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Sachin Tendulkar - The Ultimate Discussion

Amazing player without doubt. I can see why you'd prefer Lara there are also understandable reasons why many would do the opposite. THose are very specific reasons. ANy fair overall analysis would have Tendulkar 2 steps ahead of Lara.

What analysis are you talking about? Numbers some idiots tend to summarize? They never even come close to doing justice to what the two greats were able to accomplish on the field. This is why even if Sanga or Kallis or Ponting were to average 60s, Tendulkar would still rank a level above them. Subjectively, the following are the reasons I consider Lara ahead of Tendulkar:

- Lara had a greater range of shots, pick out any two Lara innings and they will look vastly different, the range of his sweeps, cuts and drives was greater than any other batsmen I have ever watched.

- Lara was more entertaining to watch: there are very few if any who would dispute this, the high backlift and the flourish was a sight to behold, Lara looked good even when he left deliveries.

- Counter attacking - I have lost count of the amount of times I witnessed Lara come in while the West Indies were 20-2 or 3 down and launch devastating counter attacks against some of the best bowlers in the world.

- Best player of spin bowling - Lara couldn't pick Murali, but I have never seen any other batsmen dominate Murali the way he did in that one series in Sri Lanka, it was the stuff of legends, carving Murali away ball after ball against the spin on a turning wicket requires tremendous amounts of skill. Especially when every other batsmen was failing around him.

- Teams only had to focus in on Lara, for a large part of Tendulkar's career, he had other batting greats around him, although he was the prized wicket, teams also had to key in and exhaust considerable energy in getting the likes of Dravid, Laxman, Sehwag and Ganguly out. Lara was literally the only focus of the opposition for almost all of his career.

- An in form Lara was the most devastating batsmen, he would even outclass the likes of Gilchrist and Jayasuria when in the mood. I recall one game against Pakistan where he was struggling to time the ball in Australia, scored a 50 off 90 odd balls, he went onto score 150 and the next 100 came off 50 odd balls. Tendulkar was brilliantly aggressive especially in the early parts of his career, but an in form Lara had the ability to take the game away even quicker. He could win you games out of seemingly impossible situations.

- Big scores, the record speaks for itself, the number of double hundreds, 400, 500 in first class cricket, you have to be a class above the rest to accomplish those feats.

As I said, the argument for Tendulkar over Lara is one of consistency and solidity, but I think that only is true because Lara just wasn't as focused on the job half the time and would play very ordinary cricket for certain stretches. I don't fault him for that, I don't think scoring runs as consistently was as much of his obsession as it was Tendulkars, Lara was moody but when on song, he was the best batsmen in the world.

In any case, despite his up and downs, his record is still remarkable and just as good as Tendulkars if not better, especially if you compare them for the same amount of matches played at Lara's retirement.

The longevity argument is nullified by the fact that Lara continued to dominate bowling attacks right into his retirement, he stayed true to his game and entertained right till the end, and he retired while still on top.
 
Losing matches sure. Sachin is no1 there.


Which bowler did Sachin dominate that Viv could not in the same time frame??
Please name them and describe how Sachin decimated them, while Viv was made a bunny.

I look forward to a proper response, instead of thoughtless one-liner like above.
I find it extremely funny when people call Sachin match loser. I mean c'mmon that is far from truth. BTW do you know that Wasim Akram is the only test bowler in history who has 3 ten wicket hauls in test cricket and all on losing side. Shall we start calling match loser as well, is it?

Fact is Bradman himself and now Ponting said that Sachin is the greatest batsman after Don Bradman. But ofcourse few fans know better than him. Funniest of all, few 18-20 year kids in this forum who has never seen Viv batting arguea Viv Richards was way better. :))

Give it a rest guys.

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Viv against Hadlee, Imran, Lillee, Qadir was pretty average.
 
Viv faced Imran who at his peak averaged something silly like 17 runs per wicket over a 4 year period. He was an ATG bowler. Viv faced Hadlee who was unquestionably an all time great bowler. Its true that Viv did not dominate Lillee but he did fairly well there.

