[PICTURES/VIDEOS] Babar Azam’s failures against India

[uppercut]

Inshallah Babar will prove his doubters and haters wrong.
BLAH BLAH BLAH
After this World Cup, the IPL franchises will be begging the BCCI to find a way to sign Babar!

You can bookmark this comment for prosperity.

*BUMP*

How is the highlighted part working out for Mr. Babbar Sher ? Is his phone ringing yet ? Please keep us posted on the progress

Meanwhile I am going to spend my Sunday watching the re-run of the 8th WC mauling of Pakistan by the india.

#8-NOTHING
#8-ZIP
#8-SIFAR

 

[Mamoon]

*BUMP*

How is the highlighted part working out for Mr. Babbar Sher ? Is his phone ringing yet ? Please keep us posted on the progress

Meanwhile I am going to spend my Sunday watching the re-run of the 8th WC mauling of Pakistan by the india.

#8-NOTHING
#8-ZIP
#8-SIFAR

Biggest win ever in an ICC tournament final amongst ALL teams is much more significant than all World Cup maulings put together. There are 180 reasons why.

 

[uppercut]

Biggest win ever in an ICC tournament final amongst ALL teams is much more significant than all World Cup maulings put together. There are 180 reasons why.

Iam intrigued ... lets see every one of these 180 reasons

 

[Mesozoic]

Babar will shine like a supernova in this World Cup. Get your sun glasses ready.

Can you please refund my sun glasses?

Those were for nothing.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Biggest win ever in an ICC tournament final amongst ALL teams is much more significant than all World Cup maulings put together. There are 180 reasons why.

Getting bowled out for 132 and getting chased in 20 overs

 

[uppercut]

Here come the excuses.

Tendulkar was an OPENER since 1994.

1 ball, 2 balls, 4 balls, makes no difference to an opener that is unless he survives around 25 overs or more in an ODI, and Powerplays were introduced in the 80s, but why should this matter to a 'MRF Genius' player anyway.

Babar will shine like a supernova in this World Cup. Get your sun glasses ready.

NZ vs IND Cricket Scorecard, 2nd ODI at Auckland, March 27, 1994

Get cricket scorecard of 2nd ODI, NZ vs IND, India tour of New Zealand 1993/94 at Eden Park, Auckland dated March 27, 1994.

www.espncricinfo.com

so thats the very first ODI where Tendulkar opened and scored 82 in 49 balls vs NZ in NZ circa 1994 before there was any T20 cricket. The SR there is 167 . I will dare you this: pretty sure that Bobby never did anything close to that against any of the top 8 Test playing countries.

 

[Mamoon]

Getting bowled out for 132 and getting chased in 20 overs

The only World Cup wins over Pakistan that actually count are the ones where India ended up winning the World Cup because when you don’t win a World Cup, none of the wins have any value in the aftermath of your elimination.

2007, 2011 and 2024 are the only wins over Pakistan that have any meaning. Similarly, had Pakistan nuked India in the CT semifinal by 180 runs but lost the final to some other team, it wouldn’t mean much either.

But I’d take Pakistan’s 180 nuke job over India over any of India’s 3 significant wins over Pakistan in World Cups simply because of the margin of defeat.

India has not returned the favor and probably never will. The odds of Pakistan and India meeting in a final are quite low to begin with and the odds of any team getting dismembered in that fashion is even lower because finals tend to be cagey affairs, but Pakistan clearly did not show any mercy on that day.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

The only World Cup wins over Pakistan that actually count are the ones where India ended up winning the World Cup because when you don’t win a World Cup, none of the wins have any value in the aftermath of your elimination.

2007, 2011 and 2024 are the only wins over Pakistan that have any meaning. Similarly, had Pakistan nuked India in the CT semifinal by 180 runs but lost the final to some other team, it wouldn’t mean much either.

But I’d take Pakistan’s 180 nuke job over India over any of India’s 3 significant wins over Pakistan in World Cups simply because of the margin of defeat.

India has not returned the favor and probably never will. The odds of Pakistan and India meeting in a final are quite low to begin with and the odds of any team getting dismembered in that fashion is even lower because finals tend to be cagey affairs, but Pakistan clearly did not show any mercy on that day.

I agree. You need a great captain like Sarfraz and a great bowler like Aamir to pull it off.

 

[pakistani pride]

Forget India. Babar has been a huge failure for years now, worst part is this should have been his best phase.

 

[mominsaigol]

I agree. You need a great captain like Sarfraz and a great bowler like Aamir to pull it off.

Fakhar, Azhar and hafeez contributed in the batting side

 

[uppercut]

The only World Cup wins over Pakistan that actually count are the ones where India ended up winning the World Cup because when you don’t win a World Cup, none of the wins have any value in the aftermath of your elimination.

Not the ones where you got evicted by your sworn "dushman mulk" in 96,2003,2007,2011, 2022, 2024 lol ?

2007, 2011 and 2024 are the only wins over Pakistan that have any meaning. Similarly, had Pakistan nuked India in the CT semifinal by 180 runs but lost the final to some other team, it wouldn’t mean much either.

