Your views on capital punishment

[TM Riddle]

Would like to know about ppers view on capital punishment and whether should it be completed scrapped out or followed more vigorously.
Also would like if people gave their opinions with subcontinent in mind.

 

[DW44]

Conflicted. Opposed to it in principle but part of me still wants it for two kinds of crimes: crimes based on mysoginistic cultural beliefs (honor killings etc) and crimes based on religious conviction (killing blasphemers/atheists etc). Apart from those two categories, I'm opposed to it e.g. if someone murders a woman, death penalty should be off the cards but if he does so in the name of honor/culture or religious beliefs, execute him. Guess my opinion is informed by my strong dislike for religion and misogyny which, at least in Pakistan's case, go hand in hand and whether or not I support the death penalty for a given crime is dependent more on the intent behind the crime than it is on the nature of the crime.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

If it works as a deterrent, and is only applied when there is no chance of a mistrial, then I'm okay with it where it fits the culture. Some crimes are so horrible that you really only want to see that criminal pay a worthy price. I'm not a fan of capital punishment on religious or ideological basis whether you are demanding them on behalf or God or as an atheist. These two extremes are just two sides of the same coin for me.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

For Murders (Any Kind) and Terrorist (even if they're accessories to a crime that inflicts loss of life)

 

[ExpressPacer]

I'm up for capital punishment. Why should child molesters, rapists or terrorists live on tax payer money? Heck, I'd even want people like who did the Peshawar APS school massacre to be tortured. Not a lot of people share the same opinion though. Maybe I'm an extremist.

 

[Hitman]

I'm completely against capital punishment for any type of crime.

 

[Robert]

I concur with [MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION]. Capital punishment is an expression of revenge, not justice based on tough love.

 

[Gubol123]

absolutely against capital punishment. Thankful that there is unofficial moratorium for most part of the last decade in India on capital punishment. There are multiple ways a trial can be compromised. There are also multiple research which establishes that even eye witnesses account cannot be fully trusted.

 

[Third_Umpire]

I concur with [MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION]. Capital punishment is an expression of revenge, not justice based on tough love.

In theory I agree with this, but wonder how I would feel if I lost a loved one to someone else's violence. Part of me feels I'd want the worst possible punishment bestowed upon that person.

 

[dildildalwalla]

Capital punishment should only be applied in a society where the judicial system and police force is properly equipped, properly funded and uncorruptable. Unless the framework exists, there is no point in applying such a law when police officers can be bribed or the courts can be corrupted.

If it's done correctly, I see no reason why murderers should not be put to death. That is true justice and something many families would call for too. Up until 2015, in the UK, the majority of people surveyed still supported capital punishment. Just last year, many people who voted leave for Brexit said they would support it. In a country like the UK where the courts are somewhat uncorrptable and the police force gathers evidence correctly, I would support capital punishment also.

In Pakistan, from an Islamic perspective, I have no problem with capital punishment however, Pakistan's governance is not Islamic and the police force is eaisly bribed (lack of working pay is a major factor) and the courts are too often influenced by outside factors. Thus, it should be abolished, for the time being anyway.

 

[DW44]

I concur with [MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION]. Capital punishment is an expression of revenge, not justice based on tough love.

Read the bits in bold:

An 18-year-old was shot dead by her paternal uncle in Rawalpindi on Friday for turning down a marriage proposal, reported Express News.

The suspect, Niaz, allegedly killed his niece, Mahrukh, in Fauji Colony. A case has been filed against the suspect on the complaint of Mahrukh’s father and the body has been sent to a hospital for an autopsy, police said.

Such incidents are extremely common in Pakistan.

In February, a middle-aged woman was shot dead at her home in Karachi’s Orangi Town for rejecting a marriage proposal for her daughter. Her daughter too was injured in the attack.

In March, A teenage orphan was allegedly sexually assaulted by her relative after she refused to marry him.

