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Pakistan's preparation for the 2016-17 tours of New Zealand and Australia - inadequate?

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Junaids

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I know that many of us disagree about the balance of the team and the squad, but we probably all agree that the excellent Test tour of England owes its success to both the fitness camp and especially to arriving in England a month before the First Test.

But they are going to have to do it all over again if they want to win Down Under in November and December.

This is the formal itinerary:

17-21 November: First Test v New Zealand at Christchurch
25-29 November: Second Test v New Zealand at Hamilton (while Australia plays South Africa in a pink ball Test at Adelaide)
Sixteen days in Australia
15-19 December: First (Day/Night) Test v Australia at Brisbane
26-30 December: Second Test v Australia at the MCG
3-7 January 2017: Third Test v Australia at Sydney

There are a number of important factors here.

1. Australia plays a home Pink Ball Day/Night Test while Pakistan are in New Zealand. Where and when do Pakistan propose to get their pink ball experience?

2. Australia will have played 3 home Tests from 3-28 November whereas Pakistan get going a fortnight later.

Question 1: Will Pakistan use that same fortnight from 3-17 November to acclimatize to conditions Down Under?

Question 2: If Pakistan does arrive and prepare from the start of November, should they do it in Australia or New Zealand?

My observations are as follows:

1. It's easier to adapt from high bounce (Australia) to lower bounce (New Zealand) than the reverse.

2. The First Test in New Zealand is at a higher-bouncing venue anyway (Christchurch).

3. Australia have been remarkably uncooperative in recent years with giving touring teams preparation matches either on lively wickets or against decent opposition.

My suggestion is that Pakistan takes 30 players to Australia from 1-12 November and camps on the West Coast. November is exam season at private schools in Australia, and I'd suggest that they contract with a prestigious private school to use their ground and gym facilities for those 12 days.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-07-16/cannane-the-cricket-curse-facing-private-schoolboys/4823314

Pakistan would effectively play against Pakistan A, not a deliberately weakened state team.

They would net for some of the time, but play two formal Pakistan v Pakistan A 3 day Tests before heading off to New Zealand.

They should then fly back from New Zealand to Australia on Wednesday 30 November and have brief practice under lights on the Thursday and Friday, before playing a pair of formal floodlit matches with a pink ball over the weekends of Saturday 3- Monday 5 December and then Thursday 8 - Sunday 11 December.

So my suggestion looks like this:

Tuesday 1 to Saturday 12 November: 30 man camp at a private school in Western Australia, including two 3 day Pakistan v Pakistan A practice "Tests".

Saturday 12 To Wednesday 16 November: practice in Christchurch

17-21 November: First Test v New Zealand at Christchurch

25-29 November: Second Test v New Zealand at Hamilton (while Australia plays South Africa in a pink ball Test at Adelaide)

Wednesday 30 November: fly to Australia

Thursday 1 and Friday 2 December: Practice under lights

Saturday 3 - Monday 5 December: 3 day practice match under lights.

Tuesday 6 and Wednesday 7 December - days off

Thursday 8 - Sunday 11 December - 4 day practice match under lights

15-19 December: First (Day/Night) Test v Australia at Brisbane
26-30 December: Second Test v Australia at the MCG
3-7 January 2017: Third Test v Australia at Sydney

That would be one awfully well-prepared touring team.

And the expense of taking 12 extra Pakistan A players would only extend for 11 days in Australia at the very start of the tour.

And [MENTION=132373]Convict[/MENTION], don't worry about which private school. Mickey Arthur has been coaching at Christ Church Grammar near you in Claremont. I'm sure he could get the facilities for a good price! Indeed the only reason to camp in WA instead of on the East Coast is so that Mickey can use his connections and see his family!
 
The key to success would be using the fortnight before the New Zealand series starts but:

1. Use it IN AUSTRALIA, not New Zealand.
2. Bring your own back-up players for opposition, don't rely on Australian states.


So you could easily pit these two teams against one another in two dress rehearsal practice matches at a Perth school before heading on to New Zealand.

PAKISTAN PROBABLES

1. Sami Aslam
2. Azhar Ali
3. Asad Shafiq
4. Younis Khan
5. Misbah-ul-Haq
6. Sarfraz Ahmed
7. Hasan Ali
8. Mohammad Amir
9. Yasir Shah
10. Wahab Riaz
11. Sohail Khan


PAKISTAN POSSIBLES

1. Salman Butt
2. Jaahid Ali
3. Babar Azam
4. Umar Akmal
5. Saud Shakeel
6. Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
7. Aamer Yamin
8. Mohammad Nawaz
9. Amad Butt
10. Ehsan Adil
11. Mohammad Asif

Interchange reserves to be used equally:
Rahat Ali
Imran Khan
 
Junaids said:
I know that many of us disagree about the balance of the team and the squad, but we probably all agree that the excellent Test tour of England owes its success to both the fitness camp and especially to arriving in England a month before the First Test.

But they are going to have to do it all over again if they want to win Down Under in November and December.

This is the formal itinerary:

17-21 November: First Test v New Zealand at Christchurch
25-29 November: Second Test v New Zealand at Hamilton (while Australia plays South Africa in a pink ball Test at Adelaide)
Sixteen days in Australia
15-19 December: First (Day/Night) Test v Australia at Brisbane
26-30 December: Second Test v Australia at the MCG
3-7 January 2017: Third Test v Australia at Sydney

There are a number of important factors here.

