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Umar Akmal should have been backed more ahead of Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq

Junaids

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Well, it's happened again.

Yet again, Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq have failed when their team really needed them.

And it's been happening for years.

In South Africa on this ground at Cape Town in 2012-13, Pakistan collapsed from 126-3 to 152-6, a lead of 164. Azhar Ali was 65 not out and there were 15 overs left to the new ball.

The next ball Azhar edged to the keeper and it was 152-7. Half an hour later it was 169 all out.

Same story at the MCG in December 2016. Azhar Ali scored a masterly 205 not out in the First Innings on a dead wicket when there was no scoreboard pressure, and Pakistan declared at 443-9. Australia replied with 624-8 and then declared 4 overs before Lunch on the Final Day when there had been just 15 wickets in 4 days.

Again Pakistan started to collapse - they were 63-4 when Asad Shafiq came in to bat in the 20th over, with the ball having gone soft and 45 overs for them to survive.

But Shafiq lasted 10 overs before falling to Nathan Lyon on the stroke of Tea.

(Yes, Younis and Misbah had failed but they usually did outside Asia when they were too old).

So Azhar needed to bat out the final session with Sarfraz and the tail, but against an old ball. It was 30 overs old when Shafiq got out.

On that last afternoon, Sarfraz Ahmed lasted 20 overs and even Mohammad Amir lasted 12 overs at the crease. The match would have been drawn if Azhar didn't get out.

But Azhar only lasted 5 overs after tea before he was out LBW to a 35 over old ball.

So what have we got here?

Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq are now almost 34 years old and almost 33 years old respectively. Everyone else their age in world cricket (except for Shaun Marsh) has been thrown out forever if they fail as often as Azhar and Shafiq do.

But they are both still too mentally weak to deliver when the pressure is on.

Both are at least the equal of Cheteshwar Pujara in terms of ability, but whereas he can dig deep and fight and fight and fight, they clearly don't have the stomach or the nerves to do that.

But why are we even here?

Umar Akmal is still only 28 years old, but because he is much more talented than Azhar Ali he was a fixture in the team when Azhar Ali was struggling to get into the side.

When the spotfixing scandal happened at Lords in August 2010:

Azhar Ali was 25 years old and averaged 26.45 after 6 Tests, all outside Asia.

Umar Akmal was 20 years old and averaged 37.18 after 12 Tests, all outside Asia.


But Umar Akmal played 4 more Tests over the next 11 months, with scores of:

4
33
47
56
30
15.

And after that Umar Akmal was never selected again. He was labeled a trouble-maker.

(No, please don't raise the shadow of fixing. No charges have ever been made against him, and if you read Ed Hawkins' "Bookie Gambler Fixer Spy" you will see that more senior batsmen in the team were the subject of far more serious rumours than Umar Akmal was).

Yes, Umar Akmal is no genius. Was David Warner?

Yes, Umar Akmal is self-centered and not a "team man".

But this is a man who emerged in Test cricket in November 2009 against a rampant Shane Bond, and on debut he did this:

129 as Shane Bond took 5-107
75 as Shane Bond took 3-46.

It's time to tell it as it is.

Pakistan has spent the last 8 years refusing top pick its best batsman because he is dumb, obnoxious and narcissistic. These are the so-called "character grounds" by which he is endlessly excluded.

(I don't see much more to like about the personalities of Kohli or Warner, but hey, there you go.)

And instead he has had to watch while two inferior batsmen are persisted with endlessly on "character grounds", when their character makes them popular team-mates even though they endlessly choke under pressure.

Yes, Umar Akmal has made bad choices in those 8 years. With the door to a Test recall clearly closed, he was dazzled by Shahid Afridi and his slogging mentality and has endlessly thrown away his wicket in limited overs matches.

But Umar Akmal is still a far more capable batsman than any other Pakistani apart from his cousin Babar Azam.

