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Tape Ball Star
- Joined
- Oct 5, 2019
- Runs
- 940
Had a great year in general, and specifically with the ball.
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I was a critic of him last year as he wasn't doing what his primary job, taking wickets and being economical. He has changed that & turned it around so fair play to him.
Saqlain must have helped him so Saqi needs to be kept on even if he doesn't land the head coach role.
I think he's a very talented bowler.
Wrist spin isn't easy. Warney debuted at 22/23 & wasn't quite ready.
If Shadab is now 23 -25 then he's worth developing still as a bowler. He's just begun to master his trade. I think he needs some more FC cricket- domestic, A Tours home & away where he can play as lead spinner to develop.
He's figured out how to be good in T20 (maybe ODI too). I still think he can be a key part of your Test team too. Good wrist spin gets wickets all around the world.
I agree; he should play Test cricket too after playing some FC games. He may prove to be an excellent all-rounder. I'm hopeful. However, I fear that he will decide to give up his bowling in the future because I feel that he thinks of himself as a batsman first.
Shadab Khan last 3 PSL matches:
4-15-4 (16 dot balls)
4-20-4 (12 dot balls)
4-28-5 (10 dot balls)
The boy has finally grown up and is acting like a man he was destined to be
Got distracted in the last few years but ever since that Rishabh pant wicket in match against India which broke all chances of india having a good score- his confidence has been very high
Lol nothing has changed. The guy still misses his length... Half of those wickets were flukes..
If this guy was consisstent with his line qnd length, he would had been something else......
No, he’s landing his balls a lot better and there is zip. Fielding was always top notch.
Batting has improved a lot.
Keep in mind, leg spinners depend on confidence… whenever his confidence is high, he will be a different player
Look at our other leg spinner - Usman Qadri - he’s struggling
flukes his way to the highest wicket taker list. Man oh man.
Anyways i still support him so good job. I really he becomes the highest wicket taker and run scorer of this psl
Major trolling ������*![]()
Shadab Khan last 3 PSL matches:
4-15-4 (16 dot balls)
4-20-4 (12 dot balls)
4-28-5 (10 dot balls)
If you’re expecting him to be Shane Warner then I’m sorrysorry but he isnt. Everyone is blinded by his wickets. Shadab hasnt been able to bowl at the right line or length.....
He bowls it too short or too full. Thats the story of his career.
Only thing that is working for him is his speed variation.. The guy is talented enough that the balls which he does land on the right line and length he can trouble the batsmen.
But every over he bowls 2 crap balls and 2 good ones. He will pick wicket here, but at international level he will still get smacked.
If you’re expecting him to be Shane Warner then I’m sorry
He’s the best Pakistan has as a wrist spinner and he has gotten key wickets to turn matches in pakistans favor. That’s what spinners need to do
Actually a spinners main method of disguise isn’t line and length, it’s to deceive in flight.he aint the best sorry. He could be the best but it looks he wont be come one..
A spinners main weapon isnt spin, but its his line and length. Your spin means nothing if you cant bowl line and length.
He fails to perform at international level because there he gets exposed.
Actually a spinners main method of disguise isn’t line and length, it’s to deceive in flight.
Secondly amount of spin is very important.
Line and length without guile and spin, overspin or googly will
Lead to a trashing
And he did take Yuvraj Singh and pant wicket when it mattered
And please do share a list of incredible leg spinners that will be better than shadab as a total package in pakistan in Lois
Let’s try to answer the question asked which is about please list another leg spinner in pakistan better than shadab.Nawaz as a left arm offie bowls good line and length, his issue is he doesnt spin it that much. Zahid mehmood was wasted under sarfraz, he had good accuracy and could had been focused on. Plus, babar wil never prefer him over his friend usman qadir
Ur amount of spin means nothig when you cannot even land the ball at the right place. Usman qadir is the best example of this. No one in pakistan has a bigger spin than usman qadir, infact his spin is more lethal as bowled at a straighter trajectory and than when it turns it surprises everyone.
His issue again ist line and length.
It seems you wont be convinced so lets just agree to disagree here.
Nawaz as a left arm offie bowls good line and length, his issue is he doesnt spin it that much. Zahid mehmood was wasted under sarfraz, he had good accuracy and could had been focused on. Plus, babar wil never prefer him over his friend usman qadir
Does not matter... It is not compulsory that a leg spinner be played.Let’s try to answer the question asked which is about please list another leg spinner in pakistan better than shadab.
