A sad truth but Pakistan's Cricket is heading in the same direction as Hockey in the country

[Sarwar89]

No one is going to agree with me, but I have reached a conclusion that just like our Hockey Team, our Cricket team is heading towards same direction.

Unfortunately Hockey team was completely neglected, they never got funds and players never got decent salaries or job security, so atleast Hockey team has a very Valid reason that they were never supported fully by Government or PHF due to lack of funds.

But Cricketers have no excuse at all. They are earning decent income via PSL and decent contracts by PCB plus safe jobs in various departments. PCB is financially much better than PHF. Yet despite all media attention hype and documentaries on them, they have produced batting collapse after collapse in dozen Test matches.

In last 1 year this team has lost 2 Home Series, is going to get white washed in South Africa, got hammered in Asia Cup by India in 2 complete one sided matches. Failed to chase 136 against Sri lanka in 2017 Test. Despite taking 74 run lead in Abu Dhabi twice, they lost at home.

I for once think that if this much money time and effort by Government was spent on Hockey they would have flourished. After all Our Hockey team won 4 world cups while Cricket team has generally under achieved since 1952 ( given the amount of resources they have been given).

They have not won a 50 over world cup since the days of Imran khan who is almost 66 years old now. Their Test cricket is going from bad to worse. I am not even mentioning their 2016 tours to Aus/Nzl where we lost 5-0.

With these performances no big Team will take pakistan seriously, instead they will limit us to 2 tests and 1-2 T20’s.

Doing well in T20 suggests that direction of Pakistan cricket and team players is focused on money. Since T20 generates money. Here credit shall be given to India Aus Nzl Saffers, they have atleast not neglected Test cricket.

Pakistan West Indies and Sri lanka are in complete decline and that is not good for sport.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

No, we're competing really well in South Africa with one of our main bats and our best test bowler out.

 

[Sarwar89]

No, we're competing really well in South Africa with one of our main bats and our best test bowler out.

Against New zealand these two
Players played. Still lost the series. That too at home. Competing in South Africa ? Unable to score 200 in both innings.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Against New zealand these two
Players played. Still lost the series. That too at home. Competing in South Africa ? Unable to score 200 in both innings.

We lost the series against NZ because we didn't play a genuine second spinner, instead opted for pseudo, good for nothing, all rounder just because he's an offspinner. We had many opportunities to bury NZ but Asif in those moments offered nothing and allowed NZ to come back in the game.

 

[Sarwar89]

No, we're competing really well in South Africa with one of our main bats and our best test bowler out.

We lost the series against NZ because we didn't play a genuine second spinner, instead opted for pseudo, good for nothing, all rounder just because he's an offspinner. We had many opportunities to bury NZ but Asif in those moments offered nothing and allowed NZ to come back in the game.

And any excuse about Test Series home loss against Sri lanka, target 136, could not chase it. Or 5 consecutive Test losses in Aus/Nzl during last Sena tour. This will be 6th loss in SENA. 6 out of 6.

 

[Minnowbasher]

Wrist slitting has started on day 2 of the first test of a long full series against a strong team away from home. Good start.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

And any excuse about Test Series home loss against Sri lanka, target 136, could not chase it. Or 5 consecutive Test losses in Aus/Nzl during last Sena tour. This will be 6th loss in SENA. 6 out of 6.

SENA losses were due to poor planning from Misbah. You cannot compare the two, this is a totally different team.

Sri Lanka was the first series for an inexperienced team and again did not play two genuine spinners.

 

[Major]

no its not.

stop over reacting

Pakistan is an avg test team. Not too good, but not too bad either

 

[Pete Rose]

A tad melodramatic

 

[Sarwar89]

No, we're competing really well in South Africa with one of our main bats and our best test bowler out.

We lost the series against NZ because we didn't play a genuine second spinner, instead opted for pseudo, good for nothing, all rounder just because he's an offspinner. We had many opportunities to bury NZ but Asif in those moments offered nothing and allowed NZ to come back in the game.

SENA losses were due to poor planning from Misbah. You cannot compare the two, this is a totally different team.

Sri Lanka was the first series for an inexperienced team and again did not play two genuine spinners.

And any excuse for disaster in Asia cup at home in uae 2018 ?

 

[Chief Destroyer]

And any excuse for disaster in Asia cup at home in uae 2018 ?

It wasn't a disaster because we learned from it and bounced back against NZ.

 

[Sarwar89]

No, we're competing really well in South Africa with one of our main bats and our best test bowler out.

We lost the series against NZ because we didn't play a genuine second spinner, instead opted for pseudo, good for nothing, all rounder just because he's an offspinner. We had many opportunities to bury NZ but Asif in those moments offered nothing and allowed NZ to come back in the game.

SENA losses were due to poor planning from Misbah. You cannot compare the two, this is a totally different team.

Sri Lanka was the first series for an inexperienced team and again did not play two genuine spinners.

It wasn't a disaster because we learned from it and bounced back against NZ.

Bounced back via losing Home Test Series against New zealand ?

 

[Sarwar89]

A reality check. People will realize it as time goes by.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Bounced back via losing Home Test Series against New zealand ?

