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"Why are you smiling at me? Do you like boys" - What do you make of ICC's decision to ban S Gabriel?

Thoughts on four-match ban?

  • Harsh, shouldn't have been banned

    Votes: 46 70.8%

  • Should have been banned for fewer games

    Votes: 9 13.8%

  • Just right

    Votes: 10 15.4%

  • The ban should have been longer

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    65
rhony said:
Exactly!!! There was nothing derogatory in asking, Why are u smiling at me? Do you like me, a boy?
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As I've stated before, if you're asking the question (are you gay) with the intent of ridiculing someone then it clearly is homophobic.
 
HitWicket said:
As I've stated before, if you're asking the question (are you gay) with the intent of ridiculing someone then it clearly is homophobic.
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What if he asked "are you mad?" with the intention of ridiculing him? Should he be banned because he insulted people with mental health issues?
 
HitWicket said:
He wasn't banned for making the comment. He got demerit points which added to previous offences resulted in a ban.

He made a comment that was intended to insult by implying that someone was gay. He can claim he's not a homophobe in general but he still made a homophobic comment. Criticising Root for calling out that comment is ridiculous.
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This shouldn't even be worth demerit points. As harmless as it gets. What's next, can't even say stupid because it's offensive to less intelligent people? Or is it the fact that this particular group of people likes to take offense to everything?
 
What the heck? I was on board with Gabriel getting punished for using homosexulity term but if this is what he said ... not even a sledge/dig at this point. This is pointless. What the heck ICC?

"Do you like boys" and "stop looking at me" ... really?
 
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light said:
What the heck? I was on board with Gabriel getting punished for using homosexulity term but if this is what he said ... not even a sledge/dig at this point. This is pointless. What the heck ICC?

"Do you like boys" and "stop looking at me" ... really?
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ICC pushing their LGBT agenda on people who don't agree with that lifestyle.
 
Well there has been an overreaction from Root and ICC on this. I don't think Gabriel should received a ban. Really poor this. This could have been handled better.
 
Root's reaction was very odd, you have to wonder if he was projecting his own prejudices on Gabriel?
 
 
 
I am glad that Gabriel has made the effort to understand his error and has apologised. Takes a big man to do that.
 
As expected, people overlooking the fact that this incident on its own wouldn't have led to Gabriel's ban, he ALREADY HAD 5 DEMERIT POINTS, so this offence has resulted in a further 4 Demerit points and he has to serve a 4 match ban which is fair.

Did Gabriel's comments warrant a points infraction? I don think so but if it contravenes any ICC guidelines or regulations then by all means he should have been infracted but 4 points seems a bit excessive based o what he said.
 
[MENTION=134473]Haroon786[/MENTION] gives me hope for PP. Measured, considering, possessed of an understanding and appreciation of history, and a refreshing lack of arrogance.
 
On the surface, it seems soft...but I'm quite confident that the general consensus would be different on this forum if it was racial or religious abuse to the same degree.

Abuse regarding sexuality is equally offensive as racial and religious prejudice, is it not?
 
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Joseph Gomes said:
ICC pushing their LGBT agenda on people who don't agree with that lifestyle.
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Nobody is pushing a LBGT agenda on you. Do you feel pressured to perform homosexual acts as a result of their decision?

Like it or not, homosexuals have the same rights as heterosexuals in most developed nations. Welcome to 2019.
 
giri26 said:
Well there has been an overreaction from Root and ICC on this. I don't think Gabriel should received a ban. Really poor this. This could have been handled better.
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In what way do you think Root overreacted?

From my perspective, he gave a measured response.
 
He might not be a homophobe but his comment can still be seen as homophobic. It's like when some people say stuff like "I hate Maths Class, it's so gay" but that doesn't necessarily make a person a homophobic, but like I said above, it is a homophobic comment no doubt. Don't understand why people are criticisng Joe Root, he just stuck up for gay people which is something that should be applauded and that doesn't mean that Root is gay himself. I am not black and am not related to black people in anyway for example but if someone made a racist comment about black people I would still stick up for them, remember Root himself acknowledged it wasn't anything that serious as he said he wasn't going to bother reporting it but I respect him a lot for sticking up. Overall, the ban is fair.
 
Wow, this is pretty dumb. This is why you should always know both sides of the story. This is not homophobic abuse, this is not even abuse.

Root's ever-present grin would get on my nerves too if I was bowling to him.
 
