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PTI's Tsunami March on 14th August [Mega Thread]

blinding light said:
I have no clue? I've been studying this phenomenon for over two years now! I've participated in elections first-hand as a kaarkun in elections, you shouldn't question my knowledge when you can't counter my claims.

What is your cold hard evidence for this? Has the democratic process NOT WORKED in Turkey? Are you even aware of the problems faced by budding countries and how democracy let them hold on despite of major crises?!

The only one exhibiting slave mentality here are the Insafians who can't take criticism, label others as Nooras to gain some sort of moral standing on an issue and worst of all, have suspended the use of ALL their mental faculties to base their ENTIRE REALITY on political rhetoric vomitted up by IK !

Your leader is running your own party like a dictatorship - what is to say he won't be NS part II in terms of 'badshahat' when he does come to power?!

This thing is not even about electoral reforms anymore, it's about ousting the government of the day!

Educate yourself, shift your focus and change your level of analysis. Prioritise Pakistan over a political party and see the chasms in your own arguments!
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This is about Pakistan. And as for IK, he tried for 15 months for electoral reforms but nothing worked. Please don't shove your "knowledge" on us illiterate people. I don't need to be studying this "phenomenon" to know corrupt when I see corrupt.

Stop giving examples of other countries. A simple history lesson will tell you we are not Turkey. Turkey has always been much much socially advanced then us. For the democratic process to work, you would think you would actually need a "democratic" process. Not a monarchy.
 
Is blinded blight the long term fanboy blind follower of shoaib malik really telling people how and what to think ?

[facepalm]
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
it is just a way to create drama...red zone red zone red zone...never heard of it before today....such bull crap
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exactly! And I totally agree about your post about regarding the system. This is a horse trading system where the biggest bidder wins the electorate who in return would do anything possible (not probable but possible) to win the seat. And for those who say that the system would evolve itself over the time, how? Education system has improved? No! courts have improved, no? Standard of living has improved? No! Ont he top of that Sharif family has developed a whole kingdom ship.Shari's sons, daughter, in-laws, close friends all are ready to take over once these both brothers decide to take a step back. NS has deployed 84 very close family and friends on top positions. It's ridiculous!

Where in the world you would see that a government wouldn't even budge after shooting 85 Innocent people including women. South Korean Prime Minister resigned over a ferry's disaster which he had nothing to do with and here we are... despite courts decision of blaming Shahzaz Sharif and NS for modeltown gate saga.. nothing has happened!
 
As someone said, the constituation is for the people. The country is not for the constitution. A constitution that lets a crook stay in power and lets him come back again and again, then thank you but it needs to be shoved.

But hey you have the right to be an idealist and keep comparing yourself to US and Turkey.
 
People and Army in red zone this is sensitive, I hope& pray there are no mischievous elements in massive crowd.
 
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Anfield said:
exactly! And I totally agree about your post about regarding the system. This is a horse trading system where the biggest bidder wins the electorate who in return would do anything possible (not probable but possible) to win the seat. And for those who say that the system would evolve itself over the time, how? Education system has improved? No! courts have improved, no? Standard of living has improved? No! Ont he top of that Sharif family has developed a whole kingdom ship.Shari's sons, daughter, in-laws, close friends all are ready to take over once these both brothers decide to take a step back. NS has deployed 84 very close family and friends on top positions. It's ridiculous!

Where in the world you would see that a government wouldn't even budge after shooting 85 Innocent people including women. South Korean Prime Minister resigned over a ferry's disaster which he had nothing to do with and here we are... despite courts decision of blaming Shahzaz Sharif and NS for modeltown gate saga.. nothing has happened!
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dont ask me, ask blinding light.

In a country a flyover is more important and gets you reelected but you lose no votes for killing your own people. Yes it will evolve. One day. More like devolve.
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
This is about Pakistan. And as for IK, he tried for 15 months for electoral reforms but nothing worked. Please don't shove your "knowledge" on us illiterate people. I don't need to be studying this "phenomenon" to know corrupt when I see corrupt.

Stop giving examples of other countries. A simple history lesson will tell you we are not Turkey. Turkey has always been much much socially advanced then us. For the democratic process to work, you would think you would actually need a "democratic" process. Not a monarchy.
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Right. You just want to storm the Parliament and shut off the dams in the name of change, right?!

s28 said:
Is blinded blight the long term fanboy blind follower of shoaib malik really telling people how and what to think ?

[facepalm]
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Facepalm YOUR line of thought, punk. Shows your own mentality.
 