Last year in June, a 19-year-old woman, Maria Sadaqat, was tortured and then set on fire by a group of men in a village near Murree for refusing to marry a man. She was a teacher at a private school in Dhok Kallar in Lower Dewal.

Police and locals said five men tortured Sadaqat at her home after she returned from work. They said one of the attackers worked at the same school as the victim.

The attackers thrashed her, pour petrol over her, and set her on fire. She cried for help but had already suffered massive injuries when neighbours, who lived at a reasonable distance, were able to get to her.

These aren't "horrific crimes that shake the nation's conscience", these are everyday occurrences and I for one would much rather see perpetrators of such acts eliminated than to waste our already meager resources on futile attempts to rehabilitate them. Earlier this year a ten year old was ordered to be raped by a 60 something year old man by a village court, another fairly regular occurrence. It's one thing to propose a blanket ban on capital punishment sitting in a place like Britain but the only way to deal with the worst excesses of a patriarchal Islamic society is to make a cautionary tale out of people who torture and set 19 year old women on fire for rejecting a 50-something year old's marriage proposal while being protected by the law and society who accept these social norms.

 

[big_gamer007]

If it works as a deterrent, and is only applied when there is no chance of a mistrial, then I'm okay with it where it fits the culture. Some crimes are so horrible that you really only want to see that criminal pay a worthy price. I'm not a fan of capital punishment on religious or ideological basis whether you are demanding them on behalf or God or as an atheist. These two extremes are just two sides of the same coin for me.

Agreed with the POV..

 

[James]

I would still go with a No.

I do get the point that we all naturally want to see the ultimate punishment meted out against the most horrendous and shameless of criminals, particularly mass murderers. Certainly if a person killed my wife or my dog, I would want to kill that person in retribution, because the animal inside of me would want that bloodlust satisfied.

However that truth is specifically why I would still say No: the Death Penalty appeals to the darker and more basic side of our human instinct, and is more of a gruesome, pointless revenge than a civilised form of justice.

 

[TM Riddle]

I'm completely against capital punishment for any type of crime.

Even in cases such as Nirbhaya where supreme court today upheld the death penalty of the 3 convicts?

 

[TM Riddle]

I would still go with a No.

I do get the point that we all naturally want to see the ultimate punishment meted out against the most horrendous and shameless of criminals, particularly mass murderers. Certainly if a person killed my wife or my dog, I would want to kill that person in retribution, because the animal inside of me would want that bloodlust satisfied.

However that truth is specifically why I would still say No: the Death Penalty appeals to the darker and more basic side of our human instinct, and is more of a gruesome, pointless revenge than a civilised form of justice.

James did you hear of the Delhi rape case of 2012 and what those demons did to that poor girl in bus ? They were just laughing and doing that stuff which is too gruesome to be mentioned here.
People like those have zero sympathy from my side and if that makes me uncivilized then so be it.

 

[kaayal]

Even in cases such as Nirbhaya where supreme court today upheld the death penalty of the 3 convicts?

I wish that juvenile also got some punishment.....

 

[Markhor]

One of the best things the Wilson Government did was to abolish the death penalty.

There is no definitive evidence that it is a deterrent. Compare the murder rates in the US between states with the death penalty and without, or Hong Kong (which abolished the death penalty) and Singapore (which increased its usage). Among the 25 US states with the highest murder rate, 20 have the death penalty.

Infact a survey of US police chiefs in 1995 found the death penalty was ranked lowest amongst strategies to reduce violent crime. So even from a practical viewpoint, the death penalty is ineffective in reducing crime. Its also very costly and time consuming, with the average death row inmate waiting 12 years between sentencing and execution.

Also, the death penalty disproportionately targets the poor and people of colour who have poorer access to good legal representation. According to the ACLU, since the revival of the death penalty in the mid-1970s about half of those on death row at any given time have been black. This is despite approximately 49% of homicide victims being white yet 77% of capital homicide cases since 1976 have involved a white victim.