Asia Cup was in ODI format as far as I know.

 

[Sarwar89]

No, we're competing really well in South Africa with one of our main bats and our best test bowler out.

We lost the series against NZ because we didn't play a genuine second spinner, instead opted for pseudo, good for nothing, all rounder just because he's an offspinner. We had many opportunities to bury NZ but Asif in those moments offered nothing and allowed NZ to come back in the game.

SENA losses were due to poor planning from Misbah. You cannot compare the two, this is a totally different team.

Sri Lanka was the first series for an inexperienced team and again did not play two genuine spinners.

It wasn't a disaster because we learned from it and bounced back against NZ.

Asia Cup was in ODI format as far as I know.

They failed to win Asia Cup at home and Test Series at Home against Sri lanka and Nzl. Disaster in both formats. And 3-0 in South Africa as well. The way our collapses in batting are happening.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

They failed to win Asia Cup at home and Test Series at Home against Sri lanka and Nzl. Disaster in both formats. And 3-0 in South Africa as well. The way our collapses in batting are happening.

Go drink some water and take a walk.

 

[Mamoon]

It will not go the hockey way because the public interest will not die, but yes we will never be a top team again.

 

[Sarwar89]

Dear Mamoon,

Object of sport is to be top team. In English Premier league in England, teams which finish 2nd or 3rd specially Man City Man utd are never happy. They want Number 1 spot.

Fighting spirit determination desire needed. I do not see it in this team sadly.

 

[Abdullah]

We need to let Mickey get on with the job and too hell with the seniority culture.
Then we are there.
People saying we are never going to be a top team are just sad, (and I hope they don't talk like that to their children if there children are not geniuses).
We got into positions to win EVERY ONE OF OUR LAST 6 TEST MATCHES COMFORTABLY AND BURY THE OPPOSITION BE IT HOME OR AWAY, BATTING FIRST OR BATTING LAST, WINNING TOSS OR LOSING TOSS AGAINST DECENT TEAMS, and the reason we didn't is because of "seniors"
So l genuinely believe we have building blocks in place on this test team.
Unfortunately there are a few road blocks too and our media is going to make it messy if Mickey tries to kick a few of them out to end this seniority culture

 

[Mamoon]

Dear Mamoon,

Object of sport is to be top team. In English Premier league in England, teams which finish 2nd or 3rd specially Man City Man utd are never happy. They want Number 1 spot.

Fighting spirit determination desire needed. I do not see it in this team sadly.

Pakistan cricket stinks of mediocrity and that is not going to change. Our cricket is a reflection of the state of the country. This country has no future and neither does its cricket.

However, since it is the only sport that people are truly passionate about, it is not going to fade away like hockey. We will play but we will continue to be rubbish at it, with an odd fluke win here and there which we will milk to the last drop.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Hockey was neglected, because it's not a big sport. Public interest in cricket will never die. This team is inexperienced and will take a lot of time to become consistent. Pakistan teams in the past, with all our stars, did jack in SENA aswell. People go on and on about the missed chances in Hobart Test '99, but they forget we got bashed rather spectacularly in the other two tests. A middle-order of Inzi, YK and MoYo couldn't stop us from getting humiliated at Perth in 2004, when McGrath took 8 wickets and bowled us out for 72. Similarly, in South Africa we have been rubbish throughout our history. Our superstars couldn't get us a series win in the West Indies, till Misbah's team finally achieved that in 2016. Our superstars lost a home series to Zimbabwe, who were good but not that good. Our superstars consistently choked in tournaments and got knocked out at crucial stages. And I'm sure we had our fair share of this rubbish even before the 90s.

Why are you holding this young team to such a high standard, when your cricketing history has had under-performing teams even with its best players? I'm as frustrated as you mate, but I don't believe all the doom and gloom. We have a lot of issues at the moment, but do remember this team with its inexperience has already performed better than Misbah's team did in 2013, in two days of cricket. They have given South Africa as good a game as the number one team in the world did last year. Give the young players, weed out the rubbish and hope they go on to become a consistent side one day.

 

[Sarwar89]

Abdullah,

If you do not mind I want to mention that batting collapses in Tests for Pakistan started way back in 2016. Edgbaston Test where despite a 100 run lead We lost.

It carried on towards Hamilton and MCG and then followed in these Sri lanka Nzl
And South Africa series.,

Mickey has not addressed these issues for 2.5 years. When Seniors perform then juniors dont do it. Or Vice Versa. When juniors perform then seniors add nothing.

Somewhere in the line Mickey has not done a good job in Tests at all.

 

[Sarwar89]

agreed with you @ Mamoon. Well
Said.

 

[Mp812]

A test series with Indians is need of hour to lift morale

 

[Sarwar89]

@ Usman Chadda.

Pakistan only lost 1 Home Test Series between 1969-1995. In 26 years only 1 Test series loss tht too a narrow 0-1 in 1980.

In 1980’s pakistan won away test series in India England Nzl and they carried out this in 1990’s winning away test series in England Nzl Zimbabwe. Drew 1-1 in 1998 in South Africa. Reached 2 world cup finals in 1990’s. Won ICC Test championship in 1999. And won two Away Tests in India in 1999. They did ok.

