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Mohammad Amir : All talent no performance?

hur rizvi said:
We cant rate anyone a success based on his first tour

In England he succeeded. Was decent in NZ. HAd one good performance in Aus.
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But wait. Kohli flopped in England so he must be a dismal failure!
 
How many bowlers perform well in non favorable conditions ? What was statc's Performance in the last series he played in UAE and India (talking abt test) he was a flop in both

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Knee jerk reaction at it's best. He's not played international cricket for 6 months and already judging. Considering his huge absence from the game for 5 whole years it's amazing how good he has been since his return. He can only get better from here
 
Deewana said:
How many bowlers perform well in non favorable conditions ? What was statc's Performance in the last series he played in UAE and India (talking abt test) he was a flop in both

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Oh no no around here we only bring up Amir's stats on flat pancakes to prove that he is a nothing bowler.
 
Syed1 said:
Oh no no around here we only bring up Amir's stats on flat pancakes to prove that he is a nothing bowler.
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Our public are just obsessed with foreign players... No one brings up starc's(for many best bowler ) test record vs Pak and India in Asia where hafeez Shehzad were bashing him for fun...so what it was a flat pitch ..but if amir gets a bit hit Amir is flop Amir is overrated.. And last night was watching Highlights of world t20 match vs Aus and WI in 2014 t20 world cup where the Windies smacked Starc for 45 runs and in one of the death overs he conceded 15 runs to lose aus the game..but Than tehy bring up starcs record in WC , why do they forget that in the same WC Yadav Wahab Boult (who all are levels below amir ) had picked up many wkts too there must have been some help..u can only imagine how lethal Amir would have been there..
For me Amir is the best fast bowler in the world currently followed by starc than Rabada

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He is definitely talented, I feel some here are being too harsh on him.

Yes he hasn't been amazing, but he has still shown plenty in the few months he's been back to suggest he's worth the hype.

I expect him to be a lot better in Tests and am looking forward to seeing him in the whites again.
 
Deewana said:
For me Amir is the best fast bowler in the world currently followed by starc than Rabada

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I think you answered your own question on why foreign players are criticized less. Here you have hyped Amir as the best without actual performances which Starc and Rabada have both delivered in the past
 
todfod 11 said:
Thankless people are pakistanis aint they...
Useless thread as usual. Amir was his magical best just one month ago.. didnt perform on some of the flatest pitches and suddenly he becomes a looser for some... what crap!!!
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Magical best based on ONE match on really seaming wickets where other bowlers also bowled great?
 
I'd understand if he played ODIs and Tests and not gotten anywickets on these pitches. But it's laughable how you guys are judging him on measly T20s. You can judge a batsman in T20s but never a bowler. A bowler gets to bowl 4 overs in a match lol.
 
Indiafan said:
Magical best based on ONE match on really seaming wickets where other bowlers also bowled great?
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Pick up Amir's stats in the Asia Cup. Just because you only saw the Ind vs Pak match doesn't mean he did not perform in Pakistan's other matches.
 
Indiafan said:
Magical best based on ONE match on really seaming wickets where other bowlers also bowled great?
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Which match he got thrashed in ?? Against india he was the only one who bowled good. The runs were leaked by wahab and sami. Bowled well against lanka bangladesh and in WC apart from australia match where he was asked to bowl when batsmen were set, flat pitch and a fool captain.
 
So far all talk with no action. Should stick to longer format only, T20s and ODIs are not his speciality. His action has a nice rhythm though.
 
Balthazar said:
So far all talk with no action. Should stick to longer format only, T20s and ODIs are not his speciality. His action has a nice rhythm though.
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4 matches - 16 overs - 81 runs - 7 wickets - 11.57 average - 5.06 economy


Those are Amir's figures from Asia Cup. Trust an Indian to not know anything about bowling.
 
Balthazar said:
So far all talk with no action. Should stick to longer format only, T20s and ODIs are not his speciality. His action has a nice rhythm though.
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Syed1 said:
4 matches - 16 overs - 81 runs - 7 wickets - 11.57 average - 5.06 economy


Those are Amir's figures from Asia Cup. Trust an Indian to not know anything about bowling.
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OMG.

