Will anyone ever replace Kapil Dev as greatest Asian bowler in Australia?

[aboveandbeyond]

Bumrah is in different class than Dev.

Only 2 Asian pacers have 50 plus wickets under 25 average outside Asia.

Bumrah - Avg 21.2 SR 47 9 5-fers

Wasim - Avg 24.8 SR 57 14 5-fers

Wasim played in a much tougher era of Test cricket. When test cricket was appreciated. Teams were well prepared for test matches with warm up 3 day games as well as getting match practice in first class 4 day cricket.

Now, players come straight from t20 franchises to jump in to test cricket. Hence, shocking batsmanship through out the world

 

[Buffet]

Wasim played in a much tougher era of Test cricket. When test cricket was appreciated. Teams were well prepared for test matches with warm up 3 day games as well as getting match practice in first class 4 day cricket.

Now, players come straight from t20 franchises to jump in to test cricket. Hence, shocking batsmanship through out the world

I agree with players jumping into test from T20 league. Having said that I am not sure it had made much difference in the test format when it comes to bowlers doing well when playing away. It may have made difference for visiting batsmen because adjustment is huge, but not much of an adjustment for home team batsmen. I also don't think Wasim played in era which was much tougher or easier. We just had 3-4 good test teams in any era.

In the last 55 years, we have only 15-16 pacers with below 25 average with 50 plus wickets. I wouldn't necessarily take the list in any order and start ranking bowlers. This list is also not eveyrthing. But just a quick look at this list shows that we don't see many bowlers coming in this list due to batsmen jumping from T20 to Test. If it was really making difference we should have seen lots bowlers in current era showing up here. Reason is simple, batsmen are playing in their familiar conditions.

Despite our impressions, test cricket has changed but not by much. Shocking batsmanship is surely visible time to time, but T20 influce also means that batsmen can dominate in big way as well. Early era had tail as walking wickets but now tails can score runs as well. So lots of things evens out in test format and as result we don't see lots of pacers appearing in this list after T20 started.

 

[gani999]

I agree with players jumping into test from T20 league. Having said that I am not sure it had made much difference in the test format when it comes to bowlers doing well when playing away. It may have made difference for visiting batsmen because adjustment is huge, but not much of an adjustment for home team batsmen. I also don't think Wasim played in era which was much tougher or easier. We just had 3-4 good test teams in any era.

In the last 55 years, we have only 15-16 pacers with below 25 average with 50 plus wickets. I wouldn't necessarily take the list in any order and start ranking bowlers. This list is also not eveyrthing. But just a quick look at this list shows that we don't see many bowlers coming in this list due to batsmen jumping from T20 to Test. If it was really making difference we should have seen lots bowlers in current era showing up here. Reason is simple, batsmen are playing in their familiar conditions.

Despite our impressions, test cricket has changed but not by much. Shocking batsmanship is surely visible time to time, but T20 influce also means that batsmen can dominate in big way as well. Early era had tail as walking wickets but now tails can score runs as well. So lots of things evens out in test format and as result we don't see lots of pacers appearing in this list after T20 started.

View attachment 147983

Stats like these rub in rather painfully how much of a loss to the cricketing world Mohd. Asif was.
He would have left the 2 Ws and most other bowlers in the shade if he had not scr**ed up the way he did.

 

[captain.hansolo]

Wasim played in a much tougher era of Test cricket. When test cricket was appreciated. Teams were well prepared for test matches with warm up 3 day games as well as getting match practice in first class 4 day cricket.

Now, players come straight from t20 franchises to jump in to test cricket. Hence, shocking batsmanship through out the world

Malarkey. By ever metric from total scores, batsmen averages, individual scores, and higher levels of athleticism measured by number of continuous games played without injury related absence, the intensity of cricket is higher now.

Just because players are paid more for playing a format that is entertaining, does not suggest that cricket has declined. There are still only 8 major cricket playing nations and teams are still 11 players only.

 

[Buffet]

We can actually see the direct result after 2007 when T20 came in. It's been 18 years and counting and yet we have just one pacer averaging below 25 in this list. Let's see if it changes in future but unless it changes, we have no evidence to say that visiting pacers are able to pick up cheap wickets due to T20 influence.

