What went wrong for Pakistan against New Zealand in ICC Champions Trophy 2025? - Personal assessment

[RidiculousMan]

To start with I think it was a good toss to win. Since in the Tri Series Pakistan had success chasing vs South Africa. The Final of that series also happened in Karachi and chasing team won it.

The middle overs again the team failed to pick up wickets. Which could be seen going into CT. Salman and Khushdil did alright but they didn't picked up any wicket and New Zealand batters just milked them for easy runs before launching onto pacers in death overs.

321 was par or just above it. Pakistan were in the game still. Except for that freak injury that happened to Fakhar. That disrupted the plans of this side who were already depleded and resources and were carrying just one opener in form of Fakhar. Babar was a make shift opener who came up from his settled no. 3 role.

Chasing 300+ always requires a positive intent and you have to take a few chances in the powerplay to get some boundaries. The start that Saud and Babar provided was abysmal and it the falling dominos of already weakened structure of the batting line up today.

Rizwan and Babar carry on the 3 runs per over intent and just when team desperately needed Fakhar to bail them out again once more. In comes an injured Fakhar who could not run properly.

This was the double whammy. You had Fakhar with restricted range of shots coming in middle overs where 4 fielders were on boundary rope. Then you had Babar who's value in this side was only in the fact that he could tick along, take single doubles and carry till the end. Fakhar couldn't hit boundaries as quickly as it was needed because of the snail paced start and Babar couldn't tick his singles - the only thing he can do while remaining in his comfort zone.

Salman tried to inject some momentum when team was looming at 9-10 runs per over of required rate. But Babar continued his merry way to a 50 at a SR of 60. This put pressure on Salman which finally gave away.

By the time Khushdil came in it was already too late. Babar in his classic style completed his 50 and went down after hitting a boundary.

Everyone I think knows the strengths and weaknesses of our players. Their limitations as well. What was shocking today was the plan management had in batting.

It was as if Fakhar was not certain to come to bat the whole team. Specially the top order didn't know how to bat in an ODI. Babar, Saud and Rizwan all went into their shell.

The duality of approach from Pakistan in that Tri Series game chasing 350+ and here chasing 321 is baffling. This one can never find an answer to. That's also Pakistan Cricket for you.

Lastly. Congratulations to all fans. We're back on Qudrat Ka Nizam wagon.

 

[Kianig89]

The main formula to succeed in ODI cricket is keep taking wickets specially in modern era, there is no other formula our docile lethargic and meek pacers are good for nothing.

30 overs from Pace 201/4 , these kind of numbers won't win you games most of the time.

The icing on cake is turtlesque top 3 who combined to score 80 in 125 balls @ SR 64. Again this is abysmal abhorrent and suicidal.

Surely Aqib had alot of work to do

 

[PakPremi]

Good assessment, it was silly to send Fakhar after fall of Rizwan when he was clearly still struggling. Not only running between wicket was issue for both batsmen but Fakhar wasted lots of balls as he could not move freely in the crease. He should had come just before Khushdil to hit out.

 

[baba ghazi]

321 is not par on this surface.. this mentality of " pace is pace yaar" is killing pakistani cricket.. pakistani pace attack is incapable of bowling in death..there are no variation, cutter clower ball.. even if there are its not executed properly..shouldnt have allowed nz to score more than 290..

 

[RidiculousMan]

The main formula to succeed in ODI cricket is keep taking wickets specially in modern era, there is no other formula our docile lethargic and meek pacers are good for nothing.

30 overs from Pace 201/4 , these kind of numbers won't win you games most of the time.

The icing on cake is turtlesque top 3 who combined to score 80 in 125 balls @ SR 64. Again this is abysmal abhorrent and suicidal.

Surely Aqib had alot of work to do

If you look at the big picture. Pakistan lost because of lack of process and plan.

When you rely on whims, individual brilliances and your gut feelings about the way you build squads or go about in a game this happens.

Pakistan get some results. They make it their set pattern. But when an uncertainty happens or a tradegy befalls. They don't know what to do.

They don't know what to do because they never built a system. Never followed a process and never had any backup plans.

That pattern gets disturb and all of a sudden the cartwheel breaks down and all you see is smoke during the game. Unable to understand and scratching your head in the moment thinking what's happening right now? What's the plan really? Did we ever had one?

 

[Usman Chadda]

321 is not par on this surface.. this mentality of " pace is pace yaar" is killing pakistani cricket.. pakistani pace attack is incapable of bowling in death..there are no variation, cutter clower ball.. even if there are its not executed properly..shouldnt have allowed nz to score more than 290..