But current team is not that young. Asad Azhar are in mid 30’s. Yasir is 33.

 

[Usman Chadda]

@ Usman Chadda.

Pakistan only lost 1 Home Test Series between 1969-1995. In 26 years only 1 Test series loss tht too a narrow 0-1 in 1980.

In 1980’s pakistan won away test series in India England Nzl and they carried out this in 1990’s winning away test series in England Nzl Zimbabwe. Drew 1-1 in 1998 in South Africa. Reached 2 world cup finals in 1990’s. Won ICC Test championship in 1999. And won two Away Tests in India in 1999. They did ok.

But current team is not that young. Asad Azhar are in mid 30’s. Yasir is 33.

New Zealand and India were rubbish teams throughout the 90s. So I wouldn't really count them as decent opposition. They did have the odd win here and there, but they were really bad on a consistent basis.

Pakistan was able to draw the first test match in 98 against South Africa because of a freak Azhar Mahmood century and rain on day 4. Otherwise, our superstars were 100 odd for 5 staring at 364 from South Africa. They played really well in the second Test to win it, again thanks to Azhar Mahmood (considering they were 89/5 on the first morning of the test). Then reality hit, and they got embarrassed in the last test by 250 runs. That was one of our strongest teams in history to visit SENA. Australian tours I really don't need to say much. Infact, did you know Australia humiliated our superstars in Pakistan by an innings, the last time they toured Pakistan? That was a budding Aussie team, known to not like touring Pakistan. The current team has been as good in England, specially the dominant first Test win earlier this year.

The point is, that this is an inexperienced side. Yes Azhar and Shafiq have played a combined total of 100-odd tests, but look around them. Pretty much everyone is a noob. They have a struggling captain, on top of all this. You have to give the likes of Babar Haris, Fakhar, Imam facepalm, Hasan, Shaheen, Abbas, and even Amir, some time. They might not make you the best team in the world in the future, but they can be good enough to make us a decent team. There are a number of issues with Pakistan cricket at the moment. Every other cricketing nation has surged ahead in-terms of professionalism, but ours continues to be stuck in the same rut as the 90s. The fact that our players still continue to give an okay account of themselves, despite these issues, proves that there is something to work with if we get our act together.

 

[rhony]

This is an over reaction. Many of you would be lying if you say you expected Pakistan to compete let alone be in a winning position (101/1) in SA after the way they played against NZ. This was an amazing performance by Pakistan. These are tricky pitches and the team was one good partnership away from winning. The game is still in balance and there are already many positives for Pak in this game.

 

[gazza619]

This is an over reaction. Many of you would be lying if you say you expected Pakistan to compete let alone be in a winning position (101/1) in SA after the way they played against NZ. This was an amazing performance by Pakistan. These are tricky pitches and the team was one good partnership away from winning. The game is still in balance and there are already many positives for Pak in this game.

Agreed. We played better than our test ranking.

 

[Savak]

It will not go the hockey way because the public interest will not die, but yes we will never be a top team again.

The later is not true either. Every team has its ups and downs, an era comes when there are so many special talents available, 4-5 match winners available in one team at their peaks at the same time and another era comes when you can't find a single player. Even India after the likes of Dhawan, Sharma and Kohli go will have plenty of questions to answer. Look at Australia right now.

Today International Cricket is not being played in Pakistan but a time will come when International Cricket will return to Pakistan, where we will play ten years worth of home series in our country in front of jam packed stadiums and the PCB will earn Broad Cast deals of $200 million plus given that it enjoyed Broad cast deals of $140-150 million in 2003-2008

 

[Mirpur express]

overreaction lol litterly millions play the game everyday hence cricket will not go the hockey route

 

[Savak]

Pakistan as a nation is only 70 years old, Western Countries have existed for centuries and have had to go through the renaissance periods, world wars to be where they are today. It took the Pakistani nation 70 years to bring a party like PTI and a leader like Imran Khan to power, anyone who lived through the 90's where the PML-N and PPP looted and plundered the country like no tomorrow would never have imagined this happening.

If IK can get the country back on track, the benefits will flow through to Cricket as well. Look at India, look at their team, their economy in the 90's and look at the Indian team and Indian Cricketing infrastructure now with their billion dollar broadcast deals, with a player like Unadkat getting $2 million salaries in the IPL

 

[Savak]

I once remember trying to watch a hockey game in the late 90's. Pure snoozefest even though Pakistan won the game. There was zero interest in terms of spectators, sponsors and you could tell the players were just playing because out of pride, national patriotism but zero long term financial windfalls.

If you don't bring commercial sponsors into the sport, if you don't pump money in, if you don't make it worth someone's while to pursue a sport and convince him that it will compensate him way more than the opportunity cost of getting an education, getting a white collar office 9-5 job then you will not have youngsters lining up to take up the sport

 

[Savak]

This thread is a result of frustration at the lack of accountability in Pakistan Cricket. Azhar Ali, Asad Shafiq, Sarfaraz should be held to account after this series if they do not come to the party at all. You can't keep giving someone chances for ever i.e. 8 years plus and get zero return. Like Mickey Arthur once said, if you have been playing for a long time, you will be held to a higher standard i.e. winning games for your country otherwise you will make way and younger players will be invested in.

