Pakistan's Test record under Mickey Arthur's reign is not looking good

[Ellipsism]

Waqar would have won the series for us.

You must be having a field day.

 

[MenInG]

Waqar would have won the series for us.

Guess he would have batted and bowled for us too

 

[Slog]

Waqar would have won the series for us.

we certainly would have been more competitive.

under waqar (or immediately after waqar where his tactics and combinations were still being employed) we were never smashed in a series (asides from maybe england 2010 though going into final test it was 2-1)

 

[Ellipsism]

we certainly would have been more competitive.

under waqar (or immediately after waqar where his tactics and combinations were still being employed) we were never smashed in a series (asides from maybe england 2010 though going into final test it was 2-1)

No coach has interfered with Misbah's killer tactics.

 

[Mamoon]

we certainly would have been more competitive.

under waqar (or immediately after waqar where his tactics and combinations were still being employed) we were never smashed in a series (asides from maybe england 2010 though going into final test it was 2-1)

Please list out the tough overseas tours during the reign of Waqar. Is it an achievement to never get smashed when we didn't tour Australia, England and South Africa even once?

We won in NZ in 2011 but the situation was different. This NZ team is better and more importantly, the pitches were flat and not the Wimbledon courts that we got this time.

 

[Slog]

Please list out the tough overseas tours during the reign of Waqar. Is it an achievement to never get smashed when we didn't tour Australia, England and South Africa even once?

We won in NZ in 2011 but the situation was different. This NZ team is better and more importantly, the pitches were flat and not the Wimbledon courts that we got this time.

NZ tour is a NZ tour. Somehow we didnt win the year before that...

The fact is that under Mickey even in UAE we were poor and that too against the weakest side to tour there. we got regular collapses in that series

 

[Mamoon]

NZ tour is a NZ tour. Somehow we didnt win the year before that...

The fact is that under Mickey even in UAE we were poor and that too against the weakest side to tour there. we got regular collapses in that series

We lost a Test because we were up against a rampant Shane Bond on a lively pitch. What would Waqar have done to negate that?

We were poor vs the WI in the UAE but every coach is allowed a blip. Waqar led us to a humiliating 2-0 thrashing in Sri Lanka in 2014.

 

[Slog]

Care to elaborate

Off the top of my head:

shuffling of batting order. Playing Asad shafiq at #4, then #3, then #6, then #3 and now back to #6. This over the course of 7 or so matched

shifting a solid #3 to open. Again unsettling the top order

Introducing an all rounder (nawaz) then dropping him

playing around with shafiq's batting order

significant reduction in skill levels displayed by our fast bowlers

needlessly comparing shafiq and babar to tendulkar and kohli putting unnecessary pressure

hiring hacks as a bowling coach


One of the good things about the side which ascented to number 1 was that all things considered it was a batting order which wouldnt collapse for fun. You can say we didnt play a lot abroad but since Mickey has come on we have collapsed multiple times even in UAE against the worst side to tour us

 

[Slog]

We lost a Test because we were up against a rampant Shane Bond on a lively pitch. What would Waqar have done to negate that?

We were poor vs the WI in the UAE but every coach is allowed a blip. Waqar led us to a humiliating 2-0 thrashing in Sri Lanka in 2014.

in his first series since return a couple of weeks earlier and taking over a poor side

 

[Mamoon]

in his first series since return a couple of weeks earlier and taking over a poor side

And he turned that poor side into world beaters in a couple of months who blanked Australia and didn't lose a series for more than a year? Wow Waqar is some coach. I wonder why aren't the likes of Australia, SA and England aren't lining up to hire him.

The truth is that Waqar got very lucky with our Test schedule. We didn't tour a single tough overseas team during his second stint and in 2010, he became the coach right after we got hammered in Australia.

You can't draw parallels with him and the coaches who have led the team to tours of Australia, South Africa and England and not play 99% of the time in Asia.

 

[Ellipsism]

Off the top of my head:

shuffling of batting order. Playing Asad shafiq at #4, then #3, then #6, then #3 and now back to #6. This over the course of 7 or so matched

shifting a solid #3 to open. Again unsettling the top order

Introducing an all rounder (nawaz) then dropping him

playing around with shafiq's batting order

significant reduction in skill levels displayed by our fast bowlers

needlessly comparing shafiq and babar to tendulkar and kohli putting unnecessary pressure

hiring hacks as a bowling coach


One of the good things about the side which ascented to number 1 was that all things considered it was a batting order which wouldnt collapse for fun. You can say we didnt play a lot abroad but since Mickey has come on we have collapsed multiple times even in UAE against the worst side to tour us

The bowling coach has transformed Amir and Wahab's actions.