And your teams achievements

But I’d take Pakistan’s 180 nuke job over India over any of India’s 3 significant wins over Pakistan in World Cups simply because of the margin of defeat.

India has not returned the favor and probably never will. The odds of Pakistan and India meeting in a final are quite low to begin with and the odds of any team getting dismembered in that fashion is even lower because finals tend to be cagey affairs, but Pakistan clearly did not show any mercy on that day.

should i bump your own posts from the past where you categorized that win as a fluke? lol

 

[BouncerGuy]

Stay on topic guys and no personal remarks please.

 

[Mamoon]

Not the ones where you got evicted by your sworn "dushman mulk" in 96,2003,2007,2011, 2022, 2024 lol ?




And your teams achievements




should i bump your own posts from the past where you categorized that win as a fluke? lol

As I said, if you don’t win a World Cup the matches that you win during the tournament hold absolutely no value. They don’t count for anything.

Whether I, you or anyone calls it a fluke makes no difference. It will not alter the reality of India suffering the most humiliating defeat ever in an ICC tournament. It is a fact backed by numbers - no team has ever lost an ICC tournament final by a bigger margin.

If it’s a fluke, be angry with your gods for allowing this fluke to happen.

 

[Aang_The_last_airbender]

Some people are handing out certificates for what win should be counted and what win should be discounted!
Oh, where do we sign up for such supreme Authority!

 

[pakistani pride]

Some people are handing out certificates for what win should be counted and what win should be discounted!
Oh, where do we sign up for such supreme Authority!

Just see at as a big face turn from Mamoon, I mean he was the biggest heel on PP, always against Pak cricket. Now with all the recent losses, he knows we need all the power to stay alive.

 

[Buffet]

He cannot handle Pakistan-India matches pressure.

5 ODIs, average 31
4 T20Is, average 30

He hasn’t played Tests against them but he is lucky because Ashwin and Jadeja would run rings around him. He is weak against spin.

9 innings, 1 half-century. It is not a coincidence.

It is a bottle-job. He is Pakistan’s best batsman but India have reduced him to mediocrity. All great Pakistani batsman were good against India but he is not following their footsteps.

Also his deluded fans who compare him to Kohli need to realize that he hasn’t been able to have 1% the impact Kohli has had on Pakistan-India matches.

Can Babar Azam improve his record against India over his career or will this fixture remain his Achilles’ Heel?

If he he continues to bottle it, will it impact his status and legacy?

Agree with OP here. Question is still an open ended question.

But it's not just about India. Babar can't score outside of flat roads of Pakistan. He averages mid 30s away with just 1-2 tons in 50-60 innings. That's just mediocre. As far as playing agaisnt India in India goes, it's better for his recrod given his inability to play spin and India having an ATG spin attack.

 

[JaDed]

As I said, if you don’t win a World Cup the matches that you win during the tournament hold absolutely no value. They don’t count for anything.

Whether I, you or anyone calls it a fluke makes no difference. It will not alter the reality of India suffering the most humiliating defeat ever in an ICC tournament. It is a fact backed by numbers - no team has ever lost an ICC tournament final by a bigger margin.

If it’s a fluke, be angry with your gods for allowing this fluke to happen.

What retarded logic? So Pakistan’s no win over India matters coz it didn’t lead to #1 ranking or WC win?

As I said, if you don’t win a World Cup the matches that you win during the tournament hold absolutely no value. They don’t count for anything.

Whether I, you or anyone calls it a fluke makes no difference. It will not alter the reality of India suffering the most humiliating defeat ever in an ICC tournament. It is a fact backed by numbers - no team has ever lost an ICC tournament final by a bigger margin.

If it’s a fluke, be angry with your gods for allowing this fluke to happen.

Since you are baiting everyone, let me put it there for you,Only wc matters no other tournament, and you have no wins which lead to wc tournament.
So basically you have nothing then.

Now go cry in Babar’s honor.

 

[JaDed]

Some people are handing out certificates for what win should be counted and what win should be discounted!
Oh, where do we sign up for such supreme Authority!

Only wins that suits his agenda counts, i can’t even tell if a person is a troll or bipolar anymore lol

 

[DeadlyVenom]

As I said, if you don’t win a World Cup the matches that you win during the tournament hold absolutely no value. They don’t count for anything.

Completely agree.

The subtle rewriting of history to make random World Cup group games the be-all and end-all of cricket has been a complete mischaracterization of the high-intensity cricket played during the peak ODI period.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Soon there will be threadds like

Babar Azam failures against Bangladesh
Babar Azam failures against Afghanistan

 

[Mainul]

Nothing special to mention it as a thread. It is expected.

Indian bowling attack is simply the best in the world for quite sometime now full of variety and class suitable for all kinds of conditions.

Babar Azam simply doesn't match their class. As simple as that. But it doesn't mean that Babar is nowhere and nobody in world cricket .

If you take case of SRT you can also find it. SRT averages only 36 against Pakistan from 1989 to 2002 in ODIs when Pakistani bowling was all class and arguably the best in the world with two W's were playing.In the same period SRT averages more than 45 overall.

I m not comparing Babar with SRT but rather stating the context.

 

[RidiculousMan]

This maybe the first and last fifty of Babar's career against India.

