Should Pakistan go with pure green pitches or spinning mine-fields in the last 2 Tests vs Australia?

[Savak]

Need to get rid of this fear of failure and losing especially when thinking about their pace attack of Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins. Australian batsmen themselves are no world beaters when it comes to juicy green wickets or spinning minefields. Pakistani bowling attack needs 20 wickets to win.

Pakistan in the UAE beat Australia due to spin and reverse swing in 2014, 2018 and in England in 2010 on a green wicket. On a flat wicket both teams are even

 

[Gilly]

Need to get rid of this fear of failure and losing especially when thinking about their pace attack of Starc, Hazelwood, Cummins. Australian batsmen themselves are no world beaters when it comes to juicy green wickets or spinning minefields. Pakistani bowling attack needs 20 wickets to win.

Pakistan in the UAE beat Australia due to spin and reverse swing in 2014, 2018 and in England in 2010 on a green wicket. On a flat wicket both teams are even

Do you consider Australian wickets flat?.

 

[Dr Khan]

Good exciting cricket should be the goal. Graveyard pitches like the one in Pindi are embarrassing. Prepare a supporting tracking, back your strength and good things will happen

 

[Varun]

Good exciting cricket should be the goal. Graveyard pitches like the one in Pindi are embarrassing. Prepare a supporting tracking, back your strength and good things will happen

To put a positive spin on it - after a few nights sleep I'm thinking to myself that if you told Pakistani fans of the 2010s that they would be back playing cricket at home again with Australia of all teams being the first Western nation to tour for a 3-match series, but the first pitch would be a pancake - they would still have taken it with both hands.

Make the next 2 decks a contest and this will be forgotten.

 

[HappyWarsFan]

Make the pitch like the one vs SA

 

[offstump]

They need to go with a green top, like Karachi 2006 Vs India. We will have Hasan back plus Shaheen and Naseem. It would be a good contest.

 

[CricVet]

I saw the pitch of the first test and never lost one bit of sleep in North America. The result came out as expected. It is exactly these UAE (or perhaps even worse) kind of pitches that give a bad name to test cricket.

I would love to see a GREEN WICKET which generates excitement. I do not care if we lose.

 

[CricVet]

Do you consider Australian wickets flat?.

Of course they are flat. The difference is in bounce. The drop-in pitches of AU are not even close to how the pitches used to be in AU.

 

[moghul]

On a supporting wicket every runs counts . If Azhar makes 50 plus score on a lively "normal" wicket and not a road, I would be convinced he deserved to be kept for another few more months in Pak playing 11.

Green top is not possible in Karachi, but supporting wicket can be made.

 

[Gilly]

Of course they are flat. The difference is in bounce. The drop-in pitches of AU are not even close to how the pitches used to be in AU.

Australian wickets are flat and Savak said that Pak and Aus are even on flat wickets.

 

[Ashmal]

Australian wickets are flat and Savak said that Pak and Aus are even on flat wickets.

This Pindi pitch is flat.

So you think it resembles an Aussie wicket

 

[Gilly]

This Pindi pitch is flat.

So you think it resembles an Aussie wicket

So this pitch is flat.

Are Australian pitches flat?.

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

Flat with low bounce means both teams are same. This what [MENTION=2501]Savak[/MENTION] meant

 

[Colorblind Genius]

Day 5 of the first test is in progress and I assume pitch in the second test won’t be a lot different.

So, I want Pak to bat all 90 overs on day 5 today and squeeze every drop of juice off of Aussie bowlers - get them injury prone - make them tired - put them to test - and practice your own batting to study n analyze the Aussie bowlers, their tactics n their weaknesses.

This should help you go in the second test with more confidence.

You can then make the sane kinda pitch (which you gonna do anyway) and see if it helps get a result?

 

[shamaan]

Day 5 of the first test is in progress and I assume pitch in the second test won’t be a lot different.

So, I want Pak to bat all 90 overs on day 5 today and squeeze every drop of juice off of Aussie bowlers - get them injury prone - make them tired - put them to test - and practice your own batting to study n analyze the Aussie bowlers, their tactics n their weaknesses.

This should help you go in the second test with more confidence.

You can then make the sane kinda pitch (which you gonna do anyway) and see if it helps get a result?

I think both captains played it smartly first with Australia their seemers only bowled 1 spell on day 5 and Pakistan didn't bowl in 5th day so both attacks will be relatively fresh even thou Pakistan will most likely make 1 or 2 changes.

