'Taj Mahal is a blot on Indian history' - BJP MLA Sangeet Som

[KingKhanWC]

BJP leader Sangeet Som has triggered controversy by saying the Taj Mahal is a "blot" on Indian culture and misquoted history by saying that Shah Jahan, builder of the 17th century marble mausoleum, had jailed his father and wanted to wipe out Hindus from the country.

The remarks by the Sardhana MLA in Meerut came after the Uttar Pradesh government removed the Taj Mahal from the list of attractions in its tourism booklet.

"Many people were disappointed that the Taj Mahal was removed from the UP tourism booklet. What history are we talking about? Whose history?

"The creator of the Taj Mahal (Shah Jahan) imprisoned his father. He wanted to wipe out all Hindus from India. If these people are part of our history, then it is very unfortunate.

"I guarantee you that we will change this history," Som was shown saying in an undated viral video, apparently addressing a public gathering.

TV reports said the BJP leader was addressing a gathering in Meerut.

Som wrongly quoted history saying Mughal Emperor Shah Jahan had jailed his father. It was Shah Jahan's son Aurangzeb who had dethroned and jailed his father inside the Agra Fort.

The Taj, one of the Seven Wonders of the World and a UNESCO World Heritage site, was built by Shah Jahan in memory of his beloved wife Mumtaz Mahal.

http://www.thenewsminute.com/article/taj-mahal-blot-indian-history-bjp-mla-sangeet-som-70067

I thought even the hardliners wouldnt criticse the Taj Mahal. A beatiful building which is world famous and attracts millions to India. For the UP government to actually remove it from its tourism booklet is very shocking.

I hope to visit this great building one day, when a more liberal government comes into power.
[MENTION=76058]cricketjoshila[/MENTION] Please tell me you dont agree with this politician and what is Modi's view on the Taj?

 

[troodon]

Diversion from the real issues plaguing Uttar Pradesh.

Throw the biscuit and let the dogs fight.


[MENTION=43583]KingKhanWC[/MENTION], I heard people who visited that place complain that the surrounding areas are really dirty. Pollution has also taken a toll on the building.

 

[Black Zero]

Correct statement but not for the reasons he stated.

 

[Hitman]

Nonsensical controversy. Can't believe this has turned into an issue.

 

[www787]

Only hardline Hindu will be satisfied with this statement, unnecessary controversy for no other reason but to pleased narrow minded individuals.

 

[Black Zero]

Only hardline Hindu will be satisfied with this statement, unnecessary controversy for no other reason but to pleased narrow minded individuals.

I am satisfied with this and I am not a hard line hindu.

 

[Hornbill]

ANI UP ✔ @ANINewsUP
It does not matter who built it and for what reason; it was built by blood and sweat of Indian labourers: UP CM Yogi Adityanath #TajMahal pic.twitter.com/KSFU56KIRz

Never thought I will agree with something he says

 

[CricketCartoons]

ANI UP ✔ @ANINewsUP
It does not matter who built it and for what reason; it was built by blood and sweat of Indian labourers: UP CM Yogi Adityanath #TajMahal pic.twitter.com/KSFU56KIRz

Never thought I will agree with something he says

Of course..otherwise why couldn't the barbarians make great monuments in the places they came from. It was because of the indian artisans..anyway taj mahal is a mediocre monument, not even 1% of ellora caves, and won't mind if all that marble was removed and used for pavements.

 

[Varun]

The Taj is a fantastic site to visit.

This is the area of the BJP where they completely lose the plot.

 

[Varun]

Thankfully sense prevails:

BJP snubs Som, Yogi asks him to explain Taj remark

AGRA: Uttar Pradesh chief minister Yogi Adityanath has sought an explanation from BJP MLA Sangeet Som on his controversial statement on the Taj Mahal.

Top sources in the BJP confirmed that the MLA has been asked to explain the reason for making the statement that caused a huge row and embarrassment for the party. Sources also claimed that the chief minister has decided to visit the 17th century architectural marvel during his proposed visit to the city on Oct 26 in order to put the controversy to rest.

When contacted, BJP state spokesperson Chandra Mohan said that the party does not agree with the Sardhana MLA's remarks. He said Som's views on Taj are "completely his own". "Our party is doing a lot for development of tourism in Agra and we are making schemes for the same," he said.

Meanwhile, the chairman of the Uttar Pradesh Shia Waqf Board on Tuesday jumped into the controversy surrounding the Taj Mahal, saying that the monument cannot be a symbol of "worship". He also alleged that "most Mughals were aiyaash (dissolute)".

"The Taj Mahal can be a symbol of love but not of worship. Apart from one or two, most Mughals were 'aiyaash'. Muslims don't consider them idols," chairman Syed Waseem Rizvi said.

On Monday, Som had questioned why the monument, which was built by a Mughal emperor "who tried to wipe out Hindus", is considered part of India's culture and history, and threatened to "change that history".

