A plan for Pakistan to win the 2018-19 Test series in South Africa

[Junaids]

I am absolutely convinced that Pakistan can win the series which begins in exactly 11 weeks' time in South Africa. India only lost 2-1 in January - when De Villiers and Morkel were still playing. And we all know how much better Pakistan then did than India in England..........

This will be a severely under-strength South African team. The selectors consistently breached the maximum quota of white players in the Test series against India and Australia earlier this year, with the consequence that even after playing the current spurious ODI series against Zimbabwe to regain some flexibility, they will almost certainly be capped at 4 white players per Test.

Which means Dean Elgar and Aiden Markram to open, FAF du Plessis to skipper the team and Quinton de Kock behind the stumps.

No AB De Villiers. No Morne Morkel. And unless they are allowed a fifth white player, no Dale Steyn either.

South Africa's quota system means that the selectors will have to pick Hashim Amla despite his obvious terminal decline, and Temba Bavuma despite his obvious inadequacies at this level.

In terms of the bowling, they will probably have to field the raw Ngidi to open the bowling with Vernon Philander, unless Dale Steyn can sneak inside the quota.

1. Dean Elgar
2. Aiden Markram
3. Hashim Amla
4. FAF du Plessis
5. Temba Bavuma
6. Best other non-white batsman
7. Quinton de Kock (wk)
8. Vernon Philander
9. Kagiso Rabada
10. Keshav Maharaj
11. Lungi Ngidi

That's probably the weakest Test eleven that South Africa has had since the early 1960's.

So what of Pakistan?

The schedule
Firstly, they need to arrive early enough.

The series against New Zealand in the UAE finishes on Friday 7 December.

The single warm-up match in South Africa commences on Wednesday 19 December in Benoni, with the First Test at Centurion a week later.

It seems obvious that they need to arrive no later than Monday 10 December to acclimatise to the extra bounce - especially as the first two Tests are at high altitude at Centurion and Johannesburg.

To me, it seems obvious that Pakistan should actually seek to send several players who are not required in the UAE to South Africa even earlier than that.

Assume that Bilal Asif, Mohammad Hafeez and Yasir Shah are Asia-specialists, and take the opportunity to send other players to South Africa early.

I would have Shadab Khan, Faheem Ashraf, Ehsan Adil, Shaheen Shah Afridi and Mohammad Amir in South Africa by the start of December.

Picking The Right Squad

It's important to understand the pre-requisites for winning in South Africa.

Pakistan's batting is weak, which means that - like in England and Ireland - they will require a lot of runs out of their two bowling all-rounders at Numbers 7 and 8.

That means that Shadab Khan must play ahead of Yasir Shah. And that Faheem Ashraf has to play too.

There's another reason not to pick Yasir Shah in the First or Second Test. Those two matches matches are on the High Veldt at altitude, where wrist-spinners spin the ball through the thin air over the top of the stumps. Almost all the overs will be bowled by the quicks, with the sole spinner in the team more for his batting than bowling.

The other 3 bowlers for a Test eleven on the High Veldt basically pick themselves. The skill of Mohammad Abbas and Mohammad Amir (whose batting at Number 9 will also be crucial). And then one bowler with height and pace is needed - it's a shootout between Wahab Riaz or Shaheen Shah Afridi.

In normal circumstances, my Test eleven for the 2 Tests at high altitude would be:

1. Imam-ul-Haq
2. Azhar Ali
3. Asad Shafiq
4. Haris Sohail
5. Babar Azam
6. Sarfraz Ahmed (c/wk)
7. Shadab Khan
8. Faheem Ashraf
9. Mohammad Amir
10. Shaheen Shah Afridi
11. Mohammad Abbas

Reserves:
Fakhar Zaman
Usman Salahuddin
Mohammad Rizwan
Wahab Riaz
Ehsan Adil

But, of course, there's a problem.

Azhar Ali has now reached the geriatric stage as a Test batsman: he is the age at which both Alastair Cook and AB De Villiers retired. He has lost form, but we don't know whether that is bad luck or due to the permanent erosion of his hand-eye coordination due to age. This means that we simply cannot be sure whether Azhar Ali is going to ever regain his form - and his last tour of South Africa was catastrophic. Even if he improves in the UAE where the bounce is lower and the pace is slower, it's no guarantee that he will cope in South Africa.

Is there an alternative if Azhar Ali's horror run persists? The only other experienced Pakistani opener with a good record in Australian or South African conditions is Salman Butt - and surely it's too late to go back to him now!

 

[Rahul1]

There is no bowler in Pakistan as good as Bumrah and obviously no batsman even half as good as Kohli. If the result of the series is anything other than a 3-0 win for South Africa, even without AB and Morkel, i would be heavily surprised.

That's the brutal truth.

 

[AliMurtaza]

You are calling an attack comprising Philander, Rabada and Ngidi in SA conditions as weak? And then they have Maharaj, a left arm spinner and we generally struggle against these. Anything less than a 3-0 series to SA will be a miracle. Agreed their batting is probably not the strongest but apart from Abbas, we don’t have a second world call test fast bowler. Mir Hamza may turn out to be good but we won’t know until he plays. Not buying Shaheen Afridi is test ready or can be a test bowler unless he has domestic numbers behind him.

