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Which players in the current Pakistan side have ATG potential?

Potential wise from those who i have watched:

Sarfraz (as captain)
Babar (overall)
Hasan (overall)
Shadab (overall)
Yasir (tests)
Haris (tests, Pakistani great probably due to injury)
Amir (lois)
Usman (Pakistani great in tests)
Faheem (Pakistan great overall)
Fakhar (Pakistani great lois)
Azhar (Pakistani great tests)
Hussain (Pakistani great overall)
Abbas (Pakistani great tests)
Sadaf (Pakistani great tests)
Saud Shakeel (Pakistani great odis and tests)
Nasir Nawaz (t20s)
Sharjeel Khan (lois)
 
SarfiBabarHaris said:
Potential wise from those who i have watched:

Sarfraz (as captain)
Babar (overall)
Hasan (overall)
Shadab (overall)
Yasir (tests)
Haris (tests, Pakistani great probably due to injury)
Amir (lois)
Usman (Pakistani great in tests)
Faheem (Pakistan great overall)
Fakhar (Pakistani great lois)
Azhar (Pakistani great tests)
Hussain (Pakistani great overall)
Abbas (Pakistani great tests)
Sadaf (Pakistani great tests)
Saud Shakeel (Pakistani great odis and tests)
Nasir Nawaz (t20s)
Sharjeel Khan (lois)
Click to expand...

If all these players are potential greats, we should be unbeatable then:kp
 
j_kazmi said:
If all these players are potential greats, we should be unbeatable then:kp
Click to expand...

All these have immense potential in different formats and departments. In other countries few of them for example like Haris would already have been greats imo.
 
None except Hasan Ali.

Fans are surprisingly way excited after only one good day of the test match. The same team was having hard time winning against Ireland.

Pakistan have been competitive against England always but are pretty minnows against every other opposition like Aus, SA,NZ and WI. Even SL just won a series in UAE.
 
Ab Fan said:
None except Hasan Ali.

Fans are surprisingly way excited after only one good day of the test match. The same team was having hard time winning against Ireland.

Pakistan have been competitive against England always but are pretty minnows against every other opposition like Aus, SA,NZ and WI. Even SL just won a series in UAE.
Click to expand...

No it’s not based on today at all. Just curious.
 
Ab Fan said:
None except Hasan Ali.

Fans are surprisingly way excited after only one good day of the test match. The same team was having hard time winning against Ireland.

Pakistan have been competitive against England always but are pretty minnows against every other opposition like Aus, SA,NZ and WI. Even SL just won a series in UAE.
Click to expand...

Its not after today's match. If you see me, [MENTION=143344]babajee[/MENTION] and some other posters for last half/1 year we have been consistently saying that bright times are ahead and we have an amazing young lot even when we were in bad position against Ireland. All these youngsters are bit different from the older lot in an area that they are v.hard working and team players. We have a good coaching staff and captain to get the best out of this lot. They just need time, backing and patience from fans. Most if not all will come good.
 
ATG is an overused term by Fans(it is a rare league) , we should start with Pakistani greats and I would say Hasan and Shadab.
 
why you want to make PCT laughing stock.i would say none only virat kohli in current generation is close to be ATG which should tell you about how hard it is to become ATG
 
amax said:
ATG is an overused term by Fans(it is a rare league) , we should start with Pakistani greats and I would say Hasan and Shadab.
Click to expand...

saeed5646 said:
why you want to make PCT laughing stock.i would say none only virat kohli in current generation is close to be ATG which should tell you about how hard it is to become ATG
Click to expand...

Ok let’s say Pakistani greats.
 
Babar Azam is the obvious pick. However, I'm also backing Shadab Khan.
 
None. First they need to become one of the best players in the world then we can talk about their potential as ATG. For example Root, Williamson, Rabada, and Starc are some of the best players around today, they have the potential to become ATG. There is just no comparison between these players and Pakistani players atm. To say any of these current Pakistani players have potential to be ATG is ridiculous, considering they haven't done anything.
 
All these players except for Sarfaraz, Amir, Azar and Asad are just starting out. Too early to call them potential ATG in tests at least. ODI Hasan has it in him to become of the ATG bowlers.
 