The BJP MLA's comments had attracted strong criticism from various quarters, including from AIMIM's Asaduddin Owaisi, who demanded to know if PM Modi will "stop hoisting Tiranga" from the Red Fort, since it was also built by "traitors".

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...o-explain-taj-remark/articleshow/61125019.cms

Anyway, at the end of the day who cares? The Taj has been here since the 1600s and will continue to be here for decades to come. Mountain out of a molehill.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Don't advocate razing it to the ground like taliban did with bamiyaan buddha..but this waste of marble should be converted to a school or hospital for better use.

 

[Madplayer]

I am satisfied with this and I am not a hard line hindu.

Taj Mahal has provided employment to countless people in India. Both, Direct and indirect employment. And also benifitted satellite attractions at other places in India by being a massive pull factor.

I couldnt care less about what the person who made the Taj was like some 500 years ago if it is feeding my poor today. The Abstract doesnt bring food to table. Ask the Indian travel agents and tour operators about it and they will explain it to you.

You have create a good image of Taj over the decades, marketed it as the symbol of love, it was one of the 7 wonders of the world and the world was in awe of it. You milked money from it for decades and now suddenly because of vote bank politics you are going to throw all that away?

This is a pathetic approach by the present government and if it creates a negative image of Taj in the world, its only the poor who will suffer.

If the exclusion of Taj from promotion campaigns is done to give other places of attraction a chance, then its understandable. If it is done out of spite and to present it as a remnant of the legacy of Evil muslim invaders, it will be of no benifit.

 

[TM Riddle]

[MENTION=136588]CricketCartoons[/MENTION] Sangit Som lol.
Our brothers losing plot as always.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

The Taj is a fantastic site to visit.

This is the area of the BJP where they completely lose the plot.

I think you are aiming a veiled criticism at India's public who voted for the BJP for the very reasons you are now complaining about. BJP has a proud history of reviving Hindu culture, and the monuments left behind by the Moghul conquerors have certainly been a sore point for many aggrieved Indians who don't follow Islam.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Sangeet Som in his own personal views may not like it.Its his opinion.There are many who think that there are other structures in India which are much older and are better.

As long as the govt doesnot endorse it, its fine.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I think you are aiming a veiled criticism at India's public who voted for the BJP for the very reasons you are now complaining about. BJP has a proud history of reviving Hindu culture, and the monuments left behind by the Moghul conquerors have certainly been a sore point for many aggrieved Indians who don't follow Islam.

I am free to dislike any monument.Thats personal freedom.Issue will only arise if govt makes it a policy, which they havent.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I am free to dislike any monument.Thats personal freedom.Issue will only arise if govt makes it a policy, which they havent.

Agreed, although I am not sure what that has to do with my post which was addressing Varun's statement that the BJP has lost the plot.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Agreed, although I am not sure what that has to do with my post which was addressing Varun's statement that the BJP has lost the plot.

That BJP is trying to revive Hindu culture etc etc.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

That BJP is trying to revive Hindu culture etc etc.

That is what it is widely known for across the world. I don't know why it should be a bone of contention.

 

[cricketjoshila]

That is what it is widely known for across the world. I don't know why it should be a bone of contention.

Please quote the proper sources.Let me be enlightened as well.

 

[Varun]

I think you are aiming a veiled criticism at India's public who voted for the BJP for the very reasons you are now complaining about.

Let's just say that the Indian public would be subject to full-frontal critique from yours truly if they decided to give the bumbling Manmohan Singh a third term.

Beyond that, I'm sure everyone who voted for the BJP over the last few years were fully aware of the party's tendencies in this direction, but as long as it remains talk - what's the biggie? Nothing is going to change the Taj Mahal now anyway.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Let's just say that the Indian public would be subject to full-frontal critique from yours truly if they decided to give the bumbling Manmohan Singh a third term.

Beyond that, I'm sure everyone who voted for the BJP over the last few years were fully aware of the party's tendencies in this direction, but as long as it remains talk - what's the biggie? Nothing is going to change the Taj Mahal now anyway.

Our friends here may not be used to constitutional supremacy so i dont blame them. May be they believe that whosoever comes to power can do anything he wants(may be personal experience of their's)and that he is a all powerful dictator.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Please quote the proper sources.Let me be enlightened as well.

There are sources all over the web, it's another topic altogether. Do you want me to start a new thread, as once again, I have no intention of derailing this one?

 

[Varun]

Our friends here may not be used to constitutional supremacy so i dont blame them. May be they believe that whosoever comes to power can do anything he wants(may be personal experience of their's)and that he is a all powerful dictator.

That, and they believe that most of India voted one of the two legitimate national parties into power just because they wanted Muslims killed. Every other thread sees them drone on and on, drives me up the wall. And I didn't even vote for anybody.

