Maybe its me, but I cant see what is your solution to this problem .Take long hard look at ourselves , What you mean exactly ?
There is no easy solution – to take a long hard look at oneself, does not literally mean to stand in front of the mirror literally for 4 hours clenching your teeth. It means having honest conversations about the way things are done, to challenge the assumptions that you have (and which were littered throughout your post – about the so called meritocracy of the west etc) and make difficult decisions.
There are many organisations doing excellent community based work – I am indeed employed by one of them. We do many things – mentoring programmes, parenting interventions, social and emotional learning, agency collaboration and place based investment etc.
We can make a difference to the people we reach but until and unless the root structural issues in society are fixed, no solution will be sustainable. The UK is the prime example – this great country, at the very top of it you have the royal family. This institution that so many millions of people in the UK love and adore, sing the national anthem in homage to etc. That institution – by definition – is there to maintain white, anglo-saxon, protestant and aristocratic supremacy.
Why are you getting confrontational and derogatory with the previous poster, showing your lack of respect for freedom of speech.
Oh he can say and think whatever he likes. I am not going to take his computer away from him or block his IP, even if I could do those things. But I also have a right for vociferously challenge what I know to be nonsensical, ignorant and illiterate comments. He was saying racism is overplayed, the race card bla bla bla. Classic neoliberal right wing nonsense. And if there is one thing that infuriates me, it is lackeys! I see people like Lawrence Fox and I just laugh at them – but when I see a lackey, it infuriates me.
You may indulge in name dropping, quoting books and fancy words, and some illustrious career - but to me, you arguments sound no different from a person who knows all the train timings of the local train . Data not information. Not 1 point of value.
I have simply made the point – forcefully – that he is nobody to talk down the existence of racism or overplay the existence of the ‘race card’. If you read his posts, he appeared to back down on that point as he didn’t push it – so I assume he was trolling earlier and realised he didn’t know what he was talking about.
Ironically though – I am still waiting for your own point of value – scratching my head a little though.
Racism exists, but its not institutional. If you are so confident, that it is there in society , please prove that it exists institutionally, in UK today.
Well, why don’t we start with getting a job:
https://natcen.ac.uk/media/20541/test-for-racial-discrimination.pdf
Methodology
We sent sets of equivalent applications to 987 real job vacancies across the UK under names commonly associated with minority groups. For each job, we sent three applications with equivalent background and qualifications: one used a ‘white’ name and the other two used names associated with different minority ethnic groups. The names were randomly assigned to the applications at the last stage to ensure there was no bias across the sample.
Findings
The level of name-based racial discrimination was found to be high across all ethnic groups. This is consistent with the high levels of discrimination found in studies in other countries in recent years.
To secure a job interview, we had to send out 74% more applications for ethnic minority candidates compared to white candidates.
This is the great ‘meritocracy’ you think the west is!
Let’s read some more about this great meritocracy, shall we. What happens when you actually get a job?
https://assets.publishing.service.g...6/race-in-workplace-mcgregor-smith-review.pdf
“ Joseph Rowntree Foundation found that BME groups tend to have unequal access to opportunities for development, often because of a lack of clear information on training opportunities or progression routes within their workplaces. This can be made worse if progression relies on opaque or informal processes, if there is a lack of BME role models or mentors at higher levels within their workplaces to provide support and advice, or if there is a gap between equality and diversity policies and practice in the workplace”.
“Our call for evidence asked specifically what the obstacles to progression were for those from a BME background. Only a small proportion of individuals believed language skills or a lack of qualifications or formal skills were an issue. The main barrier many individuals felt was standing in their way was the lack of connections to the ‘right people’. For employers and organisations, it was unconscious bias that was identified as the main barrier. However, for all groups, discrimination featured prominently as an obstacle faced by ethnic minorities. More detail on this can be found in the summary of the call for evidence findings at the end of this report.”
https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/racism-is-still-a-huge-problem/
A third reported that they had been bullied and/or subjected to insensitive questioning
- Almost 15% of women and 8% of men stated that racial discrimination had caused them to leave their job
- 28% of participants who reported experiencing racism at work reported having to take a period of sick leave
- Part time or non-permanent employees were more likely to report racial harassment and discrimination
Over 40% of those who reported a racist incident said they were either ignored, or that they had subsequently been identified as a ‘trouble maker’. Moreover, more than one-in-ten respondents raising a complaint said that they were subsequently disciplined or forced out of their job as a result of doing so.