The teams don't play bilateral against each other. Doesn't seem like it's going to change anytime soon as well.

Babar is probably going to face India only in big occasions like World Cup in ODI format. He may play a few or a couple more games depending on his retirement age. The pressure these games have, where Pakistan is almost always on the receiving end with neutral or Indian crowd support. It's highly unlikely for Babar to score a big match winning knock against India.

Maybe Champions Trophy 2025 would be that opportunity with home crowd and good batting pitches backing him.

Guess we'll find out in some years.

Just as I said nearly a year ago.

CT25 opportunity awaits nonetheless. This might be his last good opportunity against India.

 

[Vikram1989]

Soon there will be threadds like

Babar Azam failures against Bangladesh
Babar Azam failures against Afghanistan

Why not usa

 

[Devadwal]

Babar is avarage player who is hype by Pakistan fans . There are 50+ player's in indian cricket better than him

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

As I said, if you don’t win a World Cup the matches that you win during the tournament hold absolutely no value. They don’t count for anything.

Whether I, you or anyone calls it a fluke makes no difference. It will not alter the reality of India suffering the most humiliating defeat ever in an ICC tournament. It is a fact backed by numbers - no team has ever lost an ICC tournament final by a bigger margin.

If it’s a fluke, be angry with your gods for allowing this fluke to happen.

So you are saying none of the world cup matches since 1992 have mattered for Pakistan?

Its your thinking, I do like to watch lot of cricket matches of the past where we didn’t win the tournament but still have great memories.

You have no authority to declare what matters for people, if we go this route SA and Nz players shouldn’t have anything to rejoice for in world cups, which definitely isn’t the case.

 

[mominsaigol]

So you are saying none of the world cup matches since 1992 have mattered for Pakistan?

Its your thinking, I do like to watch lot of cricket matches of the past where we didn’t win the tournament but still have great memories.

You have no authority to declare what matters for people, if we go this route SA and Nz players shouldn’t have anything to rejoice for in world cups, which definitely isn’t the case.

It depends on perspective. For me none of them matter beyond 1992, 2009 and ct 2017. However I do remember 2007 being a gut punch, and 1999 as well. And I remember NZ being done dirty in 2019.

I think finalists are also remembered ASSUMING the finalists did extremely well to get up to that point.

That's my personal opinion though. I respect yours as well.

 

[mominsaigol]

Babar is avarage player who is hype by Pakistan fans . There are 50+ player's in indian cricket better than him

Travis Head > India > Babar

 

[Devadwal]

Travis Head > India > Babar

Real australia fan>>>>>> fake wannabe australia fans.

What has the Travis head to with this thread?

 

[mominsaigol]

Real australia fan>>>>>> fake wannabe australia fans.

What has the Travis head to with this thread?

Everything

 

[uppercut]

As I said, if you don’t win a World Cup the matches that you win during the tournament hold absolutely no value. They don’t count for anything.

Whether I, you or anyone calls it a fluke makes no difference. It will not alter the reality of India suffering the most humiliating defeat ever in an ICC tournament. It is a fact backed by numbers - no team has ever lost an ICC tournament final by a bigger margin.

If it’s a fluke, be angry with your gods for allowing this fluke to happen.

So let me understand the deep logic here .... your team got completely evicted from multiple worldcups by the arch enemy. These evictions do not matter to Pakistani cricket fans anymore? Perhaps aadat si hogayi hai ... show up to WC get humiliated..

 

[Hikaru]

OP ends the thread with a question, "will it impact his legacy?" Babar Azam has no legacy.

 

[RyanRyan10]

So you are saying none of the world cup matches since 1992 have mattered for Pakistan?

Its your thinking, I do like to watch lot of cricket matches of the past where we didn’t win the tournament but still have great memories.

You have no authority to declare what matters for people, if we go this route SA and Nz players shouldn’t have anything to rejoice for in world cups, which definitely isn’t the case.

If he lacks the authority to declare anything, there is no need to seek his validation. If you think he has shared something nonsensical, why engage in argument? Either what he stated is accurate or you are easily offended. Choose a stance.

 

[RyanRyan10]

Not the ones where you got evicted by your sworn "dushman mulk" in 96,2003,2007,2011, 2022, 2024 lol ?




And your teams achievements




should i bump your own posts from the past where you categorized that win as a fluke? lol

And what will you achieve by doing that?

 

[nish_mate]

To clarify I am not talking about DV

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

It depends on perspective. For me none of them matter beyond 1992, 2009 and ct 2017. However I do remember 2007 being a gut punch, and 1999 as well. And I remember NZ being done dirty in 2019.

I think finalists are also remembered ASSUMING the finalists did extremely well to get up to that point.

That's my personal opinion though. I respect yours as well.

But why do the above matter for you, aren’t you an Australian fan ?

Sacchai chip nahi sakti

 

[mominsaigol]

But why do the above matter for you, aren’t you an Australian fan ?

Sacchai chip nahi sakti

Pakistani fan till 2019. Not after. Misbah came I left.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

If he lacks the authority to declare anything, there is no need to seek his validation. If you think he has shared something nonsensical, why engage in argument? Either what he stated is accurate or you are easily offended. Choose a stance.