Heck in which world a law minister who's caught red-handed taking the bribe in a video is still active?
 
blinding light said:
Right. You just want to storm the Parliament and shut off the dams in the name of change, right?!



Facepalm YOUR line of thought, punk. Shows your own mentality.
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They are not storming the parliament, please stop the propaganda aka Fox news / IDF style. They are just protesting where it matters the most.

The government is the one that handled this in the worst way. They were asked to open 4 seats. Why didn't they open? Do you have an answer for that? Then after 15 months when the protest was announced 2 months in advance, what did they do in the meantime to stop it diplomatically? Then when it was going to start they shut down entire cities and made life hell for people when they could have just let it happen and let people protest such is their right. Why did they go coocoo?
 
Anfield said:
Heck in which world a law minister who's caught red-handed taking the bribe in a video is still active?
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Apparently in democracy it takes time to evolve and once we evolve, this person will be taken care of. Till then he will continue to do as he wishes and now with more authority as even getting caught red-handed makes no difference to his mighty status.
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
Apparently in democracy it takes time to evolve and once we evolve, this person will be taken care of. Till then he will continue to do as he wishes and now with more authority as even getting caught red-handed makes no difference to his mighty status.
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silence peon, you don't know what the badshah salaamat has decided. have you given your bayat yet?
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
They are not storming the parliament, please stop the propaganda aka Fox news / IDF style. They are just protesting where it matters the most.

The government is the one that handled this in the worst way. They were asked to open 4 seats. Why didn't they open? Do you have an answer for that? Then after 15 months when the protest was announced 2 months in advance, what did they do in the meantime to stop it diplomatically? Then when it was going to start they shut down entire cities and made life hell for people when they could have just let it happen and let people protest such is their right. Why did they go coocoo?
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dude you're banging your head against the wall. When IK does anything.. we have to look it under the light of western democracy but when PLMN does something.. it's an evolving process! What a load of Baloney! No point arguing with Hypocrites!
 
Anfield said:
dude you're banging your head against the wall. When IK does anything.. we have to look it under the light of western democracy but when PLMN does something.. it's an evolving process! What a load of Baloney! No point arguing with Hypocrites!
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well I have a new name for Nawaz's style of governance. Gullubuttocracy!! emphasis on the word Butt!! lol
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
As someone said, the constituation is for the people. The country is not for the constitution. A constitution that lets a crook stay in power and lets him come back again and again, then thank you but it needs to be shoved.

But hey you have the right to be an idealist and keep comparing yourself to US and Turkey.
Click to expand...

The constitution is NOT the one allowing crooks to stay in power The constant interruptions by military dictators and saviors like Khan are. They would have been thrown out byu the people long ago if you had not stopped democracy for even 20 years. I know you will ignore this again and spout the same sentence again and again
 
if this was an arab country the govt would be in serious convulsions!! AJE and CNN would be going crazy!! massive crowds here!!
 
Indiafan said:
The constitution is NOT the one allowing crooks to stay in power The constant interruptions by military dictators and saviors like Khan are. They would have been thrown out byu the people long ago if you had not stopped democracy for even 20 years. I know you will ignore this again and spout the same sentence again and again
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oyeee paroseeee red zone india ka nahin hayyyy!!! niklu yahan say!!lol..
 
another point: Nawaz sharif has once again failed to establish stability, has shown political incompetence, and is now throwing his people into the face of automatic weapons. For this alone he should resign. thanks for your tajarba!
 
this all red-zone is BS anyway.. In US you can go right in front of the congress building.. heck you can even go up the stairs!
 
Indiafan said:
The constitution is NOT the one allowing crooks to stay in power The constant interruptions by military dictators and saviors like Khan are. They would have been thrown out byu the people long ago if you had not stopped democracy for even 20 years. I know you will ignore this again and spout the same sentence again and again
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I would have argued with you but from your posts i have concluded you know nada about about our history and country.
 
Imran Khan is all smiles. Looks like a man in control. and clearly he is enjoying the hold he has on the crowd...and the crowd is loving him back.
 
What ever happens, you have to give it to IK hes got every opposition politicians knickers in a twist and an entire nation glued to the unfolding scenes.
 
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legendary days either way!! we will all remember this and those who are participating will never forget.
 
Insafians say Sethi is not objective but love that corrupt journalist Lucman who is making speeches in the rally itself. Isn't that paradoxal?

UsmanhailsAfridi said:
They are not storming the parliament, please stop the propaganda aka Fox news / IDF style. They are just protesting where it matters the most.

