A regret that Virat Kohli may never play a Test match versus Pakistan!

[tyron_woodley]

Indeed, means tosses, pitches, conditions had nothing to do with India’s away loss in New Zealand - better team usually wins.

Ofcourse it matters. Tosses matter. India's away loss to do with not fielding their best team. We dint play the balanced team we were supposed to. More importantly it was after a tiring schedule with no red ball practice.
You don't play short format games as practice before a major test series.

Pakistan won tosses and so did new Zealand vs Australia but they still lost.
India don't lose when they win tosses away from home.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Virat must be happy not playing in Pakistan. Naseem would have put fear in his eyes and made him his bunny.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Indo-pak series is a more realistic possiblity than Pakistanis in IPL in the medium term.

Both are remote as long as policies and approach towards India are not changed.

 

[syedahsan]

Dude! its about a sportsman accomplishment

Kinda stopped reading after that.

Naw dude, Virat does not need to play test against Pakistan to “justify” his talent, or “feel” anything about his talent.

The guy is already an extraordinary player and the whole world knows it.

You are making it sound like as if Pakistan test team is the last frontier, lol.

And frankly speaking, OP’s like your’s kinda reek that shameless mentality that unconsciously indicates a subtle yearning of playing against India.

Nothing personal against the Indian team players, but the kinda cold shoulder the Indian govts have given to our various past PCB chairmen who were on their knees with a begging bowl, I firmly believe that Pakistan should only play India if their govt begs us. If not, we are good on our path and let them follow their path.

We should focus on developing our team stronger and stronger to become an intimidating force in world cricket.

Stop worrying about how Kohli “feels” about his talent if he didn’t play test against Pakistan (seriously, it’s laughable) and stop dreaming about playing India - and perhaps move on with dignity. Their board and their govt is not worth our time.

Its about a sportsman accomplishment. When did I say Virat was not talented or needed recognition. What would he know about India Pakistan test match when he has not played one. When Gavaskar Bedi Kapil dev prasanna maninder singh shastri would talk, Viral will have nothing to say forget about adding anything to it. To say that Pakistan team would have been easily rolled over by India should be considered foolish. Same Pakistan rolled India in Champions trophy and almost got into a winning mode in the last 50 over world cup , unfortunately the heavy los against the West Indies cost Pakistan the semi final birth.

 

[Itachi]

Regret is a subjective term.

For Kohli, it won't be a regret because Pakistan has lost the glory of its past and is just a lower mid tier team (I am being generous here).

For Pakistan, it will be a regret because Pakistan has lost the opportunity to play against one of the ATG.

 

[Itachi]

Its about a sportsman accomplishment. When did I say Virat was not talented or needed recognition. What would he know about India Pakistan test match when he has not played one. When Gavaskar Bedi Kapil dev prasanna maninder singh shastri would talk, Viral will have nothing to say forget about adding anything to it. To say that Pakistan team would have been easily rolled over by India should be considered foolish. Same Pakistan rolled India in Champions trophy and almost got into a winning mode in the last 50 over world cup , unfortunately the heavy los against the West Indies cost Pakistan the semi final birth.

The thread is about tests. Even if Pakistan was the ODI world cup champion, it will still be irrelevant.

 

[Balthazar]

Nah. The current Pakistan team is just plain average and for Kohli, it's just another team from the subcontinent. Srilanka, Bangla and Pak, no difference. It's not the Kohli who is missing out here, rather it's the Pak players.

 

[Shafi]

Our team is the most uninspiring and timid under Misbah. Its good that we are playing again India. Lots of record will be broken against us either by their bowlers/batsmen and we will suffer huge defeat under 4 days. It will be more or less one sided matches. There is a gulf of difference between qualities/talent/skills between us.

 

[Shafi]

Nah. The current Pakistan team is just plain average and for Kohli, it's just another team from the subcontinent. Srilanka, Bangla and Pak, no difference. It's not the Kohli who is missing out here, rather it's the Pak players.

Its actually other way around. Misbah will be shamed heavily if we loose test by innings and big runs (Not fully Misbah's fault). Both our batsmen/bowlers will be exposed and loose their current respectable average.

 

[Mamoon]

Regret is a subjective term.

For Kohli, it won't be a regret because Pakistan has lost the glory of its past and is just a lower mid tier team (I am being generous here).

For Pakistan, it will be a regret because Pakistan has lost the opportunity to play against one of the ATG.

Nah. The current Pakistan team is just plain average and for Kohli, it's just another team from the subcontinent. Srilanka, Bangla and Pak, no difference. It's not the Kohli who is missing out here, rather it's the Pak players.

The bitter truth.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

Ofcourse it matters. Tosses matter. India's away loss to do with not fielding their best team. We dint play the balanced team we were supposed to. More importantly it was after a tiring schedule with no red ball practice.
You don't play short format games as practice before a major test series.

Pakistan won tosses and so did new Zealand vs Australia but they still lost.
India don't lose when they win tosses away from home.

I know, that’s what I’m saying. These things do matter.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Our team is the most uninspiring and timid under Misbah. Its good that we are playing again India. Lots of record will be broken against us either by their bowlers/batsmen and we will suffer huge defeat under 4 days. It will be more or less one sided matches. There is a gulf of difference between qualities/talent/skills between us.

Ok let's not go overboard. India would win most likely but it would be competitive in u.a.e. I am talking about misbah's Pakistan with Younis Khan etc. It would be close. Slight edge to virat's India in u.a.e.

In India I think India would beat them but it would be like 2-0 in a 4 test series.

 

[Mamoon]

Pakistan vs India in Test cricket would be about as competitive as Sri Lanka vs India. The gap is too big for toss, pitch, conditions etc. to play a big role.

India would end up winning more sessions and days in any case.

 

[MenInG]

Its about a sportsman accomplishment. When did I say Virat was not talented or needed recognition. What would he know about India Pakistan test match when he has not played one. When Gavaskar Bedi Kapil dev prasanna maninder singh shastri would talk, Virat will have nothing to say forget about adding anything to it. To say that Pakistan team would have been easily rolled over by India should be considered foolish. Same Pakistan rolled India in Champions trophy and almost got into a winning mode in the last 50 over world cup , unfortunately the heavy los against the West Indies cost Pakistan the semi final birth.

Apologies if your thread has been taken over by the usual Pakistan cricket haters but I do wish people here would read post #1 before putting down their thoughts.

 

[Hyperion66]

almost got into a winning mode in the last 50 over world cup

Where did that happen? An alternate universe?

BTW there is absolutely nothing to be accomplished for him playing Pak, hell if anything his legacy would be weakened a bit for scoring truckloads of soft runs.

 

[Mamoon]

India beating Pakistan in a Test series in England or Pakistan )

Pakistani pitches are tailor-made for India’s current team. They will outclass us with bat and ball 9/10 times.

The only venue in the world where Pakistan can trouble India over the course of a series is England. But even there, you would expect India to beat us majority of the times.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

I would love to see kohli scoring a century at Gaddafi and raising his bat while the crowd applauds.

 

[MHN1293]

Where did that happen? An alternate universe?