Replying to someones post is not the same as seeking validation, if it is then you are doing the same thing.

 

[RyanRyan10]

Replying to someones post is not the same as seeking validation, if it is then you are doing the same thing.

Constantly engaging in discussions with individuals who are not going to change their opinions (in this case, opinion isn't even genuine but made with a purpose) is validation seeking. I responded to you only to make you understand what he is doing. Anyways, carry on, mujhe jo karna tha maine kar diya!

 

[Mamoon]

What retarded logic? So Pakistan’s no win over India matters coz it didn’t lead to #1 ranking or WC win?

Since you are baiting everyone, let me put it there for you,Only wc matters no other tournament, and you have no wins which lead to wc tournament.
So basically you have nothing then.

Now go cry in Babar’s honor.

Series wins matter. Matches played within a series have significance because they count towards winning a series.

But matches won in tournaments lost don’t mean anything. They are as significant as winning a dead rubber match in a series that you have already lost.

 

[Mamoon]

OP ends the thread with a question, "will it impact his legacy?" Babar Azam has no legacy.

Legacy is subjective. A player might not have much of a legacy globally but he might mean a lot to his own country and Pakistan has more cricket fans than all cricket nations put together minus India, so Pakistan can shape the narratives of players legacies and don’t need validation from others.

For example, India with the might of its fan base have made a mediocre cricketer like Dhoni a legend and Tendulkar the god of batting even though he was a lesser Test batsman than Brian Lara.

If Babar has a legacy for 230m+ people of Pakistan than he has a legacy. No approval is required from fans whom he does not represent.

 

[Mamoon]

So let me understand the deep logic here .... your team got completely evicted from multiple worldcups by the arch enemy. These evictions do not matter to Pakistani cricket fans anymore? Perhaps aadat si hogayi hai ... show up to WC get humiliated..

Yes they don’t because apart from three occasions (2007, 2011 and 2024) we both ended in the same space - with no trophy in our hands. In the context of a tournament, finishing in the group stage or losing a final means the same.

It is a zero sum game. You either win or you lose. There are no brownie points for finishing higher than the rest.

Finishing higher than the rest only matters in a league format.

Losing to India in those 3 WCs that India eventually won hurt, but I would not trade all three for the biggest humiliation ever in an ICC torment where you lot got smashed by 180 runs.

Nothing can be more satisfying for a Pakistani fan than to nuke India by 180 runs in an ICC final.

 

[Mamoon]

So you are saying none of the world cup matches since 1992 have mattered for Pakistan?

Its your thinking, I do like to watch lot of cricket matches of the past where we didn’t win the tournament but still have great memories.

You have no authority to declare what matters for people, if we go this route SA and Nz players shouldn’t have anything to rejoice for in world cups, which definitely isn’t the case.

Of course, what’s the point of remembering wins in tournaments that you didn’t ultimately win?

Do Indian fans really care for their winning run in 2023 when they ended the World Cup with nothing in their hands just like all teams except Australia?

 

[Mamoon]

Agree with OP here. Question is still an open ended question.

But it's not just about India. Babar can't score outside of flat roads of Pakistan. He averages mid 30s away with just 1-2 tons in 50-60 innings. That's just mediocre. As far as playing agaisnt India in India goes, it's better for his recrod given his inability to play spin and India having an ATG spin attack.

I don’t stand by what I said previously.

Lesser players than Babar have scored runs against them in India. If Pope can score 196, so can Babar.

 

[shaz619]

I don’t stand by what I said previously.

Lesser players than Babar have scored runs against them in India. If Pope can score 196, so can Babar.

You very rarely have authentic opinions, you are only defending him / back tracking now because the majority are pointing out what a rubbish player he is, outside his die hard cult. He is struggling to score more runs then Shan Masood these days, that’s his level at this moment, being compared to that junk.

 

[Buffet]

I don’t stand by what I said previously.

Lesser players than Babar have scored runs against them in India. If Pope can score 196, so can Babar.

Why? Thread was made in Oct 2022, Since then Babar Test Avg : 36 , same downward trend in ODI and in T20.
If that's not enough, he failed in 4 games against India he played after that. 73 runs in 4 knocks.

Babar can score because XYZ scored logic was present earlier also. When all said and done, Babar needs to perform much better if wants to finish among the top 6-8 batsmen from Pakistan.

 

[AMSS]

If 27-32 is the prime peak age of batters then Babar has already wasted 3 years and he's left with 2. On this traditional scale, the bus seems to have left for Babar.

Personally, I was convinced he would go on to be the best ever from Pakistan.

Who knows, he might do a Sanga who prospered in the latter half of his career.

 

[pakistani pride]

You very rarely have authentic opinions, you are only defending him / back tracking now because the majority are pointing out what a rubbish player he is, outside his die hard cult. He is struggling to score more runs then Shan Masood these days, that’s his level at this moment, being compared to that junk.

Bro just enjoy this massive face turn by the heel mamoon. Let him take on the parosees.

 

[nish_mate]

Bro just enjoy this massive face turn by the heel mamoon. Let him take on the parosees.