 

[ElRaja]

no, look at the psl. no domestic tournament in any sport has ever played pakistani cricketers so well. cricket will be alright, and what the psl has shown is if you set up domestic to be competitive, pak is good enough to produce a world class player every season or two. it may take 4 or 5 years, but once paks domestic cricket is sorted out pak will be a top tier team again.

also the analogy with hockey is poor as a fundamental change to the way the game was played created an vacuum in technical ability asian hockey never recovered from. pak batsmen are failing because their basics, the bread and butter technicalities of batting for the past 50, 75 years, are weak. it doesnt require rocket scientists to sort out.

 

[Cric_lover4487]

Truth be told test cricket is on its last legs. In this era of instant gratification, I don't see people watching cricket anymore in pan shops, barber shops etc. So don't take it seriously. Pakistan is still a top team in ODI/T20. Cheers !!

 

[Suleiman]

*Pakistan wins World Cup next year*

“Is this a golden age?”

 

[Zakaz]

A test series with Indians is need of hour to lift morale

How is getting smashed by India, out of all teams, gonna lift our morale?

 

[ali2220]

*Pakistan wins World Cup next year*

“Is this a golden age?”

It won't happen, but if it does, the response will be that it was a "fluke" by some posters!

 

[Buffet]

Pakistan is punching above it's weight and has a chance to win this test in SA. Why so doom and gloom?

Most posters were giving very little chance to Pakistan before this series. if not for collapse, it was a certain win. Also, Cricket is so popular in Pakistan and Pakistan is a huge country. Cricket is not going to die in Pakistan in near future.

 

[Sin Nombre]

How is getting smashed by India, out of all teams, gonna lift our morale?

Will raise interest in the game, and teams always play better against their rivals (if there is a base level difference).

 

[PakLFC]

We're standing still. Neither are we going backward or forward. Our batting is just not improving since the likes of Inzi, Younis and Yousaf retired.

 

[moghul]

No, we're competing really well in South Africa with one of our main bats and our best test bowler out.

And with a non playing captain.

 

[Bilal7]

Against New zealand these two
Players played. Still lost the series. That too at home. Competing in South Africa ? Unable to score 200 in both innings.

And? New Zealand is a fantastic team, arguably the best in the world along with England. Losing to them is not shameful and winning against them at home is not a given.

 

[MMHS]

To be honest, it’s not far better than hockey right now. Don’t get me wrong, this is not to mock PAK posters here, and I am well aware of the recent Hockey World Cup results.

But, we have to be logical & realistic here. First, cricket is a game seriously played by 10-12 countries and in half of them it’s a dying sports. Only 4 developed world countries play cricket seriously and still it’s probably not among top 4 sports there anymore. Out of 10-12 countries where cricket is played, 4 are from South Asia - comfortably world’s weakest sports zone having 25%+ of world’s population. Compared to that, Field Hockey is a professional sports in at least 20 sports developed countries - Germany, Holland, Australia, Spain, Canada, Argentina, Belgium, Poland, Ireland, Newzeland, France, England, SKorea, Japan, S Africa.... still, PAK is ranked 12th in Hockey, 7th in Test (6th in ODI as well, and 1st in T20, but I stick to the elite format). Also, recent WC win of Belgium suggests that outside traditional powers, game is expanding in other European countries.

2nd factor is, there is a major change in field hockey, in terms of playing surface, rules & regulations, which actually has gone against traditional hockey powers like PAK & IND. Apart from physical attributes (won’t go to details, but I haven’t seen any hockey game in last 10-12 years, it’s like computer games these days), game’s skill has changed, tactics has changed (like basketball- no off side!!!!), and the playing surface is completely different. To catch the top hockey teams now, more than skills what PAK Hockey needs is money - billions of it, to construct hockey specific fields for mass, for better conditioning of players and for better payment for every stake holders.

Considering the ground reality, I actually think PAK hockey team is out performing cricket team. I put it this way - didn’t see that 5-0 by Belgium, but it was indeed against eventual World Champs; compared to that PAK’s performance in Asia Cup, against an under strength India in PAK’s adopted home (where India didn’t play in 12 years), not to mention Shakib, Tamim less BD .... I think, Hockey team wasn’t that poor to be honest.

Having said that, I agree with Mamoon. Hockey is facing triple fold challenges - money (technology, payment, development), system (domestic tournament, incompetence of PHF), mass interest (for best talents to stick to hockey & mass people keep interest in the game). Cricket is facing only one major challenge - incompetence of PCB. It’s possible to revive the situation in 3-4 years time definitely, but not sure the “talent” or “superior genetics”, or “just a generation phasing issue” is the right way of thought process. Wasim Khan definitely has some real job at hand.

 

[Balthazar]

Pakistan are showing signs of improvement under Mickey. They have recently won CT and drew a Test series in England and now they are competing in SA. It's just that they need to come out of UAE and it's slow wickets. Only Indian team is able to dominate on such wickets.

 

[Sin Nombre]

Hockey can be improved quite quickly.

