Ab Fan
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Won't score at fast rate even in 1st inning when required to accelerate.
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Ranking MS Dhoni as an ODI batsman?
- Thread starter Ab Fan
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Won't score at fast rate even in 1st inning when required to accelerate.
He was extremely good in 2014 and 2015 also.His Finishing skill was reduced because he wasn't a great power hitter anymore.
IMO Dhoni was India's best batsmen during 2014-2015.
Ab Fan
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In 2014, he was getting 40s-50s but his finishing skills were reduced till that time. He was completely done in 2015. Only that 92* vs SA was a good inning. Some good performances against WI and Zim but they were hardly a factor in 2015.
My point is different.Dhoni was still better than the likes of Kohli,Dhawan,Raina etc in that period.His performance in NZ(2014) was on par with Kohli and played couple of good knocks there(like 79*).He helped India win the match against WI and Zim in WC2015 and was without doubt India's 2nd best batsmen in WC 2015.His 92* along with 69 in bangladesh were also matchwinning innings.
As a finisher,he was decent in that period but as a batsmen he was extremely good.Finishing is not as easy as some people here might think.
Ab Fan
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Kohli's 123 was by far the best inning played by any Indian in that series. Dhoni got some 40s-50s but they mostly went in vain as he failed to finish chases.
In WC 2015, Raina was easily the 2nd best batsmen after Dhawan not Dhoni. His inning against Australia was a useless one(came when the match was already beyond reach) and against Zim, he played supporting role to Raina.Other Indian batters barring Raina and Dhawan were failures in this series. Raina's inning vs Pakistan, Zim(minnows) and BD(in QF) were high quality ones.
<B>As said, in 2015 he was done and I won't really say it was good by any means. In 2014, I agree he was still good as a batsmen but lost the finishing touch.</B>
Dhoni obviously didn't got as much opportunity as Raina but Raina's played important knock against Pak,Ban and Zim.Raina's performance was also very good and It's debatable whether Raina or Dhoni
was india's 2nd best batsmen in 2015WC.
There is no such thing as useless knock in WC semifinal.His 65(66) was still better than 1(13),7(11) or 44(68).On the most difficult pitch of that WC ie perth he played matchwinning knock against WI.I don't think anyone can count his 18(13) against Pak and SA as failure.As far as I can remember,He scored
runs in that WC whenever India were in Real Trouble like against Zim,WI and Aus(Semi).
Anyway,My Main point is that Dhoni was still better than the likes of kohli,Dhawan,raina etc in that period.He was India's best batsmen in that period along with R sharma(Although Sharma didn't really win lots of matches for India).
He remains not out most of the times. Hence the average. Very few impact innings.
Sorry, average only tells half of the story. MSD has been a dud with the bat for quite some time now. His scores of 40(40 balls) is not going to work with the current lineup. He is expected to finish the innings with a flourish. Waiting till 49th over and finally striking a few boundaries to take his S/R to 100 is enough to fool the gullible.
I am not saying MSD should be dropped right away. But with a pathetic middle order that India has, MSD is a burden to carry. I have seen him many times where he wastes many deliveries and gets out. If he is lucky, he will remain not out to boost his average.
MSD should either play in Top 4 and slog or come at No.8 and slog. Him coming in 35th over and slowing down the momentum is not going to work against sides like England or Aus or Kiwis. You need high octane players to come in at no.5 and 6.
MSD has been past it for a while. He is still a competent batsman who can score in singles. But hitting big shots is a far cry right now. He takes 5 or 6 overs before he can even slog. By that time, there will be too much pressure on others to accelerate.
I have seen MSD leaving it to BK to slog when he should be the one who needs to slog. BK is a decent batsman who can stick around. But he cannot slog. MSD still lets BK slog while he saves his wicket
Princejain191
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He remains not out most of the times. Hence the average. Very few impact innings.
Sorry, average only tells half of the story. MSD has been a dud with the bat for quite some time now. His scores of 40(40 balls) is not going to work with the current lineup. He is expected to finish the innings with a flourish. Waiting till 49th over and finally striking a few boundaries to take his S/R to 100 is enough to fool the gullible.
