What's new

A Non First-Class team (Abbottabad) qualifies for National T20 Cup final 2023, what does that say about the new domestic structure?

Major

ODI Star
Joined
Aug 28, 2013
Runs
35,878
Post of the Week
7
A grade 2 team by the name of Abbotabad is in the finals of the National T20 cup. We had posters here saying reduce teams so that the quality can be maintained, well guess what, if a grade 2 team is reaching finals this ends the argument that by reducing teams you maintain quality.
 
Sad day for those continuously whinging about the standard of the multi team tournament.

Inspirational performance.
 
A grade 2 team by the name of Abbotabad is in the finals of the National T20 cup. We had posters here saying reduce teams so that the quality can be maintained, well guess what, if a grade 2 team is reaching finals this ends the argument that by reducing teams you maintain quality.
So by your logic if we had another 200 teams, we would get greater quality. And have you seen the dross served up. Have you seen the batting, bowling and the shocking fielding that doesn't even compare to an average Birmingham league team.
 
So by your logic if we had another 200 teams, we would get greater quality. And have you seen the dross served up. Have you seen the batting, bowling and the shocking fielding that doesn't even compare to an average Birmingham league team.
Where did anyone said 200 teams?

The number of teams should be based upon the population and no. of cricketers that exist in the circuit.

UK has more than 10 teams, India has so many teams.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Where did anyone said 200 teams?

The number of teams should be based upon the population and no. of cricketers that exist in the circuit.

UK has more than 10 teams, India has so many teams.
Why not though. Why not a 1000? If we are selecting essentially league cricketers to do a man's job,Why stop at 24? The rubbish that has been produced over decades is because apparently we need a job creation scheme and as the World moved on,we stayed stuck to lots of clubs players, playing FC cricket and being awful which meant that no one could tell who was any good. We had Sadaf and Rashid Latif taking wickets by the bundle load. Was that good and if it wasn't, why not
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Or the FC teams are rubbish. BTW it seems that you haven't actually seen the games because if you have you realise why our national team is so average. Terrible bowling, poor batting and awful fielding
I didn’t see the games? I watched 70-80% of all the matches broadcasted, what are you on about?
 
Zindabad Abbotabad

Absolutely mauled so called Domestic Giants Peshawar
 
I didn’t see the games? I watched 70-80% of all the matches broadcasted, what are you on about?
And what did you take. The Rawalpindi WK was so good after scoring a 40, that he needed to be called to the national squad🤣🤣
Did you see the awful batting and the worse Bowling And the awful fielding If you put all the best players from this tournament together, how many decent teams would you get? 3, 4 maybe 5?
 
Don't see an issue here.

If some team wins its games fair and square then they move to the final.
 
Zindabad Abbotabad

Absolutely mauled so called Domestic Giants Peshawar
So called? Can you tell us which team has dominated the if it's not them? If anything KPK zindabad not much facilities as Punjab and sindh but still are producing good cricketers.
 
I didn’t see the games? I watched 70-80% of all the matches broadcasted, what are you on about?
If you've watched that many of these games and were impressed by the quality of cricket on display, then you are either very easily impressed or a poor judge of ability.
 
Don't see an issue here.

If some team wins its games fair and square then they move to the final.
See these guys come on to prove a point. Not one of them could talk about the awful standard that was on show here and in QA trophy. This was the system they wanted but didn't have the courage to defend it and the reason they wanted it was because IK came up with it
 
The shorter the format, the greater the chance of upsets and weaker teams defying the odds. Look at last year's T20 World Cup when Namibia beat Sri Lanka, Netherlands beat South Africa, Ireland beat England etc.

Now I actually don't mind National T20 being an inclusive, FA Cup style tournament because the PSL exists as the premier T20 competition. It's basically an audition for PSL contracts.

My problem is with the FC competition which Misbah and Hafeez reintroduced that's clearly been a step backwards in competitive quality to anyone with a pair of eyes. It's also reignited the tiresome debates about regional and departmental cricket.

It's obvious the views of some here regarding the old 6 team system is prejudiced by their views on Imran Khan, pro or anti. However let's concentrate on the cricketing arguments.

1) What's the function of FC cricket ? To serve as a pipeline of talent into the national team. There cannot be any other reason because FC cricket isn't a viable commercial property anywhere in the world. It's sustained purely by cricketing considerations.

2) To achieve this purpose, the standard of competition must be sufficiently high so players are adequately prepared for the rigours of international cricket.

3) That begs the question - how many teams is enough ? How do you define the balance between the conflicting goals of elite level competition and ensuring maximum participation ? It's difficult and subjective, but both can be achieved with the right system.

Prioritise quality over quantity at FC level but have a broader 2nd XI competition that sits below it acknowledging Pakistan has a much bigger playing base than most nations. We could've continued with a 6 provincial QEA Trophy but expanded the 2nd XI tournament to 12-16 city teams. Instead we threw out the baby with the bathwater due to ego and politics.
 
Relax… it’s t20. The most volatile format there is.
 
Or the FC teams are rubbish. BTW it seems that you haven't actually seen the games because if you have you realise why our national team is so average. Terrible bowling, poor batting and awful fielding
I admit this QEA Trophy was played in unique circumstances because it clashed with the World Cup and Asian Games so stripped the competition of 33 of the best cricketers.

However one sign that the standard of domestic competition has dropped is when cricketers who previously struggled suddenly look like worldbeaters.