We aren’t talking about SLA, we are talking about wrist spinners that get overspin, topspin as well as googly.
Thank you.
With respect, how I respond to your post varies according to which format we are discussing.
Let's start with 20 and 50 over cricket.
Imran Tahir is a fine example - as is Adam Zampa - of how a leg-spinner can thrive in white ball cricket even if he lacks the control over line and length to be conomicial in Test cricket.
That sounds counter-intuitive, but white ball cricket involves an aggressive shot every ball, whereas red ball cricket is all about a sound defence and ability to score off the occasional bad ball. Shane Warne was not as good at spinning the ball as Stuart MacGill, but he kept him out of the Test side because every ball was delivered accurately by Warne, but not MacGill.
I think in white ball cricket that there is little difference between Zahid Mehmood, Usman Qadir and Shadab Khan as bowlers, but Shadab is the best choice because he is also an electric fielder and excellent batsman. Nawaz is a good batsman too, but he can't field like Shadab and he is an accurate left-arm roller like Jadeja who is not going to fool anybody with variations.
Red ball cricket is different. And my views on this are not mainstream views in Asia.
The way I see it, in Asia you always need a specialist spin bowler in every Test. And he needs to be better than Shadab Khan or Ravendra Jadeja or Moeen Ali.
In SENA, a spinner is only ever decisive in the fourth innings, and not very often. You need someone who can bowl some spin in case you find yourself defending 250 on Day 5 on a wearing pitch, but a part-timer like Jadeja or Moeen Ali is good enough.
So in SENA, for at least 3 innings of every Test your spinner is valuable mainly as a batsman or as a fielder.
If you look at the history of Pakistan legspin bowlers in Tests, this is what you see:
Danish Kaneria: 261 wickets at 34.79, 360 runs at 7.05
Abdul Qadir: 236 wickets at 32.80, 1029 runs at 15.59
Yasir Shah: 235 wickets at 31.80, 847 runs at 13.66
Mushtaq Ahmed: 185 wickets at 32.97, 656 runs at 11.71
Intikhab Alam: 125 wickets at 35.95, 1493 runs at 22.98
Shahid Afridi: 48 wickets in 27 Tests at 35.60, 1716 runs at 36.51
Shadab Khan: 14 wickets in 6 Tests at 36.64, 300 runs at 33.33
My point is this. The difference between a Test bowling average of 32 and 36 is significant if bowling is all that you do.
But in SENA, if I have a choice between the following two spin bowlers:
Shadab Khan: bowling average 36.64, scores 50 runs per test at an average of 33.33.
Specialist Bowler B: bowling average 32, scores 15 runs per Test at an average of 10.
.......I am going to take Shadab every time in SENA.
Go back and look at the records of Danish Kaneria and Shahid Afridi. It's a complete disaster that Kaneria played so many Tests just because in one Test v Bangladesh he took 12-94. Remove that one outlier Test and Kaneria averaged 36.10 in 61 Tests, which is actually worse than Afridi's average of 35.60.
In short, Pakistan picked a specialist and gained virtually nothing with the ball, but got a guy who scored 6 runs per Test instead of the guy who scored 64 runs per Test.
That's the value of Shadab Khan. He can't be Abdul Qadir. But he can be Shahid Afridi - and in SENA that is ideal, and in Asia it makes him a decent support spinner for Sajid Khan.
With respect, how I respond to your post varies according to which format we are discussing.
Let's start with 20 and 50 over cricket.
Imran Tahir is a fine example - as is Adam Zampa - of how a leg-spinner can thrive in white ball cricket even if he lacks the control over line and length to be conomicial in Test cricket.
That sounds counter-intuitive, but white ball cricket involves an aggressive shot every ball, whereas red ball cricket is all about a sound defence and ability to score off the occasional bad ball. Shane Warne was not as good at spinning the ball as Stuart MacGill, but he kept him out of the Test side because every ball was delivered accurately by Warne, but not MacGill.
I think in white ball cricket that there is little difference between Zahid Mehmood, Usman Qadir and Shadab Khan as bowlers, but Shadab is the best choice because he is also an electric fielder and excellent batsman. Nawaz is a good batsman too, but he can't field like Shadab and he is an accurate left-arm roller like Jadeja who is not going to fool anybody with variations.
