What would other countries have done with Umar Akmal?

[Tekcirc]

first of all they don't belong in the same sentence
second of all after same number of matches, Kohli is miles ahead, whereas Umar still bang average after playing so many matches
the main thing is the mentality, at this stage Umar Akmal's mentality is the opposite of Kohli's, so don't bother arguing

You are missing my point completely. Both were talented players when they debuted, but both had their own flaws in their batting style. While Kohli was made to wait a full year for his next round of games. Akmal's flawws were ignored and hyped as best thing since sliced bread. Pakistani board just took it for granted Akmal's flaws would get resolved on its own.

When the foundations are so weak you can build towers on it.

 

[Tekcirc]

In India, we wouldn't have had to do much, because a lot of his sense of self-importance would have been straightened out naturally because he'd be among equals and several superior players.



Several of my friends seemed to rate Umar very highly back then ahead of Kohli. Seems to have been an Indian malaise.

No proof, but I always put Kohli ahead

Akmal did start with a bang louder than Kohli, but his slog mentality was so obvious. Add his poor work ethics, he doesn't deserve mention in the same sentence as Kohli today.

 

[Pollack]

Dhoni would have groomed him as a finisher and would have knocked some sense into his head. What a waste of talent

Dhoni could not groom a single player under his reign as a finisher and you feel he would have groomed Umar Akmal of all people as a finisher. Also list me all the things that dhoni could do. Already he bats,keeps,used to captain,bowls(yes whenever bowlers do good job its dhoni making them do but when they are bad they are on their own.). Hoho he is a superman.

 

[Blackbradman]

Umar Akmal not giving up on Test comeback

Akmal was of the opinion that his batting style was suited to the way Test cricket is played presently. "I still wonder what I did wrong and where I went wrong to be dropped from Test side," Akmal said in Dubai, where he is playing for Lahore Qalandars in the PSL. "They only dropped me saying that I am not suitable for Test cricket because I don't hold back, which is required in Tests.

 

[rhony]

Dhoni could not groom a single player under his reign as a finisher and you feel he would have groomed Umar Akmal of all people as a finisher. Also list me all the things that dhoni could do. Already he bats,keeps,used to captain,bowls(yes whenever bowlers do good job its dhoni making them do but when they are bad they are on their own.). Hoho he is a superman.

Dhoni molded himself from a top order bat to finisher. He is responsible for Raina, Rohit and to a certain extent Kohli's rise in the team. He is currently helping Jadav and the results are already there to see.

 

[Tekcirc]

Dhoni molded himself from a top order bat to finisher. He is responsible for Raina, Rohit and to a certain extent Kohli's rise in the team. He is currently helping Jadav and the results are already there to see.

Gautam Gambhir would heartily disagree with you. Mentoring and grooming and playing along side are not the same things.

 

[Stumper]

Umar Akmal not giving up on Test comeback

Akmal was of the opinion that his batting style was suited to the way Test cricket is played presently. "I still wonder what I did wrong and where I went wrong to be dropped from Test side," Akmal said in Dubai, where he is playing for Lahore Qalandars in the PSL. "They only dropped me saying that I am not suitable for Test cricket because I don't hold back, which is required in Tests.

All he need to do is shut the mouth, & let the bat do all the talkings... I haven't seen him going to any great batsmen for tips about what he is doing wrong and start to work upon those inputs. rather he comes gives excuses which makes no sense.

He would have been out of any team & could not have made any combacks. He seems like stubborn person who feels, it would be shame if he take advice from any past or modern greats of game.

 

[Tekcirc]

All he need to do is shut the mouth, & let the bat do all the talkings... I haven't seen him going to any great batsmen for tips about what he is doing wrong and start to work upon those inputs. rather he comes gives excuses which makes no sense.

He would have been out of any team & could not have made any combacks. He seems like stubborn person who feels, it would be shame if he take advice from any past or modern greats of game.

Pardon for tutting the same horn here. Its Afridi and his fans who are at fault. When a mediocre slogger gets worshipped and even compared to greats like Imran and Wasim in fan following, youngsters are set a very misleading example of what it means to be great at cricket.