:))) :))) :))) :)))

Haven't seen a bigger ownage in recent times here. The parosi totally shocked when presented with facts. :najam
 
Indiafan said:
Magical best based on ONE match on really seaming wickets where other bowlers also bowled great?
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Did you watch his other performances or do only his poor ones stick in your mind.

What about his 2 ODI performances against NZ earlier this year, did you actually watch his bowling ??

This is the problem, some of you can't hide your preconceived prejudices and mix it up with any nonsense just to back it up.
 
Syed1 said:
4 matches - 16 overs - 81 runs - 7 wickets - 11.57 average - 5.06 economy


Those are Amir's figures from Asia Cup. Trust an Indian to not know anything about bowling.
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How is that so far working for your team? Most of those matches were played on bowling pitches, and still your team got humbled. Hardly any achievement there considering even Binny once averaged in a single digit on those pitches.
 
Balthazar said:
How is that so far working for your team? Most of those matches were played on bowling pitches, and still your team got humbled. Hardly any achievement there considering even Binny once averaged in a single digit on those pitches.
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But you said Amir is a bad bowler in T20s and ODIs, and I presented you his stats for T20s in the one of the most recent tournaments. How does the team's performance correlate to Amir being a bad bowler even though he has figures like that.

Keep your hate inside of you, if you don't want to be owned like this every day.
 
I am expecting big things from Amir still- am happy with his trajectory since his comback where he has delivered a couple of really testing spells

We need to look after his fitness- no panga before the england series please
 
I'm all for him proving me wrong, but his comeback performances this year haven't really been all there.

ODIs he was okay. Nothing game breaking.

T20s he had like 1 or 2 sneaky overs in Asia Cup, but then when green pitches were replaced by flatties in the World t20 he kind of got exposed.

Let's see how he goes in tests, not putting any expectations on him is good for now as it means he has no pressure on him.

He's a talent for sure, but has to justify it otherwise you can't say much...
 
but in a test series there will mostly be bowling friendly pitches So how will you judge him ?
 
He was decent in the ODIs, but ordinary in T20Is. Test cricket will be his real test, should average under 23 in this series or will write him off.
 
Bhai was right again but as usual the same names got offended and touchy and couldn't face the truth.

Look what's happening now.

Real talent is in hard workers like Woakes. Who improve and stay clean and stay under the radar for most of their life until they take wickets and score runs.

Overrated fast bowling attack overall from Pak.
 
Great delivery Aamir! He is getting better and better each spell. Hopefully he will keep improving.

He has dismissed Alistair Cook 3 times today which is a big thing. Cookie certainly one of the best in the world.
 
Man..Pak fans are the biggest wrist slitters...this is his COMEBACK match :facepalm:
 
Flat track. 1st test back and Cook one of the best test batsmen around dropped twice of his bowling and then bowls him out. Yes right no performance he should be getting 10 wickets on flat track no matter what.
 
Indiafan said:
Magical best based on ONE match on really seaming wickets where other bowlers also bowled great?
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A rather overwrought argument, no, to say nothing of tiresome and mean spirited.

You may certainly argue that expectations regarding Amir seem disproportionate to the sum total of his achievements so far. But by what standards, and of what player can it ever be said that expectations of them were always just about spot on, neither too rosy nor too pessimistic? That they never disappointed, nor exceeded expectations?

So far in his still short career Amir has done both in spectacular fashion.

Among those who he has accordingly impressed are former players like Wasim Akram and Michael Holding.

Let us acknowledge that it is impressive when these kinds of people are impressed. When Akram says that Amir is more talented than he was, at the same age.

Let's acknowledge that being the youngest ever bowler to take a five at Lord's seems a rather impressive feat.

You may point out that others also have done well in similarly helpful conditions. But they weren't
17 at the time. Someone suggested Amir may struggle as he gets older and his pace declines.
Which may be true, and is a problem faced by all fast bowlers. But if Amir's development follows that of
other fast bowlers, he will for the next three- four years only get faster. And better.

