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PTI holding the parliament as hostage by not agreeing to hold the vote of no-confidence

uberkoen said:
No one jumped ships. No PTI member voted against Imran Khan. Stop believing the lies being spread on these forums.
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Your basic understanding of Pakistani politics is obvious. I'm surprised that even after following the events, you haven't comprehended what happened. Let me explain:

The PTI 'ship jumpers' were sitting in Sindh house with the opposition. They PUBLICLY showed support to the opposition. Due to this, the coalition parties jumped ship as well. Yes they didn't end up voting as the opposition had enough votes after the coalition parties joined them but that doesn't mean these guys weren't traitors to the party that gave them tickets. If they showed solidarity with PTI, the coalition parties wouldn't have jumped ship
 
uberkoen said:
No one jumped ships. No PTI member voted against Imran Khan. Stop believing the lies being spread on these forums.
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Look, I am not saying Imran Khan is a victim.

But suddenly out of the blue, the parties have a no confidence motion and everyone joins forces.

This ain't happening without interference from Army or foreign or both.

My bet is Army.
 
daytrader said:
Your basic understanding of Pakistani politics is obvious. I'm surprised that even after following the events, you haven't comprehended what happened. Let me explain:

The PTI 'ship jumpers' were sitting in Sindh house with the opposition. They PUBLICLY showed support to the opposition. Due to this, the coalition parties jumped ship as well. Yes they didn't end up voting as the opposition had enough votes after the coalition parties joined them but that doesn't mean these guys weren't traitors to the party that gave them tickets. If they showed solidarity with PTI, the coalition parties wouldn't have jumped ship
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I see....Noice.

As usual, its always the half truths that are the most damaging.

Everyone knows a few of PTI members left them.

Technically whether they voted or not is irrelevant.
 
uberkoen said:
No one jumped ships./ No PTI member voted against Imran Khan. Stop believing the lies being spread on these forums.
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So I guess PTI got ousted when it's coalition partners took away their support and joined the opposition. Then why so much Rona dhona ?
 
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liam26 said:
So I guess PTI got ousted when it's coalition partners took away their support and joined the opposition. Then why so much Rona dhona ?
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This is exactly what happened. Rona dhona because it hurt their ego and now all of a sudden the same coalition partners and the same army general that helped PTI get power in the first instance are all chors and munafiq and ghaddar but if they come back and support PTI once again they will be cleansed of their sins
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Look, I am not saying Imran Khan is a victim.

But suddenly out of the blue, the parties have a no confidence motion and everyone joins forces.

This ain't happening without interference from Army or foreign or both.

My bet is Army.
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It's not suddenly out of the blue. This has been going on since September last year.
 
daytrader said:
Your basic understanding of Pakistani politics is obvious. I'm surprised that even after following the events, you haven't comprehended what happened. Let me explain:

The PTI 'ship jumpers' were sitting in Sindh house with the opposition. They PUBLICLY showed support to the opposition. Due to this, the coalition parties jumped ship as well. Yes they didn't end up voting as the opposition had enough votes after the coalition parties joined them but that doesn't mean these guys weren't traitors to the party that gave them tickets. If they showed solidarity with PTI, the coalition parties wouldn't have jumped ship
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The bold part is all all that matters, the rest is conjecture. If horse trading is an issue urge your party to take it to court and settle he matter there until then, hold back on your false accusations and your conspiracy theories.
 
uberkoen said:
The bold part is all all that matters, the rest is conjecture. If horse trading is an issue urge your party to take it to court and settle he matter there until then, hold back on your false accusations and your conspiracy theories.
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Sure that's your opinion. Reference was filed to supreme court but they haven't taken it up because surprise surprise they're biased towards the Shariffs. This happened in broad day light. PTI ship jumpers were sitting in Sindh house and media covered it well.
 
daytrader said:
Sure that's your opinion. Reference was filed to supreme court but they haven't taken it up because surprise surprise they're biased towards the Shariffs. This happened in broad day light. PTI ship jumpers were sitting in Sindh house and media covered it well.
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lol more accusations without any proof.

On what basis as a reference filed in Supreme court? That those people were sitting in Sindh House which is a government building? lol pathetic.

Bhai Ramadan mien tu jhoot bolna band kar do.
 
uberkoen said:
lol more accusations without any proof.

On what basis as a reference filed in Supreme court? That those people were sitting in Sindh House which is a government building? lol pathetic.

Bhai Ramadan mien tu jhoot bolna band kar do.
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See your ignorance is giving you a false sense of being right. I'm not lying to you, this stuff is on record, go do your research.