When did Shafiq bat at #4?

We didn't need a spin bowling all rounder in NZ.

Amir and Wahab have improved but Rahat has been utterly useless.

 

[Slog]

And he turned that poor side into world beaters in a couple of months who blanked Australia and didn't lose a series for more than a year? Wow Waqar is some coach. I wonder why aren't the likes of Australia, SA and England aren't lining up to hire him.

The truth is that Waqar got very lucky with our Test schedule. We didn't tour a single tough overseas team during his second stint and in 2010, he became the coach right after we got hammered in Australia.

You can't draw parallels with him and the coaches who have led the team to tours of Australia, South Africa and England and not play 99% of the time in Asia.

you can judge them based on series inUAE atleast and he smashes the records there as well

the fact is that he toured NZ he won there. Same with SL.

Not his fault that he wasnt coaching when we made away tours eventhough with his team we drew in England. (even arthur said the team was waqar's and now he'll make the changes to make it even better. we all saw what happened.)

 

[Boxer]

current coach recently said....very good top 3.....

 

[Slog]

Anyways the thread is about Mickey Arthur

its undeniable that the man is a disaster and the team has regressed under him

 

[Ellipsism]

current coach recently said....very good top 3.....

Top 3 was much better than Pakistan's "world class" middle order.

 

[world cup captain]

He has tried to make this team a world beater and in order to do that, he had to make some changes. The changes he made didn't really work because the players simply do not have either the skill level, game awareness or the work ethic. Just look at Rahat for example, he can swing the ball, but other than that, he has nothing. The truth is, these guys simply aren't good enough to be the "top team". They can hover around 3 or 4 but never really be the undisputed number 1 team.

 

[Sadevdesai]

As they say ... You need Horses for the courses .... and we don't have them. Blaming the Coach or the Captain is just an easy way to dump the mess on them. In the end though each individual player has to carry his fair share of load. Drop catches can't be blamed on either of them .... can you ???

 

[Ankit007]

This is rubbish... mickey has been doing a good job. Yes a test was lost vs WI and series vs NZ but he has dropped TTFs.

And He has been developing young players like azam and sami aslam. This is their first tour in OZ and u dont expect them to hit centuries in their 1st innings. Give him time with this team and he will give pak cricket a great future. But i beleieve younis must be dropped or asked to retire. He may hit a century on this tour as well but this is not future. And misbah too. Give young guys opportunity. May be you will lose 3-0 now but next time they will win you games here.

But i think pak should have been more competetitve in this innings... and its not mickey's fault. He would have trained them well. But it was just lack of application.

 

[Slog]

This is some insanely disappointing stuff

Baffling tactics

About time Mickey Arthur and his crew of overpaid staff members take some responsibility

 

[Dr_Bassim]

This is some insanely disappointing stuff

Baffling tactics

About time Mickey Arthur and his crew of overpaid staff members take some responsibility

How do you blame the coach when 6 batsmen throw away their wickets?

Did Mickey tell Misbah to play two sweep shots, Sami Aslam to defend the ball onto his stumps, Babar Azam to miss a straighter one, Younis Khan to give bat catch practice to short leg and Asad Shafiq to dance down the track and play it into the hands of leg bat pad ?

At the end of the day, Mickey is their to overcome their slight technical deficiencies.

Not hold the bat for them and make decisions.

 

[MMHS]

Some very good points made by most posters & [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] as well.

On top of that, I'll add one critical factor - that is the phasing of the team. This is quite a good Test team, but in the wrong end of their career, therefore by everyday/series most of them are gradually decaying from their best. Test matches are least tactical if bowlers do their job & I always praise Waquar for his bowling strategy/tips. But, what PCB (& Misbah has to take lots of blame here) didn't do was phasing out seniors in that very good & settled unit in their comfort zone. Skills & acclimatization is a factor indeed for performing in alien condition, but that generation gap is the biggest factor to me (ask that wonderful IND generation regarding their last ENG/AUS Tour . PAK already was officially oldest team by some margin - if I make it unofficial, it's cricket before WW2 staff.