We have taken on Monsee, Jeera Blade, Namak Halal, all of PP in 2011-2012 to mention a few notables, what is this poster?

 

[uppercut]

Yes they don’t because apart from three occasions (2007, 2011 and 2024) we both ended in the same space - with no trophy in our hands. In the context of a tournament, finishing in the group stage or losing a final means the same.

It is a zero sum game. You either win or you lose. There are no brownie points for finishing higher than the rest.

Finishing higher than the rest only matters in a league format.

Losing to India in those 3 WCs that India eventually won hurt, but I would not trade all three for the biggest humiliation ever in an ICC torment where you lot got smashed by 180 runs.

Nothing can be more satisfying for a Pakistani fan than to nuke India by 180 runs in an ICC final.

Do you even understand what Zero Sum game theory means in the context of India/Pakistan WORLD Cup matches ? I suggest you do not look it up because you wont Even have that flimsy straw that you are desperately trying to latching on to.

And we learn new things such as winning in ICC Champions Trophy is a better achievement than crashing out of multiple world cups and having to Cry and curse the evil dushman mulk responsible for that crash out and worse watch the Dushman mulk go on to eventually lift the trophy. The horror ! Let me assure you you have never experienced that. Talk about virgin territory lol

Claiming bragging rights for winning a second-rate tournament while your team has been humiliated ( i.e. Bagled ... see my signature if you dont get what that term means ) every single time on the world stage is like flexing about winning a street race after getting lapped at Formula-1.

Keep celebrating your small-time wins while the real champions are busy making history. You’re basically bragging about winning the kid’s meal prize while everyone else is enjoying a gourmet feast at a 5-star hotel. Try again when you’re relevant in the big leagues but yeah its important to celebrate the chotti-chotti khushiyan from decades ago.

Speaking of big leagues how is the situation in the little league ? Any wins against the mighty USA, BD or Afghans lately ? lol

 

[Nikhil_cric]

What the high quality List A tournament that is Champions Cup has shown us is that Bobby Azam is still the best #3 in the country . And all the haters cannot muster up a single name who can do better there.

Record against random teams like India don't matter.

 

[JaDed]

Series wins matter. Matches played within a series have significance because they count towards winning a series.

But matches won in tournaments lost don’t mean anything. They are as significant as winning a dead rubber match in a series that you have already lost.

Series win matter zilch only series that matters are worldcups, and in your logic because Pakistan didn’t win 2021, it matters zilch.

India has 2 T20s and 2 ODI that is 100% more wins than PCT.

If champions trophy matter then might as well include Asian cup where we are ahead in tournament wins.

 

[jnaveen1980]

One technical reason is India has bowlers to exploit his weaknesses. Wrist spin is one. Kuldeep owned him twice. He had absolutely no clue. Then anyone who seams the ball back in back of a length, they are in business against him. Either he gets bowled, edges one to slips as his go to off side shot is taken away. In current form he could fail against other teams as well. That Nahid Rana dismissing him with a lifting delivery is an example. On a flat pitch he was hurried and edged one to slip.

 

[Hitman]

We have taken on Monsee, Jeera Blade, Namak Halal, all of PP in 2011-2012 to mention a few notables, what is this poster?

It was fun watching most of them getting kicked out of PP. Poor Monsee last posted before the last WC saying how he wants to see his team of lilliputs put our team out of misery.

 

[rpant_gabba]

We have taken on Monsee, Jeera Blade, Namak Halal, all of PP in 2011-2012 to mention a few notables, what is this poster?

he remade is appearance as r3verse swing and now goes by technics

 

[Vikram1989]

Guy who scored 196 with highest percentage of false shots by a visting batsmen and failed in the series for other 9 innings became an Inspiration/sample. Interesting not bothered to learn the younis khan or Inzi spin prowess but hoping on the luck.Babar azam have less avg in 4th innings in Aus than chaminda vaas, rp sigh, nehra, nuwan zoysa, zaheer khan, bhajji eyc.so definitely pope is the hope than betting something babar will learn to improve his technique.

 

[NishanKonar]

Nothing special to mention it as a thread. It is expected.

Indian bowling attack is simply the best in the world for quite sometime now full of variety and class suitable for all kinds of conditions.

Babar Azam simply doesn't match their class. As simple as that. But it doesn't mean that Babar is nowhere and nobody in world cricket .

If you take case of SRT you can also find it. SRT averages only 36 against Pakistan from 1989 to 2002 in ODIs when Pakistani bowling was all class and arguably the best in the world with two W's were playing.In the same period SRT averages more than 45 overall.

I m not comparing Babar with SRT but rather stating the context.