My issue with this, and even the Sarfraz issue, is that if these are the types of bans/fines that will be handed out for such comments then it has to be across the board. There can not be differences between a ban for someone from WI or Pak and someone from Australia. I always bring up Clarke threatening Jimmy iwth a broken arm, what punishment did he receive for it?

Or Aussie bowlers continuously using the f word, the c word and so on. All of that should be ban or fine worthy.
 
Haroon786 said:
As expected, people overlooking the fact that this incident on its own wouldn't have led to Gabriel's ban, he ALREADY HAD 5 DEMERIT POINTS, so this offence has resulted in a further 4 Demerit points and he has to serve a 4 match ban which is fair.

Did Gabriel's comments warrant a points infraction? I don think so but if it contravenes any ICC guidelines or regulations then by all means he should have been infracted but 4 points seems a bit excessive based o what he said.
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This deserves no attention from the ICC. It is not abuse, it is simply a guy demanding another guy to quit grinning at him.
 
Bilal7 said:
This deserves no attention from the ICC. It is not abuse, it is simply a guy demanding another guy to quit grinning at him.
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...after insinuating he was gay.

I've found the response on this forum disappointing, and I'm a heterosexual married man.

If it was the same level of "not abuse" denigrating his skin colour or religion, would you have a different opinion?

We have a long way to go in this world as far as equality is concerned.
 
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In what way do you think Root overreacted?

He took a brave stand on his values, and I assume he isn't even gay.

If he took a similarly strong stance over religious or racial vilification against Moeen Ali, would you think he was over-reacting?
 
Root did not overeact. This incident may be good for cricket in the long run. Players are risking fines and bans if they make ill advised statements. There is no place for talk like that. If Gabriel had said that in the workplace believe me he'd be hanging onto his job. Players are role models and it's important especially with youngster watching to set a good example.
 
barah_admi said:
My issue with this, and even the Sarfraz issue, is that if these are the types of bans/fines that will be handed out for such comments then it has to be across the board. There can not be differences between a ban for someone from WI or Pak and someone from Australia. I always bring up Clarke threatening Jimmy iwth a broken arm, what punishment did he receive for it?

Or Aussie bowlers continuously using the f word, the c word and so on. All of that should be ban or fine worthy.
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I believe Clarke was sanctioned under the exact same regulation as Gabriel has been. The demerit points system wasn't in place at the time of that incident.
 
Bilal7 said:
This deserves no attention from the ICC. It is not abuse, it is simply a guy demanding another guy to quit grinning at him.
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Yes but the ICC isn't a Muslim organisation, it has to cater for all its playing members and countries, have to remember that.
 
Torborg said:
Nobody is pushing a LBGT agenda on you. Do you feel pressured to perform homosexual acts as a result of their decision?

Like it or not, homosexuals have the same rights as heterosexuals in most developed nations. Welcome to 2019.
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I was speaking about undeveloped nations. They don't have nor need western morals. We shouldn't force it on them, seems like we're repeating the mistakes of colonial past.
 
Joseph Gomes said:
I was speaking about undeveloped nations. They don't have nor need western morals. We shouldn't force it on them, seems like we're repeating the mistakes of colonial past.
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Players have to abide by the ICC Code of Conduct.
 
HitWicket said:
I believe Clarke was sanctioned under the exact same regulation as Gabriel has been. The demerit points system wasn't in place at the time of that incident.
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Was there a ban? I certainly do not remember it.
 
Remember when McGrath sledged Sarwan in a supposed homophobic manner. Sarwan replied with a personal attack to McGrath.

Sarwan got the reprimand from the ICC.

The disciplinary rules are often one sided and silly.
 
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HitWicket said:
Like I said, the demerit points system wasn't in place so no, there was no ban.
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Yes I know but my point stands, he should have been. PLayers did get banned or fined or both even before the accumulation of the demerits points became a policy. The ICC must have the same code and rules for everyone.
 
barah_admi said:
Yes I know but my point stands, he should have been. PLayers did get banned or fined or both even before the accumulation of the demerits points became a policy. The ICC must have the same code and rules for everyone.
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Players didn't get banned for the level of offence Clarke and Gabriel committed.
 
Robert said:
Players have to abide by the ICC Code of Conduct.
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I am not saying it's illegal, but unjustified. They made a huge issue out of it. Gabriel didn't abuse the gay community. Root is not a homosexual himself, Gabriel didn't deserve to be banned more than one match.
 
