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Will MS Dhoni and Kedar Jadhav cost India dearly at the 2019 World Cup?

jagatk said:
Have to disagree, in most sports players try and cling on even if they can't hack it anymore people like Abd are fewer incomparison to a sachin or a dhoni, even ponting and cook were basically told to retire they did not go on a high, South Americans treat footballers the same way we treat cricketers, this is a selfish man being selfish, nothing really india or cricket specific for me, he pulled strings to make sure he did not get sacked as a captain after humiliation the team suffered on away tours now is pulling strings to make sure he clings on to his undeserved spot.
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Not really, the more the society is corrupted, the more the individuals will be! So the situation is worse here (not that I denied other countries are totally clear!)
 
RamLakhan said:
Not really, the more the society is corrupted, the more the individuals will be! So the situation is worse here (not that I denied other countries are totally clear!)
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I can't see that correlation but South American countries are much worse than india in terms of corruption.
 
Can't really understand why someone like Pant isn't in this team and a complete wastrel such as Karthik is still being selected ? Karthik has played 80 odd matches (more than 60 as specialist batsman) and still barely averages 30. That's an even bigger mystery than the persistent selection of Dhoni.

India should really be backing Pant in the middle-order after his performances with the test team and the IPL.
 
I would have had Gill, SHaw, Agarwal, Iyer, Pant over the guys like Rayudus, Dhonis, Karthiks, Jadhavs
 
Last Monetarist said:
Can't really understand why someone like Pant isn't in this team and a complete wastrel such as Karthik is still being selected ? Karthik has played 80 odd matches (more than 60 as specialist batsman) and still barely averages 30. That's an even bigger mystery than the persistent selection of Dhoni.

India should really be backing Pant in the middle-order after his performances with the test team and the IPL.
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This is really baffling. DK was dropped after Asia cup. Not sure if he had a monster first class season in India before his selection
 
rhony said:
This is really baffling. DK was dropped after Asia cup. Not sure if he had a monster first class season in India before his selection
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DK had a good Asia cup. Miles better than Dhoni. Then he was dropped.
 
WengerOut said:
DK had a good Asia cup. Miles better than Dhoni. Then he was dropped.
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Dhoni is a package, at least that's the perception. DK isn't and as a batsman he had a very middling Asia cup. He dug in at times but never scored enough runs. He was duly dropped after that. I think Pant's dismissals against WI turned against him and brought DK back into the side. Wish Pant showed some maturity in the WI series as he did in the AUS tour. Vaughan and Waugh think Pant is a sure shot for WC but I doubt Indian selectors and Kohli share the same view. It will be India's loss.
 
rhony said:
Dhoni is a package, at least that's the perception. DK isn't and as a batsman he had a very middling Asia cup. He dug in at times but never scored enough runs. He was duly dropped after that. I think Pant's dismissals against WI turned against him and brought DK back into the side. Wish Pant showed some maturity in the WI series as he did in the AUS tour. Vaughan and Waugh think Pant is a sure shot for WC but I doubt Indian selectors and Kohli share the same view. It will be India's loss.
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Pant had only 2 chances. Scored more than Dhoni and Kohli in their respective opening 2 matches.
 
I have been mocked a lot over the years on this forum for continuously saying that MS Dhoni is one of the most overrated batsman ever.

He was never the best batsman. He actually played very well only in his first few years 2004-2007. After that, all this « finisher » was/is a drama. India had such a formidable batting lineup. Yuvraj and Raina at 5 and 6 were winning a lot of matches when Dhoni was just staying not out, something not so hard is modern one day cricket.

Even the threads about him being finished are now 3-4 years old.
He is just hopping to be part of a World Cup winning team so his overrating takes another level!

Comparing his one dimensional or at best two dimensional batting (like Misbah) to the likes of Hussey, Abdv and others is a crime.
 
I dunno but I just feel Pant is exactly what India needs in the middle order. I mean watching him in tests makes me wonder this guy certainly should be playing limited overs game. He should be kept as a backup now because Dhoni can dug in and eat some overs while Pant is the opposite.

As India would like to have Jadhav or someone else for the sixth bowling option, I feel it makes harder for Pant to make it to XI as specialist batsmen. At the moment, as Kohli himself said, he will try different options and figure out the best possible XI, so it will all depend on form of the players before the start of WC.
 
They are bringing in Agarwal for Rahul. I was surprised to see his List A stats. Averaging 47 @100 SR. Question is if he can bat in the middle order.
 