BTW there is absolutely nothing to be accomplished for him playing Pak, hell if anything his legacy would be weakened a bit for scoring truckloads of soft runs.

What legacy? Currently he is no better than someone like inzamam in tests. And he wouldnt have been able to do much against pak in uae or or any other away country looking by his overseas record. Averages 36 in england, 36 in nz, 43 in srilanka, 38 in wi, 14 in bangladesh And guess what 68! At home. This thread was about kohli missing the oppertunity to shine against pak but has been derailed to bashing the current pakistani team.

 

[Mamoon]

What legacy? Currently he is no better than someone like inzamam in tests. And he wouldnt have been able to do much against pak in uae or or any other away country looking by his overseas record. Averages 36 in england, 36 in nz, 43 in srilanka, 38 in wi, 14 in bangladesh And guess what 68! At home. This thread was about kohli missing the oppertunity to shine against pak but has been derailed to bashing the current pakistani team.

He surpassed Inzamam as a batsman in all formats years ago. He is much better than him in all aspects of batting. Forget Inzamam, Kohli is levels above any batsman has ever produced in any format.

Posts like yours are the reason why Pakistani fans have become a laughing stock and are known throughout the cricket world as the most delusional fan base in the game.

 

[Balthazar]

Its actually other way around. Misbah will be shamed heavily if we loose test by innings and big runs (Not fully Misbah's fault). Both our batsmen/bowlers will be exposed and loose their current respectable average.

I don't think Kohli cares about Pakistani players' stats or wanting to shame them.. lol. Not playing Pak = less cricket for him to play against tier two teams.

 

[Mamoon]

He surpassed Inzamam as a batsman in all formats years ago. He is much better than him in all aspects of batting. Forget Inzamam, Kohli is levels above any batsman has ever produced in any format.

Posts like yours are the reason why Pakistani fans have become a laughing stock and are known throughout the cricket world as the most delusional fan base in the game.

Kohli is levels above any batsman Pakistan has ever produced*

 

[MHN1293]

He surpassed Inzamam as a batsman in all formats years ago. He is much better than him in all aspects of batting. Forget Inzamam, Kohli is levels above any batsman has ever produced in any format.

Posts like yours are the reason why Pakistani fans have become a laughing stock and are known throughout the cricket world as the most delusional fan base in the game.

On what basis has kohli surpassesd miandad,inzamam and younis khan in tests.

 

[Mamoon]

On what basis has kohli surpassesd miandad,inzamam and younis khan in tests.

Kohli still has 4-5 years of Test cricket left and he has already amassed 7,000+ runs and scored 27 hundreds and at an average of 53+.

He has already scored more runs at a higher average than both Miandad and Inzamam, and as I explained above, he is far from done.

He will also easily surpass Younis’ runs and century tally by the time he retires, and has already more hundreds than him outside Asia.

On top of that, he has done all of this while captaining India over the last 6 years. Among all captain batsmen, he ranks at the top.

You are kidding yourself if you think that he has not done enough yet to be considered better than the likes of Miandad, Inzamam and Younis.

As a master batsman, Kohli belongs in the league of Tendulkar, Lara, Ponting, Sir Viv etc. That is several notches above the level of Miandad, Inzamam and Younis.

 

[MHN1293]

Kohli still has 4-5 years of Test cricket left and he has already amassed 7,000+ runs and scored 27 hundreds and at an average of 53+.

He has already scored more runs at a higher average than both Miandad and Inzamam, and as I explained above, he is far from done.

He will also easily surpass Younis’ runs and century tally by the time he retires, and has already more hundreds than him outside Asia.

On top of that, he has done all of this while captaining India over the last 6 years. Among all captain batsmen, he ranks at the top.

You are kidding yourself if you think that he has not done enough yet to be considered better than the likes of Miandad, Inzamam and Younis.

As a master batsman, Kohli belongs in the league of Tendulkar, Lara, Ponting, Sir Viv etc. That is several notches above the level of Miandad, Inzamam and Younis.

Batsmen of different eras cannot be compared looking at just simple averages and hundreds like you have done. Different eras playing on bowler friendly wickets with smaller bats and larger boundary sizes and better bowlers and even then u look at miandads away record against some of the best teams of his era and it is similar to kohlis record. U must either be delusional or biased to not take those factors into account. After all the bhangra u did of someone like babar azam only scoring 3 centuries against top teams in odis next time also care to mention sachin tendulkar scoring only 26 centuries in 270 matches against top teams .As well as babars actual runs per inning(which is different from averages) against top teams is 40. Tendulkars overall runs per innings containing matches agaisnt weaker teams was also 40. So the point is in theory even babar if gets to play as many matches as tendulkar will surpass his century and run count. This was just to prove a point and not claim babar better than tendulkar due to tendulkar again having dominated good bowling lineups and playing impactfull knocks throughout his career , even in world cups.

 

[tyron_woodley]

What legacy? Currently he is no better than someone like inzamam in tests. And he wouldnt have been able to do much against pak in uae or or any other away country looking by his overseas record. Averages 36 in england, 36 in nz, 43 in srilanka, 38 in wi, 14 in bangladesh And guess what 68! At home. This thread was about kohli missing the oppertunity to shine against pak but has been derailed to bashing the current pakistani team.

He only performs against big teams not faltu teams.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Lol at comparing any Pakistani batsman from any era to Kohli

That's like saying Ishant Sharma is better than Wasim Akram.

 

[watson367]

He will not have any regrets looking back at his career. A test series will not happen in the next 15+ years, maybe even longer.

 

[Mamoon]

Batsmen of different eras cannot be compared looking at just simple averages and hundreds like you have done. Different eras playing on bowler friendly wickets with smaller bats and larger boundary sizes and better bowlers and even then u look at miandads away record against some of the best teams of his era and it is similar to kohlis record. U must either be delusional or biased to not take those factors into account.

Yes, batsmen of different eras can be compared when it is obvious that there is a significant gap between the two. Miandad, Younis, Inzamam etc. didn’t have the same status in their respective eras as Kohli has today. In fact, Younis only retired 3 years ago and it was obvious as early as 2012-2013 that Kohli will end up as a superior batsman.

Secondly, if you want to discredit Kohli’s record compared to Miandad and Inzamam because today the pitches are flatter, bats are bigger and boundaries are smaller, then are you ready to extend the same logic to bowlers?

If the batsmen today are benefiting from easier conditions, then that means that bowlers of the past benefited from easier conditions while bowlers of today have to cope with tougher conditions.

So I am willing to agree with you that Inzamam and Miandad were better then Kohli because they played in tougher conditions, as long as you extend your own logic and also admit that Boult, Rabada, Bumrah etc. were better than Wasim, Waqar, and Imran respectively.

But you obviously will not do that and defy your own logic.

This is the problem with people who keep underrating modern batsmen because of XYZ reasons. They are never willing to extend the same logic to the bowlers of previous eras.

Instead, they would try to convince you that not only are today’s conditions easier for batting, the bowlers today are also weak which is laughable and exposes their cult mentality.