Joseph Gomes said:
I was speaking about undeveloped nations. They don't have nor need western morals. We shouldn't force it on them, seems like we're repeating the mistakes of colonial past.
Click to expand...
International cricketers should be understanding of cultural differences as part of their employment.

I'm a caucasian atheist, and I expect Australian cricketers to show cultural sensitivity when playing against opponents who may hold different values regardless of what they are.

As an international cricketer of any nationality and/or faith, you don't have to approve of homosexuality, but you are expected to be sensitive towards the differing attitudes around the world.

If you disapprove, so be it. Just stay quiet on the subject. Nobody is forcing you to change your values.
 
Joseph Gomes said:
I am not saying it's illegal, but unjustified. They made a huge issue out of it. Gabriel didn't abuse the gay community. Root is not a homosexual himself, Gabriel didn't deserve to be banned more than one match.
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Gabriel definitely did denigrate the gay community.

If you insult someone by insinuating that they're gay (on international tv) you're abusing the homosexual community as a whole who already have to deal with much prejudice.
 
Joseph Gomes said:
I am not saying it's illegal, but unjustified. They made a huge issue out of it. Gabriel didn't abuse the gay community. Root is not a homosexual himself, Gabriel didn't deserve to be banned more than one match.
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Yeah, he did in the same way that making a racist comment abuses communities of other races. That Root is presumably not gay us neither here nor there.
 
Robert said:
Yeah, he did in the same way that making a racist comment abuses communities of other races. That Root is presumably not gay us neither here nor there.
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The consensus attitude here is extremely disappointing. I'm by no means a big contributor to this forum, so my opinion doesn't matter much...but I'm considering leaving for good over the response to this saga.

I thought Muslims and mostly coloured people would be more understanding towards prejudice in general.

Fwiw..I'll find it difficult to hate Root in the next Ashes series. :)
 
Torborg said:
The consensus attitude here is extremely disappointing. I'm by no means a big contributor to this forum, so my opinion doesn't matter much...but I'm considering leaving for good over the response to this saga.

I thought Muslims and mostly coloured people would be more understanding towards prejudice in general.

Fwiw..I'll find it difficult to hate Root in the next Ashes series. :)
Click to expand...

I know what you mean. Some will scream blue murder at racism and Islamophobia and rightly so, yet give tacit approval to homophobia. But I would urge you to stay as you are a liberal pluralist voice and there are a few others here.
 
Ex-Windies star Bishop defends suspended Gabriel, says education a better option

(Reuters) - The punishment handed Shannon Gabriel for a gay slur directed at Joe Root was a little harsh, says former West Indies cricketer Ian Bishop, who at the same time acknowledged the fast bowler erred in his choice of words directed at the England captain.

Gabriel was suspended for the West Indies’ four upcoming one day internationals by the International Cricket Council (ICC) after his verbal altercation with Root during the third test in St. Lucia on Monday.

The bowler said to Root: “Why are you smiling at me? Do you like boys?”

To which Root replied: “Don’t use that as an insult, there is nothing wrong with being gay.”

Root’s reply has been widely praised, and Gabriel has since apologised. Bishop has no doubt it was a sincere apology.

“I find the punishment a little on the harsh side,” Bishop said in a telephone interview with Reuters.

“I know Shannon. He is a good, good guy.

“The question he posed, in the current cultural climate, he should not have said it, and down the road he will realise you can’t say something like that because it could be perceived as a bias against a certain group.”

As a player, Bishop took 161 wickets in 43 tests at an average of 24.27 between 1989-98.

Now a widely respected television commentator in the Caribbean, the Trinidadian acknowledged that players had to be mindful that what not so long ago might have been passed off as a typical piece of on-field sledging was no longer fair game.

Bishop says that instead of suspending Gabriel, greater benefit would have been achieved had officials had a quiet talk to educate and sensitive the player, along the lines of:

“Look, we see you may not have meant great harm, but many of our players and stakeholders and people make their life choices to live by their own philosophy and that’s their right.

“We feel it’s not what we want to be seen or heard and prefer more sensitivity towards others.”

Bishop hopes the poorly-chosen remark does not blight Gabriel’s reputation.

“I will stand by his side and say he is not the demon person some have made him to be,” he said of Gabriel.