Even India with complete mismanagement are a solid top 6 team now, with very little to choose between teams ranked 3 to 7 in my opinion.

Pakistan are already showing signs of progress in field hockey.

 

[ali2220]

Ppl have no real interest in hockey, as such the game is nearly dead now.

 

[latecut]

There was a time, till 1980s, when India vs Pakistan cricket matches were considered showcase matches of hockey, the way India vs Pakistan cricket matches are now a days tried to be hyped as showcase matches of the cricket tournaments.

Both India and Pakistan have lost their primacy in hockey as hockey became a global game from being a game played seriously by just a few countries.

I cannot visualise cricket becoming a global game like hockey right now. So the subcontinental teams, whose achievements in other sports and games are nothing to write home about will continue to gloat about their cricketing achievement.

It is high time the people of the subcontinent look at other global games and try to improve their standards in those games instead of putting so much energy on just one game.

 

[moghul]

Pakistan's contribution to world cricket

1-neuteral umpires---------Imran Khan

2-Doosra------------Saqlain

3-Non-playing captain -----Sarfraz

 

[Sin Nombre]

India are pretty decent in hockey and only lost on penalties to Australia in the CT final earlier in the year. Won their group in the recently concluded WC as well.

That said, no one cares about field hockey. It is only a sport for girls in the Netherlands and not even amongst the top 5 sports in Australia.

 

[Zakaz]

India are pretty decent in hockey and only lost on penalties to Australia in the CT final earlier in the year. Won their group in the recently concluded WC as well.

That said, no one cares about field hockey. It is only a sport for girls in the Netherlands and not even amongst the top 5 sports in Australia.

well we are talking about Pakistan, no one cares about cricket either, out of the ten countries, even in Australia most people have lost interest in cricket. In Pakistan, what other sport people follow other than cricket? its squash and hockey because thats the only sports other than cricket that we are good at.

 

[Zakaz]

And? New Zealand is a fantastic team, arguably the best in the world along with England. Losing to them is not shameful and winning against them at home is not a given.

How is New Zealand the best team in the world? just because they beat us at home? so you would have called sri lanka the best team in the world as well after they beat us at home last year? These kiwis couldn't take a single wicket of kusal mendis or angelo matthews on day 5 pitch at home and they scored record partnership of unbeaten 274. Dont over glorify kiwis so much just because they beat us.

 

[Bilal7]

How is New Zealand the best team in the world? just because they beat us at home? so you would have called sri lanka the best team in the world as well after they beat us at home last year? These kiwis couldn't take a single wicket of kusal mendis or angelo matthews on day 5 pitch at home and they scored record partnership of unbeaten 274. Dont over glorify kiwis so much just because they beat us.

Once again, it is not impossible that a batsman of Matthews stature can draw his team a game overseas. New Zealand have arguably the best batsman in the world and arguably the best bowler in the world, along with a host of other good players.

 

[Mamoon]

The later is not true either. Every team has its ups and downs, an era comes when there are so many special talents available, 4-5 match winners available in one team at their peaks at the same time and another era comes when you can't find a single player. Even India after the likes of Dhawan, Sharma and Kohli go will have plenty of questions to answer. Look at Australia right now.

Today International Cricket is not being played in Pakistan but a time will come when International Cricket will return to Pakistan, where we will play ten years worth of home series in our country in front of jam packed stadiums and the PCB will earn Broad Cast deals of $200 million plus given that it enjoyed Broad cast deals of $140-150 million in 2003-2008

Pakistan’s cricket future depends on the future of the country. It is wishful thinking that Imran Khan or XYZ will put this country on track and make a difference etc.

I do not want to make this thread political, but we are a lost cause and it is only going to get worse for this country. Under such circumstances, you cannot expect cricket to grow.

 

[Zakaz]

Once again, it is not impossible that a batsman of Matthews stature can draw his team a game overseas. New Zealand have arguably the best batsman in the world and arguably the best bowler in the world, along with a host of other good players.

The same matthews had average of 36 at home against india in 2017 series where even dhawans average was 90. Hes a great batsman, no doubt, but not that great that you can't get him out the whole day on 5th day pitch along with kusal mendis, specially when they are facing the so called best test team in the world at their home.

 

[Hasan123]

Hockey was neglected, because it's not a big sport. Public interest in cricket will never die. This team is inexperienced and will take a lot of time to become consistent. Pakistan teams in the past, with all our stars, did jack in SENA aswell. People go on and on about the missed chances in Hobart Test '99, but they forget we got bashed rather spectacularly in the other two tests. A middle-order of Inzi, YK and MoYo couldn't stop us from getting humiliated at Perth in 2004, when McGrath took 8 wickets and bowled us out for 72. Similarly, in South Africa we have been rubbish throughout our history. Our superstars couldn't get us a series win in the West Indies, till Misbah's team finally achieved that in 2016. Our superstars lost a home series to Zimbabwe, who were good but not that good. Our superstars consistently choked in tournaments and got knocked out at crucial stages. And I'm sure we had our fair share of this rubbish even before the 90s.