Mobashir said:
I have been mocked a lot over the years on this forum for continuously saying that MS Dhoni is one of the most overrated batsman ever.

He was never the best batsman. He actually played very well only in his first few years 2004-2007. After that, all this « finisher » was/is a drama. India had such a formidable batting lineup. Yuvraj and Raina at 5 and 6 were winning a lot of matches when Dhoni was just staying not out, something not so hard is modern one day cricket.

Even the threads about him being finished are now 3-4 years old.
He is just hopping to be part of a World Cup winning team so his overrating takes another level!

Comparing his one dimensional or at best two dimensional batting (like Misbah) to the likes of Hussey, Abdv and others is a crime.
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Naa. That's just biased thinking. Dhoni won many games for India including the WC final. His downfall was from 2015. Before that, he was an out and out match winner. One of the best ODI bats ever.
 
rhony said:
They are bringing in Agarwal for Rahul. I was surprised to see his List A stats. Averaging 47 @100 SR. Question is if he can bat in the middle order.
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Please tell me Pant for Pandya too
 
Ab Fan said:
I dunno but I just feel Pant is exactly what India needs in the middle order. I mean watching him in tests makes me wonder this guy certainly should be playing limited overs game. He should be kept as a backup now because Dhoni can dug in and eat some overs while Pant is the opposite.

As India would like to have Jadhav or someone else for the sixth bowling option, I feel it makes harder for Pant to make it to XI as specialist batsmen. At the moment, as Kohli himself said, he will try different options and figure out the best possible XI, so it will all depend on form of the players before the start of WC.
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Having pant in the team will put pressure on grandpa Dhoni. No thanks. Karthik will give Dhoni great company when they both fail miserably in crunch situations.

India will win as long as top 3 scores 90% of the runs. If they fail, we will not even score 100. Our middle order is a joke and tail is an abomination.
 
WengerOut said:
Pandya should be jailed for becoming the reason for Vijay Shankar return.
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Shankar lol. Even if we give him a benefit of doubt for choking against Fizz at the death, his bowling is just an abomination. Guy bowls at 125 and has a slower ball to boot at 115. Just crazy selection
 
troodon said:
Having pant in the team will put pressure on grandpa Dhoni. No thanks. Karthik will give Dhoni great company when they both fail miserably in crunch situations.

India will win as long as top 3 scores 90% of the runs. If they fail, we will not even score 100. Our middle order is a joke and tail is an abomination.
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Dhoni is not going anywhere unfortunately. So, there is nothing we can do of this. It is pointless to make any imaginary XI. Just wish he clicks in WC and doesn't embarass himself.
 
Ab Fan said:
Dhoni is not going anywhere unfortunately. So, there is nothing we can do of this. It is pointless to make any imaginary XI. Just wish he clicks in WC and doesn't embarass himself.
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It's amazing that India was in a decent position when Dhoni reached his 50. 18 overs and 7 rpo required with 7 wickets in hand.

Now that Dhoni is confirmed for WC, he needs to make incremental improvement. 50 in 75 would have been much better than 50 in 95. I think he's still capable of 50 in 75. If he was not unlucky to be given out for a ball that pitched outside legstump , he could have unleashed a few strokes and maybe, maybe could have got India closer to the target. I know it's conjecture but I think that's how Indian team looks at things and believe Dhoni is valuable.

His role is to lend experience to Indian middle order and guide the team while the stroke makers bat around him. When India is Fielding, his role is to guide Kohli and the spinners. He just needs to bat at 70 SR instead of 50.
 
rhony said:
It's amazing that India was in a decent position when Dhoni reached his 50. 18 overs and 7 rpo required with 7 wickets in hand.

Now that Dhoni is confirmed for WC, he needs to make incremental improvement. 50 in 75 would have been much better than 50 in 95. I think he's still capable of 50 in 75. If he was not unlucky to be given out for a ball that pitched outside legstump , he could have unleashed a few strokes and maybe, maybe could have got India closer to the target. I know it's conjecture but I think that's how Indian team looks at things and believe Dhoni is valuable.

His role is to lend experience to Indian middle order and guide the team while the stroke makers bat around him. When India is Fielding, his role is to guide Kohli and the spinners. He just needs to bat at 70 SR instead of 50.
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He is done. Age has caught up with him. Infact he was done 3 years back. He is clearly upsetting the balance. India paid heavy penalty for going for "experience". I have zero expectation from this side that has Rayudu, Dhoni, Karthik, Jadhav in the middle order. Just get rid of 2 of Kohli, Dhawan, Rohit. That's it. Your job is done.
 