Two examples:

Ahmed Shehzad: Under the old 6 team setup, his batting average reads 38, 22 and 52 in 2019/20, 20/21 and 21/22. Didn't play FC cricket in 22/23. This year he averaged 96.

Saad Nasim: His batting average reads 14, 48 and 17 in 2019/20, 20/21 and 21/22. In 22/23 he was rightfully demoted to 2nd XI where he averaged 29. This year he returns to FC level and averaged 50, cracking a double hundred in the first few weeks of the tournament.
 
I admit this QEA Trophy was played in unique circumstances because it clashed with the World Cup and Asian Games so stripped the competition of 33 of the best cricketers.

However one sign that the standard of domestic competition has dropped is when cricketers who previously struggled suddenly look like worldbeaters.

Two examples:

Ahmed Shehzad: Under the old 6 team setup, his batting average reads 38, 22 and 52 in 2019/20, 20/21 and 21/22. Didn't play FC cricket in 22/23. This year he averaged 96.

Saad Nasim: His batting average reads 14, 48 and 17 in 2019/20, 20/21 and 21/22. In 22/23 he was rightfully demoted to 2nd XI where he averaged 29. This year he returns to FC level and averaged 50, cracking a double hundred in the first few weeks of the tournament.
When you are part of small number of teams, each game is a sort of test because you don't perform for a few games, you are dropped. If you increase the number of teams but don't have more quality players, the standard of each match drops.
 
It's hilarious hearing people say "wait for the super 8s you'll have better quality cricket"


So you agree that reducing the number of teams improves the quality of cricket??
 
It's hilarious hearing people say "wait for the super 8s you'll have better quality cricket"


So you agree that reducing the number of teams improves the quality of cricket??
What are you on about…

The quality of cricket was decent in the super 8s. Very good, exciting matches. You have to watch it to know it.
 
I think Abbottabad making the finals just tells you there is also talent in Pakistan outside or underneath the top layer. That's good.

If the system is healthy then after poor results, FC teams will look across at the talent underneath the system and bring them through as they try to improve results.

A result like this should be a little spur to FC sides to improve & bring in talent. If a pattern emerges that non FC teams are repeatedly beating FC teams for a couple of years without any change or adjustment by the FC teams, then it is a problem.
 
What are you on about…

The quality of cricket was decent in the super 8s. Very good, exciting matches. You have to watch it to know it.
Yes I agree quality has improved with fewer teams, that's logical. I just think it's a bad justification for having 18 teams to start with
 
What are you on about…

The quality of cricket was decent in the super 8s. Very good, exciting matches. You have to watch it to know it.

The shorter the format, the greater the chance of upsets and weaker teams defying the odds. Look at last year's T20 World Cup when Namibia beat Sri Lanka, Netherlands beat South Africa, Ireland beat England etc.

Now I actually don't mind National T20 being an inclusive, FA Cup style tournament because the PSL exists as the premier T20 competition. It's basically an audition for PSL contracts.

My problem is with the FC competition which Misbah and Hafeez reintroduced that's clearly been a step backwards in competitive quality to anyone with a pair of eyes. It's also reignited the tiresome debates about regional and departmental cricket.

It's obvious the views of some here regarding the old 6 team system is prejudiced by their views on Imran Khan, pro or anti. However let's concentrate on the cricketing arguments.

1) What's the function of FC cricket ? To serve as a pipeline of talent into the national team. There cannot be any other reason because FC cricket isn't a viable commercial property anywhere in the world. It's sustained purely by cricketing considerations.

2) To achieve this purpose, the standard of competition must be sufficiently high so players are adequately prepared for the rigours of international cricket.

3) That begs the question - how many teams is enough ? How do you define the balance between the conflicting goals of elite level competition and ensuring maximum participation ? It's difficult and subjective, but both can be achieved with the right system.

Prioritise quality over quantity at FC level but have a broader 2nd XI competition that sits below it acknowledging Pakistan has a much bigger playing base than most nations. We could've continued with a 6 provincial QEA Trophy but expanded the 2nd XI tournament to 12-16 city teams. Instead we threw out the baby with the bathwater due to ego and politics.
I think the lack of proper structure below the FC and List A games was a real weakness of the system and RR should have dealt with it. No one expected miracles to undo decades of rubbish but a system needed to have been properly started with proper score cards on a weekly basis and videos of good performances.
 
It shows that you can find talent anywhere in this country, you just need to provide them platforms to showcase their skills.

That is what Abbottabad players did.

We have to increase the number of teams in domestic circuit and in the PSL because we have enough talent here in Pakistan but due to the small opportunity windows we mostly never get the desired results out of it.
 
very poor quality of cricket in the whole tournament. rubbish to say the least.
But but we have so much talent we needs 100s of teams. I watched the whole tournament and I can say majority of the players looked if they were picked of the streets.
 
But but we have so much talent we needs 100s of teams. I watched the whole tournament and I can say majority of the players looked if they were picked of the streets.
It was awful, nobody will waste watching substandard below club-level tournaments. But the whole system is going back . No hope.
 
Great for Abbottabad making it to the final, I hope the go on to win the tournament.
 
Beating Peshawar who was undefeated in the whole tournament is some achievement for this new team. Talent is there in Pakistan just need to work on bringing it to the limelight.
 
Do not get excited over these local tournaments they are not the barometer, empirically tested decades ago Sialkot Stallions giant of local T20 had some unbeaten run s well were humiliated in CLT20's.
 
Back
Top