1. Australia plays a home Pink Ball Day/Night Test while Pakistan are in New Zealand. Where and when do Pakistan propose to get their pink ball experience?

2. Australia will have played 3 home Tests from 3-28 November whereas Pakistan get going a fortnight later.

Question 1: Will Pakistan use that same fortnight from 3-17 November to acclimatize to conditions Down Under?

Question 2: If Pakistan does arrive and prepare from the start of November, should they do it in Australia or New Zealand?

My observations are as follows:

1. It's easier to adapt from high bounce (Australia) to lower bounce (New Zealand) than the reverse.

2. The First Test in New Zealand is at a higher-bouncing venue anyway (Christchurch).

3. Australia have been remarkably uncooperative in recent years with giving touring teams preparation matches either on lively wickets or against decent opposition.

My suggestion is that Pakistan takes 30 players to Australia from 1-12 November and camps on the West Coast. November is exam season at private schools in Australia, and I'd suggest that they contract with a prestigious private school to use their ground and gym facilities for those 12 days.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-07-16/cannane-the-cricket-curse-facing-private-schoolboys/4823314

Pakistan would effectively play against Pakistan A, not a deliberately weakened state team.

They would net for some of the time, but play two formal Pakistan v Pakistan A 3 day Tests before heading off to New Zealand.

They should then fly back from New Zealand to Australia on Wednesday 30 November and have brief practice under lights on the Thursday and Friday, before playing a pair of formal floodlit matches with a pink ball over the weekends of Saturday 3- Monday 5 December and then Thursday 8 - Sunday 11 December.

So my suggestion looks like this:

Tuesday 1 to Saturday 12 November: 30 man camp at a private school in Western Australia, including two 3 day Pakistan v Pakistan A practice "Tests".

Saturday 12 To Wednesday 16 November: practice in Christchurch

17-21 November: First Test v New Zealand at Christchurch

25-29 November: Second Test v New Zealand at Hamilton (while Australia plays South Africa in a pink ball Test at Adelaide)

Wednesday 30 November: fly to Australia

Thursday 1 and Friday 2 December: Practice under lights

Saturday 3 - Monday 5 December: 3 day practice match under lights.

Tuesday 6 and Wednesday 7 December - days off

Thursday 8 - Sunday 11 December - 4 day practice match under lights

15-19 December: First (Day/Night) Test v Australia at Brisbane
26-30 December: Second Test v Australia at the MCG
3-7 January 2017: Third Test v Australia at Sydney

That would be one awfully well-prepared touring team.

And the expense of taking 12 extra Pakistan A players would only extend for 11 days in Australia at the very start of the tour.

And [MENTION=132373]Convict[/MENTION], don't worry about which private school. Mickey Arthur has been coaching at Christ Church Grammar near you in Claremont. I'm sure he could get the facilities for a good price! Indeed the only reason to camp in WA instead of on the East Coast is so that Mickey can use his connections and see his family!
Click to expand...

Christchurch?

Their facilities certainly won't prepare you for tests
 
We have a day/night test against WI lined up in October.

That'll be our "practice" on that end of things.
 
Junaids said:
I know that many of us disagree about the balance of the team and the squad, but we probably all agree that the excellent Test tour of England owes its success to both the fitness camp and especially to arriving in England a month before the First Test.

But they are going to have to do it all over again if they want to win Down Under in November and December.

This is the formal itinerary:

17-21 November: First Test v New Zealand at Christchurch
25-29 November: Second Test v New Zealand at Hamilton (while Australia plays South Africa in a pink ball Test at Adelaide)
Sixteen days in Australia
15-19 December: First (Day/Night) Test v Australia at Brisbane
26-30 December: Second Test v Australia at the MCG
3-7 January 2017: Third Test v Australia at Sydney

There are a number of important factors here.

1. Australia plays a home Pink Ball Day/Night Test while Pakistan are in New Zealand. Where and when do Pakistan propose to get their pink ball experience?

2. Australia will have played 3 home Tests from 3-28 November whereas Pakistan get going a fortnight later.

Question 1: Will Pakistan use that same fortnight from 3-17 November to acclimatize to conditions Down Under?

Question 2: If Pakistan does arrive and prepare from the start of November, should they do it in Australia or New Zealand?

My observations are as follows:

1. It's easier to adapt from high bounce (Australia) to lower bounce (New Zealand) than the reverse.

2. The First Test in New Zealand is at a higher-bouncing venue anyway (Christchurch).

3. Australia have been remarkably uncooperative in recent years with giving touring teams preparation matches either on lively wickets or against decent opposition.

My suggestion is that Pakistan takes 30 players to Australia from 1-12 November and camps on the West Coast. November is exam season at private schools in Australia, and I'd suggest that they contract with a prestigious private school to use their ground and gym facilities for those 12 days.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-07-16/cannane-the-cricket-curse-facing-private-schoolboys/4823314

Pakistan would effectively play against Pakistan A, not a deliberately weakened state team.

They would net for some of the time, but play two formal Pakistan v Pakistan A 3 day Tests before heading off to New Zealand.

They should then fly back from New Zealand to Australia on Wednesday 30 November and have brief practice under lights on the Thursday and Friday, before playing a pair of formal floodlit matches with a pink ball over the weekends of Saturday 3- Monday 5 December and then Thursday 8 - Sunday 11 December.

So my suggestion looks like this:

Tuesday 1 to Saturday 12 November: 30 man camp at a private school in Western Australia, including two 3 day Pakistan v Pakistan A practice "Tests".

