[VIDEO] "I have no plans to retire now because I am fit, I can bat, I can bowl" : Shoaib Malik

[TeymurBlake]

When will Shoaib Malik call it a day man...

We have tried many new players as our No.6 but going to Malik won't help either. Specially with his age and lack of ability against pace bowling.

 

[Forum363]

He never said he wants to play t20 international cricket again , if he did he would have got back into the team .

As for his age he got given the captaincy after the 2011 World Cup . During that period of captaincy he was our top performer in CT13 , scored the most runs out of all players in a calendar year for 2013 and was our top scorer in the 2015 World Cup . Based on that he deserves to be in the one day team regardless of his age.

If he remained in the team or attempted to remain in the team despite having poor performances I would not be backing the guy , but stats and performances don’t lie.

He is the complete opposite to Malik and Hafeez, there is actually no comparison, different pedigree different class .

I haven’t searched the threads as I’m on my phone but there are plenty of articles available. For example - https://m.timesofindia.com/sports/n...to-make-t20-comeback/articleshow/26776783.cms

His performances were adequate but he picked a weak team and created a defensive brand of cricket where he would come in, and score meaningless runs to keep his average high but not contribute to wins for Pakistan. The argument would always be that he’s performing much better than the rest so he’s not the problem and without him, Pakistan wouldn’t even reach 150.

What about the PSL where ‘he remained in the team and attempted to remain despite his poor performances’?

Malik and Hafeez are considerably better limited over cricketers while Misbah was a better Test player. All three had spells in captaincy and I’d argue that Misbah was the weakest in terms of his leadership skills except in UAE tests which were his forte.

 

[Zaz]

Read the entire post. Malik has been in very good form in the last four years. He makes the team on merit alone. The same goes for Hafeez. Rather than drudging up old tournaments when both players were clearly not the players they are now with much improved strike-rates, I urge you to look at the numbers instead of projecting whatever bias you may have against them.

Fact of the matter is that we wouldn't even be having this conversation if we actually had some reliable batsmen in the middle-order. But as we all know Pakistan's T20 batting basically ends at No.4.

His form is all bashing minnows in t20s Put him against zimbabwe yes he looks like bradman

Hes been poor as usual against the bigger teams australia south africa england and Nz avging 21 against these team combined in the last 4 years

Whether we have reliable batsmen after 4 or not Id rather the opportunity is given to someone to build for the future for pakistan in the limited overs format than someone whos bottled it continuously over his last 20 yrs

 

[daytrader]

Haha because no international league was interested in having a 40+ Misbah playing for them, while they would still happily pay for Malik who is a specialist in these leagues.

Again with the accusations, not sure where you're getting your info from. Misbah has played IPL, BPL, CPL and PSL so not sure how you can say leagues haven't been interested.

Misbah's a better T20 batter than Malik and if he had retired from tests to solely focus on T20, he would've taken these leagues seriously. But that's not the route he took as money isn't everything. He instead focused on giving his all to his country.

Test is the only format which suited his deadbatting style and given he had full authority there as captain due to his past record, he ofcourse stayed playing as long as he could. That in itself is the selfish thing.

It wasn't his past record. He took us to #1 in 2016 and retired in 2017. He was still performing before retirement.

Malik was always a rubbish player, but he recognised his limitations and retired from tests to prolong his limited overs career.

No doubt Malik has been rubbish. He's had numerous opportunities to become Captain of PCT but he was selfish and didn't want to take such responsibility as he knew he could make more money playing these leagues. For him it was all about money, whereas for Misbah it was about his country.

 

[daytrader]

I haven’t searched the threads as I’m on my phone but there are plenty of articles available. For example - https://m.timesofindia.com/sports/n...to-make-t20-comeback/articleshow/26776783.cms

Seems like click bait as the title of the article doesn't add up to Misbah's comments. He said "if the selectors and board want me to play T20Is again, I will do it." not "I want to make a T20I comeback". Could've been an answer to journalist's question as he had played CPL that year.

His performances were adequate but he picked a weak team and created a defensive brand of cricket where he would come in, and score meaningless runs to keep his average high but not contribute to wins for Pakistan. The argument would always be that he’s performing much better than the rest so he’s not the problem and without him, Pakistan wouldn’t even reach 150.

He's a realist. in those days our batting was shambles, just look at our record from 2010 onwards. Half of the time we could not bat full 50 overs and sometimes we didn't even bat out 20 over in T20Is. It's unfair to criticize the only guy who was carrying the team rather than serial losers like Akmals, Malik, Hafeez and to an extent Afridi.

Malik and Hafeez are considerably better limited over cricketers while Misbah was a better Test player. All three had spells in captaincy and I’d argue that Misbah was the weakest in terms of his leadership skills except in UAE tests which were his forte.

It's the other way around as Misbah is the one that's considerably better than the two. Please just compare the stats of international LOIs of all three:
Misbah averages 43 in ODIs and 37 in T2OIs
Malik is 34 in ODIs and 31 in T20Is
Hafeez is 33 in ODIs and 27 in T20Is

Misbah literally averages 10 runs more than the two in ODIs and at least 5 runs in T20Is.

 

[topspin]

Man Misbah set an awful precedent by playing till mid 40s. All Pakistan players think they can do that now lol. They think being fit is all that matters. Malik is rubbish against pace. Hence is useless selecting him at the age of 39 as he won’t improve in this aspect no matter how fit he is. Yes he is a good player of spin, but his limitations are too much to carry now.

Precisely this. I'm glad you understand Misbah's dedication to promote the toxic old fogey culture. Also, I laugh how some posters are crying at you for stating the problem. Lol at those guys asking you "why bring Misbah into this?"

 

[daytrader]

Precisely this. I'm glad you understand Misbah's dedication to promote the toxic old fogey culture. Also, I laugh how some posters are crying at you for stating the problem. Lol at those guys asking you "why bring Misbah into this?"

The real toxic culture, is aged senior players crying to the media to be selected. We've seen this with YK, MoYo and Afridi in the past now its Malik's turn with Hafeez soon to join. Misbah was too graceful to do this and had always been selected on merit. He never ran to the media to cry and retired respectfully rather than being kicked out of the team. That's the actual precedent he set, not 'I'm fit to play I should be selected'.

Btw im curious to know why you're only blaming Misbah, did Afridi and YK not play into their 40s?