Ab Fan said:
None except Hasan Ali.

Fans are surprisingly way excited after only one good day of the test match. The same team was having hard time winning against Ireland.

Pakistan have been competitive against England always but are pretty minnows against every other opposition like Aus, SA,NZ and WI. Even SL just won a series in UAE.
Click to expand...

Pakistan lost one series to NZ after 30 years Windies we regularly beat home and away SL caught us at the wrong time our first series post Mis-You we also won our last away series to them. SA and Aus agreed we play like minnows against them when we travel though we have not lost a home series to both of them for over 10 years. So I guess if these are minnow stats then even India is minnows for being 2-17 in their non sub cont test matches:)
 
Darkrai said:
None. First they need to become one of the best players in the world then we can talk about their potential as ATG. For example Root, Williamson, Rabada, and Starc are some of the best players around today, they have the potential to become ATG. There is just no comparison between these players and Pakistani players atm. To say any of these current Pakistani players have potential to be ATG is ridiculous, considering they haven't done anything.
Click to expand...

Hasan was CT bowler of the tournament and rose to no 1 in the ODI bowling ranks.
Yasir Shah is the second fastest ever to 100 Test wickets and rose to no 1 in the Test bowling rankings.
Babar is no 1 in the T20 batting rankings and rose to 5 in the ODI rankings.

I am not as optimistic as others about the number of ATGs in our pipeline. But in fairness, isn't this what "becoming one of the best in the world" looks like? If Hasan is ranked above Starc, how can one say there is no comparison between him and Starc?
 
New Yorker said:
Hasan was CT bowler of the tournament and rose to no 1 in the ODI bowling ranks.
Yasir Shah is the second fastest ever to 100 Test wickets and rose to no 1 in the Test bowling rankings.
Babar is no 1 in the T20 batting rankings and rose to 5 in the ODI rankings.

I am not as optimistic as others about the number of ATGs in our pipeline. But in fairness, isn't this what "becoming one of the best in the world" looks like? If Hasan is ranked above Starc, how can one say there is no comparison between him and Starc?
Click to expand...

Rankings are fine but you need a lot more to become the best in the world. For instant, Babar needs to score against top oppositions away, he needs to play matching winning knocks against Eng, Aus, SA, India, and NZ-we saw what happened in NZ. He needs to do that consistently for at least few years before he could reach the stage where one could say he is a potential ATG.

Yasir is no doubt a very good bowler but can you honestly say he has what it takes to become shane warne or at least come close to him...no. Yasir so far has been successful at taking wickets on turning tracks but like Babar he needs to do this away from home against top opposition. He does not necessarily have to give top performance everywhere in the world because that would be very difficult but he has to do a lot more than what he showed in Aus..

Hasan Ali has only played 30 ODIs 2 tests and 16 T20s. Let him give the kind of performance that he is giving us now consistently for few years before we could say he is a Potential ATG. Remember many players give incredible performance for couple of years but then decline very fast. You have batsmen averaging 70+ for couple of years but that doesn't last long, their averages drop after awhile, because it's very difficult to do that consistently. Same thing with bowlers, that's why i say give him time before you say he is going to become the next Wasim or McGrath because that is the standard for ATG.

Starc has played 42 test and 72 ODIs. There isn't much to compare as far as tests are concerned because Hasan just made his debut, taht's why i say it's too early give him time. In ODIs Hasan's sample size is much less compared to starc but i will say Hasan has been top class in ODI-so let him give top class performance for couple of years in ODIs and Tests then we can talk about his potential as ATG.
 
Ab Fan said:
None except Hasan Ali.

Fans are surprisingly way excited after only one good day of the test match. The same team was having hard time winning against Ireland.

Pakistan have been competitive against England always but are pretty minnows against every other opposition like Aus, SA,NZ and WI. Even SL just won a series in UAE.
Click to expand...

WI? Seriously ?
Pakistani Test side is younger one , give them time before writing them off .Two years back , pak were no 1 side in the world , be patient .All ups and down are the phases of every team , be it pak or any team else .
 
Last edited by a moderator:
None of them, yet. Only Hasan Ali is a possibility.

And lol @ Amir being an ATG. It's insane how Pakistani's overrate him.
 
