Painful and torturous to watch cricket under Misbah-ul-Haq/Waqar Younis

[Boiz Played Well]

I completely agree. When you have a more qualified option in Dean Jones, who is a well respected cricketer along with a decent coach why not go with him.

I’m not sure if Dean Jones would’ve helped the test team all that much. But I personally feel the test team is beyond help if even the best possible coach comes along. Jones vs. Misbah for our limited teams? I would’ve picked Jones. Because there’s at least some experience and some idea of what to expect. IU has also been one of those teams which have put data and analytics to good use. And with scarce resources, as was the case with IU and as is the case with Pakistan as a national team atm, that’s not a bad thing.

All of Misbah’s experience is a couple of coaching classes the PCB held over the summer.

 

[Boi]

Waqar was a pathetic captain and has proven to be a useless coach in all his tenures yet the PCB continues to choose him again and again. Misbah's captaincy presided over our lowest ODI and T-20 rankings and yet the PCB went for him.

He’s done good work when he’s just been bowling coach. A very bad head coach but he’s the best man for the job for helping and nurturing the upcoming pacers.

 

[Boiz Played Well]

He’s done good work when he’s just been bowling coach. A very bad head coach but he’s the best man for the job for helping and nurturing the upcoming pacers.

Do you know any particular bowlers he has helped as bowling coach?

I’m not for or against Waqar as bowling coach. I’m genuinely curious about his other coaching terms where he hasn’t been head coach.

 

[thecrusade911]

Keep quiet. Atleast we didn't lose games to Sri Lanka D under them

Pakistani fans are really delusional. Why the hell do people think that Micky and Sarfaraz duo were the reason we were number 1 in T20s? If this duo was so good why didn't our rankings improve in ODIs. The only reason is that no team took T20s seriously apart from us. ODIs were taken seriously and guess what we lost even to Bangladesh and almost won against Afghanistan. Do you guys really believe that the team that hardly wins against Afghanistan and looses to Bangladesh can be considered as a good team.
People here bragging about that we shouldn't have changed our side that took us to number 1; are you guys seriously saying that Hafeez, Malik, Hasan and Sarfaraz would have won us these T20s against Australia (though I think Hafeez can still be considered in the team if your no. 5 is Aasif Ali). We started loosin T20 under Micky and Sarfaraz. We lost to South Africa B team, then to England. It was about time we were put to our place.
The main problem really is that there is no real talent coming through. If you think bowling at 145+kph, hitting 3 sixes in a row, making a century or a double century means you are talented, then the results are there for everyone to see. Talent means you should be able to bunch of various things whether you are a bowler or batsman. Batsman should be very dynamic, should be able to score on both sides of the field with a healthy strike rate consistently against both spinners and faster bowlers(SENA players also play well against spinners in while ball cricket, test is a different game altogether). Similar goes to the bowlers. That is who should be called as talented. Show me one player from Pakistan like this apart from Babar. Don't say Harris Sohail. He'll exposed very very soon.

 

[muqarrab]

Pakistani fans are really delusional. Why the hell do people think that Micky and Sarfaraz duo were the reason we were number 1 in T20s? If this duo was so good why didn't our rankings improve in ODIs. The only reason is that no team took T20s seriously apart from us. ODIs were taken seriously and guess what we lost even to Bangladesh and almost won against Afghanistan. Do you guys really believe that the team that hardly wins against Afghanistan and looses to Bangladesh can be considered as a good team.
People here bragging about that we shouldn't have changed our side that took us to number 1; are you guys seriously saying that Hafeez, Malik, Hasan and Sarfaraz would have won us these T20s against Australia (though I think Hafeez can still be considered in the team if your no. 5 is Aasif Ali). We started loosin T20 under Micky and Sarfaraz. We lost to South Africa B team, then to England. It was about time we were put to our place.
The main problem really is that there is no real talent coming through. If you think bowling at 145+kph, hitting 3 sixes in a row, making a century or a double century means you are talented, then the results are there for everyone to see. Talent means you should be able to bunch of various things whether you are a bowler or batsman. Batsman should be very dynamic, should be able to score on both sides of the field with a healthy strike rate consistently against both spinners and faster bowlers(SENA players also play well against spinners in while ball cricket, test is a different game altogether). Similar goes to the bowlers. That is who should be called as talented. Show me one player from Pakistan like this apart from Babar. Don't say Harris Sohail. He'll exposed very very soon.

We became number one in T20s by playing in UAE where bowling was a factor and 160s were enough. 160 is below par in most other places. Its only now we are playing in australia and waking up to reality.

In ODIs, if Mickey and Sarfraz were that good then why did we not have our starting 11 nailed going into the WC?

 

[thecrusade911]

We became number one in T20s by playing in UAE where bowling was a factor and 160s were enough. 160 is below par in most other places. Its only now we are playing in australia and waking up to reality.

In ODIs, if Mickey and Sarfraz were that good then why did we not have our starting 11 nailed going into the WC?

Exactly

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Pakistani fans are really delusional. Why the hell do people think that Micky and Sarfaraz duo were the reason we were number 1 in T20s? If this duo was so good why didn't our rankings improve in ODIs. The only reason is that no team took T20s seriously apart from us. ODIs were taken seriously and guess what we lost even to Bangladesh and almost won against Afghanistan. Do you guys really believe that the team that hardly wins against Afghanistan and looses to Bangladesh can be considered as a good team.
People here bragging about that we shouldn't have changed our side that took us to number 1; are you guys seriously saying that Hafeez, Malik, Hasan and Sarfaraz would have won us these T20s against Australia (though I think Hafeez can still be considered in the team if your no. 5 is Aasif Ali). We started loosin T20 under Micky and Sarfaraz. We lost to South Africa B team, then to England. It was about time we were put to our place.
The main problem really is that there is no real talent coming through. If you think bowling at 145+kph, hitting 3 sixes in a row, making a century or a double century means you are talented, then the results are there for everyone to see. Talent means you should be able to bunch of various things whether you are a bowler or batsman. Batsman should be very dynamic, should be able to score on both sides of the field with a healthy strike rate consistently against both spinners and faster bowlers(SENA players also play well against spinners in while ball cricket, test is a different game altogether). Similar goes to the bowlers. That is who should be called as talented. Show me one player from Pakistan like this apart from Babar. Don't say Harris Sohail. He'll exposed very very soon.

Our rankings did improve in ODIs and we did win an ICC trophy despite the mess they were given to start with.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Misbah is a disgusting person and even worse cricketing mind. You guys will continue to cry. Even his staunch followers will lose their mind soon.

 

[HappyWarsFan]

Misbah is a disgusting person and even worse cricketing mind. You guys will continue to cry. Even his staunch followers will lose their mind soon.

Your the same guy who is horrible at judging talent and obsessed with youngsters.

I saw your post in another thread about how LQs youth development program was so great and how it'll help them fo well. Well now it's last place for 4 years in a row for them. How funny. Youth isn't everything.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Your the same guy who is horrible at judging talent and obsessed with youngsters.

I saw your post in another thread about how LQs youth development program was so great and how it'll help them fo well. Well now it's last place for 4 years in a row for them. How funny. Youth isn't everything.

The development program is very good. Only problem is the clown running it and selecting the players, Aqib. You take him out and put someone responsible in and it will show.

 

[Plumb]

The development program is very good. Only problem is the clown running it and selecting the players, Aqib. You take him out and put someone responsible in and it will show.

Absolutely!!!! We need to pick the right players and groom them. So far we have seen players who are one spell wonder and one innings wonder. They end up playing for 3-4 years and the cycle continues.

 

[Boi]

Do you know any particular bowlers he has helped as bowling coach?