“One scenario should not define who he is growing into as a person.”

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-c...-says-education-a-better-option-idUKKCN1Q425R
 
I think it's 'just right'. It was an obviously homophobic remark; it wasn't the most sinister but homophobia - like racism - has no place in a civilised world. Perhaps his best defence is that the West Indies are inherently homophobic, and therefore his remark was nothing more than an expression of his national culture given that gay sex was illegal in Trinidad until very recently. But I don't think that will do Trinidad any PR favors.

I understand the 'it was just banter' point. But how far do we take this? And on that note, I must ask, to the people here who seem completely bemused by the ban: is your reaction largely the same on racial abuse? If it is then, fine, you're at least consistent. What if Root had said to Misbah: next time use mouth wash, you curry muncher? I mean, it's probably true, and it's seemingly harmless. But how far do we go? What if Root had replied that Gabriel should stop jumping up and down like a monkey? Or that Gabriel should go back to Africa on the slave ship that bought his n*gger parents to this squalid little island? What if Root had asked him what he was going playing cricket when the cotton still needed picking? You see, words can be hurtful. A Pakistan being subjected to jokes about terrorism would surely know this.

Personally, I draw the line at abuse that's centred around group prejudice (i.e. on race, sexuality, gender), and I've a less stern outlook on abuse centered solely on the individual (i.e. overweight, ginger, crooked teeth).
 
West Indies bowler Shannon Gabriel is hopeful of returning from injury in time to be selected for a planned Test tour of England.

The Windies and England are attempting to organise a three-match series - to be held behind closed doors - for July, with games pencilled in for July 8, July 16 and July 24, according to Johnny Grave, the Cricket West Indies (CWI) chief executive.

Grave also confirmed a 25-man squad, including 10 reserves, will travel to the United Kingdom in the week commencing June 8.

Gabriel has not featured in the longest format since September 2019, having struggled with an ankle injury which subsequently required surgery in November last year.

Now, the paceman is focusing on stepping up his rehabilitation with the aim of returning to the fold for the series.

"It's a good feeling always to represent West Indies. It's good to be back out on the park," he told i955FM. "The plan is right now to try to make it to the tour to England - hopefully that comes off. I'm just trying my best to stay positive and I hope everything goes well.

"It has been a long journey since November when I did the surgery on my ankle. Everything is going well, it has been a long process in terms of getting back to running and bowling and stuff like that.

"I am trying my best to be as fit as possible so I'm really working hard in terms of my fitness and managing my weight, trying not to get too heavy to put too much strain on my ankle. So I know once I put in the hard work everything will be okay in the end. I just want to stay positive.

"There has been no high-intensity work, I'm just taking my body back into it easy, taking it one day at a time and not trying to push too hard but it's still long while before the first Test in England and by that time I'm sure I'll be fit and ready."

With cricket having been suspended since March due to the coronavirus pandemic, Gabriel does not expect it to be an easy transition for many players to return, especially with physical-distancing measures introduced by the ICC.

"It's going to take a lot. It's going to be mentally taxing on the brain but you have to stay positive. Keep your mind fresh," Gabriel said. "I know they [England] are going to be coming at us all guns [blazing] at us, but I know the guys

"Plus plenty of the guys haven't been playing any cricket, so it is going to take us a while to get back there. On the positive side, you're still getting the opportunity to play cricket and represent your country so that in itself should be enough motivation."


https://sportstar.thehindu.com/cric...and-test-tour-coronavirus/article31673837.ece
 
Robert said:
I know what you mean. Some will scream blue murder at racism and Islamophobia and rightly so, yet give tacit approval to homophobia. But I would urge you to stay as you are a liberal pluralist voice and there are a few others here.
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A few others?

They’ve taken over!

Won’t let anybody speak of anything anymore.
 
Stuff like this drives fans away. I mean seriously, how do you even sledge in modern day cricket?

Sport needs to be intense and competitive. This ain't Peppa Pig with sunshine and flowers.

ICC needs to concentrate on getting their act together rather than playing moral police.
 
Hadi Rizvi said:
Stuff like this drives fans away. I mean seriously, how do you even sledge in modern day cricket?

Sport needs to be intense and competitive. This ain't Peppa Pig with sunshine and flowers.

ICC needs to concentrate on getting their act together rather than playing moral police.
Click to expand...

If tackling homophobia drives fans away then good riddance to them.
 
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