 

[shamaan]

Pakistan should definitely go with a spinning pitch

 

[Colorblind Genius]

I think both captains played it smartly first with Australia their seemers only bowled 1 spell on day 5 and Pakistan didn't bowl in 5th day so both attacks will be relatively fresh even thou Pakistan will most likely make 1 or 2 changes.

Yep, Aussies played very smart not to fall for it and tried to bowl their heart out in order to dismiss Pakistan in 50 overs and then try to win the game. They knew that the pitch was not worth the effort.

Pakistan tried though, and that's good enough for now.

 

[sweep_shot]

I think spin track makes sense. Pakistan can probably win 2-0 if they produce spin tracks.

 

[shamaan]

Yep, Aussies played very smart not to fall for it and tried to bowl their heart out in order to dismiss Pakistan in 50 overs and then try to win the game. They knew that the pitch was not worth the effort.

Pakistan tried though, and that's good enough for now.

Exactly but hopefully pitch is better for the next two tests

 

[Zaz]

Why does it have to be a green or spinning

Pakistan needs a fair pitch Theyve never done well when the pitch is extreme one way or another and anyway you dont get either in pakistan like india or england

The best pitches in pakistan are sporting pitchs which provide avge scores of 280 and good batters and bowlers get rewards equally

 

[Saj]

Why resort to a green top or rank turner.

Why not prepare a sporting pitch which doesn't play into Aussie hands.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

Day 5 of the first test is in progress and I assume pitch in the second test won’t be a lot different.

So, I want Pak to bat all 90 overs on day 5 today and squeeze every drop of juice off of Aussie bowlers - get them injury prone - make them tired - put them to test - and practice your own batting to study n analyze the Aussie bowlers, their tactics n their weaknesses.

This should help you go in the second test with more confidence.

You can then make the sane kinda pitch (which you gonna do anyway) and see if it helps get a result?

One can say your wish was granted

Anyways, Pak should make a sporting balanced pitch.

 

[hitthestump]

Surely this isn't hard to figure out?

Australia's bowling is stronger in pace and weaker in spin. Pakistan's is weaker in pace and stronger in spin.

Get Shadab into the squad for the 2nd test, have him replace Chacha at 7 and prepare a dry pitch which turns from day 3 onwards.

Pakistan surely would be huge favourites in such a scenario.

 

[ethan hunt]

Pakistan have put unnecessary pressure on themselves by producing this absolutely horrendous wicket . They would have beaten Australia comfortable on a normal spin track . Now my only concern is that they might produce a lottery pitch after all the backlash. Unnecessary pressure

 

[moghul]

They cannot make a green top in Karachi, pace and movement will not last beyond first hour. PCB should produce a true wicket which would take some turn but not the low quality wickets they make in India . Australian pace attack is far better than Pakistan and their spinners are also have an edge over Pakistan . Pakistan will lose the series 0-1, I think.

 

[Savak]

They cannot make a green top in Karachi, pace and movement will not last beyond first hour. PCB should produce a true wicket which would take some turn but not the low quality wickets they make in India . Australian pace attack is far better than Pakistan and their spinners are also have an edge over Pakistan . Pakistan will lose the series 0-1, I think.

What are you smoking. Our spinners outbowled their 400 plus wicket Lyon. Our pacers outbowled their celebrated pace attack as well who are only good in Australia

 

[moghul]

What are you smoking. Our spinners outbowled their 400 plus wicket Lyon. Our pacers outbowled their celebrated pace attack as well who are only good in Australia

I really admire your patriotism. Watch what happens in coming tests.

 

[Kraetoz]

They cannot make a green top in Karachi, pace and movement will not last beyond first hour. PCB should produce a true wicket which would take some turn but not the low quality wickets they make in India . Australian pace attack is far better than Pakistan and their spinners are also have an edge over Pakistan . Pakistan will lose the series 0-1, I think.

How does their spinners have an edge over Pakistan? Of all the nations he has played against, Nathan Lyon averages the worst against Pakistan. He averages 52 with the ball against Pakistan in 10 tests, the sample size isn't small either. Generally spinners don't trouble Pakistan in tests at all, unless if they are Srilankans in Srilanka on a rank turner.

 

[Fahdi]

Stick to the normal sporting wicket like we had for the SA series. They are what suit us best.

