The hypocrisy of cricket pundits is astonishing!

[Devadwal]

17 wickets have fallen on the opening day of the 1st Test between Australia and India in Perth, and all we are hearing are praises for the fast bowlers, who have been brilliant today. I’m not against bowlers, but imagine if 17 wickets had fallen to spinners on the opening day.

We’d be hearing cries everywhere—from the commentary box to social media—about how these substandard pitches are ruining Test cricket and how home teams exploiting home advantage is seen as cowardice of the highest order.

Why this double standard when it comes to pitches?

 

[Kianig89]

Because spinners are always considered a secondary part, and if the secondary part takes over where will we fit the primary portion.

Every playing 11 has mostly 2-3 fast bowlers and 1 spinner. If spinners become so dominant role of fast bowling will be curtailed as evident by Pakistan's struggle in Test cricket where none of the fast bowler can play 3 consecutive games.

 

[shaz619]

It is partly India’s fault because of the unsporting pitches you’ve produced in the past with the extravagant spin, we’ve seen spinning pitches in asia but nothing like what they have been in India. Jadeja & Ashwin are genuinely no where near as good as they are hyped to be.

As far as the current Test is concerned, yeah good effort by the bowlers, but more than the pitch or anything else, I’ve never seen such terrible technique in Test cricket. Yes, we can blame T20 cricket to some extent, but both countries still have more investment in their FC set up then other nations which makes the performances all the more shocking, it may just be the times we live in.

Think about it, Wasim/Waqar faced ATG’s from almost every country:

India

The great Rahul The Match Winner Dravid
VVS Laxman

Sunil Gavaskar

Australia

Ponting
Waugh
Hayden
Langer
Gilchrist

Zimbabwe

Flower Brothers

New Zealand

Martin Crowe

West Indies

Viv Richards
Brian Lara
Gordon Greenridge

I’ve probably missed a few names but these batters regularly had to deal with lateral movement or reverse swing between 145-155 kph, and while it was tough, they were better equipped to handle high class bowling. But now, a tiny bit of movement and batters are dancing like chickens….

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

17 wickets have fallen on the opening day of the 1st Test between Australia and India in Perth, and all we are hearing are praises for the fast bowlers, who have been brilliant today. I’m not against bowlers, but imagine if 17 wickets had fallen to spinners on the opening day.

We’d be hearing cries everywhere—from the commentary box to social media—about how these substandard pitches are ruining Test cricket and how home teams exploiting home advantage is seen as cowardice of the highest order.

Why this double standard when it comes to pitches?

Look i get your point by saying spin piiches often get highlighted in asia but it should be balanced pitches like pak produced vs england not like india where glenn philips is bowling like murli you get my point bro?

17 wickets have fallen on the opening day of the 1st Test between Australia and India in Perth, and all we are hearing are praises for the fast bowlers, who have been brilliant today. I’m not against bowlers, but imagine if 17 wickets had fallen to spinners on the opening day.

We’d be hearing cries everywhere—from the commentary box to social media—about how these substandard pitches are ruining Test cricket and how home teams exploiting home advantage is seen as cowardice of the highest order.

Why this double standard when it comes to pitches?

 

[Devadwal]

Because spinners are always considered a secondary part, and if the secondary part takes over where will we fit the primary portion.

Every playing 11 has mostly 2-3 fast bowlers and 1 spinner. If spinners become so dominant role of fast bowling will be curtailed as evident by Pakistan's struggle in Test cricket where none of the fast bowler can play 3 consecutive games.

There is nothing like secondary parts.

All time top wicket taker is spinner .

In Asian conditions team most teams are play with more spinner than Pacers .

 

[Kianig89]

There is nothing like secondary parts.

All time top wicket taker is spinner .

In Asian conditions team most teams are play with more spinner than Pacers .

You cannot neglect the history, fast bowlers are the main lead.
There are many GOAT fast bowlers than Spinners

 

[Devadwal]

Look i get your point by saying spin piiches often get highlighted in asia but it should be balanced pitches like pak produced vs england not like india where glenn philips is bowling like murli you get my point bro?

A trundler pacer like Aamir Jamal can get 7 Wickets on spicy pitch than why not philips?

 

[Varun]

Has to be a bit of a colonial mentality in this.

 

[Devadwal]

All home team are play on their strength at home. So why cricket expert are crying about Turner pitches but praise greenish pitches .