Why are you holding this young team to such a high standard, when your cricketing history has had under-performing teams even with its best players? I'm as frustrated as you mate, but I don't believe all the doom and gloom. We have a lot of issues at the moment, but do remember this team with its inexperience has already performed better than Misbah's team did in 2013, in two days of cricket. They have given South Africa as good a game as the number one team in the world did last year. Give the young players, weed out the rubbish and hope they go on to become a consistent side one day.

Azhar 33
Asad 32
Shan 29
Sarfraz 31
Fakhar 28
Amir 26 (made his debut in 2009)
Yasir 32

Babar and Hasan Ali aren't novices to international
It's not a young team. Young team excuse is pathetic.

 

[MMHS]

There was a time, till 1980s, when India vs Pakistan cricket matches were considered showcase matches of hockey, the way India vs Pakistan cricket matches are now a days tried to be hyped as showcase matches of the cricket tournaments.

Both India and Pakistan have lost their primacy in hockey as hockey became a global game from being a game played seriously by just a few countries.

I cannot visualise cricket becoming a global game like hockey right now. So the subcontinental teams, whose achievements in other sports and games are nothing to write home about will continue to gloat about their cricketing achievement.

It is high time the people of the subcontinent look at other global games and try to improve their standards in those games instead of putting so much energy on just one game.

Indeed. One of Amol Palekar's famous movie (Gol Mal??), an IND-PAK hockey Test was mentioned (as an excuse of not being able to accept some appointment).

 

[JattMaula]

There was a time, till 1980s, when India vs Pakistan cricket matches were considered showcase matches of hockey, the way India vs Pakistan cricket matches are now a days tried to be hyped as showcase matches of the cricket tournaments.

Both India and Pakistan have lost their primacy in hockey as hockey became a global game from being a game played seriously by just a few countries.

I cannot visualise cricket becoming a global game like hockey right now. So the subcontinental teams, whose achievements in other sports and games are nothing to write home about will continue to gloat about their cricketing achievement.

It is high time the people of the subcontinent look at other global games and try to improve their standards in those games instead of putting so much energy on just one game.

We are slowly but surely becoming decent hockey team again. This time with some fans following them.

 

[BlackShadow]

Sports is a fairly accurate representation of how a country is doing (economically and socially). Pakistan Cricket, hockey and other sports will see an upswing after a few years of prosperity in the country.

 

[Something]

Sports is a fairly accurate representation of how a country is doing (economically and socially). Pakistan Cricket, hockey and other sports will see an upswing after a few years of prosperity in the country.

Yes, a few years of prosperity and Sarfraz will turn into Kohli. You're absolutely dead on

 

[Arham_PakFan]

Nah, overreaction.

If a few decisions had not gone against us and if we had not lost 2 key players due to injury, we could have won this game.

 

[shortbread]

Pakistan is just 2 good batsmen and an astute captain away from domination!

Bowling attack: tick, among the best in the business
Fielding unit: tick, massive improvement
Good Coaching unit: tick

 

[BlackShadow]

Yes, a few years of prosperity and Sarfraz will turn into Kohli. You're absolutely dead on

TTFs will be kicked out once the system kickastarts and starts churning out quality players again. It takes time.

 

[Abdullah]

Abdullah,

If you do not mind I want to mention that batting collapses in Tests for Pakistan started way back in 2016. Edgbaston Test where despite a 100 run lead We lost.

It carried on towards Hamilton and MCG and then followed in these Sri lanka Nzl
And South Africa series.,

Mickey has not addressed these issues for 2.5 years. When Seniors perform then juniors dont do it. Or Vice Versa. When juniors perform then seniors add nothing.

Somewhere in the line Mickey has not done a good job in Tests at all.

That England tour we knew was tough as misyou were quite old and at the end of the line and it was the next batch of seniors who failed there too in that game (Azhar Asad sarfaraz) these were the guys who were meant to step up in the time the next batch of youngsters were to get settled into the side . ( Like misyou did with openers,Azhar ,shafiq were being bedded in.)

So after misyou left we just have not had Azhar sarfaraz and shafiq step up at all and we have had bad defeats which they should have been able to prevent even if juniors failed around them in their bedding in process. ( Remember nobody comes into tests and starts averaging 50 from game 1)

It has now got worse where our young guys have had a good game abroad together ( shaan imam Babar) and the seniors have cost that game too!

 

[SensiblePakFan]

I miss hockey.

 

[Abdullah]

Abdullah,

If you do not mind I want to mention that batting collapses in Tests for Pakistan started way back in 2016. Edgbaston Test where despite a 100 run lead We lost.

It carried on towards Hamilton and MCG and then followed in these Sri lanka Nzl
And South Africa series.,

Mickey has not addressed these issues for 2.5 years. When Seniors perform then juniors dont do it. Or Vice Versa. When juniors perform then seniors add nothing.

Somewhere in the line Mickey has not done a good job in Tests at all.

That England tour we knew was tough as misyou were quite old and at the end of the line and it was the next batch of seniors who failed there too in that game (Azhar Asad sarfaraz) These were the guys who were meant to step up in the time the next batch of youngsters were to get settled into the side . (Like misyou did with openers,Azhar ,shafiq when they were being bedded in.)

