[VIDEOS] Shan Masood Career Poultry Farm

[unemployedgm]

Imam scores runs against International Bowlers because there is no real incentive to stop a batsman batting at a SR of 70 odd in ODI Cricket.

 

[unemployedgm]

That's an eye opener. Shows that even on his 'peak' tours he returned sub 40 averages. This is Bangladesh level performance. If there was ever a moment glorifying mediocrity, we have seen it with PCB and Shan.

Bangladesh has a far better batting lineup than Pakistan.

 

[ads101]

To be honest Ahmed Shehzad has not done anything bad in his test career. He looks better batsman than Shan and abid

I wouldn't mind seeing shehzad back in tests before and felt he was harshly dropped from the test side, but he's gone downhill since that incident and isn't in good form. So he's not really an option to bring back.

 

[Energy]

Just took at a look at Shan's record. An average of 34 in FC and 54 in List A. That is a big, big gap and don't know why the selectors never saw this.

 

[UzmanBeast]

Hardworking doesn’t buy ability.

I agree with you that this is not the last of Masood in Test cricket. He will make a comeback and perhaps not even get dropped after this, but the point is that his chapter should be closed now because it is blatantly obvious that he will never succeed at this level.

Just a terrible opener with no ability at all. He might have made the Wisden team of the year in a pandemic hit year, but this guy is not good enough to get into the Irish and Zimbabwean Test teams.

Exactly. He lacks the skillset to be a successful top-order batsman. We need to move on from him.

 

[D/DAhmed]

Fyi there is no comparison between. Asad Shafiq and Shan.

Secondly, Shans failing isn't a lack of ability. Unlike his FC average which is in the low 30s, his List A average is 59. Shan doesn't score runs because his approach at the crease in the longer format is to survive. Let me say this again, it is impossible to have an average of note when you are never trying to score runs. Apart from being a default mechanism, this happens when you are fearful and mentally weak.

He is not the only one. Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq who are far better players have employed the same approach. So where is this coming from?

Who pioneered this approach?

List A pitches in Pakistan are flat as pancakes, and it is incredibly easy to face the hard and new white ball on them. This is why you have the likes of Khurram Manzoor, Sharjeel Khan, Sami Aslam, Sahibzada Farhan etc averaging 50+ in List A. I think even Asad Shafiq has a 60+ average as a List A opener if you exclude his ODI innings. Not just that, but for the past 10 years the best domestic bowlers in Pakistan rarely played List A competitions, so you'd have trundlers like Saad Altaf running in and bowling even slower than the national traitor Abbas. It's why barely anyone has been selected for ODI's on the basis of their List A performances, instead we used to select top order players for ODI's based on their Test performance, and lower-order players based off T20.

Shan Masood has become a source of shame for his country and his family. I noticed recently that off the pitch he wears glasses, and I hope he wears contact lens when he bats because its clear that he sees the ball incredibly late. That's why he keeps nicking behind on the leg side, missing yorkers and scores most of his runs through the gap between third and fourth slip. I think this is also the reason he plays the short-ball better, as he gets more time to actually see the delivery (a reason as to why his average is better in South Africa and Australia). Regardless, its time to tear up his parchi and wave goodbye to him once and for all, because he does not have what it takes for this level. Frankly, if his job is to score 0(22), then Abbas has already shown he is capable enough to do that job.

 

[MenInG]

Before we get too far ahead of us with praise for Shan in the Derbyshire thread, lets remind ourselves of this thread and the comments by some.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Before we get too far ahead of us with praise for Shan in the Derbyshire thread, lets remind ourselves of this thread and the comments by some.

I think alot of posters have been left to eat humble pie.

This kind of domination by an overseas batter is unheard of in County cricket nowadays. The detractors will still find ways to downplay Shan's extraordinary performance. But their words mean nothing when his bat is doing all the talking.

 

[Usman]

I think alot of posters have been left to eat humble pie.

This kind of domination by an overseas batter is unheard of in County cricket nowadays. The detractors will still find ways to downplay Shan's extraordinary performance. But their words mean nothing when his bat is doing all the talking.

Congratulations to Shan and I hope this marks a turning point in his career. However the comments in this thread are entirely justified and are a result of years of really quite awful performances from Shan. If he can replicate this sort of form and ability in international cricket then heck, get him into the test team now in place of Fawad and get him in the ODI team in place of Iftikhar or Kushdil.

In the test team I would have Shan bat at 3 because both Imam and Abdullah did exceptionally well against Australia and I would rather not fix what isn’t broken. However Shan can take 3 and Azhar can move down to 5.

In the ODI team, I think realistically Shan could take 4 as the top three are settled and cannot be shifted.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Congratulations to Shan and I hope this marks a turning point in his career. However the comments in this thread are entirely justified and are a result of years of really quite awful performances from Shan. If he can replicate this sort of form and ability in international cricket then heck, get him into the test team now in place of Fawad and get him in the ODI team in place of Iftikhar or Kushdil.

In the test team I would have Shan bat at 3 because both Imam and Abdullah did exceptionally well against Australia and I would rather not fix what isn’t broken. However Shan can take 3 and Azhar can move down to 5.

In the ODI team, I think realistically Shan could take 4 as the top three are settled and cannot be shifted.

