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Should India become a Hindu Rashtra?

Well of course thats how authoritarians behave! Telling people what their religion should mean or say!


Just because my choice or preference of cow goes against yours, you will claim i shouldnt kill cow because i dont have to? But i want to! So what now? You will impose your will on me?

There is a term for that you know! Fascism!!

:)) Easy copy out. Cry fascism when you are caught lying about religion, and turning a dietary preference into a religious issue so that you get to play the religion card.


Show me where it says that cow slaughter is a religious obligation. I am not telling you what your religion should mean. I am asking you to bring the proof for your lies. Dont hide behind religion and give it a bad name.
 
I'm just asking if India isn't already one? And what does India want to accomplish by declaring itself as a Hindu nation? India can rename itself but I'm sure people's lives won't be impacted.

You guys are now realizing why Pakistan was created but it's too late for India now. If anything, there can be other separation movements.

Lots of things can be achieved and people's lives can be impacted in many ways if one religion is to be declared the state religion.

What separation movement? Lol. If some people dont like a country doesnot mean they can take their land and go away. No non hindu minority has more than 30 to 35% population in any province of India. Lol separation.
 
:)) Easy copy out. Cry fascism when you are caught lying about religion, and turning a dietary preference into a religious issue so that you get to play the religion card.


Show me where it says that cow slaughter is a religious obligation. I am not telling you what your religion should mean. I am asking you to bring the proof for your lies. Dont hide behind religion and give it a bad name.

So the govt of India is telling Muslims the best you can do is sacrifice camels? When our Prophet believed cows or a share in cow are the second or third options? So what you are saying is the a government shoukd tell or you as CricketCartoon should tell Muslims what they should or should not sacrifice?

Look i onow you are a top class troll and i am just feeding the troll, but even to the devout hindu deep inside you, a religious person, does this not sound appalling at all? If you prefer to pray to Ram but i force you to say you cant have a statue of Ram but you can have any other God in your home because i find it offensive you pray to Ram, how would you behave? I am not saying you cant pray to Vishny or Kalli or any other hindu diety, but you cant pray to Ram because i just dont happen to like that guy?

How much sense would that make to you and you tell me how much authority do i possess as a Muslim to interpret your religion and tell you what you can or cannot do as a Hindu?
 
So the govt of India is telling Muslims the best you can do is sacrifice camels? When our Prophet believed cows or a share in cow are the second or third options? So what you are saying is the a government shoukd tell or you as CricketCartoon should tell Muslims what they should or should not sacrifice?

Look i onow you are a top class troll and i am just feeding the troll, but even to the devout hindu deep inside you, a religious person, does this not sound appalling at all? If you prefer to pray to Ram but i force you to say you cant have a statue of Ram but you can have any other God in your home because i find it offensive you pray to Ram, how would you behave? I am not saying you cant pray to Vishny or Kalli or any other hindu diety, but you cant pray to Ram because i just dont happen to like that guy?

How much sense would that make to you and you tell me how much authority do i possess as a Muslim to interpret your religion and tell you what you can or cannot do as a Hindu?

I am not interpreting your religion for you. I know nothing about your religion. Therefore I want you to show me where does your religion say that cow slaughter is an obligation/fard.

Show me the verse. If you cannot them be brave and accept that it is not an obligation.

Also can you tell me how often did The Prophet (pbuh) used to eat meat, and what is the sunnah for having a meat diet?
 
I am not interpreting your religion for you. I know nothing about your religion. Therefore I want you to show me where does your religion say that cow slaughter is an obligation/fard.

Show me the verse. If you cannot them be brave and accept that it is not an obligation.

Also can you tell me how often did The Prophet (pbuh) used to eat meat, and what is the sunnah for having a meat diet?

What you are saying is akin to me asking you: How can an animal be your God or holy to you? When 90% of the world can eat meat, how come people in your country cant?
But i wont ask you that.. its your belief.

It is clear to me the anti Muslim in you will never concede to my right to religious liberty but at least i can prove to you that you are infringing on my civil liberty by telling me what not to eat, simple as that..
 
What you are saying is akin to me asking you: How can an animal be your God or holy to you? When 90% of the world can eat meat, how come people in your country cant?
But i wont ask you that.. its your belief.

It is clear to me the anti Muslim in you will never concede to my right to religious liberty but at least i can prove to you that you are infringing on my civil liberty by telling me what not to eat, simple as that?

You are wasting time with these analogies because you cannot bring me the proof. You have been caught lying about your religion. No where does your religion say that cow slaughter is a fard.

And The Prophet (pbuh) used to have meat occasionally. The greatest example to follow. But there are many so called muslims who don't follow him and eat meat everyday. Feeding the hungry is Islam. Gluttony and lying is not Islam.
 
The most idiotic thread I have seen on the internet, beta India won't survive without secularism, just try to make India a hindu rashtra, I dare you
 
You are wasting time with these analogies because you cannot bring me the proof. You have been caught lying about your religion. No where does your religion say that cow slaughter is a fard.

And The Prophet (pbuh) used to have meat occasionally. The greatest example to follow. But there are many so called muslims who don't follow him and eat meat everyday. Feeding the hungry is Islam. Gluttony and lying is not Islam.

I really dont know how else to prove to you. How am i lying? The second preferred animal for sacrifice is the cow. If a Muslim doesnt find a camel, what is he supposed to sacrifice? We are fulfilling the sunnah of our prophet PBUH.

Now can you show me a hindu scripture that says you cant kill cow?
Here is an excerpt from a hindu expert:

http://theconversation.com/hinduism...story-with-cows-and-people-who-eat-them-80586

Seems like Hindus are confused about whether they can eat cow or not.

Lets try and stick to the point and not beat around the bush.

Regardless if the religious authenticity which i have proven, India is the infringing upon general civil liberties of its citizens by telling them not to kill cows which are only holy to Hindus and even then its debatable whether they should eat cow meat or not.