I’m not for or against Waqar as bowling coach. I’m genuinely curious about his other coaching terms where he hasn’t been head coach.

The likes of Gul and Rana Naveed transformed under Waqar. Rana got to number 1 in the ODI rankings in 05/06 under the coaching of Waqar.

 

[Kroll]

The likes of Gul and Rana Naveed transformed under Waqar. Rana got to number 1 in the ODI rankings in 05/06 under the coaching of Waqar.

That's like a decade and half a go.

 

[muqarrab]

Our rankings did improve in ODIs and we did win an ICC trophy despite the mess they were given to start with.

What improvement? The icc trophy we won was a fluke. Going into the tournament we did not have a settled eleven and we stumbled upon a winning eleven. Hard to see how Mickey or Sarfraz should be given credit for that.

 

[TeymurBlake]

I’m not sure if Dean Jones would’ve helped the test team all that much. But I personally feel the test team is beyond help if even the best possible coach comes along. Jones vs. Misbah for our limited teams? I would’ve picked Jones. Because there’s at least some experience and some idea of what to expect. IU has also been one of those teams which have put data and analytics to good use. And with scarce resources, as was the case with IU and as is the case with Pakistan as a national team atm, that’s not a bad thing.

All of Misbah’s experience is a couple of coaching classes the PCB held over the summer.

That's my point, Dean Jones isn't perfect but he probably was the best option for Pakistan at the time. Misbah shouldn't not have even been considered regardless if that was coach or selector.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

What improvement? The icc trophy we won was a fluke. Going into the tournament we did not have a settled eleven and we stumbled upon a winning eleven. Hard to see how Mickey or Sarfraz should be given credit for that.

From #9 to #6. After falling to a level where we couldn't even compete against Bangladesh, we were able to beat both World Cup finalists in the same tournament.

 

[Mamoon]

It is painful and torturous to watch Pakistan no matter who the coach is.

 

[Haripotter]

This tour is already over. Let's wait for Bangladesh T20s.

 

[MRSN]

We became number one in T20s by playing in UAE where bowling was a factor and 160s were enough. 160 is below par in most other places. Its only now we are playing in australia and waking up to reality.

In ODIs, if Mickey and Sarfraz were that good then why did we not have our starting 11 nailed going into the WC?

True. Pak were good because they faced less T20 quality teams and played SENA on UAE pitches where Imad with his darts become unplayable and bounce does not rise as high as we saw in Aus and also because UAE pitches were slow which is not very T20 friendly. under Sarfraz tenure we faced WI teams which didn't have their star players who refused to tour Pakistan and also we played them on our home pitches.

People who have followed Pak cricket closely know we were never as good as our rankings say. We lacked quality hitters, which is essential for modern T20 game. Our team can't score beyond 150-160 even during Mickey days.

 

[MRSN]

From #9 to #6. After falling to a level where we couldn't even compete against Bangladesh, we were able to beat both World Cup finalists in the same tournament.

That's minnow level thinking. Pakistan definitely is good enough to be 6 or 7 ranked side but what we want is consistency and become a top 4 sides. Under Mickey Pak almost got knocked out by Afghanistan and it required drop catches and a rare match winning innings from Wahab and Imad. We looked hopeless in the Asia cup. We were thrashed by SL in thr UAE in tests anf T20Is in Pak.

We were never ad good as people make it out to be during Misbah and Sarfraz days and the fact that Sarfraz was biggest liability captain I have ever seen makes those days quitr forgetful. It's time to move on.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Pakistani fans are really delusional. Why the hell do people think that Micky and Sarfaraz duo were the reason we were number 1 in T20s? If this duo was so good why didn't our rankings improve in ODIs. The only reason is that no team took T20s seriously apart from us. ODIs were taken seriously and guess what we lost even to Bangladesh and almost won against Afghanistan. Do you guys really believe that the team that hardly wins against Afghanistan and looses to Bangladesh can be considered as a good team.
People here bragging about that we shouldn't have changed our side that took us to number 1; are you guys seriously saying that Hafeez, Malik, Hasan and Sarfaraz would have won us these T20s against Australia (though I think Hafeez can still be considered in the team if your no. 5 is Aasif Ali). We started loosin T20 under Micky and Sarfaraz. We lost to South Africa B team, then to England. It was about time we were put to our place.
The main problem really is that there is no real talent coming through. If you think bowling at 145+kph, hitting 3 sixes in a row, making a century or a double century means you are talented, then the results are there for everyone to see. Talent means you should be able to bunch of various things whether you are a bowler or batsman. Batsman should be very dynamic, should be able to score on both sides of the field with a healthy strike rate consistently against both spinners and faster bowlers(SENA players also play well against spinners in while ball cricket, test is a different game altogether). Similar goes to the bowlers. That is who should be called as talented. Show me one player from Pakistan like this apart from Babar. Don't say Harris Sohail. He'll exposed very very soon.

Before you go on an emotional rant again, sit down and calmly think about the fact that we used to beat weak teams atleast regularly. The way we disintegrated against Sri Lanka was sad to see. It was inevitable we would get smashed here.

Also, we won an ICC trophy under Mickey and came within a whisker of a semi-final spot in the WC, when no one gave us a chance after the West Indies thrashing. We have issues with our talent and our system, no sane individual is oblivious to that fact. But we look like a joke under Misbah, rather than an intetnational level team.

 

[Flat_Track_Bully]

Before you go on an emotional rant again, sit down and calmly think about the fact that we used to beat weak teams atleast regularly. The way we disintegrated against Sri Lanka was sad to see. It was inevitable we would get smashed here.

Also, we won an ICC trophy under Mickey and came within a whisker of a semi-final spot in the WC, when no one gave us a chance after the West Indies thrashing. We have issues with our talent and our system, no sane individual is oblivious to that fact. But we look like a joke under Misbah, rather than an intetnational level team.

Mickey knew how to get the best out of the players.

Misbah has no experience of coaching so how he has no clue what he is doing.

 

[Saj]

The harsh reality is that it doesn't matter who the coach of Pakistan is, they would have struggled on this tour of Australia.

I worry about what could happen in the upcoming Test series.

 

[Junaids]

The harsh reality is that it doesn't matter who the coach of Pakistan is, they would have struggled on this tour of Australia.

I worry about what could happen in the upcoming Test series.

How do you work that out?

1. Last year South Africa thrashed Australia (including Smith, Warner, Cummins, Hazlewood and Starc) in conditions familiar to both teams.
2. Australia crushed Sri Lanka early this year, but...…
3. A month later, Sri Lanka won in South Africa.

What is the conclusion?

It doesn't matter if you get massacred at first when you arrive in Australia or South Africa. If you give your players 4-6 weeks acclimatization (Sri Lanka acclimatized in Australia for South Africa) then you can do well.

Now look at Pakistan. They played in South Africa at the start of this year, and lost the first two Tests because they scored 100 runs too few in each match.

But look closer, and there were three players who demonstrated a complete lack of ability to perform in Australian/South African conditions. One was Azhar Ali, who showed that at his age he has completely lost it. The second was Yasir Shah, who as ever showed his complete inability to adapt to southern hemisphere conditions. The third was Fakhar Zaman. I would add that Sarfraz only played one proper innings.

The lessons were simple. All Pakistan needed to do to be competitive were:

1. Land the Test team in Australia no later than 20 October.
2. Replace Azhar Ali with someone capable of averaging more than 9.83.
3. Replace Yasir Shah with someone capable of averaging less than 88 with the ball, preferably who could bat.
4. Replace Sarfraz Ahmed with Mohammad Rizwan.

I would add that someone needed to grovel to Mohammad Amir to play the Pink Ball Greentop Test.