And in case you think that Umar Akmal's form doesn't merit a Test place, his last two First Class scores a month ago were:

113
52

Azhar Ali is about to be 34 years old.
Asad Shafiq is about to be 33 years old.
Umar Akmal is 28 years old.

Surely the time has come to stop making the same mistakes, and to swallow a bit of pride and recognize that the "character" that made Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq easy to work with and compliant also made them mentally weak.
 
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Yes Junaids the best players are never selected in PCT yet again..
 
Yes Junaids the best players are never selected in PCT yet again..
Mental midgets are often lovely guys.

And often the least likeable and most selfish players are the best - from Virat Kohli to Viv Richards to Diego Maradona to Cristiano Ronaldo.

Extreme talent often breeds selfishness and narcissism.
 
Mental midgets are often lovely guys.

And often the least likeable and most selfish players are the best - from Virat Kohli to Viv Richards to Diego Maradona to Cristiano Ronaldo.

Extreme talent often breeds selfishness and narcissism.

Are you saying Umar Akmal is better than Pujara or Dravid in tests?
 
Yup. If Pakistan field their bench XI they would be the best team in the world.
I think the point is that the top teams in the world are all of similar standards (when Smith and Warner are playing), arguably with India a bit better than the others.

But Pakistan's purges and vendettas and dalliance with geriatrics makes them endlessly select teams beneath their true potential.
 
Umar Akmal was dropped because he showed no temperament for test cricket. We’ve gone through this before.
 
Umar Akmal was dropped because after his debut test performance (which looks more and more like a fluke), he did absolutely nothing of note in test cricket

Heck forget test cricket. From 2010 to 2017 he hit a grand total of 1 century in first class cricket despite playing majority of the seasons
 
POTW - [MENTION=137997]Abdullah[/MENTION]719

If Umar Akmal hadn’t been dropped from the test squad it would have improved him as an overall batsman, and would’ve benefited his ODI career.
 
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Umar Akmal was dropped because after his debut test performance (which looks more and more like a fluke), he did absolutely nothing of note in test cricket

Heck forget test cricket. From 2010 to 2017 he hit a grand total of 1 century in first class cricket despite playing majority of the seasons
Trust me, we’ve gone through this before. [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] eventually (for the only time) agreed that Umar deserved to be dropped and I thought we will move on. And then out of no where I saw such posts again.

Now that Azhar/Asad are failing its not unexpected to see a new thread on how Umar freaking Akmal was a lovely test prospect undone by Misbah and co.
 
Umar Akmal was dropped because after his debut test performance (which looks more and more like a fluke), he did absolutely nothing of note in test cricket

Heck forget test cricket. From 2010 to 2017 he hit a grand total of 1 century in first class cricket despite playing majority of the seasons
I've acknowledged that when the road to Test selection was blocked, he slogged like an idiot in domestic cricket.

But this is Umar Akmal's ENTIRE Test career:

129 and 75 away to NZ (Bond)
46 and 52 away to NZ
0 and 77 away to NZ

51 and 27 away to Australia (Johnson, Siddle)
49 and 49 away to Australia
8 and 15 away to Australia

5 and 22 against Australia in England (Johnson, Hilfenhaus)
21 and 8 against Australia in England
4 and 4 away to England (Anderson, Broad, Swann)
17 and 20 away to England
38 and 16 not out away to England
6 and 79 not out away to England

4 against South Africa in Dubai

33 and 47 away to West Indies
56 and 30 away to West Indies

15 away to Zimbabwe

If you call this doing "absolutely nothing" in away Test cricket, please compare it with:

Misbah failed in 3 innings out of 4 in Australia in 2009-10
Misbah failed in 5 innings out 6 in South Africa in 2012-13
Misbah failed in 4 innings out of 7 in England in 2016
Misbah failed in 2 innings out of 2 in New Zealand in 2016-17
Misbah failed in 6 innings out of 6 in Australia in 2016-17

Younis failed in 5 innings out of 6 in South Africa in 2012-13
Younis failed in 6 innings out of 7 in England in 2016
Younis failed in 4 innings out of 4 in New Zealand in 2016-17
Younis failed in 4 innings out of 6 in Australia in 2016-17.