You can spin your theories as much as you can and come up will all kind of squad selections, and you pulled similar threads before Pak visited Aus in 2016, we will lose 3-0 or at best 2-0 against SA this winter.

 

[cricketindiafan]

Rabada an ATG in making
Philander an ATG on home pitches
Maharaj - best ever Spinner since readmission
Ngidi - a very exciting prospect

Add a fit and firing Steyn to the mix and you have perhaps the strongest attack in the world especially in SA conditions. Batting is weaker but that bowling unit can do with 250-300 runs on the board.

 

[zain7077]

I am absolutely convinced that Pakistan can win the series which begins in exactly 11 weeks' time in South Africa. India only lost 2-1 in January - when De Villiers and Morkel were still playing. And we all know how much better Pakistan then did than India in England..........

This will be a severely under-strength South African team. The selectors consistently breached the maximum quota of white players in the Test series against India and Australia earlier this year, with the consequence that even after playing the current spurious ODI series against Zimbabwe to regain some flexibility, they will almost certainly be capped at 4 white players per Test.

Which means Dean Elgar and Aiden Markram to open, FAF du Plessis to skipper the team and Quinton de Kock behind the stumps.

No AB De Villiers. No Morne Morkel. And unless they are allowed a fifth white player, no Dale Steyn either.

South Africa's quota system means that the selectors will have to pick Hashim Amla despite his obvious terminal decline, and Temba Bavuma despite his obvious inadequacies at this level.

In terms of the bowling, they will probably have to field the raw Ngidi to open the bowling with Vernon Philander, unless Dale Steyn can sneak inside the quota.

1. Dean Elgar
2. Aiden Markram
3. Hashim Amla
4. FAF du Plessis
5. Temba Bavuma
6. Best other non-white batsman
7. Quinton de Kock (wk)
8. Vernon Philander
9. Kagiso Rabada
10. Keshav Maharaj
11. Lungi Ngidi

That's probably the weakest Test eleven that South Africa has had since the early 1960's.

So what of Pakistan?

The schedule
Firstly, they need to arrive early enough.

The series against New Zealand in the UAE finishes on Friday 7 December.

The single warm-up match in South Africa commences on Wednesday 19 December in Benoni, with the First Test at Centurion a week later.

It seems obvious that they need to arrive no later than Monday 10 December to acclimatise to the extra bounce - especially as the first two Tests are at high altitude at Centurion and Johannesburg.

To me, it seems obvious that Pakistan should actually seek to send several players who are not required in the UAE to South Africa even earlier than that.

Assume that Bilal Asif, Mohammad Hafeez and Yasir Shah are Asia-specialists, and take the opportunity to send other players to South Africa early.

I would have Shadab Khan, Faheem Ashraf, Ehsan Adil, Shaheen Shah Afridi and Mohammad Amir in South Africa by the start of December.

Picking The Right Squad

It's important to understand the pre-requisites for winning in South Africa.

Pakistan's batting is weak, which means that - like in England and Ireland - they will require a lot of runs out of their two bowling all-rounders at Numbers 7 and 8.

That means that Shadab Khan must play ahead of Yasir Shah. And that Faheem Ashraf has to play too.

There's another reason not to pick Yasir Shah in the First or Second Test. Those two matches matches are on the High Veldt at altitude, where wrist-spinners spin the ball through the thin air over the top of the stumps. Almost all the overs will be bowled by the quicks, with the sole spinner in the team more for his batting than bowling.

The other 3 bowlers for a Test eleven on the High Veldt basically pick themselves. The skill of Mohammad Abbas and Mohammad Amir (whose batting at Number 9 will also be crucial). And then one bowler with height and pace is needed - it's a shootout between Wahab Riaz or Shaheen Shah Afridi.

In normal circumstances, my Test eleven for the 2 Tests at high altitude would be:

1. Imam-ul-Haq
2. Azhar Ali
3. Asad Shafiq
4. Haris Sohail
5. Asad Shafiq
6. Sarfraz Ahmed (c/wk)
7. Shadab Khan
8. Faheem Ashraf
9. Mohammad Amir
10. Shaheen Shah Afridi
11. Mohammad Abbas

Reserves:
Fakhar Zaman
Usman Salahuddin
Mohammad Rizwan
Wahab Riaz
Ehsan Adil

But, of course, there's a problem.

Azhar Ali has now reached the geriatric stage as a Test batsman: he is the age at which both Alastair Cook and AB De Villiers retired. He has lost form, but we don't know whether that is bad luck or due to the permanent erosion of his hand-eye coordination due to age. This means that we simply cannot be sure whether Azhar Ali is going to ever regain his form - and his last tour of South Africa was catastrophic. Even if he improves in the UAE where the bounce is lower and the pace is slower, it's no guarantee that he will cope in South Africa.

Is there an alternative if Azhar Ali's horror run persists? The only other experienced Pakistani opener with a good record in Australian or South African conditions is Salman Butt - and surely it's too late to go back to him now!

No Babar Azam? You were one of his strong advocates.

 

[pratiktc]

Might be little difficult for Shafiq to handle batting at 3 and 5.

Anyway Pak to lose 2-0. Pak should look for small moral victories in series like going 4 inns without being bowled out for less than 150. Youngsters like Babar making one good 70-80 score.