Just for a random check - those 14 players playing in NZ - this is their official rounded age

Sami 21, Azhar 32, Babar 22, YK 39, Misbah 43, Asad 31, Rizwan 25, Sarfy 30, Sohail 33, Amir 25, Rahat 28, Imran 30, Yasir 31, Wahab 32 = that's an average of over 30, with mood around 31 & out-layers being 39, 43. If I put the qualifier of Khan's scouting; that average will reach 35, & mood might be even 38 & out-layer at 45; which is a horrible, horrible scenario.

Here PCB is caught off guard a bit - apart from Misbah, previous Chief Selectors have carried a team like there is no tomorrow - now at the wrong time PAK is facing back to back to back tough, foreign tours. That generation gap has created a hollow - there is a bunch of seniors : YK, Misbah, Azhar, Asad, Sarfy, (MoHa) - who has the experience to cope with the challenge, but just don't have the steam left to apply that in to action (or adjust their game - at 36 Azhar can't change his mood operandi or at 35 Sarfy can't learn to score beyond sweep). The other bunch is Babar, Rizwan, Sami, Masood (gradually he is proving that all those insult was a bit OTT), Ahmed, Haris, Umar ... they had the age & skill to cope-up with time, but they just don't have enough experience to survive the critical moments. Take this Series - Babar looked most fluent in 3 innings so far - twice has got out to balls he should have avoided (& could have done easily with few more Tests under his belt) & the shot Rizwan played was beyond explanation.

Coming on to bowling, I simply can't imagine that apart from Amir, PAK's youngest pacer in last 2 years is probably 32 at actual now (Rahat). It's a self created myopia, because half of that squad should have been phased out already, but wasn't as PCB (& Misbah) didn't look beyond next series. Many of those players should have played much earlier - for example, Sohail is 33 now as per books - between 2010 to 2015, this guy was sidelined by Uncle Tanvir, Cheema, Rauf, Sami ...... The ugliest that we have seen is probably Babar (Zulfi) - there is absolutely now excuse for carrying a near 45 years young man to UK, when 3/4 very good & quality young prospects are around.

Nepotism & vested interest has brought PCB to compromised stands - established seniors like Afridi, YK, MoHa, Misbah, Azmal & their lobby has got the better off PCB at the expense of a generation. Today, PCB is changing a major corporate policy, something they introduced to satisfy YK couple of years back - just one example. For the senior players side, I can say that, they also have enough "tools" in terms or media & "records" between 2000 to 2010 period, which can make life of many PCB senior officials uncomfortable - therefore it was a win-win for both party. The loss is a generation of may be Umar, Amin, Usman, Haris, Hammad, Gohar, Shahzaib, Hamza, Pasha, Fawad ..... who knows, may be many more.

It has to be ACB like clean-out of mid 80s (something which should have been done just after WC 2015) & sacrifice couple of years - may be PAK'll play WC 2019 qualifiers, may be go down to 6th in Test ranking, but this policy of requesting Misbah for one more series, or expecting YK to turn it in one last time, investment on MoHa, Ajmal ...... isn't going t work.

I have written many, many "long" posts here - probably some of those now makes a bit sense, that why I thought the best way was to appoint Amir as Captain & Babar deputy & then gradually phase out an aging generation, where, may be only Azhar, Asad & Yasir of current senior lot has a future beyond 2017. This vicious cycle has to be cracked at one point - otherwise every 2 years there is an ICC event or couple of "Tough Tours" - PCB will never be able to reduce that average age below 30 & I am talking about official age here.

Thanks again, if you could bear till the end of this long essay.

No response on this?

 

[Wristy_Shuffler]

Terrible coach imo. I've seen him give interviews saying we focus on discipline, keep things tight and expect wickets to come. That tactic was on full display in this Test but THAT'S NOT HOW YOU PLAY when you have 450 on the board in the first innings and as much as I like Misbah, he was just as complicit, awful pair.

 

[Slog]

How do you blame the coach when 6 batsmen throw away their wickets?

Did Mickey tell Misbah to play two sweep shots, Sami Aslam to defend the ball onto his stumps, Babar Azam to miss a straighter one, Younis Khan to give bat catch practice to short leg and Asad Shafiq to dance down the track and play it into the hands of leg bat pad ?

At the end of the day, Mickey is their to overcome their slight technical deficiencies.

Not hold the bat for them and make decisions.

Even strategy wise we could have done a lot more to make sure it didnt come to this.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Even strategy wise we could have done a lot more to make sure it didnt come to this.

Misbah was horrible in this match both as a captain and as a player.