Sindh house is a provincial government building. NCM was for federal government. See the difference?

In Sindh, PPP is in power and Zardari was orchestrating the whole spiel of bringing in the turncoats. They even thanked him once the NCM was successful.
 
daytrader said:
Sure that's your opinion. Reference was filed to supreme court but they haven't taken it up because surprise surprise they're biased towards the Shariffs. This happened in broad day light. PTI ship jumpers were sitting in Sindh house and media covered it well.
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So biased that they sent Nawaz packing?
 
daytrader said:
See your ignorance is giving you a false sense of being right. I'm not lying to you, this stuff is on record, go do your research.

Sindh house is a provincial government building. NCM was for federal government. See the difference?

In Sindh, PPP is in power and Zardari was orchestrating the whole spiel of bringing in the turncoats. They even thanked him once the NCM was successful.
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What is on record? That some members of the parliament went to Sindh House? Okay, so? What does that mean? It means nothing. Did something illegal take place? No, it did not.

What is court supposed to do? Send them to jail for going to Sindh House? LOL yaar kia baatien karte ho aap
 
uberkoen said:
What is on record? That some members of the parliament went to Sindh House? Okay, so? What does that mean? It means nothing. Did something illegal take place? No, it did not.

What is court supposed to do? Send them to jail for going to Sindh House? LOL yaar kia baatien karte ho aap
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There was a reference filed. I'll upload it for you once I'm on a computer.
 
daytrader said:
There was a reference filed. I'll upload it for you once I'm on a computer.
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A reference filed on what basis hahaha. You keep missing the point. Can you tell me what law was broken. You've proven yourself to be an expert on the Constitution of Pakistan and are able to challenge the verdict given by the supreme court so I'm sure you can tell me what law was broken by these people?
 
Are PTI members going to resign en-masse? There were reports that it will happen today
 
uberkoen said:
A reference filed on what basis hahaha. You keep missing the point. Can you tell me what law was broken. You've proven yourself to be an expert on the Constitution of Pakistan and are able to challenge the verdict given by the supreme court so I'm sure you can tell me what law was broken by these people?
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They can't intervene in parliamentary affairs or rulings of thr speaker. This was clarified as recently as a few weeks ago.
 
Bewal Express said:
They can't intervene in parliamentary affairs or rulings of thr speaker. This was clarified as recently as a few weeks ago.
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Are you one of the 5 Judges of the Supreme Court or do you know the law better then they do? If so, can you provide your law education and experience which qualified you to comment on a unanimous verdict of the Supreme Court? If not, well... you know what to do..
 
uberkoen said:
A reference filed on what basis hahaha. You keep missing the point. Can you tell me what law was broken. You've proven yourself to be an expert on the Constitution of Pakistan and are able to challenge the verdict given by the supreme court so I'm sure you can tell me what law was broken by these people?
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Not on a computer but here is a link to it:

https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/9...etation-of-article-63a-filed-in-supreme-court

It was filed based of Article 63A. Which deals with 'Disqualification on grounds of defection, etc.' Government wanted SC to interpret it, before any law could be broken. Since SC didn't take it up, it encouraged the ship jumpers to openly support the opposition.

Proofs would've been presented in court but since the banana court didn't take it up, the government decided to go with a different strategy. Please refrain from calling someone a liar when you don't know what you're talking about
 
uberkoen said:
Are you one of the 5 Judges of the Supreme Court or do you know the law better then they do? If so, can you provide your law education and experience which qualified you to comment on a unanimous verdict of the Supreme Court? If not, well... you know what to do..
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So judges can't make mistakes or wrong decisions? They can't have a bias? They can't be bought?

Above the judges is the Constitution of Pakistan! It is black and white and has a clear barrier between the courts and parliament under Articles 68 and Article 69
 
daytrader said:
Not on a computer but here is a link to it:

https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/9...etation-of-article-63a-filed-in-supreme-court

It was filed based of Article 63A. Which deals with 'Disqualification on grounds of defection, etc.' Government wanted SC to interpret it, before any law could be broken. Since SC didn't take it up, it encouraged the ship jumpers to openly support the opposition.

Proofs would've been presented in court but since the banana court didn't take it up, the government decided to go with a different strategy. Please refrain from calling someone a liar when you don't know what you're talking about
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Because there was no deflection. Deflection tu tab hoti had they voted against PTI.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Yes. Very essential to take monay and overthrow elected governments (la Karnataka, MP, Goa, etc).

