"Our bowlers were bowling at 130kph, their bowlers were bowling at 145kph" : Sarfaraz Ahmed

[RamLakhan]

Why there are no fast bowlers in Pakistan anymore? This used to lift their entire team (including batting & fielding)

 

[Pakhs]

Why there are no fast bowlers in Pakistan anymore? This used to lift their entire team (including batting & fielding)

They dont have a shoab akhtar but they have quick enough bowlers even now. The issue is always the same thats batting.

 

[Majid Khan]

The scary thing is Steyn is in his mid 30s and about 10 years older than Amir, but look at the difference in fitness , Steyn still looks like an athlete.

No sportsman no matter how gifted can not reach anywhere near his potential if he does not achieve supreme fitness— look at Imran, through fitness and strength training this guy became a fast bowler from a skinny medium pacer.

 

[Buffet]

View attachment 87156

Average/fastest

Last year same time.

Slowest ball by Ishant, Bumrah and Shami was 135.6. Ali was quickest from Pakistan with 135.5 avg speed.

Average speed of Pakistani was surely down. They often bowl slow with new ball and save energy for older ball.

 

[OmarKhan99]

If I was running the PCB, I would as an emergency action organise a national pace and Yorker bowling contest and invite the public , at every district and town level. Keep the goal simple: bowlers get to bowl 5 overs each (30 balls) at nothing but stumps , and bowlers who clock at 140kph and are able to hit the bottom third of the stumps (paint it a different colour) most regularly should progress to the next round.

Do this in every town and district and finally at provinces level, and then nationally and you will find the cream , with at least a dozen bowlers who could offer you some potential.

Then take those guys and fast track them with coaching and fitness work, and see what you get out of them.

How many times have we seen these Fast-Bowling "Talent Hunt" and scouting competitions in the recent past claiming to unearth the next Shoaib Akhtar, and how many times have those selected players actually progressed through to the international scene? Not many.

What these events will give us are players that bowl briskly but aren't young enough (don't have the required neuroplasticity) to be taught the dynamics in order be consistent and hence, are rarely inducted into a professional set up. When a drubbing of such manner takes place, it's only natural that people want to see some immediate changes, but I think it is imperative that we don't make drastic decisions in the vein of this recent series and instead make most/optimal use of the players at our current disposal.

For the fear of repeating myself, and since it has already been well-documented on this very thread, I won't say much about our current pace battery of Amir, Hasan, Shaheen, and Shinwari. In short, I believe they have the pace to operate at 140-147 consistently but only when adequately rested.

Instead of looking for short-term solutions to the dearth in "express" bowling options in the recent past, I reckon it would be more sensible that we focus on the long-term ones. Musa, Arshad, Rauf, Hasnain, Naseem, and Shaur are all part of a good core/batch of young players that are coming up, with a few being recognized as having genuine potential to be nurtured into express bowlers. The first thing is that they must be provided with the kind of domestic pitches that will encourage them to make use of their pace and make them go at full tilts for extended periods of time. PCB must provide them with an incentive to go rough up that ball and try to beat the batsmen for pace to get the breakthroughs like in the old days, and that can only happen if they don't solely bowl on pitches where you can get wickets by just dibbly dobbling along. Obviously, they'll also need to hire competent coaches for all levels, starting from the grass-roots and all the way up, to help them with the technicalities (use of front-arm, not falling away in the follow through, braced front leg, etc. ). Once they play enough domestics, the management will be able to sift through the best candidates and then induct them into NCA camps where they should go under rigorous conditioning of their bodies & minds and further develop their fitness & consistency.

All in all, I think instead of taking desperate actions, we should realize that we have great talent coming through, but need to have the necessary professionalism in the system to funnel/channel these players when they are still young. I agree, that we should have scouts, but I don't think that we can rely on that system alone, and rather the scouts should be a component of the professional set-up that can find some youngsters equipped with extraordinary talent and then fast-track them into their respective age groups and give them the full opportunity to metamorphose, rather than just some false hope.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

View attachment 87156

Average/fastest

Last year same time.