The fact is Saeed Anwar , Ejaz Ahmed, Inzimam were lucky to feast on pathetic Indian bowling attacks of the 90s

Its Babar Azam's misfortune that he has to play India when they have a world class bowling attack

Saeed Anwar wud not have scored that 194 if he had to face Bumrah, Shami & Kuldeep instead of Kuruvilla, Mohanty, Sunil Joshi

of course its not Saeed Anwar's fault. Just like its not Kohli's fault that he gets to feast on Haris Rauf, Hasan Ali, Wahab Riaz instead of Wasim Akram & Waqar Younis

 

[Mainul]

The fact is Saeed Anwar , Ejaz Ahmed, Inzimam were lucky to feast on pathetic Indian bowling attacks of the 90s

Its Babar Azam's misfortune that he has to play India when they have a world class bowling attack

Saeed Anwar wud not have scored that 194 if he had to face Bumrah, Shami & Kuldeep instead of Kuruvilla, Mohanty, Sunil Joshi

of course its not Saeed Anwar's fault. Just like its not Kohli's fault that he gets to feast on Haris Rauf, Hasan Ali, Wahab Riaz instead of Wasim Akram & Waqar Younis

Yes, that's right.
That's why Gavaskar is an ATG because of his phenomenal record against the then West Indies pace attack on uncovered pitches.

 

[NishanKonar]

Yes, that's right.
That's why Gavaskar is an ATG because of his phenomenal record against the then West Indies pace attack on uncovered pitches.

Exactly. Just like today scoring test hundred against India will be rated very highly. Like scoring a hundred against Australia in the 90s or West Indies in the 80s or South Africa in the early 2010s ( Dale Steyn . More Morkel, Philander)

20 years back whenever India played a test series - it was golden opportunity for opposition batters to improve their batting averages. Even someone like Shoaib Malik made a career bashing our hapless bowlers

Yes Babar has been a failure against India but that's nothing wrong it. Like many great batters struggled against the West Indies - including the great Javed Miandad. Even Inzamam was very poor against Australia

 

[Mainul]

Exactly. Just like today scoring test hundred against India will be rated very highly. Like scoring a hundred against Australia in the 90s or West Indies in the 80s or South Africa in the early 2010s ( Dale Steyn . More Morkel, Philander)

20 years back whenever India played a test series - it was golden opportunity for opposition batters to improve their batting averages. Even someone like Shoaib Malik made a career bashing our hapless bowlers

Yes Babar has been a failure against India but that's nothing wrong it. Like many great batters struggled against the West Indies - including the great Javed Miandad. Even Inzamam was very poor against Australia

Miandad is a great batsman ,to me an ATG even without his average performance against WI. Because he has so many other achievements.

But Babar is a good batsman not more than that.

 

[NishanKonar]

Miandad is a great batsman ,to me an ATG even without his average performance against WI. Because he has so many other achievements.

But Babar is a good batsman not more than that.

Yes. Javed Miandad is obviously in a different league. My point even the best players can struggle against the top dogs of their era

Like David Gower & Ian Botham struggled against West Indies. Kallis was bang average against Australia

 

[Buffet]

Indian bowling attack is simply the best in the world for quite sometime now full of variety and class suitable for all kinds of conditions.

Babar Azam simply doesn't match their class. As simple as that. But it doesn't mean that Babar is nowhere and nobody in world cricket .

+1

Struglling against good bowling unit does not make you a poor player. Most batsmen will not do that well against best bowling sides. Having said that if you can do well then it does elevate you.

 

[Hikaru]

Legacy is subjective. A player might not have much of a legacy globally but he might mean a lot to his own country and Pakistan has more cricket fans than all cricket nations put together minus India, so Pakistan can shape the narratives of players legacies and don’t need validation from others.

For example, India with the might of its fan base have made a mediocre cricketer like Dhoni a legend and Tendulkar the god of batting even though he was a lesser Test batsman than Brian Lara.

If Babar has a legacy for 230m+ people of Pakistan than he has a legacy. No approval is required from fans whom he does not represent.

If legacy were subjective, everyone can be claimed to have a legacy, and in one's own little world, that might be true. Babar, Joginder Sharma, Henry Olonga, all share it within their fanbase.

However for general discussion of a global sport, legacy by default refers to what the player means to the sport, the accomplishments.

So my point was, Babar bottling it here and there isn't gonna hurt his global legacy, there is no such legacy. As for his Pakistani legacy, it will stay no matter what, so there's no need to delve into what-ifs.

 

[jnaveen1980]

+1

Struglling against good bowling unit does not make you a poor player. Most batsmen will not do that well against best bowling sides. Having said that if you can do well then it does elevate you.

Yup. Like Laxman did against Peak 2000 Australia. Only guy to have healthy average home and away against Austrlaia

From 1999-2007

Laxman avges decently against Australia home and away totaling 1409 runs.

Away 55
Home 48

 

[Mainul]

+1

Struglling against good bowling unit does not make you a poor player. Most batsmen will not do that well against best bowling sides. Having said that if you can do well then it does elevate you.

In tests Babar averages 65 in England against England, 47 in New Zealand, 36 in SA. Thats good . He averages poor 25 in Australia, but he still has a good 7-8 years in his career to rectify it in next tours. Who knows what he could in India against India. May have performed well if Pakistan had played.

In ODIs Babar averages 48 against England in England, 60 against south Africa in South Africa, 56 against Australia in Australia. Thats quite good.

So overall Babar performed well in SENA countries and doing average performance only against the best attack in the world doesn't negate his stature as a good batsman.

 

[nish_mate]

he remade is appearance as r3verse swing and now goes by technics

Apparently taken them on enough for them to believe in rebirth and continue posting with new avatars, so I ask again what's this guy in comparsion? A zero game theory fanboy?