Red ball cricket is different. And my views on this are not mainstream views in Asia.
The way I see it, in Asia you always need a specialist spin bowler in every Test. And he needs to be better than Shadab Khan or Ravendra Jadeja or Moeen Ali.
In SENA, a spinner is only ever decisive in the fourth innings, and not very often. You need someone who can bowl some spin in case you find yourself defending 250 on Day 5 on a wearing pitch, but a part-timer like Jadeja or Moeen Ali is good enough.
So in SENA, for at least 3 innings of every Test your spinner is valuable mainly as a batsman or as a fielder.
If you look at the history of Pakistan legspin bowlers in Tests, this is what you see:
Danish Kaneria: 261 wickets at 34.79, 360 runs at 7.05
Abdul Qadir: 236 wickets at 32.80, 1029 runs at 15.59
Yasir Shah: 235 wickets at 31.80, 847 runs at 13.66
Mushtaq Ahmed: 185 wickets at 32.97, 656 runs at 11.71
Intikhab Alam: 125 wickets at 35.95, 1493 runs at 22.98
Shahid Afridi: 48 wickets in 27 Tests at 35.60, 1716 runs at 36.51
Shadab Khan: 14 wickets in 6 Tests at 36.64, 300 runs at 33.33
My point is this. The difference between a Test bowling average of 32 and 36 is significant if bowling is all that you do.
But in SENA, if I have a choice between the following two spin bowlers:
Shadab Khan: bowling average 36.64, scores 50 runs per test at an average of 33.33.
Specialist Bowler B: bowling average 32, scores 15 runs per Test at an average of 10.
.......I am going to take Shadab every time in SENA.
Go back and look at the records of Danish Kaneria and Shahid Afridi. It's a complete disaster that Kaneria played so many Tests just because in one Test v Bangladesh he took 12-94. Remove that one outlier Test and Kaneria averaged 36.10 in 61 Tests, which is actually worse than Afridi's average of 35.60.
In short, Pakistan picked a specialist and gained virtually nothing with the ball, but got a guy who scored 6 runs per Test instead of the guy who scored 64 runs per Test.
That's the value of Shadab Khan. He can't be Abdul Qadir. But he can be Shahid Afridi - and in SENA that is ideal, and in Asia it makes him a decent support spinner for Sajid Khan.
I think the premise of you your post is correct and for the reasons above I too would pick Shadab in every test match puayed in SENA.
However, where I disagree is that Shadab is still very very young for a leg spinner and is some way away from reaching his peak. On this basis, and because he's a gun fielder and more then handy with the bat, I would pick him as the second or third spinner in sub continent conditions. So basically I would pick him in every test match played by Pakistan unless its an absolute green samba of a wicket. But even then I would assess how his batting is coming along and if he really improves on this front then I would bat him at 6 even on a green wicket.
Sometimes a player comes along and you can just see the talent he has and you have to make a decision to back him in a ll conditions. I think Shadab is one of those players.
it isnt about talent, Shadab is a flashy player with a similar personality which we confuse it with Talent...
The reason he gets chosen above Nawaz is because of his personality, nothing else.
Pakistan might go with SHadab for 1-2 more years when they finally realize that the guy aint gonna improve...
I think you you're talking about a different player.
This is Shadab Khan who has been exceptional of late in T20's, he was arguably our best bowler in the recently concluded world cup and took for wickets for nothing in the final.
He's a gun fielder at cover point and an extremely safe pair of hands. Catches win matches in all formats and his fielding, in the shorter formats, is extremely useful.
What I've mentioned above is a fact, nothing flashy...
In tests, he has only played 6 games and if you apply some cricketing logic you'll know that a leg spinner gets better with age so there is plenty of time for him to improve in test match cricket too.
He is nowhere near the finished article which tells you he has an extremely high ceiling.
Surely this is not the player you're talking about? Maybe set up a different thread to discuss the player you have in mind.
Just because hes a flashy player doenst make him international standard one...
Before telling me to apply cricketing logic, why not look at Shadab Khan's bowling from a qualitative pov. Statistics in his case are flawed once you see what he does in reality.
His fielding means nothing when he cant do his primary job. If fielding was the criteria, than Imran Butt would be getting the openers slot for the next 3 years.
