Who should be held responsible for the fact that our bench strength is totally under prepared heading into the ODI WC in 2023?

[Savak]

Pakistan's bowling line up looked totally toothless given the injuries to Naseem and Haris Rauf.

Our Spin bowling resources for which Shadab, Nawaz have been given an eternally monopoly for the last few years are looking very pedestrian whereas all the other major countries have proper specialist spinners who are going to play a major role in the 2023 ODI WC in India.

Who should be held responsible for all this?

Is it Misbah ul Haq who was appointed as the Chief Selector, Head Coach, Batting Coach of the team from 2019 to 2021? Is it Waqar Younis who was appointed as the bowling coach from 2019 to 2021?

Is it Saqlain Mushtaq who was the team's head coach from 2021 to 2023?

Is it Ramiz Raja who as CEO made Babar an all power captain with complete control over squad and team selections from 2021 to 2023?

Or is it Babar Azam who has been Pakistan's captain from 2019 to today?

Everyone was criticizing the likes of England, Australia, India for playing their B, C sides in meaningless bilateral contests. The likes of Rohit, Kohli have literally sat out of so many ODI and T-20 games where India have played so many of their fringe IPL and Domestic Players and the end result is that now India is finally fielding their A side in ODI's given that the WC is here and every member of the squad is ready and every member on the bench looks ready to step in when given the opportunity.

PCB really needs to curb player power and to tell the players who the boss is.

 

[Rana]

It’s the PCB as a whole

They empowered Babar and his clique

The clique never rested, nor were they ever dropped through lean patches

Now, they will face the music

 

[Major]

Mohammad Waseem, Rameez Raja and PCB politics.

1 year ago, Ifti was not in the world cup plans. Saud Shakeel and Salman Agha were the first choice players in odi. The likes of Rameez Raja went gaga on our pace bowling.

I have said this many times on this forum, world cup is in India, India is the land of spin. No matter what happens, Spinners do well in India.

These guys played Zahid mehmood, Usama Mir, Shadab Khan, Nawaz. If nawaz bowled bad, they bought Imad in. Usama Mir was never in the plans and only played cause Shadab got injured in a foreign t20 league. Zahid Mehmood sucked cause he was slow and than Usman Qadir played games on friendship qouta.

Even though Usman Qadir was never gonna get selected, Babar still played him in crucial games due to the dosti.

Alot of people are responsible here, but Rameez Raja was the main guy invovled

 

[Major]

It’s the PCB as a whole

They empowered Babar and his clique

The clique never rested, nor were they ever dropped through lean patches

Now, they will face the music

Babar was emploeyed by Imran Khan. But no one here wants to discuss that

 

[Energy]

The fact that the third seamer only bowled 3 overs and you flew over a couple of guys playing T20 from the UK shows how the administration is making a mockery of their jobs.

Why couldn't we groom one proper front line spinner in the last 2 years? How does Faheem find his place in the squad without doing anything noteworthy?

 

[Savak]

It’s the PCB as a whole

They empowered Babar and his clique

The clique never rested, nor were they ever dropped through lean patches

Now, they will face the music

Najam Sethi tried to curb Babar's powers, he wanted to appoint a new vice captain atleast and also wanted to reduce Rizwan's influence in the squad. The players i.e. Shaheen, Haris Rauf and Babar's other Lackey's rebelled and the PCB under pressure back tracked.

 

[rickroll]

Good thread.

Rizwan played well today but I still feel his performance is not consistent enough. But it also begs the question, whom else does Pakistan have as a good keeper+batsman option if Rizwan is out? Just compare with India, they have KL Rahul, Ishan Kishan, and Pant - any of whom is arguably much better and consistent than Pakistan's only choice that is Rizwan.

 

[Major]

Najam Sethi tried to curb Babar's powers, he wanted to appoint a new vice captain atleast and also wanted to reduce Rizwan's influence in the squad. The players i.e. Shaheen, Haris Rauf and Babar's other Lackey's rebelled and the PCB under pressure back tracked.

lol the fans went crazy, especially pti fans.

now deal with it.

 

[ahmadharis1]

All of team management including Babar Azam. Not one ounce of forward thinking, no backup plans. No other team insists on playing their first XI for every game, save for 3 random T20Is against Afghanistan.

Look at England and Australia, two powerhouse teams. They don't play their best XI that often. Bilaterals are filled with veterans mixed with some new blood and by the time world cup selection comes, they have an entire depth chart to pick from.