Why does one standard apply to Misbah, Younis, Azhar and Shafiq, while another applies to Umar Akmal?
 
Trust me, we’ve gone through this before. [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] eventually (for the only time) agreed that Umar deserved to be dropped and I thought we will move on. And then out of no where I saw such posts again.

Now that Azhar/Asad are failing its not unexpected to see a new thread on how Umar freaking Akmal was a lovely test prospect undone by Misbah and co.
That's not quite right.

I don't accept that Umar Akmal should have been dropped for either a geriatric non-playing captain or for two inferior mental midgets who are five years older.

I accept that he is an annoying fool. But I still think that he is the present and the future of Pakistan batting, because the cupboard of batsmen in Pakistan is ALWAYS bare and currently it's even emptier than usual.

It's a national sports team, not a franchise that can sign overseas players. The talent pool is what it is.

You pick your best players. And if the coach or the inferior teammates don't like the best players, you show them the door, not the best players.

This is what Homework-gate was all about, and it cost Mickey Arthur his last job. Mitchell Johnson, Shane Watson and James Pattinson were underperforming, but they were the best talent that there was available. Their replacements were inferior.

Eventually the coach got the chop, Johnson came back, and the rest is history.
 
Round and round we go....

Umar akmal never was good enough for international cricket. He got work out by teams and that was that..
[MENTION=133760]Abdullah719[/MENTION] could you please put here the stats post you did few months ago on Umar Akmal.... that should settle it.
 
Trust me, we’ve gone through this before. [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] eventually (for the only time) agreed that Umar deserved to be dropped and I thought we will move on. And then out of no where I saw such posts again.

Now that Azhar/Asad are failing its not unexpected to see a new thread on how Umar freaking Akmal was a lovely test prospect undone by Misbah and co.
That's not quite right.

I don't accept that Umar Akmal should have been dropped for either a geriatric non-playing captain or for two inferior mental midgets who are five years older.

I accept that he is an annoying fool. But I still think that he is the present and the future of Pakistan batting, because the cupboard of batsmen in Pakistan is ALWAYS bare and currently it's even emptier than usual.

It's a national sports team, not a franchise that can sign overseas players. The talent pool is what it is.

You pick your best players. And if the coach or the inferior teammates don't like the best players, you show them the door, not the best players.

That always has to be the way in international sport, because the playing stocks can't be strengthened by buying foreign players. But come to think of it, didn't Manchester United just get rid of Jose Mourinho because they had to pick between him and Paul Pogba?

This is what Homework-gate was all about, and it cost Mickey Arthur his last job. Mitchell Johnson, Shane Watson and James Pattinson were underperforming, but they were the best talent that there was available. Their replacements were inferior.

Eventually the coach got the chop, Johnson came back, and the rest is history.
 
Round and round we go....

Umar akmal never was good enough for international cricket. He got work out by teams and that was that..

[MENTION=133760]Abdullah719[/MENTION] could you please put here the stats post you did few months ago on Umar Akmal.... that should settle it.

Averages a terrible 63 on a batting friendly pitch in New Zealand.

33 in Aus, 30 in England, 41 in Windies.

HASN’T HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO PLAY A SINGLE TEST MATCH AT HOME (NUTERAL) VENUE.

[MENTION=133760]Abdullah719[/MENTION] may bring up the 35 average, but, not any of the current batsman in Pakistan could ever dream of achieving such stats, they’d barely touch 20 outside sub continent.
 
Umar Akmal was dropped because after his debut test performance (which looks more and more like a fluke), he did absolutely nothing of note in test cricket

You can't fluke runs in Tests against Mitchell Johnson in Australia or against a rampant Shane Bond in New Zealand or against Anderson and Broad and Swann in England.