We would have lost even if the target was 290.

22/2 in 10 overs is diabolical to say the least. Unacceptable.

 

[RidiculousMan]

We would have lost even if the target was 290.

22/2 in 10 overs is diabolical to say the least. Unacceptable.

Teams either score runs and lose wickets in powerplay. Or score slow but lose no wickets in the powerplay.

Pakistan today didn't scored runs and lost wickets as well.

 

[Usman Chadda]

To start with I think it was a good toss to win. Since in the Tri Series Pakistan had success chasing vs South Africa. The Final of that series also happened in Karachi and chasing team won it.

The middle overs again the team failed to pick up wickets. Which could be seen going into CT. Salman and Khushdil did alright but they didn't picked up any wicket and New Zealand batters just milked them for easy runs before launching onto pacers in death overs.

321 was par or just above it. Pakistan were in the game still. Except for that freak injury that happened to Fakhar. That disrupted the plans of this side who were already depleded and resources and were carrying just one opener in form of Fakhar. Babar was a make shift opener who came up from his settled no. 3 role.

Chasing 300+ always requires a positive intent and you have to take a few chances in the powerplay to get some boundaries. The start that Saud and Babar provided was abysmal and it the falling dominos of already weakened structure of the batting line up today.

Rizwan and Babar carry on the 3 runs per over intent and just when team desperately needed Fakhar to bail them out again once more. In comes an injured Fakhar who could not run properly.

This was the double whammy. You had Fakhar with restricted range of shots coming in middle overs where 4 fielders were on boundary rope. Then you had Babar who's value in this side was only in the fact that he could tick along, take single doubles and carry till the end. Fakhar couldn't hit boundaries as quickly as it was needed because of the snail paced start and Babar couldn't tick his singles - the only thing he can do while remaining in his comfort zone.

Salman tried to inject some momentum when team was looming at 9-10 runs per over of required rate. But Babar continued his merry way to a 50 at a SR of 60. This put pressure on Salman which finally gave away.

By the time Khushdil came in it was already too late. Babar in his classic style completed his 50 and went down after hitting a boundary.

Everyone I think knows the strengths and weaknesses of our players. Their limitations as well. What was shocking today was the plan management had in batting.

It was as if Fakhar was not certain to come to bat the whole team. Specially the top order didn't know how to bat in an ODI. Babar, Saud and Rizwan all went into their shell.

The duality of approach from Pakistan in that Tri Series game chasing 350+ and here chasing 321 is baffling. This one can never find an answer to. That's also Pakistan Cricket for you.

Lastly. Congratulations to all fans. We're back on Qudrat Ka Nizam wagon.

They panicked after NZ blasted them at the death once more and Fakhar’s injury.

This team is just mentally timid. Saud should have gone out there and showed everyone Fakhar will not be missed, yet continued to waste deliveries doing no idea what. Babar and Rizwan did the same, just shut the game down like they usually do.

They were shell-shocked by how brutal NZ was at the death and one of their main players getting injured. By then, the only go-to plan was taking the game deep and everything else just went out of the window.

This ‘taking the game deep’ nonsense needs to be put away.

 

[Cover Drive Six]

Last 10 overs in Bowling and First 10 overs in Batting went wrong for Pakistan.

 

[emranabbas]

The main formula to succeed in ODI cricket is keep taking wickets specially in modern era, there is no other formula our docile lethargic and meek pacers are good for nothing.

30 overs from Pace 201/4 , these kind of numbers won't win you games most of the time.

The icing on cake is turtlesque top 3 who combined to score 80 in 125 balls @ SR 64. Again this is abysmal abhorrent and suicidal.

Surely Aqib had alot of work to do

The only people who have work to do are rizwan and babar win any battle you will need to attack one point you can't play innings where your in a defensive mode 247

 

[Major]

the only way to win is if we take wickets.

Batting is as garbage as it was 20 years ago.

 

[Bewal Express]

Our bowling gave away around 90 runs too many on this wicket. For me it was a 230 pitch. Our fast bowlers bowl at least 2 hit me balls every over and Our spinners aren't even domestic standard. Our batting was awful. Babar was poor and unimaginative, Riz should be at 5 batted at 3, and FZ should not have come in until number 7. This is a very average team and by Sunday we will be out.

 

[Savak]

Its madness how Pakistan is still sticking to Babar, Rizwan, Shaheen, Naseem, Rauf. These players have lost so many matches for Pakistan and we are sitting at the bottom of the rankings in almost all formats. Other countries tolerate 2 failures maximum but then hold players accountable.

