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Rank all the teams according to their ability to produce fast-bowlers historically
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Danyaalr01
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I would put South Africa, Pakistan and Australia all equal.
West Indies produced many greats in the past, but other team are now catching up. WI still lead it due to their pacers in the 70s -90s period. Right now they just have Kemar Roach. Alzarri Joseph looks promising though.
marlonbrowndo
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West Indies
Australia
Pakistani
South Africa
New Zealand
England
India
Sri Lanka
Australia
Pakistani
South Africa
New Zealand
England
India
Sri Lanka
sweep_shot
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Australia
South Africa
West Indies
Pakistan
NZ
England
India
SL
Zimbabwe
BD.
South Africa
West Indies
Pakistan
NZ
England
India
SL
Zimbabwe
BD.
The lone Ranger
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West Indies
Australia
South Africa
England
Pakistan
Newzealand
India
Sri Lanka
Australia
South Africa
England
Pakistan
Newzealand
India
Sri Lanka
Mesozoic
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West Indies
Australia
Pakistan
South Africa
India
England
New Zealand
Sri Lanka
Zimbabwe
Bangladesh
Australia
Pakistan
South Africa
India
England
New Zealand
Sri Lanka
Zimbabwe
Bangladesh
I think, it’s by quality because by numbers, Aussies and Poms will be ahead always because of the longer time they are playing.
If I go by the top six pacers produced by these teams, this will be my list (alphabetically- haven’t ranked yet)
Australia: Lillee, Lindwall, McGrath, Davidson, Miller - last one is really tight between many - Spoforth, Noble, Jack Gregory, Ted McDonald, G Mackenzie, Thompson, Alderman, Gillespie, McDermott, Johnson .... the recent guy, Cummins. I’ll take the very non Aussie like fast bowler - Terry Alderman.
England: Truman, Snow, Willis, Anderson, Bedsar - 6th one I’ll go with Larwood, for the hype.
India: Kapil, Srinath, Mo Nisar, Zak, Bumrah - for 6th, I pick Shami over Ishant.
New Zealand: Hadlee, Bond, Boult, Wagner, Southee; 6th one I’ll go with Cairns over Bert Taylor, Morrison & C Martin
Pakistan: Wasim, Imran, Waquar, Fazal Mahmood, Asif, Shoaib. I think, hardly any one will pick out of this list, but may be order will be a bit different.
South Africa: Donald, Styen, Neil Adcock, Rabada, S Pollock - for last spot, I’ll take Vernon Phi over Makhya. Unfortunately, can’t consider Procter, Van der Bill, Gerth Le Roux.
Srilanka: Vaas, Malinga, Ramesh Ratnayeke, Ravi Ratnayeke, Dihara Fernando, for 6th, may be
If I go by the top six pacers produced by these teams, this will be my list (alphabetically- haven’t ranked yet)
Australia: Lillee, Lindwall, McGrath, Davidson, Miller - last one is really tight between many - Spoforth, Noble, Jack Gregory, Ted McDonald, G Mackenzie, Thompson, Alderman, Gillespie, McDermott, Johnson .... the recent guy, Cummins. I’ll take the very non Aussie like fast bowler - Terry Alderman.
England: Truman, Snow, Willis, Anderson, Bedsar - 6th one I’ll go with Larwood, for the hype.
India: Kapil, Srinath, Mo Nisar, Zak, Bumrah - for 6th, I pick Shami over Ishant.
New Zealand: Hadlee, Bond, Boult, Wagner, Southee; 6th one I’ll go with Cairns over Bert Taylor, Morrison & C Martin
Pakistan: Wasim, Imran, Waquar, Fazal Mahmood, Asif, Shoaib. I think, hardly any one will pick out of this list, but may be order will be a bit different.
South Africa: Donald, Styen, Neil Adcock, Rabada, S Pollock - for last spot, I’ll take Vernon Phi over Makhya. Unfortunately, can’t consider Procter, Van der Bill, Gerth Le Roux.
Srilanka: Vaas, Malinga, Ramesh Ratnayeke, Ravi Ratnayeke, Dihara Fernando, for 6th, may be
My ranking will be
1. Australia: they had every thing, in almost every generation. Even to think that during their darkest period of mid 80s, they had Lawson, Reid, McDermott, while Alderman was in South Africa and Packer Reject Australia still had Thompson, Hogg, Pascoe, Dymock.