Furthermore, you are actually wrong about today’s pitches. This era of Test cricket has less flat pitches than the 2000s. Apart from Australia and UAE, almost every other venue produces pitches that provides assistance to bowlers as well.

If you want to gauge Kohli’s greatness and skill level as a batsman, look no further than the 2018 Test series in South Africa.

It was played on one of the most bowling friendly wickets ever and is the only Test series in history where every single wicket in every single innings fell.

Kohli top scored in that series by a big margin (de Villiers finished second) and was the only batsman to score a hundred.

The way he batted on those pitches against an incredible bowling attack of Steyn, Rabada, Philander and Morkel showed his greatness and his ability to adapt to any conditions against any bowling attack.

The likes of Inzamam, Younis and perhaps even Miandad (although he was a better batsman than both) would have been walking wickets on those pitches against the same quality of bowling.

Inzamam didn’t score a single Test hundred against South Africa home and away. The bowling attack that he faced - Donald, Pollock, Ntini, Hayward, Fanie de Villiers etc. was not better than the attack of Steyn, Rabada, Philander and Morkel.

Moreover, Inzamam played on South African wickets that were not tougher than the ones Kohli played on in 2018.

After all the bhangra u did of someone like babar azam only scoring 3 centuries against top teams in odis next time also care to mention sachin tendulkar scoring only 26 centuries in 270 matches against top teams .As well as babars actual runs per inning(which is different from averages) against top teams is 40. Tendulkars overall runs per innings containing matches agaisnt weaker teams was also 40. So the point is in theory even babar if gets to play as many matches as tendulkar will surpass his century and run count. This was just to prove a point and not claim babar better than tendulkar due to tendulkar again having dominated good bowling lineups and playing impactfull knocks throughout his career , even in world cups.

Longevity is not a piece of cake. Pakistani fans always act as if it is a walk in the park to play over 650+ international matches and prove yourself to be a legendary batsman for pretty much the entire duration.

Playing 463 ODIs is not a joke. Neither is scoring 18,000+ runs and 49 hundreds. If Babar can pull it off he will deserve to be compared to Tendulkar.

Heck, if Babar ends up with 10,000+ runs and 30+ ODI hundreds, he will deserve to be considered among the top 5 greatest ODI batsman.

 

[MHN1293]

Yes, batsmen of different eras can be compared when it is obvious that there is a significant gap between the two. Miandad, Younis, Inzamam etc. didn’t have the same status in their respective eras as Kohli has today. In fact, Younis only retired 3 years ago and it was obvious as early as 2012-2013 that Kohli will end up as a superior batsman.

Secondly, if you want to discredit Kohli’s record compared to Miandad and Inzamam because today the pitches are flatter, bats are bigger and boundaries are smaller, then are you ready to extend the same logic to bowlers?

If the batsmen today are benefiting from easier conditions, then that means that bowlers of the past benefited from easier conditions while bowlers of today have to cope with tougher conditions.

So I am willing to agree with you that Inzamam and Miandad were better then Kohli because they played in tougher conditions, as long as you extend your own logic and also admit that Boult, Rabada, Bumrah etc. were better than Wasim, Waqar, and Imran respectively.

But you obviously will not do that and defy your own logic.

This is the problem with people who keep underrating modern batsmen because of XYZ reasons. They are never willing to extend the same logic to the bowlers of previous eras.

Instead, they would try to convince you that not only are today’s conditions easier for batting, the bowlers today are also weak which is laughable and exposes their cult mentality.

Furthermore, you are actually wrong about today’s pitches. This era of Test cricket has less flat pitches than the 2000s. Apart from Australia and UAE, almost every other venue produces pitches that provides assistance to bowlers as well.

If you want to gauge Kohli’s greatness and skill level as a batsman, look no further than the 2018 Test series in South Africa.

It was played on one of the most bowling friendly wickets ever and is the only Test series in history where every single wicket in every single innings fell.

Kohli top scored in that series by a big margin (de Villiers finished second) and was the only batsman to score a hundred.

The way he batted on those pitches against an incredible bowling attack of Steyn, Rabada, Philander and Morkel showed his greatness and his ability to adapt to any conditions against any bowling attack.

The likes of Inzamam, Younis and perhaps even Miandad (although he was a better batsman than both) would have been walking wickets on those pitches against the same quality of bowling.

Inzamam didn’t score a single Test hundred against South Africa home and away. The bowling attack that he faced - Donald, Pollock, Ntini, Hayward, Fanie de Villiers etc. was not better than the attack of Steyn, Rabada, Philander and Morkel.

Moreover, Inzamam played on South African wickets that were not tougher than the ones Kohli played on in 2018.



Longevity is not a piece of cake. Pakistani fans always act as if it is a walk in the park to play over 650+ international matches and prove yourself to be a legendary batsman for pretty much the entire duration.

Playing 463 ODIs is not a joke. Neither is scoring 18,000+ runs and 49 hundreds. If Babar can pull it off he will deserve to be compared to Tendulkar.

Heck, if Babar ends up with 10,000+ runs and 30+ ODI hundreds, he will deserve to be considered among the top 5 greatest ODI batsman.

Going back to my first post i clearly mentioned that "currently" kohli is not greater than the pakistani greats. However there is no doubt that eventually he will surpass them. Had you read the post you would have realized that i was comparing kohlis legacy built up till now to that of inzamams by the end of his career. But if he preforms consistently over the next few years he will surpass him. You also failed to answer how him scoring runs against a pakistan team which rose to among the top 2 in the world, against saeed ajmal and the fastest bowler to 200 wickets in the uae would be considered soft.

 

[Mamoon]

Going back to my first post i clearly mentioned that "currently" kohli is not greater than the pakistani greats. However there is no doubt that eventually he will surpass them. Had you read the post you would have realized that i was comparing kohlis legacy built up till now to that of inzamams by the end of his career. But if he preforms consistently over the next few years he will surpass him. You also failed to answer how him scoring runs against a pakistan team which rose to among the top 2 in the world, against saeed ajmal and the fastest bowler to 200 wickets in the uae would be considered soft.

Even if he retires today, he will still be considered a better batsman than anyone in Pakistan history.

What he does from here till the end of his career will only enhance his legacy further. He has already left all Pakistani batsman far behind.

Ajmal was never good enough for Kohli. Kohli always dominated him whenever they faced-off, and Kohli wasn’t even at his peak then.

He picked his variations beautifully and was always in control.

Test cricket was Ajmal’s weakest format, and there is no doubt Kohli would have dominated him in Test cricket too.

 

[Confucius]

Yes, batsmen of different eras can be compared when it is obvious that there is a significant gap between the two. Miandad, Younis, Inzamam etc. didn’t have the same status in their respective eras as Kohli has today. In fact, Younis only retired 3 years ago and it was obvious as early as 2012-2013 that Kohli will end up as a superior batsman.

Secondly, if you want to discredit Kohli’s record compared to Miandad and Inzamam because today the pitches are flatter, bats are bigger and boundaries are smaller, then are you ready to extend the same logic to bowlers?