 

[shah9425]

Toothless death bowling

And then the powerplay

Did the damage

 

[riddu]

worst bowler naseem

 

[adi_62941]

The whole team's batting depends on Fakhar's power-hitting. If he scores, the entire team gains confidence. Today, he missed his batting spot due to the rules and was also injured, which made the other batters feel they couldn't do it on their own.

We lost the match within the first 10 overs. There wasn't a single moment during Babar's innings when I felt he could take us close to victory. His batting has been stuck and miserable lately.

God knows what has happened to him—he has lost all his confidence, and there’s no temperament left in him. He seriously needs to be rested and sent back to domestic cricket.

 

[corleone]

The cupboard is bare unfortunately. Barring Saim there are no quality young players coming thru hence we're forced to rinse and repeat the same individuals and performances every tournament.

 

[sweep_shot]

Game was lost in 2 areas:

1) 43-50 overs while NZ were batting.

2) First 15 overs while Pakistan were batting.

These two periods were decisive.

 

[Savak]

The whole team's batting depends on Fakhar's power-hitting. If he scores, the entire team gains confidence. Today, he missed his batting spot due to the rules and was also injured, which made the other batters feel they couldn't do it on their own.

We lost the match within the first 10 overs. There wasn't a single moment during Babar's innings when I felt he could take us close to victory. His batting has been stuck and miserable lately.

God knows what has happened to him—he has lost all his confidence, and there’s no temperament left in him. He seriously needs to be rested and sent back to domestic cricket.

All NZ did was keep it tight disciplined to him backed up by some excellent fielding. Not once did Babar try stepping down the track, making room or look to play lifted shots to clear the field to put the bowlers and fielders under pressure. He allows the bowlers to settle in and bowl to a line length.

 

[adi_62941]

All the big teams have analyzed Pakistan’s players and know their weaknesses. Santner is an exceptional captain, and if he wins the Champions Trophy, it wouldn’t surprise me because he has demonstrated incredible leadership skills. He is calm, composed, and cool-headed on the field. The whole world knows exactly where to bowl to Fakhar, Babar, and Rizwan.

Fakhar, on whom the entire team's batting depends, is an unpredictable player with a weird batting style. Sometimes he scores, but most of the time, he looks shaky and fails.

 

[RidiculousMan]

All NZ did was keep it tight disciplined to him backed up by some excellent fielding. Not once did Babar try stepping down the track, making room or look to play lifted shots to clear the field to put the bowlers and fielders under pressure. He allows the bowlers to settle in and bowl to a line length.

He's mentally done. Should take a rest for Pakistan's sake.

 

[Major]

If Khushdil can make runs on this pitch, its criminal for other batters not to

 

[psyoptica]

The whole team's batting depends on Fakhar's power-hitting. If he scores, the entire team gains confidence. Today, he missed his batting spot due to the rules and was also injured, which made the other batters feel they couldn't do it on their own.

We lost the match within the first 10 overs. There wasn't a single moment during Babar's innings when I felt he could take us close to victory. His batting has been stuck and miserable lately.

God knows what has happened to him—he has lost all his confidence, and there’s no temperament left in him. He seriously needs to be rested and sent back to domestic cricket.

The problem with Pakistan players is they see it as an insult rather than an opportunity to work on their weakness and regain form. This would never happen with an Australian player no matter how big he is. Babar is an average player at best and the way he was hyped by his fans and the media, he started thinking too much of himself. It's almost impossible now to convince him he's average and needs to work on him flaws and no one in the Pakistan team management has the gal to stand up to him

 

[Rana]

Batting is as garbage as it was 20 years ago

@mominsaigol @shaz619 @topspin @emranabbas @Dr_Bassim @jnaveen1980 @Devadwal

This guy claims to be a true Pakistan fan.

20 years ago the line up was:

1. Salman Butt
2. Kamran Akmal
3. Younis Khan
4. Mohammad Yousuf
5. Inzimam ul Haq
6. Shoaib Malik
7. Shahid Afridi
8. Abdul Razzaq
9. Rana Naved
10. Shoaib Akhtar
11. Mohammad Asif

 

[Major]

@mominsaigol @shaz619 @topspin @emranabbas @Dr_Bassim @jnaveen1980 @Devadwal

This guy claims to be a true Pakistan fan.