Being a troll of the highest order you can continue to scream at the top of your lungs that i am lying.. but deep inside, you know the reality of it all. Stop defending an indefensible position.
 
Lots of things can be achieved and people's lives can be impacted in many ways if one religion is to be declared the state religion.

What separation movement? Lol. If some people dont like a country doesnot mean they can take their land and go away. No non hindu minority has more than 30 to 35% population in any province of India. Lol separation.

What would you envision could be achieved if Hinduism was declared the state religion? Bear in mind that India's biggest cheerleaders in Pakistan are almost to a man virulent opponents of state religion in their own country.
 
Hopefully yes, the BJP has awoken some Indian Muslims and Christians and this would wake the rest
 
Lots of things can be achieved and people's lives can be impacted in many ways if one religion is to be declared the state religion.

What separation movement? Lol. If some people dont like a country doesnot mean they can take their land and go away. No non hindu minority has more than 30 to 35% population in any province of India. Lol separation.

State and religion have to stay separate at all cost, its one thing for which i would defn get on the streets with many in TN or I would support anti-state religion movements monetarily(with as much as i can) that I promise you, this thought process would literally end up dividing India, I agree on Uniform law and that Hindu temples should be given same power as others, or no one should be given power but having a state religion is unacceptable.
 
State and religion have to stay separate at all cost, its one thing for which i would defn get on the streets with many in TN or I would support anti-state religion movements monetarily(with as much as i can) that I promise you, this thought process would literally end up dividing India, I agree on Uniform law and that Hindu temples should be given same power as others, or no one should be given power but having a state religion is unacceptable.

don't mix the separation of state and church with state and religion. Every country where majority follow a religion should have a state religion which is the first among equals ( all religions will be equal, but the majority religion should get the first access and preference).
 
don't mix the separation of state and church with state and religion. Every country where majority follow a religion should have a state religion which is the first among equals ( all religions will be equal, but the majority religion should get the first access and preference).

No State Religion, only state. Dharmik religions boast about spirituality, then let it be spiritual and people who want to find spirituality and peace come find it no need to confuse it with the state.
 
No State Religion, only state. Dharmik religions boast about spirituality, then let it be spiritual and people who want to find spirituality and peace come find it no need to confuse it with the state.

dharmic religions don't boast. they are grounded in humility. the state can only be enriched by the injection of humility and morality which only the dharmic religions can provide.
 
dharmic religions don't boast. they are grounded in humility. the state can only be enriched by the injection of humility and morality which only the dharmic religions can provide.

What could demonstrate humility better than reconstructing the demolished mosque in Aydodhya to show the generosity of the Hindu spirit, sending the message that The Divine is more than a construct of bricks and mortar?
 
What could demonstrate humility better than reconstructing the demolished mosque in Aydodhya to show the generosity of the Hindu spirit, sending the message that The Divine is more than a construct of bricks and mortar?

Humility has meaning only when you are strong. if a beggar shows humility, that is not appreciated. Hindus need to show their strength and greatness before they show their humility.
 
Modi elected again, what are the chances?

Thanks to Jinnah for creating hindu vote bank in North India, Rajiv Gandhi and Congress used it to gain votes during their time and now BJP is using it.
 
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One of the biggest hurdles to the Hindu Rashtra is that Hindus themselves seem unclear as to what it means to be Hindu. Your post is a testament to it if you don't mind me saying it. Everything is measured against what minorities say or do. Muslims have their own personal laws, minorities have their own churches, educational systems and blah, blah etc.

Bhai they have those things because they hold their faiths and customs dear to their hearts. If Hindus did the same, they wouldn't need to look at anyone else to wonder where they are going wrong.
Probably best not to comment about things you don’t know.
There is Seperate personal laws for Hindus, muslims and christians that was the point.
There needs to be a uniform laws for all civilians rather than them all doing their own things.
 
Yes and I kind of wish Modi had the guts to do it but they won't do it.

Modi has no say. The party that won the last state election only won 2 out of 39 seats today because they were allying themselves with Modi. Modi is a villain in South, at least in TN. Modi/Cong or any national party has no say in TN lol. Even Hinduism between south and North is a lot different.
 
Probably best not to comment about things you don’t know.
There is Seperate personal laws for Hindus, muslims and christians that was the point.
There needs to be a uniform laws for all civilians rather than them all doing their own things.

I was commenting on the OP which is whether India should become a Hindu rastra. Unless you are suggesting that the uniform law should be based on Hindu principles, not sure if we are even on the same topic.
 
Yes, I think India should be a Hindu Rastra.

After Independence, India was divided into present-day India and Pakistan on the basis of religious difference. Areas with Muslim majority went with Pakistan and Pakistan became an Islamic country then why not India?

There are many Christian and Islamic countries but not a single Hindu country. Where will Hindu go if mistreated in their own country India?

Though there is not much difference between Secular country & Hindu Rastra but we need India to become Hindu country for below reasons:

1) Today, Hindus are mistreated in their own country because of lack of unity in them.It has become fashion for so called Seculars (in fact Pseudo-Seculars) to mock Hinduism & Hindu deities as they know that Hindus are tolerant & divided (by different caste, cultures, regions and languages) so Hindus will never respond or oppose.

2)Hindus are ignored/discriminated by almost all political parties because Hindus are not Vote-Bank for them as Hindus have lack of unity. So all so called secular politicians have became anti-hindu while appeasing united minorities to get votes.

3) Most media houses of India are owned by Hindu-haters brigade of pseudo-secular politicians so they cover only those news which support their anti-hindu propaganda. Hence Media houses are biased in doing journalism. They are “selective” in criticising the person or political parties or religious organisations.

Because Hindus are secular by default, even though India becomes officially a Hindu country, minorities can still thrive here.

Discuss - Should India become an official 'Hindu Repulic of India'?

what a dumb thought !
 