Saturday 12 To Wednesday 16 November: practice in Christchurch

17-21 November: First Test v New Zealand at Christchurch

25-29 November: Second Test v New Zealand at Hamilton (while Australia plays South Africa in a pink ball Test at Adelaide)

Wednesday 30 November: fly to Australia

Thursday 1 and Friday 2 December: Practice under lights

Saturday 3 - Monday 5 December: 3 day practice match under lights.

Tuesday 6 and Wednesday 7 December - days off

Thursday 8 - Sunday 11 December - 4 day practice match under lights

15-19 December: First (Day/Night) Test v Australia at Brisbane
26-30 December: Second Test v Australia at the MCG
3-7 January 2017: Third Test v Australia at Sydney

That would be one awfully well-prepared touring team.

And the expense of taking 12 extra Pakistan A players would only extend for 11 days in Australia at the very start of the tour.

And [MENTION=132373]Convict[/MENTION], don't worry about which private school. Mickey Arthur has been coaching at Christ Church Grammar near you in Claremont. I'm sure he could get the facilities for a good price! Indeed the only reason to camp in WA instead of on the East Coast is so that Mickey can use his connections and see his family!
Click to expand...

do we play WI before NZ tests?
 
Junaids said:
The key to success would be using the fortnight before the New Zealand series starts but:

1. Use it IN AUSTRALIA, not New Zealand.
2. Bring your own back-up players for opposition, don't rely on Australian states.


So you could easily pit these two teams against one another in two dress rehearsal practice matches at a Perth school before heading on to New Zealand.

PAKISTAN PROBABLES

1. Sami Aslam
2. Azhar Ali
3. Asad Shafiq
4. Younis Khan
5. Misbah-ul-Haq
6. Sarfraz Ahmed
7. Hasan Ali
8. Mohammad Amir
9. Yasir Shah
10. Wahab Riaz
11. Sohail Khan


PAKISTAN POSSIBLES

1. Salman Butt
2. Jaahid Ali
3. Babar Azam
4. Umar Akmal
5. Saud Shakeel
6. Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
7. Aamer Yamin
8. Mohammad Nawaz
9. Amad Butt
10. Ehsan Adil
11. Mohammad Asif

Interchange reserves to be used equally:
Rahat Ali
Imran Khan
Click to expand...

Probable team is much better than possible team :)

But, Sohail Khan has fitness issues. He should be in the squad no doubt, but he should only play in playing XI when there are 5 bowlers. Otherwise should go with Imran Khan.

Batting line up is top one.

Possible batting line up is very raw and bowling also.

With little changes in probable, a very good team can be made.
 
Pakistan will be fine in new zealand, conditions are usually quite similar to england we always traditionally do well in tests in new zealand and we will win the series there. The test series in Australia will be very tough and we will require a 5th bowling option in those conditions.
 
Junaids said:
The key to success would be using the fortnight before the New Zealand series starts but:

1. Use it IN AUSTRALIA, not New Zealand.
2. Bring your own back-up players for opposition, don't rely on Australian states.


So you could easily pit these two teams against one another in two dress rehearsal practice matches at a Perth school before heading on to New Zealand.

PAKISTAN PROBABLES

1. Sami Aslam
2. Azhar Ali
3. Asad Shafiq
4. Younis Khan
5. Misbah-ul-Haq
6. Sarfraz Ahmed
7. Hasan Ali
8. Mohammad Amir
9. Yasir Shah
10. Wahab Riaz
11. Sohail Khan


PAKISTAN POSSIBLES

1. Salman Butt
2. Jaahid Ali
3. Babar Azam
4. Umar Akmal
5. Saud Shakeel
6. Mohammad Rizwan (wk)
7. Aamer Yamin
8. Mohammad Nawaz
9. Amad Butt
10. Ehsan Adil
11. Mohammad Asif

Interchange reserves to be used equally:
Rahat Ali
Imran Khan
Click to expand...

I would actually put the front line bowlers into the Reserve Team so that our batting gets to bat against Amir, Yasir and Wahab rather than Ehsan Adil, Nawaz and Butt. Similarly Amir, Wahab and Yasir would benefit much more by bowling to the likes of Azhar, Younis and Misbah rather than Jaahid, Butt, Saud.
 
shariqnoor said:
I would actually put the front line bowlers into the Reserve Team so that our batting gets to bat against Amir, Yasir and Wahab rather than Ehsan Adil, Nawaz and Butt. Similarly Amir, Wahab and Yasir would benefit much more by bowling to the likes of Azhar, Younis and Misbah rather than Jaahid, Butt, Saud.
Click to expand...
Brilliant idea!

But do you agree?

Take your own high quality opposition. Don't leave it to Cricket Australia - they will put out kids and reserve grade cricketers.

I would take Mohammad Irfan to use as a practice bowler in short, fast spells.

The pace and bounce of Wahab and Irfan will prepare the batsmen as well as possible for facing Starc.

Meanwhile you need Mohammad Asif and Ehsan Adil if only to mimic Josh Hazlewood's height, pace and angle.
 
I agree with your idea overall as it has lots of merit, but I think it's not practical to have 30 players on tour. The costs/logistics are too much to accommodate 30 players even if it is for a fortnight. It's probably not going to happen.

Regarding the players, I also don't think Salman Butt and Mohammad Asif are getting into the A team even anytime soon. With our Test team doing well, I don't see any chance for both of them to come back.
 
Is it going to be day night test between west indies and Pakistan? where I can find the schedule?
 