So that's three ATG quick bowlers that he did face who were all in their primes. Sehwag was excellent but the only ATG he really had to deal with was McGrath and he did not fare too well there.

Viv's record againist NZ is very poor.Avgs 19.

Viv avgs 42 againist Pakistan.Good but not exceptional.
 
There is no doubt Tendulkar is an elite batsman. I do think some Pak fans are biased against him though. But i don't think there is any batsman in the last few decades who can be ranked as clearly the greatest or anything.

You can make arguments for Viv, you can make arguments for Lara or Ponting. Sachin is definetely elite and in that caliber. There is very little to seperate these guys from each other. I have always seen the trio of Tendulkar,Lara and Ponting as the three best of their generation. It will be very interesting to see the three best batsmen of this era, especially in tests.
 
I find it extremely funny when people call Sachin match loser. I mean c'mmon that is far from truth. BTW do you know that Wasim Akram is the only test bowler in history who has 3 ten wicket hauls in test cricket and all on losing side. Shall we start calling match loser as well, is it?

Does it matter? We are discussing Sachin not Wasim. Did you know that off Sachin's 51 test centuries only 20 were in won matches? All these are pointless stats. Fact is you can't compare batsmen from different eras and state that Sachin is the greatest. Likewise I don't claim that Viv or Bradman is better than Sachin. They were greats of their respective eras.

Sachin can only be compared to Ponting and Lara and arguments can be made he his better than them. These brainless comments about how Sachin is the greatest by bringing up stupid stats like Viv never dominated bowlers is asinine.

Funniest of all, few 18-20 year kids in this forum who has never seen Viv batting arguea Viv Richards was way better. :))

Give it a rest guys.
Because all 18-20 year olds who support Sachin have seen Viv and Bradman bat to know that Sachin is the greatest thing since sliced bread :))
 
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Its interesting but kind of silly to argue who is better than who. For example, Tendulkar was more consistent than Lara. But Lara was better at making big hundreds and his legendary 153 is a better knock chasing than anything Tendulkar did.

On the other hand, Tendulkar was a bit better against express pace than Lara. We are splitting hairs here.

Its like comparing Ambrose, Waqar, Wasim, McGrath, Donald. There isn't much to seperate any of them. You can make arguments for any of them. If i had to pick a team where i could pick three of these bowlers, i could pick any three and it would be a virtually unplayable attack.

The same argument is true for the batsmen. There is not much to seperate them.
 
Does it matter? We are discussing Sachin not Wasim. Did you know that off Sachin's 51 test centuries only 20 were in won matches? All these are pointless stats. Fact is you can't compare batsmen from different eras and state that Sachin is the greatest. Likewise I don't claim that Viv or Bradman is better than Sachin. They were greats of their respective eras.

Sachin can only be compared to Ponting and Lara and arguments can be made he his better than them. These brainless comments about how Sachin is the greatest by bringing up stupid stats like Viv never dominated bowlers is asinine.


Because all 18-20 year olds who support Sachin have seen Viv and Bradman bat to know that Sachin is the greatest thing since sliced bread :))

YOu haven't explained your match loser comment yet. Dont be a coward.
 
YOu haven't explained your match loser comment yet. Dont be a coward.

You haven't answered my question to earlier in the thread were I asked you how you compared Sachin to Bradman. Who's the coward? Coward.

It's ok I never expected a response which equired some mental acuity from you anyways :srt
 
Why isn't there anymore news about Sachin's son ? He received fair amount of media attention couple of years ago.
 
Steyn's not looked more lethal than that. I don't you understand the game when you say stuff like that. You're supposed to preserve your wicket against the best bowlers and target the weaker ones. Steyn was bowling banana outswing that match, unplayable stuff. Watching him tame Steyn there was a sight to behold, those who followed the mach back then would testify to it [MENTION=1842]James[/MENTION] knows whati'm talking about regarding that match and battle between Sach and Steyn.

Yes indeedy those were very special performances from both Steyn and Sachin.
 
Why isn't there anymore news about Sachin's son ? He received fair amount of media attention couple of years ago.