So it is

Bumrah(fast)
Ishant( fast medium)
Shami (fast medium)
Hasan( fast medium)
Aamir (medium fast)
Faheem (medium fast)
Pandya ( medium fast)
Abbas (medium)

in terms of pace in tests. As I suspected , Hasan is the fastest of the Pakistani bowlers in terms of average speed.

 

[Abdullah719]

Slowest ball by Ishant, Bumrah and Shami was 135.6. Ali was quickest from Pakistan with 135.5 avg speed.

Average speed of Pakistani was surely down. They often bowl slow with new ball and save energy for older ball.

135.6 is the average pace. Number on the left is average, on the right is fastest.

 

[saeed5646]

Sarfaraz Ahmed at a presser:

"If you talk about our bowlers and their bowlers, there was a big difference and our bowlers are not upto the mark"

"Our bowlers are bowling at average speed of 130 kph whilst their bowlers were bowling at 145 kph, if you bowl with lack of pace you will not get wickets"

"I dont know whats going on there [speaking about speeds] but previously it has happened like that when I came in 2013 - we had the same problem - at that time we had Irfan, Umar Gul and Tanvir Ahmed - they also had same problem but I dont know [pointing outside] whats happening in here in Cape Town"

"For me they are fitter than us"

"For me as a team we are not playing well, we were thinking that our bowling was far better based on Centurion but we didnt take wickets here and if we had done that, we would have restricted them to 250-300 runs and it would have been a different story"

"Credit goes to SA, they know how to play in SA. Their bowlers bowled really well and didn't give us any bad balls, our batsmen played some quality shots. They batted well too but we gave too many loose balls"

"We lacked discipline in batting but whenever Asian team goes away, they have problems but the way our batsmen showed their character in the 2nd innings, that's how you play Test cricket. We're getting better day by day"

"For the last Test, we need to bat like we did in the 2nd inns, we have nothing to lose. We need to be positive. But we also have to take 20 wickets otherwise we can't win. India took 20 wickets in Johannesburg in their win. Fakhar batted at 6 because he likes to play shots, he was facing some problems with the new ball and Shan Masood was batting really well so we thought Fakhar might feel better at #6"

i do think pakistan bowler have recovered well in term of speed in test matches.Shaheen through out first test maintain round about average speed of 138 .While nasim average speed was recorded 143 which was fastest of match and also better than starc .

 

[Nikhil_cric]

What was true against SA is true against Bangladesh now.

 

[TheSultan]

What was true against SA is true against Bangladesh now.

They just don’t learn. Although the likes of Mir Hamza struggle to get it over 130 when going flat out.

The bigger problem is the identification of the problem.

1. You need to identify fast bowlers who you mark as test pace bowlers.
2. You get them playing first class and red ball cricket.
3. You manage your finances and your policies, so if said bowlers want to go the easy route for franchises, you can offer some financial incentive for them to stick with red ball.

Having pace bowlers is essential in a test team. At least one if not more who can bowl average speed of 140+.

I know the “enlightened” ones will bring in the age old “speed is not everything look at McGrath, Pollock etc”.

What people don’t realise that McGrath still had Brett Lee and before that Gillespie (who was pretty sharp). Pollock had Allan Donald.

Asif had Shoaib and then Amir.

You need someone in the team to keep the batsmen honest - even if they don’t take the bulk of the wickets. It’s a team game.

 

[kron]

They just don’t learn. Although the likes of Mir Hamza struggle to get it over 130 when going flat out.

The bigger problem is the identification of the problem.

1. You need to identify fast bowlers who you mark as test pace bowlers.
2. You get them playing first class and red ball cricket.
3. You manage your finances and your policies, so if said bowlers want to go the easy route for franchises, you can offer some financial incentive for them to stick with red ball.

Having pace bowlers is essential in a test team. At least one if not more who can bowl average speed of 140+.

I know the “enlightened” ones will bring in the age old “speed is not everything look at McGrath, Pollock etc”.