Totally double standards

 

[Devadwal]

Has to be a bit of a colonial mentality in this.

"Twada Kutta Tommy, Sadda Kutta Kutta"

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

A trundler pacer like Aamir Jamal can get 7 Wickets on spicy pitch than why not philips?

Bro i am not saying you said anything wrong i am just pointing out philips getting wickets on a turner pitch does that make cricket exciting someone like philips is getting wickets and fast bowlers are just there as spectators.

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

All home team are play on their strength at home. So why cricket expert are crying about Turner pitches but praise greenish pitches .

Totally double standards

Ya that i agree with you i saw english fans and media were crying on why pak changed their pitches to low and spin that should not happen every team should have there home advantage period.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

It is partly India’s fault because of the unsporting pitches you’ve produced in the past with the extravagant spin, we’ve seen spinning pitches in asia but nothing like what they have been in India. Jadeja & Ashwin are genuinely no where near as good as they are hyped to be.

As far as the current Test is concerned, yeah good effort by the bowlers, but more than the pitch or anything else, I’ve never seen such terrible technique in Test cricket. Yes, we can blame T20 cricket to some extent, but both countries still have more investment in their FC set up then other nations which makes the performances all the more shocking, it may just be the times we live in.

Think about it, Wasim/Waqar faced ATG’s from almost every country:

India

The great Rahul The Match Winner Dravid
VVS Laxman

Sunil Gavaskar

Australia

Ponting
Waugh
Hayden
Langer
Gilchrist

Zimbabwe

Flower Brothers

New Zealand

Martin Crowe

West Indies

Viv Richards
Brian Lara
Gordon Greenridge

I’ve probably missed a few names but these batters regularly had to deal with lateral movement or reverse swing between 145-155 kph, and while it was tough, they were better equipped to handle high class bowling. But now, a tiny bit of movement and batters are dancing like chickens….

Jadeja is as good in Away conditions as Jimmy Clouderson.

Pakistani pacers used bottle caps so all this doesn’t apply on them.

Waqar doesn’t even have a good record against top teams in their home ground.

This is just a racist rant caused by jealousy when you saw Bumrah rip through the Aussies.

Kane Williamson and Ross Taylor are two of the best Nz batsman, Rachin will be next.

Andy Flower was the only great batsman in that Zim lineup.

 

[Devadwal]

Ya that i agree with you i saw english fans and media were crying on why pak changed their pitches to low and spin that should not happen every team should have there home advantage period.

Whenever a test match happens in aisa which favour Spinners ( no rocket science) ,most of talk about pitch rather than bowlers and batsman.

I dont have any problem with greenish pitches or Turner, I'm even love the low scoring thriller compared to patta pitches .but i dont like the way SENA nation's expert are crying about turning tracks .

 

[Aqib_mustafa]

Whenever a test match happens in aisa which favour Spinners ( no rocket science) ,most of talk about pitch rather than bowlers and batsman.

I dont have any problem with greenish pitches or Turner, I'm even love the low scoring thriller compared to patta pitches .but i dont like the way SENA nation's expert are crying about turning tracks .

Ya true on this one agree with you these sena fans always cry about asia spin pitches should just get on just like how asian teams dont cry about greenish pitches which they always get.

 

[mominsaigol]

The batters of today have inferior defensive technique but vastly superior attacking technique that’s why you see the likes of Ind, Eng, SriLanka chasing big scores in the 4 th innings, this is something that wouldn’t have been possible with the batters from the 90s.

Even your adopted nation England was utter trash in the 90s and whipping boys for every other team, the bottle cap expert padded his stats against them only.

Anderson might be your Baap not Jadejas, they have similar away bowling stats while Jadeja also bats unlike the tailender who was violated by Bumrah.

You have too much interest in a bowlers look, I don’t care as I don’t swing that way, you can go ahead and attach pictures of Wasim, Waqar and Imran in your toilet.

The batters of today have inferior defensive technique but vastly superior attacking technique

^^ This statement here proves that youre a hypocrite. You're the one who hasnt watched cricket pre 2011 and its very clear because what you stated is total nonsense.

Theirs no hard and fast rule. Many batters of the past and especially in England's case the likes of Ian Bell, Gary Ballance, Johnathon trott and what was essentially the crapola 2011-2014 englsnd team had horrible techniques both defensive and attacking wise they were moot.