India never was a true Hindu Rashtra perhaps prior to 300 BC, in fact it's a little known fact that Hinduism was almost wiped out in the reign of Ashoka and Buddhism became the dominant religion, not even through forced conversion but gradually. In fact when a Chinese traveler visited Kancheepuram in the 600s he documented the majority to be Jains and then Buddhists.

I grew up surrounded by Hindus, my mother-tongue is Tamil and "arwi" has a thousand year history not to mention the maritime language of the ancient bay of Bengal was Tamil, we've never had any problems with anyone. Its only when Saudi Arabia started showing its oil clout and spreading their hate that kids now in my village are talking about "us" vs "them".
 
It already is all but in name, keeping a secular veneer helps it perpetuate a false narrative of a democratic and pluralistic society when it clearly isn't one.
 
You cannot have it both ways. You want hindus first policy and then you say rights of minorities.. how do you consolidate the two?

Easy, by eliminating the backward caste system.

Not going to happen given the rampant levels of superior complex in India.
 
Fantastic OP. Completely agree. If that's what the people of India want, then why not?

I do not see any problem with that when Muslims took their lands and created their own countries. Why should not Hindus be allowed to do the same?
 
It already is all but in name, keeping a secular veneer helps it perpetuate a false narrative of a democratic and pluralistic society when it clearly isn't one.
Couldn't have said it better.
They will never have the guts to do it anyway.
 
Fantastic OP. Completely agree. If that's what the people of India want, then why not?

I do not see any problem with that when Muslims took their lands and created their own countries. Why should not Hindus be allowed to do the same?
If that makes you feel better about your country and religion so be it. Glad India’s helping you in that way.
Hindu’s have always been secular, hence why other religions coexisted in India for centuries. When the Zorastrians were being prosecuted in the middle east they turned to India for refuge.

People are just tired of the so secularity in India, who beleieve appeasement of minorities and only critising the majority religion. Some of the wrongs such as casteism, dowry, sati partha etc are bing goten rid off. Which is a good thing.
But you need to be able criticize the wrongs you see in the minority things but these secularists think no we can’t do that.
 
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From Khushwant Singh's book The End of India published in 2003. Something for excitable Hindu BJP fans to think about, though the damage has already been done....

Every fascist regime needs communities and groups it can demonize in order to thrive. it starts with one grour or two. But it never ends there. A movement built on hate can only sustain itself by continually creating fear and strife. Those of us today who feel secured because we are not Muslims or Christians are living in a fool’s paradise. The Sangh is already targeting Leftist historians and Westernized youth. Tomorrow it will turn its hate on women who wear skirts, people who eat meat, drink liquor, watch foreign films, don’t go on annual pilgrimage to temples, use tooth paste instead of Danthmanjan, prefer allopathic doctors to vaids, kiss or shake hands in greeting instead of shouting ‘Jai Sri Ram….’ No one is safe. We must realize this if we hope to keep India alive.
 
From Khushwant Singh's book The End of India published in 2003. Something for excitable Hindu BJP fans to think about, though the damage has already been done....

This quote especially the Jai Shri Ram bit reminds me of:

There's an RSS-run school down the road from where I live. It came up a few years back and is well-stocked in terms of space, facilities and the quality of teachers. The daughter of a maid who works at our place got admission there and it's free for her. But the kid needs to compulsorily stay in the hostel there.

The interesting thing is, the kids are taught to wish each other with a Jai Shri Ram. Even the parents are advised to say the same whenever they drop by and meet their kids.

It's pretty weird not just because of invoking religion at every stage but also because Rama as a cultural or religious figure is irrelevant in the South. We have variants of Krishna, Shiva and Ganesha but never Rama. Funny cuz we would happily celebrate Deepavali and never pause to worship Rama.

Anyway, it's a pretty dreary thought to imagine a whole bunch of kids indoctrinated from hostel days and entering the next gen of India.
 
Should India become a Hindu rastra? First of all, the word, India is incorrectly used for the country that calls itself India.

The word India, refers to the Indus river, which flows through pakistan. Since the time of Alexander, the world India, has been used to describe those regions that are modern day Pakistan.

Pakistan has a greater claim to being India, than India itself.

Show what should the country that incorrectly calls itself India be? it is Bharat or Hindustan.

do I care whether it should be a Hindu Rastra?.

I couldn't give a rat's ****.

This is precisely why Pakistan gained independence, so we could not have to care.
Be whatever you want to be.
 
It's pretty weird not just because of invoking religion at every stage but also because Rama as a cultural or religious figure is irrelevant in the South. We have variants of Krishna, Shiva and Ganesha but never Rama. Funny cuz we would happily celebrate Deepavali and never pause to worship Rama.

Srinivasa Ramanujan. MG Ramachandran. Venki Ramakrishnan. What are the origins of their names?
 
Whether they don’t label it as such, India is actually a Hindu state. Secularism is on the label but the bottle is definitely hinduism first inside.
 
Srinivasa Ramanujan. MG Ramachandran. Venki Ramakrishnan. What are the origins of their names?

Just ask him about the relevance of a city in his state called "Rameswaram"..

Lol. Looks like some ******** guys can't digest that Lord Rama is no longer relevant in the South.

Mr Robbie. I'm not from Tamil Nadu. Are you from the US?

I visited Rameswaram around a year back. Didn't see any sign of Rama in the most famous temple there, the one by the beach. Forget the name. The one with the beautiful pillars. Though they have pulled a horrendous paint job on them. Won't be surprised if the BJP's allies were behind it. It's the kind of aesthetics and demonetization-type move they would make :)

There was one smaller one which was quite cool, elevated one. It had footprints, perhaps symbolizing Lord Ram. But that's about it.

Lord Shiva was worshiped in Rameswaram as far as I could see :(

I m generally saying Hindus are scared people.Even in fights I have seen they don't have guts.
Lol at generalizing. Most people have guts only in groups. Including Muslims.
 