Surely Mickey Arthur can help in his regard with his time and experience in Australia. An arrangement for a camp.
 
this tour is where Mickey needs to earn his roti..

the cost would be a key issue I think. Its a bit more expensive down under than in the uk i think?

taking a full 30 players brings its own headaces and muslay. you need to look after the 30 players. who will manage all of them?

its a great idea but the only way I can see it happening is if the pakistan A side tours at the same time.
 
Pakistan have played in New Zealand a few times recently for limited overs and conditions aren't too dissimilar to England.

For Australia preparations definitely need to be thorough.

As for the D/N Tests, a number of QEA Trophy matches will be played with a pink ball.
 
Our preparation in my mind for the Australian series needs more to be of a tactical aspect rather than technical. Where our teams have failed in Australia in the past in my mind is in not having a solid game plan. We've taken real talent there, without having any solid ideas about HOW to win test matches over there. If you have a look at teams who've done well there in the past (England, South Africa), they've won not necessarily because they've been more talented, but rather because each member of the squad had a clearly outlined role to perform, and collectively they had a game plan to dismantle the Aussies.

Thats where i think for us the series will be won or lost. All of our bats have just proven that they have the capacity to bat long and amass big totals, and the Aussie decks aren't those of yesteryear (bounce). Absolutely key for us is that when our 15 man squad arrive here down under, each individual knows his game plan, and the role he is expected to play.

Thats where our coaching and management staff come in to play. They need to have this sorted and in check well before we arrive in Australia. Substantial forward planning is required. I would say that even before the NZ series begins, our coaching staff/selection panel should have a decent idea of who their preferred XI is. Obviously this can change from test to test but there should be a general idea of who we want lining up for the first test in Australia, before we kick off in NZ. Finally i think we have the coaching personnel in place that has the capacity to put this all together.

One other important aspect i feel is that we actually have to have the belief that we can win. I think our past tours there, we've not necessarily believed we can win there, hence we've seen some sporadic brilliant individual performances, without actually stringing anything together.
 
Brilliant idea OP and also some other brilliant posts from other posters especially 'shariqnoor'...if PCB can arrange something/anything remotely familiar, it will only help us do better!

Now the question is 'Who will tie the bell around cat's neck' ie.e. who will put this across to Arthur, PCB, Misbah et?
[MENTION=93712]MenInG[/MENTION] [MENTION=138379]#GreenRoars[/MENTION] [MENTION=9]Saj[/MENTION] [MENTION=138980]TalentSpotterPk[/MENTION] @AllPakPassionMembers :-)
 
And one more thing, this will be Mickey Arthur's revenge series to get back and payback some of what he was given when he was kicked out...Go Mickey Go Mickey Go Mickey LOL
 
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION]

The idea is very good. But, I feel PAK/PCB can't prepare the team like this artificial way. I understand the logic (& the venue of WA as well), but financially & logistically, it's really difficult to manage everything.

I think, the preparation should start from WI Series. To start with, PCB can prepare faster & bouncier wickets - it's not possible to simulate WACA in UAE, but the wickets can be made much faster & bouncier than usual. Then the size of boundary - every PAK (Asian) team struggles in AUS in those vast out fields. PCB can utilize the maximum available playing area in 3 UAE venues. There is a D/N Test, so it's partially covered.

The last one could be team composition. In a 450 overs Test, PAK can rout WI with 3 spinners + Aamir with 1 - 7 loaded with batsmen, very good at those wickets. WI's best spinner looks like is Chase; who is Moeen class & Bishu is probably not even Adil; therefore winning 3-0 shouldn't be the target. What PCB should do is play the same combination that they are going to use in ANZ, regardless of wicket/condition. That's 3 pacers + Yasir and an all-rounder OR 2 batsmen that can bowl 40 overs combined. At present, I am not sure about the all-rounder, therefore I'll prefer 4+2 formula.

However, the practice matches that you have mentioned are excellent idea. Before every cricket season, BCCI used to arrange Challenger Cup with 3 teams covering 30 probables (& some of those who are confirmed, resting seniors). I am not sure if it's possible to take the entire unit of 35 people in Australia fora month, but the same can be done in Pakistan on faster & bouncier wickets, using the same balls to be used in ANZ.

In any case, PAK's Test team is quite solid - couple of key fixes, it should dominate Kiwis & compete with AUS. I think, before ENG tour, I focused on 2 elements, which are critical to success - 1. Behind the batsman catching & 2. Opening pair. It still stands same - PAK can't win Test Series in ANZ with MoHa or Iftekhar at 1st slip, just one example - this has to improve LOT. The opening pair issue is better now for sure. This is one reason, I liked Shaan as he could hang around for lots of balls, but that area is better covered with current pair.

Along with catching, 2 other burning issues that need to be improved are use of new ball & stamina of the bowlers. These has nothing to do with preparation in Australia. May be PCB can hire a pro bowling coach to work with pacers regarding the new ball issue.

Having a capable all-rounder is ultimate in cricket, but those are the most difficult gems to extract. I am afraid, playing in NZ/AUS, Yamin or Nawaz is more likely to become Iftekhar V2.0 - that's a wastage spot. Instead of that, I'll do it other way - I'll make sure that Aamir, Wahab, Sohail, Yasir, Rahat, Imran & few other bowlers are worked double in nets so that they can improve their batting contribution. Runs from tail is mostly a function of the top order & application by the tail when there is a set batsman in. England tail didn't last long when PAK bowlers were fresh, neither Aussie tail survived against Lankan spinners once both end was open. But, it's possible that last 4 players can add 5-10 runs to their average by determination & application and of course lots of time in batting nets.