This is not rocket science.

Forget my own favourites, if Pakistan had arrived early enough they would have been competitive with:

1. Imam-ul-Haq
2. Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
3. Shan Masood
4. Babar Azam
5. Haris Sohail
6. Asad Shafiq
7. Iftikhar Ahmed (yes, I'd prefer Shadab)
8. Sameen Gul
9. Ehsan Adil
10. Shaheen Shah Afridi
11. Naseem Shah (Brisbane) / Mohammad Abbas (Adelaide)

The problem is the terrible decisions to arrive far too late and to include Azhar Ali and Yasir Shah.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

From #9 to #6. After falling to a level where we couldn't even compete against Bangladesh, we were able to beat both World Cup finalists in the same tournament.

Yes once the pressure was off to qualify and it would have needed a miracle to qualify, we suddenly started winning.

Remind you of anything?

I mean, if you are going to "thump chests at winning against world cup finalists", lets just keep it a bit realistic.

 

[MMHS]

How do you work that out?

1. Last year South Africa thrashed Australia (including Smith, Warner, Cummins, Hazlewood and Starc) in conditions familiar to both teams.
2. Australia crushed Sri Lanka early this year, but...…
3. A month later, Sri Lanka won in South Africa.

What is the conclusion?

It doesn't matter if you get massacred at first when you arrive in Australia or South Africa. If you give your players 4-6 weeks acclimatization (Sri Lanka acclimatized in Australia for South Africa) then you can do well.

Now look at Pakistan. They played in South Africa at the start of this year, and lost the first two Tests because they scored 100 runs too few in each match.

But look closer, and there were three players who demonstrated a complete lack of ability to perform in Australian/South African conditions. One was Azhar Ali, who showed that at his age he has completely lost it. The second was Yasir Shah, who as ever showed his complete inability to adapt to southern hemisphere conditions. The third was Fakhar Zaman. I would add that Sarfraz only played one proper innings.

The lessons were simple. All Pakistan needed to do to be competitive were:

1. Land the Test team in Australia no later than 20 October.
2. Replace Azhar Ali with someone capable of averaging more than 9.83.
3. Replace Yasir Shah with someone capable of averaging less than 88 with the ball, preferably who could bat.
4. Replace Sarfraz Ahmed with Mohammad Rizwan.

I would add that someone needed to grovel to Mohammad Amir to play the Pink Ball Greentop Test.

This is not rocket science.

Forget my own favourites, if Pakistan had arrived early enough they would have been competitive with:

1. Imam-ul-Haq
2. Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
3. Shan Masood
4. Babar Azam
5. Haris Sohail
6. Asad Shafiq
7. Iftikhar Ahmed (yes, I'd prefer Shadab)
8. Sameen Gul
9. Ehsan Adil
10. Shaheen Shah Afridi
11. Naseem Shah (Brisbane) / Mohammad Abbas (Adelaide)

The problem is the terrible decisions to arrive far too late and to include Azhar Ali and Yasir Shah.

There is a little difference though, which somehow you missed - that was SAF, this is Pakistan. That was a SAF with many of their experienced players in form, this is PAK, who under the dynamic coaching of Micky Arthur cost CSAF 5 day's gate money out of 15, when SAF is in severe decline and their senior players are shadow of their past. Sometimes your logic really makes me think that are we really that stupid here in PP, that someone will constantly feed us theories and expect to swallow? SRL beat SAF in SAF, a SAF that played golf for 5 days out of 15, when every day was scheduled for cricket against PAK ....... same SRL blanked Mickey Arthur's PAK in their makeshift home by same 2-0 margin .... I don't see any missing link here.

At least you didn't mention this time Shadab Khan - that's the biggest gain of that T20 Series I guess, you got a better idea of "all-rounder" Shadab Khan's batting ability. A week back, you were selling 100 runs from Shadab & Faheem - you didn't mention in how many Tests; PAK is scheduled to play 9 Tests in next 1 years - if that's the benchmark, I won't argue.

The XI you have put with Rizwan as opener and those 4 pacers - AUS would have won both Test by innings and declaring both times in their only innings. They lost in total 3 wickets, of which one was questionable LBW, in T20 games where batsmen swings bat almost blindly, and that attack had the most experienced 4 PAK bowlers .... and you think..... any way.

I am a bigger fan of Mo Amir - that guy is absolute trash these days, no heart, no passion, even no shame .... Mo Amir has played couple of pink ball Test already - have you checked back what he had earned there? Your latest fantasy is Sameen Gul & Ehsan Adil ...... after Salman Butt, Faheem Ashraf and Mo Nawaz, enough said.

 

[Junaids]

There is a little difference though, which somehow you missed - that was SAF, this is Pakistan. That was a SAF with many of their experienced players in form, this is PAK, who under the dynamic coaching of Micky Arthur cost CSAF 5 day's gate money out of 15, when SAF is in severe decline and their senior players are shadow of their past. Sometimes your logic really makes me think that are we really that stupid here in PP, that someone will constantly feed us theories and expect to swallow? SRL beat SAF in SAF, a SAF that played golf for 5 days out of 15, when every day was scheduled for cricket against PAK ....... same SRL blanked Mickey Arthur's PAK in their makeshift home by same 2-0 margin .... I don't see any missing link here.

At least you didn't mention this time Shadab Khan - that's the biggest gain of that T20 Series I guess, you got a better idea of "all-rounder" Shadab Khan's batting ability. A week back, you were selling 100 runs from Shadab & Faheem - you didn't mention in how many Tests; PAK is scheduled to play 9 Tests in next 1 years - if that's the benchmark, I won't argue.

The XI you have put with Rizwan as opener and those 4 pacers - AUS would have won both Test by innings and declaring both times in their only innings. They lost in total 3 wickets, of which one was questionable LBW, in T20 games where batsmen swings bat almost blindly, and that attack had the most experienced 4 PAK bowlers .... and you think..... any way.

I am a bigger fan of Mo Amir - that guy is absolute trash these days, no heart, no passion, even no shame .... Mo Amir has played couple of pink ball Test already - have you checked back what he had earned there? Your latest fantasy is Sameen Gul & Ehsan Adil ...... after Salman Butt, Faheem Ashraf and Mo Nawaz, enough said.

I don’t really understand the hostile tone in your recent replies.

Shadab Khan has three fifties in five Tests outside Asia. In South Africa he averaged five times as many runs per innings as Azhar Ali.

You seem not to have grasped my point. South Africa are much stronger than Australia, and Pakistan is stronger than Sri Lanka. Yet still Sri Lanka won in South Africa because they respected the game and they acclimatised properly.

As usual, a Misbah team has arrived in the Southern Hemisphere far too late. And now there will be inevitable consequences.

I’m always very happy to debate with you and to disagree with you. But I’m not going to argue with you or disrespect you.

 

[MMHS]

I don’t really understand the hostile tone in your recent replies.

Shadab Khan has three fifties in five Tests outside Asia. In South Africa he averaged five times as many runs per innings as Azhar Ali.

You seem not to have grasped my point. South Africa are much stronger than Australia, and Pakistan is stronger than Sri Lanka. Yet still Sri Lanka won in South Africa because they respected the game and they acclimatised properly.

As usual, a Misbah team has arrived in the Southern Hemisphere far too late. And now there will be inevitable consequences.

I’m always very happy to debate with you and to disagree with you. But I’m not going to argue with you or disrespect you.

My apologies, if I had hurt you - may be I am also extremely upset with the recent show of PCT, and expect better. Sometimes, I feel that your over enthusiastic posts regarding PCT is a sort of mocking to the team struggling to maintain their minimum status as an elite cricket team (which they are not in AUS/SAF). I didn't accept your friend request, because I haven't accepted anyone's invitation here - I just keep my personal life out of PP life.