Infact Jos Butler has a superior defensive technique then all those batters with the exception of Cook(in test cricket). Root came after that era and his defensive technique is superior to 95% of English batters who have ever played the game.

Alex hales was also a more complete batter then anyone English player from the dark days.

Similarly Prime Steve Smith's defense in test cricket is infinitely superior to Pointings as Smith would often just accurately judge the line and length of a ball and just put his foot to block it or leave it altogether.

Pant is also 100X superior to Dhoni in test cricket in all aspects..he has an unorthodox technique but his solid defense is what has allowed him to stay longer then any Indian batter atm.

Pull the dravid Cord out of your head. Test cricket has always remained the same and hasn't changed.

Odi cricket only got more attacking due to the 2 new ball rule which made it easier hence ot seems that players are more attacking in whiteball now when in reality the rule changes accomdated towards it.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

It's true

I've been guilty of it too in the past. I don't think it's colonial but it's just because we are used to seeing spinners only come into things day 3 onwards.

Generally it does seem to be the case that if spinners take wickets early in a game then pitch must be bad, but if pacers take it then it's WOW what great bowling.

 

[Buffet]

17 wickets on day 1. I think it's safe to say that anyone complaining about rank turners should stop complaining.

I think 17 wickets on day 1 or rank turners, both are good. You get all kinds of pitch in test cricket. That's why it's called test cricket.

 

[Farabi]

17 wickets have fallen on the opening day of the 1st Test between Australia and India in Perth, and all we are hearing are praises for the fast bowlers, who have been brilliant today. I’m not against bowlers, but imagine if 17 wickets had fallen to spinners on the opening day.

We’d be hearing cries everywhere—from the commentary box to social media—about how these substandard pitches are ruining Test cricket and how home teams exploiting home advantage is seen as cowardice of the highest order.

Why this double standard when it comes to pitches?

It’s a colonial hangover that still exists.

Another example is Pakistanis writing off debutants who cannot play pace in Australia as if Australian debutants can do well on Asian spinning mambas.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

The batters of today have inferior defensive technique but vastly superior attacking technique

^^ This statement here proves that youre a hypocrite. You're the one who hasnt watched cricket pre 2011 and its very clear because what you stated is total nonsense.

Theirs no hard and fast rule. Many batters of the past and especially in England's case the likes of Ian Bell, Gary Ballance, Johnathon trott and what was essentially the crapola 2011-2014 englsnd team had horrible techniques both defensive and attacking wise they were moot.

Infact Jos Butler has a superior defensive technique then all those batters with the exception of Cook(in test cricket). Root came after that era and his defensive technique is superior to 95% of English batters who have ever played the game.

Alex hales was also a more complete batter then anyone English player from the dark days.

Similarly Prime Steve Smith's defense in test cricket is infinitely superior to Pointings as Smith would often just accurately judge the line and length of a ball and just put his foot to block it or leave it altogether.

Pant is also 100X superior to Dhoni in test cricket in all aspects..he has an unorthodox technique but his solid defense is what has allowed him to stay longer then any Indian batter atm.

Pull the dravid Cord out of your head. Test cricket has always remained the same and hasn't changed.

Odi cricket only got more attacking due to the 2 new ball rule which made it easier hence ot seems that players are more attacking in whiteball now when in reality the rule changes accomdated towards it.

On an average defensive technique has gone down.

Secondly what can I say after you posted that Bell and Trott had horrible technique and worse than Jos Buttlers technique.

I mean either you haven’t really seen them play or you are just messing around.

Alex Hales was a t20 hack

 

[jnaveen1980]

I don't think we had this many 140k bowlers in the same side bowling with accuracy.. Nowadays fast bowlers as a unit are lot better than yesteryears. Just look through the history. If you have 4 decent fast bowlers (even average 4th one) you can be effective anywhere. Back then West Indies had 4 fast bowlers that bullied the world. IN 2005 ENgland had 4 fast bowlers that made history. India started making news after they formed the pace trio. It is not just defense technique. "Bowling unit" has gotten better. Different styles of bowlers emerge. Didn't Pakistan get bowled out for 59 & 53 on a flat wicket? Now it happens more often because quality has increased.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Good thread @Devadwal

The data is very clear .

Pitches that seam, on average, 0.55 degrees result in batting averages declining to around 30 .