That is one of the reasons for why expectations on him may yet outpace his performances for
some time.
 
I think, he had a great day to be honest - was sent to bat behind Wahab, that's itself an insult, but added 20+ with Yasir. Then in a day he had to dismiss Cook 3 times - that's 30K Test runs. And, I believe his stats has about 8 extra runs courtesy to Yasir & Misbah.

What else, bowled in 4 spells; kept the pressure always & has one more innings left. Who knows, he can get a couple tomorrow morning, can spank another 15-16 with bat & take 3 more in 2nd innings in a win.

Its a Test match & we have seen only 2 days - I do understand why T20 is so popular in PAK.
 
Bowled ok. Some good deliveries but a little rusty I'd say. As expected of course but as the series gets going the attack overall will also settle down. I think the slope at lords and the fact it was the first test in a long time caused some of our pacers to bowl some loose deliveries both sides of wicket. Particularly Rahat. If one end leaks runs then Amir is less effective.
 
MMHS said:
I think, he had a great day to be honest - was sent to bat behind Wahab, that's itself an insult, but added 20+ with Yasir. Then in a day he had to dismiss Cook 3 times - that's 30K Test runs. And, I believe his stats has about 8 extra runs courtesy to Yasir & Misbah.

What else, bowled in 4 spells; kept the pressure always & has one more innings left. Who knows, he can get a couple tomorrow morning, can spank another 15-16 with bat & take 3 more in 2nd innings in a win.

Its a Test match & we have seen only 2 days - I do understand why T20 is so popular in PAK.
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Well said.

Game is far from over.
 
He's gonna get better as he bowls more. Amir started of a bit poorly getting hit for 33 runs in just 6 overs at 5.5 rpo, although he then came back quite strongly with his next 12 overs. In his last 12 overs he only got hit for 32 runs and picked up 1 wicket. 1/32 in 12 overs at an economy rate of 2.67. So he bowled good at the end but didn't pick up many wickets. We need to stay patient with him.
 
MMHS said:
I think, he had a great day to be honest - was sent to bat behind Wahab, that's itself an insult, but added 20+ with Yasir. Then in a day he had to dismiss Cook 3 times - that's 30K Test runs. And, I believe his stats has about 8 extra runs courtesy to Yasir & Misbah.

What else, bowled in 4 spells; kept the pressure always & has one more innings left. Who knows, he can get a couple tomorrow morning, can spank another 15-16 with bat & take 3 more in 2nd innings in a win.

Its a Test match & we have seen only 2 days - I do understand why T20 is so popular in PAK.
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Exactly.
 
By the way what has starc done in Test matches in UAE nd India...


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He seemed to get bit tired which we can expect but hopefully with rest today can come in morning and wrap inns of inshallallah


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I have to disagree with this.. he got Alaistar Cook out 3 times.. I mean seriously you can't expect him to anything more than that..
 
Deewana said:
By the way what has starc done in Test matches in UAE nd India...


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Don't bring logic in a discussion based on mindless chest-thumping and nationalism driven agendas.
 
Really not surprised to see such a wrist slitting thread. If you actually thut amir would run thru the lineup, you're delusional as they come. England did their homework and surely they spent more time studying amir. Give him some time. If you're writing him off already then I feel sorry for you. It's gonna be a tough series for you to watch
 
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First test in 6 years it's a completely different format from Odis and t20 he will take time to get back into it wristslitters clearly don't understand cricket.
 
Seriously?

If he takes a five wicket haul in the next innings, is he better than Wasim?

PPers showing why selectors should use their own brain and not listen to the general public which knows squat.
 
amir is one of the most talented bowlers in the world and his performance wasn't great today but he hasn't played in a test in 6 years so considering that his performance was good
 
Leaked a few runs, but the dropped catches hurt him.

To get Cook out three times in one day isn't a joke.
 
Deewana said:
By the way what has starc done in Test matches in UAE nd India...


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Forget that. What was Starc's performance in last year's Ashes series? Consistently going at 4-5 RPO throughout the five match series. Took Kaneria-esque five-wicket hauls (100+ runs and high econ) before someone comes in with that.