 

[Visaal-E-Yaar]

Revamp just two weeks before WC is not possible.

Zaman ( his selection over dhani is not justified at all, dhani is better bowler than him)
Wasim jr. ( might have talent but it's raw)
Faheem
Muhammad haris ( not made for odi, today he looks technically so weak)
Shadab ( he need big break just send him to FC)

Our best hope is rauf and naseem to get fit before WC.

1. Abdullah shafique/imam
2. Fakhar Zaman ( i dont think they will drop him)
3. Babar azam
4. Iftikhar ahmed
5. Rizwan
6. ????? ( unfortunately, we dont have anyone for this spot who can accumulate innings, who can bat with your tail till end, most likely shadab will grab this spot)
7. Muhammad nawaz
8. ????? ( wasim jr., faheem asraf can grab this spot both are good, we need good all rounder on this spot, unfortunately we dont have one, can management take big decision and call abrar ahmed for this spot??)
9. Shaheen shah
10. Naseem shah
11. Rauf/???? ( rumors that he ruled out of WC hope thats just rumors if this is true then we are in a big trouble, dhani, ihsanullah, dhani, arshad, zaman are options most probably, but are they ready for WC? Dhani might be right call.)

 

[hitthestump]

All of team management including Babar Azam. Not one ounce of forward thinking, no backup plans. No other team insists on playing their first XI for every game, save for 3 random T20Is against Afghanistan.

Look at England and Australia, two powerhouse teams. They don't play their best XI that often. Bilaterals are filled with veterans mixed with some new blood and by the time world cup selection comes, they have an entire depth chart to pick from.

I completely agree with this.

 

[Sherazkhalid]

Problem is that we are still stuck in 90s, how many times you can say that with Pakistan batting first, a score of 325 is going to be put on the scoreboard, little bit of movement and we go in shell. WC is going to be a bad experience except some miraculous showing by someone and that shows we rely on someone's outstanding performance rather than consistency.

 

[Runner Up]

Despite Pakistan being the host country, India and Sri Lanka had much more favourable conditions. This dynamic could have potentially influenced the atmosphere on the field. It's worth considering that if Pakistan had chosen to host matches in cities like Lahore, Karachi, Multan, etc., they might have had more control over pitch conditions, potentially providing them with an advantage.

In any sporting event, various factors contribute to the outcome, and it's important to acknowledge the complexities involved. This match serves as a reminder of how location and crowd support can play a significant role in the overall experience for both players and spectators."

 

[hitthestump]

Not enough ODI's
Not enough rotation
Too much dependency on Imam and Babar to score runs
Too much dependency on Shadab

We knew the next WC was in India, the situation called for us to really try out our whole spin arsenal in preparation but the only people who got picked were Shadab and Nawaz most of the time.

Imam and Babar were safe and secure for this WC. They didn't need to play every single game. Saud, Abdullah Shafique and Tayyab Tahir should have been given opportunities.

The one time we actually played our bench against Afghanistan our greedy board turned it into t20's so they could pocket the cash.

Utterly shameless scenes.

 

[Rana]

Najam Sethi tried to curb Babar's powers, he wanted to appoint a new vice captain atleast and also wanted to reduce Rizwan's influence in the squad. The players i.e. Shaheen, Haris Rauf and Babar's other Lackey's rebelled and the PCB under pressure back tracked.

There you go

Can’t deal with Shadab, Rizwan and Shaheen+ loser journalists…but you want to bring BCCI down to their feet

Bunch of clowns the whole lot of them!

 

[Visaal-E-Yaar]

There you go

Can’t deal with Shadab, Rizwan and Shaheen+ loser journalists…but you want to bring BCCI down to their feet

Bunch of clowns the whole lot of them!

Just bashing all around very little number of people here actually came up with solutions.
Go home spend quality time with family and friends for whole week, lock yourself in a conference room for 12 hours, sit with management and work on squad and plans, finalize your plan and stick to it.

 

[IAJ]

Our team’s main priority is to become no.1 team in the World by playing against AFG, BD, Zim and in all those matches you keep playing Babar so he can become no.1 batsman in the World, and all of your best bowlers so you can get the title «World’s beste pace attack».

This poor mentality is hurting the team when they play better teams and are forced to play second string players because of injuries.