And, I'll make sure that Azhar & Babar/Haris/MoHa (whoever is picked for Iftekhar) is bowling lots of overs in nets. Of all the teams, that play with 6 batsmen, historically none had been such one dimensional like this PAK side - probably 5 of their batsmen doesn't even bowl at nets. This has to change - YK, Misbah are too old now; but Azhar, Asad, Babar, Sami, Haris, Amin .... must be made to work equal amount of time with ball, just as the bowlers with bat. You can't bring a bits & piece all-rounder just to cover that - playing Yamin or Anwar Ali or Iftekhar is the easy way out - that little contribution shouldn't cost one precious Test spot.
 
For NZ they need preparation...for australia they don't need....they will do very good this time in Australia i hope if they play to their potential...
 
Pakistan sending 30 players to Australia because of course we are the richest board in the cricket world. Here is a team who has been ignored for ages - even at this moment there is a series being played between A-teams and no one has even asked Pakistan to be part of it because of the finances involved plus whatever political scenarios that shape cricket.

Let's get real for a second and realize the limitations of being Pakistan for once rather than creating imaginary hypothetical scenarios and what not.
 
GoUgandaCranes said:
Pakistan sending 30 players to Australia because of course we are the richest board in the cricket world. Here is a team who has been ignored for ages - even at this moment there is a series being played between A-teams and no one has even asked Pakistan to be part of it because of the finances involved plus whatever political scenarios that shape cricket.

Let's get real for a second and realize the limitations of being Pakistan for once rather than creating imaginary hypothetical scenarios and what not.
Click to expand...
You had FORTY players in England for the month of July.

I am talking about less than two weeks of a camp in Western Australia with 18 senior and 12 Pakistan A players.

Be clear about this. South Africa tours Australia in the first half of November. Unless you bring your own A team and let Mickey Arthur book your facilities, Cricket Australia will do what they did to NZ last year - send you to play against kids on doctored wickets.

If your A team flies Economy and shares rooms in 3 star hotels, the twelve days would cost around A$3000 each, or US$25,000 in total.

That is peanuts for what it would add to the preparation.

You will need the time in Australia after the NZ leg for Pink Ball preparation. The only red ball acclimatisation possible in Australia is BEFORE you go to NZ.
 
Syed1 said:
Pretty certain we will demolish New Zealand
Click to expand...

Under current circumstance, this is on the cards, however the real test begins when we start the Aussie tour. In many many previous tours, we have just been steamrolled no matter which ever set of players we have taken down under.
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] brings an excellent idea on the table, but financially it is very difficult to pull off such a thing. CA isn't some dumb board to just let this all play it's course and not intervene (in directly I might add) to hamper such a preparatory course. They just saw what happened in England after the month long acclimatization the players did before the tour.

Do we all really think the Aussies, one of the most ruthless teams in home conditions, would make matters so easy for a rejuvenated Pakistan ?? I think not !!
 
ahmedwaqas92 said:
Under current circumstance, this is on the cards, however the real test begins when we start the Aussie tour. In many many previous tours, we have just been steamrolled no matter which ever set of players we have taken down under.
[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] brings an excellent idea on the table, but financially it is very difficult to pull off such a thing. CA isn't some dumb board to just let this all play it's course and not intervene (in directly I might add) to hamper such a preparatory course. They just saw what happened in England after the month long acclimatization the players did before the tour.

Do we all really think the Aussies, one of the most ruthless teams in home conditions, would make matters so easy for a rejuvenated Pakistan ?? I think not !!
Click to expand...
Pakistan's two weeks at Hampshire before the England tour officially started was self-funded and self-organised.

It cost a fair bit of money, but a 2-2 drawn series ensures that much more money will be earned from frequent invitations for long tours of England.

The Australia tour is no different. New Zealand Cricket will offer to host Pakistan for that period 1-12 November. The PCB should ensure that there is two weeks in Australia before going to NZ, so they should only accept the first half of November in NZ if they can arrange the second half of October in Australia.

And here is a real left-field proposal.

Instead of South Africa and Pakistan both playing rubbish practice matches in Australia in late October on horrible wickets against reserve grade Aussies, why don't they play against each other behind closed doors in Australia in the second half of October?
 
Playing at the Gabba is always tough. Sydney and the MCG will be more to our liking. The Aussies are incredible at home. Starc and Hazlewood will be an enormous threat but like the England tour am quietly confident beforehand.
 
Junaids said:
You had FORTY players in England for the month of July.

I am talking about less than two weeks of a camp in Western Australia with 18 senior and 12 Pakistan A players.

Be clear about this. South Africa tours Australia in the first half of November. Unless you bring your own A team and let Mickey Arthur book your facilities, Cricket Australia will do what they did to NZ last year - send you to play against kids on doctored wickets.

If your A team flies Economy and shares rooms in 3 star hotels, the twelve days would cost around A$3000 each, or US$25,000 in total.

That is peanuts for what it would add to the preparation.

You will need the time in Australia after the NZ leg for Pink Ball preparation. The only red ball acclimatisation possible in Australia is BEFORE you go to NZ.
Click to expand...

That's now how it works -- that's not how any of it works.

But for the sake of your experience, sure, valid suggestions Sir.
 
So basically we will go down under with no preparations

Point 1 :

Third test against WI ends on 03 Nov.

First against NZ starts on 17 Nov.