So after misyou left we just have not had Azhar sarfaraz and shafiq step up at all and we have had bad defeats which they should have been able to prevent even if juniors failed around them in their bedding in process. ( Remember nobody comes into tests and starts averaging 50 from game 1)

It has now got worse where our young guys have had a good game abroad together ( shaan imam Babar) and the seniors have cost that game too!

Mickey can only do so much. Right now the team should be in a place where Asad Azhar and sarfaraz are leading the younger lot but we are at the stage where I feel more comfortable when Harris and Babar are batting ( I'm adding shaan to that too)

Sarfaraz and Asad especially just look awful in the slightest bit of pressure

 

[Muhammad Saad]

Pakistan�s cricket future depends on the future of the country. It is wishful thinking that Imran Khan or XYZ will put this country on track and make a difference etc.

I do not want to make this thread political, but we are a lost cause and it is only going to get worse for this country. Under such circumstances, you cannot expect cricket to grow.

For once I have to agree with Mamoon , all this doom and gloom talk might be actual unless we improved as nation wholly. (seems unlikely at the moment but you never know about God's plan)

 

[Shafi]

Actually it will worse. Hockey is suffering due to lack of finance, low quality local coach, no proper fitness trainer, corrupt PHF officials. But Talent is there. But in cricket we have almost no talent in local set up plus corrupted players and officials have lot of power.

 

[hadi123]

We hear this every time Pakistan perform badly.

 

[Mamoon]

For once I have to agree with Mamoon , all this doom and gloom talk might be actual unless we improved as nation wholly. (seems unlikely at the moment but you never know about God's plan)

We are responsible for own demise so we should not expect any divine help. We don’t deserve it.

 

[asadee]

At least as a nation we have been successful at canning the likes of Nawaz and Zardari (inshallah by next month). Can we do the same in cricket?

 

[Usman Chadda]

Azhar 33
Asad 32
Shan 29
Sarfraz 31
Fakhar 28
Amir 26 (made his debut in 2009)
Yasir 32

Babar and Hasan Ali aren't novices to international
It's not a young team. Young team excuse is pathetic.

Inexperienced. Compare the total number of matches to other teams, and you might understand.

Also, doesn't help when your senior players are useless. Azhar, Shafiq and Sarfraz are possibly the most uninspiring lot you can ever get anywhere.

 

[Khwaja78]

In a system where nepotism rules over merit and deserving players are not selected, these kinds of pronouncements are harsh and far from reality. Another diversion from the truth.

Does current Pakistan system like 80s nurtured and invested in making a solid performing batsman?

For 9 yeas now same set of players are in test team with meagre averages. Few players [Babar Azam, Umar Akmal, Imam, Ahmed Shehzad] are given host of chances and rest are not even allowed to set foot in the National XI dressing room.

 

[topspin]

The problem lies with the incompetence of the PCB where they have been living on past glory since 92 WC, relying on sheer raw talent alone isn't suffice in the modern era when other teams have caught up investing their resources into fitness, diet regimes, pitches, coaches and as a whole reforming their cricket structures from grassroots level.

When you look at Pakistan cricket their players lack fitness, don't eat well and haven't had access to great facilities and also let down by poor domestic coaches and substandard pitches.

I don't buy into "UAE is affecting our cricket" as a major factor whatsoever simply because if you have a dysfunctional cricket structure then you'll inevitably yield mediocrity regardless of where we play our home matches. The foundations of our cricketing structure must be fixed first, hence why South Africa were still able to produce fine players without any international cricket during the times of the Apartheid.

What has also held Pakistan back in the 2010s is the way PCB have reacted after the 2009 spot-fixing scandal. I had no issues with Misbah leading the side in his late 30s for a few years to steady the ship and preserve the reputation of the cricket nation as a short term fix. He deserves a lot of credit for carrying out his role in a dignified manner and giving his 100% but it was in 2013 when PCB lost their senses. A drawn series against a very poor Zimbabawe side (nothing like the 90s) should have sent alarm bells that he wasn't suitable to lead the side any longer and finished with bat after being exposed in the whitewash series in SA in that year. Also in 2013, his captaincy was also the reason why the side crashed out of the CT without a single win.

His defensive and ultra-cautious approach with preference for seniors and obedient youngsters (like Azhar and Shafiq) has ensured he has done more harm than good to Pakistan cricket. For instance his preference for Shafiq over the likes of Haris, Fawad and Umar Akmal (after a decent away leg outside SC) simply epitomises this. We're all quick to jump the gun and blame Shafiq however who was the genius that somehow thought he was some long term investment?

After his retirement from ODIs , PCB went with his recommendations of appointing a weak, tactically inept, defensive minded Azhar Ali as captain. During his ODI captaincy stint (from post WC 2011 - 2015 WC) he enforced defensive batting while other teams were playing the modern game which saw the inclusion of openers possessing firepower such as Rohit, Warner and etc. Misbah on the other hand opted for batsmen with strike rates of 70-75 batting in the top order.

From 1999 WC, Pakistan have managed to do reach semis in every LOI ICC event held in England except for the one led by Misbah 5 years ago in that CT, losing every single match in the group stage thanks to his batting selections and choice of batting order to make matters worse.