Maybe hasn't done anything special. I think its better. Let him enjoy the game, there shouldn't be any pressure of expectations on him.
 
Anyone else felt the goosebumps seeing Sachin in the stands?

If only he was out there in the middle. What a champ he was! Flashbacks 2003 match.
 
Was looking like a calm, peaceful Buddhist monk who had attained nirvana. Looks much younger than even :afridi
 
LG-Virat-1458418455.jpg



To The Great Sachin.


#Respect
 
How good was Tendulkar in other facets of the game?

People call him a beast of a batsman, that's obviously an understatement.

Forget beast, India consider him their god, LOL.

What I want to know is how do people rate this great batsman's bowling and fielding? Was he anything special outside of batting?
 
blessed in all facets :hafeez

Could've been a decent allrounder if he put his mind to it and kept his finger nails away from the seam. Remember some good bowling outings from him, he was more consistent than Afridi at least lol bowling wise.

Good fielder too, remember him stealing a 300+ chase from us by taking a good catch at the boundary rope of Inzi man. Took it at the last second else it was a sixer.
 
Well he was an all rounder under Azharuddin captaincy. He defended less than 6 runs in last over against Inzi (?). Also had safe pair of hands (except post 2011)
 
That famous hero cup final last over where he gave South Africa one of its earliest chokes

Also the world famous 2001 Kolkata test which is known as the turnaround in indian cricket known for the clutch innings of laxman and Dravid and bhajjis bowling but people forget that it was Sachin's 3 wickets in the 2nd innings that turned the match in indias favor.

Things like that cannot be scripted :asif :butt :amir
 
I think he was a very talented leg spinner. Due to tennis elbow injury he didnt bowl as much after 2005, but if he would have continued bowling he could have easily got 250+ wickets in ODI. Till 2005 he had 140 ODI wickets and after he had started bowling less he got 14 wickets in the next 7-8 years
 
Well he was an all rounder under Azharuddin captaincy. He defended less than 6 runs in last over against Inzi (?). Also had safe pair of hands (except post 2011)

no Inzi was in 2005 and Inzi was able to score the winning runs
Sachin did it against SA in 1993

 
Sachin was pretty damn good in every thing other than being captain and they realised it quickly.
 
Also another notable performance with the ball was in 1992.... People obviously remember his man of the match winning 2003 and 2011 knocks against pak.... In 1992 along with 54 runs he ended up with figures of 1/37 in 10 overs And took the match turning wicket of amir sohail And hence rightfully the man of the match
 
If you watched the game vs WI (WC), you'd have heard Gavaskar draw a comparison when Kohli turned up to bowl the final over, to the semi-final of the Hero Cup when Sachin who hadn't bowled all game took the ball when senior bowlers :kapil were reluctant to defend 4 runs vs Brian Mcmillan (best all rounder in the world at the time).

Was crucial when India were short of time during the famous 2001 Test vs Australia at Kolkata. Recall a 5 wicket haul vs Aus at Kochi also defending a lowish target.

Was pretty talented with the ball and could bowl seamers in swinging conditions and offspin (to lefties) and leggies to right handers. Famously bowled Warne with a googly which caused Chappell to comment - if anyone should have picked that, it should have been Warne :))

Here's Dravid on Sachin's bowling skills.


As a fielder, he was the most dependable and committed fielder in a team of mediocre to poor fielding standards bar Azhar and Jadeja (in LOIs)


Could've been a decent allrounder if he put his mind to it and kept his finger nails away from the seam.

:))
 
At his best he was a really useful part-timer and was underbowled. Not dissimilar to Michael Clarke in that respect.

Nothing special as a fielder
 
Above average part time bowler and an average fielder.
 
he was a decent spinner but very inaccurate and he had limited abilities as a fielder because of his lack of athleticism.
I don't recall him dropping any catches and he rarely fielded in the slips in test matches.
 
As it is, he was a useful part timer and an acceptable and safe, albeit unspectacular fielder.

But if things had been different, he could have been a good, test class spinner. He definitely had the talent, variety and accuracy (which was OK, but could have been developed with coaching) to succeed if his career had taken that path.
 