 

[gazza619]

Pakistan curators dont know how to prepare spinning wickets.

 

[PakLFC]

We need a result orientated track instead of one where every batter is scoring a century. Spin or pace friendly produce something that gives the bowlers an even chance even it it gives the Aussies a better chance of victory. Groundsmen need to get a grip of themselves instead of boring the viewer to tears what that dross!

 

[princeuk]

I do get the feeling that the next 2 tracks will produce a result, i think more spin friendly rather than pace. Preferably a little something for everyone.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Why resort to a green top or rank turner.

Why not prepare a sporting pitch which doesn't play into Aussie hands.

We need pitches like he we had for SA series which offered reverse swing and turn later in match.

 

[Babeikh]

We need pitches like he we had for SA series which offered reverse swing and turn later in match.

Exactly

Why does it have to be either a green minefield or a square turner? Just do what we did for the South Africa series. Balanced pitches that offer something for everyone.

 

[shamaan]

Exactly

Why does it have to be either a green minefield or a square turner? Just do what we did for the South Africa series. Balanced pitches that offer something for everyone.

Becouse when you go Australia what kind of pitches do we get ?

 

[Babeikh]

Becouse when you go Australia what kind of pitches do we get ?

This series is in Pakistan

 

[sali]

Its a big dilemma that they dont have quality spinners (no Yasir!) and they dont trust their batters against Aus pacers. I would go with seamer friendly pitch and play Shawn Masood at no 2 or 3 in place of Iftikhar. Our bowling unit will be Haris Rauf, Shahen Afridi, Hasan Ali and Nueman. May be fawad Alam can also do some stop bowling.

 

[wrongun]

Of course they are flat. The difference is in bounce. The drop-in pitches of AU are not even close to how the pitches used to be in AU.

They've actually carried out major changes to the drop ins in the last few years and you'll notice they aren't flat anymore.

Completely changed the way they prep them, the depth of the soil bed, grass cover etc.

 

[Colorblind Genius]

They've actually carried out major changes to the drop ins in the last few years and you'll notice they aren't flat anymore.

Completely changed the way they prep them, the depth of the soil bed, grass cover etc.

Depth of soil, and the prep method may have little to no impact.

The major impact is the contents of the soil.
Bouncy and fast paced tracks have soil with higher ratio of hard mineral in powdered form.

We will need to analyze the contents of soil samples taken from sporting tracks from all over the world and see what can we edit to upgrade our own soil/clay contents, and prepare good pitches?

Another way is to do a trial n error method in a controlled environment where we can add a certain amount of powdered form of hard elements like marble or limestone etc in the clay, and the amount of leaving grass, and moisture on the pitch, should also be thrown into the equation, till we hit that magic ratio, that is safe yet produces lively wickets.

 

[shamaan]

This series is in Pakistan

I no that the series is in Pakistan and that's why we should create spinning pitches when Pakistan tour Australia the pitches have plenty of pace and bounce becouse it suites them !

 

[ChTab]

Pitches for SA series were great, PCB should replicate those pitches for remaining matches.

 

[Bewal Express]

The only problem with spinning pitches is that they have a guy with 400 wickets and our guys are very average. The only problem with green seamers is that they have 3 guys who are amongst the best to play in recent times. We play best on flat wickets with little bit in it for the bowlers. Just a little more grass early on and more deterioration on the 4th and 5th day is our ideal wicket, basically Pindi plus

 

[Babeikh]

I no that the series is in Pakistan and that's why we should create spinning pitches when Pakistan tour Australia the pitches have plenty of pace and bounce becouse it suites them !

So? What is your point? You are not making any sense mate.

The choice is not green top vs dust bowl. There is a lot in between those kinds of pitches that we can do. Look at the pitches we had for the South Africa series - that is what we need.

 

[Thanos]

Pakistan have put unnecessary pressure on themselves by producing this absolutely horrendous wicket . They would have beaten Australia comfortable on a normal spin track . Now my only concern is that they might produce a lottery pitch after all the backlash. Unnecessary pressure

I second your thoughts. Unnecessary pressure on Pakistan due to first test to prepare better pitch. Pakistan need to trust their spinners and prepare a spin track. SENA players play under lot of pressure when they see a spin track in India, BD or SL. Pakistan needs to exploit the same.

 

[Cricfan4eva]

Dry pitch leaves a lot to toss, side batting first has massive advantage.