I thought part of our success in England was due to early arrival and mental readiness to adapt to good bowling and different than home pitches.

Point 2 :

another point to note is that we always play on NZ pitches before travelling to Aus ?
Since Australia tour is most important, why does PCB wastes precious time playing on NZ pitches which are quite different to Aus pitches ? (or is this fact not even understood yet? ).
If we just concentrate on Australia tour, just like we did for England we can easily get more practice and side matches right before the start of our first test.

Point 3:

Where is the bowling all-rounder every team needs down under?

We are playing Nawaz against WI which is such a big waste of time since he is certainly not a player to be playing tests on bouncy pitches him being a spinner and less than average batsman.

Hammad Azam, Amad Butt, heck even Yasir Arafat could have been tried against an easy team(no disrespect to them) just so he can get a feel playing under Misbah and all.

Please share your thoughts
 
Misbah-ul-Haq foreshadows Pink Ball disaster today

Misbah has given an interview today which should terrify anybody who understands Pink Ball cricket.

We all know that Cricket Australia has found that only a greentop and grassy outfield can prevent the pink ball from becoming a rolled-up rag on which scores like 600-1 occur.

Yet this is what Misbah said yesterday: "Pink balls survive better on grassy pitches, but we have to make sure we use pitches on which the team survives better. You always go by your choices based on how you perform and what your strengths are. A better team always performs regardless of the conditions, so that is the bottom line."

I find this terrifying, for the following reasons:

1. Pink ball matches are gripping to watch because wickets fall constantly and every run counts double. But Misbah sounds like a fear of being bowled out by the Windies means that Pakistan is going to prepare a bald pitch to kill the ball.

2. Everyone knows that Pink Kookaburra balls don't spin. Even the manufacturers freely say so. But this implies that instead of the standard four quicks on a greentop, Misbah intends to field three spinners and two quicks. For a match with a non-spinning ball.

3. For reasons I cannot begin to understand, Pakistan's only Pink Ball match in Australia before the Gabba Test is an underwater match at Cairns at the height of the Monsoon season. So today's Dubai Test is the only actual Pink Ball rehearsal before the Gabba greentop Test. Yet Misbah is flagging a bald pitch at Dubai and a match in which it's impossible to get out.

I find Misbah's comments staggering. Even if the Windies get themselves out, what about preparation for Brisbane?
 
Clever last line there. Saved yourself a slice of humble pie for now. :yk
 
Bouncy tracks and Aussie aggression will make it very hard for us. We'll do okay against NZ but the Aussies will hammer us.
 
Cricket Australia has really stitched up Pakistan.

The only preparation match for the Pink Ball Test at Brisbane is an underwater match at Cairns, at the height of its Monsoon season.
 
Misbah can say whatever he wants to but it won't matter. Had he been playing in Pakistan, the curators would be obliged to listen to him but the UAE pitches are not in the PCB's control.
 
The pitches in UAE are not prepared keeping in mind strengths of a team. They are prepared how they should be; lasting for 5 days. PCB generally has no say from what I know.

We don't have any sample size to conclude that on a docile track we'll witness 600-1 scores with the pink ball.

I think ball will still move and would be most tricky to face during twilight time with the floodlights starting to take effect.

Also, in the practice game; leg spinners from both sides took 5fers, so your point about spinners getting no turn with the pink ball is quite outlandish and somewhat baseless.
 
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Trust Micky and Misbah to somehow find a way. On a practical note the preparation for this tour has practically been ZERO

:facepalm:

Eman Factor is very important
 
Pitches in UAE are not prepared by Misbah or PCB's commandments. Curators are not on PCB payroll.

Also, spinners have been the strength of Pak bowling attack in UAE in past series. Don't bash him for that.
 
Junaids said:
Misbah has given an interview today which should terrify anybody who understands Pink Ball cricket.

We all know that Cricket Australia has found that only a greentop and grassy outfield can prevent the pink ball from becoming a rolled-up rag on which scores like 600-1 occur.

Yet this is what Misbah said yesterday: "Pink balls survive better on grassy pitches, but we have to make sure we use pitches on which the team survives better. You always go by your choices based on how you perform and what your strengths are. A better team always performs regardless of the conditions, so that is the bottom line."

I find this terrifying, for the following reasons:

1. Pink ball matches are gripping to watch because wickets fall constantly and every run counts double. But Misbah sounds like a fear of being bowled out by the Windies means that Pakistan is going to prepare a bald pitch to kill the ball.

2. Everyone knows that Pink Kookaburra balls don't spin. Even the manufacturers freely say so. But this implies that instead of the standard four quicks on a greentop, Misbah intends to field three spinners and two quicks. For a match with a non-spinning ball.

3. For reasons I cannot begin to understand, Pakistan's only Pink Ball match in Australia before the Gabba Test is an underwater match at Cairns at the height of the Monsoon season. So today's Dubai Test is the only actual Pink Ball rehearsal before the Gabba greentop Test. Yet Misbah is flagging a bald pitch at Dubai and a match in which it's impossible to get out.

I find Misbah's comments staggering. Even if the Windies get themselves out, what about preparation for Brisbane?
Click to expand...
Well, I told you so.

Cricket Australia had sound reasons for concluding that Pink Balls require a greentop.

When people are stupid enough to use it on a normal wicket, it's impossible to take wickets. No spin, no reverse, and the ball becomes a discoloured rag.

The PCB and Misbah appear to be trying to kill Pink Ball cricket at birth.
 