They are not. If you go back and read them, most of them are personal comments rather than an objective look at his numbers.

One poster even said that the book should be closed on him (eventhough its more than likely that Shan will make a comeback) because he believes that Shan is not good enough for test cricket.

Whenever Shan got selected in the national side in the last 4 years, it was because he scored runs in domestic cricket. Whatever alternative history you are reading is simply incorrect.

He had one terrible series in New Zealand for which he was seemingly banished, all while Imran Butt played multiple series as a specialist fielder.

Since then he has smashed bowling attacks in the QeA Trophy, had an amazing PSL where he was the 3rd highest run-scorer and now is dominating County cricket. At the end of the day, you can't keep a good man down for long.

 

[Nasty Naz]

I think alot of posters have been left to eat humble pie.

This kind of domination by an overseas batter is unheard of in County cricket nowadays. The detractors will still find ways to downplay Shan's extraordinary performance. But their words mean nothing when his bat is doing all the talking.

His FC record was poor for a very long time and despite the crazy runs he's been piling, it's only now getting to a respectable FC overall.

Good for him but but let's keep in mind, he has been given plenty of chances in Test matches and made plenty of comebacks. He has never been able to stick despite Pakistan being extremely desperate for a Test opener for years.

I'd be willing to give him a shot at #3 over Azhar considering how old and poor Azhar is but as an opener, I would still rather stick with Imam who is showing plenty of potential and is quite young. Imam has been doing exceptionally well in FC too last few seasons.

 

[GreenKhan]

Just for the record Shan masood last 4 test innings for Pak was 8,0,0,0.

Many felt he had turned a corner after his 156 against England but he scored only 32 runs in his following 8 innings .

He was rightly dropped .

His loss of form was another persons gain.

Scoring runs in the county circuit for part of season does not now give him direct selection into the test side and overlook all his previous failings .

Also despite playing nearly 25 tests and 50 innings he still is not averaging 30, so it’s fair to say he had had his chances to cement his position and has failed to do so .

People just need to relax and put things in perspective.

 

[hitthestump]

Congratulations to Shan and I hope this marks a turning point in his career. However the comments in this thread are entirely justified and are a result of years of really quite awful performances from Shan. If he can replicate this sort of form and ability in international cricket then heck, get him into the test team now in place of Fawad and get him in the ODI team in place of Iftikhar or Kushdil.

In the test team I would have Shan bat at 3 because both Imam and Abdullah did exceptionally well against Australia and I would rather not fix what isn’t broken. However Shan can take 3 and Azhar can move down to 5.

In the ODI team, I think realistically Shan could take 4 as the top three are settled and cannot be shifted.

Good post. While we can all be hopeful that the latest model of Shan 6.0 will be the real deal, the previous interations of his cricket deserved the criticism.

 

[Usman]

They are not. If you go back and read them, most of them are personal comments rather than an objective look at his numbers.

One poster even said that the book should be closed on him (eventhough its more than likely that Shan will make a comeback) because he believes that Shan is not good enough for test cricket.

Whenever Shan got selected in the national side in the last 4 years, it was because he scored runs in domestic cricket. Whatever alternative history you are reading is simply incorrect.

He had one terrible series in New Zealand for which he was seemingly banished, all while Imran Butt played multiple series as a specialist fielder.

Since then he has smashed bowling attacks in the QeA Trophy, had an amazing PSL where he was the 3rd highest run-scorer and now is dominating County cricket. At the end of the day, you can't keep a good man down for long.

You make it sound like posters have a personal vendetta against Shan. Let me assure you that most Pakistani cricket fans want the best for the team and they want the best most prolific players selected for the team. If Shan does well, everyone will support him.

The reason so many posters have been against Shan, myself included, is because he is someone who has been given an extended run in test cricket and has consistently failed. And his failure has been total - he has appeared at times to have the ability of a tailender. Personally I have been furious watching him get selected time and again, knowing that before he even starts to bat, he is a walking wicket. The fact that he has been given such an extended run despite virtually no results has not sat well with a lot of fans, because every opportunity Shan took was an opportunity someone else could have been given to prove themselves instead.

You mention Imran Butt the specialist fielder being selected. I agree that Imran is not a good batsman. But Shan was at one stage so bad, that even Imran Butt was a massive improvement - at least he would not get out for 0. That is how desperate the situation had become with Shan.

Shan’s test record is atrocious and his First Class record isn’t much better. He may well have had patches of doing well in domestic cricket, but apart from one hundred against England (where he survived several chances) and another match winning partnership with Younus Khan against Sri Lanka, Shan has done literally nothing. This isn’t alternative history as you call it, this is fact.

As I say, if Shan has turned a corner, then that’s great, I’d be happy for him to be in contention for selection again. But please do not come into this thread acting like Shan is the victim of some witch hunt and that fans have been unfair to him. Shan is responsible for his own lack of performance and the criticism he has received has been well deserved.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

You make it sound like posters have a personal vendetta against Shan. Let me assure you that most Pakistani cricket fans want the best for the team and they want the best most prolific players selected for the team. If Shan does well, everyone will support him.

The reason so many posters have been against Shan, myself included, is because he is someone who has been given an extended run in test cricket and has consistently failed. And his failure has been total - he has appeared at times to have the ability of a tailender. Personally I have been furious watching him get selected time and again, knowing that before he even starts to bat, he is a walking wicket. The fact that he has been given such an extended run despite virtually no results has not sat well with a lot of fans, because every opportunity Shan took was an opportunity someone else could have been given to prove themselves instead.

