistanis, looking at footage of East London Mosque and women in saris.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Are they? I haven’t noticed...

Look out for the turban sanjeev bhaskarseeks to be everywhere too.

 

[MenInG]

The Pakistani community was stuck in a time warp - they wanted to bring up kids in UK in a Pakistani way that was not there in Pakistan also.

 

[Bigboii]

The Pakistani community was stuck in a time warp - they wanted to bring up kids in UK in a Pakistani way that was not there in Pakistan also.

Wasn't Pak more liberal back than (in 60s 70s) or was it the case of different values of elites and middle class but elites were just dominating the media space at that time so there values were overly represented?

 

[SpiritOf1903]

The village Pakistanis are woefully out of date. Which is a major factor in the heinous gangs that have emerged

 

[Giannis]

British Pakistanis are victima of their own pride. With other South Asian communit9esz notably Bengalia and Punjabi, it's very close knit but nationally they have organisations for their betterment and it has succeeded given their high levels of entrepreneurship.

There's the British sikh association which is hugely influential for example which is why for such a small community, it is heavily overrepresented in the media.

Most Pakistanis in the UK are Punjabi so I don't what you mean by "Punjabi" unless you're referring to Indian Sikhs. Please use the word Indian or Indian-Punjabi on a Pakistani forums, your ethnic classifications make no sense to us. Thanks.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Most Pakistanis in the UK are Punjabi so I don't what you mean by "Punjabi" unless you're referring to Indian Sikhs. Please use the word Indian or Indian-Punjabi on a Pakistani forums, your ethnic classifications make no sense to us. Thanks.

Well I'm not sure if Pakistanis from the majority of Punjab identify as British Pakistani or British Punjabi.

Most British Pakistanis are technically Potohari/Mirpuri?

 

[Giannis]

Well I'm not sure if Pakistanis from the majority of Punjab identify as British Pakistani or British Punjabi.

Most British Pakistanis are technically Potohari/Mirpuri?

British Pakistani Punjabi, they're not mutually exclusive terms.

 

[Slog]

Most of the Pakistanis who went to Britain in the time were uneducated blue collar people with no exposure to the world. It shows in them but that’s understandable. But it also shows in their children’s children which is baffling

 

[SensiblePakFan]

British Pakistanis are victima of their own pride. With other South Asian communit9esz notably Bengalia and Punjabi, it's very close knit but nationally they have organisations for their betterment and it has succeeded given their high levels of entrepreneurship.

There's the British sikh association which is hugely influential for example which is why for such a small community, it is heavily overrepresented in the media.

You say that but lots of Pakistanis are in British Govt right now.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Most of the Pakistanis who went to Britain in the time were uneducated blue collar people with no exposure to the world. It shows in them but that’s understandable. But it also shows in their children’s children which is baffling

It's not that baffling. If they live in insulated communities, then it's quite likely they think their way of living is just the way it's meant to be. You see the same in white British kids growing up in insulated blue collar communities as well.

 

[Buffet]

It's not that baffling. If they live in insulated communities, then it's quite likely they think their way of living is just the way it's meant to be. You see the same in white British kids growing up in insulated blue collar communities as well.

Agree here. Views are shaped a lot by exposure level. Many AA and Whites hold certain views despite being here for many generations and it's due to living in insulated communities.

 

[KB]

One of the contrasts with the later Middle East labour export boom was the length of stay. Gulf governments, of course, tended to discourage or prevent claims to citizenship among expatriate communities.

Ijaz Gilani, who has performed pioneering work on public opinion research in Pakistan over a number of years, surveyed Pakistani returnees in 1981. He found for Saudi Arabia, that returnees reported that they had on average intended to stay for 2.66 years but had actually stayed for an average of 2.88 years. For UAE the figures were 3.14 and 4.85. For the UK the intended stay was not that different - 2.00 years - but the actual stay was 19.06 years on average.

Many of course never returned permanently to Pakistan.

 

[uberkoen]

If you go to England, you can see the difference clearly. In the 50's Pakistani's from various villages moved to England due to the construction of Mangla Dam. These guys mostly worked in textile mills, car production and food processing industries with their hubs being in the Yorkshire, West Midlands, Luton and Slough.

These areas till date look like some old run down Pakistani village. In the 60's educated Pakistani's also started moving to England and most of these people settled in London.

In the 70's when England started moving from manufacturing towards services the Pakistani's in Yorkshire and the West Midlands suffered massively and most of these guys then moved towards taxi driving which is still evident today not just for the people who came here originally but also their children.

 

[Pakpak]

Most Pakistanis in the UK are Punjabi so I don't what you mean by "Punjabi" unless you're referring to Indian Sikhs. Please use the word Indian or Indian-Punjabi on a Pakistani forums, your ethnic classifications make no sense to us. Thanks.