Junaids said:
Well, I told you so.

Cricket Australia had sound reasons for concluding that Pink Balls require a greentop.

When people are stupid enough to use it on a normal wicket, it's impossible to take wickets. No spin, no reverse, and the ball becomes a discoloured rag.

The PCB and Misbah appear to be trying to kill Pink Ball cricket at birth.
Click to expand...

Honestly, if it's a green top in Australia, Australia have to equally worry about their batting. If anything, last time when the pitch was green, they didn't do too well in the first innings.

If it wasn't for the great Kamran Akmal, we would have won that test with 9 wickets and a day to spare.
 
We love our excuses, but it's not about lack of preparation. Our batting is simply rubbish unless the pitch is flat, and we have been exposed here. We got lucky in England because w played on two pitches that suited us.

They can practice on green pitches all year long but they will still fail. When you have an 'ATG' who is a veteran of 100 Tests but still bats like a tailender on a green pitch, what else needs to be said?

We need to accept that we have overestimated the capabilities of this team.
 
Mamoon said:
We love our excuses, but it's not about lack of preparation. Our batting is simply rubbish unless the pitch is flat, and we have been exposed here. We got lucky in England because w played on two pitches that suited us.

They can practice on green pitches all year long but they will still fail. When you have an 'ATG' who is a veteran of 100 Tests but still bats like a tailender on a green pitch, what else needs to be said?

We need to accept that we have overestimated the capabilities of this team.
Click to expand...

Think Harris Sohail would've been a worthy addition had he not been injured this long.
 
By failing to prepare - acclimatise - Pakistan have ensured that Azhar, Sami and Younis are already mentally shot and their techniques are unravelling.

But the only viable replacement in Aussie conditions is Salman Butt, who will be watching on TV.
 
Junaids said:
By failing to prepare - acclimatise - Pakistan have ensured that Azhar, Sami and Younis are already mentally shot and their techniques are unravelling.

But the only viable replacement in Aussie conditions is Salman Butt, who will be watching on TV.
Click to expand...

How about Misbah retiring and Butt coming back as captain for Aus series?
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">England tour - arrived well before 1st Test, training camp, acclimatisation, warm up matches<br>Aus tour - 1 warmup match vs weak team<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash">#Cricket</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@Saj_PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saj_PakPassion/status/809713036600766464">December 16, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
I'd never thought I'd say this but [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] you are 100% CORRECT on this issue. PCB should be whipped and flogged for inadequate preparation of these tours of New Zealand and Australia. There was no need for West Indies series to have dragged on for as long as it did. 2 Tests, 3 ODIs and 1 T20 would've sufficed. We're playing them in FOUR Tests next year anyway !

In England, the preparation was near perfect. We arrived early, gained exposure against the Dukes ball and our coaching staff had plenty of time to work with the players. Yet in New Zealand - the first ball of the tour our batsmen faced was on the first morning of the 1st Test !

Yes modern cricket entails intense scheduling pressures, and yes PCB were unlucky with the weather in NZ. However to have only one game of competitive practice arranged before the 1st Test KNOWING NZ were experiencing a particularly rainy season and NOT have ANY contingency plans is appalling planning.

Then merely days after that shambles we come to Australia where historically we've struggled. If ever there was a series where you MUST give your players time to adapt to the pace and bounce of the wickets. Yet we get one lousy match against a group of teenagers.

Even if you can't organise a match against a local side - arrange an intra-squad match for all I care. Have a cricketing version of a 7-a-side - but AT LEAST organise sufficient practice !

We don't get a chance to tour New Zealand and Australia often so I'm disappointed we've decided not to give ourselves the maximal possible chance of shining so we can return again in the future more often as exposure to these conditions can only be good for our players' development.
 
Slightly better batting performance in this 2nd innings so far. Batsmen starting to show some signs they are acclimatising though obviously still a long way behind.

Whilst some more practice matches wouldn't have guaranteed preventing that 1st innings disaster - more time out in the middle would've been beneficial for the batsmen and could've added an extra 50-100 runs to that total.

I hope people in the media will hold the team management accountable over this.
 
Fully agreed with [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] at the time about the fallacy of scheduling the WI limited overs series before the test matches. It would have been straightforward to finish the test series in the middle of October and sent the test squad (excluding the likes of Sarfraz and Babar) to Australia to acclimatize to conditions and undertake fitness training similar to the preparation we had in England. You arguably have to be fitter to succeed in Australia than England because of the harsher conditions. We may have lost an ODI or T20 to the West Indies that way by not picking the test bowlers such as Amir and Wahab, but we would have been better prepared for these more important assignments. It was amateur scheduling to the highest degree.
 
These batsmen will never encounter conditions as tough as Brisbane under lights against starc and hazelwood. They will lose but even if one or two of them give Oz a bloody nose through a century then it'll be some comfort going into Sydney and mcg.
 
Batsmen looking like they're adapting to conditions.

If we had two or three warmups we would've been able to hit the ground running from the start in this series.

Thank you PCB for this scheduling.
 
Markhor said:
Batsmen looking like they're adapting to conditions.

If we had two or three warmups we would've been able to hit the ground running from the start in this series.

Thank you PCB for this scheduling.
Click to expand...

cant blame PCB

ICC maybe

but this is how it works these days

you need to be prepared and not make excuses
 
Slog said:
cant blame PCB

ICC maybe

but this is how it works these days

you need to be prepared and not make excuses
Click to expand...

The schedule is jam packed nowadays. Teams keep playing international cricket these days. And then there are these pyjama leagues.