Ask Mohammad Hafeez!

The bottom line is that this was Umar Akmal's entire Test career.

129 and 75 away to NZ (Bond)
46 and 52 away to NZ
0 and 77 away to NZ
51 and 27 away to Australia (Johnson, Siddle)
49 and 49 away to Australia
8 and 15 away to Australia
5 and 22 against Australia in England (Johnson, Hilfenhaus)
21 and 8 against Australia in England
4 and 4 away to England (Anderson, Broad, Swann)
17 and 20 away to England
38 and 16 not out away to England
6 and 79 not out away to England
4 against South Africa in Dubai
33 and 47 away to West Indies
56 and 30 away to West Indies
15 away to Zimbabwe

He only played Test cricket for 22 months. And he only scored less than 10 in 2 of his last 10 Test innings.

How do you end a career for that?
 
That's not quite right.

I don't accept that Umar Akmal should have been dropped for either a geriatric non-playing captain or for two inferior mental midgets who are five years older.

I accept that he is an annoying fool. But I still think that he is the present and the future of Pakistan batting, because the cupboard of batsmen in Pakistan is ALWAYS bare and currently it's even emptier than usual.

It's a national sports team, not a franchise that can sign overseas players. The talent pool is what it is.

You pick your best players. And if the coach or the inferior teammates don't like the best players, you show them the door, not the best players.

That always has to be the way in international sport, because the playing stocks can't be strengthened by buying foreign players. But come to think of it, didn't Manchester United just get rid of Jose Mourinho because they had to pick between him and Paul Pogba?

This is what Homework-gate was all about, and it cost Mickey Arthur his last job. Mitchell Johnson, Shane Watson and James Pattinson were underperforming, but they were the best talent that there was available. Their replacements were inferior.

Eventually the coach got the chop, Johnson came back, and the rest is history.
Incidentally, I don't in any way blame Mickey Arthur for the suicidal decision to continue not to select Umar Akmal.

He is an outsider who lost his last job for throwing out some of the best players for disciplinary transgressions.

He came into a national team with an all-powerful captain (Misbah) who owed his place in the team to Umar Akmal's continued exclusion. And powerful forces have continued to whisper vague allegations against the Akmal family in general.

And Umar Akmal, being a complete fool, has damaged his own situation by making stupid impulsive comments and turning up for national duty looking like a fat cartoon caricature of himself.

But the bottom line remains the same.

When Mickey Arthur took the job, the batting consisted of:

1) Two forty-something batsmen who trained hard but always failed in 4 or 5 innings out of 6 in every series outside Asia.

2) Two mental midgets in terms of Azhar and Shafiq who were treated like promising youngsters even though they were already in their thirties.

3) Mohammad Hafeez.

It should have been obvious that now that Younis Khan was in steep decline, the two people whom Mickey Arthur needed to build his batting line-up around were Babar Azam and Umar Akmal.

(Especially given that then and now Haris Sohail basically plays on one leg.)

I have no time for Ahmed Shehzad because he has done nothing against pace outside Asia. But Umar Akmal is the missing centerpiece of the Pakistan Test batting line-up.
 
Have been saying this every single hour, every single day during Misbah ul Haqs tenure and reign, he was biased towards Azhar Ali, Asad Shafiq type players who have made a career of scoring soft runs and failing under pressure more often than not.
 
UA is done , lets move on

Umar Akmal is FIVE YEARS younger than Azhar Ali.

Umar Akmal is FOUR YEARS younger than Asad Shafiq.

Umar Akmal is ONE YEAR younger than Shan Masood.

He scored a masterful matchwinning century and a fifty in his last two First Class innings, in the Final of the QEA Trophy. In other words, in the highest level and highest pressure First Class match he has been allowed to play for 7.5 years.

If he is done, then someone is asking the wrong questions.
 