He should be the made the coach so that we can have him and also get rid of Shastri

On a serious note,he isn't going to get dropped so he can be protected and for that we will have to pick 3 allrounders so that he can come at 7-8
4 specialist Bat,3 AR(2 Bat AR + 1 AR),Dhoni,3 specialist bowlers
That should be our combo



If Hardik isn't available then Krunal,Shivam Dubey & K.Gowtham should be the 3 ARs
K.Gowtham isn't actually an AR but can get us quickfire 25-30 in the end and he is good enough to play as a specialist spinner
[MENTION=143730]AMSS[/MENTION] [MENTION=146232]jeeteshssaxena[/MENTION]
your views?
 
rhony said:
It's amazing that India was in a decent position when Dhoni reached his 50. 18 overs and 7 rpo required with 7 wickets in hand.

Now that Dhoni is confirmed for WC, he needs to make incremental improvement. 50 in 75 would have been much better than 50 in 95. I think he's still capable of 50 in 75. If he was not unlucky to be given out for a ball that pitched outside legstump , he could have unleashed a few strokes and maybe, maybe could have got India closer to the target. I know it's conjecture but I think that's how Indian team looks at things and believe Dhoni is valuable.

His role is to lend experience to Indian middle order and guide the team while the stroke makers bat around him. When India is Fielding, his role is to guide Kohli and the spinners. He just needs to bat at 70 SR instead of 50.
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India needed 148 in 18 overs
That's 8.22 rpo not 7
Had he got just 20 runs more
We would have required 128 off 18 overs that's 7.09 rpo,then we would have been in the match

Scoring 71 off 96 these days even if we are 4/3 in 4 overs isn't that tough but MSD wasted too many deliveries
 
jnaveen1980 said:
He is done. Age has caught up with him. Infact he was done 3 years back. He is clearly upsetting the balance. India paid heavy penalty for going for "experience". I have zero expectation from this side that has Rayudu, Dhoni, Karthik, Jadhav in the middle order. Just get rid of 2 of Kohli, Dhawan, Rohit. That's it. Your job is done.
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See it's making the best out of the existing situation. He is going to be in the team. That's confirmed. Indian team management looks at Dhoni as a package and not just a batsman. They know his limitations. The problem is with the rest of the order. As you said, Rayudu, Karthik are useless. That's where India is suffering. Rayudu was terrible in the field. He actually helped WI tie a game by letting a boundary on the last ball in India with his Fielding. He's a mug with the bat and an FTB. Karthik is a TTF. Having Pant in the team along with Dhoni will help. Pant can accelerate around Dhoni and Dhoni can guide Pant. Karthik was a big part of India's failure last night.
 
RyanRyan10 said:
India needed 148 in 18 overs
That's 8.22 rpo not 7
Had he got just 20 runs more
We would have required 128 off 18 overs that's 7.09 rpo,then we would have been in the match

Scoring 71 off 96 these days even if we are 4/3 in 4 overs isn't that tough but MSD wasted too many deliveries
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My bad. Yes 8 rpo. Teams can chase 8 rpo with 7 wickets in hand these days. Yes, he wasted too many. A bit ultra conservative. He can improve his SR with a bit of wit and strike rotation. We will have to see if he improves
 
rhony said:
It's amazing that India was in a decent position when Dhoni reached his 50. 18 overs and 7 rpo required with 7 wickets in hand.

Now that Dhoni is confirmed for WC, he needs to make incremental improvement. 50 in 75 would have been much better than 50 in 95. I think he's still capable of 50 in 75. If he was not unlucky to be given out for a ball that pitched outside legstump , he could have unleashed a few strokes and maybe, maybe could have got India closer to the target. I know it's conjecture but I think that's how Indian team looks at things and believe Dhoni is valuable.

His role is to lend experience to Indian middle order and guide the team while the stroke makers bat around him. When India is Fielding, his role is to guide Kohli and the spinners. He just needs to bat at 70 SR instead of 50.
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You made a good point but we need to look into it deeply. Dhoni starts getting his first 20-30 runs very slowly and that creates pressure on batsmen at other end, and then comes the time when he really is required to switch gears and this is where he improves his Strike Rate only slightly.