Actually what Pakistan did in England was a luxury, that can't be the norm as you can't always land 2-3 weeks earlier. I remember India playing international cricket in the winter followed by the awfully long IPL followed by the WT20 and then landing in England for a 5 test series. They simply fell away after the 3rd test or so. That is why I was praising the PCB for its scheduling then when Shady was arguing with me that pre tour preparations are useless and it's all about the "talent" of the teams.:srini
 
Slog said:
cant blame PCB

ICC maybe

but this is how it works these days

you need to be prepared and not make excuses
Click to expand...
I agree modern cricket entails tough scheduling pressures - so that's why you have to work around it and make compromises.

WI series went on for too long - 2 Tests, 3 ODIs and a T20 would've sufficed. This would've given us more time for these NZ and Australia tours.

One match on a slow, low pitch in Cairns was wholly insufficient. If no Australia A or Shield team was available to play - hell, arrange an intra-squad match. Just get some more practice so we can hit the ground running.

We haven't played any Test cricket in Australia for 6 years. We're not India who have the opportunity of playing in Australia nearly every year be it Tests or ODIs. This makes preparation all the more important for a group of players who rarely get to tour outside Asia anyway.
 
The blame lies with both ICC and PCB - Tours of Australia after 6 years with no warm up matches prior to the series is criminal. Why are PCB touring Australia with a gap of 6 years each time?

PCB has to be strong and bold enough to ask the ICC for more foreign tours rather than spending 6-8 months playing on docile wickets in the UAE every year from the past 8 years, that is how we would not be developing cricketers.
 
Markhor said:
I agree modern cricket entails tough scheduling pressures - so that's why you have to work around it and make compromises.

WI series went on for too long - 2 Tests, 3 ODIs and a T20 would've sufficed. This would've given us more time for these NZ and Australia tours.

One match on a slow, low pitch in Cairns was wholly insufficient. If no Australia A or Shield team was available to play - hell, arrange an intra-squad match. Just get some more practice so we can hit the ground running.

We haven't played any Test cricket in Australia for 6 years. We're not India who have the opportunity of playing in Australia nearly every year be it Tests or ODIs. This makes preparation all the more important for a group of players who rarely get to tour outside Asia anyway.
Click to expand...


Reducing match in a series is not a solution. For the sake of saying, if WI series was 2 Tests, it would have just saved 9-10 days, of which I am sure 3/4 would have gone to players personal time then (& rightly so). After AUS, PAK will go to WI - where the wickets again are different. Then in UAE, followed by SAF - PAK'll struggle to put 2 Test series if number of matches are to be sacrificed to acclimatize. It doesn't work like that.

The best (read only) way is to prepare diversified domestic/home series wickets, so that players are groomed on different surface. In cricket, I see 2 major difference in wickets - 1. bounce & 2. turn

The challenge is to adjust from low bounce to high bounce & from firm wickets to crumbling spin wickets. May be you can add green tops with that, which is synonymous to rank turners & of course batting belter - so basically 4/5 different types of wickets. Which is exactly what the Old Aussie & English Test venues were -

Fast & bouncy track - WACA/Oval
Seemers - Hobart/Leeds
Dry spinner - SCG/Old Traford (unless it rains)
Swing - Gabba/Nottingham
Uneven bounce - MCG/Birmingham
Batting belter - Adelaide/Lord's.

Weather has a big factor in those condition, like it'll always swing everywhere in UK when it's gloomy or moist; while wickets in AUS will crack, if the sun is shining for all through 3/4 days, but more or less each of those wickets had their own unique characters.

More or less, in SAF as well wickets are diversified, but there are not many spin tracks. When WI was at it's glory, you could have replaced their 5 venues with identical characteristics - in tropical Caribbean, it's not possible to make green top seemers, but it was almost identical - it spins at PoSpain, lightning fast at Kensington (Barbados), uneven seemers at Kingston, batting paradise at Bourda (Georgetown) & Antigua been always a bit surprise like MCG/Birmingham - you have 700+ & you have couple matches called of for under prepared surface there. Oblate, I see lots of diversity in Indian wickets at Ranji level (at Test matches, they'll always use their preferred surface as per strategy). Even in SRL & Bangladesh, there are good diversity in domestic wickets - we won't give IND/PAK/SRL the tracks that Poms played; neither ENG/AUS/SAF will get the track PAK played, but wickets in Dhaka, CTG, Rajshahi, Sylhet & Khulna gradually developing their own character.

Compared to that, PAK domestic wickets are 100 years behind & UAE is 50 years - when it comes to preparing home teams for foreign tours. It's no wonder that, PAK is the only team, which historically has performed better away than home, which might not be reflected in W/L always (main reason is the touring side also struggles on the dross that PCB farmers prepare).

Unless players play at least 12-15 meaningful FC matches on diversified surfaces, don't think artificially you can prepare them - this is not 70s or 80s that average 7/8 Tests & 15/18 ODI/Year is your calendar & you can take a month long pleasure trips around a country before playing 1st Test. One can't complain or go against system - only way to survive is to shape own house. Professional soccer players play League match on Saturday night, then fly up to 12 - 16 hours to reach Brazil/Argentina or Southern Africa - then plays 2 WC/Continental Cup qualifiers in 8 days & come back to Europe for again Saturday-Tuesday League & Europe club schedules - that's why they put so much weightage on away performance. Cricket won't be any different going forward - only way to be at top tier is better house keeping.
 
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