Lol. Looks like some ******** guys can't digest that Lord Rama is no longer relevant in the South.

Mr Robbie. I'm not from Tamil Nadu. Are you from the US?

I visited Rameswaram around a year back. Didn't see any sign of Rama in the most famous temple there, the one by the beach. Forget the name. The one with the beautiful pillars. Though they have pulled a horrendous paint job on them. Won't be surprised if the BJP's allies were behind it. It's the kind of aesthetics and demonetization-type move they would make :)

There was one smaller one which was quite cool, elevated one. It had footprints, perhaps symbolizing Lord Ram. But that's about it.

Lord Shiva was worshiped in Rameswaram as far as I could see :(


Lol at generalizing. Most people have guts only in groups. Including Muslims.

Didnt you say Bjp will lose in karnataka? You cant even get that right and you want to discuss the relevance of Lord Ram?

Do you even know the name of the temple in Rameshwaram?
 
Far from it. In India, the reality is hindus always being treated as 2nd class citizens. Kashmiri Pandits will always remind modern India the plight of hindus in its own country. Only in last 5 years under the current regime, hindus have somewhat found their lost voice but BJP wont be there always. So just that hindus dont get treated unfairly again when new govt/Congress comes into power, its imperative for India to become Hindu nation.

What are your personal experiences of being treated as a second class citizens?
 
Didnt you say Bjp will lose in karnataka

Yes. And what happened. Did they win? :))

Which government is in power in Karnataka?

Do you even know the name of the temple in Rameshwaram?

I googled it, just for you. I don't remember or care to remember these details anymore. The only historical temple's name I can remember is the Shore Temple because it's my favorite and has been since I studied about it in school :)

Ramanathaswamy Temple. That's the one I was talking about. A name like that and yet Lord Shiva is worshiped there :cobra
 
Yes. And what happened. Did they win? :))

Which government is in power in Karnataka?



I googled it, just for you. I don't remember or care to remember these details anymore. The only historical temple's name I can remember is the Shore Temple because it's my favorite and has been since I studied about it in school :)

Ramanathaswamy Temple. That's the one I was talking about. A name like that and yet Lord Shiva is worshiped there :cobra

You predicted this about LS elections and Bjp got a massive mandate in Karnataka in LS.

You may not care. But Hindus do. Rameshwaram is one of the four dhams of vaishnava sect. Hindus know why its called ramanathaswamy. Why it has a shivalinga and yet is one of the holiest shrines of vaishnavas.
 
Lol. Looks like some ******** guys can't digest that Lord Rama is no longer relevant in the South.

Mr Robbie. I'm not from Tamil Nadu. Are you from the US?

I visited Rameswaram around a year back. Didn't see any sign of Rama in the most famous temple there, the one by the beach. Forget the name. The one with the beautiful pillars. Though they have pulled a horrendous paint job on them. Won't be surprised if the BJP's allies were behind it. It's the kind of aesthetics and demonetization-type move they would make :)

There was one smaller one which was quite cool, elevated one. It had footprints, perhaps symbolizing Lord Ram. But that's about it.

Lord Shiva was worshiped in Rameswaram as far as I could see :(


Lol at generalizing. Most people have guts only in groups. Including Muslims.

I know people have guts in groups but from personal experience muslim gujjars don't run away from fight.
 
If you think about the topic or the question posed in the topic of this thread, and the fact it was started by an Indian and on a Pakistani forum, it’s like someone asking posting a question “Should I commit suicide” on a suicide prevention discussion board, where all manner of folks will try to talk you out of it , but deep inside most of them know your mind is made up. LMAO...
 
You predicted this about LS elections and Bjp got a massive mandate in Karnataka in LS.

No I didn't. I thought BJP would lose nationally, not in Karnataka. I got that badly wrong, I know.

Here's what I posted at the time of the state elections.

Even among the Cong, there was a certain acceptance that nationally people would vote for BJP. Locally a different result was expected.

You may not care. But Hindus do. Rameshwaram is one of the four dhams of vaishnava sect. Hindus know why its called ramanathaswamy. Why it has a shivalinga and yet is one of the holiest shrines of vaishnavas.

Yes sir. Even Lord Ram knew who was the real Don in the South :)

Aren't you Bengali? Why are you rallying behind Lord Ram, who doesn't need your support btw.

I'm yet to meet a single Bengali who worships Rama. My neighbor is Bengali and she was verbally lynched at her yoga class by a rabid bunch of BJP fans when she criticized the political emergence of Rama here.
 
No I didn't. I thought BJP would lose nationally, not in Karnataka. I got that badly wrong, I know.

Here's what I posted at the time of the state elections.





Yes sir. Even Lord Ram knew who was the real Don in the South :)

Aren't you Bengali? Why are you rallying behind Lord Ram, who doesn't need your support btw.

I'm yet to meet a single Bengali who worships Rama. My neighbor is Bengali and she was verbally lynched at her yoga class by a rabid bunch of BJP fans when she criticized the political emergence of Rama here.

Lol. Now you are telling me whats important for bengalis.Lol. Stop telling Hindus about their gods. They know better.

Regarding Ramanathaswamy temple, hindus know why its a centre for both Shaiva and Vaishnava sects.
 
Ok. All the best with being a born-again Rama devotee :moyo

Bengal is one of the strongholds of Vaishnavism. If you had known what that means you wouldnot make these comments.

You think its funny to use smileys when talking about religion of others and discuss their gods. It only goes to show your attitude towards others religion. Nothing else.
 
Bengal is one of the strongholds of Vaishnavism. If you had known what that means you wouldnot make these comments.

You think its funny to use smileys when talking about religion of others and discuss their gods. It only goes to show your attitude towards others religion. Nothing else.

Oh, so now we're getting into Vaishnavism and Shaivism. Why don't we bring in Advaita philosophies along the way, though I'm not sure it will suit current agendas. :faf

When I first started losing religion, I was quite militant about it. Experiences have toned me down. Mostly because: while my Dad is practically an atheist, my mother is very religious and my sister and her family, moderately religious. Nowadays I generally try to adopt a 'live and let live' approach.