Then there's the issue of wrongful conviction which still occurs. Even in developed countries like the US and UK, you'll get faulty eyewitness accounts, misconduct from prosecutors and police, a botched crime scene, tampering of evidence and so on. Miscarriages of justice still happen, take the case of Troy Davis. I refuse to accept the loss of one innocent life for the sake of this so-called justice.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I can get both sides of the argument, but it really does make me laugh when I read a liberal's furious justification to introduce a barbaric form of punishment which is itself a prescription of the barbaric ideology he despises. Truly two sides of the same coin.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Conflicted. Opposed to it in principle but part of me still wants it for two kinds of crimes: crimes based on mysoginistic cultural beliefs (honor killings etc) and crimes based on religious conviction (killing blasphemers/atheists etc). Apart from those two categories, I'm opposed to it e.g. if someone murders a woman, death penalty should be off the cards but if he does so in the name of honor/culture or religious beliefs, execute him. Guess my opinion is informed by my strong dislike for religion and misogyny which, at least in Pakistan's case, go hand in hand and whether or not I support the death penalty for a given crime is dependent more on the intent behind the crime than it is on the nature of the crime.

What's difference between those two and a random murder? Or a murder of a child? I know you're a hardcore athiest but you're just showing your bias here.

 

[DW44]

What's difference between those two and a random murder? Or a murder of a child? I know you're a hardcore athiest but you're just showing your bias here.

My bias is evident? I'm not even trying to hide it, I don't do that whole "oh I'm neutral and x is just as bad as y so they're too sides of the same coin" routine because x is objectively worse than y and I have no tolerance for intolerance. The difference is that one kind of crime is overwhelmingly represented by isolated incidents with little to no connection between different incidents while the other is a systemic issue that enjoys widespread support from society at large. 200'000 people won't show up at the funeral of some random child murderer and later siege the parliament of the 6th largest nation on earth. They will and did when the murderer was a religious person acting in the name of religious beliefs held dear by a majority of the nation's citizens. Javed Iqbal is a footnote in our history and a man no one will ever speak up for. Mumtaz Qadri is a national hero for tens, possibly hundreds, of millions of Pakistanis so while conventional justice works for ordinary killers, it doesn't for religious ones because it creates ten more hence the need for the state to stamp its authority and make it clear to potential Qadris that there's only one way this ends.

 

[KingKhanWC]

My bias is evident? I'm not even trying to hide it, I don't do that whole "oh I'm neutral and x is just as bad as y so they're too sides of the same coin" routine because x is objectively worse than y and I have no tolerance for intolerance. The difference is that one kind of crime is overwhelmingly represented by isolated incidents with little to no connection between different incidents while the other is a systemic issue that enjoys widespread support from society at large. 200'000 people won't show up at the funeral of some random child murderer and later siege the parliament of the 6th largest nation on earth. They will and did when the murderer was a religious person acting in the name of religious beliefs held dear by a majority of the nation's citizens. Javed Iqbal is a footnote in our history and a man no one will ever speak up for. Mumtaz Qadri is a national hero for tens, possibly hundreds, of millions of Pakistanis so while conventional justice works for ordinary killers, it doesn't for religious ones because it creates ten more hence the need for the state to stamp its authority and make it clear to potential Qadris that there's only one way this ends.

I dont think the topic was specifically related to Pakistan but it's nice to know there are people like you out there who wouldn't want a serial child killer given capital punishment but anyone who kills one person because of religous extremism. But it is your opinion, thank fully it's a very very rare.

 

[DW44]

I dont think the topic was specifically related to Pakistan but it's nice to know there are people like you out there who wouldn't want a serial child killer given capital punishment but anyone who kills one person because of religous extremism. But it is your opinion, thank fully it's a very very rare.

I'm Pakistani so I'd much rather clean up my own house first. Ideally, the death penalty wouldn't exist to begin with but with religious nuts it's an option of last resort.

 

[KingKhanWC]

I'm Pakistani so I'd much rather clean up my own house first. Ideally, the death penalty wouldn't exist to begin with but with religious nuts it's an option of last resort.