He needs to call it quits.

To be fair Mickey was never gonna turn things around in away tours.

You need to give Mickey some UAE dustbowls to see if we have receded or it's just status quo.

 

[Slog]

Misbah was horrible in this match both as a captain and as a player.

He needs to call it quits.

To be fair Mickey was never gonna turn things around in away tours.

You need to give Mickey some UAE dustbowls to see if we have receded or it's just status quo.

we struggled to beat WI, the weakest Test side that has toured WI since 2010.

It could easily have been a 2-1 reverse.

and we collapsed every match

no way a year ago we would have let the WI matches go so close

 

[AlphaFighter]

Unfair to blame Mickey Arthur. Pakistan has had a busy last 6-8 months where the team hasn't even had time to regroup in a training camp, off season given that the team was busy in England, then West Indies, then New Zealand and now Australia.

Blame the man who was in charge of the team for 7 long years.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

I think a lost of posters who belittled India's series win in the Caribbean will be in for a shock when PAK tour there.

 

[JaDed]

I think a lost of posters who belittled India's series win in the Caribbean will be in for a shock when PAK tour there.

aIctuallyy think Yk will come good there its his kind of pitches nowadays.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

I agree.

The pitches were faster than they have been in quite some and not as spin friendly . Pakistan won't be able to use their UAE strategy in the Caribbean against Shannon,Alzarri and Miguel.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

aIctuallyy think Yk will come good there its his kind of pitches nowadays.

They were spin friendly for more than a decade but when we toured there earlier this year, those decks had good pace and bounce and didn't really aid Ashwin all that much. I think we might see faster pitches in the Caribbean now.

 

[in_cutter]

Unfair to blame Mickey Arthur. Pakistan has had a busy last 6-8 months where the team hasn't even had time to regroup in a training camp, off season given that the team was busy in England, then West Indies, then New Zealand and now Australia.

Blame the man who was in charge of the team for 7 long years.

The usual hate & bias from you. You are talking as if we won every previous series in Aus. Were you in hiding during all that success under Misbah?

The fact is Pakistan is mentally not up for it in Australia- never have been.

 

[Hawkeye]

Starting to agree with [MENTION=138463]Slog[/MENTION]

Mickey has shown us very poor tactics and poor use of bowlers too.

Asif must be brought back.

 

[in_cutter]

Starting to agree with [MENTION=138463]Slog[/MENTION]

Mickey has shown us very poor tactics and poor use of bowlers too.

Asif must be brought back.

Or just accept that the bowlers were mediocre? We need to look at the bigger picture rather than finding a scapegoat, i.e, why does Pakistan mentally disintegrate in Australia?

 

[Markhor]

Pakistan teams for over 40 years have received one mauling after another in Australia no matter thr coach was.

Did Arthur tell Sohail to keep bowling short and wide pies or Wahab to continually overstep or for Yasir to bowl one hit-me ball after another ? Did he ask for such inadequate pre-tour preparation or for the batsmen to throw their wickets away ?

Microsoft Word master Waqar wouldn't have done any better. The Pep Guardiola of cricket was lucky just like in 2011 that he was able to pad his stats overseeing our UAE wins before resigning and avoiding tough tours like South Africa in 2013 and these tours of England, New Zealand and Australia this year.

But I'm sure he'd have wrote a good report about our failing.

 

[Shafi]

What's the role of Mickey Arthur, Inzamam-ul-Haq, the selectors and Shahriar Khan?

We are loosing left, right and center for long time.Recently got Whitewashed by NZ and and another white wash is on the way by Australia. But there is no initiative taking to stop this downfall. Same captain, same players and same managements are retaining again and again.

Inzamam
A failure as a chief selector and should go back to his old job. What the point of watching domestic crickets? Not giving opportunities to some young players

Micky
A drama queen for camera and does not even have his understanding/power whom to select. A flattering talk about Tendulqar (Shafiq), kohli (Babar) of players like Shafiq (failed in most cases), Babar (Yet to show his class, probably too early to judge) and stick with players like Rahat, Sami (Not a international material)

Selectors
Watching matches but no understanding or power to choose some one

Shahriar Khan

Every now and then come out of nowhere and give statement in or against a player on media.

Really disappointed!!!

 

[FreePalestine]

Mickey Arthur - How has he done so far?

tbh I haven't been that impressed with him so far... I don't think he has a broad enough cricketing intelligence, like Woolmer had, only thinks in terms of aggression and playing modern day cricket.