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Have been saying this every single hour, every single day during Misbah ul Haqs tenure and reign, he was biased towards Azhar Ali, Asad Shafiq type players who have made a career of scoring soft runs and failing under pressure more often than not.

It's always tempting to surround yourself with low caliber people who don't challenge you rather than superior but more difficult alternatives.

But those same low caliber people crumble under pressure.
 
Hoping to see Umar ,Shehzad and Salman in top order for PCT soon in 2019.

Oh hell no!!! We don’t need ttf’s who’s been given a 1000 chances. We need to include Saad, Said and Rizwan into the lineup.
 
Averages a terrible 63 on a batting friendly pitch in New Zealand.

33 in Aus, 30 in England, 41 in Windies.

HASN’T HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO PLAY A SINGLE TEST MATCH AT HOME (NUTERAL) VENUE.

[MENTION=133760]Abdullah719[/MENTION] may bring up the 35 average, but, not any of the current batsman in Pakistan could ever dream of achieving such stats, they’d barely touch 20 outside sub continent.

Hold your horses.... off memory it’s a very detailed post. You will get to see upto the point he was dropped....


I hope he puts it up here.. otherwise I will have to go hunting for it.
 
Okay everybody, ask yourself these questions.

In Pakistan's last four Test matches:

First Test v New Zealand at Abu Dhabi.
Umar Akmal would have come in on the last day at 130-4 chasing 176. They lost - would they have with him in the team?

Third Test v New Zealand at Abu Dhabi
In the First Innings, replying to New Zealand's 274, Umar Akmal would have come in at 286-4.

Instead they collapsed to 348 all out.

Would they have with Umar Akmal there instead?

First Test v South Africa at Centurion
Azhar Ali scored 36 and 0.
Asad Shafiq scored 7 and 6.

Would Umar Akmal have done worse?

Second Test v South Africa at Cape Town
Azhar Ali scored 2 before fencing a regulation short ball to slip.

Asad Shafiq scored 20 streaky, high-risk runs before nicking off to slip.

Would Umar Akmal have done worse?
 
Okay everybody, ask yourself these questions.

In Pakistan's last four Test matches:

First Test v New Zealand at Abu Dhabi.
Umar Akmal would have come in on the last day at 130-4 chasing 176. They lost - would they have with him in the team?

Third Test v New Zealand at Abu Dhabi
In the First Innings, replying to New Zealand's 274, Umar Akmal would have come in at 286-4.

Instead they collapsed to 348 all out.

Would they have with Umar Akmal there instead?
YES

First Test v South Africa at Centurion
Azhar Ali scored 36 and 0.
Asad Shafiq scored 7 and 6.

Would Umar Akmal have done worse?
Yes - Umar Akmal 0, 0

Second Test v South Africa at Cape Town
Azhar Ali scored 2 before fencing a regulation short ball to slip.

Asad Shafiq scored 20 streaky, high-risk runs before nicking off to slip.

Would Umar Akmal have done worse?
YES streaky 0 is what he would have got

[/QUOTE]
 
Fans really are clueless. One batsman averages 35 while playing all but one innings away from home against 3 legends of their prospective time and then we have other batsman not even averaging 25 outside against ok bowlers but that one guy who performed because he played those shots got lucky. Good job fans, you deserve underperforming players .
 
YES


Yes - Umar Akmal 0, 0


YES streaky 0 is what he would have got
Umar Akmal batted twice in 14 Test matches in his career.

Only in 1 out of 14 Tests did he score less than 10 runs.

Only in 1 other out of 14 Tests did he score less than 25 runs.

In his last five completed (2 innings) Tests Umar Akmal scored:

86 runs
80 runs
85 runs for once out
44 runs for once out.
37 runs.

So your description of his poor batting output actually bears no resemblance to reality.
 
Umar akmal clearly deserved better than asad shafiq.
But the difference between both of them was the attitude.
One was courteous.
And other we know all who denied playing a match just because his elder brother was supposed to be dropped from the team.
 