The house you want to run away from lol.

 

[DW44]

The house you want to run away from lol.

A decision of last resort made only after trying to make it work there for six years. Unfortunately, staying alive and free in a nation of extremists is not possible. Doesn't make me want to see the place get better any less. I returned once, would do it again if the situation improves.

 

[Junaids]

I concur with [MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION]. Capital punishment is an expression of revenge, not justice based on tough love.

Exactly.

Primitive revenge for primitive people.

And, as we see every day in the USA, its existence makes rapists and robbers more likely to murder their victims to eliminate witnesses.

 

[kdoversmg]

I'd volunteer to pull the lever in the nirbhaya case. Hell, i'd pay to do it

 

[kdoversmg]

Exactly.

Primitive revenge for primitive people.

And, as we see every day in the USA, its existence makes rapists and robbers more likely to murder their victims to eliminate witnesses.

do you have any info to back it up that murders happened becos of capital punishment? or is this your usual habit of spinning tales?

 

[KingKhanWC]

A decision of last resort made only after trying to make it work there for six years. Unfortunately, staying alive and free in a nation of extremists is not possible. Doesn't make me want to see the place get better any less. I returned once, would do it again if the situation improves.

It's never going to improve to your liking. Having an attitude of only wanted death for crimes associated to religion but not anything else is not doing your house any favours anyway.

 

[R0H1T]

I wish that juvenile also got some punishment.....

He should've been castrated & WTH is his name not out in public domain, he should be universally ostracized for the rest of his pathetic lifetime!

 

[DW44]

It's never going to improve to your liking. Having an attitude of only wanted death for crimes associated to religion but not anything else is not doing your house any favours anyway.

Probably won't, not in my lifetime anyway but you have to start somewhere. Let me worry about that since it doesn't really concern you anyway. As to whether or not it does my house any favors, I don't see how removing a cancer, which is exactly what religious nuts are, doesn't help.

 

[Lonewarrior]

people who are against it , i have one question for them.
what about cases like Nirbhaya rape case ?
dont she deserves the justice for it ?

 

[KingKhanWC]

Probably won't, not in my lifetime anyway but you have to start somewhere. Let me worry about that since it doesn't really concern you anyway. As to whether or not it does my house any favors, I don't see how removing a cancer, which is exactly what religious nuts are, doesn't help.

You would have some sort of credibility if it was only aimed at extremists who take the lives of others but your real issue is with religion itself. Im just trying to understand your extreme reasoning as I've never come across anyone who only wants death penalty for extremist crimes but nothing else.

 

[DW44]

You would have some sort of credibility if it was only aimed at extremists who take the lives of others but your real issue is with religion itself. Im just trying to understand your extreme reasoning as I've never come across anyone who only wants death penalty for extremist crimes but nothing else.

Except I made it clear that I want it for people who "kill" for their religious beliefs, not religious people in general. You don't need to concern yourself with understanding my thought process since (a) I don't see why and (b) if you could have, you would​ have by now.

 

[ExpressPacer]

I'm completely against capital punishment for any type of crime.

Not even a painless death? Why spend millions of hard earned tax payer money on a rapist, terrorist or a murderer?

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

For Me Punishments of any type are not for revenge, but
reformation of Society and must not exceed the extent of the offence.

To prevent crime, the aim should be to eliminate the conditions that produce it.

Punishment seeks to remove the very root-cause of all crime by working a complete moral reformation in man. It blocks all approaches to crime.


There should be Capital Punishment for Murderers but there should be provision of forgiveness from the affected party. If they forgive the person than there should be no capital punishment for that person but rather a jail term.


But as far as capital punishment for honour killings, serial killing, killings related to terrorism , killings motivated by any religion or killings such as Nirbhaya's is concerned they should all be considered as State Criminals, Terrorists & Enemy of State and there should be no provision of Mercy and they should be given Capital Punishment.