To be honest, I would rather have someone who has a stronger understanding of what Pakistan cricket is and why it is amazing, rather than trying to make us ape Western obsessions with aggression.

I also think he is over-emotional, insecure and needy. It is not about him. Thank god he has stopped the histrionics, but do you really want that kind of attitude leading players? It can lead to a very unpredictable and unstable dressing room environment. Again, see Woolmer - calm, sure of himself, took the good with the bad with equanimity.

He has also approved some odd tactical decisions in his time. Yes Babar can play at 3 in the UAE, but would it not be better to let him have no. 5 and build his way up. No. 3 is a very pressurized position, maybe you are right and he will succeed eventually (I believe in Babar's talent) but wouldn't it be better to give him a chance at 5 before throwing him in at 3, risking his confidence at a vulnerable age?

Think about the talent, not just the negatives. And don't try to make us England or Australia. We are Pakistan. Yes, strike rate needs to improve, but you have to allow players to play the way they have been taught and are comfortable and build from there. I don't want to see Azhar constantly under pressure to hit big from Arthur, for example. Not that he would listen to him, but that pressure would not be helpful. Or him dropping a promising young player like Sami Aslam because he is 'too defensive'. (It is test cricket)

 

[Slog]

Waste of space

Total embarassment this guy

Worst result sequence ever in our history

And lose two out of last three test matches against this mediocre piece of trash West Indies side

Wrong selection calls.

Pathetic selection of Shadab Khan.

#ThankYouMickeyArthur

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

CT should be the last chance Micky should get........

If he fails to deliver sack him with the horrible team that he's assembled in the last 1 year....Azhar Mehmood as bowling coach ???? Seriously ??

 

[Slog]

CT should be the last chance Micky should get........

If he fails to deliver sack him with the horrible team that he's assembled in the last 1 year....Azhar Mehmood as bowling coach ???? Seriously ??

It's almost a year and that's more than enough time

 

[ask_analyse_act]

MICKEY had a very tough time, no doubt about it... I somehow feel he is being hands tied to select hafeez and cannot drop MISBAH n YOUNIS.. he has a desire to build a young n strong side...

Fortunate for Waqar all the series where at UAE and no series in ENG, AUS and NZ..

Unfortunate for MICKEY 4 away series in ENG, AUS, NZL and WI now...

 

[Mamoon]

Waqar fans doing bhangra. As usual, ignoring the elephant in the room.

 

[Markhor]

Waqar fans doing bhangra. As usual, ignoring the elephant in the room.

These Waqar fans were nowhere to be seen after Jamaica Test. Now they're all over this forum like white on rice.

 

[Slog]

These Waqar fans were nowhere to be seen after Jamaica Test. Now they're all over this forum like white on rice.

Stop having a whinge and being a crybaby.

Everyone was here.

Also stop hiding behind Waqar and talk about Arthur's pathetic record

He has been here for a year. How much longer will you deflect.

 

[Markhor]

Stop having a whinge and being a crybaby.

Everyone was here.

Also stop hiding behind Waqar and talk about Arthur's pathetic record

He has been here for a year. How much longer will you deflect.

We'll see after Dominica Test. I want to see how he reacts to this.

 

[waleed88]

Mickey has not shown the experimental prowess he showed when he first came into Pakistan team, now he has settled for Babar as a no.3, and playing TTFs like Shehzad back into form... first it was about Mickey trying to do something better for Pakistan... now he is just cashing in on his contract and accepted the rules bossed to him by the status quo

No more trying Shafiq at no.3, or any other of his dynamics that he tried when he first came... now its just playing to the gallery

 

[Hawkeye]

Honestly, the blame has to go to Arthur now. [MENTION=138463]Slog[/MENTION] is right.

He has brought back Shehzad, Shan Masood. And is not dealing quickly enough with the likes of Shafiq. Also only playing 4 bowlers.

All of this is upon coach. Failing so far.

 

[dildildalwalla]

Honestly, the blame has to go to Arthur now. [MENTION=138463]Slog[/MENTION] is right.

He has brought back Shehzad, Shan Masood. And is not dealing quickly enough with the likes of Shafiq. Also only playing 4 bowlers.

All of this is upon coach. Failing so far.

Pakistan have played 4 bowlers for a long time now and Shafiq was a key batsman during Pak's unbeaten run.