Well earned respite for Muhammed Abbas after toiling on UAE tracks. Hoping he gets a five-fer and reinforces his class.

 

[Junaids]

Rabada an ATG in making
Philander an ATG on home pitches
Maharaj - best ever Spinner since readmission
Ngidi - a very exciting prospect

Add a fit and firing Steyn to the mix and you have perhaps the strongest attack in the world especially in SA conditions. Batting is weaker but that bowling unit can do with 250-300 runs on the board.

I watched the Durban and Port Elizabeth Tests against Australia at the grounds, and I have to say that the bowling does not intimidate me.

Philander was what Mohammad Abbas is: a very skilful medium pacer.

Rabada is okay, but a little limited. His pace is around the level of Wahab Riaz and he is hostile but he isn't a great swing or seam proponent. He's like a poor man's Pat Cummins.

Ngidi is very raw. He's a similar pace to Rabada, but again, not much seam or swing.

Maharaj is a decent left-arm spinner, in the class of Zulfiqar Babar or Abdul Rehman, but inferior to Vettori. And the first two Tests at Centurion and Johannesburg will offer him nothing: high bouncing pitches with lush green outfields.

I can't stress enough that against the dodgy technique of Bavuma and the failing hand-eye coordination of Amla, the xtra pace and height of Shaheen Shah Afridi and/or Wahab Riaz is crucial.

 

[Junaids]

You are calling an attack comprising Philander, Rabada and Ngidi in SA conditions as weak? And then they have Maharaj, a left arm spinner and we generally struggle against these. Anything less than a 3-0 series to SA will be a miracle. Agreed their batting is probably not the strongest but apart from Abbas, we don’t have a second world call test fast bowler. Mir Hamza may turn out to be good but we won’t know until he plays. Not buying Shaheen Afridi is test ready or can be a test bowler unless he has domestic numbers behind him.

You can spin your theories as much as you can and come up will all kind of squad selections, and you pulled similar threads before Pak visited Aus in 2016, we will lose 3-0 or at best 2-0 against SA this winter.

My point before the Aussie tour was that Misbah and Younis would be liabilities.

And they were.

 

[Junaids]

Not buying Shaheen Afridi is test ready or can be a test bowler unless he has domestic numbers behind him.

I think the opposite.

Shaheen Shah Afridi will not develop at all playing domestic cricket on helpful tracks in Pakistan or Tests on UAE graveyards.

He needs to be in every national team squad in all 3 formats so he is bowling in the nets to the best. And he should play no domestic cricket at all.

 

[The Viper]

Tbh apart from the openers who are pretty good at home, the rest of the batting lineup looks vulnerable. But I don’t think our batting is any better. Think it will be a battle of the bowling attack’s. Haris Sohail and Imam are the key I feel as Azhar looks finished.

 

[Justcrazy]

If Pakistan manage to win that series , it would be there biggest ever test series win ever.

 

[WengerOut]

SA might prepare true pitches this time and will try to blast away Pak batsmen. Pakistan bowlers also could be less potent. The series could be close still.

I want Pak to win and Kohli - Shastri duo to look stupid.

 

[ads101]

Our batting stops at 5 with that line up. Faheem and Shadab aren't reliable bats and don't think they offer much with the ball. I think it's also likely as usual the openers will be more the sacrifice in SA, so pressure will be on 3-5 to make bulk of the runs. Hafeez isn't the answer as opener either, but I'm not sure Azhar is too as you said, he's ageing and probably going to do more work down the order. I do think Amir should play with Abbas, but not sure on Shaheen too young and inexperienced he's not used to playing many tests. I'd be tempted to try Shinwari or Junaid here instead, and I'm leaning to Shinwari.

I'd probably try out Fakhar as opener, I have my doubts but he likes bounce and we don't have many options. Ideally I'd like a right handed opener to partner Imam, but I can't think of one really pressing atm.

Probably would go with

1. Imam
2. Fakhar
3. Azhar
4. Haris
5. Asad
6. Usman Salluhuddin
7. Sarfraz
8. Yasir
9. Amir
10. Shinwari
11. Abbas

I don't mind playing a genuine spinner in Yasir (or Bilal) I'll take the risk. Usually Asian teams have won a test or two on the back of a spinners performance like Herath. And even in England Yasir won us matches even if his average wasn't great. Plus given the SA are worse against spin than pace, think it's always good for us to include a specialist one.

 

[Hasan123]

You live in a fantasy world at times. Rabada is a poor mans pat Cummins is a awful statement. Mahraj has been brilliant at international level.

Lol also our series finishing on December 7th against NZ isn't good. We won't leave early like you are asking. We won't have that much preparation for the tour like we did for the previous England tours.

 

[Swashbuckler]

I watched the Durban and Port Elizabeth Tests against Australia at the grounds, and I have to say that the bowling does not intimidate me.

Philander was what Mohammad Abbas is: a very skilful medium pacer.

Rabada is okay, but a little limited. His pace is around the level of Wahab Riaz and he is hostile but he isn't a great swing or seam proponent. He's like a poor man's Pat Cummins.

Ngidi is very raw. He's a similar pace to Rabada, but again, not much seam or swing.

Maharaj is a decent left-arm spinner, in the class of Zulfiqar Babar or Abdul Rehman, but inferior to Vettori. And the first two Tests at Centurion and Johannesburg will offer him nothing: high bouncing pitches with lush green outfields.