You mention Imran Butt the specialist fielder being selected. I agree that Imran is not a good batsman. But Shan was at one stage so bad, that even Imran Butt was a massive improvement - at least he would not get out for 0. That is how desperate the situation had become with Shan.

Shan’s test record is atrocious and his First Class record isn’t much better. He may well have had patches of doing well in domestic cricket, but apart from one hundred against England (where he survived several chances) and another match winning partnership with Younus Khan against Sri Lanka, Shan has done literally nothing. This isn’t alternative history as you call it, this is fact.

As I say, if Shan has turned a corner, then that’s great, I’d be happy for him to be in contention for selection again. But please do not come into this thread acting like Shan is the victim of some witch hunt and that fans have been unfair to him. Shan is responsible for his own lack of performance and the criticism he has received has been well deserved.

You shouldn't be speaking for everyone else. Because while you may not have an agenda against him, many posters do.

You have made a number of assertions in your post. But question is can you back these assertions with facts?

Because here are the facts:

- Shan was our best batter in South Africa. A country in which just about all of our batters except Babar and him struggled in. Shan was the second highest run-scorer in the entire series, just 23 runs behind Quinton de Kock.

- In England he became the first Pakistani opener to score a century in the country since 1996, and the first overseas opener to score a century in the first innings of a test since 2015. If scoring a century in England was so easy wouldn't someone have scored one in the last 24 years?

- In Australia, he averaged 39 and looked far more credible than the majority of our batting line-up. Only he, Babar and Rizwan showed some spine against the Australian bowlers.

- At home he dominated smashing 2 centuries in 3 tests and averaging 60.

He had one bad terrible series in New Zealand and apparently that was enough for the selectors to forget the fact that his performances as an opener were head and shoulders above any other Pakistani opener in quite some time...especially considering the fact that he played most of his tests since 2018 in the toughest conditions imaginable for a Pakistani opener.

Btw here are his yearly averages since he returned in 2018:

2018: 42
2019: 40
2020: 36

They are by no means outstanding. But when you consider the fact that he played 10 out of those 13 matches in SENA its incredibly harsh to discard him all while continuing with guys like Imam, Abid Ali, Imran Butt who have consistently failed in countries like England, Australia, South Africa.

And for those claiming he hasn't done well in domestic. Here are his averages in the QeA Trophy ever since it was revamped in 2019:

2019 45.16
2020: 65.3
2021: 71.7

These are not patches but consistent runs season after season.

I used to have a massive dislike for Shan Masood uptill 2017. But ever since he returned to the side in South Africa he was a very different batter. His technique was different, his mindset was different, his approach was different.

Nobody is calling him the second coming of Graeme Smith or Matthew Hayden. But if you are going to start judging someone on their SENA record, then look at those of other Asian batters too. Because Shan's numbers there are better than alot of Asian batters too...not just Pakistani batters.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

His FC record was poor for a very long time and despite the crazy runs he's been piling, it's only now getting to a respectable FC overall.

Good for him but but let's keep in mind, he has been given plenty of chances in Test matches and made plenty of comebacks. He has never been able to stick despite Pakistan being extremely desperate for a Test opener for years.

I'd be willing to give him a shot at #3 over Azhar considering how old and poor Azhar is but as an opener, I would still rather stick with Imam who is showing plenty of potential and is quite young. Imam has been doing exceptionally well in FC too last few seasons.

Yeah okay that's just flat-out incorrect. Ever since the QeA Trophy was revamped and turned into an actual FC competition he has consistently scored runs. Here are his averages since 2019:

2019 45.16
2020: 65.3
2021: 71.7

Since returning to the side in 2018, he has played 10 out of his 13 tests in SENA. He has not exactly lit the world on fire but if you look at his performances in South Africa, Australia, England, they are head and shoulders above that of any other Pakistani opener, and alot of Pakistani middle-order batters too.

While guys like Imam and Abid dominated at home, he only got to play 3 tests at home. In which he averages 60.

If you want to judge a player based on his performances in SENA than please hold others to the same standards aswell. Shan had one terrible series after which he was seemingly discarded. Eventhough he has consistently scored tough runs in tough conditions when most others failed.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Shan Masood is the best test opener in Pakistan. He is better than Abid Ali, Imam-ul-Haq and Abdullah Shafique. Anyone who decides to do a deep-dive into his numbers since 2018-19 will find out the same.

Because while Imam and Abid have inflated their averages by dominating at home, Shan has had to grit it out and score tough runs in quite literally the toughest conditions imaginable for any Pakistani opener.

He also has a consistent track-record in FC cricket since 2019, based on which he merits selection...as opposed to someone like Abdullah Shafique who, for all his talent did not deserve to be selected based on his performances for Central Punjab's Second XI side.

 

[as-95]

I am not going to even bother reading the walls of text above me that are doing bhangra over Shan Masood scoring in county cricket because its called county cricket for a reason!

The quality of county cricket sides is probably equivalent to a weak international side like Bangladesh... would Shan Masoods runs have any meaning if he scored against Bangladesh? Ofcourse not!