We can all crib that Akmal should have used his head. But fans and the playing environment does play a role. In school, we read a biography on Kapil Dev as to how no body cared about a fast bowler from India. There was no tradition, no support for a fast bowler to survive in India.

Its a huge struggle to rise in such a setup. Same applies for Akmal where fans and media and sponsors show overwhelming love to a wild slogger. Who wouldn't want to be one?

 

[Stumper]

Pardon for tutting the same horn here. Its Afridi and his fans who are at fault. When a mediocre slogger gets worshipped and even compared to greats like Imran and Wasim in fan following, youngsters are set a very misleading example of what it means to be great at cricket.

We can all crib that Akmal should have used his head. But fans and the playing environment does play a role. In school, we read a biography on Kapil Dev as to how no body cared about a fast bowler from India. There was no tradition, no support for a fast bowler to survive in India.

Its a huge struggle to rise in such a setup. Same applies for Akmal where fans and media and sponsors show overwhelming love to a wild slogger. Who wouldn't want to be one?

Its hard to understand why peoples like misbah who tries to win games by trying to win the games by batting till last over to keep Pakistan in the hunt are kept at bay and, players like Afridi, UA are worshipped.

 

[Markhor]

I wouldn't mind him opening as there would be no more excuses left.

As for other countries, they would've kicked him out on fitness grounds alone. The way he turns easy 2s into 1s is disgusting. He weighed 91kg at his last fitness test and has a fat level reading of 115 when anything above 100 is considered high. Yet he says "what do you expect of me ?" and that losing weight would mean losing power in his shots.

 

[Tekcirc]

I wouldn't mind him opening as there would be no more excuses left.

As for other countries, they would've kicked him out on fitness grounds alone. The way he turns easy 2s into 1s is disgusting. He weighed 91kg at his last fitness test and has a fat level reading of 115 when anything above 100 is considered high. Yet he says "what do you expect of me ?" and that losing weight would mean losing power in his shots.

If he has a medical condition then sorry, there is no special treatment at top tier of sports for that.

 

[Markhor]

If he has a medical condition then sorry, there is no special treatment at top tier of sports for that.

He doesn't have a medical condition. This idea that if you lose weight you lose power in your shots is a myth, yes it may take a bit of time adjusting but if you're a fit and in-shape cricketer you can still be an effective strokemaker.

Its pure laziness and unprofessionalism that we've come to expect from this boy who's never grown up and doesn't take responsibility for his own career.

 

[Stallion__]

He would still have been an inconsistent player irrespective of which country he would have played for.

 

[Tekcirc]

He doesn't have a medical condition. This idea that if you lose weight you lose power in your shots is a myth, yes it may take a bit of time adjusting but if you're a fit and in-shape cricketer you can still be an effective strokemaker.

Its pure laziness and unprofessionalism that we've come to expect from this boy who's never grown up and doesn't take responsibility for his own career.

I know that bro, He is saying that like he has a medical condition and should be exempted from fitness standards!

 

[Tekcirc]

He would still have been an inconsistent player irrespective of which country he would have played for.

No one would have remembered him at international level after so many failures. All teams have tons of players who shine a little but fizzle out, they are shunted back to domestic circuit like forever:

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Hilarious to see some posters trying to prove that if Umar was in some other team he would have been an international class player.

There are two things that define success.

Brain and Work Ethic.

Unfortunately Akmal lacks both.

He would have played around 50 internationals for a foreign team and then discarded for good. Might have got a slightly longer rope in tests before being discarded for losing some tests because of charging down the wicket and losing his wicket.

By now, he would have been history in every major cricket playing country.

Only in Pakistan can his attitude and problems be attributed to tragedy, system and continuous external factors.

And the funny thing is, his supporters keep milking the pudding.

 

[shaz619]

Umar may have been utilized better by another set up [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] but you can't deny that the man just has a really really bad attitude and god awful work ethic; I've never seen a player with such an inflated victim mentality. He's not a bad person but just doesn't hold himself accountable on any level which is why he cannot get better as a player.

 

[salman24]

Give him a proper run at the top of the order. Let him play his game and evolve as a batsman instead of criticizing him every chance they got, and making him a scapegoat for everything.