Boy oh boy you do have some strong delusions. Rabada a poor man's Cummins? Maharaj mediocre? Ngidi no skill? Have you even watched SA play test cricket the last few years? You make it sound like SA in SA has a bowling attack like Sri Lanka.

 

[cricketindiafan]

I watched the Durban and Port Elizabeth Tests against Australia at the grounds, and I have to say that the bowling does not intimidate me.

Philander was what Mohammad Abbas is: a very skilful medium pacer.

Rabada is okay, but a little limited. His pace is around the level of Wahab Riaz and he is hostile but he isn't a great swing or seam proponent. He's like a poor man's Pat Cummins.

Ngidi is very raw. He's a similar pace to Rabada, but again, not much seam or swing.

Maharaj is a decent left-arm spinner, in the class of Zulfiqar Babar or Abdul Rehman, but inferior to Vettori. And the first two Tests at Centurion and Johannesburg will offer him nothing: high bouncing pitches with lush green outfields.

I can't stress enough that against the dodgy technique of Bavuma and the failing hand-eye coordination of Amla, the xtra pace and height of Shaheen Shah Afridi and/or Wahab Riaz is crucial.

Obviously a guy taking 11 wickets in a test is mediocre.

And that last line is even more amusing. You have dissed a guy with 150 wickets@21 but are hyping someone who has hardly played FC cricket and another pacer who may not even make it to the Test squad to SA.

 

[New Yorker]

There is no bowler in Pakistan as good as Bumrah and obviously no batsman even half as good as Kohli. If the result of the series is anything other than a 3-0 win for South Africa, even without AB and Morkel, i would be heavily surprised.

That's the brutal truth.

I like Bumrah but in Tests Abbas is doing even better than him so far.

Junaids quota baiting is unconvincing. South Africa's bowling attack is as good as it has ever been. Rabada is the no 1 bowler in the world, and doing better than Steyn or Donald at the same stage of their careers, Philander is himself a former ICC no 1, and as good as Pollock ever was, Ngidi has been terrific so far, and Maharaj is possibly South Africa's best spinner ever. The naked truth is that the best bowlers in the South Africa at the moment are black and colored. Steyn and Morkel will not be missed.

 

[Ahmed216]

U dont need bits and pieces like shadab and faheem in a test match, especially in SA.

Imam
Azhar
Haris
Asad
Babar
Usman
Sarfraz
Yasir
Shaheen
abbas
Amir/Hasan

 

[RamLakhan]

Winning against Australia in UAE and then hoping for overseas victory looks similar mistake of Indians' hope of even brutal victories at home & going with all the confidence to SENA countries!

 

[New Yorker]

Rabada an ATG in making
Philander an ATG on home pitches
Maharaj - best ever Spinner since readmission
Ngidi - a very exciting prospect

Add a fit and firing Steyn to the mix and you have perhaps the strongest attack in the world especially in SA conditions. Batting is weaker but that bowling unit can do with 250-300 runs on the board.

Yep. I do believe this is the best pace attack in the world, and the best overall attack on pace friendly pitches, where only one spinner will play.

I am less and less convinced by Amir; Pakistan should give a berth to Hamza or Sadaf, bounce is good in South Africa.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Our batting line-up will be destroyed by that bowling attack. OP is forgetting the kind of wickets dished out to India recently. It won’t matter if Pakistan bowlers do well, since our batting will be ripped apart on those green wickets consistently.

 

[Rahul1]

I like Bumrah but in Tests Abbas is doing even better than him so far.

Junaids quota baiting is unconvincing. South Africa's bowling attack is as good as it has ever been. Rabada is the no 1 bowler in the world, and doing better than Steyn or Donald at the same stage of their careers, Philander is himself a former ICC no 1, and as good as Pollock ever was, Ngidi has been terrific so far, and Maharaj is possibly South Africa's best spinner ever. The naked truth is that the best bowlers in the South Africa at the moment are black and colored. Steyn and Morkel will not be missed.

Abbas better than Bumrah? Seriously?

 

[Ahmed216]

Abbas better than Bumrah? Seriously?

Abbas is a much better bowler than Bumrah in tests. Bumrah is effective only bcoz of an awkward action. Once the pace is gone he'll be thrashed everywhere. Bowls fast walking to the crease hence injury prone.
Abbas is much more skillful

 

[ali2220]

Abbas better than Bumrah? Seriously?

The sample size for both is so small that its too early to comment. Have them play atleast 25 test matches before passing such judgement.

 

[ali2220]

Our batting line-up will be destroyed by that bowling attack. OP is forgetting the kind of wickets dished out to India recently. It won’t matter if Pakistan bowlers do well, since our batting will be ripped apart on those green wickets consistently.

Completely agreed!

 

[Junaids]

U dont need bits and pieces like shadab and faheem in a test match, especially in SA.

Imam
Azhar
Haris
Asad
Babar
Usman
Sarfraz
Yasir
Shaheen
abbas
Amir/Hasan

You especially need bits and pieces fourth and fifth bowlers in South Africa - it’s why Azhar Mahmood is the GOAT Pakistani Player there.

The top order will often leave Pakistan 100-5. They will need the tail to wag!