I am not saying MSD should be dropped right away. But with a pathetic middle order that India has, MSD is a burden to carry. I have seen him many times where he wastes many deliveries and gets out. If he is lucky, he will remain not out to boost his average.
MSD should either play in Top 4 and slog or come at No.8 and slog. Him coming in 35th over and slowing down the momentum is not going to work against sides like England or Aus or Kiwis. You need high octane players to come in at no.5 and 6.
MSD has been past it for a while. He is still a competent batsman who can score in singles. But hitting big shots is a far cry right now. He takes 5 or 6 overs before he can even slog. By that time, there will be too much pressure on others to accelerate.
I have seen MSD leaving it to BK to slog when he should be the one who needs to slog. BK is a decent batsman who can stick around. But he cannot slog. MSD still lets BK slog while he saves his wicket
Can't disagree more. That 2011-2014 period was when he was an absolute beast. Hardly any series went by when he averaged below 50. And he consistently played impactful innings.
However, the assessment fits the post-2015 Dhoni. He should not be batting below no. 4. Has lost power hitting ability and ability to take singles as often as he used to. Agreed that he can be a liability like Yuvraj was in WC16 if Virat keeps ignoring the problem - though Virat probably ignores it because Dhoni adds a lot in the 50 overs that India is bowling with his keeping and captaincy experience. Right now, Virat is masking the deficiency but if Virat gets out early on a 280+ pitch, we will probably be in dumps.
Bilal7
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He is no longer a good enough finisher but is still clearly better than most Indian ODI batsmen. Therefore, India should move him up the order and give the finishing duties to someone else.
Abdullah719
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"Always Believed MS Dhoni Should Bat Up The Order," Says Sourav Ganguly
MS Dhoni made his international debut under Sourav Ganguly's captaincy against Bangladesh in December, 2004. Dhoni, who is considered one of the greats of the game now, worked as a ticket collector in Indian Railways in his early days and faced many difficulties during his initial cricketing days. However, things changed when Ganguly saw some potential in Dhoni and helped him get his maiden national call-up. Recalling the incident Ganguly, the current BCCI president, said that it was his job to pick the best players and is glad that the Indian cricket team got an unbelievable player in MS Dhoni, who has established himself as one of the best in the business.
The wicketkeeper-batsman turned 39 on Tuesday and the Board of Control for Cricket in India (BCCI) tweeted a clipping of Ganguly's interview with Test opener Mayank Agarwal, on his birthday.
In his show 'Dada Opens with Mayank', Agarwal asks Ganguly if it was true that Dhoni came into the national team after he vouched for him.
"Dada your word got Mahi bhai picked in the Indian team and rest is history. Is that a myth or reality?" Agarwal asked Ganguly. Ganguly, who is currently at the helm of country's cricketing affairs, replied that he only did what every captain is supposed to do for the team -- find young talents and show faith in them.
"Yeah, it's true but that's my job, isn't it? That's every captain's job to pick the best and make the best team possible," Ganguly answered. "You go by your instincts... you go by your faith on that player that he will deliver for you and I am happy that Indian cricket got a Mahendra Singh Dhoni, because he is unbelievable," he added. Ganguly, who led India to the final of 2003 World Cup, said that for him Dhoni is much more than just a world class finisher and rates him as one of the "great players in world cricket".
Ganguly also recalled how a young Dhoni scored a blistering century against Pakistan batting at three position. "One of the great players in world cricket, I would say, not just finisher. I think everyone talks about the way he finishes lower down the order but he batted at number three when I was captain and he got a 140-odd against Pakistan in Vizag," said the BCCI president, heaping praise on the wicketkeeper-batsman.
Dhoni batted majority of his career lower down the order and devoted himself to finishing the innings for the team. In doing so, he established himself as one of the best finishers in world cricket but Ganguly said that he always believed Dhoni should have batted up the order which would have allowed him to take on opposition bowlers and hit boundaries at will.
"I always believed that he should bat up the order because he is so destructive. You know the best players in the shorter format have the ability to hit boundaries at will," Ganguly explained. For Ganguly, Dhoni was one of the specialists when it comes to shorter format as he could clear the ropes and find fence even under extreme pressure.