As a fielder, he was the most dependable and committed fielder in a team of mediocre to poor fielding standards bar Azhar and Jadeja (in LOIs)

You forgot Robin Sing, out specialist fielder back in days :malik. Dravid also good fielder back then. See some diving catch in his early days in YT

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At his best he was a really useful part-timer and was underbowled. Not dissimilar to Michael Clarke in that respect.

Nothing special as a fielder
Not bad either. Yes he was fat and could not dive etc. But I do not recall him dropping any catch etc. Also he had a fantastic throwing arm from deep.

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Not bad either. Yes he was fat and could not dive etc. But I do not recall him dropping any catch etc. Also he had a fantastic throwing arm from deep.

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You haven't watched him enough, then. He dropped a lot of sitters. In comparison to Ponting, he was a pathetic fielder.
 
You haven't watched him enough, then. He dropped a lot of sitters. In comparison to Ponting, he was a pathetic fielder.
Lol who compared him to Ponting?? Obviously he is much inferior to Punter who was an ATG fielder. Can you highlight some so called sitters Sachin dropped?

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People are overrating his bowling.. used to bowl long hops and would get punished for 4.

Magic arm.. lol..
 
Fairly average but safe fielder

Part time bowler

Terrible leader
 
Could've been an excellent leggie had he put his mind to it. Could really turn the ball and had a good wrong un as well. His 5 fer in Kochi was against a very good lineup and some batsmen really struggled against his bowling :inzi
 
Could've been an excellent leggie had he put his mind to it. Could really turn the ball and had a good wrong un as well. His 5 fer in Kochi was against a very good lineup and some batsmen really struggled against his bowling :inzi

all part timers have 3-4 performances where they end up with crazy match turning figures. Doesnt make them 'excellent bowlers if they put their mind to it.'
 
Anyways this is why i always claim that Ponting>Tendulkar as cricketers is a no contest

As batsmen they are neck and neck and people can pick either and it can be justified. But almost everyone would say that Ponting is far superior fielder and captain to Tendular
 
all part timers have 3-4 performances where they end up with crazy match turning figures. Doesnt make them 'excellent bowlers if they put their mind to it.'

Yes, but with Sachin, his every wicket was a pure gold.. he was the most talented bowler, who just didn't put his mind to it.. else he was better than Warne.
 
Anyways this is why i always claim that Ponting>Tendulkar as cricketers is a no contest

As batsmen they are neck and neck and people can pick either and it can be justified. But almost everyone would say that Ponting is far superior fielder and captain to Tendular

SRT the batsman > Ponting the batsman, fielder, captain, bowler, commentator, etc..
 
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Yes, but with Sachin, his every wicket was a pure gold.. he was the most talented bowler, who just didn't put his mind to it.. else he was better than Warne.

Yousuf averages 1 as a bowler

wish he'd put his mind into it
 
Good fielder, i considered him a very good catcher and a decent outfielder who rarely made mistakes. He was certainly not in the Ponting / Rhodes category but not as slow as Imran Khan or Inzamam either.

As a bowler, he was a good part-timer. Played a handy role with the ball in two of Indias most famous test victories (Eden 2001 and Adelaide 2003) and around a dozen ODI victories.

As a leader, he left much to be desired.
 
all part timers have 3-4 performances where they end up with crazy match turning figures. Doesnt make them 'excellent bowlers if they put their mind it.'

Tendulkar often displayed skill which was more than what a part time leggie could do. That was my point .
 
The comparisons with Ponting are frankly quite lame. Ponting played for a much superior lineup. Give any half decent cricketer Mcwarne,Gillespie,Gilly,Haydis,Langer/Martyn/Hussey and theyll win pretty much everything . Tendulkar s captaincy was during the 90's when India were absolutely rubbish with both bat and ball . And while SRT was certainly no Ponting in the field, he had a safe pair of hands and a strong,accurate arm. Certainly an excellent allround cricketer.
 
ATG batsman no doubt, but a a part time bowler may be like Joe Root or Azhar Ali or Kohli, and a worst fielder.
 