If the batsmen today are benefiting from easier conditions, then that means that bowlers of the past benefited from easier conditions while bowlers of today have to cope with tougher conditions.

So I am willing to agree with you that Inzamam and Miandad were better then Kohli because they played in tougher conditions, as long as you extend your own logic and also admit that Boult, Rabada, Bumrah etc. were better than Wasim, Waqar, and Imran respectively.

But you obviously will not do that and defy your own logic.

This is the problem with people who keep underrating modern batsmen because of XYZ reasons. They are never willing to extend the same logic to the bowlers of previous eras.

Instead, they would try to convince you that not only are today’s conditions easier for batting, the bowlers today are also weak which is laughable and exposes their cult mentality.

Furthermore, you are actually wrong about today’s pitches. This era of Test cricket has less flat pitches than the 2000s. Apart from Australia and UAE, almost every other venue produces pitches that provides assistance to bowlers as well.

If you want to gauge Kohli’s greatness and skill level as a batsman, look no further than the 2018 Test series in South Africa.

It was played on one of the most bowling friendly wickets ever and is the only Test series in history where every single wicket in every single innings fell.

Kohli top scored in that series by a big margin (de Villiers finished second) and was the only batsman to score a hundred.

The way he batted on those pitches against an incredible bowling attack of Steyn, Rabada, Philander and Morkel showed his greatness and his ability to adapt to any conditions against any bowling attack.

The likes of Inzamam, Younis and perhaps even Miandad (although he was a better batsman than both) would have been walking wickets on those pitches against the same quality of bowling.

Inzamam didn’t score a single Test hundred against South Africa home and away. The bowling attack that he faced - Donald, Pollock, Ntini, Hayward, Fanie de Villiers etc. was not better than the attack of Steyn, Rabada, Philander and Morkel.

Moreover, Inzamam played on South African wickets that were not tougher than the ones Kohli played on in 2018.



Longevity is not a piece of cake. Pakistani fans always act as if it is a walk in the park to play over 650+ international matches and prove yourself to be a legendary batsman for pretty much the entire duration.

Playing 463 ODIs is not a joke. Neither is scoring 18,000+ runs and 49 hundreds. If Babar can pull it off he will deserve to be compared to Tendulkar.

Heck, if Babar ends up with 10,000+ runs and 30+ ODI hundreds, he will deserve to be considered among the top 5 greatest ODI batsman.

I like the way you ignored MHNs comment on different conditions making it hard to compare batsman's across different eras and instead focused on "status". *Facepalm*. That's what agenda does: prevents you from conceding other rationale ideas if they go against your agenda. And as for Kohli being the greatest asian captain, you would be laughed out of the room even if it was full of the most die hard indian kohli fans.

Such a reductive way of evaluating the efficacy of batman/captaincy by looking at stats alone.

Anyway, back to the TOPIC. Pretty sure Kohli would have loved to compete against pak in pak be it tests or odis. Champions want to succeed everywhere and against his arch historic rivals no less (irrespective of how poor Pak is currently). He would have been very successful no doubt and would have enjoyed performing there.

 

[MenInG]

Even if he retires today, he will still be considered a better batsman than anyone in Pakistan history.

What he does from here till the end of his career will only enhance his legacy further. He has already left all Pakistani batsman far behind.

Ajmal was never good enough for Kohli. Kohli always dominated him whenever they faced-off, and Kohli wasn’t even at his peak then.

He picked his variations beautifully and was always in control.

Test cricket was Ajmal’s weakest format, and there is no doubt Kohli would have dominated him in Test cricket too.

When you make such statements, please preface them with "In my view" because the casual observer may think this is a fact of some sort which it is not.

 

[Swashbuckler]

Pak would have been favorites in 2011-12 when India was in transition phase. India the favorites post 2016 (end of MisYou era) when Pak was in decline while Kohli's team found a new gear. In 2013-15 however very tough to say, India was the best placed team to defeat Pak in fortress UAE while Pak was the only team that could have won in India. Cricket is poorer since we were robbed of the possibly epic battles of Ashwin/Jadeja vs MisYou and Yasir vs Kohli/Pujara. Those battles could have created so many legacies and wonderful memories.

ODIs and T20s India has been unquestionably superior except during our transition phase post 2011 WC.

From India not just Kohli, I am sure all of them including Pujara, Jadeja, Ashwin, Shami will have the regret of not facing Pakistan at least once in a test series.

 

[Deewana Mastana]

Must be kidding if you're really thinking of this as he won't regret zilch.

 

[Colorblind Genius]

Its about a sportsman accomplishment. When did I say Virat was not talented or needed recognition. What would he know about India Pakistan test match when he has not played one. When Gavaskar Bedi Kapil dev prasanna maninder singh shastri would talk, Viral will have nothing to say forget about adding anything to it. To say that Pakistan team would have been easily rolled over by India should be considered foolish. Same Pakistan rolled India in Champions trophy and almost got into a winning mode in the last 50 over world cup , unfortunately the heavy los against the West Indies cost Pakistan the semi final birth.

If you say that it will be a regret for YOU that Kohli didn’t play against Pakistan, then I understand.
But if you say that Kohli will be regretful that he didn’t play against Pakistan then frankly speaking. it’s laughable.

 

[cricketjoshila]

When you make such statements, please preface them with "In my view" because the casual observer may think this is a fact of some sort which it is not.

In your view who are pakistani batsmen who are better than Kohli?

 

[Mamoon]

I like the way you ignored MHNs comment on different conditions making it hard to compare batsman's across different eras and instead focused on "status". *Facepalm*. That's what agenda does: prevents you from conceding other rationale ideas if they go against your agenda. And as for Kohli being the greatest asian captain, you would be laughed out of the room even if it was full of the most die hard indian kohli fans.

Such a reductive way of evaluating the efficacy of batman/captaincy by looking at stats alone.

Anyway, back to the TOPIC. Pretty sure Kohli would have loved to compete against pak in pak be it tests or odis. Champions want to succeed everywhere and against his arch historic rivals no less (irrespective of how poor Pak is currently). He would have been very successful no doubt and would have enjoyed performing there.

You don’t need to get into the different conditions debate to conclude that Kohli is comfortably a superior batsman to Miandad, Inzamam and Younis.

You also don’t need an agenda to arrive to that conclusion either.

In fact, anyone who thinks otherwise is the one with an agenda and deserves a facepalm.

If Pakistani fans cannot digest the fact Kohli is better than any batsman in Pakistan history, it is their problem.

With or without stats, Kohli is a better batsman than all of them. You can use any criteria/measurement and Kohli will come out on top when compared to Pakistani batsmen.

As far as his captaincy record is concerned, you can judge captaincy in many different ways including W/L ratio.

There is no one one criteria for judging captaincy. You can choose the criteria of your liking and come to the conclusion that Kohli is a terrible Test captain if it makes you feel better,

but your chosen criteria will not change the fact that Kohli has 33 Test wins as captains and could potentially overtake G. Smith as the most prolific Test captain ever by wins.

Moreover, he also kept his team at the top of the rankings for a very long time. The longest reign at the top in this decade.