 

[Last Monetarist]

I think they will be allowed to play 5 white cricketers, they have no choice as there is really no first-class standard batsman of colour apart from Bavuma. So they will probably play de Bruyn as a specialist batsman, would be unfair on him if he doesn't given that he scored a century in his last test innings.

 

[shah_1]

There is no bowler in Pakistan as good as Bumrah and obviously no batsman even half as good as Kohli. If the result of the series is anything other than a 3-0 win for South Africa, even without AB and Morkel, i would be heavily surprised.

That's the brutal truth.

Abbas has so far been better than Bhumrah

But it will be 3-0

 

[New Yorker]

Abbas better than Bumrah? Seriously?

What I wrote is that Abbas has done better than Bumrah in Tests so far.

Abbas averages 17 after 8 Tests, 2/3 of which have been played on pace bowling graveyards in the Windies and the UAE.

Bumrah averages 25 after playing 6 Tests in South Africa and England.

Abbas is ranked 21st in the ICC Test bowling rankings, ahead of every other pacer from Asia, and currently also Dale Steyn. Bumrah is ranked 37.

I am aware that it is early days, and accordingly framed my argument with care.

Want to give that approach a try?

 

[DRsohail]

So Bumrah is already better than all bowlers we have in test.. psrosi bhi theek kahtay ha.

 

[Junaids]

I watched South Aftica’s First two home Tests against Australia in person, and the three against India on TV.

They have no batting.

AB De Villiers is an ATG but the rest have enormous flaws, especially now that Amla is a has-been.

If Pakistan had arrived an extra two weeks earlier I’d have made them favourites.

South Africa only beat Australia because the Aussies Mentally disintegrated when they were caught ball-tampering, with cliques forming within the team, with Starc and Hazlewood and Lyon angry that Smith implicated them in his press conference.

And then on top of that there was the issue of Lyon and Mitch Marsh finding themselves in a John Terry/Wayne Bridge style past and present love triangle. The WAGS who were friends with the discarded Mrs Lyon turned against Mr Lyon, and it all descended into chaos.

And meanwhile Dave Warner was being humiliated on and off the field for Mrs Warner’s past.

 

[Junaids]

So Bumrah is already better than all bowlers we have in test.. psrosi bhi theek kahtay ha.

Clearly, because Bumrah has taken an enormous 28 Test wickets!

 

[the_outsider]

I am absolutely convinced that Pakistan can win the series which begins in exactly 11 weeks' time in South Africa.

That is why you fail!

 

[gani999]

There is no bowler in Pakistan as good as Bumrah and obviously no batsman even half as good as Kohli. If the result of the series is anything other than a 3-0 win for South Africa, even without AB and Morkel, i would be heavily surprised.

That's the brutal truth.

And Pakistan is without Younis Khan this time too.....

 

[Napa]

The problem with OP's threads is that he will say something outrageous, and then when you cite data to refute his claims, or events prove him to be very mistaken, he simply disappears.

 

[Zahid87]

I thought you would give up after your plan to win in Australia, my 'English' friend.

But I suppose the time for you to pop up has come....expect you to go into raptures during India's tour of Australia.

 

[Zahid87]

Our batting line-up will be destroyed by that bowling attack. OP is forgetting the kind of wickets dished out to India recently. It won’t matter if Pakistan bowlers do well, since our batting will be ripped apart on those green wickets consistently.

The OP has a history of seeing only what he wants to see.

Not sure whether its his age, since he seems to hark on about the glorious days of county cricket, or whether its deliberate.

 

[wrongun]

You live in a fantasy world at times. Rabada is a poor mans pat Cummins is a awful statement. Mahraj has been brilliant at international level.

Lol also our series finishing on December 7th against NZ isn't good. We won't leave early like you are asking. We won't have that much preparation for the tour like we did for the previous England tours.

I think Cummins is actually a poor man's Rabada from what I've seen- and that's coming from an Aussie.

Ngidi has looked very good also- but I've not seen him bowl enough.

With or without Steyn, this SA pace attack is high quality. I actually think Steyn struggles to get back in, such has been the form of Rabada/Ngidi and Philander doing the steady job.

 

[SarfiBabarHaris]

SA batting is weak but their bowling probably is the best in world. Maharaj is an underrated spinner.

I expect Haris Sohail to come good on those fast and bouncy tracks.

 

[MMHS]

SAF's batting is weak without AB & a declining Amla - but not sure if it's weaker than PAK. Their attack is best at their home condition and Mahraj will be more effective against PAK considering their record against SLAO spinners. If Styen is still dropped being fit for the quota - I'll personally request PP to award POST of THE MILLENNIUM for this thread in retrospective.

Coming to PAK XI - this bits & pieces "all-rounder" is not going to work. PAK's weakness is batting and 6 batsmen is required - tail can't start from 6 with Sarfraz. 3A Pacers (Abbas, Amir, Afridi) is also my choice, but my 4th blower will be a Leggi (Yasir or a new guy, not Shadab) or this new guy Bilal & I'll extract few SLAO spin overs from Haris. Azhar Mahmood scored 2 outstanding 100s in SAF (3 in 6 Tests against them, including 1 on debut), doesn't mean tail-ender like Fahim will do the same or Shadab is covering only specialist spinners quota for his 20s & 30s. OP has mentioned Mahmood, but in same Test at Durban, Mushi took 9 wickets, 6 in 2nd, and he batted at 10.