 

[James]

people who are against it , i have one question for them.
what about cases like Nirbhaya rape case ?
dont she deserves the justice for it ?

Is that what she wants? Has anyone asked her?

 

[James]

Not even a painless death? Why spend millions of hard earned tax payer money on a rapist, terrorist or a murderer?

Painless or not is up for debate.

This is more about the moral, ethical and philosophical implications of giving the legal right to a society to end the life of an individual as a form of punishment. The painful / painless element is superficial in comparison to this.

 

[Syed1]

I'm completely against capital punishment for any type of crime.

And why is that?



Why should you and I innocent citizens pay our hard earned money in tax to get a guy who committed a heinous crime live the rest of his life with a roof over his head, a place to shower and free food for the rest of his life?

If a guy takes a life or commits rape then he longer is a functioning member of society and under no circumstances should be allowed to mingle with common people.

This means he would spend the rest of his life in jail with everything paid for? There was a study in the US that every prisoner that is in for life the US taxpayers have to pay about $150,000 for him. Better to send the criminal to his maker rather than wasting our money on that waste of skin.

 

[Syed1]

Painless or not is up for debate.

This is more about the moral, ethical and philosophical implications of giving the legal right to a society to end the life of an individual as a form of punishment. The painful / painless element is superficial in comparison to this.

What about the legal right of the person that criminal took the life of?

 

[James]

Except I made it clear that I want it for people who "kill" for their religious beliefs, not religious people in general. You don't need to concern yourself with understanding my thought process since (a) I don't see why and (b) if you could have, you would​ have by now.

Why are religious beliefs being portrayed here as more of a heinous motivation for taking life than any other reason? - Such as extreme political beliefs, racial hatred, financial gain, a crime of passion, or because of jealousy, or something else altogether.

Surely the act of murder itself is what is unequivocally wrong, and we can work from this point - there is definitely a debate to be had on whether or not there should be a death penalty for murder - but for (allegedly) religious reasons in particular? I would consider that to be blatant discrimination to be honest.

 

[James]

What about the legal right of the person that criminal took the life of?

Totally agree that there is a debate to be had on the death penalty. But focusing on whether the 'death experience' will be painful for the perpetrator or not (?) is hardly the way to frame the debate.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Painless or not is up for debate.

This is more about the moral, ethical and philosophical implications of giving the legal right to a society to end the life of an individual as a form of punishment. The painful / painless element is superficial in comparison to this.

I can't disagree because we ARE in a way going against the course of nature by ending a life. However, I also believe that hard earned taxpayer money shouldn't be wasted on caring for the life of a rapist or a terrorist.

 

[Syed1]

Totally agree that there is a debate to be had on the death penalty. But focusing on whether the 'death experience' will be painful for the perpetrator or not (?) is hardly the way to frame the debate.

IMHO the administered death should be painless through lethal injection.

 

[James]

I can't disagree because we ARE in a way going against the course of nature by ending a life. However, I also believe that hard earned taxpayer money shouldn't be wasted on caring for the life of a rapist or a terrorist.

If the numbers were more compelling I would agree, however from what I understand it often costs just as much to execute as it does to imprison, particularly in the US.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Another point of interest is something I came across while reading a book on Sociology. More people will give in to their wants (fetishes or whatever you may call it) and rape someone in a country where they know they will be fed, given shelter and possibly even the chance of being released instead of being given the capital punishment.

Personally, I believe in Feminism, Equality and everything similar in nature. I consider myself a fairly moderate person. However, I still support the capital punishment because it is a good way to make an example out of someone (even if some consider it aggressive) to stop more people of thinking about doing the same.

 

[James]

IMHO the administered death should be painless through lethal injection.

I guess my only worry is, how do we know it is painless? They can't test it on someone and then ask them afterwards if they felt any pain or not (lol)

Another question might be - should it be painless? Or for a right and proper retribution, should we make it proportionately painful?

Very interesting stuff.