It's needless insecurity and a continuation of the constant victim mentality. There are other variables which go into elections, local and global: the economy for starters, and then civic issues, and foreign policy.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Taj Mahal has provided employment to countless people in India. Both, Direct and indirect employment. And also benifitted satellite attractions at other places in India by being a massive pull factor.

I couldnt care less about what the person who made the Taj was like some 500 years ago if it is feeding my poor today. The Abstract doesnt bring food to table. Ask the Indian travel agents and tour operators about it and they will explain it to you.

You have create a good image of Taj over the decades, marketed it as the symbol of love, it was one of the 7 wonders of the world and the world was in awe of it. You milked money from it for decades and now suddenly because of vote bank politics you are going to throw all that away?

This is a pathetic approach by the present government and if it creates a negative image of Taj in the world, its only the poor who will suffer.

If the exclusion of Taj from promotion campaigns is done to give other places of attraction a chance, then its understandable. If it is done out of spite and to present it as a remnant of the legacy of Evil muslim invaders, it will be of no benifit.

Oh please take your sanctimonious claptrap elsewhere. We milked money from it? It was the congress who glorified this ugly monstrosity of a structure, standing on the bloods of innocent. When was it in the 7 wonders? Another lie by anti nationals..who wanted hindus to be self hating and feeling inferior by making them think no hindu monument is worthy of respect and this ugly structure is superior piece of architecture. We hindus could carve 10 times more excuisite temples from a single rock mountain..don't believe me? go and see ellora caves.

And if these barbarians who ruled us were so cultured why couldnt they erect monuments in the countries of their origin. They only knew to erect makbaras and tombs..no universities, because jahil don't know the value of education..only know to waste money.

And even if it brings some tourism, it cant be at the cost of our pride.. that is like having a bamiyan buddha in the very heart of afghanistan, which the taliban had to remove, as it had no place there. We need to stop glorifying these waste of space and promote our own..which are suffering due to neglect. Only in India does the hindu culture gets relegated to the dustbin, and the barbarian mughals are glorified as cultured and refined. I am so bloody happy that i never visited this ghatiya beghairat building, even though my father in law was overseeing its maintenance as he is civil engineer, and invited me ki damaad babu aap aayiye aapko shahanshah se rubara karate hain.

 

[cricketjoshila]

That, and they believe that most of India voted one of the two legitimate national parties into power just because they wanted Muslims killed. Every other thread sees them drone on and on, drives me up the wall. And I didn't even vote for anybody.

It's needless insecurity and a continuation of the constant victim mentality. There are other variables which go into elections, local and global: the economy for starters, and then civic issues, and foreign policy.

For some religion may be the start and end of all.Since Pakistan was created on a religious basis and a certain propoganda and narative is pushed there about India, the views dont surprise me. What surprises me is their massive interest in what Indians do in their country.

 

[Chrish]

“Castles themselves committed no crime”

- Sansa Stark

 

[Madplayer]

Oh please take your sanctimonious claptrap elsewhere. We milked money from it? It was the congress who glorified this ugly monstrosity of a structure, standing on the bloods of innocent.

Indians elected congress into power all those years so it was the decision of Indians to glorify Taj. Quite rightly if it profited the poor.

When was it in the 7 wonders? Another lie by anti nationals..who wanted hindus to be self hating and feeling inferior by making them think no hindu monument is worthy of respect and this ugly structure is superior piece of architecture. We hindus could carve 10 times more excuisite temples from a single rock mountain..don't believe me? go and see ellora caves.

http://www.thehindu.com/features/kids/Epitome-of-love/article14424002.ece

The rest of this portion got me confused whether it is a serious post of sarcastic

And if these barbarians who ruled us were so cultured why couldnt they erect monuments in the countries of their origin. They only knew to erect makbaras and tombs..no universities, because jahil don't know the value of education..only know to waste money.

What has this got to do with the topic at hand? Lol

And even if it brings some tourism, it cant be at the cost of our pride.. that is like having a bamiyan buddha in the very heart of afghanistan, which the taliban had to remove, as it had no place there.

Glad to know Taliban is your standard now. And lol at pride. Would you feed your pride to the hungry?

We need to stop glorifying these waste of space and promote our own..which are suffering due to neglect. Only in India does the hindu culture gets relegated to the dustbin, and the barbarian mughals are glorified as cultured and refined. I am so bloody happy that i never visited this ghatiya beghairat building, even though my father in law was overseeing its maintenance as he is civil engineer, and invited me ki damaad babu aap aayiye aapko shahanshah se rubara karate hain.

) hahahahahahahahaha goodness gracious me. I havent laughed so hard in a long long time.

 

[pillionrider]

I don't know the reasons given for removing Taj Mahal from the UP tourism booklet, and I couldn't be bothered. It's renowned enough to not require appearance in a booklet. In any case, most of those government booklets are pathetic and so outdated, it's ridiculous.

However, having been to the Taj and plenty of other places around India (mostly South), I can confidently say there are places that fill you with as much, and in my case, more wonder than the Taj Mahal.