2. West Indies for a short span of time, their peak was probably best ever, but not much either side. Even in 1973, almost 38 years old Sir Gary opened for them, while after 2002, it ended with Walsh. But, for a good period, they had Sylvester Clarke, Wyen Daniel, Kieth Boyce, Ezra Mosley, Anthony Grey, Pat Patterson, Winston Davies .... as backup while Croft & Stevenson went to SAF.
Really tight between Pakistan, England, South Africa - I go for PAK, SAF, England in that order by a whisker. I think, of those 18, my top 6 picks will be Wasim, Imran, WY, Truman, Donald & Styen - it’s 3, 2 & 1, so PAK tops that group.
Again, tight between Kiwis & India - I give Kiwis the 6th spot for their top two picks - of those 12, first two will be Kiwi and the first one is a total body length taller than others.
SRL are just making numbers here.
1. Australia: they had every thing, in almost every generation. Even to think that during their darkest period of mid 80s, they had Lawson, Reid, McDermott, while Alderman was in South Africa and Packer Reject Australia still had Thompson, Hogg, Pascoe, Dymock.
2. West Indies for a short span of time, their peak was probably best ever, but not much either side. Even in 1973, almost 38 years old Sir Gary opened for them, while after 2002, it ended with Walsh. But, for a good period, they had Sylvester Clarke, Wyen Daniel, Kieth Boyce, Ezra Mosley, Anthony Grey, Pat Patterson, Winston Davies .... as backup while Croft & Stevenson went to SAF.
Really tight between Pakistan, England, South Africa - I go for PAK, SAF, England in that order by a whisker. I think, of those 18, my top 6 picks will be Wasim, Imran, WY, Truman, Donald & Styen - it’s 3, 2 & 1, so PAK tops that group.
Again, tight between Kiwis & India - I give Kiwis the 6th spot for their top two picks - of those 12, first two will be Kiwi and the first one is a total body length taller than others.
SRL are just making numbers here.
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Ab Fan
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I think it's Australia.
They have McGrath, Lillee, Miller, Lindwall, Davidson, Thommo, Gillispie, McDermott, Lee, Johnson, Starc and Cummins.
Windies are very close second IMO with Marshall, Garner, Holding, Roberts, Ambrose, Walsh, Bishop and in the modern era Kemar Roach.
It's close between the two IMO but if you include spinners, Australia takes it without doubt.
Third is South Africa with Dale Steyn, Allan Donald, Shaun Pollock, Kagiso Rabada, Vernon Philander, Neil Adcock and Makhaya Ntini.
Pakistan are very close fourth with Imran, Wasim, Waqar, S Akhtar, Asif and Fazal.
England are fifth as they had Trueman, Willis, Barnes, Bedser, Statham, Snow, Botham, Anderson and Broad as standouts (few of them part of amateaur era).
Bar Trueman, don't see anyone from England better than atleast three names from South Africa and also atleast three names from Pakistan.
New Zealand 6th because they had Hadlee. Outside that, they had Bond, Boult, Wagner and Southee. All modern-era names. Chris Martin was probably second best NZ bowler after Hadlee before the turn of millennium.
India don't have any legendary bowler but they had Kapil Dev, Srinath and Zaheer in past and Bumrah and Mohammad Shami have already made good names for themselves in world cricket.
Sri Lanka are last with Chaminda Vaas and to an extent Lasith Malinga the only two known names across the world.
So, the ranking is
Australia
Windies
South Africa
Pakistan
England
New Zealand
India
Sri Lanka
They have McGrath, Lillee, Miller, Lindwall, Davidson, Thommo, Gillispie, McDermott, Lee, Johnson, Starc and Cummins.
Windies are very close second IMO with Marshall, Garner, Holding, Roberts, Ambrose, Walsh, Bishop and in the modern era Kemar Roach.
It's close between the two IMO but if you include spinners, Australia takes it without doubt.
Third is South Africa with Dale Steyn, Allan Donald, Shaun Pollock, Kagiso Rabada, Vernon Philander, Neil Adcock and Makhaya Ntini.
Pakistan are very close fourth with Imran, Wasim, Waqar, S Akhtar, Asif and Fazal.
England are fifth as they had Trueman, Willis, Barnes, Bedser, Statham, Snow, Botham, Anderson and Broad as standouts (few of them part of amateaur era).
Bar Trueman, don't see anyone from England better than atleast three names from South Africa and also atleast three names from Pakistan.
New Zealand 6th because they had Hadlee. Outside that, they had Bond, Boult, Wagner and Southee. All modern-era names. Chris Martin was probably second best NZ bowler after Hadlee before the turn of millennium.