Again, this is not some ranking or anything like that provide a quick snapshot of how hard or how easy it has been for visting pacers collectively.


All visting pacers having 100 plus away wickets after 2007.

 

[Buffet]

Stats like these rub in rather painfully how much of a loss to the cricketing world Mohd. Asif was.
He would have left the 2 Ws and most other bowlers in the shade if he had not scr**ed up the way he did.

Yes, he was a huge loss for cricket. He had his limitations but he was also very very good in setting up batsmen. I would have loved to see him play longer.

 

[hassan918]

Stats like these rub in rather painfully how much of a loss to the cricketing world Mohd. Asif was.
He would have left the 2 Ws and most other bowlers in the shade if he had not scr**ed up the way he did.

He was surely more than good enough to break plenty of records, especially in test cricket.

 

[Hawkeye]

lol Kapil Dev.

He’s a tier 2 bowler at best. Wasim, Bumrah, Imran Khan are far far ahead.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Jasprit Bumrah in Tests in Australia
Matches: 8
Wickets: 40
Avg: 18.80
SR: 45.7
5W: 2

 

[Bhaijaan]

lol Kapil Dev.

He’s a tier 2 bowler at best. Wasim, Bumrah, Imran Khan are far far ahead.

So why was Imran not as good as Kapil against West Indies

 

[Hitman]

Jasprit Bumrah in Tests in Australia
Matches: 8
Wickets: 40
Avg: 18.80
SR: 45.7
5W: 2

The Aussie have been historically the best at showing opposition players and teams their true aukaat. Remember a certain choker who was shown his aukaat in the 96' WC match against India by Ajay Jadeja? Some of his blind fans laugh off that match as a pyjama match. Well, look at his career Test record against the Aussies and you'll end up ROLF. That ROFL will multiply 100x if you look at his performance in Australia in Tests.​

 

[uppercut]

So why was Imran not as good as Kapil against West Indies

And to be clear you are only talking about bowling. Because Kapil is one of the ONLY few batsmen to score a run a ball hundred back in the 80s against the WI ( in WI !!!) and nearly repeated it in the next test.. An absolute legend like no other

 

[Bhaijaan]

And to be clear you are only talking about bowling. Because Kapil is one of the ONLY few batsmen to score a run a ball hundred back in the 80s against the WI ( in WI !!!) and nearly repeated it in the next test.. An absolute legend like no other

Kapil Dev is one of the greatest ever and when it came to playing the greatest team of his era, he was way ahead of Immy the Wife Maker and Ian Botham.

 

[shaz619]

Kapish Uncle was the Ryan Ten Doeschate of his time, and there was nil flex in his bowling arm to, it’s a no brainer among the Indian phast quicks!

​

 

[Romali_rotti]

Kapil Dev is one of the greatest ever and when it came to playing the greatest team of his era, he was way ahead of Immy the Wife Maker and Ian Botham.

I could never understand how Dev could out bat, out bowl and be the better player in comparison to Imran in the WI but looked like Mohammad Sami when playing in NZ...

Some things are just not supposed to make sense I guess.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Kapil Dev is one of the greatest ever and when it came to playing the greatest team of his era, he was way ahead of Immy the Wife Maker and Ian Botham.

Oh don't insult Dev by mentioning Botham. Botham couldn't put bat on ball vs the WI and his bowling figures are even more horrible against WI....

To make matters worst Dev has outbowled Botham in Aus also vs Bothams greatest rival....

Botham didn't have the talent or skill to show up vs the best of his Era.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Bumrah

Most wickets by visiting bowlers in Australia. Bumrah, Hadlee, Ambrose have been at a different level.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Best visiting bowlers in Australia from #AsianBloc

 

[Bhaijaan]

Best fast bowlers from #AsianBloc in Australia

 

[Bhaijaan]

An ewww record for Srinath, Ishant, Akhtar, Waqar in Australia really. They got destroyed by the Aussies.

