Steve Waugh - Best of all Test batsmen overseas?

[Harsh Thakor]

Steve Waugh was not an epitome of elegance or perfect technique personified but when the chips were down he was the ultimate man to retrieve a sinking ship.He may not have dissected an attack in the manner of a Viv or Lara but morally could often be more the scourge in the eyes of opponents.To ressurect a team from the grave from the depths of despair to attain heights of glory .He made many a big score on bad wicket like at Trinidad in 1995 when he was unbeaten and at Delhi in 1996.His imperious style of batting resembled the charge of a military commander .Steve' s batting blended the mental tenacity of a soldier with the craft of an engineer.No batsmen won the battle more in the mind than Steve.Steve faced great bowlers like Wasim,Ambrose and Donald overseas as well as Murlitharan.I would club him with batsmen like Ian Chappell, Alan Border,Javed Miandad ,Jacques Kallis and Rahul Dravid.

He had a remarkable test average of 55.85 overseas.Steve was particularly prolific in the West Indies where he averaged above 68 and in England where he averaged above 74.In South Africa he averaged just above 50 which is remarkable considering the conditions prevailing there.He was also ever consistent on the sub-continent averaging above 48 in India and above 39 in Pakistan.In England,South Africa and West Indies Waugh overshadowed Border statistically.


Alan Border may have faced better bowlers but it was Steve who turned the course or won games more.In many ways although a super batsmen Border was the man to champion a losing cause.Border's best overseas series performances were mainly in losing causes like the 1981 and 1985 Ashes,the 1984 series in West Indies ,1980 series in Pakistan etc.Morally Steve pioneered the Australian ressurection in test cricket in the 1989 Ashes in England when averaging above 90 to enable his team to triumph by a 4-1 margin .Although overall averaging around 41 in South Africa he averaged 78.25 in South Africa in 1997 to win his team the unofficial test championship.In West Indies in 1995 he not only topped the averages but enabled Australia to clinch the unofficial world championship crown who became the 1st team to beat the Calypsos on their own soil since Ian Chapell led Australia did in 1973.



Rahul Dravid although had a similar record but did not succeed against equal calibre of bowling as Waugh did.Greg Chappell was right up there but not as successful in England and did not play in India and South Africa.

STEVE WAUGH OVERSEAS TEST BATTING RECORD-


away 1986-2003 76 116 25 5083 200 55.85 10642 47.76 16 20 11 579 11



in England 1989-2001 22 32 10 1633 177* 74.22 3085 52.93 7 4 2 192 1 view innings
in India 1986-2001 9 15 4 521 110 47.36 1325 39.32 1 2 1 59 2 view innings
in New Zealand 1986-2000 10 17 2 529 151* 35.26 1152 45.92 1 3 2 67 1 view innings
in Pakistan 1988-1998 8 13 1 498 157 41.50 1023 48.68 1 3 3 56 1 view innings
in South Africa 1994-2002 9 14 2 603 160 50.25 1413 42.67 1 4 2 83 0 view innings
in Sri Lanka 1999-2002 4 5 0 83 31 16.60 211 39.33 0 0 1 7 1 view innings
in U.A.E. 2002-2002 2 2 1 103 103* 103.00 192 53.64 1 0 1 13 2 view innings
in West Indies 1991-2003 14 21 5 1096 200 68.50 2140 51.21 4 4 1 99 6 view innings
in Zimbabwe 1999-1999 1 1 1 151 151* - 351 43.01 1 0 0 18 0 view innings

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Steve Waugh got huge support from his bowlers though, which is needed to win games (Warne, Mcgrath and Gillespie). Allan Border only had an aging Dennis Lillee for 5 years who was a great test bowler.

Personally I would still choose Border, a batsman can't win test all by himself no matter how good he is. Waugh and Tendulkar are pretty close however

 

[Harsh Thakor]

Steve Waugh got huge support from his bowlers though, which is needed to win games (Warne, Mcgrath and Gillespie). Allan Border only had an aging Dennis Lillee for 5 years who was a great test bowler.

Personally I would still choose Border, a batsman can't win test all by himself no matter how good he is. Waugh and Tendulkar are pretty close however

Is not Sunil Gavaskar right up there?Staggerings statistics outside in India averaging more.that too against the best bowling.Adding WSC supertsest even Greg Chappell is close and arguably even the great Viv Richards.Where do you rank Dravid here?

 

[zizour]

Steve Waugh was not an epitome of elegance or perfect technique personified but when the chips were down he was the ultimate man to retrieve a sinking ship.He may not have dissected an attack in the manner of a Viv or Lara but morally could often be more the scourge in the eyes of opponents.To ressurect a team from the grave from the depths of despair to attain heights of glory .He made many a big score on bad wicket like at Trinidad in 1995 when he was unbeaten and at Delhi in 1996.His imperious style of batting resembled the charge of a military commander .Steve' s batting blended the mental tenacity of a soldier with the craft of an engineer.No batsmen won the battle more in the mind than Steve.Steve faced great bowlers like Wasim,Ambrose and Donald overseas as well as Murlitharan.I would club him with batsmen like Ian Chappell, Alan Border,Javed Miandad ,Jacques Kallis and Rahul Dravid.