The problem is that like today, he was at 10 off some 40 balls, that will create significant pressure on the batsmen at other end. If Rohit would have got out hitting at the point when Dhoni was 6 off 36, it would have been really bizarre for India.

Dhoni needs to bat at SR of 70 at least from early on only and if he can then switch gears as per his capability, then that will help. However, if he starts at 30-40 SR, it will put huge pressure on batsmen at other end only. He bats at 5-6 and you can't afford to bat this slow there.
 
Ab Fan said:
You made a good point but we need to look into it deeply. Dhoni starts getting his first 20-30 runs very slowly and that creates pressure on batsmen at other end, and then comes the time when he really is required to switch gears and this is where he improves his Strike Rate only slightly.

The problem is that like today, he was at 10 off some 40 balls, that will create significant pressure on the batsmen at other end. If Rohit would have got out hitting at the point when Dhoni was 6 off 36, it would have been really bizarre for India.

Dhoni needs to bat at SR of 70 at least from early on only and if he can then switch gears as per his capability, then that will help. However, if he starts at 30-40 SR, it will put huge pressure on batsmen at other end only. He bats at 5-6 and you can't afford to bat this slow there.
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True. The top 3 in India have the capability to bat around Dhoni and soak in the pressure, score freely. The issue is with the rest. Rayudu and Karthik can't bat with Dhoni and maintain the RR in those initial 4 to 5 overs. That's where Pant can be effective. Dhoni can guide him while Pant can relieve the pressure.
 
rhony said:
They are bringing in Agarwal for Rahul. I was surprised to see his List A stats. Averaging 47 @100 SR. Question is if he can bat in the middle order.
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Wow. Looks like this has changed in the matter of hours. It's going to be Shubman Gill that will replace Rahul in the NZ tour. So, he is after all into consideration. If Rayudu flops in the next 2 games which I think he will, Gill will be slotted at no.4 or no.3 in NZ
 
Even as a Pakistan fan and no fan of India, it was hard to see Dhoni struggling. The guy has done so much for Indian cricket and conducted himself with dignity, it's hard to understand why he's ruining his legacy?

Not just his batting but he made a terrible error when he went too far to the right and the ball went to his left, over his shin for 4 byes.
 
Sad to see him like this. For India’s sake he needs to improve his strike rate or step down.
 
The Viper said:
Sad to see him like this. For India’s sake he needs to improve his strike rate or step down.
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The thing is that this is his game. Thats how Dhoni plays nowadays. With old age it takes longer go into the first gear. If he accelerates faster there will be a crash and he will get out cheaply.
 
rhony said:
This is really baffling. DK was dropped after Asia cup. Not sure if he had a monster first class season in India before his selection
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That's been the trend for 10 years now, I just don't understand the fascination of Indian selectors with DK. Every year he gets into team, gives an average performance, gets dropped and then is either selected again or is called in as replacement whenever some batsman get injured. They could have selected Manish Pandey or Mayank Agarwal or anyone who has performed well in domestic circuit. Why always DK will remain a mystery to me.
 
RyanRyan10 said:
He should be the made the coach so that we can have him and also get rid of Shastri

On a serious note,he isn't going to get dropped so he can be protected and for that we will have to pick 3 allrounders so that he can come at 7-8
4 specialist Bat,3 AR(2 Bat AR + 1 AR),Dhoni,3 specialist bowlers
That should be our combo



If Hardik isn't available then Krunal,Shivam Dubey & K.Gowtham should be the 3 ARs
K.Gowtham isn't actually an AR but can get us quickfire 25-30 in the end and he is good enough to play as a specialist spinner
[MENTION=143730]AMSS[/MENTION] [MENTION=146232]jeeteshssaxena[/MENTION]
your views?
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The selectors have made it clear that dhoni is the first choice wk and i don't think this will change.
According to me we need three specialist fast bowlers +hardik+kuldeep +spin bowling allrounder.
Ambati rayudu did well in 2018 but all matches he played were in asia and he didn't play against a single good fast bowling unit.
I don't think he has the ability to accelerate against good fast bowlers outside india.
For me the X1 should be something like:
Rohit
Dhawan
Kohli
Gill/rahul
Hardik
Dhoni
Krunal(better batsman than jaddu)
Bhuvi
Kuldeep
Shami
Bumrah.