Again - you can be dismissive about his captaincy record and moan about home wins, but that will not take away his record. Moreover, if wins at home were so cheap, other teams wouldn’t be so far behind India when it comes to home dominance.

Learn to respect greatness. Kohli is a great among the greats and his legacy towers over the vast majority of cricketers who have ever played the game.

 

[Mamoon]

When you make such statements, please preface them with "In my view" because the casual observer may think this is a fact of some sort which it is not.

It is a fact. Apart from some Pakistani fans who are in denial and cannot see yet another Indian batsman become bigger than their batsman, the whole world recognizes Kohli as a better batsman than Miandad/Younis/Inzamam.

 

[Mamoon]

You don’t need to get into the different conditions debate to conclude that Kohli is comfortably a superior batsman to Miandad, Inzamam and Younis.

You also don’t need an agenda to arrive to that conclusion either.

In fact, anyone who thinks otherwise is the one with an agenda and deserves a facepalm.

If Pakistani fans cannot digest the fact Kohli is better than any batsman in Pakistan history, it is their problem.

With or without stats, Kohli is a better batsman than all of them. You can use any criteria/measurement and Kohli will come out on top when compared to Pakistani batsmen.

As far as his captaincy record is concerned, you can judge captaincy in many different ways including W/L ratio.

There is no one one criteria for judging captaincy. You can choose the criteria of your liking and come to the conclusion that Kohli is a terrible Test captain if it makes you feel better,

but your chosen criteria will not change the fact that Kohli has 33 Test wins as captains and could potentially overtake G. Smith as the most prolific Test captain ever by wins.

Moreover, he also kept his team at the top of the rankings for a very long time. The longest reign at the top in this decade.

Again - you can be dismissive about his captaincy record and moan about home wins, but that will not take away his record. Moreover, if wins at home were so cheap, other teams wouldn’t be so far behind India when it comes to home dominance.

Learn to respect greatness. Kohli is a great among the greats and his legacy towers over the vast majority of cricketers who have ever played the game.

And speaking of conditions, Kohli has actually played in tougher Test conditions than Inzamam and Younis, and he is still better than both.

 

[Confucius]

And speaking of conditions, Kohli has actually played in tougher Test conditions than Inzamam and Younis, and he is still better than both.

Now now pumpkin. Don't divert you know exactly what I was calling you out on. Swerving the debate by casually changing the focus from change in conditions to star status - classic sophist. No need to parrot the obvious: Kohli is comfortably by some margin better than most batsman produced by us by some margin, doesn't take a genius to work that one out. When it comes to pre 2000 we just cant say how much better he was than our 90s bunch or even vs the Indian 90s line up because the conditions are so different. Night night.

 

[Artaxerxes]

Indo-pak series is a more realistic possiblity than Pakistanis in IPL in the medium term.

Mark my words.There will not be any Pak-Ind series for the next 50 years.I don't understand why people
are so desperate to see Pak-India series.There is and there will be plenty of cricket
matches to watch.There no lack of choice.WI is playing NZ,Pak will be playing NZ soon,India is play Aus,England will be visiting Lanka and SA will visit Pakistan.

 

[FreakCricket]

This issue is very political in nature, the current situation doesn't allow for a bilateral series any time soon not in this century for sure. Modi and Bakhts have totally change the dynamics and playing with Pakistan will means total 360 of their policy. There's literal genocide happening in India against Muslims and playing with Pakistan is out of the equation totally, brining up a post like this is a total dream. For the Current Government, any association with Pakistan is a sin.

 

[Rana]

When things resume normally (15-20 years later), I’m sure both boards can organise a masters India Pakistan series and let Babar and Kohli play against each other as old men aged 50 odd

 

[shamaan]

In your view who are pakistani batsmen who are better than Kohli?

Miadad and younis

 

[tyron_woodley]

Miadad and younis

Maindad perhaps.
Younis no. Younis never performed in any match Saving innings in Australia or south Africa. He performed only in England and n.z

 

[Hitman]

Miadad and younis

That's all I got to say. Miandad with an average of 29 against the West Indies isn't half as good as Kohli.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Miadad andyounis

Kohli is a million miles away from these two in LOIs.

In tests Kohli has already left Younis behind and is equal to Miandad.

Overall he is comfortably ahead of both.

When the debate of the best batsman of any era comes Kohli's name crops up for the present era.

No one talks about Younis or Miandad in those terms.

 

[shamaan]

That's all I got to say. Miandad with an average of 29 against the West Indies isn't half as good as Kohli.

Kohli averages 77 against sri lanka his highest average
Miadad averages 79 aganist new Zealand

Also averages 67 against the great Indian team

The 6 he hit against india was the greatest shot played by a Bateman
You think this ara is harder to score runs than that era



Miadad averages 67 against the great indian team

 

[shamaan]

Kohli is a million miles away from these two in LOIs.

In tests Kohli has already left Younis behind and is equal to Miandad.

Overall he is comfortably ahead of both.

When the debate of the best batsman of any era comes Kohli's name crops up for the present era.

No one talks about Younis or Miandad in those terms.

Yeah becouse their lot less best bateaman in this era no doubt he is best in this era but would he have been in miadad era

 

[Mamoon]

Now now pumpkin. Don't divert you know exactly what I was calling you out on. Swerving the debate by casually changing the focus from change in conditions to star status - classic sophist. No need to parrot the obvious: Kohli is comfortably by some margin better than most batsman produced by us by some margin, doesn't take a genius to work that one out. When it comes to pre 2000 we just cant say how much better he was than our 90s bunch or even vs the Indian 90s line up because the conditions are so different. Night night.

Kohli is comfortably better than any batsman we have ever produced. This includes the batsmen from 90’s, 80’s and before that.

As far as conditions are concerned, I have already given the example of the 2018 Test series in South Africa, which was played on one of the most bowling-friendly pitches in history.

It is the only series ever where every single wicket in every single innings fell, and they way Kohli battled against a bowling attack of Steyn, Philander, Rabada and Morkel and proved himself to be a level above every other batsman including de Villiers is all the proof anyone needs about his ability and class to handle tough conditions against lethal bowlers.

Besides, as far as the conditions are concerned, if you want to downplay Kohli because he apparently plays in easier batting conditions (not true, but let’s play along) then are you will to apply the same logic to today’s bowlers as well?

I will agree with you that Kohli is inferior to Inzamam and Miandad because he is batting in easier conditions if you agree that Boult and Bumrah are better than Wasim and Waqar because they are bowling in tougher conditions.

But people who keep downplaying modern batsmen do not have the courage to apply their own logic to bowlers.

As I said before, you do not need to get into the conditions and different eras debate to come to the conclusion that Kohli is far superior to any batsman Pakistan has ever produced. This includes Miandad, Hanif, Zaheer, Majid, Saleem, Inzamam, Yousuf and Younis.

He is a better batsman than every single one of them. Anyway, it is not a shame to be inferior to Kohli because he is elite among the elites. As a batsman, he is in the same class as the likes of Tendulkar, Lara, Sir Viv, Ponting, Greg Chappell etc.