"You look over a period of time in the history of one-day cricket, the best players can find the fence under pressure consistently and MS Dhoni was one of them and that's why he was special," he explained. Dhoni hasn't played any international cricket since July last year and was expected to return to action for his IPL franchise Chennai Super Kings in this year's Indian Premier League (IPL).
Sadly, the coronavirus pandemic has thwarted those plans, forcing the BCCI to postpone the cash-rich league indefinitely.
https://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/ms-dhoni-should-have-batted-up-the-order-says-sourav-ganguly-2258572
MS Dhoni made his international debut under Sourav Ganguly's captaincy against Bangladesh in December, 2004. Dhoni, who is considered one of the greats of the game now, worked as a ticket collector in Indian Railways in his early days and faced many difficulties during his initial cricketing days. However, things changed when Ganguly saw some potential in Dhoni and helped him get his maiden national call-up. Recalling the incident Ganguly, the current BCCI president, said that it was his job to pick the best players and is glad that the Indian cricket team got an unbelievable player in MS Dhoni, who has established himself as one of the best in the business.
The wicketkeeper-batsman turned 39 on Tuesday and the Board of Control for Cricket in India (BCCI) tweeted a clipping of Ganguly's interview with Test opener Mayank Agarwal, on his birthday.
In his show 'Dada Opens with Mayank', Agarwal asks Ganguly if it was true that Dhoni came into the national team after he vouched for him.
"Dada your word got Mahi bhai picked in the Indian team and rest is history. Is that a myth or reality?" Agarwal asked Ganguly. Ganguly, who is currently at the helm of country's cricketing affairs, replied that he only did what every captain is supposed to do for the team -- find young talents and show faith in them.
"Yeah, it's true but that's my job, isn't it? That's every captain's job to pick the best and make the best team possible," Ganguly answered. "You go by your instincts... you go by your faith on that player that he will deliver for you and I am happy that Indian cricket got a Mahendra Singh Dhoni, because he is unbelievable," he added. Ganguly, who led India to the final of 2003 World Cup, said that for him Dhoni is much more than just a world class finisher and rates him as one of the "great players in world cricket".
Ganguly also recalled how a young Dhoni scored a blistering century against Pakistan batting at three position. "One of the great players in world cricket, I would say, not just finisher. I think everyone talks about the way he finishes lower down the order but he batted at number three when I was captain and he got a 140-odd against Pakistan in Vizag," said the BCCI president, heaping praise on the wicketkeeper-batsman.
Dhoni batted majority of his career lower down the order and devoted himself to finishing the innings for the team. In doing so, he established himself as one of the best finishers in world cricket but Ganguly said that he always believed Dhoni should have batted up the order which would have allowed him to take on opposition bowlers and hit boundaries at will.
"I always believed that he should bat up the order because he is so destructive. You know the best players in the shorter format have the ability to hit boundaries at will," Ganguly explained. For Ganguly, Dhoni was one of the specialists when it comes to shorter format as he could clear the ropes and find fence even under extreme pressure.
"You look over a period of time in the history of one-day cricket, the best players can find the fence under pressure consistently and MS Dhoni was one of them and that's why he was special," he explained. Dhoni hasn't played any international cricket since July last year and was expected to return to action for his IPL franchise Chennai Super Kings in this year's Indian Premier League (IPL).
Sadly, the coronavirus pandemic has thwarted those plans, forcing the BCCI to postpone the cash-rich league indefinitely.
https://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/ms-dhoni-should-have-batted-up-the-order-says-sourav-ganguly-2258572
Bhaijaan
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One of the greatest ever without a doubt. At his peak, and just before Kohli hit his respective peak, many non Indians comfortably put him him the league of Tendulkar and Richards, some even at the top. Proper match winner amd with such incredible consistency.
sweep_shot
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One of the best ODI batsmen of all time.
He is an ODI ATG.
He is an ODI ATG.
WhenSultansBowled
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Indian ODI batting in last few years:
SRT, Gangoly, Sehwag, Dravid, Yuvi, Kohli and Sharma.
SRT, Gangoly, Sehwag, Dravid, Yuvi, Kohli and Sharma.