You mess it up twice. Firstly when you keep playing your best players in meaningless matches you risk injuries. Secondly when they ate injured you have to throw in players with no experience at the highest level.

Do you think Kohli and Rohit had played in a series against AFG? No disrespect to AFG but you know what I mean.

Today no-one cares about the no.1 title, what matters in the end is the actual trophies you win or big games. Everyone will remember this spirited Sri Lankan team and their win. They even missed many key players themselves but noone mentions that.

Even when Bumrah was injured I didn’t see Indians come up with excuses, but we have two players out and keep mentioning them in every post. This shows how rubbish we actually are.

Keep statpadding against minnows!

Having said that I feel for the team with all this travelling. From SL to Lahore to Multan, to SL, back to Lahore and to SL. I just put up this randomly, but all this travel is not good for the body, even if you travel first class.

 

[Visaal-E-Yaar]

Our team’s main priority is to become no.1 team in the World by playing against AFG, BD, Zim and in all those matches you keep playing Babar so he can become no.1 batsman in the World, and all of your best bowlers so you can get the title «World’s beste pace attack».

This poor mentality is hurting the team when they play better teams and are forced to play second string players because of injuries.

You mess it up twice. Firstly when you keep playing your best players in meaningless matches you risk injuries. Secondly when they ate injured you have to throw in players with no experience at the highest level.

Do you think Kohli and Rohit had played in a series against AFG? No disrespect to AFG but you know what I mean.

Today no-one cares about the no.1 title, what matters in the end is the actual trophies you win or big games. Everyone will remember this spirited Sri Lankan team and their win. They even missed many key players themselves but noone mentions that.

Even when Bumrah was injured I didn’t see Indians come up with excuses, but we have two players out and keep mentioning them in every post. This shows how rubbish we actually are.

Keep statpadding against minnows!

Having said that I feel for the team with all this travelling. From SL to Lahore to Multan, to SL, back to Lahore and to SL. I just put up this randomly, but all this travel is not good for the body, even if you travel first class.

Disagree with sixth paragraph, that's not true media and on some instances rohit also came up with excuses for not having bumrah. India bowling unit gets spark on return of bumrah.

 

[TheSultan]

I blame the spot fixing trio.

They gave Misbah’s dead career CPR. He proceeded to come in and destroy our mentality.

Babar ain’t my favourite but his mentality is a continuation of this defensive and self serving mindset that was instilled since 2010

 

[Nasty Naz]

This is a PCB issue. Pakistan haven't even played that many ODI's since the WC.

Pakistan played its bench when they won series but its hard to simply be mostly playing bench lineups when you hardly play ODI's in the first place.

 

[Farabi]

Our team’s main priority is to become no.1 team in the World by playing against AFG, BD, Zim and in all those matches you keep playing Babar so he can become no.1 batsman in the World, and all of your best bowlers so you can get the title «World’s beste pace attack».

This poor mentality is hurting the team when they play better teams and are forced to play second string players because of injuries.

You mess it up twice. Firstly when you keep playing your best players in meaningless matches you risk injuries. Secondly when they ate injured you have to throw in players with no experience at the highest level.

Do you think Kohli and Rohit had played in a series against AFG? No disrespect to AFG but you know what I mean.

Today no-one cares about the no.1 title, what matters in the end is the actual trophies you win or big games. Everyone will remember this spirited Sri Lankan team and their win. They even missed many key players themselves but noone mentions that.

Even when Bumrah was injured I didn’t see Indians come up with excuses, but we have two players out and keep mentioning them in every post. This shows how rubbish we actually are.

Keep statpadding against minnows!

Having said that I feel for the team with all this travelling. From SL to Lahore to Multan, to SL, back to Lahore and to SL. I just put up this randomly, but all this travel is not good for the body, even if you travel first class.

Who are Missing key players? Pak was missing world class star players not sure it’s comparable. Also sudden injuries day before the game are always difficult to plan for

 

[asfandyar]

Socialism. Stop treating domestic cricket like PIA and Steel Mills.

 

[IAJ]

Who are Missing key players? Pak was missing world class star players not sure it’s comparable. Also sudden injuries day before the game are always difficult to plan for

SL were missing 4 first team players.

And why do you think it’s difficult to plan? Simple answer, you didn’t give the bench players sufficient chances against lesser teams, can’t keep playing your best players even against minnows and then throw in the reserves to the Lions.

 

[Farabi]

SL were missing 4 first team players.