 

[Junaids]

Umar may have been utilized better by another set up [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] but you can't deny that the man just has a really really bad attitude and god awful work ethic; I've never seen a player with such an inflated victim mentality. He's not a bad person but just doesn't hold himself accountable on any level which is why he cannot get better as a player.

Yes, I accept every word.

But does he need to get better than a Test average of 37 outside Asia?

 

[asma_cricfan]

after reading posts regarding his fitness, i was thinking why he would work hard to improve his fitness and awareness of game plan when he can be selected in ODI without playing any recent domestic ODI tournament.

Any other country where he can use his mysterious connections would play him as long as he want.

 

[shaz619]

Yes, I accept every word.

But does he need to get better than a Test average of 37 outside Asia?

You're right but those numbers came during his prime, he is not the same batsman anymore. Some evidence, in the recent AUS series he averaged 32 at a S/R of 82, during his prime he averaged 37 (although at a S/R of 71) in the ODI's in Australia during the 2009/10 tour over there. His cousin is doing a much better job then him and is more then an adequate replacement/investment.

 

[Bouncer]

Several of my friends seemed to rate Umar very highly back then ahead of Kohli. Seems to have been an Indian malaise.

No proof, but I always put Kohli ahead

Proves that Indian fans UNDERSTAND art of batting way better than Pakistani cricket fans. It is a culture of batting and not just those playing but those following understand the art.

In India, we wouldn't have had to do much, because a lot of his sense of self-importance would have been straightened out naturally because he'd be among equals and several superior players.

I am intrigued by the word that you used to describe Umar, "self-importance" and how it would have been straightened out by several superior players in Indian team.

Here is also a difference between Indian senior cricketer and Pakistani ones, The self importance of the seniors in Pak, those in leadership position were the ones whose self importance was the reason UA was thrown out of the team. They could not put a check on their own self importance and on the stand that their prescribed way of batting IS THE ONLY WAY to follow & the ones who do not follow it, will be taught a lesson. Classic definition of Self Importance.

When he was dropped from test team in Fall 2011, do you know what the chief selector (Mohsin Hasan Khan) said? He said..UA needs to go back to domestic cricket to learn how to play patience cricket. Sounds like a great man with wonderful advice for UA, right?

Now - Do you know what he did next to UA? He selected him to go play in Hong Kong Super 6's for Pak to learn how to play patiently. Do you see what happened here?

Here is another GEM from that chief selector (Mohsin Hasan Khan). Right before the Zim tour (Where UA was dropped from test side) there was a T20 tournament in which one guy caught my eye...Here is what I wrote about that guy little while ago.

Sharjeel Khan: The real unfortunate one...I think, his biggest disadvantage is that he is from Hyderabad....I honestly feel terrible for this guy, Let me first start by telling you when I first saw him, it was in Pak T20 tournament couple of years ago, the way he was treating all the bowlers was just eye opening, he was really really quick at picking up the length of the ball and he had real good hand eye coordination, he dominated the bowling that he faced in such a way that reminded me of Adam Gilchrist, especially the way he hoicked the balls over mid wicket and how good/punishing he was on the short balls. Now Pak is the only place where "ex cricketers/cricket experts" who will present a players strength as his weakness just so they can push other guy who is either from their city or is related to them or has connection that helped that cricket expert get where he is...either in some position within PCB (Coach/Selector) or on some news channel as a cricket expert. So Sharjeel was not taken on next Pak tour (which was of Zimbabwe in 2011) and one guy who made it to the tour was the commentator for that T20 in which sharjeel played like a royalty. The excuse that the genius MHK gave and was heard via other media people that Sharjeel is too much of an on side player...those geniuses were not able to process the fact that it was Sharjeel's good hand eye coordination which was enabling him to pick up length of the ball too early and also that the quality of bowlers was not so good to keep challenging so he kept hitting most of his scoring shots on the on side. So they were able to turn (what to me looked like)his biggest strength into a weakness and keep him outside. Another guy who scored some runs in that T20 cup was Ramiz Raja who got taken to that Zimb tour, but anyone would tell you that he looked like an onside slogger (thats what they called sharjeel and kept him him and took Ramiz) but Ramiz was not from Hyderabad so he got to tour. I honestly believe that he is very very unfortunate to have the talent that he does and perhaps his chances of Playing for Pak are very very slim as he will always miss out on being from Hyderabad and not having the support from people like Iqbal Qasim, Wasim Bari, MHK, Salim Jaffar, Sikandar Bakhat, Moin Khan, Abdul Qadir, Mohammad Ilyaas etc etc and media folks like Yahya Hussaini, Faizan Lakhani, abdul majeed bhatti and this cult of Ex cricketers and media folks will not go in favor of this guy from Hyderabad. - See more at: http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...!&p=8408750&highlight=Commentator#post8408750