Srinath with an average of 50 is just awful. I have respect for him and he was great for us mostly but what the hell, averaging 50 in Australia? Graveyard for #AsianBloc bowlers

 

[DeadlyVenom]

That's a sensational record for Bumrah. Aussies are bamboozled by him.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Bumrah has completed 50 test wickets on the Australian soil today. His bowling average there is 17.83 now.

 

[Buffet]

Some posters have totally lost perspective by downplaying how brilliant Bumrah has been in Aus. Some posters cite Aus weak batting or not being good at home anymore or Aus pitches being too bowler's friendly.

Aus has been extremely strong and has fantastic batting for home conditions in the last 7-8 years.

Since Bumrah Debute, Aus in Aus against all teams (except Ind),

• Batting Avg : 45 runs per wicket.
• W/L - 20

See below, Clearly the one of the most dominating record you can see for a team and for a batting unit.




In exact same period, Bumrah helped his team to win so many tests and series in Aus with following numbers,

Bumrah in Aus - 50 wickets : Avg of 17 : SR 42

We are watching a absolute top class genius. Take the toughest opposition in their den and stand out, that's what top tier players do. How many players you recall in history with record like this against such a strong/domianting home team?

And yet, we may have many posters talkign non-sense like,

• Aus batting is weak in Aus - despite avg of 45 runs per wicket
• Not a great test team, who cares ATG or not, W/L of 20 at home is simply out of the world. It's a great home record for any era.
• Pitches has become too bowler friendly - Touring sides except India has averaged 45 runs per wicket.

I am not sure if they are watching the same cricket when some posters pointing out weak Aus team in Aus, weak Aus batting in Aus or very bowler's friendly pitches in Aus.

 

[Bhaijaan]

News flash

Jasprit Bumrah becomes the greatest ever Asian bowler to tour Australia as he overtakes the legendary Kapil Dev’s tally of 51 test wickets on the Australian soil

 

[Bhaijaan]

Hopefully Bumrah can take his tally to 60 wickets by the end of the tour.

 

[Bhaijaan]

This is now already one of the greatest ever performances in a test series in Australia by a fast bowler in the 21st century :-

1. M. Johnson : 37 wickets at 13.97
2. J. Bumrah : 29* wickets at 12.41
3. B. Hilfenhaus : 27 wickets at 17.22
4. S. Clarke : 26 wickets at 17.03
5. B. Lee : 24 wickets at 22.58
6. J. Anderson: 24 wickets at 26.04

 

[Romali_rotti]

This is now already one of the greatest ever performances in a test series in Australia by a fast bowler in the 21st century :-

1. M. Johnson : 37 wickets at 13.97
2. J. Bumrah : 29* wickets at 12.41
3. B. Hilfenhaus : 27 wickets at 17.22
4. S. Clarke : 26 wickets at 17.03
5. B. Lee : 24 wickets at 22.58
6. J. Anderson: 24 wickets at 26.04

Yeah but Waqar is the best though

 

[Hitman]

Yeah but Waqar is the best though

You have no idea how 'magnificious' Waqar was both against Australia and in particular in Australia. Stuff of legends.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Greatest performances by a pace bowler in Australia since 1970s

1. B. Hogg: 41 wickets at 12.85
2. M. Johnson : 37 wickets at 13.97
3. G.Lawson: 34 wickets at 20.20
4. J.Thompson: 33 wickets at 17.93
5. S.R. Hadlee: 33 wickets at 12.15
6. C. Ambrose: 33 wickets at 16.42
7. C.McDermott: 32 wickets 21.09
8. J.Snow: 31 wickets at 22.83
9. C.McDermott: 31 wickets at 21.61
10. J.Thompson: 29 wickets at 28.55
11. J. Bumrah : 29* wickets at 12.41

 

[pillionrider]

11 matches, 51 wickets @24.58, 5 fifers, one 8 wicket haul


Wasim Akram came very close with 36 wickets.


Someone like young Jasprit Bumrah could replace Kapil in future. He has pace, can bowl a good line length and has lots of cricket left in him.

Having said that 50+ test wickets in Australia is a HUGE deal for an Asian bowler. Historically Australia has been a graveyard for Asian bowlers.