Looking for the thread “You know things are bad when...”. Can anyone help me please?
 
Umar akmal clearly deserved better than asad shafiq.
But the difference between both of them was the attitude.
One was courteous.
And other we know all who denied playing a match just because his elder brother was supposed to be dropped from the team.

umar also does have some severe mental health issues, addicted to eating and a psychotic father in law in addition to his talent
 
I agree he should come back because people who practise "revisionism" usually suffer from amnesia (self-made or innate) regarding true capabilities of an individual.

Umar was not dropped because of abilities because his manner of dismissal.

You argue that Umar would score more than Azhar or Asad.

Perhaps not in the longer run.

Look at some of his dismissals just to refresh your memory.

6435702649.png6435702649.png

7342081038.png

Those refreshers tell you his career was over before it started.

Now you are just clutching at straws because Pakistan team is struggling.
 
Umar Akmal batted twice in 14 Test matches in his career.

Only in 1 out of 14 Tests did he score less than 10 runs.

Only in 1 other out of 14 Tests did he score less than 25 runs.

In his last five completed (2 innings) Tests Umar Akmal scored:

86 runs
80 runs
85 runs for once out
44 runs for once out.
37 runs.

So your description of his poor batting output actually bears no resemblance to reality.

"past performance is no indication of future gains" especially when that past performance came years back. You were speculating on how he will perform and I added my speculation
 
I agree he should come back because people who practise "revisionism" usually suffer from amnesia (self-made or innate) regarding true capabilities of an individual.

Umar was not dropped because of abilities because his manner of dismissal.

You argue that Umar would score more than Azhar or Asad.

Perhaps not in the longer run.

Look at some of his dismissals just to refresh your memory.

View attachment 86971View attachment 86971

View attachment 86972

Those refreshers tell you his career was over before it started.

Now you are just clutching at straws because Pakistan team is struggling.

This is just bizarre.

You are saying that Umar Akmal had to be dropped from Tests forever because at the age of 20 years and 11 months he threw his wicket away for 56 in one innings and 33 in another innings?

In an away series outside Asia in which his four innings scores were:

33 (in the same innings the much older Azhar scored 34 and Shafiq scored 2)
47 (Azhar 0, Shafiq 42)
56 (Azhar 67, Shafiq 0)
30 (Azhar 53, Shafiq 4)

So in the two Tests you cite as why Umar Akmal had to be dropped forever:

Umar Akmal scored 166 runs at 41.50
Azhar Ali scored 154 runs at 38.50
Asad Shafiq scored 48 runs at 12.00

And that’s why the 20 year old Umar Akmal was dropped forever after one more match?
 
This is just bizarre.

You are saying that Umar Akmal had to be dropped from Tests forever because at the age of 20 years and 11 months he threw his wicket away for 56 in one innings and 33 in another innings?

In an away series outside Asia in which his four innings scores were:

33 (in the same innings the much older Azhar scored 34 and Shafiq scored 2)
47 (Azhar 0, Shafiq 42)
56 (Azhar 67, Shafiq 0)
30 (Azhar 53, Shafiq 4)

So in the two Tests you cite as why Umar Akmal had to be dropped forever:

Umar Akmal scored 166 runs at 41.50
Azhar Ali scored 154 runs at 38.50
Asad Shafiq scored 48 runs at 12.00

And that’s why the 20 year old Umar Akmal was dropped forever after one more match?


This highlights the unfair, arbitrary and stupid decision to throw Umar Akmal out of Tests and invest in Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq instead.

He was 20: they were 25 and 24 years old respectively.

And he outperformed them.
 
Umar Akmal should have gotten a longer run. He might have not been the answer but he was treated harshly in tests.
 
OP refers to the 2009 test in which Akmal scored 129 and 75. But the question is did Pakistan win that match? The answer is No.