What people don’t realise that McGrath still had Brett Lee and before that Gillespie (who was pretty sharp). Pollock had Allan Donald.

Asif had Shoaib and then Amir.

You need someone in the team to keep the batsmen honest - even if they don’t take the bulk of the wickets. It’s a team game.

Correct. Even steyn who was quick had morkel

 

[Rana]

They just don’t learn. Although the likes of Mir Hamza struggle to get it over 130 when going flat out.

The bigger problem is the identification of the problem.

1. You need to identify fast bowlers who you mark as test pace bowlers.
2. You get them playing first class and red ball cricket.
3. You manage your finances and your policies, so if said bowlers want to go the easy route for franchises, you can offer some financial incentive for them to stick with red ball.

Having pace bowlers is essential in a test team. At least one if not more who can bowl average speed of 140+.

I know the “enlightened” ones will bring in the age old “speed is not everything look at McGrath, Pollock etc”.

What people don’t realise that McGrath still had Brett Lee and before that Gillespie (who was pretty sharp). Pollock had Allan Donald.

Asif had Shoaib and then Amir.

You need someone in the team to keep the batsmen honest - even if they don’t take the bulk of the wickets. It’s a team game.

Top post

 

[Nikhil_cric]

They just don’t learn. Although the likes of Mir Hamza struggle to get it over 130 when going flat out.

The bigger problem is the identification of the problem.

1. You need to identify fast bowlers who you mark as test pace bowlers.
2. You get them playing first class and red ball cricket.
3. You manage your finances and your policies, so if said bowlers want to go the easy route for franchises, you can offer some financial incentive for them to stick with red ball.

Having pace bowlers is essential in a test team. At least one if not more who can bowl average speed of 140+.

I know the “enlightened” ones will bring in the age old “speed is not everything look at McGrath, Pollock etc”.

What people don’t realise that McGrath still had Brett Lee and before that Gillespie (who was pretty sharp). Pollock had Allan Donald.

Asif had Shoaib and then Amir.

You need someone in the team to keep the batsmen honest - even if they don’t take the bulk of the wickets. It’s a team game.

Yep. Solid points. You need at least one man in the attack who consistently bowls upwards of 85 mph to keep the batters on the backfoot. Ideally, 2

 

[mominsaigol]

They just don’t learn. Although the likes of Mir Hamza struggle to get it over 130 when going flat out.

The bigger problem is the identification of the problem.

1. You need to identify fast bowlers who you mark as test pace bowlers.
2. You get them playing first class and red ball cricket.
3. You manage your finances and your policies, so if said bowlers want to go the easy route for franchises, you can offer some financial incentive for them to stick with red ball.

Having pace bowlers is essential in a test team. At least one if not more who can bowl average speed of 140+.

I know the “enlightened” ones will bring in the age old “speed is not everything look at McGrath, Pollock etc”.

What people don’t realise that McGrath still had Brett Lee and before that Gillespie (who was pretty sharp). Pollock had Allan Donald.

Asif had Shoaib and then Amir.

You need someone in the team to keep the batsmen honest - even if they don’t take the bulk of the wickets. It’s a team game.

Gilchrist would have still been fine even without a pacer.

However he's obviously an outlier. What you hold is true.

Outliers will always exist since you'll never find a guy who bowls exactly the same impossible delivery 24/7

 

[Bhaijaan]

Pakistani cricketers are malnourished and lack pace and poor quality or lack of ghosht is a major reason behind that.

 

[mominsaigol]

Pakistani cricketers are malnourished and lack pace and poor quality or lack of ghosht is a major reason behind that.

Malnourished? They eat all day? Azam Khan ko dekha hai?

 

[aboveandbeyond]

Pakistani cricketers are malnourished and lack pace and poor quality or lack of ghosht is a major reason behind that.

Yes. They lack conditioning as well.

You look at Mark woods, Mitchell Starc, Bumrah, Shami, these guys are all consistent with their pace through out the day.

Pakistan bowlers are out of puff after one spell. This says to me to Many biryanis!