But if Pak prepare a turner, not a dustbowl mind you but a turner that aides spin from day 1, they should fancy themselves to win even if they lose the toss.

 

[shamaan]

So? What is your point? You are not making any sense mate.

The choice is not green top vs dust bowl. There is a lot in between those kinds of pitches that we can do. Look at the pitches we had for the South Africa series - that is what we need.

Why does it have to be either a green minefield or a square turner? Just do what we did for the South Africa series. Balanced pitches that offer something for everyone.

You said the above.i am saying when you go to New Zealand it 100 percent helps thier seemers as that's thier strength.Even in India what kind of pitches do they create Dust bowls majority of the time!.

The choice for Pakistan is reverse swing and Dustbowls make it 100 percent favourable to the home side !.

 

[CricVet]

Why Green wicket is being taken as green carpet by some fans. Even in NZ, they hardly make the green mambas anymore. All the boards know that to maximize the earnings, they would need a wicket lasting full five days. When fans demand for green wicket, all they are asking for a wicket that does not have craters as in Ind or barren as in UAE. A wicket that has something something for everyone; A wickets that holds true for first 3 days and then turn - this adds balance.

 

[MenInG]

Pitch report for Karachi on Day 1

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[MenInG]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">yeah to pindi se b slow pitch hai&#55357;&#56883;&#55357;&#56883;&#55357;&#56883;.</p>— Mohammad Amir (@iamamirofficial) <a href="https://twitter.com/iamamirofficial/status/1502553718419607557?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 12, 2022</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[asifp]

Shame on Ramiz and shame on PCB for their timid and defensive mindset. You want crowds snd people, need s result oriented pitch

 

[Kianig89]

Players like Hafeez and Amir are only sounding like sore apples they forgot how they were humiliated on green tops of Joburg and Cape Town, Brisbane and Sydney not to mention they piled on runs for most of their career on the phattas of Emirates

 

[PakLFC]

I would much rather prefer Pak lose an exciting series on greener tracks then draw on flat track boring wickets. Ideally the wicket should have something for both batsmen and bowlers.

 

[Grunge101]

Irrespective of what Amir or Hafiz's motivations might be, the point they're making stands.
Utterly disappointed to see the crap PCB has come up with on this tour. They're basically saying a 0-0 draw is the best possible result we can aim for and were going to go ahead and make sure we get that.
I have no idea how a neutral cricket fan is supposed to sit down and tolerate this farce for than 15 mins. Even the highlights package turns drab.

 

[Smudger]

Irrespective of what Amir or Hafiz's motivations might be, the point they're making stands.
Utterly disappointed to see the crap PCB has come up with on this tour. They're basically saying a 0-0 draw is the best possible result we can aim for and were going to go ahead and make sure we get that.
I have no idea how a neutral cricket fan is supposed to sit down and tolerate this farce for than 15 mins. Even the highlights package turns drab.

Dont worry this pitch will take turn and Pakistan will lose comfortably

 

[Manunited18]

Any decent wicket has to have decent amount of bounce, doesn't have to be a green mamba.

 

[Xoib]

In making a pitch neutralizes aus pacers Pakistan has neutralise its biggest weapon Shaheen and are opening these two garbage spinners will win this game

 

[Varun]

What on earth?

Another expressway.

Fool me once...

 

[Zaz]

The curators are totally neutralising our spinners this series

At least add some break to the wkt for the spinners if your not gonna add any pace

 

[Kianig89]

One should prepare pitches according to resources curator was wise enough that he gauged the level of our bowlers henceforth flat wickets to negate Aussie attack

 

[Zaz]

One should prepare pitches according to resources curator was wise enough that he gauged the level of our bowlers henceforth flat wickets to negate Aussie attack

They should be looking to accentuate our bowlers strengths not negate the aussie attack

These are very strange tactics by the board n curators totally nullifying our attack

 

[asifp]

Awful to watch on tv, why would anyone want to watch this torture live. Shame on PCb

 

[shamaan]

Has this tour been the worst in terms of pitches so far ?

 

[Cric_lover4487]

Has this tour been the worst in terms of pitches so far ?

Ind tour to Pak 2006 was also similar.

 

[shamaan]

Ind tour to Pak 2006 was also similar.

But you can imagine that becouse India had 2 world class spinners.

This attack of Australia is okay they have a good Spinner and that's about it in terms of spinners.

 

[Buffet]

But you can imagine that becouse India had 2 world class spinners.