And why do you think it’s difficult to plan? Simple answer, you didn’t give the bench players sufficient chances against lesser teams, can’t keep playing your best players even against minnows and then throw in the reserves to the Lions.

Who are these 4 players? Apart from Hasaranga, do they even matter?

But yeah the lack of planning is totally Pak’s fault

 

[Ahmed216]

It is sense of insecurity that players feel about their place in the side.
It's an age old problem for Pak cricket.
I think Babar tried to rectify that giving every1 a permanent spot and make them play for the team and not themselves.
But he's definitely failed to see the other aspects of such a strategy

 

[VForVendetta]

Babar followed by Saqlain, Ramiz & Mickey would be the main responsible guys for this pathetic condition just before world cup
*Babar for obvious reasons. He is the most powerful & untouchable skipper since Imran Khan.In last 3 years, everything has been done keeping his comfort & choices in mind. PCB has given him unprecedented reign. Whoever he dislikes, doesn't get along, isn't a stooge of him have been kept away from the team.He has created a clique which has grown so powerful that PCB don't dare to question them,because if they do the clique will stage a mutiny. He has been also the only person/institution constant in Pakistan cricket for last 3 years. Multiple governments have toppled, half a dozen chairman,cs & coaches have come & gone.
*Saqlain has proven it again that a great student doesn't necessarily become a great teacher. He was one of the smartest bowlers of his era & yet turned out to be one of the dumbest coaches of all time. He clearly had no vision & input. Was probably too scared of Babar to suggest anything different. It's honestly puzzling he couldn't solve the spinner issue.
*Ramiz of course is the sole individual responsible for creating the "superman" version of Babar. All the pcb chairmen in last 3 years have contributed on this cause but it's him who empowered Babar on such a ridiculous proportion that today he is nearly untouchable. All for some fake battle against BCCI. Ramiz also is the one who ballooned this horrendous idea of Babar being equal /greater than Kohli. Before him, it was just a silly idea surfacing online between Babar's fanboys, nobody really took it seriously. But Ramiz legitimized it, made it part of his marketing & in turn created an army of delusional fans who truly started to believe this hype.
*Mickey isn't new to PCB system. The boys that he had backed in previous term have become men who are running the show now. Either he can't control these guys because they are too big or he simply isn't interested, he is here for an easy paycheck.If he was serious he should have seen how hollow this team is beneath all these fake useless records,milestones & rankings. He should have forced Babar to test their bench strength against minnows in inconsequential matches.
Other individuals like Wasim & Misbah also have fare share of blame but the above four persons should be held mostly for the mess Pak cricket is in at the moment.

 

[Bewal Express]

Bench strength comes from having a pool of talent. Our pool and talent are very shallow. A dreadful domestic system that produces nothing and leaves everything to the national team.

 

[Bewal Express]

Disagree with sixth paragraph, that's not true media and on some instances rohit also came up with excuses for not having bumrah. India bowling unit gets spark on return of bumrah.

We have made one SF in the last 24 years. Problems are deep and structural and nothing to do with Misbah

 

[Saj]

Never mind the bench strength.

They've not even settled on the squad.
They don't even know their best starting XI
They don't even know what position some of the batters should be batting in

Shambles.

 

[Rana]

Babar followed by Saqlain, Ramiz & Mickey would be the main responsible guys for this pathetic condition just before world cup
*Babar for obvious reasons. He is the most powerful & untouchable skipper since Imran Khan.In last 3 years, everything has been done keeping his comfort & choices in mind. PCB has given him unprecedented reign. Whoever he dislikes, doesn't get along, isn't a stooge of him have been kept away from the team.He has created a clique which has grown so powerful that PCB don't dare to question them,because if they do the clique will stage a mutiny. He has been also the only person/institution constant in Pakistan cricket for last 3 years. Multiple governments have toppled, half a dozen chairman,cs & coaches have come & gone.
*Saqlain has proven it again that a great student doesn't necessarily become a great teacher. He was one of the smartest bowlers of his era & yet turned out to be one of the dumbest coaches of all time. He clearly had no vision & input. Was probably too scared of Babar to suggest anything different. It's honestly puzzling he couldn't solve the spinner issue.
*Ramiz of course is the sole individual responsible for creating the "superman" version of Babar. All the pcb chairmen in last 3 years have contributed on this cause but it's him who empowered Babar on such a ridiculous proportion that today he is nearly untouchable. All for some fake battle against BCCI. Ramiz also is the one who ballooned this horrendous idea of Babar being equal /greater than Kohli. Before him, it was just a silly idea surfacing online between Babar's fanboys, nobody really took it seriously. But Ramiz legitimized it, made it part of his marketing & in turn created an army of delusional fans who truly started to believe this hype.
*Mickey isn't new to PCB system. The boys that he had backed in previous term have become men who are running the show now. Either he can't control these guys because they are too big or he simply isn't interested, he is here for an easy paycheck.If he was serious he should have seen how hollow this team is beneath all these fake useless records,milestones & rankings. He should have forced Babar to test their bench strength against minnows in inconsequential matches.
Other individuals like Wasim & Misbah also have fare share of blame but the above four persons should be held mostly for the mess Pak cricket is in at the moment.