 

[topspin]

The real toxic culture, is aged senior players crying to the media to be selected. We've seen this with YK, MoYo and Afridi in the past now its Malik's turn with Hafeez soon to join. Misbah was too graceful to do this and had always been selected on merit. He never ran to the media to cry and retired respectfully rather than being kicked out of the team. That's the actual precedent he set, not 'I'm fit to play I should be selected'.

Btw im curious to know why you're only blaming Misbah, did Afridi and YK not play into their 40s?

Misbah did not play on merit in white ball cricket following the Mohali game.

Misbah did not play on merit in red ball cricket after 2013. At his age he wasn't going to get better. His batting against pace got exposed in South Africa. He got found as captain after drawing against a minnow Zimbabwe side.

Lol Misbah played on merit, seriously what world do you live in bro?

 

[topspin]

[MENTION=139316]daytrader[/MENTION]

It's funny you bring up YK.

YK was more than twice the batsman that Misbah ever was. That guy played on merit. Stop making a fool out of yourself.

 

[Hasan123]

Precisely this. I'm glad you understand Misbah's dedication to promote the toxic old fogey culture. Also, I laugh how some posters are crying at you for stating the problem. Lol at those guys asking you "why bring Misbah into this?"

Well most Pakistan players use Misbah as an example when talking about playing till their 40s. So he did set a bad example as our players think if you are fit enough you can play till 40 and over. In the history of the game, there isn't loads of players who were at a top level at 40 and over. Hence players retire in their mid 30s.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

His form is all bashing minnows in t20s Put him against zimbabwe yes he looks like bradman

Hes been poor as usual against the bigger teams australia south africa england and Nz avging 21 against these team combined in the last 4 years

Whether we have reliable batsmen after 4 or not Id rather the opportunity is given to someone to build for the future for pakistan in the limited overs format than someone whos bottled it continuously over his last 20 yrs

Yeah build a future as Pakistan gets knocked out of the first round. I think you seem oblivious to the fact that backing new/young batsmen is what Pakistan has been doing for 2 years. And none of them have shown they have what it takes to make it besides Rizwan.

Its disappointing that you can't see the bigger picture. Malik is just a better player than all these mentally weak rookies. You talk about him being a minnow-basher but fact is we can't even produce minnow-bashers anymore. And nobody wants to see club-level cricketers representing Pakistan at the World Cup.

Malik's stats against the teams you mentioned are not great in the last four years. But there are a number of things you have completely glossed over by grouping them all together. For one thing Malik has played one innings against England in this period. Its not at all fair to say he can't perform against England based on one innings. You've also conveniently ignored his strike-rates which are consistently high and much more important for a batsman playing at the number 5-6 position in T20s. Or the fact that he averages 156 in India with a SR of 140 which shows he knows how to bat on those wickets.

And you know what? Let's say Malik is a minnow-basher. Are you seriously going to tell me that we even have minnow-bashers anymore? I mean if the Zimbabwe series wasn't a reality-check I can't imagine anything from here on out that will be.

And say what you will about Malik but nobody can deny that he is one of THE BEST players of spin in the world. With the World Cup being in India that counts quite a bit.

 

[Giannis]

His form is all bashing minnows in t20s Put him against zimbabwe yes he looks like bradman

Hes been poor as usual against the bigger teams australia south africa england and Nz avging 21 against these team combined in the last 4 years

Whether we have reliable batsmen after 4 or not Id rather the opportunity is given to someone to build for the future for pakistan in the limited overs format than someone whos bottled it continuously over his last 20 yrs

Malik has a good record against India

 

[PakLFC]

Where have you been for the past 2 years? It's been tried and it didn't work. Batting talent is bankrupt in Pakistan.

It's either Malik and Chacha for the World Cup or we take Asif Ali/Danish Aziz/Khushdil level 'youngsters' who can't hit a ball. Take your pick.

Only way forward is to keep giving newbies a chance. It is not as if Shoaib is a great batsman who will be missed once he has retired. I would rather take new ones instead of a 40 year old Shoaib Malik who has never done anything special for Pak either.

 

[daytrader]

[MENTION=139316]daytrader[/MENTION]

It's funny you bring up YK.

YK was more than twice the batsman that Misbah ever was. That guy played on merit. Stop making a fool out of yourself.

My friend, the only one making a fool of themselves is you as clearly you're not acquainted with the history of Pakistani cricket. You're trying to draw me into a comparison between YK and Misbah. I shall entertain your request though and along the way maybe you will learn something.

I bring up YK for his antics before 2015WC where he would cry to the media to be selected. Eventhough he was done and dusted in ODIs, him and his friends,Basit Ali and Rashid Latif used to huff and puff for YK to be picked. In the end he was selected, because PCB had no spine back then. His performances or lack of though are there to see and as expected he failed miserably. By comparison Misbah averaged over 50 in the same tournament, so please go look up the definition of the word merit.

Malik is now following that same precedent YK set in 2015 because he knows if he cries enough and the media puts pressure he might get selected. Malik though still can merit a place in the squad as he's a good player of spin and the T20WC is taking place in India. YK had no business playing WC2015. YK retired from ODIs 1 match right after the 2015WC

 

[daytrader]

Misbah did not play on merit in white ball cricket following the Mohali game.

Misbah did not play on merit in red ball cricket after 2013. At his age he wasn't going to get better. His batting against pace got exposed in South Africa. He got found as captain after drawing against a minnow Zimbabwe side.

Lol Misbah played on merit, seriously what world do you live in bro?

Bro even in his last test series Misbah scored two 99's in WI. That is merit.
In WC2015, his last ODIs, he averaged over 50 and was our best batter. That is merit.
He was still performing before retirement.

 

[Bewal Express]

When will Shoaib Malik call it a day man...

We have tried many new players as our No.6 but going to Malik won't help either. Specially with his age and lack of ability against pace bowling.

What's the old saying about Actors, they don't retire, they just stop getting parts. As long as someone gives him a part, he will earn out of it and carry on.

 

[Zaz]

Malik has a good record against India

Not in the last few years he doesnt

Its time he was put out to pasture Let him earn his money from playing these leagues around the world

Bringing malik back for the umpteenth time at the age of 40 does pakistan no favours If he was that good he would never have been dropped so many times anyway

We know what he can offer at 5-6 with his 20s Is that what pakistan wants anymore clearly not Time to move on

 

[hitthestump]

Only way forward is to keep giving newbies a chance. It is not as if Shoaib is a great batsman who will be missed once he has retired. I would rather take new ones instead of a 40 year old Shoaib Malik who has never done anything special for Pak either.