This pitch had seam movement , on average, of about 0.8 degrees where batting averages crash to 18.

The current kookaburra is such a solid product that even after 30 overs you can read the writing on the ball and even the OZ commies were amazed by that.

This pitch should be punished for excessive seam movement. But you very likely won't hear anyone calling for it.

You can't make such pitches with the current version of kookaburra and expect runs to be made on such decks.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Good thread @Devadwal

The data is very clear .

Pitches that seam, on average, 0.55 degrees result in batting averages declining to around 30 .

This pitch had seam movement , on average, of about 0.8 degrees where batting averages crash to 18.

The current kookaburra is such a solid product that even after 30 overs you can read the writing on the ball and even the OZ commies were amazed by that.

This pitch should be punished for excessive seam movement. But you very likely won't hear anyone calling for it.

You can't make such pitches with the current version of kookaburra and expect runs to be made on such decks.

Actually this is nothing compared to the Gabba pitch they used against SA. That was unplayable. Lot of Indian wickets due to bounce. They could have left alone.

 

[mominsaigol]

On an average defensive technique has gone down.

Secondly what can I say after you posted that Bell and Trott had horrible technique and worse than Jos Buttlers technique.

I mean either you haven’t really seen them play or you are just messing around.

Alex Hales was a t20 hack

I have seen them play. Bell got exposed by Mitchell Johnson amd that was the end of that.

Butler plays grounded shots and has a solid defence. Infact he's one the classiest batters in the world because he gets most of his scores through aggressive grounded shots and Unorthodox lofted strokes.

The the definition of risk free cricket and you can't play good solid grounded cricket shots if you don't have a good defencse.

Same for trott.

And Alex hales wasn't a t20 hack.

Bell and trott are very very overrated players that were dead weight for England for years

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

This is a great pitch. And if a pitch offers alot of turn, that's great too. Unless a pitch gets dangerous like we see in South Africa, I am perfectly fine with bowling-friendly pitches regardless of who they favor---fast-bowlers or spinners. A test match doesn't have to go all 5 days to be interesting.

Also, any home team is well within their rights to create a pitch that favors their bowlers. This argument has gotten old and boring.

 

[Savak]

Australia's batting quality is no where good enough. Even Pakistan last year with their inferior bowling attack had their moments in the 2nd and 3rd test in 2023-24 where they were in a strong position to win the test matches. That is more a sad reflection of the Australian team. This Australian team even lost to West Indies against Shamar Joseph who has not done anything else since then.

To be honest Steve Smith is a complete shadow of the batsman he was 6-7 years ago. Travis Head's and Mitch Marsh's counter attacking approach will not always bail them out.

 

[kron]

I don't think we had this many 140k bowlers in the same side bowling with accuracy.. Nowadays fast bowlers as a unit are lot better than yesteryears. Just look through the history. If you have 4 decent fast bowlers (even average 4th one) you can be effective anywhere. Back then West Indies had 4 fast bowlers that bullied the world. IN 2005 ENgland had 4 fast bowlers that made history. India started making news after they formed the pace trio. It is not just defense technique. "Bowling unit" has gotten better. Different styles of bowlers emerge. Didn't Pakistan get bowled out for 59 & 53 on a flat wicket? Now it happens more often because quality has increased.

But this will fly past spaz619's brain cause he has just vacuous space between the ears. It's air.

Bowling is vastly superior to the tullas of 90s. As a unit.

And DRS era has made it harder too. Can't cheat as much like in early days.
Waqar would average like 28 in modern era.

Wasim would still be good but lefties in tests have always been handled better. He will be around 23 24 averaging bowler like he was in 90s give he is so skilled. Not waqar though.

 

[kron]

And world likes pace bowling

Pace bowling makes cricket catchable. Spin doesn't. That is the reality tbh.

I love turning pitches but it lacks the grandiose characteristics of a seaming tracks. It just looks more elegant and pleasing on the eye. Nothing more amazing to watch than a fast bowler steaming in. It's perception. The fear of getting physically hurt and being intimidated stems from fast bowling. Not spin.

 

[Devadwal]

17 wickets fell in less than 80 overs. If the full quota of 90 overs had been bowled, it could have reached 20+wickets .

 

[Devadwal]

This is a great pitch. And if a pitch offers alot of turn, that's great too. Unless a pitch gets dangerous like we see in South Africa, I am perfectly fine with bowling-friendly pitches regardless of who they favor---fast-bowlers or spinners. A test match doesn't have to go all 5 days to be interesting.