India don't have any legendary bowler but they had Kapil Dev, Srinath and Zaheer in past and Bumrah and Mohammad Shami have already made good names for themselves in world cricket.
Sri Lanka are last with Chaminda Vaas and to an extent Lasith Malinga the only two known names across the world.
So, the ranking is
Australia
Windies
South Africa
Pakistan
England
New Zealand
India
Sri Lanka
Hasan123
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Mr Crickekter
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In terms of bowling India ranks 15th....i.e below Kenya and UAE
and Indians calling Sreenath a Legend...
and Indians calling Sreenath a Legend...
Ab Fan
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Well..Well..India have three bowlers with over 400 wickets, Pakistan has one.
<I>India is the only country with more than two bowlers who have joined 400 wickets club.</I>
Very soon Ashwin will join and increase the count to 4.
Kingpin786
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well if you read carefully thread is about fast bowlers not spinners besides zaheer khan has 300 wickets but if you compare him with asif batsmen rated asif higher than zak kp amla deviliers etc rated him higher than any other pacer both asif and shoaib also achieved number 2 ranking in tests which is not achieved by any indian pacer yet
Ab Fan
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If you read carefully, I have a post for the OP in which India is at no.7 only ahead of SL.
The one you are quoting me for is a reply to the post that was quoted. So, read that carefully first.
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Ab Fan
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Btw, Asif has brought shame to Pakistan cricket. You guys are better off hyping Wasim, Waqar, Imran and Shoaib rather than Asif who has no legacy. What he could have done means nothing today now that he hasn't done.
Kingpin786
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well i read it carefully and yes it is fact that india is ahead of srilank
Kingpin786
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world admires his skills then why cant we spot fixing is another issue and he paid price for it
tyron_woodley
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personal opinion;
only count test match greats. don't consider odi bowlers legends. so; based on GOAT or ATG TIER fast bowling abilites, this is my list;
south africa
pakistan
australia
west indies
india
new zealand
England
Sri Lanka
can swap india with n.z but india post 2010 have been excellent hence I put them ahead.
tyron_woodley
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India is ahead of England and possibly new zealand when the current generation of indian bowlers retire.
Kingpin786
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well we will have to wait for that for that
Bhaag Viru Bhaag
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Sorry but that's not how it works. Pakistan had more fast bowling options than India and because of that wickets were shared between them. India on the other hand only had one bowling spearhead at a time. Kapil, Srinath, Zaheer are perfect examples.
Only now we have got 2-3 bowlers who take wickets equally. Same can be said about England.
Ab Fan
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Sorry but that's not how it works. Pakistan had more fast bowling options than India and because of that wickets were shared between them. India on the other hand only had one bowling spearhead at a time. Kapil, Srinath, Zaheer are perfect examples.
Only now we have got 2-3 bowlers who take wickets equally. Same can be said about England.
I was just responding to something which was coming like "India are at no.15 in bowling behind Kenya and UAE."
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Barragan
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WI
Pak
Aus
SA
Definite top 4 and in that order.
Pak
Aus
SA
Definite top 4 and in that order.
tyron_woodley
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tyron_woodley
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pakistan had fazal, nawaz, imran, wasim, waqar, shoaib, asif,
now potentially shaheen maybe
naseem I am skeptical about.
but every decade we saw some great Pakistani bowler emerge. Power of pakistan in producing fast bowlers is second to none apart from maybe saffers.
now potentially shaheen maybe
naseem I am skeptical about.
but every decade we saw some great Pakistani bowler emerge. Power of pakistan in producing fast bowlers is second to none apart from maybe saffers.
Mr Crickekter
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400 wickets in 500 matches doesn't make any sense
Barragan
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Except for Donald and Steyn, who else is really top tier?
Pollock would come into the same category as Shoaib and Asif.
Pak have three definite bowlers in top tier in Imran, Wasim and Waqar, plus you can add Fazal Mahmood as well considering he was a top bowler during his era.
England so far behind? Do you know who invented cricket and which country produced Barnes, Bedser, Trueman, Statham, Larwood, Willis, Snow, Botham, Gough and Anderson.
Pollock is an ATG, a tier above Akhtar and Asif an underachiever.
tyron_woodley
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amateur era greats are not counted. post 1970 is when we really saw competitive cricket across the globe.
Ab Fan
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It tells you about durability of a cricketer. None of the Pakistan bowlers bar Akram were durable enough to play over 100 test matches.