You can't just generically say "newbies", give some names if you can. The reality is that there is nobody left to try in Pakistan. Every youngster has had their shot and they have all flopped spectacularly.

Malik ought to be nowhere near international cricket right now. But the sad fact is that despite the best efforts of the selectors they are yet to find even one batsman who can make him obsolete.

Pakistan are facing a middle order crisis leading up to the WC. You can pick your Asif's and Khushdil's who bring inexperience along with being talentless, or you can pick Malik who will probably at least contribute something. Take your pick.

 

[GreenKhan]

Bro even in his last test series Misbah scored two 99's in WI. That is merit.
In WC2015, his last ODIs, he averaged over 50 and was our best batter. That is merit.
He was still performing before retirement.

Finally a sensible poster . Misbah was there on merit.I have mentioned this in my earlier posts to . Stats don’t lie . Qudos bro

 

[topspin]

My friend, the only one making a fool of themselves is you as clearly you're not acquainted with the history of Pakistani cricket. You're trying to draw me into a comparison between YK and Misbah. I shall entertain your request though and along the way maybe you will learn something.

I bring up YK for his antics before 2015WC where he would cry to the media to be selected. Eventhough he was done and dusted in ODIs, him and his friends,Basit Ali and Rashid Latif used to huff and puff for YK to be picked. In the end he was selected, because PCB had no spine back then. His performances or lack of though are there to see and as expected he failed miserably. By comparison Misbah averaged over 50 in the same tournament, so please go look up the definition of the word merit.

Malik is now following that same precedent YK set in 2015 because he knows if he cries enough and the media puts pressure he might get selected. Malik though still can merit a place in the squad as he's a good player of spin and the T20WC is taking place in India. YK had no business playing WC2015. YK retired from ODIs 1 match right after the 2015WC

Wrong again, I'm well versed with YK's history as I have watched cricket long enough to know who has done the most damage to Pakistan cricket over the last 10 years.

I didn't agree with YK's tantrum at the time but his sins in comparison to Misbah are simply a drop in the ocean.

Any genuine well wisher for Pakistan cricket wouldn't approve of Misbah let alone indulge to such extreme lengths in the way you resolutely defend him. It is clear like the other bakhts, you support Misbah more than the Pakistan team.

 

[topspin]

Bro even in his last test series Misbah scored two 99's in WI. That is merit.
In WC2015, his last ODIs, he averaged over 50 and was our best batter. That is merit.
He was still performing before retirement.

Your analysis is biased. You've just cherry picked one series in WI, which happened to be his last series played in relatively easy batting conditions.,

As for the 2015 WC and his ODI career in his last 12-18 months, remind me what his ODI strike rate was in 2014 and in the 2015 WC?

If you know the numbers, you'll know his strike rate in 2014 and in that WC was in the low to mid 70s. All this shows his he scored runs by merely occupying the crease. He showed no intent and provided no impact. No wonder he couldn't score a single ODI ton.

Playing home cricket in the UAE has allowed him to inflate his stats well above his true caliber. The fact that he averages under 30 in Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Australia and South Africa tells you what a mediocre batsman he was.

 

[PakLFC]

You can't just generically say "newbies", give some names if you can. The reality is that there is nobody left to try in Pakistan. Every youngster has had their shot and they have all flopped spectacularly.

Malik ought to be nowhere near international cricket right now. But the sad fact is that despite the best efforts of the selectors they are yet to find even one batsman who can make him obsolete.

Pakistan are facing a middle order crisis leading up to the WC. You can pick your Asif's and Khushdil's who bring inexperience along with being talentless, or you can pick Malik who will probably at least contribute something. Take your pick.

Anyone who is doing well at domestic level. There must be some who are better then this Shoaib who is hardly a great that you are raving about him. All he is good at is edging it to slip.

Khushdil and anyone showing promise would be be much better then this clown Shoaib.

 

[Maher96]

The numbers all number 3-7 provided in the team is everything Malik can do.

That’s all he is pointing out. Sad part is he is making fun of the current lot of selected players. Straight dig goes the all rounders in the team like Hafeez, Nawaz, Imad or Shadab. He can do the same job.

 

[hitthestump]

Anyone who is doing well at domestic level. There must be some who are better then this Shoaib who is hardly a great that you are raving about him. All he is good at is edging it to slip.

Khushdil and anyone showing promise would be be much better then this clown Shoaib.

Nobody is raving about Shoaib. But i'm even less enthused about the idea of going into a World Cup with Khushdil at 5 along with someone like Asif Ali, Hussain Talat or Danish Aziz at 6. They can't even hit a ball.

Not sure how much this needs to be emphasised but domestic cricket has thrown up zero, and i mean zero batting talent required for this level. Everyone has been tried. Everyone has failed.

The best alternative to Shoaib Malik i can give you is from domestics is Chacha Iftikhar (who has failed enough at international level himself) or we can really scrape the barrel to try Sohaib Maqsood and Khurram Manzoor.

Whatever happens you are getting either a certified TTF for the World Cup or a youngster who has zero talent or ability. It's lose lose, but it's a no brainer that we lose a little less with Malik.

 

[Manzy2599]

Brother, prior to WC2011, our ODI team was in shambles. We played 23 ODIs from 2010 to the start of WC. Out of those 23, we failed to bat out 50 overs in 12! As you can see 'holding one end together was the need of the hour and Misbah fulfilled that role wonderfully.

The semi final against India wasn't his fault alone, in fact he wasn't even captain. If our lower middle order (Ajmal, Africa, Razzaq) performed that day we could've won.

Yeah it’s a team game but Misbah was there for around 30 overs of the chase so he had responsibility to see them through. He played so negatively which put pressure on Pakistan’s fragile middle who have always been poor chasers. Had he played a little more positively Pakistan would’ve made it. You can’t rely on Ajmal for batting can you? And we all know Afridi was hit and miss and Razzaq often bottled under pressure. Misbah was also the first culprit for the dropped catches which was the easiest one even before the controversial Ajmal lbw. Afridis daughter summed up his innings perfectly after the game saying he did tuk tuk throughout the innings and started hitting at the end when the game was lost while she was crying.