Also, any home team is well within their rights to create a pitch that favors their bowlers. This argument has gotten old and boring.

There's definitely a bias for pace friendly pitches compared to Turner .This is my point.

 

[jnaveen1980]

There's definitely a bias for pace friendly pitches compared to Turner .This is my point.

They were very clear even before the series. Perth pitch will be fiery like the old WACA. Fair enough. Home conditons. THey can take advantage of it. Rohit already brought this up after that SA test win where SA bowled out for 55 or something.He said something like "As long as they don't complain about spinning pitches it is okay".

 

[Devadwal]

They were very clear even before the series. Perth pitch will be fiery like the old WACA. Fair enough. Home conditons. THey can take advantage of it. Rohit already brought this up after that SA test win where SA bowled out for 55 or something.He said something like "As long as they don't complain about spinning pitches it is okay".

Yea. I'm not critical of pitches but exposing the hypocrisy of Western media's / Expert's regarding spin friendly pitches.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Yea. I'm not critical of pitches but exposing the hypocrisy of Western media's / Expert's regarding spin friendly pitches.

This has been called out by many. Most recently Sehwag talked about the Gabba pitch which was actually a dangerous pitch. 34 wickets fell in 2 days and match was over. It was way too green.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/c...boggling-hypocrisy-shocking-Gabba-wicket.html

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

I have seen them play. Bell got exposed by Mitchell Johnson amd that was the end of that.

Butler plays grounded shots and has a solid defence. Infact he's one the classiest batters in the world because he gets most of his scores through aggressive grounded shots and Unorthodox lofted strokes.

The the definition of risk free cricket and you can't play good solid grounded cricket shots if you don't have a good defencse.

Same for trott.

And Alex hales wasn't a t20 hack.

Bell and trott are very very overrated players that were dead weight for England for years

Bell and Trott have better techniques and stats than anyone in the current England team apart from Root.

Buttler is nowhere near, his test average will tell you the story, its actually a sin to compare trott and Bells technique to Jos Buttler or Hales.

 

[mominsaigol]

Bell and Trott have better techniques and stats than anyone in the current England team apart from Root.

Buttler is nowhere near, his test average will tell you the story, its actually a sin to compare trott and Bells technique to Jos Buttler or Hales.

I never compared them when it comes to test format.

You can survive in test cricket with awkward techniques. Your best batter steve smith has one of the weirdest stances in test, Younis Khan is very awkward in tests as well lol.

Butler technique wise is > them, anyone who has watched these guys would know.

Butler is a textbook example of how to play safe cricket while being aggressive.

 

[Ab Fan]

Bell and Trott have better techniques and stats than anyone in the current England team apart from Root.

Buttler is nowhere near, his test average will tell you the story, it’s actually a sin to compare trott and Bells technique to Jos Buttler or Hales.

Only brother @mominsaigol is capable of making such absurd claims.

Buttler and Hales has better defensive game than Trott and Bell lmao

 

[mominsaigol]

Only brother @mominsaigol is capable of making such absurd claims.

Buttler and Hales has better defensive game than Trott and Bell lmao

Hales no, Butler yes

 

[aboveandbeyond]

I never compared them when it comes to test format.

You can survive in test cricket with awkward techniques. Your best batter steve smith has one of the weirdest stances in test, Younis Khan is very awkward in tests as well lol.

Butler technique wise is > them, anyone who has watched these guys would know.

Butler is a textbook example of how to play safe cricket while being aggressive.

Butlers downfall in test was his glaring technique. The fifth stump channel was his Achilles heel against the moving ball

 

[mominsaigol]

Butlers downfall in test was his glaring technique. The fifth stump channel was his Achilles heel against the moving ball

He lost form later 100%. Prime? Naw

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

There's definitely a bias for pace friendly pitches compared to Turner .This is my point.

I don't recall anyone complaining about pitches in India in a long time though. I'm talking about players and coaches. Pundits I don't really care about because most of them tend to be out of their depth anyways.

 

[aboveandbeyond]

He lost form later 100%. Prime? Naw

As a England fan would have loved Buttler to succeed. Problem is, in Tests, if a glaring weakness is not rectified as a bat, then bowlers will pray on it, and with all the other commitments for Joss in other formats, he gave up Tests.