The comparisons with Ponting are frankly quite lame. Ponting played for a much superior lineup. Give any half decent cricketer Mcwarne,Gillespie,Gilly,Haydis,Langer/Martyn/Hussey and theyll win pretty much everything . Tendulkar s captaincy was during the 90's when India were absolutely rubbish with both bat and ball . And while SRT was certainly no Ponting in the field, he had a safe pair of hands and a strong,accurate arm. Certainly an excellent allround cricketer.

That's what I thought as well about Ponting's captaincy but after listening to him commentate in Big Bash I have changed my mind. Great cricket brain no doubt about it. Would make one heck of a coach if he decides to take it up.
 
You forgot about SRT the ball tamperer being better than Ponting :srt

Sachin was a good talented leg spin bowler & above avg: fielder and safe catcer. He was good at medium pace bowling too.The proof of it is that he has 200 international wickets .Some of these dismissials where classic quality deliveries or came at crucial times for India.Had he become more selective in batting(by skipping non consequential matches etc) & concentrated more on bowling he could have attained much more success as a bowler.But as it turned out he bowled less and less to prolong is batting career.

In ball tampering SRT < Imran Khan:asif
 
The comparisons with Ponting are frankly quite lame. Ponting played for a much superior lineup. Give any half decent cricketer Mcwarne,Gillespie,Gilly,Haydis,Langer/Martyn/Hussey and theyll win pretty much everything . Tendulkar s captaincy was during the 90's when India were absolutely rubbish with both bat and ball . And while SRT was certainly no Ponting in the field, he had a safe pair of hands and a strong,accurate arm. Certainly an excellent allround cricketer.

Ponting did keep all those egos in check. Not actually as easy a task as people think.
 
The comparisons with Ponting are frankly quite lame. Ponting played for a much superior lineup. Give any half decent cricketer Mcwarne,Gillespie,Gilly,Haydis,Langer/Martyn/Hussey and theyll win pretty much everything . Tendulkar s captaincy was during the 90's when India were absolutely rubbish with both bat and ball . And while SRT was certainly no Ponting in the field, he had a safe pair of hands and a strong,accurate arm. Certainly an excellent allround cricketer.

I have actually never rated Ponting very highly as a captain. Of the Australian captains that I have seen from Mark Taylor to Michael Clarke, I rate Ponting as the worst. He was a decent captain but not as good as his captaincy records suggest.
 
That being said, Tendulkar is one of the worst captains I have seen. Captaincy was just not his thing. He could do pretty much everything else decently on a cricket field, great batsman, good fielder and a decent bowler with a lot of variety from slow medium to off and leg spin. IMO he would have been an excellent leg break bowler if that was his main craft. He had all the weapons and could turn it miles just did not have as much control as the proper bowlers do due to lack of practice.
 
Part-time bowler, average fielder and poor captain.
 
People call him a beast of a batsman, that's obviously an understatement.

Forget beast, India consider him their god, LOL.

What I want to know is how do people rate this great batsman's bowling and fielding? Was he anything special outside of batting?


Had moments of sheer genius with the ball in his hand as well as in the field. Never have i seen a player taking a better one handed outfield skier than what a teenage Tendulkar did in England. To compare his fielding is to compare Kapil's batting to Viv Richards though, we're pretty happy in what we got from him in the field. Tendulkar was a competent and safe fielder, everybody isn't JOnty Rhodes or Ponting, they were excepptionally gifted athletes, Tendulkar wasn't physically at their level if he was he would have eclipsed them too because his passion and determination to succeed we all know has been at another level throughout his career.

With the ball, before Hardik Pandya vs Bangladesh, Tendulkar vs RSA remained the finest last over ever bowled by an Indian to save the match. Yes, we never had outstanding death bowlers but fact that Tendulkar remained our brightest last over memory for two decades tells you about the genius of the man. I thought he was a pretty cunning spinner when his body allowed him the freedom to do the tricks. The 2004 season i guess he bowled a lot of leg spin and looked pretty threatening. SO many times i've seen Tendulkar getting the ball and doing things completely out of the blue.
 