 

[sundries]

1) His problem is his mental strength .. He makes statements like "Now you will see a Mature Umar Akmal" but 6 months later he is still the same .. It's like someone making statements to oneself that from tomorrow onwards I will work out or study like anything and never do
2) Dhoni might never have mentored or backed him because he always expects his players to be committed towards winning and those are the players he has backed and has always been weary of irresponsible or crowd pleasing players .. Maybe the reason why Yusuf Pathan was shown the door
3) He is talented but seldom have players flourished solely on the basis of talent in International cricket .. Not many teams would have persisted with him ..

 

[Monsee]

It seems Pakistan is lost at what to do with Umar Akmal. What other countries would have done with Umar Akmal? I am specifically interested in Australia, England, South Africa and India.

Considering the tidh on this guy these days, he would have been sent on a maternity leave, for good i.e!

 

[rhony]

Gautam Gambhir would heartily disagree with you. Mentoring and grooming and playing along side are not the same things.

Gambhir is just a sore loser. The Indian team post WC 2011 was moulded by Dhoni. Ashwin, Jadeja etc have Dhoni to tank for along with Rohit, Raina (come back), Dhawan etc

 

[Sin Nombre]

I see some silly comparisons to Raina or Maxwell as LOI players.

You would take both of them over Ukmal just for fielding alone.

 

[asma_cricfan]

lol.
i had to bump this thread.
he was gifted a chance by shinwari but he is am akmal.
if there was someone else, he would atleast carefull for his next shots.

 

[Tekcirc]

I see some silly comparisons to Raina or Maxwell as LOI players.

You would take both of them over Ukmal just for fielding alone.

The comparison what Boards would have done with Akmal if he was in India or any other team.
Akmal had a stellar start to his career and had lots of potential but he wasted away due to poor attitude and still PCB persists with him.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Another failure today when even accumulators like Sarfraz and Rizwan batted at a higher strike rate.

This guy is the most overrated cricketer in the history of Cricket, a complete failure who should be shown the door permanently now.

 

[pillionrider]

Proves that Indian fans UNDERSTAND art of batting way better than Pakistani cricket fans. It is a culture of batting and not just those playing but those following understand the art.



I am intrigued by the word that you used to describe Umar, "self-importance" and how it would have been straightened out by several superior players in Indian team.

Here is also a difference between Indian senior cricketer and Pakistani ones, The self importance of the seniors in Pak, those in leadership position were the ones whose self importance was the reason UA was thrown out of the team. They could not put a check on their own self importance and on the stand that their prescribed way of batting IS THE ONLY WAY to follow & the ones who do not follow it, will be taught a lesson. Classic definition of Self Importance.

When he was dropped from test team in Fall 2011, do you know what the chief selector (Mohsin Hasan Khan) said? He said..UA needs to go back to domestic cricket to learn how to play patience cricket. Sounds like a great man with wonderful advice for UA, right?

Now - Do you know what he did next to UA? He selected him to go play in Hong Kong Super 6's for Pak to learn how to play patiently. Do you see what happened here?

Here is another GEM from that chief selector (Mohsin Hasan Khan). Right before the Zim tour (Where UA was dropped from test side) there was a T20 tournament in which one guy caught my eye...Here is what I wrote about that guy little while ago.

Interesting read.

Just to continue with the point I was making. Early in Kohli's career, I've seen him strutting around after a good knock. Yuvi used to bully him in a friendly way, but more importantly, the presence of Sachin at the time I think had a big role in keeping him in check and getting him to realise what was most important as a cricketer.

 

[Saj]

It's always easy to blame the lack of role-models and mentors.

Those that want to learn and succeed don't need role models or mentors.