Pakistan has a more complex issue tho.
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Corruption is a different issue. Just because a police may take money and do corruption, should we stop the institution altogether?

The procedure itself has nothing to do with corruption or legalizing it. If it is getting abused, then it's a different issue.
 
daytrader said:
Not on a computer but here is a link to it:

https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/9...etation-of-article-63a-filed-in-supreme-court

It was filed based of Article 63A. Which deals with 'Disqualification on grounds of defection, etc.' Government wanted SC to interpret it, before any law could be broken. Since SC didn't take it up, it encouraged the ship jumpers to openly support the opposition.

Proofs would've been presented in court but since the banana court didn't take it up, the government decided to go with a different strategy. Please refrain from calling someone a liar when you don't know what you're talking about
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There was already a hearing on the NCM. What happened to those proofs then? So the descendent will show proofs when they wishes to and court has to agree with their tantrums?

Why those proofs wasn't shown in the first place when SC specifically asked them?
 
uberkoen said:
Because there was no deflection. Deflection tu tab hoti had they voted against PTI.
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Why wasn't the Presidential ref decided before the vote? Surely it merited a midnight opening rather opening up for an anticipated contempt. Do courts open for murder cases before cases where a murder may happen��
 
uberkoen said:
Because there was no deflection. Deflection tu tab hoti had they voted against PTI.
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The traitors played their part in the downfall of the government. Just by siding with the opposition, they went against party discipline.
 
daytrader said:
So judges can't make mistakes or wrong decisions? They can't have a bias? They can't be bought?

Above the judges is the Constitution of Pakistan! It is black and white and has a clear barrier between the courts and parliament under Articles 68 and Article 69
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Ji ji everyone is making mistakes. Judges are bought. Army is bought. PTI coalition partners are bought. PTI's own party members are bought. Everyone is a ghaddar. Everyone is bought except for Imran Khan. What a brilliant narrative.

Kuch sharam karo.
 
daytrader said:
So judges can't make mistakes or wrong decisions? They can't have a bias? They can't be bought?

Above the judges is the Constitution of Pakistan! It is black and white and has a clear barrier between the courts and parliament under Articles 68 and Article 69
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What constitutes as parliamentary action?

The action of a speaker who is upon judgement of one person or motion for non confidence who is backed by majority of MNAs?

Even if I go by former, the deputy speaker doesn't have jurisdiction in the first place to do so.
 
Itachi said:
There was already a hearing on the NCM. What happened to those proofs then? So the descendent will show proofs when they wishes to and court has to agree with their tantrums?

Why those proofs wasn't shown in the first place when SC specifically asked them?
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When did the SC 'specifically' ask for them? The court made it clear that the only thing they were looking at was the decision of the speaker and not any thing else.
 
daytrader said:
When did the SC 'specifically' ask for them? The court made it clear that the only thing they were looking at was the decision of the speaker and not any thing else.
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Yes. The decision of the deputy speaker was under article 5 which was subjected to proof of foreign interference.
 
uberkoen said:
lol. "Mien in sab ko rulaon ga". I guess he meant his own supporters.
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Ro ro ke toh hakumat mein aaye. Kabhi SC ke samne kabhi boot polish kar ke. Aaj bhi Maryam ro rhi thi ke mere Abu ko London mein na tang karo
 
Itachi said:
Yes. The decision of the deputy speaker was under article 5 which was subjected to proof of foreign interference.
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Yea your ignorance knows no bounds. You're really annoying as we went over this a few times and you continue to turn a blind eye. Please stop quoting me
 
Itachi said:
Yes. The decision of the deputy speaker was under article 5 which was subjected to proof of foreign interference.
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And Kaptaan offered the proof. They were in on the fix. Why didn't the SC stay open day and night to hear such an important reference. The SC are the mafias pimps. 50,000 cases awaiting but that's no a problem, a mafia request needs midnight openings
 
daytrader said:
Ro ro ke toh hakumat mein aaye. Kabhi SC ke samne kabhi boot polish kar ke. Aaj bhi Maryam ro rhi thi ke mere Abu ko London mein na tang karo
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hahaha ulti parri tu maza aya?

Like Amir Liaqat would say "Kaissaa dia?"
 
daytrader said:
Yea your ignorance knows no bounds. You're really annoying as we went over this a few times and you continue to turn a blind eye. Please stop quoting me
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Yes, annoying because he's being logical and asking for proof which doesn't exist. Nahi tang karo yaar PTI walon ke accept all their cases and find everyone guilty just because they say so even though they don't have any proof.
 
daytrader said:
Yea your ignorance knows no bounds. You're really annoying as we went over this a few times and you continue to turn a blind eye. Please stop quoting me
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Was the proof shown on hearing or not?