20 years ago the line up was:

1. Salman Butt
2. Kamran Akmal
3. Younis Khan
4. Mohammad Yousuf
5. Inzimam ul Haq
6. Shoaib Malik
7. Shahid Afridi
8. Abdul Razzaq
9. Rana Naved
10. Shoaib Akhtar
11. Mohammad Asif

now go watch the highlights of world cup 2007, only than you will understand.

 

[Kroll]

Nothing went wrong, its just a mediocre team full of mediocre personalities. Its time SSA, Naseem and Rauf were given the boot so others can get a turn at getting blasted around the park.

 

[Major]

Nothing went wrong, its just a mediocre team full of mediocre personalities. Its time SSA, Naseem and Rauf were given the boot so others can get a turn at getting blasted around the park.

Im soo tired of watching Shaheen get the opening spell only because he would take a wicekt first over in 2021.

 

[shaz619]

now go watch the highlights of world cup 2007, only than you will understand.

They won a World Trophy just two years later and would have won it in the final Q of 2007 to were it not for the coward Misbah

 

[Major]

They won a World Trophy just two years later and would have won it in the final Q of 2007 to were it not for the coward Misbah

What does that got to d with anything I said? Everyone knows Pakistans batting has never been stable, whats to argue with this?

 

[Champ_Pal]

There was no conviction either in batting or bowling.

When Pakistan was bowling, they were trying to control the runs and hoping to keep NZ under 300. No one really looked like taking wickets.
When Pak was batting, there was no intent to chase. They pretty much waved the white flag right from ball one. By the end of 5th over, it was evident that they had no intention to chase the total. Just hoping to reduce the margin of defeat..

In the end, Pak did manage to reduce the margin of defeat. But the NRR still suffered.

 

[jnaveen1980]

They have lost 3 games in a row to NZ. Now without Rachin Ravindra. NZ is just too good for Pakistan.

 

[zaidihusain]

You can't win any game if your main batsman who is playing cricket since last 9 years cannot play run a ball. Apart balls wasted by Babar look at the balls wasted by Saud, Rizwan & Fakhar. What was the intent of these players, why they don't know how to rotate strike in their home conditions even after playing so much cricket? Are they playing to save their place or to win the game?

 

[Cricket Warrior]

They have lost 3 games in a row to NZ. Now without Rachin Ravindra. NZ is just too good for Pakistan.

arrange another 10, i m sure Pak will lose all 10

 

[mominsaigol]

@mominsaigol @shaz619 @topspin @emranabbas @Dr_Bassim @jnaveen1980 @Devadwal

This guy claims to be a true Pakistan fan.

20 years ago the line up was:

1. Salman Butt
2. Kamran Akmal
3. Younis Khan
4. Mohammad Yousuf
5. Inzimam ul Haq
6. Shoaib Malik
7. Shahid Afridi
8. Abdul Razzaq
9. Rana Naved
10. Shoaib Akhtar
11. Mohammad Asif

I dont have any more issues with @Major as we're on friendly terms now but yes we do disagree on alot of things and this is just another one added to the pile.

2025 Pakistan is literally fakhar or bust, if we do a side by side comparison

1) Fakhar > Kamran Akmal

2) Babar > Salman Butt

3) Younis > Saud Shakeel

4) Yousaf > Rizwan

5) Inzimam > Agha

6) Malik > Tayyab

7) Afridi > Khusdil

8) Razzaq > Shaheen

9) Rana > Naseem

10) Pindi Express > Rauf

11) asif > Abrar (even though abrar is a spinner, Asif is more impactful and a better person to have)

2005 Pakistan wipes the floor with 2025 Pakistan. Only the opening is better courtesy of fakhar. As for Babar vs butt. Idk, Babar is better but on current form I don't know. Babr's current form is garbage, i don't remember what form butt was in 2005.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

This is a lot of words to say Babar lost us the match.

 

[Major]

I dont have any more issues with @Major as we're on friendly terms now but yes we do disagree on alot of things and this is just another one added to the pile.

2025 Pakistan is literally fakhar or bust, if we do a side by side comparison

1) Fakhar > Kamran Akmal

2) Babar > Salman Butt

3) Younis > Saud Shakeel

4) Yousaf > Rizwan

5) Inzimam > Agha

6) Malik > Tayyab

7) Afridi > Khusdil

8) Razzaq > Shaheen

9) Rana > Naseem

10) Pindi Express > Rauf

11) asif > Abrar (even though abrar is a spinner, Asif is more impactful and a better person to have)

2005 Pakistan wipes the floor with 2025 Pakistan. Only the opening is better courtesy of fakhar. As for Babar vs butt. Idk, Babar is better but on current form I don't know. Babr's current form is garbage, i don't remember what form butt was in 2005.