I will say that Arhur is problematic in the way he deals with personalities. It cost him with Australia and he became an embarassment and time and time again he has done the same with Pakistan, ranting, raving, making stupid tv comments. Those are the reasons he should go.

Pakistan lost this test due to Misbah's consistently negative captaincy a bowling unit unwilling or unable to make their own voice hear, while the batting looked like a bunch of nervous girls on prom night.

 

[zyrus]

I don't know what good PCB saw in him at first place. A good coach doesn't take more than 2 series to show his affect over players. I am unable to spot a single improvement under his tenure.

 

[Slog]

he really needs to sort it out

unless there is some miracle we would have lost EIGHT of our last TEN tests

and 2 out of 4 in UAE

Ridiculous stuff!

And this loss will certainly go to the team management. Mind bogglingly pathetic selection calls

 

[Boi]

#MickeyOut

 

[ask_analyse_act]

Things wrong about this test was

Going in with one regular spinner in yasir is a very bad move.
I have no idea why they select three spinners in the squad and go with yasir only.
Moving Azhar again to no.3 and not giving usman the chance
Asad shafiq again being moved. This guy needs to open his mouth and be adamant like hafeez that he will not change his batting position. If he is moved should be no.5 not 4. This is how he lost his place in ODIs when constantly being shuffled.
He should have played Azhar, Sami/Shaan, Babar, Haris, Asad, Sarfraz, Bilal Asif, Amir, yasir, asghar and Abbas.
If u can't chase a target with 6 batsmen then better play another bowler and reduce the target even further.
This is a match which pak should have won easily. Very poor strategies from MA. And from the beginning as I said Sarfraz is not a deserving option for test captaincy compared to AZHAR. Azhar should have been the captain. Let's see how far this goes.

 

[Markhor]

I'm sorry, I've been a staunch Mickey Arthur supporter but this one's on him and Sarfraz.

I was ticked off from the outset by the team selection. What has Shan Masood done to merit yet another recall ? Why move Azhar Ali from opening spot where he's had a golden run after a year full of TOUGH away tours ?

Why on earth did we play 3 seamers on the flattest and slowest pitch in the world in Abu Dhabi ? It wasn't live grass on the pitch - its cosmetic grass to hold the pitch together. With the blazing sunshine it was always going to turn brown and the pitch was to break up. Sarfraz Ahmed has been with the team since 2014, he should've known better and picked 2 spinners - we had THREE in the frickin' squad.

Arthur however has bought plenty of goodwill with the Champions Trophy and it is a tough transition he must oversee post-Younis/Misbah. I hope team management learns from this.

 

[Syed1]

Can we have different coach for tests?

 

[ask_analyse_act]

I'm sorry, I've been a staunch Mickey Arthur supporter but this one's on him and Sarfraz.

I was ticked off from the outset by the team selection. What has Shan Masood done to merit yet another recall ? Why move Azhar Ali from opening spot where he's had a golden run after a year full of TOUGH away tours ?

Why on earth did we play 3 seamers on the flattest and slowest pitch in the world in Abu Dhabi ? It wasn't live grass on the pitch - its cosmetic grass to hold the pitch together. With the blazing sunshine it was always going to turn brown and the pitch was to break up. Sarfraz Ahmed has been with the team since 2014, he should've known better and picked 2 spinners - we had THREE in the frickin' squad.

Arthur however has bought plenty of goodwill with the Champions Trophy and it is a tough transition he must oversee post-Younis/Misbah. I hope team management learns from this.

Azhars promotion an opener was one of the wisest decision. MA showed why he was a world class coach by that move and continuing to have BABAR as no.3 across all formats. He gave babar no.3 in tough tours but snatched in UAE which was his 2nd TEST in UAE. Playing yasir only in Abu Dhabi is the major reason for this loss I would say.

 

[Hamza_]

Babar should keep batting at #3.

Why push Azhar back at #3 when he is doing so well?

 

[Hasan123]

He and Sarfraz are to blame for making some poor tactical decisions.

Azhar should have remained as an opener.
A 2nd spinner should have been selected.

 

[Lefthanded]

How is Shan Masood’s selection Mickey’s fault? If Inzi is selecting him, how could Mickey block Masood being forced into the team?

Since he's forced, and Sami still has goodwill from how he batted, Sami belongs at the top. And he is young, and seems worth the investment. Who else is there except for Butt? Should a 32 year old like Butt replace a 21 year old?

So to accommodate Masood, Azhar has to drop down to 3. Who is also not a long term opener because of his age.