The government is the one that handled this in the worst way. They were asked to open 4 seats. Why didn't they open? Do you have an answer for that? Then after 15 months when the protest was announced 2 months in advance, what did they do in the meantime to stop it diplomatically? Then when it was going to start they shut down entire cities and made life hell for people when they could have just let it happen and let people protest such is their right. Why did they go coocoo?
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Because the votes can't be verified and IK knew this before participating in the elections. He should have taken action before the elections, not one year after.
 
Indiafan said:
The constitution is NOT the one allowing crooks to stay in power The constant interruptions by military dictators and saviors like Khan are. They would have been thrown out byu the people long ago if you had not stopped democracy for even 20 years. I know you will ignore this again and spout the same sentence again and again
Click to expand...

You have no idea about Pakistan. Democracy is not about just voting once in 5 years and back to your private lives. Democracy is about the will of people being supreme. Just look at the crowd that has turned up. It is an ocean of pakistanis out on streets. No opposition. No pro Nawaz marches. If Nawaz is forced to resign that will be a victory for democracy, and you should be happy, being pro democracy yourself.
 
endymion248 said:
Insafians say Sethi is not objective but love that corrupt journalist Lucman who is making speeches in the rally itself. Isn't that paradoxal?



Because the votes can't be verified and IK knew this before participating in the elections. He should have taken action before the elections, not one year after.
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he didn't know that they were all involved in this scheme...he didn't know that fake ballots were going to be added...come on now. Everything is easy to say in hindsight
 
a sea of people. Truly amazing scenes!! people asking for freedom. Isnt this what people wanted? suruk pay nikloa? well they have now!!
 
CricketCartoons said:
You have no idea about Pakistan. Democracy is not about just voting once in 5 years and back to your private lives. Democracy is about the will of people being supreme. Just look at the crowd that has turned up. It is an ocean of pakistanis out on streets. No opposition. No pro Nawaz marches. If Nawaz is forced to resign that will be a victory for democracy, and you should be happy, being pro democracy yourself.
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thanks for your understanding! indeed I couldn't have said it better myself!
 
CricketCartoons said:
You have no idea about Pakistan. Democracy is not about just voting once in 5 years and back to your private lives. Democracy is about the will of people being supreme. Just look at the crowd that has turned up. It is an ocean of pakistanis out on streets. No opposition. No pro Nawaz marches. If Nawaz is forced to resign that will be a victory for democracy, and you should be happy, being pro democracy yourself.
Click to expand...

Any politician in the world can gather a mob of lakh or two. Equal number were there for congress rallies. Did congress win the elections? A couple lakh imposing writ on 10+ million people just by power of mob rule? Surey a 1000 times more people voted for this government!

Anyways, lets leave this debate and see what follows in actuality.

Despite promises Imran doesn't seem to be anywhere near the front of the March into red zone
 
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CricketCartoons said:
You have no idea about Pakistan. Democracy is not about just voting once in 5 years and back to your private lives. Democracy is about the will of people being supreme. Just look at the crowd that has turned up. It is an ocean of pakistanis out on streets. No opposition. No pro Nawaz marches. If Nawaz is forced to resign that will be a victory for democracy, and you should be happy, being pro democracy yourself.
Click to expand...
+1.
 
Indiafan said:
Any politician in the world can gather a mob of lakh or two. Equal number were there for congress rallies. Did congress win the elections? A couple lakh imposing writ on 10+ million people just by power of mob rule? Surey a 1000 times more people voted for this government!

Anyways, lets leave this debate and see what follows in actuality.

Despite promises Imran doesn't seem to be anywhere near the front of the March into red zone
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Comparing indian polulation with pakistan is a sin itself :))
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
he didn't know that they were all involved in this scheme...he didn't know that fake ballots were going to be added...come on now. Everything is easy to say in hindsight
Click to expand...

Thats not what I am talking about. My point is about Ch Nissar's 50-60k non verifiable votes which IK knew about beforehand. There can't be a recount because of that and IK knows full well.
 
endymion248 said:
Thats not what I am talking about. My point is about Ch Nissar's 50-60k non verifiable votes which IK knew about beforehand. There can't be a recount because of that and IK knows full well.
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beforehand the election?

The fact the Mr. Nisar could admit that is amazing...who is in jail for so many votes on each seat being unverifiable?
 
endymion248 said:
Just tell us this: should 100 000 people decide for 180 000 000?
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and why should only 40 million voters should decide for 180 million total population? further to that why just over 1/4th of 40 million decide for a governing party? Why punjab alone is a deciding factor for a gov in pakistan?