Bro, there is a difference.

Alot of these guys would not perform in ICC tournaments but would in series.

 

[jnaveen1980]

arrange another 10, i m sure Pak will lose all 10

It is why i am surprised they had to give NZ 3 practice matches in Pakistan knowing they are in the same group as Pakistan.

 

[Rana]

I dont have any more issues with @Major as we're on friendly terms now but yes we do disagree on alot of things and this is just another one added to the pile.

2025 Pakistan is literally fakhar or bust, if we do a side by side comparison

1) Fakhar > Kamran Akmal

2) Babar > Salman Butt

3) Younis > Saud Shakeel

4) Yousaf > Rizwan

5) Inzimam > Agha

6) Malik > Tayyab

7) Afridi > Khusdil

8) Razzaq > Shaheen

9) Rana > Naseem

10) Pindi Express > Rauf

11) asif > Abrar (even though abrar is a spinner, Asif is more impactful and a better person to have)

2005 Pakistan wipes the floor with 2025 Pakistan. Only the opening is better courtesy of fakhar. As for Babar vs butt. Idk, Babar is better but on current form I don't know. Babr's current form is garbage, i don't remember what form butt was in 2005.

I would argue Salman Butt was a better opener than Bobsy

No way he is better than Babar at 3/4. But as an opener he is much better than Babar.

 

[Rana]

Bro, there is a difference.

Alot of these guys would not perform in ICC tournaments but would in series.

Yet they all have an ICC medal besides Yousuf and Butt.

So what’s your point??

 

[mominsaigol]

Bro, there is a difference.

Alot of these guys would not perform in ICC tournaments but would in series.

I'm well aware of their icc tournament performances however that's not the point.

In pure skill level 2005 Pakistan is superior from all fronts with the exception of the openers (fakhar and babar) who are > Butt and kamran.

Before ct, we lost to NZ on our home ground twice. As for sa and Aus, Don't let those series fool you, the aus that played against us in the 3rd odi also played against srinlanka and they got demolished. Pakistan only won the 2nd game however Carey, Marsh and Travis weren't present.

When it comes to sa, those wins were good so won't comment on them.

2005 Pakistan would still demolish 2025 Pakistan 10 ways to Sunday.

Lastly you're overestimating their failures. 2003 had players at the end of their rope and 2007 is a shocking outlier. But that's about it they don't have a big sample size to claim they they'd 100% fail in icc events.

And with the exception of fakhar's innings vs nz in 2023 which is superior to anything any Pakistani batter has ever done in an icc event, Inzi's 1992 innings in sf is a close 2nd. That innings alone is > Anything anyone from 2025 excluding fakhar will be able to accomplish.

 

[mominsaigol]

I would argue Salman Butt was a better opener than Bobsy

No way he is better than Babar at 3/4. But as an opener he is much better than Babar.

Oh yeah, as an opener butt has a better record.

Lol so besides fakhar 2005 Pakistan has 10 superior players lol.

 

[jamie smith]

I would argue Salman Butt was a better opener than Bobsy

No way he is better than Babar at 3/4. But as an opener he is much better than Babar.

No Butt was an awful batter except against India.

 

[mominsaigol]

Yet they all have an ICC medal besides Yousuf and Butt.

So what’s your point??

The idea that their failures in icc events is swekwed due to the fact 2007 was an outlier and 2003 was played with has been bowlers which hampered the team.

All these guys were fine in 1992, 1996 and 1999.

Regardless even the team from 2007 is wiping the floor with this team.

In terms of weakest it's

1) 2024 Pakistan t20nworld cup
2) 2023 Pakistan wc
3) 2022 Pakistan t20 wc
4) 2025 Pakistan CT

^^ These 4 teams are the weakest pk teams to ever play in icc events all time.

2025 is stronger then 2023 wc Pakistan tbf. Is fakhar is injured for the rest of the tournament then we are even weaker then 2023 lol and just > 2022

 

[psyoptica]

I'm well aware of their icc tournament performances however that's not the point.

In pure skill level 2005 Pakistan is superior from all fronts with the exception of the openers (fakhar and babar) who are > Butt and kamran.

Before ct, we lost to NZ on our home ground twice. As for sa and Aus, Don't let those series fool you, the aus that played against us in the 3rd odi also played against srinlanka and they got demolished. Pakistan only won the 2nd game however Carey, Marsh and Travis weren't present.

When it comes to sa, those wins were good so won't comment on them.