 

[DW44]

Why are religious beliefs being portrayed here as more of a heinous motivation for taking life than any other reason? - Such as extreme political beliefs, racial hatred, financial gain, a crime of passion, or because of jealousy, or something else altogether.

Surely the act of murder itself is what is unequivocally wrong, and we can work from this point - there is definitely a debate to be had on whether or not there should be a death penalty for murder - but for (allegedly) religious reasons in particular? I would consider that to be blatant discrimination to be honest.

There's no rational justification for treating it as worse than murder committed for any of the other reasons you listed but I've been very clear about my emotions on this issue clouding my objectivity. As someone who has seen enough religious violence to last several life times, including losing a family member to violence committed in the name of religion, and then seeing millions of my compatriots lionizing the perpetrators of such violence I make no secret of the fact that I'm not neutral or objective on this issue. If I were to put my personal feelings aside, my position on this issue would be strongly against capital punishment for anyone but that's hard to do when it has affected you personally and the society that is supposed to demand justice turns around and cheers for murderers who murder for religion. It's the same for crimes against women. Women are somewhere between vermin and domestic cattle on the food chain in my part of Pakistan and I can't be objective when those dear to me suffer while society cheers the perpetrators because it's our culture.

 

[Zak_Fan]

When we seek justice for something horrible, for the affected it could be retributive, but for the society and the system, it is something preventive in nature. Capital punishment has nothing to do with the darkness inside us, nor does it diminish our humanity. Eliminating certain threats is essential, or you could potentially be risking other lives.

 

[Rinnegan Sasuke]

I guess my only worry is, how do we know it is painless? They can't test it on someone and then ask them afterwards if they felt any pain or not (lol)

Another question might be - should it be painless? Or for a right and proper retribution, should we make it proportionately painful?

Very interesting stuff.

Interesting indeed, personally I'd choose a painless way out since torturing them would bring me down to their level. However, I wonder if I'd hold the same viewpoint if someone dear to me had died at the hands of a maniac.

 

[Muhammad10]

Focus on the topic. No need to get personal.

 

[JaDed]

If abortion is allowed it should allowed,if that's not allowed this shouldn't be either.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

There's no rational justification for treating it as worse than murder committed for any of the other reasons you listed but I've been very clear about my emotions on this issue clouding my objectivity. As someone who has seen enough religious violence to last several life times, including losing a family member to violence committed in the name of religion, and then seeing millions of my compatriots lionizing the perpetrators of such violence I make no secret of the fact that I'm not neutral or objective on this issue. If I were to put my personal feelings aside, my position on this issue would be strongly against capital punishment for anyone but that's hard to do when it has affected you personally and the society that is supposed to demand justice turns around and cheers for murderers who murder for religion. It's the same for crimes against women. Women are somewhere between vermin and domestic cattle on the food chain in my part of Pakistan and I can't be objective when those dear to me suffer while society cheers the perpetrators because it's our culture.

Not difficult to see why you get mob mentality culture in some parts of the world when emotions are allowed to overcome rationale. Religious sentiments being hurt sound familiar?

Although when I say some parts of the world, emotions play a part in the every corner of the globe when it comes to world politics. I wonder what was the emotion for retaliation when the twin towers came down?

 

[enkidu_]

We live in a world where White peoples kill more civilians in a year than whatever courts could sentence criminals to death. The number debate is crypto moralistic false metaphysics upheld by peoples with an obvious impressionistic vision of life and death. They're the same peoples who don't have a problem with millions of innocents living a life of hell for first world standards, which includes deaths of children (thousands of Congolese children have died extracting coltan for mobile phones). But when it comes to capital punishment, their bourgeois ethics resurface like the long forgotten Loch Ness : they love to defend criminals.

The human body loses billions of cells per day, where's the harm for the society in getting rid of the nefarious elements ? It's dissuasive - compare rape statistics in Saudi Arabia with the rest of the world - and cheap (why maintain such toxic elements, wasting money on them ?)

Of course, there should be fair justice, courts, etc as the Divine Law asks, but capital punishment is a karmic necessity.