It has long been baffling why the Taj was singled out as this work of magnificence that towers above anything else in India. It has also been annoying to see some Muslims in India and abroad claim the Taj as a religious work that they've lent the rest of the world and how we should all be grateful to a religion for giving us this wonder that is soooo far ahead of anything.

Indians have had scant respect for our own heritage and it's only because the Taj has had international attention for years, that governments have made some efforts to maintain it. The fate of other beauties around the country is depressing when you visit them.

 

[JoniInsafian]

Oh please take your sanctimonious claptrap elsewhere. We milked money from it? It was the congress who glorified this ugly monstrosity of a structure, standing on the bloods of innocent. When was it in the 7 wonders? Another lie by anti nationals..who wanted hindus to be self hating and feeling inferior by making them think no hindu monument is worthy of respect and this ugly structure is superior piece of architecture. We hindus could carve 10 times more excuisite temples from a single rock mountain..don't believe me? go and see ellora caves.

And if these barbarians who ruled us were so cultured why couldnt they erect monuments in the countries of their origin. They only knew to erect makbaras and tombs..no universities, because jahil don't know the value of education..only know to waste money.

And even if it brings some tourism, it cant be at the cost of our pride.. that is like having a bamiyan buddha in the very heart of afghanistan, which the taliban had to remove, as it had no place there. We need to stop glorifying these waste of space and promote our own..which are suffering due to neglect. Only in India does the hindu culture gets relegated to the dustbin, and the barbarian mughals are glorified as cultured and refined. I am so bloody happy that i never visited this ghatiya beghairat building, even though my father in law was overseeing its maintenance as he is civil engineer, and invited me ki damaad babu aap aayiye aapko shahanshah se rubara karate hain.

If you hate it so much, Pakistan will take it... We'll even pay for work and transport

 

[Lonewarrior]

'Taj Mahal used to be a Shiva temple that Mughals destroyed,' says BJP MP Vinay Katiyar

"The Taj Mahal is a Hindu temple. There are all the signs there of (Hindu) gods and goddesses, There used to be a Shivaling there which had water dripping on it from up top. That ling was removed and a mausoleum built there," said the BJP MP.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/taj-mahal-used-to-be-a-shiva-temple-that-mughals-destroyed-says-bjp-mp-vinay-katiyar/articleshow/61131286.cms

I like the spirit ....

 

[cricketjoshila]

If you hate it so much, Pakistan will take it... We'll even pay for work and transport

Please pay off your debts first.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

'Taj Mahal used to be a Shiva temple that Mughals destroyed,' says BJP MP Vinay Katiyar

View attachment 76858



https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/taj-mahal-used-to-be-a-shiva-temple-that-mughals-destroyed-says-bjp-mp-vinay-katiyar/articleshow/61131286.cms

I like the spirit ....

If that's a blot on the landscape, India must have some spectacular landscapes.

 

[cricketjoshila]

If that's a blot on the landscape, India must have some spectacular landscapes.

Despite the attempt of invaders, India indeed has many spectacular landscapes.

I am not comparing which is better or worse but just in general.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Despite the attempt of invaders, India indeed has many spectacular landscapes.

I am not comparing which is better or worse but just in general.

I can think of a lot of Indian landscapes which could be considered a blot ahead of the Taj Mahal. Would you like me to post some pics?

 

[JoniInsafian]

Please pay off your debts first.

It's an investment as part of CPEC.... We could make a lot more money since we'll rebuild it somewhere cleaner than Agra.... Where there aren't dead bodies in the Yamuna

 

[JoniInsafian]

Despite the attempt of invaders, India indeed has many spectacular landscapes.

I am not comparing which is better or worse but just in general.

Sadly a few don't exist anymore.... Like Babri Masjid... Only barbarians like BJP and Taliban destroy monuments.... So if they have same plan for Taj Mahal you should let other countries save it since obviously India can't take care of world heritage....

 

[cricketjoshila]

Sadly a few don't exist anymore.... Like Babri Masjid... Only barbarians like BJP and Taliban destroy monuments.... So if they have same plan for Taj Mahal you should let other countries save it since obviously India can't take care of world heritage....

So who were the people who destroyed countless temples in India?

 

[someone21]

Sadly a few don't exist anymore.... Like Babri Masjid... Only barbarians like BJP and Taliban destroy monuments.... So if they have same plan for Taj Mahal you should let other countries save it since obviously India can't take care of world heritage....

You need some obvious history lessons. Taj Mahal is just one monument in India, it's not the only exclusive one. So it doesn't make sense for only Taj Mahal to be heavily promoted each time.

India is a country which has the most historical monuments and also with absolutely no maintenance. So government need to take care of them all.

 

[cricketjoshila]

It's an investment as part of CPEC.... We could make a lot more money since we'll rebuild it somewhere cleaner than Agra.... Where there aren't dead bodies in the Yamuna

First pay off your debts from CPEC.Then make sure your country is safe for foreign visitors.Then build infrastructure for your people,.