Coming to the cricket - no, SAF isn't stronger than AUS, at least not that SAF which blanked PAK 3-0, then lost to SRL and being absolutely humiliated in India. I don't understand how you come to conclusion that SAF is better than AUS (I know they won 3-1, 2 years back when their 35+ brigade were 2 years younger), when AUS had drawn recent Ashes in UK (And will win 4-0/5-0 at home in 2 years time). And, SRL is much, much better Test team than PAK, looks like in T20 as well and probably a full strength SRL will beat PAK in ODI comfortably - for Test matches, they have better spinners, they have better new ball bowlers and most importantly, they have proper Test batsmen who can build innings and post a match winning total. PAK's best batsman by some margin averages 35 and has 1 hundred in like 35 innings ....

SRL didn't acclimatized for 5 weeks before SAF Tests - they won there simply because their new ball pacers used the new ball exceptionally well (And PAK's phast bowlers spilled it all over - went at 4.5+ rate with new ball on Day 1 at J'burg Test - that's embarrassing you know), their fielders took the catches, their spinners cleaned the SAF tail quickly AND most importantly, their top order isn't a laughing stalk like PAK against pace & bounce. You talk so much about "all-rounder" and "runs from bottom half" - SRL did it other way, top order set the game and kept their weak bottom half safe; just like it should be done.

Preparation indeed is a factor, but these days, no team gets 4 weeks preparation. And, by that logic PAK should have done better in AUS/SAF/NZ/ENG by the 2nd/3rd Test - they didn't and won't, simply because the required skill set isn't there, neither in bowling and not to even mention batting. And, this is quite evident in Hairs Sohail's batting - he is considered to be the 2nd best bat in PAK, and he looked absolute tail-ender against bounce, I know it's T20, but after so many years I can see which batsman is comfortable and who is struggling, regardless of format. Bowlers are struggling to hold breather for 4 overs - you expect 4 pacers to blast Aussies bowling 23-25 overs each in a day!!!! Least said about fitness and fielding is better - amateur associates like Holland & Scotland has better fitness & stamina than PAK team .... after 3 years of fitness regime under Arthur.


Again, my apologies if I had hurt you - I'll definitely look after that going forward.

 

[Junaids]

[MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION]
I contacted you personally to reach out and explain that I don't think my views about Makhaya Ntini are founded in racism - my father is an old boy of St Gregory's Dacca after all!

Can I tell you what I honestly believe about Pakistan cricket? I hope [MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] reads this too.

I think that from 1981 to 2010 Pakistan was actually better in Tests outside Asia than in it, for the following reasons:

1. Their strength was their fast bowling (Sarfraz, Imran, Wasim, Waqar, Shoaib, Asif).
2. Their weakness was their batting.
3. They never had more than 1 world class spinner at a time.

Pakistan had a serious talent shortfall which began around 2010. We saw when Ijaz Butt threw out Younis Khan and Mohammad Yousuf from the England tour in 2010 that the next generation could barely reach 150 in half their innings.

As you have correctly identified, most teams now arrive far too late for tours. This allowed Misbah to build a deceptive set of home results on playing on dead wickets and boring the opposition bowlers to death and winning by virtue of a chucker harpooning Pakistan to victory.

But it was always an illusion. Even in 2014-15, the touring New Zealanders would have won 2-1 had they not left one declaration a little bit late.

I think that Mickey Arthur was as reliant upon Steve Rixon as Brian Clough was on Peter Taylor. As soon as Rixon left, the fielding deteriorated and the quality of the decision making deteriorated.

But there is an important point here. Misbah's model as captain drew a series against England in England (an ageing Pakistan on its way down) but there was never any improvement in not just Australia and South Africa but even New Zealand.

The team that Mickey Arthur was putting together was genuinely getting better outside Asia. They too drew in England, but on their way up.

The problem outside Asia was that by January 2019 it was clear that 3 senior players were failures (Azhar Ali who was past it, Sarfraz Ahmed who was inferior to Rizwan and unbalanced the team by being unable to bat in the Top Six, and Yasir Shah who just can't adapt his bowling to the southern hemisphere). A fourth senior player, Asad Shafiq, has deteriorated only slightly but clearly is a wasted investment. A fifth player, a junior, was clearly unsuited to Test cricket - Fakhar Zaman.

I looked at that team in South Africa last January and thought:

1. Keep Shafiq another year to minimize the transition, but it's time to discard Azhar, Sarfraz and Yasir outside Asia.

2. This team was only 50 runs per innings short in the First and Third Test. It is young and on the way up and replacing the failing seniors will narrow that gap further.

I saw a team that was improving and whose weakest positions were the ones occupied by veterans.

I don't think that Mickey is the greatest coach in the world - although I thought that Mickey + Rixon was a terrific combination.

But I see a Pakistan team which has the capacity and potential to be eternally the best Asian team outside Asia, in part simply because of the production line of tall fast bowlers.

And I see a new coach who is systematically replacing up and coming youngsters with tried and tested failures and with geriatric nobodies.

I know that you and I disagree about Faheem Ashraf. But here is a guy who took 6-99 in his last Test and who has got a red ball county contract for next year because Northants see him as quicker and more incisive than their other bowlers. And yet somehow Imran Khan gets his position?

Same with Shadab.

In South Africa:
Yasir Shah played 2 Tests, took 1 wicket @ 123.00 and scored 13 runs @ 3.25.
Shadab Khan played 1 Test, took 4 wickets @ 20.00 and scored 52 runs @ 52.00.

It just horrifies me that players like Shadab and Faheem who have age on their side can get discarded after they performed that well.

 

[Junaids]

[MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION]

I should add that I can actually see a pathway to success for the Pakistan team these next five years, but it's not the path that Misbah will take.

A team based upon:

1. Imam-ul-Haq
2. Sami Aslam
3. ?
4. Babar Azam
5. Haris Sohail
6. Mohammad Rizwan
7. Shadab Khan outside Asia, Yasir Shah in Asia
8. Faheem Ashraf outside Asia, Zafar Gohar in Asia
9. Sameen Gul outside Asia, Sajid Khan in Asia
10. Naseem Shah
11. Shaheen Shah Afridi

That's a pretty strong Test team. It has three different spinners of high quality in Asia, two of whom can bat.

And outside Asia it has 4 quicks, a part-time spinner who can bat plus a batsman who can bowl part-time spin.

It is literally missing one batsman - apart from that I see a team which could do well in the next 3 World Test Championships.

 

[MMHS]

[MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION]
I contacted you personally to reach out and explain that I don't think my views about Makhaya Ntini are founded in racism - my father is an old boy of St Gregory's Dacca after all!

Can I tell you what I honestly believe about Pakistan cricket? I hope [MENTION=134608]Hawkeye[/MENTION] reads this too.

I think that from 1981 to 2010 Pakistan was actually better in Tests outside Asia than in it, for the following reasons:

1. Their strength was their fast bowling (Sarfraz, Imran, Wasim, Waqar, Shoaib, Asif).
2. Their weakness was their batting.
3. They never had more than 1 world class spinner at a time.

Pakistan had a serious talent shortfall which began around 2010. We saw when Ijaz Butt threw out Younis Khan and Mohammad Yousuf from the England tour in 2010 that the next generation could barely reach 150 in half their innings.

As you have correctly identified, most teams now arrive far too late for tours. This allowed Misbah to build a deceptive set of home results on playing on dead wickets and boring the opposition bowlers to death and winning by virtue of a chucker harpooning Pakistan to victory.

But it was always an illusion. Even in 2014-15, the touring New Zealanders would have won 2-1 had they not left one declaration a little bit late.