 

[Subaltern]

Why are religious beliefs being portrayed here as more of a heinous motivation for taking life than any other reason? - Such as extreme political beliefs, racial hatred, financial gain, a crime of passion, or because of jealousy, or something else altogether.

Surely the act of murder itself is what is unequivocally wrong, and we can work from this point - there is definitely a debate to be had on whether or not there should be a death penalty for murder - but for (allegedly) religious reasons in particular? I would consider that to be blatant discrimination to be honest.

Because blasphemy or any such 'religion induced crimes that result in death sentence' are victimless crime.
If i diss God, God isn't here to challenge me. Ie, no victim. Its like saying 'i hate superman'. well, until you find superman, much less find that he is ****** off at my comments, there is no victim, therefore, no crime.

That is why, taking a life for differing belief (or no belief) in an unproven entity, is the most heinous and petty crime there can be.

 

[Subaltern]

We live in a world where White peoples kill more civilians in a year than whatever courts could sentence criminals to death. The number debate is crypto moralistic false metaphysics upheld by peoples with an obvious impressionistic vision of life and death. They're the same peoples who don't have a problem with millions of innocents living a life of hell for first world standards, which includes deaths of children (thousands of Congolese children have died extracting coltan for mobile phones). But when it comes to capital punishment, their bourgeois ethics resurface like the long forgotten Loch Ness : they love to defend criminals.

The human body loses billions of cells per day, where's the harm for the society in getting rid of the nefarious elements ? It's dissuasive - compare rape statistics in Saudi Arabia with the rest of the world - and cheap (why maintain such toxic elements, wasting money on them ?)

Of course, there should be fair justice, courts, etc as the Divine Law asks, but capital punishment is a karmic necessity.

I'd much rather have rape statistics like Norway or Canada, with understanding and knowledge being the basis of lack of crime, than barbaric justice system that scares people into falling into line. Because the latter, is also intellectually stifling. A scared person, is not a creative person.

There is no divine law, because the divine hasn't been proven to exist. Only men who claim they represent the divine. Thats it.

 

[enkidu_]

I'd much rather have rape statistics like Norway or Canada, with understanding and knowledge being the basis of lack of crime, than barbaric justice system that scares people into falling into line. Because the latter, is also intellectually stifling. A scared person, is not a creative person.

A father disciplines his son with iron.

There is no divine law, because the divine hasn't been proven to exist. Only men who claim they represent the divine. Thats it.

We should deny your existence too then !

 

[Subaltern]

A father disciplines his son with iron.

Within reason. Or else the father gets prosecuted for child abuse. One does not have total discretion on how to punish their children physically. And as i said, the way of Norway, Canada, Finland, etc. are superior to Saudi, because they achieve similar results without engaging in violence.

We should deny your existence too then !

LOL. I am here. I am communicating with you. I am more real than God, since last i checked, God didn't show up to unilaterally prove its/his/her existence. Only words of men who claim they are carrying God's message/seen God/knows God/God came in their dreams.

So therefore, until God shows up or proves its existence, there is no divine law. Only what men CLAIM to be divine law, with zero proof of divinity presented.

 

[kaayal]

Is that what she wants? Has anyone asked her?

After the Supreme Court on Friday upheld the death sentence awarded to Nirbhaya's rapists, a sub-divisional magistrate who listened to her last declaration said she wanted her tormentors to be set ablaze, the*Times of India*reported.

SDM Usha Chaturvedi told TOI she was "happy and satisfied" the convicts would be sent to the gallows, and that Nirbhaya in December 2012 said "the rapists should not just be hanged but (also) set on fire," the report said.

http://m.indiatoday.in/lite/story/nirbhaya-wanted-her-rapists-to-be-set-on-fire-sdm-usha-chaturvedi/1/947558.html

From the guy who was with her during this torture...