 

[Yasir_ch]

I will definitely take Shoaib Malik over all those useless Asif ali khushdil Shah iftikhar Hussain talat and company.

 

[gazza619]

I can bat, i can bowl, i can take 2 runs. Doesnt that sound like a bits and pieces player? Wish he had said i can score match winning 70s or a 3 wicket haul.

Malik’s mentality throughout the later part of his career has been to take satisfaction from a 20 ball 22, bowl 2 overs for 10 runs and take a catch in the midfield. Sums up the player.

 

[daytrader]

Yeah it’s a team game but Misbah was there for around 30 overs of the chase so he had responsibility to see them through. He played so negatively which put pressure on Pakistan’s fragile middle who have always been poor chasers. Had he played a little more positively Pakistan would’ve made it. You can’t rely on Ajmal for batting can you? And we all know Afridi was hit and miss and Razzaq often bottled under pressure. Misbah was also the first culprit for the dropped catches which was the easiest one even before the controversial Ajmal lbw. Afridis daughter summed up his innings perfectly after the game saying he did tuk tuk throughout the innings and started hitting at the end when the game was lost while she was crying.

Sorry I meant Akmal instead of Ajmal. The lower order consisted of Akmal, Afridi and Razzaq. Misbah came in around the 24th over with 3 wickets gone. Next over YK was gone for his measly 13 off 32 at a strike rate of 40! Essentially leaving Pakistan at 106/4 after half the innings with all of the top order back in the pavilion. YK was the real culprit. After that the rest threw away their wickets. Forget Afridi's daughter, after the match Afridi himself admitted they played 'some irresponsible shots'! So how's Misbah to blame? And why are you holding him to higher standards than the others

 

[daytrader]

Your analysis is biased. You've just cherry picked one series in WI, which happened to be his last series played in relatively easy batting conditions.,

As for the 2015 WC and his ODI career in his last 12-18 months, remind me what his ODI strike rate was in 2014 and in the 2015 WC?

If you know the numbers, you'll know his strike rate in 2014 and in that WC was in the low to mid 70s. All this shows his he scored runs by merely occupying the crease. He showed no intent and provided no impact. No wonder he couldn't score a single ODI ton.

Playing home cricket in the UAE has allowed him to inflate his stats well above his true caliber. The fact that he averages under 30 in Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Australia and South Africa tells you what a mediocre batsman he was.

I picked that series because our discussion is retirement and how Misbah has set the precedent of playing till mid 40's. That was Misbah's last series and despite his age he was still performing till the end and was deserving of a place in the team. So for someone to say that hey if Misbah can play till his 40's we can too then they need to prove it like Misbah and perform to that level. YK and Afridi weren't able to do that and I doubt Malik and Hafeez can either.

As far his low strike rate in ODIs, 75 off 100 balls is gold for a team like Pakistan that has trouble batting for 50 overs. He played according to the team requirements and within the team limitations. Everyone knows his hitting prowess, stats wise he hit a higher percentage of 6s than the likes of Malik, Akmal and Hafeez. He had to adapt his game for the teams needs and chose to put a value on his wicket rather than playing irresponsibly.

Others also played in UAE and they couldn't come up with the same performances which means he was better than the rest of the team and was deserving of his place.

 

[Snowflake]

As far his low strike rate in ODIs, 75 off 100 balls is gold for a team like Pakistan that has trouble batting for 50 overs. He played according to the team requirements and within the team limitations.

Can't believe some people still use this rubbish to justify Misbah's pathetic batting. After his retirement, this sorry excuse fell flat on its face.

 

[daytrader]

Wrong again, I'm well versed with YK's history as I have watched cricket long enough to know who has done the most damage to Pakistan cricket over the last 10 years.

I didn't agree with YK's tantrum at the time but his sins in comparison to Misbah are simply a drop in the ocean.

Any genuine well wisher for Pakistan cricket wouldn't approve of Misbah let alone indulge to such extreme lengths in the way you resolutely defend him. It is clear like the other bakhts, you support Misbah more than the Pakistan team.

Umm ok boi, I'm a bakht and you're a blind hater who even after watching cricket for so long cannot comprehend that it's a team game and a single individual cannot be blamed for an incompetent board's failures. We can remove Misbah but that's not going to change the fact that we need to improve the system and develop players at the grassroots. The board needs to take more control and it was the lack of this control that's put us in a position where we have to resort to ttfs. If they had curbed player power in the 2000's we wouldn't have had the dressing room politics and the corruption issues that put our cricket through the darkest phase of our history. While the rest of the world was improving we let our senior players roam free and be in control for their selfish reasons.

 

[daytrader]

Can't believe some people still use this rubbish to justify Misbah's pathetic batting. After his retirement, this sorry excuse fell flat on its face.

Ok flakey you can think it's an excuse but please go look up our records. Tell me of another international team that would fail to bat out 50 overs in half their matches.

 

[Energy]

I can bat, i can bowl, i can take 2 runs. Doesnt that sound like a bits and pieces player? Wish he had said i can score match winning 70s or a 3 wicket haul.

Malik’s mentality throughout the later part of his career has been to take satisfaction from a 20 ball 22, bowl 2 overs for 10 runs and take a catch in the midfield. Sums up the player.

Self satisfaction thrives in Pakistan society. No wonder our happiness index rankings are usually high.

 

[Forum363]

Ok flakey you can think it's an excuse but please go look up our records. Tell me of another international team that would fail to bat out 50 overs in half their matches.

Whats the trend before and after Misbah? Have we been able to play 50 overs or not? What have the scores been in comparison?

You will argue we just happened to have rubbish batsmen the whole time Misbah was playing - but he was precisely the problem. He built a culture of defensive cricket based on survival and created the environment where only he could ‘thrive’ by dead batting every game and scoring useless 50s.

He has wins but that was due to a rampant Ajmal/ Afridi in limited over cricket.

He left us with a final kick by recommending Azhar as the captain even though he refused to select him in the ODI team when he was leading... and once that obviously rubbish experiment was done, Pakistan’s batting immediately started to improve.

 

[TheNightWatchman]

This dude has been playing since the 1990s. That is an unbelievable amount of time and yet he's not willing to give up on an opportunity for selection.

 

[Colorblind Genius]

I would take him any day over Danish Aziz, and Nawaz.