I think that Mickey Arthur was as reliant upon Steve Rixon as Brian Clough was on Peter Taylor. As soon as Rixon left, the fielding deteriorated and the quality of the decision making deteriorated.

But there is an important point here. Misbah's model as captain drew a series against England in England (an ageing Pakistan on its way down) but there was never any improvement in not just Australia and South Africa but even New Zealand.

The team that Mickey Arthur was putting together was genuinely getting better outside Asia. They too drew in England, but on their way up.

The problem outside Asia was that by January 2019 it was clear that 3 senior players were failures (Azhar Ali who was past it, Sarfraz Ahmed who was inferior to Rizwan and unbalanced the team by being unable to bat in the Top Six, and Yasir Shah who just can't adapt his bowling to the southern hemisphere). A fourth senior player, Asad Shafiq, has deteriorated only slightly but clearly is a wasted investment. A fifth player, a junior, was clearly unsuited to Test cricket - Fakhar Zaman.

I looked at that team in South Africa last January and thought:

1. Keep Shafiq another year to minimize the transition, but it's time to discard Azhar, Sarfraz and Yasir outside Asia.

2. This team was only 50 runs per innings short in the First and Third Test. It is young and on the way up and replacing the failing seniors will narrow that gap further.

I saw a team that was improving and whose weakest positions were the ones occupied by veterans.

I don't think that Mickey is the greatest coach in the world - although I thought that Mickey + Rixon was a terrific combination.

But I see a Pakistan team which has the capacity and potential to be eternally the best Asian team outside Asia, in part simply because of the production line of tall fast bowlers.

And I see a new coach who is systematically replacing up and coming youngsters with tried and tested failures and with geriatric nobodies.

I know that you and I disagree about Faheem Ashraf. But here is a guy who took 6-99 in his last Test and who has got a red ball county contract for next year because Northants see him as quicker and more incisive than their other bowlers. And yet somehow Imran Khan gets his position?

Same with Shadab.

In South Africa:
Yasir Shah played 2 Tests, took 1 wicket @ 123.00 and scored 13 runs @ 3.25.
Shadab Khan played 1 Test, took 4 wickets @ 20.00 and scored 52 runs @ 52.00.

It just horrifies me that players like Shadab and Faheem who have age on their side can get discarded after they performed that well.

I accept that (N'tini) explanation - let's move on.

I don't think, I believe PAK between 1975 to 1995 was a better Test team outside Asia than home - and the data will prove that as well. But, the reason wasn't fast bowlers, trust me - the reason was that the "home" of PAK's star players were outside Asia!!!! Didn't get that, let me explain - Asif (Chelmsford), Mushi (Northampton), Intekhab (London), Mazid (Swansea), Javed (Cardiff), Zaheer (Gloster), Sarfraz (Northampton), Wasim (Manchaster), WY (London), Aquib (Southampton), Wasim Raza (Durham), Imran (Hove/London), Salim Malik (Chelmsford) ....... such a shame!!!!

Fast bowlers don't win Test alone, if they are backed by some jokers with bat - an attack of Marshall, Lillee, Warne, Murali & Sobers won't win you against quality opponents - odd games may be, not series. People try to forget that, it that WIN line-up some one Jeff Doujon used to bat at 7 .... and he'll be Greg Chappell in this PAK line-up.

Your second mistake is "halo" effect - in my office, there is a South Indian guy, very nice young man working in HR .... and looks after facilities (of employees). This guy has to decline 2/3 request daily for IT support from different people - Indian and from South - must be IT guy!!!!!! You are judging the capacity and potential of PAK team's fast bowlers from that halo effect - since Fazal, Khan Mo, Imran, Wasim, WY, Shoaib, Asif came from there .... so Ehsan Adil will also be..... No bro, those fast bowlers were not born for the soil quality of PAK, they were developed into a fast bowler by systematic development and mentoring by seniors. Now, some Indian reserves are better pacer than what PAK is offering - something was opposite just about 20 years back. It's not Ijaz Butt, it's PCA (Pro Cricketers Association) that hammered the nail in PAK's cricket coffin - allow 10-12 PAK players to English County every season (And this time Counties will pick youngsters based on biological age - no wonder PAK owned most of age based record in past ... now challenged by AFGs in that domain, who are also naturally talented and born as 6 to 9 years old), PAK again will compete in even AUS. Current PAK team won't recover 50 runs from maturity - rather, they'll get exposed badly once opponents gets enough footage of they talent.

Regarding Shadab or Faheem's stats, I have said many times - don't try to over sale discrete data. This same guy Shadab went for 1/170+ in a Test Yasir took probably 10 wickets. Take that SAF fast bowler (forgot name) - he earned his life time achievement bumping PAK's batting talent, 26 wickets in 3 Tests at probably 16 ... and that guy will struggle to start for a Shield side!!!!! Faheem earned a Notts contract which only shows where English County is heading - once that same County had 3 foreigners : Sir RHD Hadlee, Clive Rice & Franklin Stevenson (& Lawrence Rowe as well?)..... irony is that, all three were also all-rounders. Shadab is bowling absolute rubbish these days - even SRL Part-timer leggi out performed him by some margin - and his batting is worse than Amir. It's good fortune for PAK cricket that BJP Govt. is saving India from PAK's cricket talent, otherwise you would have seen fun - Shadab bowling to Sharma, Dhawan, Kohli, KL, Pant, Iyer, Pandeya ....

I agree with Arthur part - no issues. Guy caught in a wrong job, in a wrong country. He should look to take charge for a team like NZ, WIN or even Ireland/ZIM/SCT - he'll do much better than what he did in PAK.

 

[MMHS]

[MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION]

I should add that I can actually see a pathway to success for the Pakistan team these next five years, but it's not the path that Misbah will take.

A team based upon:

1. Imam-ul-Haq
2. Sami Aslam
3. ?
4. Babar Azam
5. Haris Sohail
6. Mohammad Rizwan
7. Shadab Khan outside Asia, Yasir Shah in Asia
8. Faheem Ashraf outside Asia, Zafar Gohar in Asia
9. Sameen Gul outside Asia, Sajid Khan in Asia
10. Naseem Shah
11. Shaheen Shah Afridi

That's a pretty strong Test team. It has three different spinners of high quality in Asia, two of whom can bat.

And outside Asia it has 4 quicks, a part-time spinner who can bat plus a batsman who can bowl part-time spin.

It is literally missing one batsman - apart from that I see a team which could do well in the next 3 World Test Championships.

You have done that (path way) many times - with different names. Changing names won't work, unless the quality & skills are not there.

You are back into same trap which almost every PPassioners try to sell me (and few trolls me) : "Pakistan may talent bhut hai ..... only issue is selection". When fans constantly blame selection and everyone comes with a laundry list, you have to understand that problem is somewhere else. 20 years back, I heard Harsha Bhogle almost crying in TV with selection issues ... why they are not picking talented pacers from so many options - today Indian fans cursing selectors, why this tundlar is picked ... and that guy took 6 for 7 today (in a T20, I agree) - can't you see the transformation?

The team you have posted, let me tell you what will happen in 5 years

Iam & Sami are max 35 average player, that too after lots of minnow bashing and Asian runs - outside Asie, maintaining 23 will be challenge.

At 3, there is absolutely no one to pick - No. 3 is a different breed, which doesn't exist in PAK. They might try to fit in a 3rd opener in that role - same 35/23.

At 4, Babar is capable to maintain an average either side of 50, but a batsman can't deliver constantly coming at 37/2 and every bowler targeting him - his case is worse than Hanif, why & how, I believe you know.