 

[Buffet]

In tests Babar averages 65 in England against England, 47 in New Zealand, 36 in SA. Thats good . He averages poor 25 in Australia, but he still has a good 7-8 years in his career to rectify it in next tours. Who knows what he could in India against India. May have performed well if Pakistan had played.

Best 3 bowling units are Aus, Ind and SA. Averages 25-35 in Aus and SA. Has not played in Ind.

Did fine if you look at average in Eng and NZ, but no big scores. Over all his outside Asia, average of 33 reflects his ability. I won't call him doing well because he is half way in his career with only one ton outside of Asia so far and one more ton if you take all away venues. 2 away ton , that's not good. So it's not just performance agaisnt the best bowling side. It's performacne away in test outside of roads of Pakistan.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

I don’t stand by what I said previously.

Lesser players than Babar have scored runs against them in India. If Pope can score 196, so can Babar.

Oh, absolutely! Because clearly, Babar Azam just needs to channel his inner Pope and voilà, 196 runs will magically appear on the scoreboard. It’s not like cricket is a game of skill, mental toughness, and form or anything.

Yep, easy-peasy, lemon squeezy against Bumrah, Kuldeep, Shami, Ash and Jaddu!

 

[Buffet]

Best 3 bowling units are Aus, Ind and SA. Averages 25-35 in Aus and SA. Has not played in Ind.

Did fine if you look at average in Eng and NZ, but no big scores. Over all his outside Asia, average of 33 reflects his ability. I won't call him doing well because he is half way in his career with only one ton outside of Asia so far and one more ton if you take all away venues. 2 away ton , that's not good. So it's not just performance agaisnt the best bowling side. It's performacne away in test outside of roads of Pakistan.

Just to show how much he has to do to be among the top 5-6 batsmen in Pakistan, He needs to get ton counts closer to double digits. No one gets rated for only scoring tons at home specially on flat roads.

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Legacy is subjective. A player might not have much of a legacy globally but he might mean a lot to his own country and Pakistan has more cricket fans than all cricket nations put together minus India, so Pakistan can shape the narratives of players legacies and don’t need validation from others.

For example, India with the might of its fan base have made a mediocre cricketer like Dhoni a legend and Tendulkar the god of batting even though he was a lesser Test batsman than Brian Lara.

If Babar has a legacy for 230m+ people of Pakistan than he has a legacy. No approval is required from fans whom he does not represent.

Oh, absolutely, let's dive into this pool of delusion, shall we?

Firstly, let's talk about the "mediocre" cricketer MS Dhoni. I suppose being the only captain in the history of the game to win all three ICC trophies (World Cup, Champions Trophy, and World T20) is just a minor achievement, right? And his 10,773 runs in ODIs, often finishing games with a calmness that would make a monk proud, is just a walk in the park? Not to mention his lightning-fast stumpings and catches behind the wicket, redefining the role of a wicketkeeper-batsman.

The man who has more stumpings than any other wicketkeeper in ODIs, with a cricketing brain so sharp it's admired all over the cricketing world, is mediocre? Newsflash, for the uninitiated, Dhoni has more brains in his helmet than some people have in their heads.

But sure, let's call him mediocre, why not?

And Sachin Tendulkar, the "lesser" Test batsman than Brian Lara? I must have missed the memo where scoring the most runs in Tests (15,921) and ODIs (18,426), and being the only player to score 100 international centuries is considered "lesser". But hey, who needs facts when you can have opinions, right?

And the cherry on top - "Pakistan can shape the narratives of players legacies and don’t need validation from others". Well, of course, why would you need validation when you can live in your own bubble of denial? But outside of a Bizarro World, legacy isn't just about what you do at home (and what you mean at home), it's about what you do on the global stage. And on that stage, Dhoni and Tendulkar have danced more times than Babar has even been in the audience.

 

[mominsaigol]

What the high quality List A tournament that is Champions Cup has shown us is that Bobby Azam is still the best #3 in the country . And all the haters cannot muster up a single name who can do better there.

Record against random teams like India don't matter.

Kamran ghulam has been performing better at no 3 then Babar lol

 

[uppercut]

Oh, absolutely, let's dive into this pool of delusion, shall we?

Firstly, let's talk about the "mediocre" cricketer MS Dhoni. I suppose being the only captain in the history of the game to win all three ICC trophies (World Cup, Champions Trophy, and World T20) is just a minor achievement, right?

Yup you see ... missing from MSD's trophy cabinet is the Hajmola cup...

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Kamran ghulam has been performing better at no 3 then Babar lol

KG will make it as opener to PAK side ahead of the useless Abdullah . Don't think he should displace Bobby.

 

[mominsaigol]

KG will make it as opener to PAK side ahead of the useless Abdullah . Don't think he should displace Bobby.

You said Babar is the best no 3 and I told you a no 3 who's been performing better then he is in SR and no of centuries scored, but lower avg as Kamran in this tournament has either scored big or been dismissed early while Babar has frequently hit the 40+ mark

 

[BouncerGuy]

There is no doubt that Babar has failed to make a mark against Indie yet but one thing that should be noted is that we are talking about an opposition that we do not play much. Only ICC events.