I would have dropped Sarfraz for a better WK if allowed. If MoHa is picked for SAF series based on his AUS bashing in UAE, then it's better to make him Captain & pick a new WK - MoHa will be much, much ....... much better specialist Captain than current man in charge.

Otherwise, my XI will be
1. Imam,
2. Azhar
3. Haris,
4. *Asad (Assigned Deputy,so deserves the chance to lead the side),
5. Babar,
6. Suad (I'll pick one new face in the series - if he is good, he'll do it, no need to protect young players from failure. He can be 5th bowler as well)
7. WK (May be Rizwan)
8. Amir
9. Afridi
10. Abbas
11. Specialist spinner (obviously Bilal, Yasir or a new face like Gohar/Raza/Irfan will bat higher than 11, but my point is - I'll pick the best available spinner in Country, based on his bowling only - even if he is to bat at 11)

PAK's series against NZ finishes on early DEC & I think Tests are scheduled later, so no way PAK can fly before 10th, which gives max 2 weeks preparation. Not enough, but at least they can plan much better than Kohli's team. If ODI's against NZ were scheduled later, I would have said that send an A team with Asad, Azhar, Imam, Haris, Abbas, Yasir, Wahab in it.

 

[Shandarchowka]

So basically you think an attack of Rabada, Philander, Maharaj, and Ngidi is actually a weak one? That's a little too much.

 

[Bilal7]

Winning against Australia in UAE and then hoping for overseas victory looks similar mistake of Indians' hope of even brutal victories at home & going with all the confidence to SENA countries!

The difference being that Pakistan has won 3 matches out of the last six that they have played in England.

Abbas better than Bumrah? Seriously?

Abbas is a much better test bowler than Bumrah, yes.

 

[ARK Rafay]

Our batting is quite week. We'll be blown away

 

[Bilal7]

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION], why play a spinner at all? I get that South Africa stuggle against spinners but they are not Australia and Shadab is unlikely to cause them many problems in Jo'Burg. Centurion can have something in it for the spinners but if it does, Yasir Shah will utilize it more effectively than Shadab will.

This is the team I would like to see:

1) Imam ul Haq
2) Azhar Ali/Sami Aslam
3) Asad Shafiq
4) Haris Sohail
5) Babar Azam
6) Usman Salahuddin
7) Sarfaraz Ahmed (c) (wk)
8) Faheem Ashraf/Yasir Shah
9) Mohammad Amir
10) Shaheen Shah Afridi
11) Mohammad Abbas

Haris Sohail will be a key player; not only will he be required to bat well but he will be the only spinner if they do play four pacers. Shafiq is the only current batsman with a century in South Africa and should bat at #3.

 

[Ali_Pakistan]

Well we can say anything we want but I am sure selectors will prove most of us wrong. We are going to see this team in SA.
Imam
Hafeez
Azhar
Haris
Asad
Babar
Sarfraz
Yasir
Abbas
Amir
Hasan.
Last two guys perhaps may change and we might find someone like Wahab or Faheem playing for us.

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

Your batting wouldn't win it but, your bowling could

Better go with good pace attack(no use of AR like Shadab who won't be lethal anyways). Harris and Asad as part timers for spin

07. S Ahmed + *
08. M Amir
09. S Afridi
10. M Abbas
11. M Hamza

You need tall pacers there. Faheem, Hassan and Amir wouldn't do much. But, due to lack of options you can have Amir, not other two.

Amir, Abbas to open the bowling
Shaheen, Mir to take over from each end.

Shaheen and Hamza need to be brought in. They'll be quite handy with their height.

 

[Rahul1]

The difference being that Pakistan has won 3 matches out of the last six that they have played in England.



Abbas is a much better test bowler than Bumrah, no.

Corrected.

 

[JibranAnsari]

I will consider it a win if we manage to win a single test match.

 

[JibranAnsari]

Corrected.

Ofcourse Mohammad Abbas is better test bowler at the moment.

 

[WengerOut]

The difference being that Pakistan has won 3 matches out of the last six that they have played in England.

How is that gonna help Pak in SA? India have a decent record against SA this decade. Still did not help them in Eng. More of a mental barrier. Same with Pak in case of SA.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

It is a great opportunity for us. Our best ever to win there but only if we select properly.

Imam
Azhar
Harris
Babar
Shafiq
Fakhar
Faheem
Sarfraz
Amir
Hasan
Abbas

If we play this 11 we win 2-1

 

[New Yorker]

It is a great opportunity for us. Our best ever to win there but only if we select properly.

Imam
Azhar
Harris
Babar
Shafiq
Fakhar
Faheem
Sarfraz
Amir
Hasan
Abbas

If we play this 11 we win 2-1

I have no idea why people would play Amir over Hamza. Amir has had his chance and has been about decent in Tests at best since his return from the ban. Hamza averages 17 in FC cricket. I would play a pace attack of Hamza, Abbas and Sadaf for height. I like Shaheen but he needs to put up numbers in domestics to show he is ready for Tests. Either Yasir or Kashif as spinner if Yasir continues to look so woefully out of form. No part timers.