No Pakistani batsman so far has reached that level.

 

[Hyperion66]

Miadad and younis

Don't say this out loud, people would stop taking you seriously.

 

[Mamoon]

Kohli is a million miles away from these two in LOIs.

In tests Kohli has already left Younis behind and is equal to Miandad.

Overall he is comfortably ahead of both.

When the debate of the best batsman of any era comes Kohli's name crops up for the present era.

No one talks about Younis or Miandad in those terms.

Kohli has also left Miandad behind in Tests. Miandad benefited greatly from biased home umpiring. He rarely, if ever, got LBW in Pakistan.

In this era of neutral umpiring and DRS, his average would have been lower.

Miandad is by far the greatest Pakistani batsman, but he is still a level below Kohli and the other batsmen in his league that I mentioned in my previous post.

 

[Mamoon]

Inzamam has 1 century in 100+ innings against Australia and South Africa, and people are arguing that he was better than Kohli.

Inzamam at his peak would have been a walking wicket against Rabada, Steyn, Philander and Morkel in the 2018 series where Kohli scored 270+ runs at an average of 47.

Inzamam wouldn’t have averaged more than 30 on those pitches against those bowlers.

The level of delusion and denial among our fans is both laughable and pitiful.

 

[Hyperion66]

I will agree with you that Kohli is inferior to Inzamam and Miandad because he is batting in easier conditions if you agree that Boult and Bumrah are better than Wasim and Waqar because they are bowling in tougher conditions.

But people who keep downplaying modern batsmen do not have the courage to apply their own logic to bowlers.

Game, set, match.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

Game, set, match.

I agree Kohli is superior. That being said, if anyone is interested a certain cricket article-publishing entity that I can’t mention did an analysis on the top ODI bowlers of all time recently, it’s worth a read if anyone is interested. It incorporates factors like era, toughness of opposition and tracks etc.

The all-time rankings were:

1. Glenn McGrath
2. Muttiah Muralitharan
3. Wasim Akram
4. Brett Lee
5. Joel Garner
6. Mitchell Starc
7. Chaminda Vaas
8. Shaun Pollock
9. Shane Bond
10. Trent Boult
11. Waqar Younis
12. Jasprit Bumrah
13. Saeed Ajmal

The methodology was very comprehensive and includes tournament victories too, among other things like balls per wicket, bowling average, economy, performances in winning matches versus losing causes, longevity and consistency versus impact etc.

 

[MHN1293]

I agree Kohli is superior. That being said, if anyone is interested a certain cricket article-publishing entity that I can’t mention did an analysis on the top ODI bowlers of all time recently, it’s worth a read if anyone is interested. It incorporates factors like era, toughness of opposition and tracks etc.

The all-time rankings were:

1. Glenn McGrath
2. Muttiah Muralitharan
3. Wasim Akram
4. Brett Lee
5. Joel Garner
6. Mitchell Starc
7. Chaminda Vaas
8. Shaun Pollock
9. Shane Bond
10. Trent Boult
11. Waqar Younis
12. Jasprit Bumrah
13. Saeed Ajmal

The methodology was very comprehensive and includes tournament victories too, among other things like balls per wicket, bowling average, economy, performances in winning matches versus losing causes, longevity and consistency versus impact etc.

Is there a similar article present for batsmen. Would love to view the corresponding rankings for batsmen.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Kohli averages 77 against sri lanka his highest average
Miadad averages 79 aganist new Zealand

Also averages 67 against the great Indian team

The 6 he hit against india was the greatest shot played by a Bateman
You think this ara is harder to score runs than that era



Miadad averages 67 against the great indian team

That was a weak awfully poor Indian side that he averages 67 against.
India were a poor team in 80s and 90s.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

Is there a similar article present for batsmen. Would love to view the corresponding rankings for batsmen.

There isn’t. They did an an analysis using a few metrics but nowhere near as detailed as the above bowlers list. They later admitted that the batting analysis was flawed, but you can go check it out if you want.

 

[Hyperion66]

I agree Kohli is superior. That being said, if anyone is interested a certain cricket article-publishing entity that I can’t mention did an analysis on the top ODI bowlers of all time recently, it’s worth a read if anyone is interested. It incorporates factors like era, toughness of opposition and tracks etc.

The all-time rankings were:

1. Glenn McGrath
2. Muttiah Muralitharan
3. Wasim Akram
4. Brett Lee
5. Joel Garner
6. Mitchell Starc
7. Chaminda Vaas
8. Shaun Pollock
9. Shane Bond
10. Trent Boult
11. Waqar Younis
12. Jasprit Bumrah
13. Saeed Ajmal

The methodology was very comprehensive and includes tournament victories too, among other things like balls per wicket, bowling average, economy, performances in winning matches versus losing causes, longevity and consistency versus impact etc.

Thanks for this post. Very informative. I actually find myself in agreement with the list, except that I just can not place Vaas that high over Younis, Bond and Pollock, I understand this is strictly an ODI based ranking and based on stats and numbers but figures are not always the truest representation of ability. Also I would put Ajmal higher as well, I personally think his records are tainted due to his dodgy action but it is the ICC that allowed him ball and did not contemplate making his numbers invalid so who am I to judge? Dude was a bigger match winner than most of the big names listed here.

 

[chacha kashmiri]

We found him out in the icc champions trophy
He was out on back to back balls

Our left arm seamers will have him constantly fishing outside his off stump

 

[Thunderbolt14]

Thanks for this post. Very informative. I actually find myself in agreement with the list, except that I just can not place Vaas that high over Younis, Bond and Pollock, I understand this is strictly an ODI based ranking and based on stats and numbers but figures are not always the truest representation of ability. Also I would put Ajmal higher as well, I personally think his records are tainted due to his dodgy action but it is the ICC that allowed him ball and did not contemplate making his numbers invalid so who am I to judge? Dude was a bigger match winner than most of the big names listed here.

I agree that Ajmal is underrated, but I simply can’t find a place for him over anyone else in this list. Who would you demote? I think he’s actually placed quite well, and that’s exactly where he should be.

I actually really like this list, it’s quite, quite beautiful just how it merges quantitative data in such a way that it’s subjectively very appealing to the viewer. It “intuitively” just feels right.

 

[Mamoon]

We found him out in the icc champions trophy
He was out on back to back balls

Our left arm seamers will have him constantly fishing outside his off stump

Yeah, we also “found out” Rohit and Dhawan before they thrashed us twice in the UAE in the Asia Cup pretty much on their own.

If the Asia Cup didn’t happen, not in a million years would Pakistani fans believe that India would crush us twice in UAE without Kohli.

No contemporary Pakistani bowler is good enough to dominate Kohli and stop him from scoring runs over the course of a series in any format.

Pakistani fans are as usual living in deep denial and in a world of their own.

And yes I remember Junaid having his number in the 2012-13 ODI series.

 

[Mamoon]

Chuckers like Muralitharan and Ajmal do not deserve to be recognized.

In my mind, neither of the two ever existed and their records have no relevance to me.

I consider Warne to be the leading Test wicket-taker and Wasim to be the leading ODI wicket-taker.