This attack of Australia is okay they have a good Spinner and that's about it in terms of spinners.

+1

It is a dumb idea to make a pitch where your entire home attack becomes useless.

 

[shamaan]

+1

It is a dumb idea to make a pitch where your entire home attack becomes useless.

I agree these pitches should have had some turn and some reverse.

 

[shah_1]

No trust at all on Shaheen and Hasan who were part of ICC team of the year. These two were the backbone of the team in the last year.

 

[Cric_lover4487]

I agree these pitches should have had some turn and some reverse.

I feel Karachi pitch will turn after 3 days. Hot weather and no dew at all. Cracks will open.

 

[Buffet]

But you can imagine that becouse India had 2 world class spinners.

This attack of Australia is okay they have a good Spinner and that's about it in terms of spinners.

Pakistan has a history of producing total roads and sometimes it's not much to do with opposition bowling being better.

1989 series against India. Pakistan had Wasim, Waqar, Qadir & IK. India was a vastly inferior team compared to Pakistan in the 80s/early 90s.

4 tests series with the result of 0-0 and it was due to pitch.

Priority was to avoid loss first.

 

[Buffet]

I agree these pitches should have had some turn and some reverse.

I think this pitch has some movement. It may move more with time. The first pitch was really horrible. Lyon is a good spinner, but Pakistan should bank on coming ahead with the pitch taking some turns.

 

[James]

This new pitch isn’t definitively as bad as ‘Pindi (yet) but the early signs in Karachi have not been good.

 

[shamaan]

I think this pitch has some movement. It may move more with time. The first pitch was really horrible. Lyon is a good spinner, but Pakistan should bank on coming ahead with the pitch taking some turns.

If thier was movement it was only Minimal and only lasted for about 8 overs.I don't think we will see more swing than what we have seen.

Pakistan need to make sure they get level with Australia or get a lead.

 

[Buffet]

If thier was movement it was only Minimal and only lasted for about 8 overs.I don't think we will see more swing than what we have seen.

Pakistan need to make sure they get level with Australia or get a lead.

I did not see the entire day, but I recall seeing some reverse as well. Also, the pitch may take some turns in the last few days. The last pitch was dead even on 5th day.

 

[Savak]

Reverse swing is useless if you cannot reverse the ball both ways. One dimensional reverse swing is not a problem for quality batsmen.

 

[Maher96]

 

[moghul]

View attachment 115270

Thanks for sharing our agony , professor .

 

[Bilal Ahmad15]

View attachment 115270

Well Done Professor, very intelligent

 

[shamaan]

I did not see the entire day, but I recall seeing some reverse as well. Also, the pitch may take some turns in the last few days. The last pitch was dead even on 5th day.

Same to be honest I just heard the commentators state that thier was reverse I didn't watch all of it.i think thier will be turn on day 4/5 but proberly manageable spin.

 

[CricVet]

View attachment 115270

The same so called professor who thrived on such shams. This culture of producing roads has resulted these fake glorified batsmen who most of the time crumbled under a slightest pressure on a good sporting wicket.

 

[silentkiller187]

Used to finish the match in two to three days in our time’ Javed Miandad

KARACHI: Pakistan’s former Test captain Javed Miandad lashed out at the performance of the Pakistan Cricket Team, also recalled his playing days, said that we used to finish the game within two to three days in our time.

Javed, while talking to the media, during a local event, said Pakistan used to win within two to three days on the spinning wickets.

“We used to dominate in our home grounds by making spin wickets. When I was playing, we have also finished Tests in two three days,” he said.

Javed further stated that he believes Pakistan should win at home.

“Pakistan made pitches according to their strength. Now, I think they need to win here because if they lose at home, they will lose everywhere in the world,” he said.

“400, 500 runs are normal in Test cricket. You are playing for Pakistan so you have to soak the pressure and show the intent,” he added.

Javed then went on to comment about the pitches of Pakistan and said the pitches here do not support fast bowling.

“Spin pitches can be made in Pakistan, the soil here is not suitable for fast pitches,” he said.

“Lahore’s pitch is a little fast, but not as fast as they are made in different parts of the world,” he added.

Pakistan’s batting great then furthered expressed his desire that the ongoing second Test between Pakistan and Australia here, concludes a result.

It is pertinent to mention here that Australia set Pakistan a massive target of 506, while Pakistan have managed to score 94 for the loss of two wickets in 44 overs.