Playing 2 front line spinners in england won't help, infact Chahal did zilch in eng tour(odis).
I feel Hardik is going to be our best player in world cup, we just need to give him the no. 5 spot.
There is no solution to our pathetic tail.
 
jeeteshssaxena said:
The selectors have made it clear that dhoni is the first choice wk and i don't think this will change.
According to me we need three specialist fast bowlers +hardik+kuldeep +spin bowling allrounder.
Ambati rayudu did well in 2018 but all matches he played were in asia and he didn't play against a single good fast bowling unit.
I don't think he has the ability to accelerate against good fast bowlers outside india.
For me the X1 should be something like:
Rohit
Dhawan
Kohli
Gill/rahul
Hardik
Dhoni
Krunal(better batsman than jaddu)
Bhuvi
Kuldeep
Shami
Bumrah.

Playing 2 front line spinners in england won't help, infact Chahal did zilch in eng tour(odis).
I feel Hardik is going to be our best player in world cup, we just need to give him the no. 5 spot.
There is no solution to our pathetic tail.
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Tail starts after 3. This team is no different than the current one.
 
jagatk said:
I can't see that correlation but South American countries are much worse than india in terms of corruption.
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South American countries are indeed on par (or even below) India in terms of economics! Only lower population and higher area (density) and rich natural resources (just like India) saved them! And their mentality is similar to India (and coincidentally they are also called Indians perhaps!) Idol Worship/God/Hero Worship is OK, if it takes to the position side, but unfortunately it is taking to the negative side! (Let's not discuss that deeply) If we relate it to past periods (mythic periods), then internal wars will take care of this (filtration of oldies and less-talented ones!) but current professional world (which only fits to proper professional outfits) is safeguarding them and they are using the loopholes smartly!
 
jeeteshssaxena said:
If the most hyped teenager(gill) is a tailender then we should stop playing cricket.
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That i think is the key word here, he is an unknown commodity, I would rather he wasn't picked before the world cup, Kohli came in to one of the most balanced teams india has had, he was never under pressure to perform from get go as he had people before and after him that took this responsibility, picking poor gill in this muddle order is throwing him to the sharks, either you come in with little time left as the top 3 have done the batting order's job or if the top 3 fail you are on a hiding to nothing as these other idiots around you are useless.
 
jeeteshssaxena said:
The selectors have made it clear that dhoni is the first choice wk and i don't think this will change.
According to me we need three specialist fast bowlers +hardik+kuldeep +spin bowling allrounder.
Ambati rayudu did well in 2018 but all matches he played were in asia and he didn't play against a single good fast bowling unit.
I don't think he has the ability to accelerate against good fast bowlers outside india.
For me the X1 should be something like:
Rohit
Dhawan
Kohli
Gill/rahul
Hardik
Dhoni
Krunal(better batsman than jaddu)
Bhuvi
Kuldeep
Shami
Bumrah.

Playing 2 front line spinners in england won't help, infact Chahal did zilch in eng tour(odis).
I feel Hardik is going to be our best player in world cup, we just need to give him the no. 5 spot.
There is no solution to our pathetic tail.
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Tail looks pathetic more so because of the brittle middle order! If you observe carefully only Bumrah & Kuldeep are the compulsory players for the XI (for the next 3 to 5 years!). The rest can be replaced with better options! Even then Kuldeep is not such a bad batsman (can easily fit at least No.10 spot & Bumrah at No.11. We don't have to be so severe to them! Even the great Australian & WI teams in the past did have very bad No.10 & No.11 batsmen! That's not such a compulsion! The specialists have to take care of the batting! The current England Team & the old SA teams used to look special to eyes with alrounders till the end of the lineup, but they actually belong to "choker" group, because perhaps they are complacent!)

The problem lies from No.4 to No.9 (6 positions!) We need high quality batsmen at No.4 & No.5 (at least 80 to 90% of the ability of Top 3) They need not have any other special bowling (or even WK/fielding skills!) Hardik should have improved at No.6 by now in both batting & bowling (at least in batting!) Unfortunately we didn't have sufficient time (spent some time to utilize him in Tests! For proper ODI preparation he should have played only in ODIs... He missed out in Asia Cup as well!) The 2nd spinner should definitely be an alrounder (I always felt playing Chahal along with Kuldeep is not good unless the pitch is turning square! He should only be a backup spinner) The 2nd seamer should preferably have some batting skills (but if he is a decent bowler and supports Bumrah completely then I don't mind if the batting is not up to the mark and if it lengthens our tail... As I said the actual problem lies from No.4 onward!) So Bhuvaneshwar or Shami should first be reliable with ball, then we can see if they any handy with bat!