 

[chacha kashmiri]

Yeah, we also “found out” Rohit and Dhawan before they thrashed us twice in the UAE in the Asia Cup pretty much on their own.

If the Asia Cup didn’t happen, not in a million years would Pakistani fans believe that India would crush us twice in UAE without Kohli.

No contemporary Pakistani bowler is good enough to dominate Kohli and stop him from scoring runs over the course of a series in any format.

Pakistani fans are as usual living in deep denial and in a world of their own.

And yes I remember Junaid having his number in the 2012-13 ODI series.

We were unstoppable with junaid and hasan ali
It's still why India won't play us unless it's world Cup game

 

[Mesozoic]

We were unstoppable with junaid and hasan ali
It's still why India won't play us unless it's world Cup game

Hum ko maalum hain haqiqat ...... lekin dil ke khush rakhne ko ghalib, ye khayaal achha hain

 

[Mamoon]

We were unstoppable with junaid and hasan ali
It's still why India won't play us unless it's world Cup game

I see.

 

[Rajdeep]

We found him out in the icc champions trophy
He was out on back to back balls

Our left arm seamers will have him constantly fishing outside his off stump

So why couldnt your left arm seamers stopped him from scoring in WC 2019 game? That was after CT finals, no?

Or is it for some Pak fans time is still stuck June 2017?

Also, if your seamers only found out in 2017 that Kohli has weakness in 5th stump line, they must have been living inside a cave for so long.

 

[syedahsan]

Bringing out the best when these two sides meet

Its about a sportsman accomplishment. When did I say Virat was not talented or needed recognition. What would he know about India Pakistan test match when he has not played one. When Gavaskar Bedi Kapil dev prasanna maninder singh shastri would talk, Viral will have nothing to say forget about adding anything to it. To say that Pakistan team would have been easily rolled over by India should be considered foolish. Same Pakistan rolled India in Champions trophy and almost got into a winning mode in the last 50 over world cup , unfortunately the heavy los against the West Indies cost Pakistan the semi final birth.

I am talking about bringing out the best when they play each other. One day game was just an example. India Pakistan matches become interesting. India might win test matches or series but every session to the end could be competitive. The pressure , the feel for the game on the players is just beyond comprehension. As far as Pakistani loss is concerned it won't be the first time. They lost miserably in 1982 under Asif Iqbal in India. NO team is there to stay as a top team forever . Its a cycle. How many times did a weak English team played against Warne McGrath's Australia and faced whitewash. Did that decreased the excitement or did not want the series just because England will be easily rolled over? Just ask the crowd or the players if that series made it easy on them knowing what the likely result would be.

 

[syedahsan]

Bringing out the best when these two sides meet

The thread is about tests. Even if Pakistan was the ODI world cup champion, it will still be irrelevant.

I am talking about bringing out the best when they play each other. One day game was just an example. India Pakistan matches become interesting. India might win test matches or series but every session to the end could be competitive. The pressure , the feel for the game on the players is just beyond comprehension. As far as Pakistani loss is concerned it won't be the first time. They lost miserably in 1982 under Asif Iqbal in India. NO team is there to stay as a top team forever . Its a cycle. How many times did a weak English team played against Warne McGrath's Australia and faced whitewash. Did that decreased the excitement or did not want the series just because England will be easily rolled over? Just ask the crowd or the players if that series made it easy on them knowing what the likely result would be.

 

[Smbhayi]

Virat must be happy not playing in Pakistan. Naseem would have put fear in his eyes and made him his bunny.

........and shiver his legs...

 

[Rajdeep]

We were unstoppable with junaid and hasan ali
It's still why India won't play us unless it's world Cup game

I find these kind of posts fascinating.

Yesterday brother [MENTION=151892]Thunderbolt14[/MENTION] claimed that Sachin was scared of facing 2 Ws and hence India didnt play any tests with Pakistan in 90s.

Today I am hearing BCCI dont play Pak because Kohli is scared of facing Juniad Khan and Hasan Ali.

Then your PM once famously said, how Indian captains used to be scared going out for toss with him.

It appears to me, generations of Indian players are scared of their Pakistani counterparts. I am no halloween fan but going by these evidences Pak team is very spooky indeed.

 

[Artaxerxes]

Chuckers like Muralitharan and Ajmal do not deserve to be recognized.

In my mind, neither of the two ever existed and their records have no relevance to me.

I consider Warne to be the leading Test wicket-taker and Wasim to be the leading ODI wicket-taker.

I agree.Bumrah is also a chucker and should not be in the list.

 

[Mamoon]

I agree.Bumrah is also a chucker and should not be in the list.

He has hyper-extension. That is not chucking.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

I find these kind of posts fascinating.

Yesterday brother [MENTION=151892]Thunderbolt14[/MENTION] claimed that Sachin was scared of facing 2 Ws and hence India didnt play any tests with Pakistan in 90s.

Today I am hearing BCCI dont play Pak because Kohli is scared of facing Juniad Khan and Hasan Ali.

Then your PM once famously said, how Indian captains used to be scared going out for toss with him.

It appears to me, generations of Indian players are scared of their Pakistani counterparts. I am no halloween fan but going by these evidences Pak team is very spooky indeed.

If it so pleases you, kindly avoid putting words in my mouth. No one ever said Sachin was afraid of Wasim and Waqar; I have the utmost respect for Sachin and he is one of my favorite batsmen. If you want to put words in someone’s mouth, do it to someone who is less likely to call you out on it.

My statement was that Sachin dodged the two at their peaks, for almost an entire decade. That is fact, and not up for debate.

It obviously does not diminish Sachin’s legacy - he remains one of the greatest batsmen ever in my eyes. However, that battle will always remain a figment of both your imagination and mine. That is disappointing to any cricket lover. If not for these politics, the cricket of that era would have been some of the most closely contested and entertaining between any two cricketing nations to have ever played the game. That is the only regret I have, and many others who genuinely love cricket will have this same regret too.

Unfortunately, not all people are interested in the game like that. Just today I opened up social media to see the comments under ICC’s post about Babar’s injury. Thousands of Indians insulting him - this kind of attitude is nauseating.

As far as I personally go, I believe respect should always be given where it is due and Kohli is another of my all-time favorite batsmen. Even if he would have dominated Yasir Shah, it is a battle I for one will always regret not being able to watch, just as I regret never being able to watch Tendulkar battle with Akram and Younis at their peaks - whether Tendulkar would end up dominating them or not. That’s not the point.

The truth is, these days it’s very easy for posters like yourself to act all high and mighty because of India’s (deserved) dominance of this era. It’s when the going gets tough that you have nowhere to go - most will desert a failing Indian team, let alone those who remain and appreciate other teams despite their own team failing, like many Pakistanis like myself do of Indian players.

For that reason, I count you exceedingly lucky - you are unlikely to ever witness the Indian team reach the lows of Pakistan cricket, in your lifetime. I’m very happy for you. God forbid you ever become bitter and stop appreciating cricket the way you do today.