Please add deluded commentators Urooj Mumtaz, Bazid Khan and Sana Mir to this list. They have played their role in creating the false perception

 

[VForVendetta]

Please add deluded commentators Urooj Mumtaz, Bazid Khan and Sana Mir to this list. They have played their role in creating the false perception

They are insignificant figures in Pak cricket, which is why I don't feel it necessary to add them. Now someone like Aamir Sohel, yes you can add him.

 

[Rana]

They are insignificant figures in Pak cricket, which is why I don't feel it necessary to add them. Now someone like Aamir Sohel, yes you can add him.

They may be insignificant but they do beat the drum with the false perception propaganda which is overall normalised on social media and discussion circles.

 

[VForVendetta]

Bench strength comes from having a pool of talent. Our pool and talent are very shallow. A dreadful domestic system that produces nothing and leaves everything to the national team.

Your talent pool is not worse than BD,Sri or SA(of last 5 years at least). It's the lack of vision, intent & guts to look forward that's hurting more. What stopped them in last 1 year on trying Haris, Ayub, Abdullah, Usama, Wasim, Ihsanullah etc against Nep,Ned,Afg to settle them & have ample match practice under their belt?

 

[ayemgilani86]

Babar was emploeyed by Imran Khan. But no one here wants to discuss that

not allowed to use his name in media

 

[ayemgilani86]

lol the fans went crazy, especially pti fans.

now deal with it.

we had same issues before when Sarfaraz was captain, unfortunately no matter what government comes one thing is guaranteed PCB and everyone involved around it sucks
When Imad Wasim used to play ODIs he was always justifiably criticized and never sat out easy games, including Hasan Ali and Sarfaraz himself would always bat at no 8
its the culture set since Misbahs days
the captaincy style of Inzi, SHoaib Malik, Misbah, Sarfaraz, Babar is exactly similar
and the coaches we have had have never addressed the defensive captaincy Dav WHatmore, Mickey Arthur, Misbah all have been exactly the same

 

[ayemgilani86]

Babar was emploeyed by Imran Khan. But no one here wants to discuss that

you got your wish buddy, hes in prison. be happy now

 

[msb314]

Some might disagree but getting rid of Mickey Arthur immediately after the 2019 WC was a huge mistake..

Yes we lost quite a few games but we needs to have perspective that England, India etc. are all very strong opponents. We did OK in the WC and Mickey had a vision for our style of play..

Sadly it quickly went to shambles after that..

 

[ahmadharis1]

Also some blame on Pakistan's management and their lack of patience.

In their eyes if they don't see a drastic change in a year or two, there's a sudden captaincy change, a domestic restructuring, head coach is fired and replaced

 

[saqib.rai]

We played very very less ODI Cricket after 2019 World Cup. Simple

 

[Bewal Express]

One of the major reasons for the failure to develop young players is the panicky fans and media who treat every match like a WC final. This leads to the selection being safety first and win at all cost. This means young, left field selections aren't made and we don't get unknown talent. For example Mohammed Asghar had talent but little control, but no one would have the courage to select him and take the risk. So we are left with non spinning spinners

 

[Ahmed216]

It is sense of insecurity that players feel about their place in the side.
It's an age old problem for Pak cricket.
I think Babar tried to rectify that giving every1 a permanent spot and make them play for the team and not themselves.
But he's definitely failed to see the other aspects of such a strategy

Exactly what mushtaq and afridi said on TV yesterday. Players play with niggles because they fear if their replacements perform well they'll be forgotten

 

[Bhaijaan]

Blokes in the bench need to stand up