:)))

The Indians are desperately trying to turn their idol into an all-rounder to prepare for the next time the Imran vs Tendulker debate is restarted. Reminds me of that one gentleman who was mentioning Tendulker's 50 odd wickets to try and give him leverage against Kallis.

Tendulker was a pure batsman and nothing more.
 
:)))

The Indians are desperately trying to turn their idol into an all-rounder to prepare for the next time the Imran vs Tendulker debate is restarted. Reminds me of that one gentleman who was mentioning Tendulker's 50 odd wickets to try and give him leverage against Kallis.

Tendulker was a pure batsman and nothing more.

if we watch the highlights of some of the deliveries of Sachin's to take those wickets , no impartial analyser can doubt about his bowling talent.His balls to dismiss Moin Khan & Shane Warne were caliber deliveries.Such deliveries with out a doubt proves that he could have ended with far more no: of wkts(both in tests & one dayers) had he concentrated more on his bowling.But for that, as i earlier said, he needed to compromise on his batting longevity because he didn't posses the body strength & stamina & physical fitness in the long run to concentrate more on his bowling along with maintaining his longevity in batting. Had he compromised on his batting longevity by being selective w.r.t unimportant matches & utilised that effort to improve his bowling skills, i have no doubt in the fact that he could have turned into a batting all rounder, i mean a batting great with the bowl avg: similar to that of some one like Ravi Sastri.If we assume the probablities of that happening,we can see that it is very high.This is because Kumble, India's most successful spinner ever debuted just 4 or 5 months after Sachin debuted.Kumble was so succesful especially in Indian conditions that he just needed any other spinner at the other end to share his workload.For me Sachin could easily have done that role in the place of Raju ,Chauhan etc.But in reality it turned out to be that his towering status as a batsman seems to loom over his moderate bowling
achievements even more than had he been a 'good' to 'very good' calibre batsman.
 
:)))

The Indians are desperately trying to turn their idol into an all-rounder to prepare for the next time the Imran vs Tendulker debate is restarted. Reminds me of that one gentleman who was mentioning Tendulker's 50 odd wickets to try and give him leverage against Kallis.

Tendulker was a pure batsman and nothing more.

How insecure can you get? No one here was trying to portray Tendulkar as an allrounder at all. Everyone seems to agree he had talent, but was at the end of the day, only a part timer.

Lame posting.
 
How insecure can you get? No one here was trying to portray Tendulkar as an allrounder at all. Everyone seems to agree he had talent, but was at the end of the day, only a part timer.

Lame posting.

"No one". Reading the post just above your own would be a good place to start, if you want to find the people trying to boost Sachin's standing in the other facets of the game. Funny how it's always the trolls on their second or third accounts that attack other posters like this.
 
The comparisons with Ponting are frankly quite lame. Ponting played for a much superior lineup. Give any half decent cricketer Mcwarne,Gillespie,Gilly,Haydis,Langer/Martyn/Hussey and theyll win pretty much everything . Tendulkar s captaincy was during the 90's when India were absolutely rubbish with both bat and ball . And while SRT was certainly no Ponting in the field, he had a safe pair of hands and a strong,accurate arm. Certainly an excellent allround cricketer.

Yup no one denies sachin and Lara both to be poor captains.. But claiming ponting to be better cricketer based on his captaincy is pretty lame.. Anyone with half brain cell would have lead that side to victory.. Same way no one claims viv to be as good of a captain as Clive Lloyd despite achieving the same results..
 
"No one". Reading the post just above your own would be a good place to start, if you want to find the people trying to boost Sachin's standing in the other facets of the game. Funny how it's always the trolls on their second or third accounts that attack other posters like this.

You seems pointing to me...Mohammed Yousof's dismissal bowled round his legs,Gary Kirstein's(dismissal bowled round his legs of a left hander), Shane warne(LBW of a wrong one),Moin Khan(bowled of a wrong one)-all just indicates he was capable of spinning both into and away from the batsman.
So i firmly sticks to my point.
 