Saqlain Mushtaq had a career of less than 50 tests where he took as many wickets as India's secondary spin option Ravindra Jadeja already has taken and the latter is looking good for more wickets and more runs.
Mohammad Amir has stopped playing test cricket after 36 tests. The total number of test matches played by Amir and Asif combined is a meagre total of 59 tests. What legacy should be talk about them?
Post the turn of the millennium, Pakistan have struggled to produce a fast bowler with over 200 test wickets and this is in an era where there was no Wasim Akram, no Waqar Younis and not even a Shoaib Akhtar, the latter himself ended with 175 test wickets.
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Barragan
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Ab Fan
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421 wickets@23. Why not an ATG? He certainly is. Plenty of wickets and massively economical. At his peak, he had the pace and had one of the best seam position while bowling.
Barragan
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Is chanderpaul an ATG?
Same way Chanders got the job done, so did Pollock.
Might as well add Philander to the list as well, did the same job as Pollock, however with better stats.
Ab Fan
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Nope, Philander is leagues behind Pollock. Look at Philander's bowling in Asia. He was treated as a stock bowler there. Philander also had several injuries and has half the number of wickets Pollock has.
You are doing injustice to Shaun Pollock by comparing him to Philander who is just a Saffer great. Pollock and Walsh are genuine ATGs.
Barragan
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Definitely not for me, great numbers, but just not at that ATG level.
Mr Crickekter
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Saqlain is the master of doosra... and you are comparing him with jaddu...
We have an ocean of fast bowlers so it is a reason that our bowlers get little matches....
U people keep playing bowlers for 400 matches bcoz u don't have alternatives...
Amir quited test cricket bcoz he knows it better that pak have resources...
Ab Fan
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What resources? You are ranked 7th as a test team. It's not like you have Wasim and Waqar playing in your team that Amir quited test or some other cricketer has been rested. Amir's test average got dropped to over 30 by only 36 tests. Lucky that Asif didn't made a return to international cricket.
Back when you had the resources, Pakistan was second best team during the 80s and 3rd best in the 90s. Now its nowhere to be seen in the top 5.
Bigboii
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I think it's historical rankings not right know because than WI would not be no 1
Shutdown Corner
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Australia by a wide margin. Windies 2nd. PaK 3rd.
NZ, SA, India, SL after that.
NZ, SA, India, SL after that.
HappyWarsFan
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I agree. Ireland, Zimbabwe, UAE, Kenya all have a greater fast bowling legacy than India. 
Robert
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Well, historically England produced Kortright, Larwood, Voce, Bowes, Allen, Farnes, Trueman, Statham, Tyson, Price, Snow, Willis, Dilley, Cowans, Lawrence, Malcolm, Gough, Harmison, Flintoff, Wood and Finn so should be higher than NZ at least, who didn’t produce a fast bowler until the late 1970s.
SA are too high on the list - they have produced only a handful of quicks, though admittedly very good ones (Heine, Adcock, Pollock, Proctor, Donald, Steyn, Rabada).
WI lead by miles.
GoUgandaCranes
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Fazal Mahmood and Khan Muhammad
Sarfaraz Nawaz and Imran Khan
Wasim Akram and Waqar Younus
Shoaib Akhtar
Muhammad Amir and Muhammad Asif
The chain broke after 2010 but I feel that we have recovered to some extent and maybe can produce a couple more from this recent batch.
In between we have had Muhammad Zahid, Muhammad Akram, Tahir Naqqash, Sikandar Bakht, Saleem Jaffar, Rana Naveed, Amir Nazeer, Aqib Javed who were good at domestic level and showed limited ability in international cricket.
Don't need to compare to other nations but alhamdulillah we have had some good quality fast bowlers in the past and the present and future look bright too.
Sarfaraz Nawaz and Imran Khan
Wasim Akram and Waqar Younus
Shoaib Akhtar
Muhammad Amir and Muhammad Asif
The chain broke after 2010 but I feel that we have recovered to some extent and maybe can produce a couple more from this recent batch.
In between we have had Muhammad Zahid, Muhammad Akram, Tahir Naqqash, Sikandar Bakht, Saleem Jaffar, Rana Naveed, Amir Nazeer, Aqib Javed who were good at domestic level and showed limited ability in international cricket.
Don't need to compare to other nations but alhamdulillah we have had some good quality fast bowlers in the past and the present and future look bright too.
Mr Crickekter
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Historically speaking this ranking system has failed when it comes to major tournaments.... If ranking matters then you would not have been beaten blue and white by Newzeland..
Robert
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I'd say four of those guys were fast and the rest FM.
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