Don't know about ATG, but I can count a couple of international standard players for sure. Hasan and Babar.
 
Darkrai said:
Rankings are fine but you need a lot more to become the best in the world. For instant, Babar needs to score against top oppositions away, he needs to play matching winning knocks against Eng, Aus, SA, India, and NZ-we saw what happened in NZ. He needs to do that consistently for at least few years before he could reach the stage where one could say he is a potential ATG.

Yasir is no doubt a very good bowler but can you honestly say he has what it takes to become shane warne or at least come close to him...no. Yasir so far has been successful at taking wickets on turning tracks but like Babar he needs to do this away from home against top opposition. He does not necessarily have to give top performance everywhere in the world because that would be very difficult but he has to do a lot more than what he showed in Aus..

Hasan Ali has only played 30 ODIs 2 tests and 16 T20s. Let him give the kind of performance that he is giving us now consistently for few years before we could say he is a Potential ATG. Remember many players give incredible performance for couple of years but then decline very fast. You have batsmen averaging 70+ for couple of years but that doesn't last long, their averages drop after awhile, because it's very difficult to do that consistently. Same thing with bowlers, that's why i say give him time before you say he is going to become the next Wasim or McGrath because that is the standard for ATG.

Starc has played 42 test and 72 ODIs. There isn't much to compare as far as tests are concerned because Hasan just made his debut, taht's why i say it's too early give him time. In ODIs Hasan's sample size is much less compared to starc but i will say Hasan has been top class in ODI-so let him give top class performance for couple of years in ODIs and Tests then we can talk about his potential as ATG.
Click to expand...

A balanced analysis , quality post.
 
Being an ATG is very difficult so that term can't just be thrown around. I think in the current team, Hasan Ali has the highest chance imo if he stays fit, amazing bowler and just an amazing character :)
 
Darkrai said:
Rankings are fine but you need a lot more to become the best in the world. For instant, Babar needs to score against top oppositions away, he needs to play matching winning knocks against Eng, Aus, SA, India, and NZ-we saw what happened in NZ. He needs to do that consistently for at least few years before he could reach the stage where one could say he is a potential ATG.

Yasir is no doubt a very good bowler but can you honestly say he has what it takes to become shane warne or at least come close to him...no. Yasir so far has been successful at taking wickets on turning tracks but like Babar he needs to do this away from home against top opposition. He does not necessarily have to give top performance everywhere in the world because that would be very difficult but he has to do a lot more than what he showed in Aus..

Hasan Ali has only played 30 ODIs 2 tests and 16 T20s. Let him give the kind of performance that he is giving us now consistently for few years before we could say he is a Potential ATG. Remember many players give incredible performance for couple of years but then decline very fast. You have batsmen averaging 70+ for couple of years but that doesn't last long, their averages drop after awhile, because it's very difficult to do that consistently. Same thing with bowlers, that's why i say give him time before you say he is going to become the next Wasim or McGrath because that is the standard for ATG.

Starc has played 42 test and 72 ODIs. There isn't much to compare as far as tests are concerned because Hasan just made his debut, taht's why i say it's too early give him time. In ODIs Hasan's sample size is much less compared to starc but i will say Hasan has been top class in ODI-so let him give top class performance for couple of years in ODIs and Tests then we can talk about his potential as ATG.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree with much of what you say in here, but it is also a far more reasoned argument than your previous post, to which I took issue. I was not claiming that any current Pakistani players looks certain to become ATGs, I am entirely agnostic on the matter. What I found strange is the assertion

1, that they first have to become best in the world. how would you know that? do not rankings matter at all. and if so, what about those no 1 rankings for x, y, z?

2. that there is no comparison between hasan and starc. which there of course is. otherwise the icc rankings would be of no interest. i don't care is hasan is better or nor. but one can clearly compare them.

now i dont want to wade into a debate about what it means to be 'the best' but i was struck by your apparent confidence that the question of who is best can be so easily arbitrated. whereas in fact, it seems that is what we spend all day arguing about, innit?
 