2005 Pakistan would still demolish 2025 Pakistan 10 ways to Sunday.

Lastly you're overestimating their failures. 2003 had players at the end of their rope and 2007 is a shocking outlier. But that's about it they don't have a big sample size to claim they they'd 100% fail in icc events.

And with the exception of fakhar's innings vs nz in 2023 which is superior to anything any Pakistani batter has ever done in an icc event, Inzi's 1992 innings in sf is a close 2nd. That innings alone is > Anything anyone from 2025 excluding fakhar will be able to accomplish.

2007 Pakistan team was among the favourites to win the world cup. The outcome wasn't something anyone expected. Plus the format of the tournament made it possible for the big teams to get relegated in the initial rounds due to an upset win. Same thing happened with India when they lost to Bangla.

Pakistan batting was way stronger than the current team but bowling was weak. We had Sami, rana, iftikhar anjum leading the bowling attack. Our bowling strength developed later with the addition of Asif, Amir, Gul and quality spin bowlers.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

3rd consecutive win for NZ against PAK. Just beaten by a better, more skilled side

 

[Buffet]

64(90) SR 71 when chasing 320 runs.

That leaves 200-210 balls for others to score all runs.

Most of the times it will work only if batsman can step up and go crazy after 90 balls or some one else goes crazy. It's best to not play at SR of 70 for 90 balls when chasing 320 runs.

This is not the only reason. NZ played better. But simply highlighting - the longer you play with SR of 70 when chasing 320-330 runs, harder you will make for your team.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

now go watch the highlights of world cup 2007, only than you will understand.

Why just 2007 World Cup then?

We can also watch Mohali 2011, Misbah's famous (infamous?) scoop T20 World Cup and watch Pakistan in 2015 crumble to 1-4 vs West Indies when Misbah was captain basically ending their tournament before it even started.

 

[Bewal Express]

Its madness how Pakistan is still sticking to Babar, Rizwan, Shaheen, Naseem, Rauf. These players have lost so many matches for Pakistan and we are sitting at the bottom of the rankings in almost all formats. Other countries tolerate 2 failures maximum but then hold players accountable.

Agreed but the alternatives are even missed. For example had Shadab played today, we would had a better batter at 7, a better fielder and a better "spinner". This isn't to say he is much cop, but he is better than the alternatives. We are in a desperate bind because the average players are better than the really bad ones

 

[Rana]

Why just 2007 World Cup then?

We can also watch Mohali 2011, Misbah's famous (infamous?) scoop T20 World Cup and watch Pakistan in 2015 crumble to 1-4 vs West Indies when Misbah was captain basically ending their tournament before it even started.

bEcAuSe MiSbAh WaS bEtTeR tHaN iNzImAm iN iCc ToUrNaMeNt

 

[TeymurBlake]

The squad was appalling to select.

1 spinner & no other opener picked. Also Hasnain is in the squad.

 

[RyanRyan10]

Why just 2007 World Cup then?

We can also watch Mohali 2011, Misbah's famous (infamous?) scoop T20 World Cup and watch Pakistan in 2015 crumble to 1-4 vs West Indies when Misbah was captain basically ending their tournament before it even started.

Winless in CT 2013

 

[TeymurBlake]

The squad was appalling to select.

1 spinner & no other opener picked. Also Hasnain is in the squad.

The squad was appalling to select.

1 spinner & no other opener picked. Also Hasnain, Usman & Rana Farheen are in the squad.

Lack of combination in the squad as well. Similar top order players, lack of lower order batters picked.

The tournament was done once the squad was picked.

 

[RidiculousMan]

64(90) SR 71 when chasing 320 runs.

That leaves 200-210 balls for others to score all runs.

Most of the times it will work only if batsman can step up and go crazy after 90 balls or some one else goes crazy. It's best to not play at SR of 70 for 90 balls when chasing 320 runs.

This is not the only reason. NZ played better. But simply highlighting - the longer you play with SR of 70 when chasing 320-330 runs, harder you will make for your team.

This is why he is to be blamed the most. Not Tayyab for instance who straight up went for it.

This Babar doesn't understand. When you are left with no choice in a situation you have to throw the kitchen sink because there's no option. Yet he chooses to take the game deep. Was he waiting for his ideal de Villiers to show up and score the 250 runs at 10 runs per over?

 

[shaz619]

What does that got to d with anything I said? Everyone knows Pakistans batting has never been stable, whats to argue with this?