Anyways this is why i always claim that Ponting>Tendulkar as cricketers is a no contest

As batsmen they are neck and neck and people can pick either and it can be justified. But almost everyone would say that Ponting is far superior fielder and captain to Tendular

Ponting as a batsman was more dangerous, he was merciless against pace. I was always very worried when Pakistan faced Australia and especially when he was batting.

I still remember he once hammered India, Dravid said he was the best batsman in the world even though Sachin was playing.

It is subjective but Ponting was something else IMHO.
 
if we watch the highlights of some of the deliveries of Sachin's to take those wickets , no impartial analyser can doubt about his bowling talent.His balls to dismiss Moin Khan & Shane Warne were caliber deliveries.Such deliveries with out a doubt proves that he could have ended with far more no: of wkts(both in tests & one dayers) had he concentrated more on his bowling.But for that, as i earlier said, he needed to compromise on his batting longevity because he didn't posses the body strength & stamina & physical fitness in the long run to concentrate more on his bowling along with maintaining his longevity in batting. Had he compromised on his batting longevity by being selective w.r.t unimportant matches & utilised that effort to improve his bowling skills, i have no doubt in the fact that he could have turned into a batting all rounder, i mean a batting great with the bowl avg: similar to that of some one like Ravi Sastri.If we assume the probablities of that happening,we can see that it is very high.This is because Kumble, India's most successful spinner ever debuted just 4 or 5 months after Sachin debuted.Kumble was so succesful especially in Indian conditions that he just needed any other spinner at the other end to share his workload.For me Sachin could easily have done that role in the place of Raju ,Chauhan etc.But in reality it turned out to be that his towering status as a batsman seems to loom over his moderate bowling
achievements even more than had he been a 'good' to 'very good' calibre batsman.



This post is mired in delusion

Sachin was a part time bowler who bowled to his potential. Anyone claiming otherwise is an insecure ******.

For a team like India which didn't have the greatest bowlers to begin with Sachin would have bowled a lot more and achieved more success with the ball if he was really upto any good

You point to so called magic deliveries which to be honest weren't really magic deliveries as such. But just to hi or you let's assume they were indeed magic deliveries. Even then it doesn't mean he had the requisite skill to be a good bowler on a consistent basis. Infact all it points to is his inconsistency and lack of control over his bowling that he could not reproduce those magic deliveries on a consistent enough basis to be deemed as being valuable for his bowling.

Clarke for eg also bowled some genius spells and brought famed Indian batting lineups to their knees on 2 occasions. However you don't see any one claiming that if he had put more effort on his bowling etc he would have ended up as a much better bowler. Because these were anomalies and one has to accept that. The thing with bowlers like Sachin or Clarke or others in this mould is that they are good change bowlers and help to meander the game along and once in a while they Might contribute with a great spell which you should take with both hands. But at no point should you make the mistake of thinking that this is something you can expect on a regular basis if the said player puts enough effort in training with regards to his bowling
 
Ponting as a batsman was more dangerous, he was merciless against pace. I was always very worried when Pakistan faced Australia and especially when he was batting.

I still remember he once hammered India, Dravid said he was the best batsman in the world even though Sachin was playing.

It is subjective but Ponting was something else IMHO.

Ponting was the best player from 2003-2007. But SRT overshadowed him for twice the period (in 90s and from 2007 - 2011).

A player performing against a team is not the be all and end all.

I have never seen Lara and Ambrose perform against us. I remember Sarwan and Chanders irritating us more.

But that does not mean in a Lara vs Ponting comparison, I would use that as a yardstick cos its a faulty yardstick.

Do entire career comparisons.

I know nobody is changing anybody's opinion in such threads but just thought of posting it for those who may be undecided and are just checking out this thread.
 
Ponting was the best player from 2003-2007. But SRT overshadowed him for twice the period (in 90s and from 2007 - 2011).

A player performing against a team is not the be all and end all.

I have never seen Lara and Ambrose perform against us. I remember Sarwan and Chanders irritating us more.

But that does not mean in a Lara vs Ponting comparison, I would use that as a yardstick cos its a faulty yardstick.

Do entire career comparisons.

I know nobody is changing anybody's opinion in such threads but just thought of posting it for those who may be undecided and are just checking out this thread.