I could go on and on and on.
What else do you want to talk about?
School?
https://www.barnardos.org.uk/blog/how-systemic-racism-affects-young-people-uk
“When it comes to school, data shows that some children are disciplined far more often than others. According to Government data, the groups of children with the highest rates of permanent exclusion in the school year 2018-19 are White Gypsy and Roma pupils (0.39%), Traveller of Irish Heritage pupils (0.27%), Black Caribbean pupils (0.25%) and Mixed White and Black Caribbean children (0.24%).
When we look at the wider context of racism within schools, we begin to see a pattern. A poll of more than 400 BAME teachers found that 54 per cent have experienced actions they believe are demeaning to their racial heritage or identity. Students are also likely to have experienced this too - if not from teachers, then from their classmates - incidences of racism in school have increased over the last ten years. “
The justice system?
“This is another area in which accusations of systemic racism emerge time and time again. Across the UK, Black children were over four times more likely than white children to be arrested. Young black men were stopped and searched by police more than 20,000 times in London during the coronavirus lockdown – the equivalent more than a quarter of all black 15- to 24-year-olds in the capital. Overall stop-and-search rates between 2018 and 2019 show that Black people are now nearly 10 times more likely to be stopped and searched by police than white people. The disparity doesn’t end there - research from the Sentencing Council found that Black and minority ethnic people are far more likely to be sent to prison for drug offences than white defendants who have committed similar crimes.”
There is also The Lammy Review which found that the chances of receiving a prison sentence for drug offences were 240% higher for BAME defendants than their white counterparts.
Shall I go on?
Firstly - did you ever notice, that all cultures are NOT equal Â…
Some cultures have concept of
Meritocracy,
freedom of speech,
and concept of reason,
and tenet of speaking truth.
These principles which i have mentioned, if you notice, are not just words, they are values crafted for centuries, evolved into western society today.
Meritocracy, lol, concept of reason and speaking the truth, lol.
I’ll give freedom of speech. I mean, I’m not going to jail for saying these things – but you can look at what the mainstream media does to such people – actually that’s another thing I haven’t mentioned but could easily write a PhD on. Free speech isn’t as simple as not going to jail.
Yes, 100 % west have a superior work ethic - because of this rational thinking. Would you not agree?
No I don’t agree at all – this is the lie that has been told. It’s actually the lie that neoliberalism tells. That all you have to do is work hard blab la bla, work 5 jobs, work 4949 hours a day, work, work, work so someone else can get rich and you will get your reward. It’s a lie. The system is rigged.
So you want to sacrifice merit & fill the government with minorities. Why should any business/ individual believe in your utopia, and impose your equalitarian views, above his own judgment - thats his prerogative. If he believes that the crime statistics is skewed towards black people or would like to take the mathematical approach to hire germans - you cant hijack his free will.
Did I say I want to fill the government with anyone? Did I say I want to sacrifice merit? No. I said neither of those things.
I actually believe in true meritocracy – and that means everyone gets the same chance in life, in a system that isn’t rigged in favour of any group of people. It’s those structural inequalities I want to tear down, not some non existent meritocracy.
Of course, the black boy or girl could face discrimination, which he or she absolutely should not face, and history has been unfair to them. But by that rationale, if we see the history of contribution of the black community to the growth of America, it has been very little. So why should you selectively quote history then ? Please note - im not saying that he should be discriminated, just dont appease him, or give him preferential treatment.
Now I am beginning to understand your mindset better. You say the black community has contributed very little to the growth of America lololol.
Ok. Read a book mate. You were making fun of me for reading, it seems you really haven’t a clue.
There are the required laws in place to sue, for overt racism.
Big deal. Everyone knows about overt racism. What makes institutional and structural racism so dangerous is that it is not in your face. It is not overt. It is not obvious.
There But rather than appeasement, ( which is very risky and loss making ), IF, the current system, engages in meritocracy, reason & free speech, then things will get alright in time. The whole teach a man to fish, feed him for a lifetime thing.
The path of gold is open to be treaded, whoever is worthy can walk it.
There is NO meritocracy. The system is rigged. A handful of exceptions aside, if you are BAME you basically need a whole load of luck and a million things to go your way. The white man doesn’t need that. You could teach a man to fish but if you then don’t let him come to the market, he isn’t going to sell any fish.
I will make a part 2 of this post about the whole victim card angle soon, but in a more structured way, this was more of a type as you go thing
Do what you want mate.