As soon as she saw me she moved her hands to gesture me closer,” he recalls. “She was pleased when I told her the culprits had been caught. But she kept trying to say that we shouldn’t have boarded the bus. She was in pain, but she was certain to let it be known she wanted the men burnt alive.’’

http://fridaymagazine.ae/features/the-big-story/delhi-gang-rape-victim-s-friend-tortured-by-guilt-1.1321650

And from the rapist who some people here want to reform for the greater good....


Mukesh Singh, the driver of the bus
showed no remorse and kept expressing bewilderment that such a fuss was being made about this rape, when everyone was at it.

"When being raped, she shouldn't fight back. She should just be silent and allow the rape. Then they'd have dropped her off after 'doing her', and only hit the boy," he said.

Chillingly, he went on: "The death penalty will make things even more dangerous for girls. Now when they rape, they won't leave the girl like we did. They will kill her. Before, they would rape and say, 'Leave her, she won't tell anyone.' Now when they rape, especially the criminal types, they will just kill the girl. Death."

When asked to another rapist....

When I asked him how he could cross the line from imagining what he wanted to do, to actually doing it - given her height, her eyes, her screams - he looked at me as though I was crazy for even asking the question and said: "She was beggar girl. Her life was of no value."

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-31698154

Better to die while getting raped than silently suffering for the rest of the life....

 

[TM Riddle]

After the Supreme Court on Friday upheld the death sentence awarded to Nirbhaya's rapists, a sub-divisional magistrate who listened to her last declaration said she wanted her tormentors to be set ablaze, the*Times of India*reported.

SDM Usha Chaturvedi told TOI she was "happy and satisfied" the convicts would be sent to the gallows, and that Nirbhaya in December 2012 said "the rapists should not just be hanged but (also) set on fire," the report said.

http://m.indiatoday.in/lite/story/nirbhaya-wanted-her-rapists-to-be-set-on-fire-sdm-usha-chaturvedi/1/947558.html

From the guy who was with her during this torture...

As soon as she saw me she moved her hands to gesture me closer,” he recalls. “She was pleased when I told her the culprits had been caught. But she kept trying to say that we shouldn’t have boarded the bus. She was in pain, but she was certain to let it be known she wanted the men burnt alive.’’

http://fridaymagazine.ae/features/the-big-story/delhi-gang-rape-victim-s-friend-tortured-by-guilt-1.1321650

And from the rapist who some people here want to reform for the greater good....


Mukesh Singh, the driver of the bus
showed no remorse and kept expressing bewilderment that such a fuss was being made about this rape, when everyone was at it.

"When being raped, she shouldn't fight back. She should just be silent and allow the rape. Then they'd have dropped her off after 'doing her', and only hit the boy," he said.

Chillingly, he went on: "The death penalty will make things even more dangerous for girls. Now when they rape, they won't leave the girl like we did. They will kill her. Before, they would rape and say, 'Leave her, she won't tell anyone.' Now when they rape, especially the criminal types, they will just kill the girl. Death."

When asked to another rapist....

When I asked him how he could cross the line from imagining what he wanted to do, to actually doing it - given her height, her eyes, her screams - he looked at me as though I was crazy for even asking the question and said: "She was beggar girl. Her life was of no value."

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-31698154

Better to die while getting raped than silently suffering for the rest of the life....

I cannot even...But no let's waste our taxpayer's money on these rakshasas because apparently its for the greater good of the society.

 

[MenInG]

Exactly.

Primitive revenge for primitive people.

And, as we see every day in the USA, its existence makes rapists and robbers more likely to murder their victims to eliminate witnesses.

So now we need to be nice to these vile people?

 

[Junaids]

So now we need to be nice to these vile people?

Goodness me, no.

By all means make life in prison seem hopeless for them.

But imagine the stereotype brutal rapist in a southern city in the USA. He does an equation in his head and calculates that if his victim lives, she might send him to the death chamber. So he kills her.

There are so many things you can do short of the death penalty to reduce dangerous crime. In the southern US, just criminalise gun possession whilst under the influence of alcohol or drugs.