At 5, Haris Sohail might not last 5 months, let alone 5 years. That guy isn't chronic unfit, rather that guy is a sick attitude player, should be kicked out immediately - only in PAK, you'll see pro player with that sort of fitness and physic. Again, max a 35-38 average player.

6. Rizwan ..........

7. Yasir was born at least 6 years old, now officially 33, and looks like 43, 5 years later he'll look like 53....
5 years later you might see Shadab Khan playing Ramadan League T5 (F5).

8. Faheem Ashraf won't make PAK team in foreseeable future - or other way, if he makes it, I can feel only sorry for PAK cricket. Gohar is excellent choice - only in PAK it's taking him so long....

9/10/11 - decent to good prospect, with lots of ifs.... they are starting from a base, unless that base goes in down slope, pace attack should be better than what it is now. But, playing with this UAE model (PAK wickets are even worse - check the 3 T20 games on PAK's No. 1 venue - shambolic, so no hard feelings for UAE) cricket, they'll have to wait for someone to take the skin out of ball - no team can compete after allowing 170/1 consistently.

The glaring weakness of your squad is the batting - the fundamental of any cricket team; it won't solve by just picking players or changing players or bringing youngsters. We have seen several youngsters in PP for last few years, until they were brought in day light ......

PAK can do well in 3 Test championship - but, not with or for the team you have selected. It doesn't work that way - suddenly, these batsmen are not going to post 350+ scores, or bowlers learn to use new ball. It can happen, the path way is only and only by investing in PAK's FC cricket, improving domestic wickets, improving playing conditions, massively improving coaching & player development system/talent management, systematic grooming (from age level by phase), proper selection methodologies, modernized conditioning regime (not like Mickey Arthur's YoYo, which passed Imad & Sarfraz with scores of 18), and lots, lots of honesty & passion by the custodians of PAK cricket.

 

[Junaids]

Again, [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION].

The issue is this.

Pakistan has ALWAYS in my 50 years been a team which can only win low scoring matches unless the pitch is as dead as a dodo.

Nothing has changed. They have never had more than 2 international class batsmen in the team at once since 1979 if I am honest.

I think that Sami Aslam, Imam and Rizwan should average 40 - slightly more than Shafiq.

Babar should average 50.

So 4 of the top 6 have contributed 170 runs. Even if your numbers 3 and 6 only average 30 each, suddenly you're up to 230 runs per innings.

Shadab in my opinion can average 35 with the bat and 38 with the ball, which suits me.

Now your top 7 has contributed 265 runs. As you know, I need my Numbers 8 and 9 to contribute 40 runs per innings between them - that's as important as their bowling.

Now I'm up to 305 runs per innings, and that's all you need in Test cricket. You don't lose very often if you score 610 runs in a Test.

I don't expect miracles. I don't think that Pakistan is going to produce better options than Imam and Sami Aslam, but I want to get every ounce of potential out of the pair of them.

Look at the other Test teams around the world. Most of them only have a couple of world class players, if that.

That team that I listed is roughly on a par with pretty much everyone except for the current Indians.

 

[MMHS]

Again, [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION].

The issue is this.

Pakistan has ALWAYS in my 50 years been a team which can only win low scoring matches unless the pitch is as dead as a dodo.

Nothing has changed. They have never had more than 2 international class batsmen in the team at once since 1979 if I am honest.

I think that Sami Aslam, Imam and Rizwan should average 40 - slightly more than Shafiq.

Babar should average 50.

So 4 of the top 6 have contributed 170 runs. Even if your numbers 3 and 6 only average 30 each, suddenly you're up to 230 runs per innings.

Shadab in my opinion can average 35 with the bat and 38 with the ball, which suits me.

Now your top 7 has contributed 265 runs. As you know, I need my Numbers 8 and 9 to contribute 40 runs per innings between them - that's as important as their bowling.

Now I'm up to 305 runs per innings, and that's all you need in Test cricket. You don't lose very often if you score 610 runs in a Test.

I don't expect miracles. I don't think that Pakistan is going to produce better options than Imam and Sami Aslam, but I want to get every ounce of potential out of the pair of them.

Look at the other Test teams around the world. Most of them only have a couple of world class players, if that.

That team that I listed is roughly on a par with pretty much everyone except for the current Indians.

Understood the maths - but, may not be 230, with current lot top 6 should reach 170 (add up their average) ...... if I add another 80, instead of 305, It should reach somewhere between 240 to 250, and a total around 500 ..... sometimes why PAK combined innings is challenged to reach half of that is a big surprise for me.....

It's true - most of the teams have two world class batsmen, and I tend to believe PAK has one - so the difference isn't there. Difference is that most of top teams have 4/5 other batsmen who'll walk into PAK XI and, PAK's other 5 will struggle to make their C squad.

 

[Captain caveman]

Imam will be a sitting duck to aussies bouncers!
Shan masood is the best pakistani player of bouncers and did well in SA, but his not in the squad!

Shan should have been partnered with abid ali, Is abid ali in the squad?

Azhar ali is finished.

Babar wil do ok.

Ifti will do alright, but he is as terrible against bouncers as imam, but the bowlers will be wary of him as he can play aggressively, something imam cant and hence why imam gets pressurised.

Shafiq i think will do ok.

Basically, opening with shaan and abid ali and dropping iman would have made pakistan a better team against australia, still would have most likely lost, but it would have been competitive.
Now l expect a one sided hammering!

 

[Captain caveman]

Imam will be a sitting duck to aussies bouncers!
Shan masood is the best pakistani player of bouncers and did well in SA, but his not in the squad!

Shan should have been partnered with abid ali, Is abid ali in the squad?

Azhar ali is finished.

Babar wil do ok.

Ifti will do alright, but he is as terrible against bouncers as imam, but the bowlers will be wary of him as he can play aggressively, something imam cant and hence why imam gets pressurised.

Shafiq i think will do ok.

Basically, opening with shaan and abid ali and dropping iman would have made pakistan a better team against australia, still would have most likely lost, but it would have been competitive.
Now l expect a one sided hammering!

My bad, just checked the score and shan is playing, thank goodness he was selected. But azhars out cheaply as expected. Should have selected abid ali.
The guys i missed out were haris sohail and rizwan.
Haris needs to get his act together, his been dismissed cheaply again!
He is so talented but looks so lerthargic at times, down right lazy if i am honest, he wil need to pull his socks up!
Rizwan would do alright for a keeper / lower order batsman, probably get scores in the 20s and 30s.

So looking at the current team playing aus a, im glad imam is not playing and the one change in the batting line up i would have chosen abid ali over the captain azhar, now i dont think abid is in this tour and how do you go about dropping the captain?


Bowling there have gone for yasir shah, afridi, naseem shah and imran khan.
I would have selected shadab khan instead of yasir, as i dont see spin playing a huge role in these tests and shadab can bat.
I would have gone for sameen gul or ehsan adil instead of imran khan.

2/3 changes from the team misbahs gone for, but i think these 2/3 changes would have made a big difference.

 

[The_Odd_One]

The outcome of the series would have been 3-0 even with Mickey and Sarfraz.

A full-strength Australian team in Australia is one of the hardest opponents to beat.

 

[thecrusade911]

Before you go on an emotional rant again, sit down and calmly think about the fact that we used to beat weak teams atleast regularly. The way we disintegrated against Sri Lanka was sad to see. It was inevitable we would get smashed here.

Also, we won an ICC trophy under Mickey and came within a whisker of a semi-final spot in the WC, when no one gave us a chance after the West Indies thrashing. We have issues with our talent and our system, no sane individual is oblivious to that fact. But we look like a joke under Misbah, rather than an intetnational level team.