 

[MMHS]

If I go 20 years back, the Test at Durban that PAK won, SAF put them in and PAK had a make shift Captain (Sohail), 2 debutantes (MoYo one), and a 20 years batsman with 4-5 Tests (Mo Wasim) .... and XI was missing their best 2 players - some Wasim Akram & Inzi Haq.

There after, that team had a bottom 4 of : 8. Mushtaq, 9. Waquar, 10. Shoaib, 11. Fazal E Akbar with a career average standing now of 12, 10, 10 & 13 (Fazal's FC average was 8 )

Do we know why & how PAK won that Test? Sorry, not for the runs from bottom half; rather because 4 bowlers took 20 wickets for a total cost of 457 runs, against a line-up that had Boucher, Pollock, Kluesner, Fannie De Villiers & Donald in last 5 .... for a note F de Villiers has a Test average of 19 after 20+ Tests

The ONLY & I repeat only chance for PAK to win a Test or two is to get 20 SAF wickets at cheaper than SAF's cost - may be those Test (s) can end in 3 Days. These "all-rounders" are not going to add meaningful runs and they won't take much wickets either. Azhar Mahmood was picked purely for his batting in previous Series in a line-up missing Wasim, Ul Haq & just banned Malik (regular Captain Latif as well) and Amir was leading for the first time as Test Captain in that Series - and he didn't take any wicket in that Test either.

Fazle Akbar, a very Abbas-isque pacer took 3 wickets in his first spell in combined innings & tail-ender Mushi to add his little batting contribution of 2 & 22, had a match figure of 32-9-71-3 & 37-13-78-6 == 69-22-149-9

I hope it brings some sense in this thread - bits & pieces cricketers are not much of use, they are good at salvaging pride in defeat. And, "Spinners for lower order batting contribution", is a liability in playing XI. I hope PAK management takes a look at this scorecard, before finalizing their play book.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/...nd-test-pakistan-tour-of-south-africa-1997-98

 

[MMHS]

If I go 20 years back, the Test at Durban that PAK won, SAF put them in and PAK had a make shift Captain (Sohail), 2 debutantes (MoYo one), and a 20 years batsman with 4-5 Tests (Mo Wasim) .... and XI was missing their best 2 players - some Wasim Akram & Inzi Haq.

There after, that team had a bottom 4 of : 8. Mushtaq, 9. Waquar, 10. Shoaib, 11. Fazal E Akbar with a career average standing now of 12, 10, 10 & 13 (Fazal's FC average was 8 )

Do we know why & how PAK won that Test? Sorry, not for the runs from bottom half; rather because 4 bowlers took 20 wickets for a total cost of 457 runs, against a line-up that had Boucher, Pollock, Kluesner, Fannie De Villiers & Donald in last 5 .... for a note F de Villiers has a Test average of 19 after 20+ Tests

The ONLY & I repeat only chance for PAK to win a Test or two is to get 20 SAF wickets at cheaper than SAF's cost - may be those Test (s) can end in 3 Days. These "all-rounders" are not going to add meaningful runs and they won't take much wickets either. Azhar Mahmood was picked purely for his batting in previous Series in a line-up missing Wasim, Ul Haq & just banned Malik (regular Captain Latif as well) and Amir was leading for the first time as Test Captain in that Series - and he didn't take any wicket in that Test either.

Fazle Akbar, a very Abbas-isque pacer took 3 wickets in his first spell in combined innings & tail-ender Mushi to add his little batting contribution of 2 & 22, had a match figure of 32-9-71-3 & 37-13-78-6 == 69-22-149-9

I hope it brings some sense in this thread - bits & pieces cricketers are not much of use, they are good at salvaging pride in defeat. And, "Spinners for lower order batting contribution", is a liability in playing XI. I hope PAK management takes a look at this scorecard, before finalizing their play book.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/...nd-test-pakistan-tour-of-south-africa-1997-98

I have to add a little insights here as well, which I heard in my own ears - this is from Hansie Cronje (Something in line - don't catch me for comas & semi colons ...): "When you get a side all-out for a combined total of less than 500 on such wicket, you expect for an easy win, but I must have to admire PAK attack even without Wasim - they were relentless and always coming at you, never gave us the comfort. At times Shoaib was unstoppable & Mushi just had a game to remember ...... and obviously Azhar & Saeed batted wonderfully to rescue the situation in two innings"

I am not going for a comparison between that SAF & this SAF that PAK will face.

PS: Those are feeling a comfort that SAF will be forced to drop Styen to manage that "quota" numbers, should be cautioned that just after PAK tour, SAF has 9 games (2 Test, 5 ODI, 2 T20s) against SRL in FEB, which they can win with 10 non whites under Faf & they have 3 ODIs & a T20 in few days time in AUS as well ...... Styen is not resting people, if he is fit.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

There is no bowler in Pakistan as good as Bumrah and obviously no batsman even half as good as Kohli. If the result of the series is anything other than a 3-0 win for South Africa, even without AB and Morkel, i would be heavily surprised.

That's the brutal truth.

Abbas is miles ahead of Bumrah as a test bowler.

Bumrah wishes he could bowl as consistently as Abbas. Abbas also has the ability to take wickets on any and every surface.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

OP is underrating South Africa's batting. Ghar main sub sher hotay hain. And Amla, Elgar, du Plessis, Markram will not be easy wickets to get. Plus there's the issue of our fragile batting which will find it increasingly difficult to survive if South Africa dishes out a green-top. I do think we can win one test but anything more than that seems highly unlikely.