You tried to berate our batting line up 20 years ago when it achieved more then this bunch of spineless cowards, but you forget they would have achieved even more gold was it not for Misbah; so if your criticism is valid of the past line up then Misbah has a lot to do with that

 

[Savak]

Agreed but the alternatives are even missed. For example had Shadab played today, we would had a better batter at 7, a better fielder and a better "spinner". This isn't to say he is much cop, but he is better than the alternatives. We are in a desperate bind because the average players are better than the really bad ones

The thing is you have to keep players on their toes and have competition in the team. Players will end up having zero incentive or pressure to perform, improve if all the stakeholders just take the position that these are the best available players and everyone else on the bench and in domestic cricket is crap. Players need a kick up the back side.

 

[shaz619]

20 years ago we had one of our best set ups ever under Bob Woolmer, and 07 WC aside, 07 T20 trophy should have been won was it not for Misbah but when we made him a drinks boy in 09 T20 WC we won that, but the shatan still haunts us in Mohali to this day.

 

[Aami]

I think we sort of had a settled team after Aus, Zim and SA series wins so why change the squad? ...

Most teams after losing a player just plug the gap, that gap, so bring Usman in for Saim?. . Simple.

You've lost a 6th bowler in Saim, so fine bring Khushdil in ...OK. Nothing more.

Why played all those one days, won, and then changed ... why?

So this team was fine ..

Usman (Saim injured)
Fakhar (Abdullah dropped)
Babar
Riz
Sal
Kamran
Khushdil
Shaheen
Nasim
Haris
Abrar

Its not too late, this team can still play!

Do you guys seriously think by benching Saud, Tayyab, Faheem and Hasnain, we're missing a trick? Nope.

 

[shah9425]

This thread is about

But people now blaming misbah for everything

Who have retired a long time ago

 

[shaz619]

bEcAuSe MiSbAh WaS bEtTeR tHaN iNzImAm iN iCc ToUrNaMeNt

Misbah was better than Inzi at carrying the drinks in ICC tournies

 

[Aami]

This thread is about

But people now blaming misbah for everything

Who have retired a long time ago

haha

 

[Major]

Why just 2007 World Cup then?

We can also watch Mohali 2011, Misbah's famous (infamous?) scoop T20 World Cup and watch Pakistan in 2015 crumble to 1-4 vs West Indies when Misbah was captain basically ending their tournament before it even started.

becasue the line up he posted was off 2007 world cup.

 

[shah9425]

haha

I mean we are taking about 2025 champions trophy

But now we are blaming that scoop shot of 2007

 

[psyoptica]

This thread is about

But people now blaming misbah for everything

Who have retired a long time ago

He left a legacy that shaped the Pakistan cricket team's playing mentality as a slow, cowardly unit playing with the "saftey first" approach regardless of the circumstances. He was notorious for consuming a lot of overs, much like Babar's batting today, while the wickets around him continued to fall.
Misbah's approach may have worked 30 years ago but has no value in modern day cricket.

 

[RidiculousMan]

This thread is about

But people now blaming misbah for everything

Who have retired a long time ago

It's their daily hajmola

 

[RyanRyan10]

This thread is about

But people now blaming misbah for everything

Who have retired a long time ago

it started with someone claiming that Pakistan batting has been crap since 20 years ago. Some posters were responding to that claim.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

becasue the line up he posted was off 2007 world cup.

I mean to say when have Pakistan played great in ICC tournaments?

It doesnt matter which year you choose.

Its 1992 and 2009 and 2017 when Pakistan won tournaments and all of these times we had captains who understood the game.

 

[shah9425]

He left a legacy that shaped the Pakistan cricket team's playing mentality as a slow, cowardly unit playing with the "saftey first" approach regardless of the circumstances. He was notorious for consuming a lot of overs, much like Babar's batting today, while the wickets around him continued to fall.
Misbah's approach may have worked 30 years ago but has no value in modern day cricket.

But he didn't asked or taught Babar to play like this
He also won lot of matches on his own

So stop digging the past and focus on present

 

[LordJames]

Saud is the best player of spin so lets send him to open to face the new ball.

The writing was on the wall after that.

 

[mesmerizer85]

Saim Ayub was the X-factor that was giving positive start to the team in earlier ODIs. His Injury caused the Selection team to make so many changes to the winning combination that screwed up PCT.

 

[Rana]

This thread is about

But people now blaming misbah for everything

Who have retired a long time ago

Why are you upset?

 

[Bewal Express]

The thing is you have to keep players on their toes and have competition in the team. Players will end up having zero incentive or pressure to perform, improve if all the stakeholders just take the position that these are the best available players and everyone else on the bench and in domestic cricket is crap. Players need a kick up the back side.