Ideally If you are a good enough team, you should beat that Sri Lanka team on any day no matter who the coach is. The problem is coach also but the bigger problem is PLAYERS themselves.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Yes once the pressure was off to qualify and it would have needed a miracle to qualify, we suddenly started winning.

Remind you of anything?

I mean, if you are going to "thump chests at winning against world cup finalists", lets just keep it a bit realistic.

Nobody is thumping chests. He said there was no improvement. I provided facts that there was.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Ideally If you are a good enough team, you should beat that Sri Lanka team on any day no matter who the coach is. The problem is coach also but the bigger problem is PLAYERS themselves.

Yes, but please do explain how the same set of players beat such weak opposition under Mickey, and were reduced to kittens under Misbah?

 

[Kroll]

If he's insistent on playing Yasir Shah which he probably will do cos why bring him? Then things are going to get very painful indeed.

Watching Azhar play will be a torturous process as he can barely hold a bat due to a dodgy knee.

 

[Salman4.]

Misbah-ul-Haq's team selections and frank attitude compared to Mickey Arthur/Inzamam-ul-Haq regime

Misbah might be a limited coach. He might be a test coach and not a T20 one. He might be a defensive coach.
But since taking over Arthur, I like the fact that new players are being tested and actually getting chances. The whole T20 squad played except Qadir (it was difficult to drop Shadab as he was getting better). Now today in the practice match, all the depth is being tested. In Mickey's era the word "depth" didn't exist. We saw the same 13-14 players playing for 2 years.
There is also another thing I like about him. His directness in the press conferences. Whenever asked about a particular player, he always tells us what is going in his mind unlike Inzi who would not give proper answers and Arthur who, after every loss, would come out saying 'we are a team who hates losing' and all of that trash.
What do you think guys?

 

[Kroll]

Only 2 days in to the 1st Test, don't know if it's worth staying up late or getting up in the small hours to watch the rest of the cricket?

Normally, you might have a nightmare while sleeping during the night, but if I stay or get up early, I could be experiencing a nightmare whilst awake.

Looks like the rest of this Test series is going to be redundant.

 

[emranabbas]

Misbah has lost his marbles infact he didn't have any to begin with

 

[Slog]

This is Misbah cricket not Waqar.

He has no say in tactics

 

[Asif321]

now guess what . Misbah after the tour will say we learnt alot this tour it was learning curve for boys!

we come australia for learning , learning and experiments should be done in FC and in low profile series
not here in Australia

 

[Greenstorm]

Someone should launch a campaign on social media to sack Misbah and Waqar. He is sucking the life out of Pakistan cricket. I have wasted my youth watching this guy and his team since last 10 years.

 

[Asif321]

this is going to be long 4 years .

 

[aukhan]

Someone should launch a campaign on social media to sack Misbah and Waqar. He is sucking the life out of Pakistan cricket. I have wasted my youth watching this guy and his team since last 10 years.

I really feel for your generation. You guys grew up watching Misbah Era.

 

[aukhan]

Its 2013 again.

Misbah makes it so painful to watch Pakistan cricket. He has destroyed this decade.

 

[SarfiBabarHaris]

I have wasted my youth watching this guy and his team since last 10 years.

This!

One of my biggest regret in life

 

[Energy]

Agreed. It is a painful time to be a Pakistan supporter. Have a feeling Misbah will go on to be the next Intikhab Alam. Forever associated with the PCB.

 

[Bleedgreen4ever]

this is going to be long 4 years .

Let's hope he gets kicked out before that.

I hope this guy gets sacked after the coming world T20

 

[Aaaaa]

Its 2013 again.

Misbah makes it so painful to watch Pakistan cricket. He has destroyed this decade.

This. I’m sure misbah is a lovely guy but my God he makes cricket so boring.

Although I don’t blame this current performance solely on him because I do feel our team lacks talent and ability which no coaching or selection can improve. But Misbah at the helm isn’t helping. I remember watching cricket under him when the team looked scattered and without tactics and I get the same feeling now again.

 

[Shazzam]

Should have never given these important roles. International cricket is not some joke where you give opportunity to a dude whose hardly qualified. The results are all there for everyone to see. Pakistan deserves these results.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Let's hope he gets kicked out before that.

I hope this guy gets sacked after the coming world T20

Yep, he will be. From the looks of things, this team will lose every single match they play. We lost before too, but did not get smashed like this. Come World T20, we will definitely face a first round exit and enter yet another rebuilding phase.

 

[MRSN]

now people will realize why I was such a strong hater of his personality. He acted like a dictator when he was in full charge of the team during his peak days as a captain. He promoted friendship and experience over performing youngsters.

Still remember him benching Umar Akmal despite his 3 50s in last 5 odd games and also the way Misbah sideline him from tests despite Umar performing on tough away WI tour.

He didn't drop UA for lack of performance but failure of UA to accept Misbah's school of thought play and bow down to his stature like Azhar and others were doing.

still remember Waqar and Misbah's post wc 15 report why Pakistan couldn't make semis because UA and Ahmed Shehzad wouldn't spend time on crease. This is the level of these two persons and people expect them to change our fortunes.

 

[coy0607]

Anyone who follows Pakistan cricket knew what the sort of devastation the Misbah + Waqas era would bring, just look at the LOI performance from 4-5 years ago.

This is 100% Wasim Khan’s failure. His biggest decisions have been total disasters for Pakistan cricket

 

[Captain caveman]

This is Misbah cricket not Waqar.

He has no say in tactics

Its all misbah, waqar is just a bowling coach.
Does anyone in their right mind think waqar would have chosen imran khan snr, musa and abbas to play these two tests in aus, of course not, this is misbah's decision!
Misbah has always tried to be too clever, ever since i first saw him, from the moment he played that pathetic ramp shot to the slow motion in mohali and now adelaide. Misbah please leave us alone, Allah ka vas ta humra pitcho cho dor!

 

[emranabbas]

Its all misbah, waqar is just a bowling coach.
Does anyone in their right mind think waqar would have chosen imran khan snr, musa and abbas to play these two tests in aus, of course not, this is misbah's decision!
Misbah has always tried to be too clever, ever since i first saw him, from the moment he played that pathetic ramp shot to the slow motion in mohali and now adelaide. Misbah please leave us alone, Allah ka vas ta humra pitcho cho dor!

Have you not watched him in wc20 in 2007 I think

He lost us a final from a winning position

 

[emranabbas]

Its all misbah, waqar is just a bowling coach.
Does anyone in their right mind think waqar would have chosen imran khan snr, musa and abbas to play these two tests in aus, of course not, this is misbah's decision!
Misbah has always tried to be too clever, ever since i first saw him, from the moment he played that pathetic ramp shot to the slow motion in mohali and now adelaide. Misbah please leave us alone, Allah ka vas ta humra pitcho cho dor!

https://youtu.be/UtEexaJhPEc

 

[Captain caveman]

Have you not watched him in wc20 in 2007 I think

He lost us a final from a winning position

The ramp shot was a refferal to that.

 

[Captain caveman]

Anyone who follows Pakistan cricket knew what the sort of devastation the Misbah + Waqas era would bring, just look at the LOI performance from 4-5 years ago.

This is 100% Wasim Khan’s failure. His biggest decisions have been total disasters for Pakistan cricket

PCB could have picked anyone from small heath and they would done a better job than wasim khan.

 

[Captain caveman]

Ehsan mani, wasim khan.and misbah ul haq all need to be fired TODAY!

 

[MMHS]

Posters here would like to drink blood of Misbah & WY, because of a false belief ............. guys, the barrel is empty, trust me - not much left to scratch. Have patience, and give them some time - it won't happen over night.