SarfiBabarHaris said:
Potential wise from those who i have watched:

Sarfraz (as captain)
Babar (overall)
Hasan (overall)
Shadab (overall)
Yasir (tests)
Haris (tests, Pakistani great probably due to injury)
Amir (lois)
Usman (Pakistani great in tests)
Faheem (Pakistan great overall)
Fakhar (Pakistani great lois)
Azhar (Pakistani great tests)
Hussain (Pakistani great overall)
Abbas (Pakistani great tests)
Sadaf (Pakistani great tests)
Saud Shakeel (Pakistani great odis and tests)
Nasir Nawaz (t20s)
Sharjeel Khan (lois)
Click to expand...

Even from all countries taken together, it will be hard to put so many names for potential to become ATG.
 
Buffet said:
Even from all countries taken together, it will be hard to put so many names for potential to become ATG.
Click to expand...

Included many as Pakistani greats and for different formats separately. But i get your point if you are strictly talking about international ATGs all formats combined. Then i will go with Babar, Hasan and Shadab.
 
Godhelpma said:
WI? Seriously ?
Pakistani Test side is younger one , give them time before writing them off .Two years back , pak were no 1 side in the world , be patient .All ups and down are the phases of every team , be it pak or any team else .
Click to expand...

If you perform competitively against minnows like WI hone and away it doesn't make you great team.
 
Faheem, Shadab and Babar are three player which can be serious contender for ATG players. Specially Faheem, in my opinion, his batting is much better than all other Pakistani fast bowling all rounder like Razzaq, Azhar and Wasim Akram. His bowling will improve with time.
 
None of them will be ATG but a lot of them can be Pakistan greats

Babar Azam
Azhar Ali
Shoaib Malik
Fakhar Zaman
Sarfraz Ahmed (for captaining us to a CT win)
Shadab Khan
Faheem Ashraf
Muhammad Amir
Hassan Ali
Yasir Shah
Muhammad Abbas
 
New Yorker said:
I don't disagree with much of what you say in here, but it is also a far more reasoned argument than your previous post, to which I took issue. I was not claiming that any current Pakistani players looks certain to become ATGs, I am entirely agnostic on the matter. What I found strange is the assertion

1, that they first have to become best in the world. how would you know that? do not rankings matter at all. and if so, what about those no 1 rankings for x, y, z?

2. that there is no comparison between hasan and starc. which there of course is. otherwise the icc rankings would be of no interest. i don't care is hasan is better or nor. but one can clearly compare them.

now i dont want to wade into a debate about what it means to be 'the best' but i was struck by your apparent confidence that the question of who is best can be so easily arbitrated. whereas in fact, it seems that is what we spend all day arguing about, innit?
Click to expand...

Ranking are a bit flawed. A player can become number 1 by performing only against WI,WL,BD, and Zimbabwe. Performing against those countries is entirely different from performing say in Aus, SA etc. We have been playing a lot cricket against SL and WI as of late but the same isn't true for most other countries. So an Aus player will find it difficult to become number 1 in ICC ranking because they will be playing against stronger teams. Rankings can be useful but they can be also misleading at times.

To become the best in the world is simple. You not only have to perform away against top countries but also have to become a match winner-regardless of the opposition. Lets take Babar as an example. He averages around 51 but that's mostly because he always scores big against WI and SL. He completely flopped in NZ. He averaged around 56 in Aus but he could not win us a single match-so not a match winner against a top side away from home. In comparison Joe Root averages 54 in Aus, NZ, SA, and Ind. If Babar was averaging 51 by performing away against the best countries and winning us matches then i would consider him one of the best in the world because averaging over 50 is very difficult.

In Test cricket you can't compare Hasan with Starc yet for obvious reasons, different story in ODIs. In ODIs yes i think Hasan is one of the best in the world ATM, especially for his CT performance, but it's still too early to claim he can become ATG when he has only played like 30 matches. Also in NZ he averaged 36. Like i said earlier, players need to give consistent performance for several years in order for one to consider them ATG potential. For those reasons i say give him time before labeling him a potential ATG-plus it's also unnecessary pressure on the players. Heck there are some people who don't even consider AB an ATG material, we all know how good he has consistently been, so becoming an ATG is not easy. I do believe he is our player ODI player and if he continues to be this good consistently for couple of years then you can say he has potential to be ATG.
 
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