And Pakistan need to build a batting lineup around him. IF Babar or a future selected batsman step up, he can replace Azhar then.

Mickey's not stupid, but he's working with a sifarish culture here. I can't imagine Mickey has anything against Alam, but he's not chief selector.

for this loss, can he blamed for how the batsmen couldn't chase? Coach can't think or bat for 6 professionals. Maybe two spinners could have made a difference, but we lost because of an embarrassing Batting performance.

Mickey has brought a fitness culture and discipline to the team. He's not working with much though.

 

[Slog]

Has nothing to do with Waqar or Arthur. This team is solid in Asian conditions, doesn't matter who the coach is.
.

Good observation. Team is SOO SOLID. Another one of Mamoon's classic gems

And dont make the false point that Misbah and Younis arent there. The performance last year vs WI was pathetic even with them and we won the series by the skin of our teeth.

Ever since this clown took over, our Test performances have been in a downward spiral

 

[Slog]

Have you visibly seen a different playing style in the UAE under Waqar compared to when Pakistan played under Mickey?

Back then you clearly couldnt see it

Can you see it now?

 

[Slog]

Off the top of my head:

shuffling of batting order. Playing Asad shafiq at #4, then #3, then #6, then #3 and now back to #6. This over the course of 7 or so matched

shifting a solid #3 to open. Again unsettling the top order

Introducing an all rounder (nawaz) then dropping him

playing around with shafiq's batting order

significant reduction in skill levels displayed by our fast bowlers

needlessly comparing shafiq and babar to tendulkar and kohli putting unnecessary pressure

hiring hacks as a bowling coach


One of the good things about the side which ascented to number 1 was that all things considered it was a batting order which wouldnt collapse for fun. You can say we didnt play a lot abroad but since Mickey has come on we have collapsed multiple times even in UAE against the worst side to tour us

Probably can add several more points to the list

Mickey Arthur will forever be remembered for being the first coach to lose in UAE. And he has the worst record in the history of Pakistan coaches in terms of results

 

[Markhor]

Good observation. Team is SOO SOLID. Another one of Mamoon's classic gems

And dont make the false point that Misbah and Younis arent there. The performance last year vs WI was pathetic even with them and we won the series by the skin of our teeth.

Hardly. We comfortable beat West Indies in the first two Tests unless you genuinely thought West Indies were going to chase down 357 on the 5th Day of a Test in Asia...

People were freaking out for no reason.

Sharjah defeat was disappointing but it was a dead rubber.

Shan Masood is Mickey's blue eyed boy because he speaks good English and can hit the weights hard.

Shan Masood also has a father on the governing board of the PCB. This nepotism has existed through Pakistan's history and foreign coaches will never be able to change that culture. BTW did Shan Masood not feature under Waqar ?

 

[Slog]

[/B]
Hardly. We comfortable beat West Indies in the first two Tests unless you genuinely thought West Indies were going to chase down 357 on the 5th Day of a Test in Asia...

People were freaking out for no reason.

Sharjah defeat was disappointing but it was a dead rubber.



Shan Masood also has a father on the governing board of the PCB. This nepotism has existed through Pakistan's history and foreign coaches will never be able to change that culture. BTW did Shan Masood not feature under Waqar ?

The game was in the balance for quite a bit. It was our NARROWEST margin of victory in UAE ever. And regardless it showed a clear decline in level of performance. Way to dismiss the Sharjah defeat.

And going by the performances here if our team was solid we would have not eneded up with a 5-0 whitewash down under. The NZ team was mediocre to the bone and esp the 2nd test we should have never lost. It should have been won.

There has been a clear decline in performance under Mickey Arthur in ALL facets of the Test game and in all conditions over a one year period. He will be the first coach to have a negative win/loss record in UAE which is humiliating and embarrassing for any professional.

Shan Masood featured under Waqar and performed. And when he got found out by Anderson in UAE he was dropped. So dunno why he is being persisted with by Arthur

 

[Markhor]

The game was in the balance for quite a bit. It was our NARROWEST margin of victory in UAE ever. And regardless it showed a clear decline in level of performance. Way to dismiss the Sharjah defeat.

And going by the performances here if our team was solid we would have not eneded up with a 5-0 whitewash down under. The NZ team was mediocre to the bone and esp the 2nd test we should have never lost. It should have been won.

There has been a clear decline in performance under Mickey Arthur in ALL facets of the Test game and in all conditions over a one year period. He will be the first coach to have a negative win/loss record in UAE which is humiliating and embarrassing for any professional.