A leg spinner gets better with age when he is actually playing cricket. He has only managed to play 11 first class games in 4 years.
Also in those 4 years, his line and length has only deteriorated.
But i understand, just because he is flashy and is kind of a cool personality, people will be blind to his 2 half of the pitch balls and 2 full toss bowling in every over.
Such bowlers dont survive in international, and his record in odis are already terrible
Just because hes a flashy player doenst make him international standard one...
Before telling me to apply cricketing logic, why not look at Shadab Khan's bowling from a qualitative pov. Statistics in his case are flawed once you see what he does in reality.
His fielding means nothing when he cant do his primary job. If fielding was the criteria, than Imran Butt would be getting the openers slot for the next 3 years.
A leg spinner gets better with age when he is actually playing cricket. He has only managed to play 11 first class games in 4 years.
Also in those 4 years, his line and length has only deteriorated.
But i understand, just because he is flashy and is kind of a cool personality, people will be blind to his 2 half of the pitch balls and 2 full toss bowling in every over.
Such bowlers dont survive in international, and his record in odis are already terrible
He avges 32 in odis How is that terrible? Yes he isnt no warne with the ball but as a package adds great value for money when you take into account his excellent fielding and more than useful lower order batting
Shadab is a great asset to the pakistan and hopefully will continue to get better and improve
Read my post again.
You are th one that called him a flashy player. You said one should not mix flashy with talent.
I don't think he is a flashy player, and even if he is he has backed it up with performances.
I'm sorry but you are just making arguments for the sake of it. Not really making much sense
If you dont see anything wrong with his bowling accuracy and are enjoying the 14 wickets he has taken than i wont argue any further....
Based on what can be seen by his bowling, when he will be bowling at international level only than would people get that these domestic wickets mean nothing when you dont have accuracy in your bowling. You survive international cricket on accuracy
So for the record,
Shadab has a better bowling average then Jadeja and Ashwin in both T20's and Odi's.
The man averages 21.79 in T20's.
Plus e'sonly payed 6 tests matches and mostly in SENA
He has been bowling really well for some time. Even in t20 World Cup, he was pretty good.
Pakistan has four players with the potential to be world class Test cricketers.It really bothers me that he is not serious about test cricket .
He has the game for it and if he gets serious about it he will be a difference for us challenging top 3 test positions or staying a mid table team .
It really bothers me that he is not serious about test cricket .
He has the game for it and if he gets serious about it he will be a difference for us challenging top 3 test positions or staying a mid table team .
Yes plus he’s young and athletic plus can bat.Pakistan has four players with the potential to be world class Test cricketers.
Three of them already are: Babar Azam, Mohammad Rizwan and Shaheen Shah Afridi.
Shadab Khan is the other guy with the potential to be a decisive Test cricketer.
And four is enough to be a Top Three Test team: the only Aussie cricketers in that bracket are currently Labuschagne, Smith and Cummins.
England has Root and Stokes.
New Zealand has Williamson and Jameson.
India has Kohli and Bumrah.
Shadab's really stepped up his game over the last few months. His bowling has been top class with much more control, he has looked more confident with the bat and just seems to have a better idea on his role for whatever team he plays for.
Would love to see him potentially play some county or FC later this year just to help refine his skills furthermore. Can see him being a great asset for us in tests within the next year or two
Don't watch PSL but if Shadab is finding his confidence again that's a positive sign.
However it's nonsense to suggest he should be recalled to the Test team based on PSL form. Big difference between bowling 4 overs where batsmen are looking to attack you, and bowling 20+ overs in a Test innings where you're expected to hold an end.
naa, he aint ready for test. With the line and length he has got, he aint gonna trouble no one.
I think Shadab should just play 1 or 2 seasons of first class cricket. If he can make his accuracy consisstent, than he should plan to play all three formats.
If Shadab cant fix his accuracy, than screw test and first class. He can make easy money by just playing limited overs for Pakistan and t20 all over the world.
There is no point in playing first class and test if you cant fix your accuracy, better to just earn money as t20 franchise player
With respect, you are still thinking of Shadab Khan as a specialist spinner.
I don’t think that’s his role.
His role is to be a Tony Greig / Moeen Ali, who can reliably average 35 with the bat from Number 7 in Tests and bowl 4 decent overs of spin per session in the first three innings of a Test and bowl more on Day 5.