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I think nasir has summed it up beautifully ...i am not expecting any miracles from amir and neither the perfomances that he put up 6 years ago for 2 valid reasons
1) He is playing a Test match after 6 years and it takes some time to Adjust to Test cricket both with bowling and fitness and mind u he hasnt played much First class cricket too

2) Secondly the conditions in that infamous tour of england in 2010 were much more tougher for batting and suitable for bowling there was a reason that we were puting up 150 on the board most times..We put up 340 in the 1st innings of 1st test in this series which probably betters our highest score of the last series in england..maybe our batting has improved a bit but conditions plays a huge role.. oval will be flat too maybe old trafford may provide some help from him..

I expect hugely improved perfomances from amir in Australia


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Just the start of busting myths..... Amir will be eaten alive as days progress.
 
Deewana said:
I think nasir has summed it up beautifully ...i am not expecting any miracles from amir and neither the perfomances that he put up 6 years ago for 2 valid reasons
1) He is playing a Test match after 6 years and it takes some time to Adjust to Test cricket both with bowling and fitness and mind u he hasnt played much First class cricket too

2) Secondly the conditions in that infamous tour of england in 2010 were much more tougher for batting and suitable for bowling there was a reason that we were puting up 150 on the board most times..We put up 340 in the 1st innings of 1st test in this series which probably betters our highest score of the last series in england..maybe our batting has improved a bit but conditions plays a huge role.. oval will be flat too maybe old trafford may provide some help from him..

I expect hugely improved perfomances from amir in Australia


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But..... But..... Amir is a legend. He shouldn't have problems like the mortal bowlers. No?
 
He's just like any other regular bowler, who needs favorable conditions to take wickets. Not everyone can be like Dale Steyn. But he's still a lot better than that rubbish bowler Wahab Riaz, who IMO is below to Ishanth Sharma.
 
MMHS said:
I think, he had a great day to be honest - was sent to bat behind Wahab, that's itself an insult, but added 20+ with Yasir. Then in a day he had to dismiss Cook 3 times - that's 30K Test runs. And, I believe his stats has about 8 extra runs courtesy to Yasir & Misbah.

What else, bowled in 4 spells; kept the pressure always & has one more innings left. Who knows, he can get a couple tomorrow morning, can spank another 15-16 with bat & take 3 more in 2nd innings in a win.

Its a Test match & we have seen only 2 days - I do understand why T20 is so popular in PAK.
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Very well said.
 
Just an above average bowler hyped by his countrymen.

Would become a Good bowler in Friendly conditions like Anderson but never a Legend like Steyn.
 
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He looks like a world beater when conditions offer a lot of swing, but is a below average bowler otherwise. A Test average of 45 outside England is testimony to the fact.

Having said that, his performance will be a lot better in swing friendly conditions. He can be more dangerous than Anderson in matches to come.
 
s.h.a.k said:
Flat track. 1st test back and Cook one of the best test batsmen around dropped twice of his bowling and then bowls him out. Yes right no performance he should be getting 10 wickets on flat track no matter what.
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Yeah I agree with this.

He was head & shoulders your best pacer. He didn't have a great day, but bowled ok & importantly created 3 chances off the other teams best batsman & captain- kept trying & got him out. There's some heart there.

He contributes with the bat a bit (& room to improve to a decent #8 possibly as he settles into top cricket again) and still has the potential to cut loose- he bowled some crackers in NZ & in shorter formats since his comeback.

So far I see a bowler whose average days (today) are still pretty solid and we all know how good his best days can be- 2 days into a comeback (wow, impatience!) I'd say he's on track.

Any kid who can bowl 150ks in Australia & then slow down & swing it round corners in England like a match winner all within the space of 6 months at 18 years old is worth persevering with for a couple of series at least- even if he's just getting his groove back for 5 matches.

Invest in talent, don't blowtorch it then throw it away.
 
wrongun said:
Yeah I agree with this.

He was head & shoulders your best pacer. He didn't have a great day, but bowled ok & importantly created 3 chances off the other teams best batsman & captain- kept trying & got him out. There's some heart there.