Btw CPEC isnt Pakistani money, its chinese money.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I can think of a lot of Indian landscapes which could be considered a blot ahead of the Taj Mahal. Would you like me to post some pics?

I believe two can post pics.would that be ok?

 

[Lonewarrior]

Despite the attempt of invaders, India indeed has many spectacular landscapes.

I am not comparing which is better or worse but just in general.

what attempt of invaders ?

 

[JoniInsafian]

First pay off your debts from CPEC.Then make sure your country is safe for foreign visitors.Then build infrastructure for your people,.

Btw CPEC isnt Pakistani money, its chinese money.

Obviously India should had followed this advice.... Because now millions of people visit Taj Mahal and go back with image of dead bodies and trash in the river....

Why do you care where money is from?? If someone says there is Shiva temple under Taj Mahal then you guys will demolish it.. Then better we take it naa?

 

[CricketCartoons]

When are we going to see Muslim guilt, where muslims who were not responsible for what was done to hindus, would be sympathetic towards and will fight for the rights of hindus? Anyone? How about you, [MENTION=48620]Cpt. Rishwat[/MENTION] ?

 

[JoniInsafian]

So who were the people who destroyed countless temples in India?

So people who get highest civilian awards from India should have same moral standards as people who lived 500 years ago??

Secondly, if a temple becomes unused then it's not rare that people will build something for own use on top in old days... In fact you can go anywhere Rome Iraq Istanbul Spain, you will find temples that someone built on top of.... Or repurposed... However, in modern days, nobody will do that because we understand notion of world heritage... Almost nobody...

 

[JoniInsafian]

You need some obvious history lessons. Taj Mahal is just one monument in India, it's not the only exclusive one. So it doesn't make sense for only Taj Mahal to be heavily promoted each time.

India is a country which has the most historical monuments and also with absolutely no maintenance. So government need to take care of them all.

Haha spare me the lies... There was 0 site of heritage built by muslim rulers in the UP list... Despite UP having many sites and forts from mughal periods and before... And secondly you have leaders of BJP saying that Taj Mahal was built by invaders so obviously everyone knows the motive here and it's not to promote other site... And last same BJP is responsible for Babri Mosque demolition (and they gave highest civilian award to people who did demolition in 2015) and now they're pushing stories that Taj Mahal is built on top of Shiva Temple so again only a blind person would say that this isn't about religion....

 

[CricketCartoons]

Haha spare me the lies... There was 0 site of heritage built by muslim rulers in the UP list... Despite UP having many sites and forts from mughal periods and before... And secondly you have leaders of BJP saying that Taj Mahal was built by invaders so obviously everyone knows the motive here and it's not to promote other site... And last same BJP is responsible for Babri Mosque demolition (and they gave highest civilian award to people who did demolition in 2015) and now they're pushing stories that Taj Mahal is built on top of Shiva Temple so again only a blind person would say that this isn't about religion....

The babri masjid should have been reverted back to a temple right after india got indepdence...but it is a measure of the slavery of hindus that we are still unable to revert it back to its pristine glory and correct the historical injustices inflicted by the barbarian invaders.

 

[JoniInsafian]

The babri masjid should have been reverted back to a temple right after india got indepdence...but it is a measure of the slavery of hindus that we are still unable to revert it back to its pristine glory and correct the historical injustices inflicted by the barbarian invaders.

And obviously everyone can take the matter in own hands and do demolition.... And then get highest civilian awards... How is Taj Mahal safe in such country with no rule of law???

 

[CricketCartoons]

And obviously everyone can take the matter in own hands and do demolition.... And then get highest civilian awards... How is Taj Mahal safe in such country with no rule of law???

People take matters in their hand when justice is denied to them and the law and justice of the country deny them their rights. But to only target those innocents who took law in the hands in wrong, one must look at the root cause. It is like blaming the palestinians when they fight back against israel.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Obviously India should had followed this advice.... Because now millions of people visit Taj Mahal and go back with image of dead bodies and trash in the river....

Why do you care where money is from?? If someone says there is Shiva temple under Taj Mahal then you guys will demolish it.. Then better we take it naa?

India is safe thats why tourists visit the Taj Mahal and other places.Dont know what are you talking about.

We dont want to take money from people who themselves dont have money.

 

[cricketjoshila]

So people who get highest civilian awards from India should have same moral standards as people who lived 500 years ago??

Secondly, if a temple becomes unused then it's not rare that people will build something for own use on top in old days... In fact you can go anywhere Rome Iraq Istanbul Spain, you will find temples that someone built on top of.... Or repurposed... However, in modern days, nobody will do that because we understand notion of world heritage... Almost nobody...

Temples became unused.Lol.Rather temples were vandalised and looted.Thats a truth accepted by historians.

Iraq Istanbul Spain?werent they invaded? With only spain being able to throw the invaders out.

