Morality of Religions- Discussion thread

[Stewie]

You are again putting words in my mouth, I believe you were the one who first used 'ugly' parts with reference to the Bible. My reply was that was not unique for holy books and you have to justify the same bits in your own book.

Regarding post#497, he did say it was Allah's challenge which is why it piqued my curiosity and I didn't know what he meant by that. Is that something in the Hadiths ? Something in Islamic traditions ? Or did he just make that up ?

I am not sure where he is getting it from. I don't see any verse cited and it read like a personal opinion to me.

Even if you can find any authentic source that makes such a claim, I would not know how to respond to it, on account of my previous assertion that I am not a master of comparative religion. I know very little about what Hindus or Christians claim and how Islam's claims would be superior to them. I can try and handle anything you find offensive, but if you are getting offended at a claim made by a holy book or religion that it is superior to others and the only truth, well I am sorry ... but nothing I or anybody will be able to do anything about that. You just have to develop a thick skin. All religions make such a claim, one way or another.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

You are again putting words in my mouth, I believe you were the one who first used 'ugly' parts with reference to the Bible. My reply was - that was not unique for holy books and you have to justify the same bits in your own book.

Regarding post#497, he did say it was Allah's challenge which is why it piqued my curiosity and I didn't know what he meant by that. Is that something in the Hadiths ? Something in Islamic traditions ? Or did he just make that up ?

What is particularly your issue, plz elaborate. If it's about ALLAH (SWT) challenge to produce anything like Quran then you have heard it right.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Am I supposed to believe this screen grab? Where is the actual source of this?

| Pew Research Center

www.pewresearch.org

 

[Champ_Pal]

Every religion is good...no holy book preaches bad things. Its the way people interpret them according to their convenience.

Discussing on religion is never ending cycle. I would request admins to lock this thread.

I will fix your first sentence.

Every religion has parts that are good.

If any religion depends on people's interpretations, then the religion and its holy books have failed their purpose.

I agree that discussions on religion can be monotonous. Its not easy to make people see religion for what is its worth. People are born into a religion. More often than not, they are only exposed to the good side of it. Their elders and religious heads only tell the good things about their faith. No religion can claim exception. We just have to dig a bit deeper than the surface level and the unpleasant things come out in open.

 

[Stewie]

https://www.pewresearch.org/religio...itics-society-overview/gsi2-overview-1-png/[/

So what is this really proving? I ...c or otherwise) to bring about such a change.

 

[Stewie]

I will fix your first sentence.

Every religion has parts that are good.

If any religion depends on people's interpretations, then the religion and its holy books have failed their purpose.

I agree that discussions on religion can be monotonous. It’s not easy to make people see religion for what is its worth. People are born into a religion. More often than not, they are only exposed to the good side of it. Their elders and religious heads only tell the good things about their faith. No religion can claim exception. We just have to dig a bit deeper than the surface level and the unpleasant things come out in open.

The unpleasant stuff is usually n the politicization of religion. If you keep religion to a personal level and do not use it as an excuse to violate fellow human beings, it will never get unpleasant.

 

[RexRex]

If it's about ALLAH (SWT) challenge to produce anything like Quran then you have heard it right.

I mentioned this already .. Act 5, Scene 3 of Shakespeare's 'King Lear' gives me the same tears & emotion that you might get when you read your holy book. I consider the former a better piece of work. There are passages in the Bible too, not to mention the Gita.

My point is .. what is awesome to you is not awesome to others. It's a purely subjective thing.

 

[Stewie]

So what is this really proving? I ...c or otherwise) to bring about such a change.

I was on my phone and this somehow got messed up. So here is my proper response to this PEW poll.

I think it is very understandable and normal for Muslims to prefer the Islamic laws. I don't think this is any earth shattering revelation. This is regardless of where they live. Now, if any demographic in the world starts using illegal tactics to get their way, that's a problem. I would like to know if this PEW research poll in any way proves that was done?

I think preferring one thing and then trying to force it on others who don't prefer it... are two entirely different things. The former is not objectionable. The latter is.

 

[Stewie]

I mentioned this already .. Act 5, Scene 3 of Shakespeare's 'King Lear' gives me the same tears & emotion that you might get when you read your holy book. I consider the former a better piece of work. There are passages in the Bible too, not to mention the Gita.

My point is .. what is awesome to you is not awesome to others. It's a purely subjective thing.