I agree but you need players that are going to be credible. It's our misfortune that we never build any bench strength. Look at our awful test bowling, the new guys are barely FC. The hard yards are done at the FC level over a long period of time but our FC teams are mostly 2nd 11 county teams, with no professionalism. There is no team culture or any stability. The World has moved on and we have Ghani glass playing some other chumps with Moeez Ghani made captain.

 

[Bewal Express]

Saud is the best player of spin so lets send him to open to face the new ball.

The writing was on the wall after that.

Looking at how scared he looked, I don't think it would have made any difference. This was a chance for him but he looked a rabbit in the headlights

 

[Bewal Express]

For me our decline started in 1999. That was the last time we went into a tournament and were either the best or on par with the best. We had an excellent bowling lineup with all basis covered and our batting had enough power, finesse and guile to win games. Since then we had a few green shoots but the trend is downwards.

 

[RidiculousMan]

Looking at how scared he looked, I don't think it would have made any difference. This was a chance for him but he looked a rabbit in the headlights

Different formats. He's good against spin in defending and maneuvering.

But when asked to hit the spinners in white bal. It becomes a different game. Defending is easy. Attacking is difficult.

 

[TheSultan]

We can say the bowling was bad (which it was), but pitches like Karachi in the modern day are 320 pitches, this is nothing out of the ordinary.

It’s our consumption of dots after dots after dots. This obsession has killed our cricket. 22 after 10 overs? What era do they think they are playing. Babar, Rizwan, Saud should hang their heads in shame. There is simply no excuse for it.

even kids know the importance and f rotating the strike.

Absolutely pathetic. I am ashamed of this team and their cowardly brand of cricket. India deserve to decimate them.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

For me our decline started in 1999. That was the last time we went into a tournament and were either the best or on par with the best. We had an excellent bowling lineup with all basis covered and our batting had enough power, finesse and guile to win games. Since then we had a few green shoots but the trend is downwards.

I would venture to say that it wasnt our decline that really started it all but a paradigm shift of cricket in 2000 along with Saurav Ganguly who shifted mindsets. in India and cricket in general.

Before this, we used to depend on a few superstars and miracles and it was enough in the 90s to compete because cricket was considered more of an elite sport and less heed was given to its development and progression.

2000 saw the era of professionalism, atheleticism, mental transformation and embracing cricket as a major sport.

Australia were pioneers of the mental game and took it levels unmatched in history of the game.
The other teams simply are/were too professional to let one or two superstars or miracles to let Pakistan win major tournaments.

When T20 came through, Pakistan had another chance because the skills and concentration were sequestered for shorter period of time (most of Pakistan and South Asians have untreated ADHD and DSM IX psychiatric issues anyways).

However, now even in T20 skills have changed and Pakistan is languishing at bottom. They are still used to grabbing a win here and there by a freak performance but the consistency and ability to self-improve doesnt exist because it is simply not ingrained in our sportsmen.

The fact that Babar sat around for 60 odd runs at a SR of 70s while chasing 320 odd and the fact that his innings will still applauded by large segments of the Pakistani society tells me that the mental ability of the fans is zero.

They dont have any idea about cricket. Getting excited at our team chasing 200 in 20 overs or 350 in 50 overs against C class teams of England and South Africa tells you most of them have never introspected on a game of cricket in their life.

If you want joy and have the mental capacity higher than a baboon I would suggest to follow some other team.

The paradigm change just isnt happening in the next 5 years because large segments of the society are afraid of change and it wont happen.

So results will stay the same.

With the odd win here and there.

 

[Major]

Well when your coach is aqib javed what do you expect

 

[hamzie]

The squad selection

 

[Bewal Express]

We can say the bowling was bad (which it was), but pitches like Karachi in the modern day are 320 pitches, this is nothing out of the ordinary.

It’s our consumption of dots after dots after dots. This obsession has killed our cricket. 22 after 10 overs? What era do they think they are playing. Babar, Rizwan, Saud should hang their heads in shame. There is simply no excuse for it.

even kids know the importance and f rotating the strike.

Absolutely pathetic. I am ashamed of this team and their cowardly brand of cricket. India deserve to decimate them.

This wasn't a 320 pitch. As soon as I saw Khushdil turn the ball,I felt it was a 230 pitch. Our bowlers were really poor

 

[AAli98]

NZ have got Paks number big time.. Pak have Nepals number shame they’re not in the tournament.