I understand he is scoring heavily but its COUNTY CRICKET! He has been poor in international cricket and this county stint may warrant a run of games for the international side but he is likely to fail again.

Mediocre player that posters are desperate to succeed because he speaks good english

 

[Zaz]

Shan Masoods last 8 innings before he was dropped

0
1
4
18
10
0
0
0

You cant continue to play with those scores esp when he looked like he was a walking wkt and couldnt buy a run to save his life in his last few innings

He was rightly dropped

 

[hitthestump]

- In England he became the first Pakistani opener to score a century in the country since 1996, and the first overseas opener to score a century in the first innings of a test since 2015. If scoring a century in England was so easy wouldn't someone have scored one in the last 24 years?

And that innings will always stick out in the memory because of how flukey it was. He might have been able to carry this knock longer if it wasn't for that. In the end, rightly dropped.

 

[Nasty Naz]

Yeah okay that's just flat-out incorrect. Ever since the QeA Trophy was revamped and turned into an actual FC competition he has consistently scored runs. Here are his averages since 2019:

2019 45.16
2020: 65.3
2021: 71.7

Since returning to the side in 2018, he has played 10 out of his 13 tests in SENA. He has not exactly lit the world on fire but if you look at his performances in South Africa, Australia, England, they are head and shoulders above that of any other Pakistani opener, and alot of Pakistani middle-order batters too.

While guys like Imam and Abid dominated at home, he only got to play 3 tests at home. In which he averages 60.

If you want to judge a player based on his performances in SENA than please hold others to the same standards aswell. Shan had one terrible series after which he was seemingly discarded. Eventhough he has consistently scored tough runs in tough conditions when most others failed.

Right and his FC before that was extremely poor before the last few season. Like I said, it's only getting to a respectable level now because of the runs he has been piling last few years.

He has also played quite a few matches in UAE where he's been quite awful as well. Like I said, I don't mind giving him a chance but not over Imam at this point simply because he is younger and has shown plenty of potential. Right now, he is just a bit down the pecking order with the emergence of Abdullah & Imam starting to look good in red ball.

Shan over Azhar? Zero issues with that because Azhar is far too old and looks done. This team needs more lefty middle of the order bat anyways. My ideal preference would still be Saud Shakeel because well, he is younger and can be a contributor for a long time and it's unlikely Shan can do the same with his age. However, he has a case to get a look at that spot and he would likely be better off not opening.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

And that innings will always stick out in the memory because of how flukey it was. He might have been able to carry this knock longer if it wasn't for that. In the end, rightly dropped.

Oh really, so we're talking in hypotheticals and what ifs now? If Gibbs had taken that catch in '99 or Donald hadn't run himself out South Africa may be World Champions today. He didn't, they didn't and that's the bottom line. Would have, could have, should have doesn't really have any application in the real world.

And you can talk all day about how "flukey" that innings was but fact is no Pakistani opener has even played a "flukey" innings in England since 1996. Rather than needlessly trying to bring down someone who scored 156 in England (just because you don't like him), why haven't you bothered to ask yourself why a Pakistani opener besides Shan hasn't even played a "flukey" innings in England since 1996?

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Right and his FC before that was extremely poor before the last few season. Like I said, it's only getting to a respectable level now because of the runs he has been piling last few years.

He has also played quite a few matches in UAE where he's been quite awful as well. Like I said, I don't mind giving him a chance but not over Imam at this point simply because he is younger and has shown plenty of potential. Right now, he is just a bit down the pecking order with the emergence of Abdullah & Imam starting to look good in red ball.

Shan over Azhar? Zero issues with that because Azhar is far too old and looks done. This team needs more lefty middle of the order bat anyways. My ideal preference would still be Saud Shakeel because well, he is younger and can be a contributor for a long time and it's unlikely Shan can do the same with his age. However, he has a case to get a look at that spot and he would likely be better off not opening.

Bro, what are you even talking about?

I literally just told you that he has been scoring runs consistently in FC cricket for 3 years. What do his numbers before that have to do with anything?

Did you even bother to read the whole post or did you start writing after reading half of it? I clearly stated that he has been a completely different player since he returned in 2018. In case you don't know, 2017 came before 2018.

And even if you look at his FC numbers pre-2019 they are mediocre or average...they are not "extremely poor" or "quite poor" as you stated. If you can't back an assertion up with evidence, don't bother making that assertion because it leaves you with little to no credibility.

 

[hitthestump]

Oh really, so we're talking in hypotheticals and what ifs now? If Gibbs had taken that catch in '99 or Donald hadn't run himself out South Africa may be World Champions today. He didn't, they didn't and that's the bottom line. Would have, could have, should have doesn't really have any application in the real world.

And you can talk all day about how "flukey" that innings was but fact is no Pakistani opener has even played a "flukey" innings in England since 1996. Rather than needlessly trying to bring down someone who scored 156 in England (just because you don't like him), why haven't you bothered to ask yourself why a Pakistani opener besides Shan hasn't even played a "flukey" innings in England since 1996?