Most Pakistanis in UK are definitely not Punjabi. Most are from Mirpur in AJK.

 

[irfan]

Most Pakistanis in UK are definitely not Punjabi. Most are from Mirpur in AJK.

No they're not, I would dispute that. It's more like 50:50 Mirpuri & Punjab proper

 

[Pakpak]

No they're not, I would dispute that. It's more like 50:50 Mirpuri & Punjab proper

You can dispute it it means nothing really. I checked Wikipedia which states that the number one origin is AJK with Punjab at number two and the rest are small.

 

[Pakpak]

 

[irfan]

You can dispute it it means nothing really. I checked Wikipedia which states that the number one origin is AJK with Punjab at number two and the rest are small.

you believe Wikipedia? ok so what are the numbers or % breakdown, notice they don't give any?

 

[Pakpak]

you believe Wikipedia? ok so what are the numbers or % breakdown, notice they don't give any?

Yeah as Wikipedia is backed by facts.

https://webarchive.nationalarchives....gov.uk/documents/communities/pdf/1170952.pdf

The UK's own report, on chapter 8.2 states that 2/3rds of British Pakistanis are Mirpuris. Will you disbelieve the government's own report too? You can give your evidence, I gave you two sources. One which is official. While all your evidence is 'I dispute it'. Yeah, no.

 

[irfan]

If you look at the sources in that report you will see that they are just estimates, there are no accurate figures at all; that is my point otherwise I don't care what % are Punjabi & what %Mirpuri etc

 

[Pakpak]

If you look at the sources in that report you will see that they are just estimates, there are no accurate figures at all; that is my point otherwise I don't care what % are Punjabi & what %Mirpuri etc

So hang on, you refused Wikipedia even though they cited their opinion with evidence twice, unlike you. Then you refused to believe a government report but in the same breath you expect us to believe your view with no evidence, no source, nothing. How does that work? If we are to disbelieve a government study and report because it doesn't meet your stringent criteria then your opinion by the same criteria means even less. Why don't you do a report and come back your estimates like the government did or you can provide us with any official source countering what I have posted. Its because you won't find any. I atleast provided two sources to back up my view. Twice. And also FYI I am Punjabi myself incase you think I am Mirpuri skewing numbers. Even the best estimates place the Mirpuri population at 60% vs Punjabis in UK.

And you do care hence why you're posting on about it.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

So hang on, you refused Wikipedia even though they cited their opinion with evidence twice, unlike you. Then you refused to believe a government report but in the same breath you expect us to believe your view with no evidence, no source, nothing. How does that work? If we are to disbelieve a government study and report because it doesn't meet your stringent criteria then your opinion by the same criteria means even less. Why don't you do a report and come back your estimates like the government did or you can provide us with any official source countering what I have posted. Its because you won't find any. I atleast provided two sources to back up my view. Twice. And also FYI I am Punjabi myself incase you think I am Mirpuri skewing numbers. Even the best estimates place the Mirpuri population at 60% vs Punjabis in UK.

And you do care hence why you're posting on about it.

One thing is for sure, only Pakistanis seem to think this is important, certainly the rest of Britain doesn't care. As far as they are concerned there is just Pakistanis, which region they hail from is of no interest to them.

 

[Pakpak]

One thing is for sure, only Pakistanis seem to think this is important, certainly the rest of Britain doesn't care. As far as they are concerned there is just Pakistanis, which region they hail from is of no interest to them.

Yes, this is very true. Even look at our cricket team, Karachi this Lahore that.

 

[KingKhanWC]

You say that but lots of Pakistanis are in British Govt right now.

Dont forget sports stars, actors, singers, comedians, ceos, high level doctors etc. Pretty much in every aspect of society. Outside of Pakistan the Brit Paks are the most famous Pakistanis.

The problem is people are still brining over Pakistanis from Pakistan, esp in marriage. So it has to start again from the 60's for many families.

Imo there is no reason to marry from Pakistan when there are so many Pakistanis here now, unless they met and fell in love.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

Dont forget sports stars, actors, singers, comedians, ceos, high level doctors etc. Pretty much in every aspect of society. Outside of Pakistan the Brit Paks are the most famous Pakistanis.

The problem is people are still brining over Pakistanis from Pakistan, esp in marriage. So it has to start again from the 60's for many families.

Imo there is no reason to marry from Pakistan when there are so many Pakistanis here now, unless they met and fell in love.

People are marrying in Pakistan because local boys/girls have other life goals and a stable family/marriage is not their priority.

Mothers/Aunties know this. That's why there are so many such marriages