The problem that Pakistan Cricket has been facing is bigger than any individuals such as Akmal, Azhar or Shafiq. Our cricketers collectively have been lacking mental strength and determination for quite some time. All we see are flashes of brilliance and then it's back to mediocrity.

Also, we can't just look at stats to understand why Akmal was dropped. One has to see the context as well. Don't get fooled by Akmal's score of 79 in 4th test against England in 2010 (check the match scorecard, we had already lost that match before he came to bat). Just like the team, he also had a disastrous tour of England back then. Most people wanted a change after that and they were not wrong in desiring that. Azhar and Shafiq showed promise, maturity and determination then, which had been missing in the team. Azhar played his role in Pak securing draws against SA in 2010 and Shafiq contributed in Pak's victory in NZ test in early 2011. They made match winning/saving contributions unlike Akmal. Now, it's a different story that these two have not fulfilled their potential and have gone from good to bad to ugly. Maybe, Umar can be tried again but at that time, dropping Umar and backing Shafiq and Azhar did make sense.
 
OP refers to the 2009 test in which Akmal scored 129 and 75. But the question is did Pakistan win that match? The answer is No.

The problem that Pakistan Cricket has been facing is bigger than any individuals such as Akmal, Azhar or Shafiq. Our cricketers collectively have been lacking mental strength and determination for quite some time. All we see are flashes of brilliance and then it's back to mediocrity.

Also, we can't just look at stats to understand why Akmal was dropped. One has to see the context as well. Don't get fooled by Akmal's score of 79 in 4th test against England in 2010 (check the match scorecard, we had already lost that match before he came to bat). Just like the team, he also had a disastrous tour of England back then. Most people wanted a change after that and they were not wrong in desiring that. Azhar and Shafiq showed promise, maturity and determination then, which had been missing in the team. Azhar played his role in Pak securing draws against SA in 2010 and Shafiq contributed in Pak's victory in NZ test in early 2011. They made match winning/saving contributions unlike Akmal. Now, it's a different story that these two have not fulfilled their potential and have gone from good to bad to ugly. Maybe, Umar can be tried again but at that time, dropping Umar and backing Shafiq and Azhar did make sense.

I refer you to my post three posts ago, about the West Indies tour (after which Umar Akmal got one more Test innings).

Umar Akmal was 20 years old and averaged 41.5.

Azhar Ali was 25 years old and averaged 38.5.

Asad Shafiq was 24 years old and averaged 12.00.

I’d expect a 20 year old to have rash flashes of youthful impetuosity.

But they invested in inferior older players rather than the vastly superior, younger option.
 
I don't really like umar akmal but I am pretty sure he would have been more useful than asad shafiq.
 
well past is past , what now? What is PCB doing with guys like salahuddin , saad and saud? How long will they be waiting while guys like asad could fail again and again?
 
This is just bizarre.

You are saying that Umar Akmal had to be dropped from Tests forever because at the age of 20 years and 11 months he threw his wicket away for 56 in one innings and 33 in another innings?

In an away series outside Asia in which his four innings scores were:

33 (in the same innings the much older Azhar scored 34 and Shafiq scored 2)
47 (Azhar 0, Shafiq 42)
56 (Azhar 67, Shafiq 0)
30 (Azhar 53, Shafiq 4)

So in the two Tests you cite as why Umar Akmal had to be dropped forever:

Umar Akmal scored 166 runs at 41.50
Azhar Ali scored 154 runs at 38.50
Asad Shafiq scored 48 runs at 12.00

And that’s why the 20 year old Umar Akmal was dropped forever after one more match?

I just gave you few examples of how he played tests.

Nearly all his dismissals have been in similar fashion or mode.

I am not arguing if Azhar and Asad were better replacements but arguing the premise that a careless Umar Akmal would have tempered his career and channelled his energies into success.
 
I refer you to my post three posts ago, about the West Indies tour (after which Umar Akmal got one more Test innings).

Umar Akmal was 20 years old and averaged 41.5.