Your argument makes any given survey in history invalid. I hope you see the drift...

The participants in any protest are merely an overall representation of society and can be decisive if there is no opposing protest or march. If at all rest of the population thinks these protesters are wrong then they should come out and help their gov from falling. SIMPLE!
 
zimmz said:
and why should only 40 million voters should decide for 180 million total population? further to that why just over 1/4th of 40 million decide for a governing party? Why punjab alone is a deciding factor for a gov in pakistan?
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Should have thought about that when your leader was saying that PTI Tsunami would sweep the 2013 elections.

Your argument makes any given survey in history invalid. I hope you see the drift...
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No survey is perfectly representative. There is a difference in legitimacy between 40 millions and less than a 100k.

The participants in any protest are merely an overall representation of society and can be decisive if there is no opposing protest or march. If at all rest of the population thinks these protesters are wrong then they should come out and help their gov from falling. SIMPLE!
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Is that the system IK advocates for?
 
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Saeed said:
Since when did I even mentioned any number? The are out there in Islamabad because of the rigging and it doesn't matter, how big or small.
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Actually it matters, a lot! If the rigging was small, that does mean that the majority of people who voted wanted this government. So what rights do PTI supporters, a minority, have to push the government out?
 
The storming up comment was not my creation ala IDF/Fox news Style. It was Imran's own words.

Only time will tell how this all unfolds.

I have to go for now. Have a final exam to write.

Although I do not agree with this circus, I just hope whatever the result is, it favours PAKISTAN, forever and always!
 
Indiafan said:
Actually it matters, a lot! If the rigging was small, that does mean that the majority of people who voted wanted this government. So what rights do PTI supporters, a minority, have to push the government out?
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It techinically began with 14 constituencies, but the dhitai of both IK and NS esp the latter resulted in this scenario, thanks to well propagated rhetoric.
 
Indiafan said:
Actually it matters, a lot! If the rigging was small, that does mean that the majority of people who voted wanted this government. So what rights do PTI supporters, a minority, have to push the government out?
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Well lets decide if it was on a small scale or larger then we will move on to the next question that what should be done to the government? You also seem to be missing the other half part, it's not only PTI supporters.
 
Indiafan said:
Till now police have offered no resistance. So far, so good
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yes so far so good

111 brigade of punjab army is also in red zone, a unit that is famous for carrying out coups on civilian governments.

looks like ganja days are numbered. military might do a coup.
 
According to news reports, Dr Qadri's crowd of supporters is much larger than that gathered by Imran
 
endymion248 said:
Should have thought about that when your leader was saying that PTI Tsunami would sweep the 2013 elections.
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?????

So you accept your argument was wrong!

endymion248 said:
No survey is perfectly representative. There is a difference in legitimacy between 40 millions and less than a 100k.
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If survey can represent 40 millions then why not protests?

By your argument the march for restoring CJ was also not representative of whole nation. Yet CJ was restored!
Similarly any protests around the world are not representative enough be it protests again WoT or for any other reason.

endymion248 said:
Is that the system IK advocates for?
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Which system?
 
Saeed said:
Are you intentionally trying to confuse people to get them to support your king or it's natural?
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Are you angry at me or at your own words? At least you resemble Imran Khan in this aspect of talking first and thinking later.

Like I said before, I couldn't care less about NS. My grand-uncle was a PTI candidate for provincial assembly so, if I was partisan and traditionalist, I would have to support IK.
 
zimmz said:
?????

So you accept your argument was wrong!



If survey can represent 40 millions then why not protests?
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By survey, I meant suffrages, where 40 millions represent 40 millions.

You are questioning whether 40 millions can represent 180. I'm saying that it's not perfect but it's still more representative than 100k.

As far as poll surveys are concerned, the samples are randomized and supposed to be representative. A survey of 100k is taken seriously because it has the same people who are going to vote. When 100k go to Islamabad, they are not random and they don't represent the people who are going to vote in any sense of it.


Which system?
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The one where we measure how much crowd each side can oppose in the streets.
 
Unbelievable crowd! This is..... one of my most memorable moments! I have followed the coverage of this whole episode over the past days with such intensity that I feel like being there.

Irrespective of what happens ahead, and I have really been praying for Pakistan a lot, congratulations to Tahir-ul-Qadri and Imran Khan for now for gathering such a huge, huge crowd!.

I will never ever forget what I have witnessed over the past two hours or so!
 