Malik bowls just as good, and his batting and fielding agility is far superior than both combined.

I think Malik should play the upcoming T20 WC India (if that ever happens) and then exit out from Pak national team’s competition. He should be free to play in pvt leagues.

We gotta be honest with ourselves, his fitness puts Sharjeel, and Azam Khan to shame. What youngsters are we talking about?

 

[topspin]

I picked that series because our discussion is retirement and how Misbah has set the precedent of playing till mid 40's. That was Misbah's last series and despite his age he was still performing till the end and was deserving of a place in the team. So for someone to say that hey if Misbah can play till his 40's we can too then they need to prove it like Misbah and perform to that level. YK and Afridi weren't able to do that and I doubt Malik and Hafeez can either.

As far his low strike rate in ODIs, 75 off 100 balls is gold for a team like Pakistan that has trouble batting for 50 overs. He played according to the team requirements and within the team limitations. Everyone knows his hitting prowess, stats wise he hit a higher percentage of 6s than the likes of Malik, Akmal and Hafeez. He had to adapt his game for the teams needs and chose to put a value on his wicket rather than playing irresponsibly.

Others also played in UAE and they couldn't come up with the same performances which means he was better than the rest of the team and was deserving of his place.

As usual Misbah fans hate YK so much they have to make up all kind of lies and take whatever steps needed to engage in character assassination.

So many thanks for showing your true colours.

YK is and was always a superior batsman to Misbah. He was an ATG player of spin and I wouldn't put it past him if he was to get back into the Pakistan team and outperform all his team mates anywhere in Asia.

 

[topspin]

Umm ok boi, I'm a bakht and you're a blind hater who even after watching cricket for so long cannot comprehend that it's a team game and a single individual cannot be blamed for an incompetent board's failures. We can remove Misbah but that's not going to change the fact that we need to improve the system and develop players at the grassroots. The board needs to take more control and it was the lack of this control that's put us in a position where we have to resort to ttfs. If they had curbed player power in the 2000's we wouldn't have had the dressing room politics and the corruption issues that put our cricket through the darkest phase of our history. While the rest of the world was improving we let our senior players roam free and be in control for their selfish reasons.

Yes I have no shame to admit that I hate Misbah for the damage he has done to Pakistan cricket. No individual has damaged Pakistan cricket than he has over the last 10 years. My hate is purely based on cricket reasons so this dispels your dumb accusation of me being a "blind hater".

But one thing I know for certain is that you support Misbah more than Pakistan cricket. That's why you are a bakht.

 

[topspin]

"75 off 100 balls is gold for a team like Pakistan"

Oh you Misbah cheerleaders, you don't fool us

 

[IMMY69]

I would take him any day over Danish Aziz, and Nawaz.

Malik bowls just as good, and his batting and fielding agility is far superior than both combined.

I think Malik should play the upcoming T20 WC India (if that ever happens) and then exit out from Pak national team’s competition. He should be free to play in pvt leagues.

We gotta be honest with ourselves, his fitness puts Sharjeel, and Azam Khan to shame. What youngsters are we talking about?

I have put an eleven out there that doesn't include Malik or the Khushdils and Asifs.

That's the way forward.

A team with Malik in it is laughable.
I know you're better than this.

 

[TeymurBlake]

What's the old saying about Actors, they don't retire, they just stop getting parts. As long as someone gives him a part, he will earn out of it and carry on.

That's the problem, he's not going to retire. But I don't back the team to not select him.

 

[daytrader]

As usual Misbah fans hate YK so much they have to make up all kind of lies and take whatever steps needed to engage in character assassination.

So many thanks for showing your true colours.

YK is and was always a superior batsman to Misbah. He was an ATG player of spin and I wouldn't put it past him if he was to get back into the Pakistan team and outperform all his team mates anywhere in Asia.

Is that it? You have nothing else to say about the rest of the discussion and are just going to nitpick one line and divert to a discussion around YK vs Misbah? Come on topspin, you can do better!

I haven't said anywhere that I hate YK or don't think of him being a superior test batter. I simply stated a fact that he did jack just before retirement, both in ODIs and Tests
but you fail to understand this and are trying to divert to YK vs Misbah. That's a discussion for another thread. I'll make sure I tag you and share my views on the topic if I come across such a thread.

 

[daytrader]

Yes I have no shame to admit that I hate Misbah for the damage he has done to Pakistan cricket. No individual has damaged Pakistan cricket than he has over the last 10 years. My hate is purely based on cricket reasons so this dispels your dumb accusation of me being a "blind hater".

But one thing I know for certain is that you support Misbah more than Pakistan cricket. That's why you are a bakht.

You exaggerate the damage that you're envisioning in your mind. Look at the period between WC2007 and WC2011, you will see where we were and then maybe even appreciate a little bit of the stability Misbah brought.
Throughout our discussion all you've done is resort to general statements, diversions and your personal opinions of Misbah. You have not provided any cricketing reasons on how he's damaged our cricket or why he was not deserving of a place in the team.

So yes, THANK YOU for admitting you're a blind hater good sir

 

[PakSarZameen]

Not sure why Malik should retire, he adds a lot of value to his PSL side and other domestic leagues. Youngsters can learn from his experience.

As for international cricket, that is up to the selectors. If they want him, they will select him. Personally, I wouldn't want him back. Hafeez is sufficient.

I'm not a fan of telling cricketers when to retire. That is their bread and butter. If they have passion for the game, they should continue playing.

 

[Saj]

Give me Malik in the side over Asif Ali any day of the week.

Better fielder
Better batsman
Better bowler
Better support to the skipper

 

[PakLFC]

Nobody is raving about Shoaib. But i'm even less enthused about the idea of going into a World Cup with Khushdil at 5 along with someone like Asif Ali, Hussain Talat or Danish Aziz at 6. They can't even hit a ball.

Not sure how much this needs to be emphasised but domestic cricket has thrown up zero, and i mean zero batting talent required for this level. Everyone has been tried. Everyone has failed.

The best alternative to Shoaib Malik i can give you is from domestics is Chacha Iftikhar (who has failed enough at international level himself) or we can really scrape the barrel to try Sohaib Maqsood and Khurram Manzoor.

Whatever happens you are getting either a certified TTF for the World Cup or a youngster who has zero talent or ability. It's lose lose, but it's a no brainer that we lose a little less with Malik.