Azhar Ali was 25 years old and averaged 38.5.

Asad Shafiq was 24 years old and averaged 12.00.

I’d expect a 20 year old to have rash flashes of youthful impetuosity.

But they invested in inferior older players rather than the vastly superior, younger option.

If I am not wrong, Younis Khan was not available for that WI tour and Akmal got a chance in place of him. Considering that Shafiq and Azhar had made match winning/saving contributions in the last two test series versus superior teams of SA and NZ, Akmal needed to do something exceptional to keep his place in the side once Younis returned. He only did relatively better. Avg of 41 is not bad but a hundred might have helped his cause. And remember, there was a chance to chase a target of 200 odd in WI, Akmal scored 40 odd and then got out and we lost. And the one inning he played after that series was probably against Zimbabwe in which he failed and the rest is history. Azhar and Shafiq (barring his dismal WI outing) brought stability in the side which was much needed in those days, though it was short lived.

Having said all this, I am all in for giving Akmal a chance in tests again provided he has learnt his lessons.
 
Akmal should never have been dropped from the test team. He was not dropped based on merit.

But he was dropped. And he was also dropped from the squad because Misbah and Waqar didn't like him. Misbah even had him kicked out of his domestic first class team.

It's sad but true. Akmal's career might have had a very different trajectory if he was retained in the test team.
 
Round and round we go....

Umar akmal never was good enough for international cricket. He got work out by teams and that was that..

[MENTION=133760]Abdullah719[/MENTION] could you please put here the stats post you did few months ago on Umar Akmal.... that should settle it.

To be fair, those stats were mainly for limited over games... His longer format stats are probably comparatively better than that.
 
To be fair, those stats were mainly for limited over games... His longer format stats are probably comparatively better than that.
I compiled a list a year or so ago. I haven’t got it to hand, but the results were something like:

Compared with Younis, Misbah, Azhar, Hafeez and Shafiq in Australia, England, New Zealand and South Africa this last decade:

1. Umar Akmal scored less than 10 in the lowest proportion of innings.

2. Umar Akmal scored 30 or more in the highest proportion of innings.
 
Whilst I agree the stats are damning, seems like there was favouritism involved in the selection/non-selection of players. However Umar Akmal did have behaviour problems and he seemed rotten to the core and unlike the mavericks you've listed he hadn't produced anywhere near enough performances to merit anyone overlooking those glaring character flaws.

My question is why do we keep bringing up the same names? Why can't people and the team bring up fresh names.
 
That's not quite right.

I don't accept that Umar Akmal should have been dropped for either a geriatric non-playing captain or for two inferior mental midgets who are five years older.

I accept that he is an annoying fool. But I still think that he is the present and the future of Pakistan batting, because the cupboard of batsmen in Pakistan is ALWAYS bare and currently it's even emptier than usual.

It's a national sports team, not a franchise that can sign overseas players. The talent pool is what it is.

You pick your best players. And if the coach or the inferior teammates don't like the best players, you show them the door, not the best players.

That always has to be the way in international sport, because the playing stocks can't be strengthened by buying foreign players. But come to think of it, didn't Manchester United just get rid of Jose Mourinho because they had to pick between him and Paul Pogba?

This is what Homework-gate was all about, and it cost Mickey Arthur his last job. Mitchell Johnson, Shane Watson and James Pattinson were underperforming, but they were the best talent that there was available. Their replacements were inferior.

Eventually the coach got the chop, Johnson came back, and the rest is history.

Although I agree with you, It has to be said that Umar Akmal's case is quite complicated still. I believe Pakistan has nothing to lose really with him in the side and I still think I would much rather have UA as wicket keeper batsman instead of Rizwan as a replacement. However the guy seems to have lost his way mentally more than physically (as argued by the selectors). He really needs to get rid of this ego and sense of entitlement first before he can move forward as a player. Its this mental block that really isnt allowing him to display his immense talent anywhere really.
 
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