Even career comparisons are not comprehensive all the time. Sure, they probably are the best way to judge but other factors need to be considered such as quality of opposition, conditions etc.

The ability to take a game by the scruff of the next on a consistent basis should be considered.

I just loved the way Ponting batted, his unbelievable reflexes and fearless stroke play.

I'm sure others will associate Sachin and Lara with the same qualities but it's all opinions of course...and what are we without them!
 
Even career comparisons are not comprehensive all the time. Sure, they probably are the best way to judge but other factors need to be considered such as quality of opposition, conditions etc.

The ability to take a game by the scruff of the next on a consistent basis should be considered.

I just loved the way Ponting batted, his unbelievable reflexes and fearless stroke play.

I'm sure others will associate Sachin and Lara with the same qualities but it's all opinions of course...and what are we without them!

I agree Ponting is known MORE for taking the game by the scruff of the neck. Every batsman has a certain way he is looked at and Ponting is looked at in that way.

But career comparisons are different topics. Yes, taking the game by the scruff of the neck does come into play. Only stat boys would exclude such stuff.

In the end, its all about our opinions but to a large extent, objective analysis can be made.
 
Came across this beaut few days back haven't seen it before. .

I think that pretty much says all about how seriously we can take a lot of the folks over here regarding their negative reviews of Sachin. Fact of the matter is 90% of the folks here haven't even witnessed him in his prime and have missed out on the overall experience of knowing Sachin as a batsman. T20 tamasha got late to Sachin as he entered the fag end of his career otherwise people would have seen his T20 beast mode too which he would have taken to ODIs to better everything ABD or Kohli are doing today.

You have to look back and dig up some stats to see what strike rates were like in his era and how his 5-15 run superior SR was pretty phenomenal for the time. It is safe to safe Tendulkar has defined modern day top order ODI batsmanship. While Viv exhibited his break free striking ability to the world, Tendulkar showcased his immense ability to build the perfect inning at the top of the order and take total control of the match. Every upcoming top order ODI batsman basically aspires to do what Sachin mastered and that is what every coach expects from his openers and #3.
 
Came across this beaut few days back haven't seen it before. Thought I post it here.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/current/match/640027.html

MCC v ROW Lord's, Jul 18, 1998






Sachin and Ara with a 177 run partnership chasing 260 odd against McGrath/Donald/Srinath/Kumble. Would have been great watching.
Saw it live and probably one of the better innings of Sachin against a top class bowling attack on a bitterly cold day in London. Champion player and this innings proves why.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk
 
That was the 1998 Sachin.

The Invincible Sachin.

Test matches, he scored (at 80 SR or something).

ODIs, he scored.

Smashed ATG bowlers, he did.

Setting targets he did.

Chasing he did.

Performed in finals, he did.

Single handedly won games for his side, he did.

lol.
 
Ponting as a batsman was more dangerous, he was merciless against pace. I was always very worried when Pakistan faced Australia and especially when he was batting.

I still remember he once hammered India, Dravid said he was the best batsman in the world even though Sachin was playing.

It is subjective but Ponting was something else IMHO.

Have to agree. Once Ponting had survived the initial overs he would seize the opportunity and attack the fast bowlers , while sachin would be just content to maintain his avg and collect his century.
Sachin could rarely be described as "imperious" in his batting , while the word was often used to describe Ponting and Lara and can now perhaps be used to describe Kohli.
Kohli resembles Ponting in that respect .

Sachin was more of an efficient run aggregator.
 
Saw it live and probably one of the better innings of Sachin against a top class bowling attack on a bitterly cold day in London. Champion player and this innings proves why.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

Anwar looked much reassured than Tendulkar against McGrath in this innings and overall.
 
That was the 1998 Sachin.

The Invincible Sachin.

Test matches, he scored (at 80 SR or something).

ODIs, he scored.

Smashed ATG bowlers, he did.

Setting targets he did.

Chasing he did.

Performed in finals, he did.

Single handedly won games for his side, he did.

lol.

Test matches he scored at 80 SR .. are you kidding ?
 
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