I mean i could just use your argument right back at you. If the 156 was so fluid, how do you explain the lack of big scores afterwards? The fact that Shan was dropped something like 4-5 times during that innings meant we might not ever have been having this discussion. Even Shan would probably admit he's twice the player now than he was back then.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

I mean i could just use your argument right back at you. If the 156 was so fluid, how do you explain the lack of big scores afterwards? The fact that Shan was dropped something like 4-5 times during that innings meant we might not ever have been having this discussion. Even Shan would probably admit he's twice the player now than he was back then.

He played 4 tests after that innings in England and New Zealand...after which he was dropped. Don't you think its just a little bit hypocritical for you to question his performances in 2 of the toughest countries for Asian batters to bat in, all while completely ignoring Abid Ali's similar failures not just there but in West Indies and at home, or Imran Butt's performances?

After scoring his second test century Abid Ali went two years without scoring one until he cracked a double ton against freaking Zimbabwe. During this time he failed at home and away repeatedly but he never got the same treatment as Shan. Imran Butt never once looked a credible test opener even when he was playing against Zimbabwe, and yet even he got six tests before he was dropped.

Shan was treated unfairly. Someone who had given the performances he had given deserved more patience before he was kicked to the curb.

 

[IMMY69]

Shan Masood, in the the PSL, looked a class apart from all other openers.
He's continued his form in country cricket.

He seems to have overcome his technical flaws and is currently in sublime form and is a shoe in for the national team. All format player that needs to be backed up by the selectors and team management.

 

[hitthestump]

He played 4 tests after that innings in England and New Zealand...after which he was dropped. Don't you think its just a little bit hypocritical for you to question his performances in 2 of the toughest countries for Asian batters to bat in, all while completely ignoring Abid Ali's similar failures not just there but in West Indies and at home, or Imran Butt's performances?

After scoring his second test century Abid Ali went two years without scoring one until he cracked a double ton against freaking Zimbabwe. During this time he failed at home and away repeatedly but he never got the same treatment as Shan. Imran Butt never once looked a credible test opener even when he was playing against Zimbabwe, and yet even he got six tests before he was dropped.

Shan was treated unfairly. Someone who had given the performances he had given deserved more patience before he was kicked to the curb.

Abid was on his first life. For Shan it was already his 3rd or 4th comeback, someone who been through the revolving door of Pakistan cricket many times before. The jury was always out on whether he had enough ability to compliment his hard work and the string of poor scores after an arguably lucky century only strengthened that hypothesis.

For a long rope to be given you need a strong justification. It wasn't easy to argue that the story playing out with Shan wasn't the one we'd seen many times before. His FC stats also suggested that home tracks weren't going to turn him into a monster.

Hopefully we're going to see a different outcome now, but even then i can see in this thread that people are skeptical due to how they've seen Shan not seize opportunities in the past. Hard work is only one part of the equation at the top levels.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Abid was on his first life. For Shan it was already his 3rd or 4th comeback, someone who been through the revolving door of Pakistan cricket many times before. The jury was always out on whether he had enough ability to compliment his hard work and the string of poor scores after an arguably lucky century only strengthened that hypothesis.

For a long rope to be given you need a strong justification. It wasn't easy to argue that the story playing out with Shan wasn't the one we'd seen many times before. His FC stats also suggested that home tracks weren't going to turn him into a monster.

Hopefully we're going to see a different outcome now, but even then i can see in this thread that people are skeptical due to how they've seen Shan not seize opportunities in the past. Hard work is only one part of the equation at the top levels.

Yeah sorry but that's a seriously poor justification. Abid is two years older than Shan so if anything, there should be far less confidence in his abilities than Shan's. Abid did really well in domestic to earn a spot in the side but keep in mind that when he was selected he and Shan had comparable FC averages. Shan averaged 35 whereas Abid averaged 37.

I think that when a Pakistani batter bats the way he batted in South Africa and Australia, there's a pretty good justification to give him the long rope. It wasn't easy to argue? He smashed 2 hundreds at home and averages 60 thus far in home conditions.

Also, looking at FC stats in isolation can be highly misleading because they don't always take into account how much a player has improved or how well he is doing recently. Furthermore, Babar had a FC average of 35 when he made his test debut, Abid averaged 37. Imam had a FC average of 35 when he made his test debut. If their FC averages weren't looked at, why was Shan's?

People such as yourself can be skeptical all you want. He is the best opener in Pakistan right now. The fact that he is on his third life and worlds apart from where he was in 2017 shows me that he is someone who is actually committed to working hard and improving as a cricketer too. But the double standards that the selectors and posters such as yourself seem to have are sad to see.

 

[Markhor]

But when you consider the fact that he played 10 out of those 13 matches in SENA its incredibly harsh to discard him all while continuing with guys like Imam, Abid Ali, Imran Butt who have consistently failed in countries like England, Australia, South Africa.

And for those claiming he hasn't done well in domestic. Here are his averages in the QeA Trophy ever since it was revamped in 2019:

2019 45.16
2020: 65.3
2021: 71.7

These are not patches but consistent runs season after season.

I used to have a massive dislike for Shan Masood uptill 2017. But ever since he returned to the side in South Africa he was a very different batter. His technique was different, his mindset was different, his approach was different.

Nobody is calling him the second coming of Graeme Smith or Matthew Hayden. But if you are going to start judging someone on their SENA record, then look at those of other Asian batters too. Because Shan's numbers there are better than alot of Asian batters too...not just Pakistani batters.