 

[JoniInsafian]

India is safe thats why tourists visit the Taj Mahal and other places.Dont know what are you talking about.

We dont want to take money from people who themselves dont have money.

Have you ever seen the dead bodies around Taj Mahal?? And all the stories of western tourists getting stalked, groped, raped?? We Pakistanis don't get guests because of Taliban and security issues but at least we know how to respect our guests.... Many Chinese and Japanese come here and we treat them like our daughters... Same for Hindus and Sikhs who come here to visit their temples...

 

[cricketjoshila]

Haha spare me the lies... There was 0 site of heritage built by muslim rulers in the UP list... Despite UP having many sites and forts from mughal periods and before... And secondly you have leaders of BJP saying that Taj Mahal was built by invaders so obviously everyone knows the motive here and it's not to promote other site... And last same BJP is responsible for Babri Mosque demolition (and they gave highest civilian award to people who did demolition in 2015) and now they're pushing stories that Taj Mahal is built on top of Shiva Temple so again only a blind person would say that this isn't about religion....

Let me ask you, once Pakistan became a separate country in 1947 how anything that happens on the other side of the border?

Isnt the meaning of partition that you would mind your own business i will mind mine?Or do you not believe in that partition?

Babri Masjid was built by demolishing a Ram Temple in one of the holiest places of Hindus.Can you tell me if there is a precedent of breaking worship place of another religion by Muslims if it was supposedly built at a place holy to Muslims?

 

[cricketjoshila]

Have you ever seen the dead bodies around Taj Mahal?? And all the stories of western tourists getting stalked, groped, raped?? We Pakistanis don't get guests because of Taliban and security issues but at least we know how to respect our guests.... Many Chinese and Japanese come here and we treat them like our daughters... Same for Hindus and Sikhs who come here to visit their temples...

Dead bodies around the Taj?May be you saw them when you came or may be you imagined it.

All these stories yet millions come to India while you have tough time convincing people to come despite promising security.

 

[JoniInsafian]

Temples became unused.Lol.Rather temples were vandalised and looted.Thats a truth accepted by historians.

Iraq Istanbul Spain?werent they invaded? With only spain being able to throw the invaders out.

The mosque of cordoba was converted into a cathedral by spanish.... Beautiful cathedral in fact..

 

[big_gamer007]

Typical politicians forcing the gullible public to forget the real issues and focus on such trivial non sense..

 

[JoniInsafian]

Dead bodies around the Taj?May be you saw them when you came or may be you imagined it.

All these stories yet millions come to India while you have tough time convincing people to come despite promising security.

And millions go back with bad stories of india... Other problem with Taj Mahal is it is become dark due to pollution...

Yes dead bodies surrounded by stray dogs and birds.... Also dead bodies of cows and boars being eaten by birds.... Sadly I can't post pictures here due to child friendly forum...

And this is often only image that westerners go back with of India... Civilized mughal building beautiful marble and then current day indians who steal shoes and pollute everything... It seems India has gone backwards from 400 years ago... From richest country in world to this :'(

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I believe two can post pics.would that be ok?

Sure, why not? We can both post pictures of Indian landscapes which could be considered a blot ahead of the Taj Mahal. Just let me know and I can get the ball rolling.

 

[CricketCartoons]

Sure, why not? We can both post pictures of Indian landscapes which could be considered a blot ahead of the Taj Mahal. Just let me know and I can get the ball rolling.

The OP is about it being a blot on history, not geography. yet again you are trying to raise a false debate and shying away from the original discussion.

 

[someone21]

And this is often only image that westerners go back with of India... Civilized mughal building beautiful marble and then current day indians who steal shoes and pollute everything... It seems India has gone backwards from 400 years ago... From richest country in world to this :'(

Haha, so now you speak of the westerners. There are increasing numbers of tourists coming to India, and there are good reasons for it. Hard for you to admit India is doing well ,so keep living in your delusional world.

Also 400 years ago, there were brutal Muslim attacks on Hindus, so thank God, we are not in that time.

 

[troodon]

When are we going to see Muslim guilt, where muslims who were not responsible for what was done to hindus, would be sympathetic towards and will fight for the rights of hindus? Anyone? How about you, [MENTION=48620]Cpt. Rishwat[/MENTION] ?

Which Muslim guilt?

The Muslims in India/Pak/Bangladesh have nothing to do with the invaders from Central Asia and Arabia.

Muslims in Indian subcontinent are sons of the soil who chose to convert or got converted.

Arabs/Central Asians are not like European White people who bend over backwards in apologizing for their invasions and loots. In fact, most still have their superior culture attitude over people of Subcontinent. They show no remorse for the things their ancestors did.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Typical politicians forcing the gullible public to forget the real issues and focus on such trivial non sense..

I hope this is the case. But are you sure this type of sentiment isn't much larger esp among the Hindu population of India? We can see on this thread Indian posters moaning about Muslim invaders.