He contributes with the bat a bit (& room to improve to a decent #8 possibly as he settles into top cricket again) and still has the potential to cut loose- he bowled some crackers in NZ & in shorter formats since his comeback.

So far I see a bowler whose average days (today) are still pretty solid and we all know how good his best days can be- 2 days into a comeback (wow, impatience!) I'd say he's on track.

Any kid who can bowl 150ks in Australia & then slow down & swing it round corners in England like a match winner all within the space of 6 months at 18 years old is worth persevering with for a couple of series at least- even if he's just getting his groove back for 5 matches.

Invest in talent, don't blowtorch it then throw it away.
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Too much wisdom for the clowns on here. It's gonna go right over their heads.
 
Lol people taking [MENTION=136729]Suleiman[/MENTION]'s threads seriously and bashing on the poor guy:narine
 
Did better than I expected tbh, those who expected a fifer in the first innings of a test match he's played in six years was absurd. Similarly,thinking he won't get better every innings regardless of the pitch is equally absurd, let the match come to a close first.
 
Dman said:
Just an above average bowler hyped by his countrymen.

Would become a Good bowler in Friendly conditions like Anderson but never a Legend like Steyn.
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Funny how none of the Test playing nations even have an 'above average bowler' right now. Steyn is on his last legs. Starc, who's touted to be the best young fast bowler right now, had an extremely average tour of England in '15.

Amir is class. Got Cook out thrice on that pitch. I believe he bowled magnificently well, besides the first 5-6 overs.

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Glad to see so many sensible comments here, obviously a few haters who will speak illogically.

Aamer had a good first day of test cricket with the ball after 6 years. He is only going to get better and better, easily the best pacer in Pakistan and one of the best in the World. as the series goes on I expect Aamer to do more and more damage and with Yasir around these are very dangerous signs for England.
 
An ordinary bowler who needs green mambas and cloudy conditions in order to look somewhat threatening.


But strangely he's considered as a
bowling great and often compared with some of the legends of the game by some of his irrational fans even though he hasn't achieved anything substantial in his career yet :srini
 
Doesn't seem able to do squat.

1/65 in the first dig, 0/33* in the second when the other pacers have taken wickets for fun.
 
Mohammad Amir looks the most toothless of all bowlers in this innings..
He's been sheerly disappointing
 
Another poor performance from this overhyped bowler. Very ordinary bowler who needs green pitches to perform. He has been the worst bowler in this 2nd innings.
 
Prince_ said:
An ordinary bowler who needs green mambas and cloudy conditions in order to look somewhat threatening.


But strangely he's considered as a
bowling great and often compared with some of the legends of the game by some of his irrational fans even though he hasn't achieved anything substantial in his career yet :srini
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I agree his fans have overrated him to an extreme point
 
Well, he needs assistance from pitch to deliver. Quite clear, really.
 
Pakistan fans, please hype Yasir Shah. He is the real deal. Help or no help from the pitch. Absolute match winner.
 
Worst Pakistani Bowler of the Match.

Once in a Lifetime Talent, Crown Prince of phasst bowling.

LOL.
 
He was always a rubbish Test bowler outside swinging conditions. Rohit Sharma of bowling.
 
He always thought he was overrated and needed bowling pitches to perform. Great bowlers like Wasim, Waqar and yes Yasir Shah perform irrespective of pitch conditions.
 
He is no wasim akram.And hence highly overrated.But overall he is a good LOI bowler and competent test bowler.
 
He bowled well in second innings. In the first innings he was a joke.

But in the second innings, he bowled alright, didnt give the bad stuff and did ok.

But the first innings bowling was a joke, 22 overs 100, england were all over us


And now he has2 wickets on 2 balls
 
What a game..!! Amir gets the winning wicket at Lords.. the ground where his career ended 6 years ago..
Kind of poetic isn't it?? :p
 
Took a couple of tail-ender wickets to make his figures look good.
 
Decent match.

I think, the way he bowled in 2nd innings, he'll get lot better in next 3 Tests.

BUT, NEED TO IMPROVE BATTING. HE HAS TO BAT AT 8.
 
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