But I am not sure if we are prepared well enough for WC... Actually our Test Team looks well settled (in spite of openers & Rahane going off-track!) The problem could have dealt better if they employed same tactics for both Test & ODI teams (In tests we are trying youngsters like Shaw, Pant, etc. But in ODIs we are sticking with old horses with broken legs!)
 
jeeteshssaxena said:
If the most hyped teenager(gill) is a tailender then we should stop playing cricket.
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You've 5 tail enders and one untested batsman. This is the strategy that selectors are already using and your solution is no different than the current scenario except inclusion of gill. Which is just a small share in a much larger picture.
 
RamLakhan said:
Tail looks pathetic more so because of the brittle middle order! If you observe carefully only Bumrah & Kuldeep are the compulsory players for the XI (for the next 3 to 5 years!). The rest can be replaced with better options! Even then Kuldeep is not such a bad batsman (can easily fit at least No.10 spot & Bumrah at No.11. We don't have to be so severe to them! Even the great Australian & WI teams in the past did have very bad No.10 & No.11 batsmen! That's not such a compulsion! The specialists have to take care of the batting! The current England Team & the old SA teams used to look special to eyes with alrounders till the end of the lineup, but they actually belong to "choker" group, because perhaps they are complacent!)

The problem lies from No.4 to No.9 (6 positions!) We need high quality batsmen at No.4 & No.5 (at least 80 to 90% of the ability of Top 3) They need not have any other special bowling (or even WK/fielding skills!) Hardik should have improved at No.6 by now in both batting & bowling (at least in batting!) Unfortunately we didn't have sufficient time (spent some time to utilize him in Tests! For proper ODI preparation he should have played only in ODIs... He missed out in Asia Cup as well!) The 2nd spinner should definitely be an alrounder (I always felt playing Chahal along with Kuldeep is not good unless the pitch is turning square! He should only be a backup spinner) The 2nd seamer should preferably have some batting skills (but if he is a decent bowler and supports Bumrah completely then I don't mind if the batting is not up to the mark and if it lengthens our tail... As I said the actual problem lies from No.4 onward!) So Bhuvaneshwar or Shami should first be reliable with ball, then we can see if they any handy with bat!

But I am not sure if we are prepared well enough for WC... Actually our Test Team looks well settled (in spite of openers & Rahane going off-track!) The problem could have dealt better if they employed same tactics for both Test & ODI teams (In tests we are trying youngsters like Shaw, Pant, etc. But in ODIs we are sticking with old horses with broken legs!)
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Agreed. When the tail starts at 4, you will lose in kncok out. That's sure.
 
Probably another silly question, but why hasn't Shreyas Iyer made the step-up to the senior team ? Seems to be doing well in state cricket and for the A-team. If I recall, he didn't exactly look out of place in the matches he played in South Africa last year. He was touted as the next big thing in Indian cricket a couple of years ago, but has seemingly dropped out of contention. His career is a salutary lesson for the likes of Shaw and Gill.
 
Last Monetarist said:
Probably another silly question, but why hasn't Shreyas Iyer made the step-up to the senior team ? Seems to be doing well in state cricket and for the A-team. If I recall, he didn't exactly look out of place in the matches he played in South Africa last year. He was touted as the next big thing in Indian cricket a couple of years ago, but has seemingly dropped out of contention. His career is a salutary lesson for the likes of Shaw and Gill.
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He was never the next big thing, decent but nothing beyond that, don't think he has the tools to make that leap from domestic success to international success.
 
jagatk said:
He was never the next big thing, decent but nothing beyond that, don't think he has the tools to make that leap from domestic success to international success.
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No, he was scoring a lot of runs in the Ranjhi Trophy and had secured a bumper contract in the IPL circa 2015-16 and there was an expectation that he'll break into the Indian team eventually. Hasn't really happened, but he's only 24. He did ok in the few chances he had early last year.
 
Itachi said:
Agreed. When the tail starts at 4, you will lose in kncok out. That's sure.
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The mindset of Top 3 will be completely different if they know that the tail starts at No.4 as you say! Actually this Top 3 is on par or even better than Hayden/Gilchrist/Ponting, but only to be called as chokers in knockouts (unfortunately)! The pressure of knockout if you know that the tail starts from No.4 (the anti-pressure or lift on the opposition when they know the same!) acts decisive! Failures by Hayden/Gilchrist/Ponting is often forgotten because others chip in and it happened several times! And people see it as team game! And Indian captain (who is part of this Top.3) has himself to blame for this ridiculous situation and for his worship of seniors (or business aspect of the game!)
 