Shan Masood featured under Waqar and performed. And when he got found out by Anderson in UAE he was dropped. So dunno why he is being persisted with by Arthur

England were six overs from getting a draw in Dubai and minutes away from winning in Abu Dhabi in 2015 but you weren't complaining about a "decline in the Test team" then.

West Indies just chased down 320+ at Headingley in seaming conditions on 5th Day so not sure why you think they're some club side who should've been swatted aside with ease. They have some talented players and UAE conditions weren't dissimilar to Caribbean pitches at home.

BTW does Sarfraz get any of the blame or does he get all the acclaim for the victories while Arthur cops for the losses ?

 

[Slog]

BTW does Sarfraz get any of the blame or does he get all the acclaim for the victories while Arthur cops for the losses ?

Sarfaraz's captaincy has been unimaginative when we are already under the pump.

However his wings are clipped. He is a captain who loves to play with spinners and Arthur's tactics mean we just have one specialist spinner.

Most of the blame goes to Arthur. Its Sarfraz's first ever series as captain. Arthur's been there almost 1.5 years and the trend has been the same

 

[Mamoon]

Good observation. Team is SOO SOLID. Another one of Mamoon's classic gems

And dont make the false point that Misbah and Younis arent there. The performance last year vs WI was pathetic even with them and we won the series by the skin of our teeth.

Ever since this clown took over, our Test performances have been in a downward spiral

Get over Waqar. He would not have prevented the drubbing in Australia and NZ. Pakistan is always a joke in Australia and NZ served pitches that resembled Wimbledon courts.

However, there is no doubt that Arthur has a big role in this shambles of a series. The batting order is not right and not playing two spinners was a huge blunder. Furthermore, the injuries to the pacers have not helped either.

More then Sarfraz and Arthur, blame goes to the PCB for arranging a two Test series in the UAE in September/October. The conditions have been nightmarish for our pacers and there is no home advantage on display.

 

[Slog]

Get over Waqar. He would not have prevented the drubbing in Australia and NZ. Pakistan is always a joke in Australia and NZ served pitches that resembled Wimbledon courts.

However, there is no doubt that Arthur has a big role in this shambles of a series. The batting order is not right and not playing two spinners was a huge blunder. Furthermore, the injuries to the pacers have not helped either.

More then Sarfraz and Arthur, blame goes to the PCB for arranging a two Test series in the UAE in September/October. The conditions have been nightmarish for our pacers and there is no home advantage on display.

I have not even mentioned Waqar lol. Phobia much?

The NZ 2nd test should have been won. Stop manufacturing history.

 

[Mamoon]

I have not even mentioned Waqar lol. Phobia much?

The NZ 2nd test should have been won. Stop manufacturing history.

It was a green pitch. Collapse was inevitable.

You may not have explicitly mentioned Waqar, but everyone can see what you are implicitly attempting to insinuate.

 

[Markhor]

Sarfaraz's captaincy has been unimaginative when we are already under the pump.

However his wings are clipped. He is a captain who loves to play with spinners and Arthur's tactics mean we just have one specialist spinner.

Most of the blame goes to Arthur. Its Sarfraz's first ever series as captain. Arthur's been there almost 1.5 years and the trend has been the same

OK so this is the new line of attack.

A Champions Trophy winning captain, who has been captain for a year with the LOI teams, has no say whatsoever in tactics - its all the fault of dictator Mickey al-Assad.

They both share blame equally. Also nice dodging of my other points.

 

[Lefthanded]

OK so this is the new line of attack.

A Champions Trophy winning captain, who has been captain for a year with the LOI teams, has no say whatsoever in tactics - its all the fault of dictator Mickey al-Assad.

They both share blame equally. Also nice dodging of my other points.

Pretty funny.

I also appreciate your insights.

 

[Syed1]

OK so this is the new line of attack.

A Champions Trophy winning captain, who has been captain for a year with the LOI teams, has no say whatsoever in tactics - its all the fault of dictator Mickey al-Assad.

They both share blame equally. Also nice dodging of my other points.

I don't know about other points, but it is definitely Mickey Al-Assad's decision to go with three pacers. The biggest blunder of this series.


Mickey's entire career is a blunder. Living on the back of fluke CT victory driven more by individual brilliance than team tactics.

 

[Hasan123]

A record that will more than likely only get worse with tours of South Africa and England next year.