Even the great Imran Khan was ineffective in Australia.

Wasim was closest and still so far behind

The great Immy wouldn't have liked this fact about the gangly, weird-mustached non-English speaking Kapil outdoing him. Won a WC before him and then stats like this

 

[Bhaijaan]

Greatest performances by a pace bowler in Australia since 1970s

1. B. Hogg: 41 wickets at 12.85
2. M. Johnson : 37 wickets at 13.97
3. G.Lawson: 34 wickets at 20.20
4. J.Thompson: 33 wickets at 17.93
5. S.R. Hadlee: 33 wickets at 12.15
6. C. Ambrose: 33 wickets at 16.42
7. C.McDermott: 32 wickets 21.09
8. J.Snow: 31 wickets at 22.83
9. C.McDermott: 31 wickets at 21.61
10. J.Thompson: 29 wickets at 28.55
11. J. Bumrah : 29* wickets at 12.41

By the end of the series i hope he breaks into top 5

 

[Bhaijaan]

Updated greatest performances by a pace bowler in Australia since 1970s

1. B. Hogg: 41 wickets at 12.85
2. M. Johnson : 37 wickets at 13.97
3. G.Lawson: 34 wickets at 20.20
4. J.Thompson: 33 wickets at 17.93
5. S.R. Hadlee: 33 wickets at 12.15
6. C. Ambrose: 33 wickets at 16.42
7. C.McDermott: 32 wickets 21.09
8. J.Snow: 31 wickets at 22.83
9. C.McDermott: 31 wickets at 21.61
10. J. Bumrah : 30* wickets at 12.83

 

[Bhaijaan]

Updated greatest performances by a pace bowler in Australia since 1970s

1. B. Hogg: 41 wickets at 12.85
2. M. Johnson : 37 wickets at 13.97
3. G.Lawson: 34 wickets at 20.20
4. J.Thompson: 33 wickets at 17.93
5. S.R. Hadlee: 33 wickets at 12.15
6. C. Ambrose: 33 wickets at 16.42
7. C.McDermott: 32 wickets 21.09
8. J.Snow: 31 wickets at 22.83
9. C.McDermott: 31 wickets at 21.61
10. J. Bumrah : 30* wickets at 12.83

1 test match still to go.

4 more wickets and Bumrah gets among Top 3 greatest performances in a test series in Australia since 1970s.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Damien Fleming just named his Top 5 visiting fast bowlers ever in Australia since he started watching cricket in 1970s

1. Bumrah
2. Hadlee
3. Ambrose
4. Holding
4. Marshal

 

[jnaveen1980]

Damien Fleming just named his Top 5 visiting fast bowlers ever in Australia since he started watching cricket in 1970s

1. Bumrah
2. Hadlee
3. Ambrose
4. Holding
4. Marshal

Bumrah didn't complete his 2nd series. Missed 2 tests. Definitely would have boosted his reputation further.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Updated greatest performances by a pace bowler in Australia since 1970s

1. B. Hogg: 41 wickets at 12.85
2. M. Johnson : 37 wickets at 13.97
3. G.Lawson: 34 wickets at 20.20
4. J.Thompson: 33 wickets at 17.93
5. S.R. Hadlee: 33 wickets at 12.15
6. C. Ambrose: 33 wickets at 16.42
7. C.McDermott: 32 wickets 21.09
8. J. Bumrah : 31* wickets at 12.64
9. J.Snow: 31 wickets at 22.83
10. C.McDermott: 31 wickets at 21.61

 

[Bhaijaan]

Updated most test wickets in Australia by a visiting fast bowler :-

1. C. Ambrose : 78 wickets @19.79
2. S. Barnes : 77 wickets @22.42
3. R. Hadlee : 77 wickets @17.83
4. C. Walsh : 72 wickets @34.33
5. B. Willis : 72 wickets @28.80
6. I. Botham : 69 wickets @28.24
7. J. Anderson : 68 wickets @34.01
8. J. Bumrah : 63 wickets @17.01
9. M. Holding : 63 wickets @24.22
10. T. Richardson : 54 wickets @30.09