Okay not raving but you do want this has been 40 years old to continue until we find someone better. So if we do not find another one with potential then the average Shoaib should play on forever. I could understand if Shoaib was special but he is damn right average himself

Do you really think that Shoaib is gonna turn it on scoring plenty of runs for us in future tournaments? I say like Ramiz Raja that we need to try new names, to go forward we may need to go back. Next you will say lets bring Afridi back too Yes even a Sohaib Maqsood would be a better option then Shoaib back in the side.

 

[Bewal Express]

Give me Malik in the side over Asif Ali any day of the week.

Better fielder
Better batsman
Better bowler
Better support to the skipper

How about saying that neither is any good. Asif isn't a FC player, and any idiot that still thinks he needs to be in the side, needs their head examined. SM was a good player in his day but has done bugger all for the best part of a decade. A guy that struggled against 80mph for the best part of his career should never be in any conversation.

 

[Saj]

How about saying that neither is any good.

Well Malik's perspective is obviously that Asif is being picked ahead of him, so the comparison is a valid one really if Asif continues to be picked.

 

[Zaz]

Well Malik's perspective is obviously that Asif is being picked ahead of him, so the comparison is a valid one really if Asif continues to be picked.

Well he wont be not after this tour

Fact is neither are good enough going forward

Pakistan need to move on from Malik and if that means some pain over the next yr or two before a replacement is found than so be it

 

[topspin]

You exaggerate the damage that you're envisioning in your mind. Look at the period between WC2007 and WC2011, you will see where we were and then maybe even appreciate a little bit of the stability Misbah brought.
Throughout our discussion all you've done is resort to general statements, diversions and your personal opinions of Misbah. You have not provided any cricketing reasons on how he's damaged our cricket or why he was not deserving of a place in the team.

So yes, THANK YOU for admitting you're a blind hater good sir

Me exposing you for being a bigger Misbah supporter than the Pakistan team does not make me a blind hater.

Individuals like yourself who belong to the Misbah cult epitomise the rotten mentality of Pakistan fans.

 

[daytrader]

Me exposing you for being a bigger Misbah supporter than the Pakistan team does not make me a blind hater.

Individuals like yourself who belong to the Misbah cult epitomise the rotten mentality of Pakistan fans.

Comeback with cricketing arguments rather than personal digs hommie. Otherwise please concede your position

 

[topspin]

Is that it? You have nothing else to say about the rest of the discussion and are just going to nitpick one line and divert to a discussion around YK vs Misbah? Come on topspin, you can do better!

I haven't said anywhere that I hate YK or don't think of him being a superior test batter. I simply stated a fact that he did jack just before retirement, both in ODIs and Tests
but you fail to understand this and are trying to divert to YK vs Misbah. That's a discussion for another thread. I'll make sure I tag you and share my views on the topic if I come across such a thread.

No lets not get it twisted. You made a claim that Misbah was still performing up until his retirement whereas YK "did jack". You brought YK into this and slagged him off but it's for the best interests of the forum I expose your lies here.

Lets see how they both fared in their last full calendar year i.e 2016 prior to their retirement:

Misbah 2016 test average: 31.94
Younis Khan 2016 test average: 50.49

Now to put to the final nail in the coffin with all your nonsense, you claimed YK was unable to play at Misbah's level

 

[Bewal Express]

Well Malik's perspective is obviously that Asif is being picked ahead of him, so the comparison is a valid one really if Asif continues to be picked.

Neither should be anywhere the team. Hopefully this is the end of AA because he is rubbish and anyone that picks him should also be sacked.
.

 

[gazza619]

Give me Malik in the side over Asif Ali any day of the week.

Better fielder
Better batsman
Better bowler
Better support to the skipper

Give me anybody over Asif Ali any day of the week.

Malik at no.5 / 6 can only be useful in low scoring games.

 

[Saj]

Neither should be anywhere the team. Hopefully this is the end of AA because he is rubbish and anyone that picks him should also be sacked.
.

Probably.

But recently the middle-order struggles of Asif Ali, Haider Ali, Hussain Talat, Khushdil Shah and Danish Aziz, have been nothing but good news for Malik and his hopes of a comeback.

 

[Bewal Express]

Probably.

But recently the middle-order struggles of Asif Ali, Haider Ali, Hussain Talat, Khushdil Shah and Danish Aziz, have been nothing but good news for Malik and his hopes of a comeback.

These guys are mostly naff and bar HA have no future. SA has decades of mediocrity and is still in the conversation. Lets be honest the batting is and has been a mess for a long time. Poor players, poor attitude towards self improvement and poor selections means we have few options but going back to Malik isn't going to solve anything.

 

[daytrader]

No lets not get it twisted. You made a claim that Misbah was still performing up until his retirement whereas YK "did jack". You brought YK into this and slagged him off but it's for the best interests of the forum I expose your lies here.

Lets see how they both fared in their last full calendar year i.e 2016 prior to their retirement:

Misbah 2016 test average: 31.94
Younis Khan 2016 test average: 50.49

Now to put to the final nail in the coffin with all your nonsense, you claimed YK was unable to play at Misbah's level

BUT BUT

I need to concede my position to a lying bakht like yourself?

he averaged 37


LOL at exposing me you

 

[topspin]

he averaged 37
View attachment 108974

LOL at exposing me you

Misbah was averaging less than YK so my point still stands.

 

[daytrader]

Misbah was averaging less than YK so my point still stands.

Sure, if you believe so as that's a year you chose for your agenda. They actually retired in 2017 and Misbah was averaging higher then.

You're making this about YK vs Misbah but Misbah had always been a staunch supporter of YK. 2016 was a horrible year for YK (by his own standards). I remember his bunny hops on the crease. Most fans and critics were asking for him to be dropped but Misbah the captain persisted with him in England where he scored a double century at Lords to tie the test series. That was his saving grace that year. Misbah nor his fans are against YK but blind haters like you will make up anything to have a dig at him

 

[Colorblind Genius]

Give me anybody over Asif Ali any day of the week.

Malik at no.5 / 6 can only be useful in low scoring games.

I will happily take Asif Ali over Danish Aziz.
And one Malik to replace both the them.