So, all that being said, if indeed I somewhere offended your religious sensibilities, please accept my apologies.

I stand by the crux of my point though - Lord Rama is not relevant in the South anymore. That said, I'm pro-temple in Ayodhya as I have stated several times here before, as Rama is important to Hindus in the North.
 
If that makes you feel better about your country and religion so be it. Glad India’s helping you in that way.
Hindu’s have always been secular, hence why other religions coexisted in India for centuries. When the Zorastrians were being prosecuted in the middle east they turned to India for refuge.

People are just tired of the so secularity in India, who beleieve appeasement of minorities and only critising the majority religion. Some of the wrongs such as casteism, dowry, sati partha etc are bing goten rid off. Which is a good thing.
But you need to be able criticize the wrongs you see in the minority things but these secularists think no we can’t do that.

I am neither Indian nor Hindu. My opinion is based on the 2 nation theory which Muslims themselves adopted. If all Muslim lands became a Muslim state then according to the same theory, all Hindu lands should become a Hindu state.
 
I actually for one would not mind if that happens.. then I won’t have to put up with pompous Indians smugly talking secularism this and secularism thst and pooh pooing the two nation theory...

I welcome this change and encourage the Muslims in the country to migrate to Kashmir and help us liberate it.
 
Seems like Mamata Bannerjee too doesn't like the political use of Lord Rama by the BJP.

"This is Bangla, not Gujarat" :))

 
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Seems like Mamata Bannerjee too doesn't like the political use of Lord Rama by the BJP.

"This is Bangla, not Gujarat" :))


Mamata is a true Bangali at heart. She even named West Bengal as, “Bangla” in Bengali. These trolls are most likely outsiders non-bengalis or even some bengalis from Modis gangs. I like Mamata Didi. She knows most the Bengalis in Bengal are hindified, hindj media has brainwashed them, they’re forgetting their bengali culture.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">They (government) seem to be in a tearing hurry to implement the 'Hindu Rashtra' agenda: Former FM <a href="https://twitter.com/PChidambaram_IN?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@PChidambaram_IN</a> on <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CitizenshipAmendmentBill?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#CitizenshipAmendmentBill</a><br>Watch <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/6PMPrime?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#6PMPrime</a> LIVE, with <a href="https://twitter.com/sardesairajdeep?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@sardesairajdeep</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/Rahulshrivstv?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Rahulshrivstv</a>: <a href="https://t.co/4fqxBWbTYl">https://t.co/4fqxBWbTYl</a><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CitizenshipWar?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#CitizenshipWar</a> <a href="https://t.co/exAkVs4HnR">pic.twitter.com/exAkVs4HnR</a></p>— India Today (@IndiaToday) <a href="https://twitter.com/IndiaToday/status/1205468657951883264?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 13, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Just joking (sorry mig)
Its not anything to do with us Pakistanis, so who cares?
Just give the kashmiris their azadi and then we can build a giant wall between india and pakistan - trump style!
 
BJP bakths and RSS and other "Pro-Hindu" groups can all go jump in a crocodile lake. We don't want them there. Clearly see the IQ of a BJP ****** vs rest of the Indians ?

I also hate the fact that these borons claim to represent India lol. All these Gujartis thinking they represent the whole of India can sit down lol.
 
As Modi heads to Ayodhya for Ram temple, fears of a Hindu India

Ayodhya, India - For the past week, Indian authorities have been vigorously engaged in giving Ayodhya, a small temple town in the northern state of Uttar Pradesh, a quick makeover in advance of Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to lay the foundation stone for a temple to Hindu deity Ram.

The temple is being built in place of a Mughal-era mosque, which was demolished by a right-wing Hindu mob in 1992, triggering nationwide religious riots in which more than 2,000 people, most of them Muslims, were killed.

India’s governing Hindu nationalist Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) rose to national prominence on the back of the temple movement launched in the 1980s.

Hindus believe the 16th-century Babri Masjid, named after Mughal emperor Babur (1483-1530), was built at the place where Ram was born in Ayodhya, located about 135km (84 miles) east of the state capital, Lucknow.

Last December, a decades-old protracted legal battle between the Hindu and Muslim parties ended with the Supreme Court awarding the contested site to Hindu petitioners, handing the BJP a victory to drive home its Hindu nationalist agenda.

The court asked the government to provide Muslims land at a “prominent site” within Ayodhya city limits to build a mosque.

India’s secular ethos compromised

With the inauguration of the temple scheduled for August 5 despite concerns due to the coronavirus, Modi’s BJP appears to have fulfilled a long-term promise to its core electorate.

The judgement was widely criticised for lacking a sound legal basis as well as signalling a majoritarian push that compromised on India’s secular and democratic constitutional ethics.

Ironically, the legal trial in the Babri demolition case is yet to be completed, and justice has eluded those who suffered the loss of life and properties in the nationwide violence that ensued in the wake of the destruction of the mosque - often dubbed the darkest chapter of modern India.

Modi’s government has faced both domestic and global criticism for deliberately neglecting its vast Muslim minority, numbering nearly 200 million. The Ayodhya verdict has only cemented this opinion among its opponents and critics.

The date chosen for the ceremony also coincides with the first anniversary of the abrogation of the special status of Indian-administered Kashmir, India’s only Muslim majority region that has been the theatre of a bloody armed rebellion for more than 30 years.

This aggressive posturing over issues that have dominated the BJP’s politics has raised concerns of Ayodhya-like campaigns in other places with shared Hindu-Muslim heritage and history as well.

MR Shamshad, a lawyer who represented Muslim parties in the temple-mosque legal dispute, says “already there are efforts by Hindu groups to ‘reclaim’ other temples that they believe were converted into mosques”.