 

[ARK Rafay]

Imam
Hafeez/Fakhar
Azhar
Haris
Asad
Usman/Babar
Sarfraz
Faheem
Shah
M Abbas
Mir Hamza

 

[CricVet]

My concern is if Pak would be able to score 100 even on a wicket that would have awkward bounce. It has always been Pak batting in SA that struggled. They will have play out of their skin to score even 200 in one inning. In any of the tests if Pak scored total of 450 in 2 innings combined, they can make a game out of it with their bowling.

 

[Abdullah Rabbani]

Ha Ha Bumrah He Is Nowhere Near
Mohammed Abbas

 

[Peshwa]

Ha Ha Bumrah He Is Nowhere Near
Mohammed Abbas

Yes because he is way ahead of abbas

 

[CricVet]

Yes because he is way ahead of abbas

Of Course Bumrah has higher avg per wicket Vs Abbas LOL:

Abbas 17.69 runs/wkt
Bumrah 25.57/wkt

Abbas Strike rate = 42.6
Bumrah Strike rate = 52.6

Per Indian logic, Bumrah wins.

 

[barah_admi]

Pakistan have to select the right bowlers. Abbas and Shah are a must and then someone with some pace...and no, not Riaz. I'd love a fit, firing and in form Amir but who knows how much FC cricket he will get in that time and how much time will be spent playing in colours.

Mir Hamza has the FC stats so lets give him a go, plus Hasan should be playing in the current series, because they need to develop him into a test bowler.

The batting is a bigger problem, if Pakistan are not comfortable getting 250-300, they lose.

 

[Ab Fan]

Pakistan dont have batsmen to deal with Rabada, Philander, Ngidi and Maharaj in South African conditions. Most of them are young and will probably be going through their first tours. They will find it very hard to cope with Philander, in particular, in those conditions.

Philander and Rabada are probably GOATs in SA conditions.

AB is a big miss but I think SA will take this series 2-1 against Pakistan.

 

[silent ischemia]

Sarfraz needs to step up both as a batsman and captain but I am afraid his batting is on the decline.
I dream of Pakistan winning a Test series in SA or Australia once in my lifetime but I am afraid that's not going to happen

 

[Peshwa]

Of Course Bumrah has higher avg per wicket Vs Abbas LOL:

Abbas 17.69 runs/wkt
Bumrah 25.57/wkt

Abbas Strike rate = 42.6
Bumrah Strike rate = 52.6

Per Indian logic, Bumrah wins.

Check out the opponents

 

[New Yorker]

Check out the opponents

Yes, you should.

Windies Tour Ave
Mohammed Shami 25
Ishant Sharma 32

South Africa Tour Ave
Mohammed Shami 17
Ishant Sharma 18

Just average wise, it seems a lot easier to be a pace bowler in South Africa,
doesn't it?

 

[giri26]

To be really frank, I see a big issue with Pakistan Test team and it will come back to haunt them in SA. The Pakistan top order is very reliant on boundaries to score their runs. They don't rotate the strike and rely on the release shot. The one thing the players have is plenty of patience, which I agree.

In SA though they are not going to get many boundary balls. India found that out earlier this year. Dale Steyn, Rabada and Philander aren't going to give you anything to hit. This is where the temperament of the Pakistan batsman will come into play. Pakistan need to work on this aspect if they have to win in SA. If you keep blocking, you are bound to nick one there.

 

[CricVet]

Pak problem is that bats are not capable of playing bounce. This is what we saw in AU when Asad Shafiq was all well set to chase down a mammoth total but then even a well set bat was bounced out by Starc. If it was only the matter of swing, I could see Pak fighting it out. Pak bats are incapable of playing steep bounce - couple this with swing, well then fear the worse. 0-3 will be a likely result.

If it rains while Pak is bowling, we can dismiss SA pretty cheap and then hope for staying in the game. Pak in this series will be hoping for a lot of miracles to keep them in the game. Azhar needs a miracle to get back into form and he is a must for the first 2 tests at least regardless of his form. We will need all of his experience. I am not too much sold on the nephew number 2 in such conditions. To be honest, I do not see one capable batsman besides Azhar to have a good test series in S.A. which says something about Pak batting. I fear that Pak lower order would be spending time to save face.

From S.A., Steyn is still a threat but Ngidi, Phiander, and Rabada are bigger threats so no respite. I hope S.A. just take it easy on Pak in the first test and we catch them napping. This Pak team will need a some form of moral boost in some ways to make this test series interesting.

 

[hadi123]

Good thread. I don't have high hopes as Test Cricket is also a mental game, and we have a poor record there. I think we would need longer to acclimitize, like we do for England series but we have a busy schedule. South Africa have a good bowling attack, so it's about how well our batsmen do. I do think SA's batting line up can be vulnerable. I think if we win the toss, our chances of winning will get better.

 

[Abdullah719]

So, is the plan in motion or what

 

[Junaids]

So, is the plan in motion or what

Two problems.

The Hafeez recall has left the openers under-experiences.

And if Yasir Shah replaces Shadab Khan, the tail lengthens too far up the order.