 

[Colorblind Genius]

Shadab imho is underrated as a batsman but if you analyse my eleven he would be the main spinner.
Even without Shadad and say Nawaz or Qadir playing there are still enough batters for a T20 Eleven

Dude, Malik is a proper batsman with proper footwork, who can keep his head down and can drive through the covers. He is compact and fit, for a batsman.

Shadab opens his chest and legs (one facing towards leg umpire and other towards point fielder) in a standing straight posture. His batting is just as bad as a #11 tail ender. His bowling as been very ordinary too.


Fielding is the only department where Malik and Shadab can be compared, and I think they both are equally good. Shadab does have young legs and can play longer (in ODI's for example), while Malik is good enough for T20.

 

[Colorblind Genius]

Shoaib Malik will be good enough for our middle-order even 10 years from now, such is the lack of talent in Pakistan.

The fact that two middling cricketers like Malik and Hafeez - who made their debuts 22 and 18 years ago respectively - still make the team on merit simply exposes the talent deficit in Pakistan.

It is shameful situation. “Pakistan me bohat talent hai” is the biggest lie and the biggest myth that has ever been sold in cricket.

Over the last 2-3 years, Malik has repeatedly stated that he plans to retire from international cricket after the upcoming WT20.

However, in light of the recent performances of the middle-order, it appears that he has had a change of heart and probably thinks that he can walk into the middle-order for another 3-4 years.

Considering the lack of talent in Pakistan, he is not being delusional at all.

10 years is a bit of exaggeration but I agree with the notion.

Gots to give credit to Malik for staying fit even after he is long overdue the retirement. But then again, he is not delusional to see the declining quality of our batting, and rightly so, feels like there is still an opportunity for him.

If the team was packed with talent and promising young players, Malik would know there is no chance.

Malik's fitness level should be an example for many upcoming so called "TALENTED" players, as their fitness is laughable.

 

[Kaddy]

He must be feeling confident after watching Asif Ali & Danish Aziz

 

[Zaz]

These guys are mostly naff and bar HA have no future. SA has decades of mediocrity and is still in the conversation. Lets be honest the batting is and has been a mess for a long time. Poor players, poor attitude towards self improvement and poor selections means we have few options but going back to Malik isn't going to solve anything.

This How can you develop options and long term players if you keep running back to a 40yr old with a pretty mediocre record?

They need to keep trying players How can pakistan cricket move forward if it keeps taking steps back?

 

[Bewal Express]

This How can you develop options and long term players if you keep running back to a 40yr old with a pretty mediocre record?

They need to keep trying players How can pakistan cricket move forward if it keeps taking steps back?

Totally agree. But the selectors panic if we lose some pointless series and then we rinse and repeat. It's an utter shambles.

 

[Shoaibbtt]

This How can you develop options and long term players if you keep running back to a 40yr old with a pretty mediocre record?

They need to keep trying players How can pakistan cricket move forward if it keeps taking steps back?

One guy said it the other day he’s a deadwood player, there’s zero point in this attention seeker because he’s no longer relevant. He does well in chasing those low to medium scores but fails whenever we need to build a score or chase a big total. He’s one dimensional and always has been in my view.

For me if we add Khurrum Manzoor and Shoaib Moqsood to the squad it will be better with Babar and Rizwan coming down the order.

 

[Manzy2599]

Sorry I meant Akmal instead of Ajmal. The lower order consisted of Akmal, Afridi and Razzaq. Misbah came in around the 24th over with 3 wickets gone. Next over YK was gone for his measly 13 off 32 at a strike rate of 40! Essentially leaving Pakistan at 106/4 after half the innings with all of the top order back in the pavilion. YK was the real culprit. After that the rest threw away their wickets. Forget Afridi's daughter, after the match Afridi himself admitted they played 'some irresponsible shots'! So how's Misbah to blame? And why are you holding him to higher standards than the others

Still Akmal, Afridi and Razzaq were never reliable batsman but Misbah was known for stabilizing the innings and was hyped up as a finisher. Yes YK played a very poor innings aswell but Misbah gets held to higher standards because he came in at the 24th over and stayed till the last ball. Even at 106/4 the required rate was 6 which is run a ball. Any other teams ‘finisher’ would’ve finished the job. Misbah put pressure on himself because he miscalculated the chase. He went into defensive mode straightaway which was not required. He focused on tuk tuk and thought I’ll make up later. The run rate started climbing steeply which led to poor shots from the non strikers cause misbahs approach was I’ll stay in and you go for it. He should’ve just played positively with singles and doubles and getting the odd boundary cause this wasn’t a very strong Indian attack either. We knew Misbah was good vs spin and he still played out maidens. This guy equaled the fastest test hundred vs Australia so it was really strange to see him go into a shell. Yuvraj and Harbajhan were bowling wicket to wicket with barely any spin. Munaf Patel was a one trick pony bowling 130 with the odd slower ball so he should’ve targeted them. We saw him hit Zaheer khan and nehra from the 48th over but it was far too late then. Even if he took initiative from the 45th over and took majority of the strike they should’ve finished it off. 56 off 76 might look fine on paper but it should’ve been atleast run a ball with 95-100 strike rate. This game should’ve also been his redemption after the 2 failed chases in the 2007 t20 world cups. That semi final game broke millions of Pakistani hearts and still hurts to talk about it today.

 

[Zaz]

Totally agree. But the selectors panic if we lose some pointless series and then we rinse and repeat. It's an utter shambles.

True Theres no patience n you cant panic on the back of a defeat or two. It takes time to develop players for most countries not just pakistan Yes asif ali and khushdil dont look the part So lets give others a chance

The management and selectors need to hold their ground on malik There should be no coming back for him Theres going to be some rough results but it ll all work for the better in the long run

 

[shamaan]

Read the entire post. Malik has been in very good form in the last four years. He makes the team on merit alone. The same goes for Hafeez. Rather than drudging up old tournaments when both players were clearly not the players they are now with much improved strike-rates, I urge you to look at the numbers instead of projecting whatever bias you may have against them.

Fact of the matter is that we wouldn't even be having this conversation if we actually had some reliable batsmen in the middle-order. But as we all know Pakistan's T20 batting basically ends at No.4.

Malik said he only wants to bat at 4 and made it clear if that's the only position then he should not be in the squad.

 

[shamaan]

If malik only wants to bat 4 then he should not be part of any squad.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Malik said he only wants to bat at 4 and made it clear if that's the only position then he should not be in the squad.

Last I checked he was neither coach nor captain.