Can’t wait to see old man Dhoni with his walking stick lose a quarterfinal match at the WC for India with his useless prodding to another 80 ball 40.
 
Don't be fooled by this knock lol Classic example of how scorecard can completely give a misleading picture.
 
RamLakhan said:
The mindset of Top 3 will be completely different if they know that the tail starts at No.4 as you say! Actually this Top 3 is on par or even better than Hayden/Gilchrist/Ponting, but only to be called as chokers in knockouts (unfortunately)! The pressure of knockout if you know that the tail starts from No.4 (the anti-pressure or lift on the opposition when they know the same!) acts decisive! Failures by Hayden/Gilchrist/Ponting is often forgotten because others chip in and it happened several times! And people see it as team game! And Indian captain (who is part of this Top.3) has himself to blame for this ridiculous situation and for his worship of seniors (or business aspect of the game!)
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Top 3 will score if we are batting first in a knockout. Batting 2nd and chasing > 300 will any-day create pressure on anyone. BTW we did win 2015 WC QF and 2017 CT SF as far as knockouts are concerned, it was against B'desh though :D
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Don't be fooled by this knock lol Classic example of how scorecard can completely give a misleading picture.
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Forget Dhoni. He's going to the WC anyway. Cherish Rayudu's innings. He's just 1 game away from being relieved of his misery
 
rhony said:
Forget Dhoni. He's going to the WC anyway. Cherish Rayudu's innings. He's just 1 game away from being relieved of his misery
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Not so sure about that.Gill was brought in as reserve opener so he won't play

Unless Dhoni moves to 4,Rayudu is gonna be there

Another thing I wanted was Jadhav for Karthik,but that's not gonna happen too
 
Rayudu has so much time to play shots that even after the keeper collected the ball, he is contemplating which shot to play.
 
Saurav said:
Not so sure about that.Gill was brought in as reserve opener so he won't play

Unless Dhoni moves to 4,Rayudu is gonna be there

Another thing I wanted was Jadhav for Karthik,but that's not gonna happen too
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Karthik and Jadav can play with Rayudu out. Hackidu biffed and puffed to boundaries through a couple of edges to prove what a hack he is just in time. It's exactly how he played before the last world cup in the AUS ENG IND tri series in AUS and duly lost his spot.
 
With that knock Dhoni has confirmed his spot for the World Cup, Dhoni & Karthik are confirmed. Both are excellent finishers.
 
rhony said:
Karthik and Jadav can play with Rayudu out. Hackidu biffed and puffed to boundaries through a couple of edges to prove what a hack he is just in time. It's exactly how he played before the last world cup in the AUS ENG IND tri series in AUS and duly lost his spot.
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That can only happen with Dhoni at 4 which Kohli doesn't prefer.Karthik is good for 30s only.Jadhav is must but things aren't working out for him
 
I'd like to have him at no.4.. what India needed is someone like Raina who can bowl few overs... it'd be nice if Rohit starts to bowl few...
 
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DK is great against third class bowling attacks, today bowling attack was the worse you will see of any world cup team. DK will show his true colors when playing against good bowlers.
 
happydavy said:
DK is great against third class bowling attacks, today bowling attack was the worse you will see of any world cup team. DK will show his true colors when playing against good bowlers.
Click to expand...
Well said about Karthik's competence with bat.
 
Kohli said:
Both are at the crease.
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Jadhav isn't the problem, we need him. He should be playing at the position kartik is and he can bowl, its dhoni and who ever else plays at 5/6 that is the problem.
 
Both will play the WC and honestly even Karthik is capable enough finisher.
 
Dhoni is way past his prime,can't hit boundaries even if he wants to,but his fans don't want to accept it
 
They will cost us the world cup .. There would be one match where we need to chase 300+ and these guys with their slow tempo will make sure we lose that match and end our campaign.
 
He has won a bilateral series regardless of that. He knows to play the situation and is not a brainless cricketer.
 
Answer is still very much yes. Jadhav has such a fragile fitness he could collapse anytime. Dhoni well is Dhoni he could screw up chase like this.
 
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