He had a remarkable test average of 55.85 overseas.Steve was particularly prolific in the West Indies where he averaged above 68 and in England where he averaged above 74.In South Africa he averaged just above 50 which is remarkable considering the conditions prevailing there.He was also ever consistent on the sub-continent averaging above 48 in India and above 39 in Pakistan.In England,South Africa and West Indies Waugh overshadowed Border statistically.


Alan Border may have faced better bowlers but it was Steve who turned the course or won games more.In many ways although a super batsmen Border was the man to champion a losing cause.Border's best overseas series performances were mainly in losing causes like the 1981 and 1985 Ashes,the 1984 series in West Indies ,1980 series in Pakistan etc.Morally Steve pioneered the Australian ressurection in test cricket in the 1989 Ashes in England when averaging above 90 to enable his team to triumph by a 4-1 margin .Although overall averaging around 41 in South Africa he averaged 78.25 in South Africa in 1997 to win his team the unofficial test championship.In West Indies in 1995 he not only topped the averages but enabled Australia to clinch the unofficial world championship crown who became the 1st team to beat the Calypsos on their own soil since Ian Chapell led Australia did in 1973.



Rahul Dravid although had a similar record but did not succeed against equal calibre of bowling as Waugh did.Greg Chappell was right up there but not as successful in England and did not play in India and South Africa.

STEVE WAUGH OVERSEAS TEST BATTING RECORD-


away 1986-2003 76 116 25 5083 200 55.85 10642 47.76 16 20 11 579 11



in England 1989-2001 22 32 10 1633 177* 74.22 3085 52.93 7 4 2 192 1 view innings
in India 1986-2001 9 15 4 521 110 47.36 1325 39.32 1 2 1 59 2 view innings
in New Zealand 1986-2000 10 17 2 529 151* 35.26 1152 45.92 1 3 2 67 1 view innings
in Pakistan 1988-1998 8 13 1 498 157 41.50 1023 48.68 1 3 3 56 1 view innings
in South Africa 1994-2002 9 14 2 603 160 50.25 1413 42.67 1 4 2 83 0 view innings
in Sri Lanka 1999-2002 4 5 0 83 31 16.60 211 39.33 0 0 1 7 1 view innings
in U.A.E. 2002-2002 2 2 1 103 103* 103.00 192 53.64 1 0 1 13 2 view innings
in West Indies 1991-2003 14 21 5 1096 200 68.50 2140 51.21 4 4 1 99 6 view innings
in Zimbabwe 1999-1999 1 1 1 151 151* - 351 43.01 1 0 0 18 0 view innings

I am sorry- Dravid should not even be in consideration. Man went absent when facing tough bowlers on tough tracks majority of the time.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Is not Sunil Gavaskar right up there?Staggerings statistics outside in India averaging more.that too against the best bowling.Adding WSC supertsest even Greg Chappell is close and arguably even the great Viv Richards.Where do you rank Dravid here?

Gavaskar is also right up there, especially due to his stats against WI which is insane. I wouldn't mind if somebody swaps Border for Gavaskar tbh.

Dravid unfortunately doesn't make the cut imo, he was terrible in South Africa, and not too good in Sri Lanka from decently large sample size. Viv surprisingly only has stellar record in England only, in comparison to other countries. He has decent everywhere else but not as good as in England.

Chappel unfortunately doesn't make the cut as well, he has played far few away matches (over 60% of the matches he played were at home). His sample size isn't large enough.

I rate Border, Gavaskar and Tendulkar on the same level, the others just a level below.

 

[Rishta Aunty]

I find this obsessive nitpicking to find flaws with the stats of ATG's really weird. No top cricketer would doubt Dravid's chops away from home just based on his averages. I was watching the TV and they brought up his 148 from eons ago in SA, and it was easily one of the best innings I've seen on a spicy wicket.

Same thing for Younus too. Yes he could have done better in certain countries, but that doesn't diminish his overall standing because he's made up for it in other places.

 

[Ab Fan]

Border for me.

 

[madhusudansarkar]

Dravid was weak against bounce, which explains his poor record in South Africa and Australia. True, he played some stellar innings in this two countries but he was often found wanting against them. He not only had a poor strike rate against these great bowling attacks but also a flattering average. He was often enamoured by his own technique and went into a shell when facing bowlers in these countries. But his record in Sri Lanka is a but hard to explain,one may attribute it to poor form on those tours though he was the weakest player of spin in the Fab 5. Despite all this facts, he is still an ATG batsman but just a rung below the likes of SRT, Pointing and Lara.

PS:- He was fabulous on his last tour to England where the rest of the Indian batsman struggled. One of the few instances where he dominated against a great bowling attack.

 

[Rishta Aunty]

Dravid was weak against bounce, which explains his poor record in South Africa and Australia. True, he played some stellar innings in this two countries but he was often found wanting against them. He not only had a poor strike rate against these great bowling attacks but also a flattering average. He was often enamoured by his own technique and went into a shell when facing bowlers in these countries. But his record in Sri Lanka is a but hard to explain,one may attribute it to poor form on those tours though he was the weakest player of spin in the Fab 5. Despite all this facts, he is still an ATG batsman but just a rung below the likes of SRT, Pointing and Lara.

PS:- He was fabulous on his last tour to England where the rest of the Indian batsman struggled. One of the few instances where he dominated against a great bowling attack.

Dravid averages 45 in SA in ODI's. His supposed weakness against bounce is a bit overrated here. Also Ponting as I pointed out somewhere else has a 11 point difference between his home and away averages. I don't know how he's magically given a free pass.