 

[sweep_shot]

Yes. They lack conditioning as well.

You look at Mark woods, Mitchell Starc, Bumrah, Shami, these guys are all consistent with their pace through out the day.

Pakistan bowlers are out of puff after one spell. This says to me to Many biryanis!

Fitness and diet need to be fixed. Otherwise, hard to succeed in Test format.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Yes. They lack conditioning as well.

You look at Mark woods, Mitchell Starc, Bumrah, Shami, these guys are all consistent with their pace through out the day.

Pakistan bowlers are out of puff after one spell. This says to me to Many biryanis!

Shami is a beast.
Look at his pace and agility at that age.

The quality of ghosht he eats is top level however not like fake donkey meat Naseem Shah and co are getting.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

Shami is a beast.
Look at his pace and agility at that age.

The quality of ghosht he eats is top level however not like fake donkey meat Naseem Shah and co are getting.

Honestly. Is there a ounce of sence in you. The way you spout rubbish, I dread to think what you consume.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

Fitness and diet need to be fixed. Otherwise, hard to succeed in Test format.

By the way, congratulations to the Bangla team. We're way to good for Pakistan.

England next for Pakistan, England will be licking their lips.

 

[sweep_shot]

By the way, congratulations to the Bangla team. We're way to good for Pakistan.

England next for Pakistan, England will be licking their lips.

Thanks.

England should be tough. All the best.

 

[shortbread]

Yes. They lack conditioning as well.

You look at Mark woods, Mitchell Starc, Bumrah, Shami, these guys are all consistent with their pace through out the day.

Pakistan bowlers are out of puff after one spell. This says to me to Many biryanis!

Fitness and diet need to be fixed. Otherwise, hard to succeed in Test format.

The conditioning of our fast bowlers has significantly declined as they prioritize mercenary wages of T20 contracts over traditional longer formats, leading to a mindset focused on delivering just four strong overs before calling it a day. This mentality, perpetuated by top senior bowlers, sets a troubling example for emerging young talent (ie. middle aged men with dodgy birth certificates), as it fosters a lack of physical endurance and mental resilience necessary for the rigors of five-day Test cricket. Fearing the grind of bowling 30-40 overs in domestic Test matches, these superstar bowlers often shy away from first-class cricket in favour of T20 gigs. For the right price they'll even play cricket at your weddings to entertain the guests. As a result, league cricket has undermined their commitment to the national team and eroded the work ethic needed for sustained success in longer formats. Sad state of affairs!

 

[aboveandbeyond]

Thanks.

England should be tough. All the best.

Lol. As a brit, I'm a big fan of the England cricket team . Even though I dont mind Pakistan doing well due to the ethnicity.

 

[TheSultan]

Pakistani cricketers are malnourished and lack pace and poor quality or lack of ghosht is a major reason behind that.

I see what you did there. I’ll allow you. You must have waited 20 years for this. But fair play, you have a good bowling attack and pak a pitiful one. It’s valid for you to gloat - at the moment.

But the wider point is that Pak are missing something. I would probably put it down to conditioning and will. I don’t see that will in the eyes of the pak bowlers and naturally even if they are pacers are struggling to last 5 days, forget whole series.

 

[Muhammad Saad]

We will get some good pacers out of now where like usual , in the last U19 Worldcup we had 3 pacers capable of bowling 86-89mph on a consistent basis , now tell me which nation in the history of U19 cricket has produce that quick pacers in just one batch? None.

 

[Muhammad Saad]

It's the lack of 4 day games being played by young pacers who are just looking for 4 glory overs resulting in they never develop enought stamina to bowl between 85-88mph through out the day.

 

[Muhammad Saad]

We will get some good pacers out of now where like usual , in the last U19 Worldcup we had 3 pacers capable of bowling 86-89mph on a consistent basis , now tell me which nation in the history of U19 cricket has produce that quick pacers in just one batch? None.

Even Pak before never had more than one 140k+ bowler at a time in the history of U19 cricket.