 

[Rajdeep]

If it so pleases you, kindly avoid putting words in my mouth. No one ever said Sachin was afraid of Wasim and Waqar; I have the utmost respect for Sachin and he is one of my favorite batsmen. If you want to put words in someone’s mouth, do it to someone who is less likely to call you out on it.

My statement was that Sachin dodged the two at their peaks, for almost an entire decade. That is fact, and not up for debate.

It obviously does not diminish Sachin’s legacy - he remains one of the greatest batsmen ever in my eyes. However, that battle will always remain a figment of both your imagination and mine. That is disappointing to any cricket lover. If not for these politics, the cricket of that era would have been some of the most closely contested and entertaining between any two cricketing nations to have ever played the game. That is the only regret I have, and many others who genuinely love cricket will have this same regret too.

Unfortunately, not all people are interested in the game like that. Just today I opened up social media to see the comments under ICC’s post about Babar’s injury. Thousands of Indians insulting him - this kind of attitude is nauseating.

As far as I personally go, I believe respect should always be given where it is due and Kohli is another of my all-time favorite batsmen. Even if he would have dominated Yasir Shah, it is a battle I for one will always regret not being able to watch, just as I regret never being able to watch Tendulkar battle with Akram and Younis at their peaks - whether Tendulkar would end up dominating them or not. That’s not the point.

The truth is, these days it’s very easy for posters like yourself to act all high and mighty because of India’s (deserved) dominance of this era. It’s when the going gets tough that you have nowhere to go - most will desert a failing Indian team, let alone those who remain and appreciate other teams despite their own team failing, like many Pakistanis like myself do of Indian players.

For that reason, I count you exceedingly lucky - you are unlikely to ever witness the Indian team reach the lows of Pakistan cricket, in your lifetime. I’m very happy for you. God forbid you ever become bitter and stop appreciating cricket the way you do today.

How did Sachin dodged playing two Ws their peak though? India and Pak didnt play much bilateral cricket in 90s and I will let you find out the reason why....what happened in 89 India tour of Pakistan and why BCCI took such stance etc. But it was the decision by the board to avoid playing with Pakistan. How did Sachin dodge? He can only play what is put up infront of him. Also, would you not agree many Pak fans and player alike claimed that Sachin was scared of facing them...didnt Akhtar wrote in his book that he saw Sachin's legs were shaking in fear...lol.

 

[MHN1293]

At the end of kohlis career he or his fans would not care if he dominated other weak teams such as srilanka or west indies. However even now ask any indian whether they would bare a loss to westindies or instead pakistan and they will chose westindies. Ask them whether they would want to thrash pakistan or instead thrash srilanka they would chose pakistan. It wont affect kohlis batting legacy that he could not face one of the weakest pakistani lineup but he will surely regret not being able to single handedly win a match against one of indias biggest rivals or score double centuries for fun against pak in their own backyard. Preformances of someone like miandad hitting a last ball 6 are still remembered by fans even though it came against a weak indian team. Many preformances of indian cricketers that led india to wins against pak and are also still remebered. Similar to how ben stokes hasnt exactly dominated austrailia through the years but in the end he will still be remembered for his one legendary preformance in 2019 that saved england from an ashes series loss.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

How did Sachin dodged playing two Ws their peak though? India and Pak didnt play much bilateral cricket in 90s and I will let you find out the reason why....what happened in 89 India tour of Pakistan and why BCCI took such stance etc. But it was the decision by the board to avoid playing with Pakistan. How did Sachin dodge? He can only play what is put up infront of him. Also, would you not agree many Pak fans and player alike claimed that Sachin was scared of facing them...didnt Akhtar wrote in his book that he saw Sachin's legs were shaking in fear...lol.

Sachin did not deliberately dodge them. To interpret that from what I said is wrong - it’s not his fault he couldn’t play against them. But he didn’t, and that’s a regret.

As far as Akhtar goes, do you really read into that headline-grabbing masala? It worked very well too, I remember Shoaib got invited on all the Indian channels after that. Now he has 2.3 million subscribers on YouTube.

 

[Artaxerxes]

He has hyper-extension. That is not chucking.

He got away with chucking because he is from India.Had he been from Pakistan,Sri Lanka or
Bangladesh the umpires would have called him and sent for biomechanical tests.

 

[Ashraful_Rox]

Sachin did not deliberately dodge them. To interpret that from what I said is wrong - it’s not his fault he couldn’t play against them. But he didn’t, and that’s a regret.

As far as Akhtar goes, do you really read into that headline-grabbing masala? It worked very well too, I remember Shoaib got invited on all the Indian channels after that. Now he has 2.3 million subscribers on YouTube.

But if you remember when Sachin faced Akhtar the first time, his balls and whole body was trembling and he got out first bowled, middle stump I remember that day as I watched it live

 

[tyron_woodley]

If it so pleases you, kindly avoid putting words in my mouth. No one ever said Sachin was afraid of Wasim and Waqar; I have the utmost respect for Sachin and he is one of my favorite batsmen. If you want to put words in someone’s mouth, do it to someone who is less likely to call you out on it.

My statement was that Sachin dodged the two at their peaks, for almost an entire decade. That is fact, and not up for debate.

It obviously does not diminish Sachin’s legacy - he remains one of the greatest batsmen ever in my eyes. However, that battle will always remain a figment of both your imagination and mine. That is disappointing to any cricket lover. If not for these politics, the cricket of that era would have been some of the most closely contested and entertaining between any two cricketing nations to have ever played the game. That is the only regret I have, and many others who genuinely love cricket will have this same regret too.

Unfortunately, not all people are interested in the game like that. Just today I opened up social media to see the comments under ICC’s post about Babar’s injury. Thousands of Indians insulting him - this kind of attitude is nauseating.

As far as I personally go, I believe respect should always be given where it is due and Kohli is another of my all-time favorite batsmen. Even if he would have dominated Yasir Shah, it is a battle I for one will always regret not being able to watch, just as I regret never being able to watch Tendulkar battle with Akram and Younis at their peaks - whether Tendulkar would end up dominating them or not. That’s not the point.

The truth is, these days it’s very easy for posters like yourself to act all high and mighty because of India’s (deserved) dominance of this era. It’s when the going gets tough that you have nowhere to go - most will desert a failing Indian team, let alone those who remain and appreciate other teams despite their own team failing, like many Pakistanis like myself do of Indian players.

For that reason, I count you exceedingly lucky - you are unlikely to ever witness the Indian team reach the lows of Pakistan cricket, in your lifetime. I’m very happy for you. God forbid you ever become bitter and stop appreciating cricket the way you do today.

Yea maybe this applies to fake Indian fans. Bewda fans

Not me. I still watched us get spanked in 2011-2012 with past prime players. Nothing would faze me. I am a die hard supporter. Hell I would die for my country if I were an Indian cricketer.

Even if we languish near the bottom, I would never desert my team

Hell I support aC Milan. We have been awful for 7 years yet I supported them all the way. Now we are turning things around and sit at the top of the table. I got used to medicoirty for a little while but now the way we are playing this season makes me believe we would finish top 4 for the first time in 7 years.