Bababr still needs to perform to cement his legacy and so far he is lacking in many araes.

 

[AMSS]

Yes, singling out Babar's nondescript record against India makes no sense. It makes sense for someone like Ponting or Warne who otherwise had fabulous record.

Do we talk about Bavuma's average record against India, for example?

 

[bunda_bindaas]

There is no doubt that Babar has failed to make a mark against Indie yet but one thing that should be noted is that we are talking about an opposition that we do not play much. Only ICC events.

Bababr still needs to perform to cement his legacy and so far he is lacking in many araes.

On flat decks, as an Indian cricket fan, I'd be more worried about Saim Ayub and a (washed-up) Fakhar Zaman than Babar.

If the wicket is conducive to spin or it seams and swings....I wouldn't worry about anyone at all!

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Yup you see ... missing from MSD's trophy cabinet is the Hajmola cup...

You forgot the best cup of all -- the "Oye Hoye" cup!

 

[bunda_bindaas]

Isn't it just delightfully ironic that the OP, who initially set out on a noble quest to rein in the overzealous Pakistani fans swooning over Babar Azam, has now performed a stunning 180-degree pirouette?

From attempting to inject a dose of reality into the Babar Azam admiration society, the OP has now taken up the mantle of championing Babar's cricketing prowess, all while throwing shade at Indian cricket fans and legends.

It's like watching someone start a marathon, only to turn around mid-race, join the opposing team, and start handing out energy drinks to help them cross the finish line first. The mental gymnastics on display here are truly Olympic-worthy.

 

[Mamoon]

Oh, absolutely, let's dive into this pool of delusion, shall we?

Firstly, let's talk about the "mediocre" cricketer MS Dhoni. I suppose being the only captain in the history of the game to win all three ICC trophies (World Cup, Champions Trophy, and World T20) is just a minor achievement, right? And his 10,773 runs in ODIs, often finishing games with a calmness that would make a monk proud, is just a walk in the park? Not to mention his lightning-fast stumpings and catches behind the wicket, redefining the role of a wicketkeeper-batsman.

0 centuries outside Asia in any format.
Average of 32 in Test cricket away from home.
Multiple thrashings as a Test team overseas.
Anyone would be able to play the finisher gimmick in ODIs when you have such a stacked top order. Even DK would have done the same. Heck, his finish in the Nidahas trophy in 2018 was better than any finish Dhoni’s pulled off in his entire career.

Most stumpings? Talk about clutching at straws. You’re bound to make a lot stumpings if you’re keeping on Indian wickets.

Dhoni was a bang average cricketer. Pant only took a couple of years to show how much better he is. His innings in Australia alone are bigger than Dhoni’s entire career.

Pant is a better batsman than Dhoni can ever hope to be. Saha is a better keeper than he could ever hope to be.

If that wasn’t enough, his PR team decided to cook up a fake story of him meeting his future girlfriend in a plane before his first century who then died in a car crash. She did not even exist in the first place.

The Dhoni biopic is full of fake characters created to boost his image. His legal team was clever enough to not twist original storylines to prevent legal defamation. Good job on that front though, that was smart.

The man who has more stumpings than any other wicketkeeper in ODIs, with a cricketing brain so sharp it's admired all over the cricketing world, is mediocre? Newsflash, for the uninitiated, Dhoni has more brains in his helmet than some people have in their heads.

But sure, let's call him mediocre, why not?

And Sachin Tendulkar, the "lesser" Test batsman than Brian Lara? I must have missed the memo where scoring the most runs in Tests (15,921) and ODIs (18,426), and being the only player to score 100 international centuries is considered "lesser". But hey, who needs facts when you can have opinions, right?

And the cherry on top - "Pakistan can shape the narratives of players legacies and don’t need validation from others". Well, of course, why would you need validation when you can live in your own bubble of denial? But outside of a Bizarro World, legacy isn't just about what you do at home (and what you mean at home), it's about what you do on the global stage. And on that stage, Dhoni and Tendulkar have danced more times than Babar has even been in the audience.

Mr. god of Test batting has never scored a 250 in his entire Test career that lasted almost as long as the dinosaurs on earth.

He only picked up 5 Man of the Series awards in playing more series than anyone in history.

He never scored more than 500 runs in a Test series.

The definition of a low impact player who drizzled for two decades but never thundered.

One of the most pathetic man of the match to Test series played ratios in history tells us the following:

- Tendulkar was never good enough to prevent India from losing series that they were meant to lose

- Most of the times when India won, there were other Indian players who did better than him.

 

[Mamoon]

Oh, absolutely! Because clearly, Babar Azam just needs to channel his inner Pope and voilà, 196 runs will magically appear on the scoreboard. It’s not like cricket is a game of skill, mental toughness, and form or anything.

Yep, easy-peasy, lemon squeezy against Bumrah, Kuldeep, Shami, Ash and Jaddu!

If Babar can score 196 vs Lyon, Cummins, Starc and Hazlewood to save a Test match, why can’t he score against your bowlers? Have they descended from the heavens?