The statement from attorney general says otherwise.

Do you have any statement to back up your claim?
 
uberkoen said:
Yes, annoying because he's being logical and asking for proof which doesn't exist. Nahi tang karo yaar PTI walon ke accept all their cases and find everyone guilty just because they say so even though they don't have any proof.
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He's asking for proof of what? Go back up and read the posts through this thread. I've gone over all the constitution Articles that the SC violated for taking up the Suo Moto. It's not logical that he keeps repeating the same thing like a broken record
 
Bewal Express said:
And Kaptaan offered the proof. They were in on the fix. Why didn't the SC stay open day and night to hear such an important reference. The SC are the mafias pimps. 50,000 cases awaiting but that's no a problem, a mafia request needs midnight openings
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So since it was IK; SC should have had put a blind eye on literal assassination of the constitution and let whatever childish drama that was going on to continue?
 
Anyone doubting the speakers power shod turn on the TV and watch the current parliament proceedings
 
daytrader said:
He's asking for proof of what? Go back up and read the posts through this thread. I've gone over all the constitution Articles that the SC violated for taking up the Suo Moto. It's not logical that he keeps repeating the same thing like a broken record
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A guy with absolutely zero knowledge of law is now giving a verdict on a 5 judge panel Supreme Court decision. This is the funniest thing I've ever seen.

Bhai apne legal credentials to pesh karo before you question the Supreme Court
 
uberkoen said:
A guy with absolutely zero knowledge of law is now giving a verdict on a 5 judge panel Supreme Court decision. This is the funniest thing I've ever seen.

Bhai apne legal credentials to pesh karo before you question the Supreme Court
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Are judges above the constitution?
 
daytrader said:
I've wasted enough time with a logger head like you
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PP is an open forum where we discuss subjects. Personal attacks is violation of terms and conditions of PP which you agreed to abide by while signing up for the forum.
 
uberkoen said:
I hear him. He's crying. He should do his job and proceed with the election of the new PM
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Well he's sending the letter to SC. His job is to protect the integrity of the house. He cannot be involved in a criminal act knowing that there's a foreign involvement
 
daytrader said:
Well he's sending the letter to SC. His job is to protect the integrity of the house. He cannot be involved in a criminal act knowing that there's a foreign involvement
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Why didn't they send the letter to SC when it first came LOL? Bohat jaldi yaad aagaya. Lagta hai aap logo ka sabun thora slow hai.

Jo karna hai kar lo bhai. Truth has prevailed. Bullies have been removed.
 
daytrader said:
Well he's sending the letter to SC. His job is to protect the integrity of the house. He cannot be involved in a criminal act knowing that there's a foreign involvement
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Protecting the integrity by keeping it hostage in order to keep the power to himself. What a guardian lol.
 
uberkoen said:
The Supreme Court functions as guardian and interpreter of the Constitution
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Guardians that are influenced by external forces to conduct a judicial coup. Parliament is supreme compared to court as Parliament has elected members and judges are appointed. Anyways PTI is filing a review for that decision as well, this battle is not over
 
Itachi said:
Protecting the integrity by keeping it hostage in order to keep the power to himself. What a guardian lol.
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Oh bhai they dissolved assemblies last time and gave up power. PTI is the least worried about keeping power, hence why they even resigned today
 
daytrader said:
Guardians that are influenced by external forces to conduct a judicial coup. Parliament is supreme compared to court as Parliament has elected members and judges are appointed. Anyways PTI is filing a review for that decision as well, this battle is not over
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Parliament is supreme to the supreme court?

Well.... You always learn new things. :facepalm:
 
daytrader said:
Guardians that are influenced by external forces to conduct a judicial coup. Parliament is supreme compared to court as Parliament has elected members and judges are appointed. Anyways PTI is filing a review for that decision as well, this battle is not over
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Do you have proof or are you just going to continue making baseless accusations?
 
There was no assassination or subversion of the constitution.

Imran done everything by the book. Where his interpretation of the constitution was incorrect he accepted the SC decision. Once he had exhausted all democratic means he relinquished power. Yes it wasn't quick, but he did nothing wrong.
 
daytrader said:
Oh bhai they dissolved assemblies last time and gave up power. PTI is the least worried about keeping power, hence why they even resigned today
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They didn't have the authority to dissolve it in the first place.
 
daytrader said:
Oh bhai they dissolved assemblies last time and gave up power. PTI is the least worried about keeping power, hence why they even resigned today
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If they have resigned why is SMQ running his mouth in the parliament?
 
uberkoen said:
Why didn't they send the letter to SC when it first came LOL? Bohat jaldi yaad aagaya. Lagta hai aap logo ka sabun thora slow hai.