Supremacy of Hindus

The Vishwa Hindu Parishad, an affiliate of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh (RSS), the parent body of the BJP, has led the movement for the Ram temple since 1984.

The trust formed to oversee the construction of the temple is composed mainly of functionaries from the VHP and the RSS, which has propounded supremacy of Hindus in India.

At the moment though, the VHP has refrained from taking a clear stand on whether similar campaigns will be launched in the future.

“Right now, we are focussed on building a grand Ram temple after 500 years of struggle. Once that is over, our religious leaders and seers will decide what to do about other such places,” VHP’s regional spokesman Sharad Sharma told Al Jazeera.

Hindu population is happy

In Ayodhya, a town with a rich and diverse history, the majority Hindu population is happy the Ram temple is being constructed.

Shravan Das, a 76-year-old ascetic, says, “Now there would be a flood of development and prosperity. Millions of Hindus will come to worship here and that will be good for everyone here.”

Sitting across him, KK Nigam, who owns a shoe shop along the main road of the town, is not so certain about his future because as part of the massive infrastructure development plans, both his house and shop are at the risk of demolition for a four-lane expressway.

“I welcome the temple but the government should not destroy our lives for the sake of development. At least 2,000 people will be displaced and their livelihoods ruined if the government goes ahead with its plans,” he says, tearing up.

At Makhapur, one of the many villages that surround Ayodhya, there is an air of indifference to the hectic preparations going on in the main town.

Bhagelu Maurya, a vegetable vendor, says, “Even if the temple is built I don’t think it will affect my life. Let it get built first, we have seen promises earlier also about development but nothing happened.”

Exodus of Muslim families

A small but significant part of the town’s businesses relies on Muslim craftsmen, milk vendors and flower sellers among others.

But since the 1990s, there has been an exodus of Muslim families owing to a threat of violence in the sleepy but sensitive town by the Sarayu River.

On the day the Babri mosque was demolished, at least 24 Muslims were killed and scores of houses belonging to the community were torched, triggering the exodus that further reduced their population in Ayodhya.

Today, those who survive here are like Abid Khan who makes wooden sandals, mostly for the large number of Hindu ascetics and monks who live here.

“I have a Hindu worker who helps me, things in the town are still peaceful. But the fact is we don’t know whom to trust because we have been betrayed earlier in 1992,” says Khan.

“More than five generations of my family have lived here but with the cries for creating a Hindu India growing louder, I don’t know how long we can last here.”

His business is also going to be disrupted by the development plans but as Muslims elsewhere in India today, Khan’s concerns are more fundamental.

At a popular bangle store, the father-son duo of Haji Salim and Abdul Kalim are more circumspect but voice similar concerns. “It would have been much better if the court’s judgement was even-handed,” Kalim told Al Jazeera.

“For years now, Muslims have not bought any land in this town. In fact, they have only been selling it and leaving. If things don’t change, we too would have to decide about our future.”

Harmonious co-existence

Ironically, a fact that is not talked about enough under the BJP rule is that most of Ayodhya’s temples are built on lands donated by Muslim rulers in the 18th and 19th centuries.

The town’s scores of mosques, tombs, mausoleums and graveyards are mute testaments to its rich Islamic history and is a symbol of harmonious co-existence between Hindus and Muslims.

There has been a marked absence of Islamic places of worship in the nearly $300m development plan for the town.

Anil Singh, an Ayodhya-based writer, sees this as part of the Hindu right wing’s scheme to obliterate the town’s syncretic past. “Go a little deeper into Ayodhya and you see so much of Hindu-Muslim heritage,” he says.

“Hindus here worship at Sufi shrines like that of Badi Bua who is considered to be the town’s patron saint. But, you won’t hear about her tomb in the government’s plans.”

The neglect of Muslims is palpable in the village where the provincial BJP government has allotted land for the mosque under the Supreme Court’s verdict.

While the local administration has left no stone unturned to ensure the foundation stone of Ram temple is laid even during a pandemic, it has not shown the same vigour to kick-start the construction of the new mosque. A veritable gloom pervades Dhannipur village.

A few residents who spoke to Al Jazeera expressed displeasure that the government had not consulted them before deciding to allocate land for the mosque in their village.

“We don’t want any trouble here and the Supreme Court asked the mosque to be built on land inside Ayodhya, not here which is about 20km from there,” Mohammad Zubair told Al Jazeera.

Over the last few years, an unprecedented sense of alienation and fear has gripped India’s minorities, particularly the Muslims.

“The BJP has been reorganising the Indian polity as an authoritarian Hindu nationalist state. Politically, three events - the Ayodhya verdict, revocation of Kashmir’s special status and statehood, and the Citizenship Amendment Act - challenged the core foundations of the Indian republic,” political scientist Zoya Hasan told Al Jazeera.

“The ceremony in Ayodhya openly involving state machinery is a sobering moment, marking the dismantling of the original republic and a signpost of the commencement of a new republic.”

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020...temple-fears-hindu-india-200804073755889.html
 
Is there some special significance of the date to Hindus?

Why wasn’t the date picked which wasn’t in the middle of Corona virus?
 
The article talks about an exodus of Muslim families from Ayodhya, but where do these people go? Bangladesh? I suppose in the short term they could move to different cities, but the same process is probably likely to happen there once the temple building finally gets the go ahead.
 
The article talks about an exodus of Muslim families from Ayodhya, but where do these people go? Bangladesh? I suppose in the short term they could move to different cities, but the same process is probably likely to happen there once the temple building finally gets the go ahead.

A proud day for me as a majoritarian supporter who believes minorities can be happy if only they know their place.
 
A proud day for me as a majoritarian supporter who believes minorities can be happy if only they know their place.

Well that was the point I was raising. Where exactly is their place? I exodus from Ayodhya can be repeated city by city, then it must be a very shrinking piece of land.
 
Well that was the point I was raising. Where exactly is their place? I exodus from Ayodhya can be repeated city by city, then it must be a very shrinking piece of land.