 

[90MPH]

Only die hard blind nationalistic Indians would criticise an iconic monument such as the Taj Mahal.

Now let me think what could the reason be for this ??
Which government is in power in India ??
Does that government in power have hard right wing members that has been constantly targeting one set of people again and again ??
And the Taj Mahal was built by whom ??

Ok I got it...easy target so it's deflect the blame game being played again.

 

[waqar goraya]

Statements like these help the health of BJP and keep its ideological base intact, satisfied.

 

[Madplayer]

Statements like these help the health of BJP and keep its ideological base intact, satisfied.

This is just about right. It isnt far fetched that these small time MLAs or smaller leaders would be directed to spit venom against muslims just to keep the hindutva vote bank intact while the senior pros would try to downplay it as a minor incident. The message is definitely being sent across to their voters that they voted for the right people.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

The OP is about it being a blot on history, not geography. yet again you are trying to raise a false debate and shying away from the original discussion.

My apologies. I may have been deflected off course by some random comment about the Taj Mahal being mediocre as a wonder compared to the Ellora Caves.

 

[CanadianG00se]

My apologies. I may have been deflected off course by some random comment about the Taj Mahal being mediocre as a wonder compared to the Ellora Caves.

Ellora caves is indeed better. Building such huge tunnel like caves during that time is impressive. I have visited the caves near Mumbai and its mesmerizing. Sad that such historic places dont get media attention as Taj does.
Taj Mahal is no mediocre monument, but its also no better than Ellora caves. Both are significant to Indian society, and both are equally historic.
You’re passing your judgement without actually visiting either of the place. I bet you wont even know what Ellora caves is, do you?
Anyways, there is no need to ridicule one to praise other. Both are UNESCo heritage center

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Ellora caves is indeed better. Building such huge tunnel like caves during that time is impressive. I have visited the caves near Mumbai and its mesmerizing. Sad that such historic places dont get media attention as Taj does.
Taj Mahal is no mediocre monument, but its also no better than Ellora caves. Both are significant to Indian society, and both are equally historic.
You’re passing your judgement without actually visiting either of the place. I bet you wont even know what Ellora caves is, do you?
Anyways, there is no need to ridicule one to praise other. Both are UNESCo heritage center

The OP is about it being a blot on history, not geography. Once again posters trying to raise a false debate and shying away from the original discussion.

 

[Varun]

Only die hard blind nationalistic Indians would criticise an iconic monument such as the Taj Mahal.

Now let me think what could the reason be for this ??
Which government is in power in India ??
Does that government in power have hard right wing members that has been constantly targeting one set of people again and again ??
And the Taj Mahal was built by whom ??

Ok I got it...easy target so it's deflect the blame game being played again.

Would you believe me if I said that 6 months from now nobody will remember this story except you?

 

[Madplayer]

Ellora caves is indeed better. Building such huge tunnel like caves during that time is impressive. I have visited the caves near Mumbai and its mesmerizing. Sad that such historic places dont get media attention as Taj does.
Taj Mahal is no mediocre monument, but its also no better than Ellora caves. Both are significant to Indian society, and both are equally historic.
You’re passing your judgement without actually visiting either of the place. I bet you wont even know what Ellora caves is, do you?
Anyways, there is no need to ridicule one to praise other. Both are UNESCo heritage center

What logic is "building tunnels in that time is impressive"? How does that make it better than Taj? In that sense the stone tools built by early man are better than the modern equipment which we use.

Fact is fact, ellora cave cannot hold a candle infront of taj in terms of being an architectural creation. Its another matter if you assign some abstract meanings to those caves and make it sound more important culturally or in some other way.

 

[90MPH]

Would you believe me if I said that 6 months from now nobody will remember this story except you?

I'm not the BJP member currently talking about it. I'm not the one in this thread justifying his insane comments. And it's not hard to figure out what his reason were or those supporting him.

I suggest you write to him so In future we don't have to "remember" about it, if it's embarrassing you so much.

 

[Varun]

I'm not the BJP member currently talking about it. I'm not the one in this thread justifying his insane comments. And it's not hard to figure out what his reason were or those supporting him.

Forget about now and answer my question; six months from now you'll be the one still stewing while the rest of us would have moved on with our lives, will you not?

Of course, the Taj Mahal will still be standing and thronged by tourists but I trust we can agree on that.

 

[big_gamer007]

I hope this is the case. But are you sure this type of sentiment isn't much larger esp among the Hindu population of India? We can see on this thread Indian posters moaning about Muslim invaders.

Apart from history classes in school ages ago I have never heard anyone talk about Muslim invaders, it's not even a topic of discussion which is 1millionth in someone's list of discussions.. So I would say normal Indians do not care about what happened 500 years ago.. Having said that if politicians bring up this topic and it becomes a constant point of debate in the media the normal public (the ones who already have resentment against Muslims and mind you that number is decent enough) would start believing it..