This is the crux of the matter. A player who's performed in the most challenging conditions for Asian batsmen should've been allowed to reverse a slump on home soil.

If Shan failed against South Africa at home too, he'd have nobody else to blame but himself.

Instead he was replaced by Imran Butt whose FC seasonal averages prior to his debut read 32, 21, 25, 26, 62 (on the deadest QEA pitches in decades) and 31...

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

This is the crux of the matter. A player who's performed in the most challenging conditions for Asian batsmen should've been allowed to reverse a slump on home soil.

If Shan failed against South Africa at home too, he'd have nobody else to blame but himself.

Instead he was replaced by Imran Butt whose FC seasonal averages prior to his debut read 32, 21, 25, 26, 62 (on the deadest QEA pitches in decades) and 31...

Imran Butt's selection for me kinda summed up the incompetence of the people running our system. You have guys like Fawad Alam, Usman Salahuddin, Saud Shakeel who couldn't get into the side after years of hardwork and consistent performances. Even Abid Ali had to work really hard to get into the side. But somehow Imran Butt who had been nothing more than a mediocre batter for his entire FC career barring one season made it to the side after that one good season.

 

[Zaz]

He played 4 tests after that innings in England and New Zealand...after which he was dropped. Don't you think its just a little bit hypocritical for you to question his performances in 2 of the toughest countries for Asian batters to bat in, all while completely ignoring Abid Ali's similar failures not just there but in West Indies and at home, or Imran Butt's performances?

After scoring his second test century Abid Ali went two years without scoring one until he cracked a double ton against freaking Zimbabwe. During this time he failed at home and away repeatedly but he never got the same treatment as Shan. Imran Butt never once looked a credible test opener even when he was playing against Zimbabwe, and yet even he got six tests before he was dropped.

Shan was treated unfairly. Someone who had given the performances he had given deserved more patience before he was kicked to the curb.

And his scores during them tests read like a telephone number with multiple ducks

To retain your position you need to show some promise
A 25 or 35 here and there

He literally avged 3 or 4 in 8 innings and was a walking wkt

You cant retain someone when they are playing so so badly

Abid shouldnt have been retained but the justification for him is at least he was scoring 20s and 30s

Not like masood who was duck after duck in those 8 innings

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

And his scores during them tests read like a telephone number with multiple ducks

To retain your position you need to show some promise
A 25 or 35 here and there

He literally avged 3 or 4 in 8 innings and was a walking wkt

You cant retain someone when they are playing so so badly

Abid shouldnt have been retained but the justification for him is at least he was scoring 20s and 30s

Not like masood who was duck after duck in those 8 innings

Kohli averaged 9.5 when India last toured New Zealand. That's not a whole lot better than what Shan averaged in New Zealand in the last series.

Was he dropped from the side? No, because it was one atrocious series.

You can't build a good team by dropping guys who are performing when they are low on confidence. Because that is when they are at their lowest. Unfortunately, there is little to no long-term planning to speak of in the Pakistan side so none of this surprises me.

 

[topspin]

Anyone who is against Shan's return to the test side simply doesn't understand cricket or has an agenda against him (like the OP has).

 

[hitthestump]

Kohli averaged 9.5 when India last toured New Zealand. That's not a whole lot better than what Shan averaged in New Zealand in the last series.

Was he dropped from the side? No, because it was one atrocious series.

You're going a bit too far now and are losing any semblance of balance to your argument. Obviously Kohli possesses a record which doesn't need any explanation. Shan meanwhile has 1 century in England (in which he could have been dismissed multiple times) and some OKish knocks in SENA. Multiple failings aside from that including in LOI's and a recent record which read like a telephone number.

How can you compare the two in terms of the chances they've been given by selectors?

As Zaz rightly says a 25/30 run knock may have led to a different outcome but there wasn't even that.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

You're going a bit too far now and are losing any semblance of balance to your argument. Obviously Kohli possesses a record which doesn't need any explanation. Shan meanwhile has 1 century in England (in which he could have been dismissed multiple times) and some OKish knocks in SENA. Multiple failings aside from that including in LOI's and a recent record which read like a telephone number.

How can you compare the two in terms of the chances they've been given by selectors?

As Zaz rightly says a 25/30 run knock may have led to a different outcome but there wasn't even that.

Kohli last scored a century in 2019. In the last 17 tests he has averaged 27. That's absolutely awful and he is arguably one of the worst performing middle-order batters in the world in the past 3 years.

I find it absolutely hilarious how you keep downplaying his one century in England and "OKish knocks in SENA", if they were such "OKish" knocks why didn't any other batters besides Babar and Rizwan put up similar performances? FYI before Shan the last time a Pakistani opener scored a century in England was 1996. And before him the last time an overseas opener scored a first innings century in England was 2015.

So yeah, you are completely wrong in saying that they were OKish knocks. They were very good-excellent knocks because South Africa and England are statistically two of the toughest places in the world to open the batting in. And those knocks mean even more when you look at the fact that almost our entire batting failed in those conditions.

 

[hitthestump]

I find it absolutely hilarious how you keep downplaying his one century in England and "OKish knocks in SENA", if they were such "OKish" knocks why didn't any other batters besides Babar and Rizwan put up similar performances? FYI before Shan the last time a Pakistani opener scored a century in England was 1996. And before him the last time an overseas opener scored a first innings century in England was 2015.