In Ayodhya, muslims were given 5 acres of land out of good will. They can be given these 5 acres in any city where they feel their space is shrinking. But they should also act like minorities and don't claim entire India.
 
In Ayodhya, muslims were given 5 acres of land out of good will. They can be given these 5 acres in any city where they feel their space is shrinking. But they should also act like minorities and don't claim entire India.

Is that what Indian Muslims are doing, claiming entire India? I had no idea, in that case they are very naughty boys and do indeed need to be put in their place ( wherever that may be).
 
Is that what Indian Muslims are doing, claiming entire India? I had no idea, in that case they are very naughty boys and do indeed need to be put in their place ( wherever that may be).

The muslims from Aligarh (which started the pakistan movement) still sing the song by majaz lakhnavi...yeh mera chaman, yeh mera chaman, main apne chaman ka bulbul hoon.
 
The muslims from Aligarh (which started the pakistan movement) still sing the song by majaz lakhnavi...yeh mera chaman, yeh mera chaman, main apne chaman ka bulbul hoon.

These people should be lauded for their vision of a united and greater India, if only internet Indians could show the same expansive vision. Even on here no PP Indian will admit to dreams of Hindu rashtra, and if you will claim to do so, it is only lordship of India-lite, one which would be carved up further with Partition 2.0.
 
Sanatan Dharma was India's only identity in ancient times. But as history suggests, India has been subjected to religious imperialism for years - by Mughals, Ghajhni and Ghoris, Christian Pastors etc.

Since we are all breaking 'Shackles of Slavery' and some cricketer turned politicians praising it, should India follow it too and declare India a hindu rastra?

Or the expectation still is -

Afghanistan will be ruled by Sharia.

Pakistan will be an Islamic country.

But India has to be remain secular?
 
Sanatan Dharma was India's only identity in ancient times. But as history suggests, India has been subjected to religious imperialism for years - by Mughals, Ghajhni and Ghoris, Christian Pastors etc.

Since we are all breaking 'Shackles of Slavery' and some cricketer turned politicians praising it, should India follow it too and declare India a hindu rastra?

Or the expectation still is -

Afghanistan will be ruled by Sharia.

Pakistan will be an Islamic country.

But India has to be remain secular?

India is already a hindutva state or there about. It should declare it officially and put an end to hypocrisy. But I doubt India will do it. A state guided by the wisdom of Chanakya will seldom take the straight path. Thats for us simpletons.
 
I've tried lurking around hindutva groups in social media to understand what they really wanted. And the common theme running in their conversations was that the muslims of British India got to create a country for their own religion while the hindus had to settle for a secular state and that Islam is the state religion for Pakistan while Hinduism doesn't enjoy the same privilege in India with hindus having to adjust for a state without state religion. They fear that Hinduism will gradually become obsolete like Christianity in many western countries or Zoroastrianism in Iran or Confucianism or Shintoism in China and Japan.

What the hindu right fails to understand though is that countries progress as societies only when they shed notions of tribalism, particularly based on religion. A society can become progress and become egalitarian only when it treats every human being equally and doesn't discriminate on based on his or her personal beliefs. Western societies realised this and they soon progressed rapidly as they emerged from the dark ages of religious conflicts in Europe. The next region to develop similarly was south east asia when countries like Japan, South Korea and more recently China have developed rapidly in the recent past and they aren't religious societies either. Coincidentally it is also true that the least progressed societies/countries in the world are also the most religious ones. It is not necessary that everyone should become atheist or agnostic. But the least that a state should do is to not let religion dictate the affairs of a state and view every individual of the state with the same lens.

I dream of a day when the state no longer sees individuals as hindus or muslims or christians but as Indians alone period. If we cannot progress faster as a nation, the best thing we could do is to have a look at how the successful nations have developed and copy their model. But no, Pakistan and Afghanistan are religious societies and so we have to emulate them so that we don't lose out in the ideological war between Hinduism and Islam! India is never going to catch up with China and it's purely because they are caught up in a silly hindu-muslim ideological war and are not coming out of that bubble. Instead of looking towards the west, India should look towards the countries on the east which have progressed rapidly over the past decades in spite of starting out in similar or even worse state to India when it started out. China didn't fall prey to this silly ideological war of religions and they instead concentrated solely on improving the lives of their people and they've managed to do it rapidly.

If India has progressed relatively better than Pakistan over the recent years, it's because it didn't let religion dictate the affairs of their state as much as Pakistan did ever since their independence. But it's being undone with the rise of religious tribalism/nationalism in the country which is setting the country back. What the hindu right doesn't understand is that in their bid to compete hard in the ideological race with Pakistan, they're not realising that they're falling behind as a nation in the race with other advanced countries ahead of them including its biggest rival China.
 
Sanatan Dharma was India's only identity in ancient times. But as history suggests, India has been subjected to religious imperialism for years - by Mughals, Ghajhni and Ghoris, Christian Pastors etc.

Since we are all breaking 'Shackles of Slavery' and some cricketer turned politicians praising it, should India follow it too and declare India a hindu rastra?

Or the expectation still is -

Afghanistan will be ruled by Sharia.

Pakistan will be an Islamic country.

But India has to be remain secular?

What will the Sikhs in India say about that? Is it fine for them?
 
Are there no Sikhs in Pakistan? Is it not fine for them there?

Lol are you serious? Over 80 % of the sikhs live in India so you can’t compare this. Secondly, please answer my question, will the sikhs in India accept this?
 
Nope. Secularism is considered to be a basic feature of the Indian Constitution as stated by the SC on numerous occasions. Dont think it can be amended
 
These fundamentalists want brutal caste system back in place, so they can have a field day just like the good old days. They are itching for power and control.
 
Sanatan Dharma was India's only identity in ancient times. But as history suggests, India has been subjected to religious imperialism for years - by Mughals, Ghajhni and Ghoris, Christian Pastors etc.