....... the barrel is indeed empty - scratching the bottom will only hurt the finger nail. It won’t happen overnight- naujowan fans need to have patience, keep low profile in PP and be aware of other country posters here; it’s our little PP family, where no one is entitled.

 

[andy0204]

Ehsan mani, wasim khan.and misbah ul haq all need to be fired TODAY!

Even if they are fired what guarantee you can give that this team will be better?

 

[Pete Rose]

As I have said: Misbah is here to win tests at home by selecting 40 year old spinners. He will give you what you want.

 

[MMHS]

PCB could have picked anyone from small heath and they would done a better job than wasim khan.

Won’t, trust me - I have followed PAK cricket almost from when Air Marshal Nur Khan was PCB Chairman!!!!!! Not sure if Zuganda has a cricket board, but they do have a soccer association - trust me, even that one would be state of the art organisation compared to previous model PCB.

WK is doing a fantastic job to my likings - no matter who is coach, this royal hammering down under was destined ... last time PAK had YK, Misbah, Amir, Wahab and that Arthur guy in charge - still it was embarrassing...... it’s actually better that next time when PCB hires their coaching staff, there will be less barking against professional (foreigner - there is no qualified coach in PAK) Coach and WK might successfully appoint a capable & qualified guy.

 

[Captain caveman]

Even if they are fired what guarantee you can give that this team will be better?

Cant guarantee that they will be better, that will depend on who replaces them.
Cant be much worse though, so worth taking the chance.

 

[Kroll]

Even if they are fired what guarantee you can give that this team will be better?

There's none but we can start rebuilding and planning for the future immediately. Misbah will just continue to serve up the same old dross.

 

[Captain caveman]

Won’t, trust me - I have followed PAK cricket almost from when Air Marshal Nur Khan was PCB Chairman!!!!!! Not sure if Zuganda has a cricket board, but they do have a soccer association - trust me, even that one would be state of the art organisation compared to previous model PCB.

WK is doing a fantastic job to my likings - no matter who is coach, this royal hammering down under was destined ... last time PAK had YK, Misbah, Amir, Wahab and that Arthur guy in charge - still it was embarrassing...... it’s actually better that next time when PCB hires their coaching staff, there will be less barking against professional (foreigner - there is no qualified coach in PAK) Coach and WK might successfully appoint a capable & qualified guy.

You know i respect your opinion, but i have to disagree with wasim khan doing a good job. Anyone who hires one man to be chief selector, head coach and batting coach, should be fired!

 

[Haripotter]

It's not even 6 months since misbah took over the reign. We all need to show patience

 

[Captain caveman]

As I have said: Misbah is here to win tests at home by selecting 40 year old spinners. He will give you what you want.

Welcome back zulfi!

 

[Captain caveman]

It's not even 6 months since misbah took over the reign. We all need to show patience

Yeah and what damage has already been done, just think where we will be in 3 years time.

 

[mystical man]

No surprise coming from a Mickey Arthur fan, the darkest era of Pakistan cricket.

We were on a perpetual losing streak, longest losing streak in ODIs, forgot what victory meant in the premier Test format, started losing even at our home!

That dark era is ending. We'll start winning Tests starting from home and become competitive in ODIs.

Not to mention Mickey Arthur's love for Sarfraz and Malik. Glad we got rid of them.

Of course it's gonna be painful for the dark era fan. I'm just looking forward to our young pacers and team play the Tests and ODIs.

Cricket ek mazaak bana ke rakh diya Hain. Mindset of the 80s where you will debut 3 youngsters with zero experience and expect them to take 20 wickets for Pakistan and win a test match.

 

[Captain caveman]

....... the barrel is indeed empty - scratching the bottom will only hurt the finger nail. It won’t happen overnight- naujowan fans need to have patience, keep low profile in PP and be aware of other country posters here; it’s our little PP family, where no one is entitled.

Barrel is certainly not full but neither is it empty.

BOWLING
Haris rauf
Naseem shah
Shaheen shah afridi
Eshan adil
Sameen gul
Shadab khan

In asia
Yasir shah
M. Abbas

BATTING
babar
Shafiq
Imam
Haris sohail(though out of form currently)
Rizwan

All decent players

 

[mystical man]

It's not even 6 months since misbah took over the reign. We all need to show patience

All my support and love to misbah but imagine india touring Australia with Deepak chahar, Saini, nagarkoti and expecting them to take 20 wickets.. What are you thinking??

 

[MMHS]

You know i respect your opinion, but i have to disagree with wasim khan doing a good job. Anyone who hires one man to be chief selector, head coach and batting coach, should be fired!

He didn’t select him - he was forced to select. When you are fighting several wolfs, best tactics is to throw some bones to the less ferocious ones and keep them happy for the time being, until you have killed the big ones. Misbah is a distraction, a decoy that’s keeping WKs back a little safer. What has happened during in 8 days of cricket in Australia was enough for entire PCB to blast - it didn’t, because of Misbah, the shield. He is taking same money like Arthur (though doesn’t deserve equal to even Arthur’s fuel cost).. no one has any problem!!!!! Let him fix the dog house first, sacking Misbah is one days task.

Making Misbah Batting coach was the only mistake so far, because it’s a technical job and guy isn’t qualified, neither experienced. Making one guy CS & Team Director actually was my long term suggestion - that’s power with accountability. Unofficially, top Captains enjoy that in cricket ... unofficially Whatmore had same privilege in SRL & BD, Hatura as well - now, officially Akram & Minhaz dotted reports to Domingo. In soccer, Managers always are selectors as well - in clubs where someone else is in that charge ........ you’ll have to look at ManU to see the consequence. Imagine, some corporate director telling Red Nose whom to buy or sell!!!!! PCTs problem is that the role is given to Misbah, not to someone Moody, Ford, Hessen, Rhodes or Gillespie, or even Arthur!!! Cricket’s future lies in that model - officially, CSAF, BCB has implemented that, partially WICB as well and unofficially BCCI - it’ll become standard practice gradually.

 

[Titan24]

....... the barrel is indeed empty - scratching the bottom will only hurt the finger nail. It won’t happen overnight- naujowan fans need to have patience, keep low profile in PP and be aware of other country posters here; it’s our little PP family, where no one is entitled.

Other than India, barrel is empty in the whole sub continent by the looks of it at the moment. Srl does produce some surprises in tests on occasions while Pak shows few tricks in T20s and ICC tournaments on occasions while BD is still trying to find its feet at this level and Afg is also just getting started at this level.

India has improved big time while Pak and Srl have gone down in the last decade or 2 while BD hasnt developed as fast as expected.

 

[MMHS]

Barrel is certainly not full but neither is it empty.

BOWLING
Haris rauf
Naseem shah
Shaheen shah afridi
Eshan adil
Sameen gul
Shadab khan

In asia
Yasir shah
M. Abbas

BATTING
babar
Shafiq
Imam
Haris sohail(though out of form currently)
Rizwan

All decent players

Names are only promise - a dilution, reality is only Babar will make Indian Test squad, isn't guaranteed to start though, while others will struggle to make the back-up squad.

Decent won’t work - in 12 member Test family, without any player (whom had been picked in last two years), PAK will still remain as 8th to 10th .... put the Emerging Team that travelled BD against AFGs, in a 5 Test Series, it’ll come out 4-1 winners, with AFGs showcasing their talent in one game where they win the toss, Rahmat leads a good first innings total and Rashid has a dream game. It’s about making top 5 - be honest with yourself and ask how may of those will make NZ/SAF/ENG (other two are embarrassingly ahead) squad of 16, you’ll realise the difference between decent & winners. I can also say that, give me Smith, Cummins, Anderson & Bumrah - Bangladesh will blow many teams .... there are several “decent” names available.