So yeah, you are completely wrong in saying that they were OKish knocks. They were very good-excellent knocks because South Africa and England are statistically two of the toughest places in the world to open the batting in. And those knocks mean even more when you look at the fact that almost our entire batting failed in those conditions.

They absolutely were OKish knocks - good but not great. The relative performance of his colleagues carries some weight but there is a limit to that too. Ultimately Shan deserves credit, but when we consider the whole picture from start to finish he needed to bring more to the table than this. Maybe not much more but it wasn't enough for the selectors to keep picking him blindly. I don't recall any significant external outcry when he was dropped either.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

They absolutely were OKish knocks - good but not great. The relative performance of his colleagues carries some weight but there is a limit to that too. Ultimately Shan deserves credit, but when we consider the whole picture from start to finish he needed to bring more to the table than this. Maybe not much more but it wasn't enough for the selectors to keep picking him blindly. I don't recall any significant external outcry when he was dropped either.

Ahan, If test cricket was so easy bro than everyone would succeed at it. Rather than being a typically ungrateful PCT fan learn to appreciate someone who has done well instead of nitpicking and needlessly downplaying their performance. The kind of expectations you have set makes me think that this Pakistan side is the second coming of 2000s Australia, where every batter is averaging over 45. Temper your expectations and come back to reality. Whatever expectations you have are simply not realistic. And you can look at Pakistan's sterling track-record of test openers in the last decade and a half to verify that.

And give Shan a chance to play at home before judging his average. He is not lucky enough to play multiple matches on flat decks like Imam or Abid.

 

[arif_2021]

He doesn’t have 0.1% of the ability Shaw has.

Shaw will score 15,000+ international runs.

oh? how many has he scored so far?

 

[Sunzi]

oh? how many has he scored so far?

528

 

[MenInG]

Like it or not, consensus will start building up for his return

 

[silentkiller187]

Shans now performed in county and PSL if ever domestic form was a used as a basis for selection then masood must be at the top of the list

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

528

Besides the fact that this is an utterly ridiculous comparison considering one player is 22 while other is 32...

I think Shan has more runs than this in just the County Championship.

 

[shamaan]

Shan should have a shout in tests batting at 3

 

[arif_2021]

Besides the fact that this is an utterly ridiculous comparison considering one player is 22 while other is 32...

I think Shan has more runs than this in just the County Championship.

its not ridiculous when you take into consideration that prithvi shaw has an inherent problems with playing inswing bowling and he has been exposed. he's another aaron finch type of player.

shaan masood on the other hand, is far better in terms of technical ability...hence the reason for his sucess

score 550 + in 330 balls when you're 14 years old does not always mean you will be successful in international cricket

 

[daytrader]

Shans now performed in county and PSL if ever domestic form was a used as a basis for selection then masood must be at the top of the list

But who does he replace? Imam, Abdullah Shafique? Don't see Azhar being dropped till after his 100 test

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

its not ridiculous when you take into consideration that prithvi shaw has an inherent problems with playing inswing bowling and he has been exposed. he's another aaron finch type of player.

shaan masood on the other hand, is far better in terms of technical ability...hence the reason for his sucess

score 550 + in 330 balls when you're 14 years old does not always mean you will be successful in international cricket

I don't think there is any reason to compare a kid who has just started playing professional cricket and a guy who has been playing for a decade plus.

But beyond that, I agree with you. Shaw does seem to have some glaring technical deficiencies.

Shan's technique was actually not that good when he came on the scene which may have perhaps been one of the reasons why he struggled initially. But he went to England, worked with Gary Palmer and modified his technique. And the results were evident in South Africa where he looked a class apart from the others. Since then he ahs been making trips to England as well as South Africa at the Gary Kirsten Academy to iron out any flaws.

I think he was mentioning his runs for India across formats. But that said, you kinda have to score 500-1000 runs in school cricket in India to get noticed as a youngster. Because that's just the kind of competition there is.

 

[moghul]

But who does he replace? Imam, Abdullah Shafique? Don't see Azhar being dropped till after his 100 test

Is that in PCB's constitution that Azhar Ali cannot be dropped before completing his 100 tests ?

 

[Sunzi]

Besides the fact that this is an utterly ridiculous comparison considering one player is 22 while other is 32...

I think Shan has more runs than this in just the County Championship.

Of course, I posted the paltry sum to emphasise the randomness, ridiculousness and hilarity of the stupid statement.

 

[shamaan]

But who does he replace? Imam, Abdullah Shafique? Don't see Azhar being dropped till after his 100 test

Azhar should be dropped and then imaam should bat at 3.

 

[MenInG]

Gone for a duck to Stuart Broad! - Hopefully a temporary aberration?!

 

[Mamoon]

First of many, many ducks in the T20I format for Mr. Zero Talent. The poultry farm business will bloom.

 

[Suleiman]

Please update for 2022

 

[GreenKhan]

First of many, many ducks in the T20I format for Mr. Zero Talent. The poultry farm business will bloom.

It’s his second one already !

 

[MenInG]

Shan's disappointing end

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[shaz619]

How on earth did he get picked in T20’s, I would even welcome back Umar Akmal with open arms instead

 

[Rana]

How on earth did he get picked in T20’s, I would even welcome back Umar Akmal with open arms

He was specially invited by the chief selector to play the Pakistan cup, score runs at 4 and fast tracked into the side

Complete bias!