Jo karna hai kar lo bhai. Truth has prevailed. Bullies have been removed.
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It was discussed in NSC and the government offered the opposition to come look at it too. They offered to SC to look at it but the banana court refused to touch it citing that 'we don't want to be involved in foreign policy'

Don't you find it weird that the PM of a country waived this letter in front of a million people and on National TV, but the judges refuse to look at it. If the threat wasn't real, they would've eagerly taken it up to prove IK wrong and put Article 6 on him
 
daytrader said:
It was discussed in NSC and the government offered the opposition to come look at it too. They offered to SC to look at it but the banana court refused to touch it citing that 'we don't want to be involved in foreign policy'

Don't you find it weird that the PM of a country waived this letter in front of a million people and on National TV, but the judges refuse to look at it. If the threat wasn't real, they would've eagerly taken it up to prove IK wrong and put Article 6 on him
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LOL. If judges refused to look at it then why did the speaker say he's submitting it to the Supreme Court today? Either it wasn't submitted in the past or the speaker is lying now. Which one is it?
 
daytrader said:
It was discussed in NSC and the government offered the opposition to come look at it too. They offered to SC to look at it but the banana court refused to touch it citing that 'we don't want to be involved in foreign policy'

Don't you find it weird that the PM of a country waived this letter in front of a million people and on National TV, but the judges refuse to look at it. If the threat wasn't real, they would've eagerly taken it up to prove IK wrong and put Article 6 on him
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Why did the public prosecutor of the govt failed to raise this in COURT when hearing was going on? Wasn't it his duty?
 
uberkoen said:
LOL. If judges refused to look at it then why did the speaker say he's submitting it to the Supreme Court today? Either it wasn't submitted in the past or the speaker is lying now. Which one is it?
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PTI wants to show the threat is real, judges don't want to touch it because it would expose alot of elements in the country that are working against Pakistan. They simply don't have guts to take up something like that. Aise kaamon ke liye zameer aur himmat chahiye. Bekaris lack both
 
Extra_Cover said:
Yes, its happening.
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Interesting. So this creates a dilemma for the Election Commission. Would they hold by-elections for 100+ seats? Presumably this takes a few months.

So till then the PDM effectively has one party rule. I dont think IK wants them to have absolute power. Also the MNAs might not be so enthusiastic about resigning their cushy jobs more than a year ahead of schedule
 
daytrader said:
PTI wants to show the threat is real, judges don't want to touch it because it would expose alot of elements in the country that are working against Pakistan. They simply don't have guts to take up something like that. Aise kaamon ke liye zameer aur himmat chahiye. Bekaris lack both
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Ajeeb baat hai. Aap ka speaker bol raha hai ke aaj mien ye present karon ka judges ko which means till now it had not been presented and you're here coming up with your own conspiracy theories.
 
uberkoen said:
Ajeeb baat hai. Aap ka speaker bol raha hai ke aaj mien ye present karon ka judges ko which means till now it had not been presented and you're here coming up with your own conspiracy theories.
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I wonder whether the speaker himself saw the letter when he enforced article 5.
 
Itachi said:
I wonder whether the speaker himself saw the letter when he enforced article 5.
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No he did not. He clearly said on the 9th of April that the letter was just handed to him. He had not seen the letter before late night on the 9th of April.

He enforced article 5 without any proof whatsoever
 
uberkoen said:
Ajeeb baat hai. Aap ka speaker bol raha hai ke aaj mien ye present karon ka judges ko which means till now it had not been presented and you're here coming up with your own conspiracy theories.
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They tried presenting it in the NCM case but again the SC refused to look at it
 
daytrader said:
They tried presenting it in the NCM case but again the SC refused to look at it
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No they didn't. More lies. It was on April 6th that they agreed to declassify the letter to key people including the supreme court. This was after the verdict was already delivered.

either provide sources and proof of whatever you're saying or keep your mouth shut and stop spreading lies.
 
daytrader said:
They tried presenting it in the NCM case but again the SC refused to look at it
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Statement of attorney general says otherwise. Do you have any concrete proof/statement that shows in the supreme court, the defendent tried to show it but judges refused to see?
 
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