Then fights, debates and protests might take place for these issues rather than the core issues one faces.. So a politician gets away with doing his job which is tough by forcing the publics attention towards such issues..

Regarding the other thread you have been on PP for a long time surely you should have understood by now that people who argue with you on points just argue because they can't stand taking criticism from a Pakistani.. They themselves know the faults in our society but if you or any other Pakistani points it out they can't take it.. It's simple forum/online war don't take it seriously..

 

[90MPH]

Forget about now and answer my question; six months from now you'll be the one still stewing while the rest of us would have moved on with our lives, will you not?

Of course, the Taj Mahal will still be standing and thronged by tourists but I trust we can agree on that.

Yes I'm the one stewing while its members of your pathetic government bringing this issue ?? Really who are you fooling ??

Couldn't care less, just giving my opinion as there's a thread about it, understand ?? If you don't want it being discussed now or 6 months from now then lunatic members of the BJP shouldn't be making a topic in the first place.

 

[Varun]

Yes I'm the one stewing while its members of your pathetic government bringing this issue ?? Really who are you fooling ??

Couldn't care less, just giving my opinion as there's a thread about it, understand ?? If you don't want it being discussed now or 6 months from now then lunatic members of the BJP shouldn't be making a topic in the first place.

Pfft...that answered my question.

If somebody in Pakistan spoke against say, the Lahore Fort I wouldn't care to blink twice, and yet you bake and burn and lose sleep for days on this non-issue...

And it's not like you'll ever get to see the Taj Mahal anyway.

 

[Yossarian]

You need some obvious history lessons. Taj Mahal is just one monument in India, it's not the only exclusive one. So it doesn't make sense for only Taj Mahal to be heavily promoted each time..

Perhaps instead of the Taj Mahal, Indians should depict the Khajuraho Temples, complete with closeups of some of their erotic art, on their tourism brochures and tv ads aimed at American, British and other Western tourists.

 

[90MPH]

Pfft...that answered my question.

If somebody in Pakistan spoke against say, the Lahore Fort I wouldn't care to blink twice, and yet you bake and burn and lose sleep for days on this non-issue...

And it's not like you'll ever get to see the Taj Mahal anyway.

Whether I see it or not Mr Varun troll is none of your concern - well we know how your government doesn't want Pakistani cricket teams or actors visiting in any case.

How convenient of you trying to divert attention on to me when it's members of your lunatic BJP government that that have said the Taj Mahal is a "blot" on India history. All I did was give my viewpoint on what then reason was, and even seeing the more bizzare reasons justifying it.

Stop derailing this thread, it's obvious what your intentions are. Don't talk about it. Sorry we will, wheather you like it or not.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Apart from history classes in school ages ago I have never heard anyone talk about Muslim invaders, it's not even a topic of discussion which is 1millionth in someone's list of discussions.. So I would say normal Indians do not care about what happened 500 years ago.. Having said that if politicians bring up this topic and it becomes a constant point of debate in the media the normal public (the ones who already have resentment against Muslims and mind you that number is decent enough) would start believing it..

Then fights, debates and protests might take place for these issues rather than the core issues one faces.. So a politician gets away with doing his job which is tough by forcing the publics attention towards such issues..

Regarding the other thread you have been on PP for a long time surely you should have understood by now that people who argue with you on points just argue because they can't stand taking criticism from a Pakistani.. They themselves know the faults in our society but if you or any other Pakistani points it out they can't take it.. It's simple forum/online war don't take it seriously..

It's interesting you say that, I never heard ordinary people discussing these issues either, but with the advent of the internet, the Hindutva movement has brought these issues to the forefront. The Babri Masjid stood for a long time before suddenly there was a groundswell of movement against it in the 90's. I don't know if that coincided with the web becoming worldwide phenomenon but certainly the BJP rise to power was fuelled by social media.

Before joshila bhai jumps in with indignation, let me be clear, I am not passing judgement on your government, or declaring Hindutva or right wing illegal movement. This is purely an observation, I don't have strong feelings either way.

 

[kabbirann]

Don't really understand the outcry over this.
Bigoted, communal,petty idiocy is BJP's USP .They are doing exactly what they were voted in for.

Agra Fort is far more aesthetically pleasing than Taj Mahal.
Never understood why the Mughals chose Agra.The climate,the people,the water- there is really nothing to like about Agra.

 

[Specialisttailender]

Which Muslim guilt?

The Muslims in India/Pak/Bangladesh have nothing to do with the invaders from Central Asia and Arabia.

Muslims in Indian subcontinent are sons of the soil who chose to convert or got converted.

Arabs/Central Asians are not like European White people who bend over backwards in apologizing for their invasions and loots. In fact, most still have their superior culture attitude over people of Subcontinent. They show no remorse for the things their ancestors did.

Can't say the same for entire subcontinent, look at Hyderabad for example. Many muslims were descendant of Central Asian, Arabian and Persian ancestry.