He'll fall in line once you make him fall in line.

 

[Snowflake]

If malik only wants to bat 4 then he should not be part of any squad.

Players make such statements when they know that they are playing under a spineless captain. The sense of entitlement has always been strong among the Pakistani players, but no one would dare say such a thing if they were playing under IK, Wasim or even Inzi. As a captain, if you have a player dictate where he'll play, would you stand back and just take it? Malik knows that Babar is a pushover, hence the attitude.

These guys need a captain like Wasim who would abuse the c*ap out of them if they spouted such rubbish. While Babar may not be able to do that because of his lack of tenure, he can certainly command respect and form a culture where players do not speak out of turn. But that's probably asking for too much from him.

 

[topspin]

Sure, if you believe so as that's a year you chose for your agenda. They actually retired in 2017 and Misbah was averaging higher then.

You're making this about YK vs Misbah but Misbah had always been a staunch supporter of YK. 2016 was a horrible year for YK (by his own standards). I remember his bunny hops on the crease. Most fans and critics were asking for him to be dropped but Misbah the captain persisted with him in England where he scored a double century at Lords to tie the test series. That was his saving grace that year. Misbah nor his fans are against YK but blind haters like you will make up anything to have a dig at him

Remember you brought up YK and slagged him off not me.

In 2017 they didn't play a whole year, not even half a year if I remember correctly which is 2016 stats are more relevant rather than one test series in WI.

Call me a blind hater as much as you like but the fact of the matter is over 80% of posters from all those who voted in that poll were against Misbah's appointment as Head Coach. So going by your brain dead logic, does that mean we are all haters?

There was also poll following the recent humiliation against Zimbabwe. That percentage has shot up to over 90%.

I am one of them because I genuinely care about the best interests of Pakistan cricket. You clearly don't which is why you it stings you when I expose you for being a bigger Misbah fan than the Pakistan team.

I've had enough of schooling you and reading your drivel. I will end by saying once a bakht and always a bakht.

 

[daytrader]

Remember you brought up YK and slagged him off not me.

In 2017 they didn't play a whole year, not even half a year if I remember correctly which is 2016 stats are more relevant rather than one test series in WI.

Call me a blind hater as much as you like but the fact of the matter is over 80% of posters from all those who voted in that poll were against Misbah's appointment as Head Coach. So going by your brain dead logic, does that mean we are all haters?

There was also poll following the recent humiliation against Zimbabwe. That percentage has shot up to over 90%.

I am one of them because I genuinely care about the best interests of Pakistan cricket. You clearly don't which is why you it stings you when I expose you for being a bigger Misbah fan than the Pakistan team.

I've had enough of schooling you and reading your drivel. I will end by saying once a bakht and always a bakht.

Majority isn't always right if that was the case we wouldn't see populists like Modi, Trump and IK be in power. Hating on Misbah is a favourite pass time for majority of the regular posters here, it doesn't mean most readers agree. I've been here longer than you and only started posting more recently because it's getting out of hand.
God has given you a brain and yet somehow you conclude that one individual has ruined our cricket lol. How can you logically overlook the years of incompetence, corruption and nepotism? All I can say to someone like you is sheep follow sheep. Don't be a sheep hater, use what God gave you

 

[shamaan]

Last I checked he was neither coach nor captain.

He'll fall in line once you make him fall in line.

But if he doesn't want to bat at 4 just leave it as that and say you don't fit the team combination.how do you make someone fa
In line after so many years.

 

[HussainZ]

It would be a travesty if Malik comes back. It would be like moving one step forward and 10 steps back, in fact no step forward and a mile back

 

[shamaan]

Players make such statements when they know that they are playing under a spineless captain. The sense of entitlement has always been strong among the Pakistani players, but no one would dare say such a thing if they were playing under IK, Wasim or even Inzi. As a captain, if you have a player dictate where he'll play, would you stand back and just take it? Malik knows that Babar is a pushover, hence the attitude.

These guys need a captain like Wasim who would abuse the c*ap out of them if they spouted such rubbish. While Babar may not be able to do that because of his lack of tenure, he can certainly command respect and form a culture where players do not speak out of turn. But that's probably asking for too much from him.

Babar already stated it was his decision when malik made a statement about misbah in control of things.its obviously that babar doesn't run the show.simple if he's trying to dictate forget it and say you don't fit our combo no need to pick him in the squad.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

But if he doesn't want to bat at 4 just leave it as that and say you don't fit the team combination.how do you make someone fa
In line after so many years.

He will bat wherever the team wants him to bat. And its unlikely that will be at 4.

If he doesn't like it he will be shown the door. The team is not going to cater to him.

Malik is not stupid. He can be a dressing room politician when he wants to. His aim was clearly to grab the headlines and get people talking, which is what he managed to do.

Frankly, I don't care about any of the games he is playing to get back into the team as long as he has the capability to deliver as a player.

 

[daytrader]

Players make such statements when they know that they are playing under a spineless captain. The sense of entitlement has always been strong among the Pakistani players, but no one would dare say such a thing if they were playing under IK, Wasim or even Inzi. As a captain, if you have a player dictate where he'll play, would you stand back and just take it? Malik knows that Babar is a pushover, hence the attitude.

These guys need a captain like Wasim who would abuse the c*ap out of them if they spouted such rubbish. While Babar may not be able to do that because of his lack of tenure, he can certainly command respect and form a culture where players do not speak out of turn. But that's probably asking for too much from him.

While I agree that senior player power needs to be curbed, I don't believe granting a captain more powers is the way. Especially in Pakistan as we are constantly playing musical chairs with captaincy. At some point these guys play under each other. Gone are the days of strong captains, especially now with franchise cricket being so popular. A captain has lots of other responsibilities (such as on field tactics, fielding placements, bowling changes etc) that they shouldn't have to be involved in selection politics. The whip should solely be with team management

 

[shamaan]

He will bat wherever the team wants him to bat. And its unlikely that will be at 4.

If he doesn't like it he will be shown the door. The team is not going to cater to him.

Malik is not stupid. He can be a dressing room politician when he wants to. His aim was clearly to grab the headlines and get people talking, which is what he managed to do.

Frankly, I don't care about any of the games he is playing to get back into the team as long as he has the capability to deliver as a player.

Exactly that's what am saying that if he doesn't want to bat in any other position but 4 he should be shown the door.