Why does it even matter to you what is said in the Quran if you don't care about it much?

I think if you have read it, and you understand it, you may hold a different view. This is like me telling you about Gita. I think the very first thought you would have is "this guy has not read it"

so these are faith/emotion driven views. Once again, we are all barking up the wrong tree.

 

[RexRex]

so these are faith/emotion driven views. Once again, we are all barking up the wrong tree.

You are certainly emotional about this, I'll give you that..

 

[Stewie]

You are certainly emotional about this, I'll give you that..

I think its illogical to expect such views to be completely divorced from emotions. They cannot be. You will be hard pressed to find people in this world who believe this stuff and yet hold no emotional investment in it. If you are claiming otherwise, I am sorry, I will not agree with you or believe you if you use yourself as an example.

 

[RexRex]

I think its illogical to expect such views to be completely divorced from emotions. They cannot be.

Then you should refrain from participating in this thread. I think the OP made it clear he wanted to discuss the morality of religions, so u should expect various religions or religious views to get scrutinised down to the finest detail.

 

[Stewie]

Then you should refrain from participating in this thread. I think the OP made it clear he wanted to discuss the morality of religions, so u should expect various religions or religious views to get scrutinised down to the finest detail.

Scrutinize it all you want, I dont see how me or anyone feeling emotional about it is going to stop you or you being emotional about something will stop me from scrutinizing it.

That's the beauty of this forum, they will pretty much allow you all these luxuries that most Hindu or Indian discussion boards wont.

 

[rpant_gabba]

“Dad, why does Deuteronomy 20 talk about killing the boys and girls?”

My daughter wants to know. Even as a biblical scholar, I don’t have a good...

www.christiancentury.org

Excerpts:

I recently felt heartbreak when my daughter, shortly after receiving her first Bible, stumbled onto Deuteronomy 20, which commands Israelites to kill all that breathes in Canaan (vv. 16–18). I’m a pacifist, and that chapter is probably the last one I would want her to read. It happened to be one of her first.

“Dad, why does it talk about killing the boys and girls?” As if that question wasn’t bad enough on its own, she asked it first thing in the morning, before I had any coffee.

“I don’t know,” I slowly replied.

“But you teach the Bible! You’re supposed to know this stuff!”

At that moment, I wanted to resign from my job as a professor of Old Testament and find another line of work. Despite her young age, she knew enough to know that the killing described in that text was wrong. I’m very familiar with scholarly and pastoral responses to texts like Deuteronomy 20; I’ve even written about some of them. At that moment, each and every explanation seemed worthless and unconvincing. What do you say to a girl in elementary school about a text with which you have such a complicated relationship?

 

[RexRex]

@rpant_gabba Dawkins appeared on the Piers Morgan show yesterday. The man comes across as a total hypocritical goose.

 

[rpant_gabba]

@rpant_gabba Dawkins appeared on the Piers Morgan show yesterday. The man comes across as a total hypocritical goose.

Good thing I'vent gone about worshipping the guy and made a new covenant and start a religion.

 

[Stewie]

For those who didn’t/don’t believe me that the US had a lot of laws derived from religion and in the future there is possibility of more heading in that direction:

Supreme Court flooded with prayers for relief from groups eager to erode the division of church and state | CNN Politics

Religious interest groups are queuing up a series of high-profile appeals at the Supreme Court this fall that could further tear down the wall separating church and state, seeking to take advantage of a friendly 6-3 conservative majority that has rapidly pushed the law in their favor in recent...

amp.cnn.com

Religious interest groups are queuing up a series of high-profile appeals at the Supreme Court this fall that could further tear down the wall separating church and state, seeking to take advantage of a friendly 6-3 conservative majority that has rapidly pushed the law in their favor in recent years.

Catholic groups are challenging a New York State requirement that health insurance plans covermedically necessary abortions, for instance. A group of Muslim and Eastern Orthodox parents in Maryland want to opt their elementary school children out of reading books about gender and sexuality. And a Tampa synagogue hopes to advertise its annual ice-skating themed Hannukah celebration on public buses.
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/09/13/politics/ketanji-brown-jackson-abby-phillip-cnn-interview
After winning a string of major victories from the court in recent years, several of the groups involved are anxious for a further expansion of the First Amendment’s free exercise clause, which guarantees the right to practice religion free of government interference.