Since we are all breaking 'Shackles of Slavery' and some cricketer turned politicians praising it, should India follow it too and declare India a hindu rastra?

Or the expectation still is -

Afghanistan will be ruled by Sharia.

Pakistan will be an Islamic country.

But India has to be remain secular?

Inshallah india becomes a Hindu rashtra officially.

Pakistanis are totally fine with it too so I don’t get your line of questioning. What one would want is for that to be official that’s it
 
I've tried lurking around hindutva groups in social media to understand what they really wanted. And the common theme running in their conversations was that the muslims of British India got to create a country for their own religion while the hindus had to settle for a secular state and that Islam is the state religion for Pakistan while Hinduism doesn't enjoy the same privilege in India with hindus having to adjust for a state without state religion. They fear that Hinduism will gradually become obsolete like Christianity in many western countries or Zoroastrianism in Iran or Confucianism or Shintoism in China and Japan.

What the hindu right fails to understand though is that countries progress as societies only when they shed notions of tribalism, particularly based on religion. A society can become progress and become egalitarian only when it treats every human being equally and doesn't discriminate on based on his or her personal beliefs. Western societies realised this and they soon progressed rapidly as they emerged from the dark ages of religious conflicts in Europe. The next region to develop similarly was south east asia when countries like Japan, South Korea and more recently China have developed rapidly in the recent past and they aren't religious societies either. Coincidentally it is also true that the least progressed societies/countries in the world are also the most religious ones. It is not necessary that everyone should become atheist or agnostic. But the least that a state should do is to not let religion dictate the affairs of a state and view every individual of the state with the same lens.

I dream of a day when the state no longer sees individuals as hindus or muslims or christians but as Indians alone period. If we cannot progress faster as a nation, the best thing we could do is to have a look at how the successful nations have developed and copy their model. But no, Pakistan and Afghanistan are religious societies and so we have to emulate them so that we don't lose out in the ideological war between Hinduism and Islam! India is never going to catch up with China and it's purely because they are caught up in a silly hindu-muslim ideological war and are not coming out of that bubble. Instead of looking towards the west, India should look towards the countries on the east which have progressed rapidly over the past decades in spite of starting out in similar or even worse state to India when it started out. China didn't fall prey to this silly ideological war of religions and they instead concentrated solely on improving the lives of their people and they've managed to do it rapidly.

If India has progressed relatively better than Pakistan over the recent years, it's because it didn't let religion dictate the affairs of their state as much as Pakistan did ever since their independence. But it's being undone with the rise of religious tribalism/nationalism in the country which is setting the country back. What the hindu right doesn't understand is that in their bid to compete hard in the ideological race with Pakistan, they're not realising that they're falling behind as a nation in the race with other advanced countries ahead of them including its biggest rival China.

Wrong. Many nations with dominant religious ideologies have flourished throughout history. Israel is a recent example.
 
Lol are you serious? Over 80 % of the sikhs live in India so you can’t compare this. Secondly, please answer my question, will the sikhs in India accept this?

Close to 80 per cent of India is hindu.

Sikhs are 2 percent.

Can you name a few countries with such a huge Majority of muslims but is not a islamic country?


There are Islamic countries, Christian countries and Buddhist countries and even a jewish country in this world. Did you ask them if they asked the religious minority before declaring their state religion?
 
These fundamentalists want brutal caste system back in place, so they can have a field day just like the good old days. They are itching for power and control.

Dont talk rubbish.

There is a difference between wanting a state religion, which many countries in the world have and demanding a caste system which is like apartheid.
 
I've tried lurking around hindutva groups in social media to understand what they really wanted. And the common theme running in their conversations was that the muslims of British India got to create a country for their own religion while the hindus had to settle for a secular state and that Islam is the state religion for Pakistan while Hinduism doesn't enjoy the same privilege in India with hindus having to adjust for a state without state religion. They fear that Hinduism will gradually become obsolete like Christianity in many western countries or Zoroastrianism in Iran or Confucianism or Shintoism in China and Japan.

What the hindu right fails to understand though is that countries progress as societies only when they shed notions of tribalism, particularly based on religion. A society can become progress and become egalitarian only when it treats every human being equally and doesn't discriminate on based on his or her personal beliefs. Western societies realised this and they soon progressed rapidly as they emerged from the dark ages of religious conflicts in Europe. The next region to develop similarly was south east asia when countries like Japan, South Korea and more recently China have developed rapidly in the recent past and they aren't religious societies either. Coincidentally it is also true that the least progressed societies/countries in the world are also the most religious ones. It is not necessary that everyone should become atheist or agnostic. But the least that a state should do is to not let religion dictate the affairs of a state and view every individual of the state with the same lens.

I dream of a day when the state no longer sees individuals as hindus or muslims or christians but as Indians alone period. If we cannot progress faster as a nation, the best thing we could do is to have a look at how the successful nations have developed and copy their model. But no, Pakistan and Afghanistan are religious societies and so we have to emulate them so that we don't lose out in the ideological war between Hinduism and Islam! India is never going to catch up with China and it's purely because they are caught up in a silly hindu-muslim ideological war and are not coming out of that bubble. Instead of looking towards the west, India should look towards the countries on the east which have progressed rapidly over the past decades in spite of starting out in similar or even worse state to India when it started out. China didn't fall prey to this silly ideological war of religions and they instead concentrated solely on improving the lives of their people and they've managed to do it rapidly.

If India has progressed relatively better than Pakistan over the recent years, it's because it didn't let religion dictate the affairs of their state as much as Pakistan did ever since their independence. But it's being undone with the rise of religious tribalism/nationalism in the country which is setting the country back. What the hindu right doesn't understand is that in their bid to compete hard in the ideological race with Pakistan, they're not realising that they're falling behind as a nation in the race with other advanced countries ahead of them including its biggest rival China.

Should i list the countries in Europe that have Christianity as the state religion or a similar arrangement?
 
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