 

[shaz619]

He was specially invited by the chief selector to play the Pakistan cup, score runs at 4 and fast tracked into the side

Complete bias!

Jesus man! that’s awful, we can’t afford three accumulators at the top my dude

 

[Rana]

Jesus man! that’s awful, we can’t afford three accumulators at the top my dude

*junaid khan black tape over his mouth pic*

 

[Usman Chadda]

He was specially invited by the chief selector to play the Pakistan cup, score runs at 4 and fast tracked into the side

Complete bias!

Didn’t the same chief selector get bashed for not selecting a top performer like Shan a couple of months ago?

 

[Rana]

Shan Masood is 10 years too old for us to have sympathy for his below par performances

 

[shaz619]

Shan Masood is 10 years too old for us to have sympathy for his below par performances

His performances in the Blast are vastly over rated, his knocks rarely won Derby games

 

[Rana]

His performances in the Blast are vastly over rated, his knocks rarely won Derby games

I bet he looked fit and stylish in his mannerisms though?

Also I think he has the most emphatic way of shouting ‘your end!!” when running between the wickets

 

[fieldMarshal]

He has no place in our t 20 side....does not have the game to be a good t 20 player at this level....a terrible selection

 

[DeadlyVenom]

His performances in the Blast are vastly over rated, his knocks rarely won Derby games

He was brought back into consideration after a decent PSL.

By all accounts he is a quality person, hard working, well mannered and gets on well with his peers.

Mickey rated him enough to take him in out of nowhere at Derbyshire.

But sadly despite his good characteristics he may be missing that X Factor to succeed at international level.

One of the few blokes you want to see doing well but mostly he has looked out of his depth.

He can still make a decent career in county and will no doubt become a respected coach/pundit in England.

 

[Ashmal]

Didn’t the same chief selector get bashed for not selecting a top performer like Shan a couple of months ago?

Exactly...the whole media and certain ex-cricketers were slating Babar and selectors for not picking him earlier.

Some even came up with wild conspiracy theories claiming Babar is jealous of Shan.

 

[ChTab]

Horrible horrible player. Can't say that I have seen a player worse than Shan

 

[shaz619]

He was brought back into consideration after a decent PSL.

By all accounts he is a quality person, hard working, well mannered and gets on well with his peers.

Mickey rated him enough to take him in out of nowhere at Derbyshire.

But sadly despite his good characteristics he may be missing that X Factor to succeed at international level.

One of the few blokes you want to see doing well but mostly he has looked out of his depth.

He can still make a decent career in county and will no doubt become a respected coach/pundit in England.

He is an absolute class guy, I’ve met him when he trained at the academy I believe he was representing his MCC team at the time. A really clever guy who speaks well and is extremely gritty.

And while I appreciate his potential in perhaps Tests or ODI’s, even though his age might question his future investment, I don’t know what he brings to a T20 side at this point. He has certainly improved under Mickey, but I don’t see this guy winning Derby or Pakistan games consistently in the T20 format with his bat alone and he isn’t a keeper, nor does he provide an option with his bowling.

I agree he will do well in his county career, it’s still something to be proud off. But, I just can’t see him doing anything for Pakistan at no.3 in T20’s, maybe I will get proven wrong and power to him, but as it stands I don’t feel he adds anything to the team and despite his grit is one dimensional.

 

[Hawkeye]

Form is temporary, class is permanent!

Another duck.

 

[PakEngFan]

Hopefully it’s the end for him in all formats. But some posters want him as the captain as he can speak English.

 

[aukhan]

This should be the end of his career but we know he is well-connected. Huraira/Imam/Sharjeel/Haris all these openers deserve to play ahead of him.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

I think its time to end this Shan Masood experiment.

 

[Suleiman]

Need to update the title to 2023. Though I fear this circus may extend beyond 2024.

Either way, start of another fresh dozen today

 

[ArabKnight]

Exactly...the whole media and certain ex-cricketers were slating Babar and selectors for not picking him earlier.

Some even came up with wild conspiracy theories claiming Babar is jealous of Shan.

It was baffling to me when he was selected. How can a Test player be selected for T20?

 

[Rana]

The blood is on Mohammad Wasim’s hand

Why did he ever invite this guy back into the national T20 cup to roll the red carpet for his return into the national team???

The guy scored soft runs and just built his case for captaincy quietly!

 

[Rana]

Two crimes to Pakistan will never be forgotten!

Misbah’s planting of Rizwan

Muhammad Wasim’s red carpet layout for Shan Masood!

 

[Ilan Bluestone]

The term is paltry.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Any know the record for most ducks ever in international cricket, I'm sure Shan can break that record.

 

[TeymurBlake]

Can't believe he played ahead of Imam-ul-Haq.

 

[gazza619]

Thank you Najam Sethi and Shahid Afridi for this joke.

 

[PakEngFan]

Two crimes to Pakistan will never be forgotten!

Misbah’s planting of Rizwan

Muhammad Wasim’s red carpet layout for Shan Masood!

The best thing misbah done was kicking out srfaraz and giving us rizwan I will always be grateful for him for that. That’s the only good thing he’s done in his career including as a player.