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DHONI183 said:
Unbelievable crowd! This is..... one of my most memorable moments! I have followed the coverage of this whole episode with such intensity that I feel like being there.

Irrespective of what happens ahead, and I have really been praying for Pakistan a lot, congratulations to Tahir-ul-Qadri and Imran Khan for now for gathering such a huge, huge crowd!.

I will never ever forget what I have witnessed over the past two hours or so!
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I think amazing is that people of out nation are waking up. I dont know what this whole episode will result it but at-least we can see our nation is tiered of these thugs.

I know Imran is very delusional guy but this is no joke seriously.
 
Indiafan said:
According to news reports, Dr Qadri's crowd of supporters is much larger than that gathered by Imran
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It's very true. Imran himself claimed that.

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x23xp2y" allowfullscreen></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x23xp2y_imran-khan-ham-qadri-sb-ka-muqabla-nhi-mustafavi-students-movement-official-facebook_news" target="_blank">Imran Khan- Ham #Qadri sb ka Muqabla nhi.....</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/Corruption_exposer" target="_blank">Corruption_exposer</a></i>
 
dhump said:
I think amazing is that people of out nation are waking up. I dont know what this whole episode will result it but at-least we can see our nation is tiered of these thugs.

I know Imran is very delusional guy but this is no joke seriously.
Click to expand...

Most of the crowd as with Doctor Sahib, not Imran. Why are people carrying small babies?
 
Indiafan said:
Most of the crowd as with Doctor Sahib, not Imran. Why are people carrying small babies?
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Because dr shab got devotees and it is different for Imran he is no religious figure.

I think its a pressure tactic to show tjey are peaceful but seriously dangerous one people are crazy about this cause I think.
 
endymion248 said:
You are questioning whether 40 millions can represent 180. I'm saying that it's not perfect but it's still more representative than 100k.
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In your own words in bold above, 100K is less representative than 40m but both are not perfect so what there to debate? The difference is explainable though. Later number is for election day when every one is almost forced to go and vote on public holiday, with much more security. In protests people are not brave enough, more on lazier side and above all the protests are usually impacting the daily life, especially the one lasting for many days.

endymion248 said:
As far as poll surveys are concerned, the samples are randomized and supposed to be representative. A survey of 100k is taken seriously because it has the same people who are going to vote. When 100k go to Islamabad, they are not random and they don't represent the people who are going to vote in any sense of it.
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How do you know the 100K are not randomized enough? People from different provinces have joined it.

endymion248 said:
The one where we measure how much crowd each side can oppose in the streets.
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If not fairly in election then 'in the streets' is automatic choice. In fact handful of nooners came out against this long march in Gujranwala and Lahore but couldn't convince others or couldn't sustain their protest against PTI. Similarly handful of traders protested against IK's announcement of COD. So it's not the system IK or I am suggesting but people have no choice but to demonstrate on streets when the system/process is not fair and free.
 
Indiafan said:
Most of the crowd as with Doctor Sahib, not Imran. Why are people carrying small babies?
Click to expand...

Its the opposite actually.Most of the crowd is with Imran.I was there three fours hours ago.It was huge and people were still pouring in.

They have completely shut down Islamabad.So the people that are now coming from Punjab and KPK are left stranded on the roads.If the roads open up which they should by tomorrow, this crowd will increase drastically.

Plus this crowd that you now see has people from Isb too belonging to every class.People here in Islamabad are mostly PTI supporters so they also went out in huge numbers today.

Hope this clears it up.
 
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Arsal_AK said:
Its the opposite actually.Most of the crowd is with Imran.I was there three fours hours ago.It was huge and people were still pouring in.

They have completely shut down Islamabad.So the people that are now coming from Punjab and KPK are left stranded on the roads.If the roads open up which they should by tomorrow, this crowd will increase drastically.

Plus this crowd that you now see has people from Isb too belonging to every class.People here in Islamabad are mostly PTI supporters so they also went out in huge numbers today.

Hope this clears it up.
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Cool, nice to hear from an insider
 
Arsal_AK said:
Its the opposite actually.Most of the crowd is with Imran.I was there three fours hours ago.It was huge and people were still pouring in.

They have completely shut down Islamabad.So the people that are now coming from Punjab and KPK are left stranded on the roads.If the roads open up which they should by tomorrow, this crowd will increase drastically.

Plus this crowd that you now see has people from Isb too belonging to every class.People here in Islamabad are mostly PTI supporters so they also went out in huge numbers today.

Hope this clears it up.
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Thank you it clears it up for those with open minds.
 
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