I could go all day about Misbah however the point is PCB had numerous occasions to smell the coffee and act but due to the sheer incompetence they allowed him to hold Pakistan back at a crucial period while other lower ranked sides like England (especially in LOIs) and NZ were moving forward.

The seniority culture has to come to an end, we gave it a chance when Salman Butt was captain in his mid to late 20s but you can't let the actions of one player dictate your decisions and go to extremes. So I fear this culture of seniority as well as nepotism is here to stay and it is pretty much summed up by Mamoon, when he mentioned that Pakistan cricket is a reflection of its society as a failing nation.

 

[Smudger]

Relax buddy Pakistani have such short memories. If Pak wins next test everything will be forgotten.
Even in this test pak fought brilliantly after 90odd for 7 but luck was not on our side.
Dont be influenced by people who are so negative. The theory or school of thought that everything that can go wrong will go wrong is so stupid . If it was true China or Korea would never have been where they are now. Every person will die while crossing the road

 

[Savak]

The problem lies with the incompetence of the PCB where they have been living on past glory since 92 WC, relying on sheer raw talent alone isn't suffice in the modern era when other teams have caught up investing their resources into fitness, diet regimes, pitches, coaches and as a whole reforming their cricket structures from grassroots level.

When you look at Pakistan cricket their players lack fitness, don't eat well and haven't had access to great facilities and also let down by poor domestic coaches and substandard pitches.

I don't buy into "UAE is affecting our cricket" as a major factor whatsoever simply because if you have a dysfunctional cricket structure then you'll inevitably yield mediocrity regardless of where we play our home matches. The foundations of our cricketing structure must be fixed first, hence why South Africa were still able to produce fine players without any international cricket during the times of the Apartheid.

What has also held Pakistan back in the 2010s is the way PCB have reacted after the 2009 spot-fixing scandal. I had no issues with Misbah leading the side in his late 30s for a few years to steady the ship and preserve the reputation of the cricket nation as a short term fix. He deserves a lot of credit for carrying out his role in a dignified manner and giving his 100% but it was in 2013 when PCB lost their senses. A drawn series against a very poor Zimbabawe side (nothing like the 90s) should have sent alarm bells that he wasn't suitable to lead the side any longer and finished with bat after being exposed in the whitewash series in SA in that year. Also in 2013, his captaincy was also the reason why the side crashed out of the CT without a single win.

His defensive and ultra-cautious approach with preference for seniors and obedient youngsters (like Azhar and Shafiq) has ensured he has done more harm than good to Pakistan cricket. For instance his preference for Shafiq over the likes of Haris, Fawad and Umar Akmal (after a decent away leg outside SC) simply epitomises this. We're all quick to jump the gun and blame Shafiq however who was the genius that somehow thought he was some long term investment?

After his retirement from ODIs , PCB went with his recommendations of appointing a weak, tactically inept, defensive minded Azhar Ali as captain. During his ODI captaincy stint (from post WC 2011 - 2015 WC) he enforced defensive batting while other teams were playing the modern game which saw the inclusion of openers possessing firepower such as Rohit, Warner and etc. Misbah on the other hand opted for batsmen with strike rates of 70-75 batting in the top order.

From 1999 WC, Pakistan have managed to do reach semis in every LOI ICC event held in England except for the one led by Misbah 5 years ago in that CT, losing every single match in the group stage thanks to his batting selections and choice of batting order to make matters worse.

I could go all day about Misbah however the point is PCB had numerous occasions to smell the coffee and act but due to the sheer incompetence they allowed him to hold Pakistan back at a crucial period while other lower ranked sides like England (especially in LOIs) and NZ were moving forward.

The seniority culture has to come to an end, we gave it a chance when Salman Butt was captain in his mid to late 20s but you can't let the actions of one player dictate your decisions and go to extremes. So I fear this culture of seniority as well as nepotism is here to stay and it is pretty much summed up by Mamoon, when he mentioned that Pakistan cricket is a reflection of its society as a failing nation.

I can sympathize and understand domestic players not following diet plans, modern training methods and professional quality practices. But the guys who make it to the national team have no such excuses to be eating the wrong stuff off the field and for having an extremely poor work ethic. In fact some of the domestic and U-19 players themselves should have no excuse given that they have access to the NCA.

The NCA is clearly not working, whatever they are teaching is just not being implemented, you have out dated coaches who have no results to show for their work, the PCB and selectors are also to blame because they don't take serious action against players who refuse to change their ways and don't conform to modern professional standards.

 

[CricFan2012]

No it won't.

I don't recall hockey ever being as big as this, cricket is the main sport in Pakistan, yes we could possibly reach a low point like we did in hockey but we won't stay there for long.

Cricket is in every Pakistani's blood, we recently won the CT and that certainly inspired a young generation like the World Cup did. Heck we have an outside chance of winning the World Cup and that can ensure a couple ATGs from the next few generations.

 

[silent ischemia]

I have been saying this for a decade now. We did not develop a system that could keep on producing quality players; be it hockey, squash or cricket. Remember sports evolve. The fitness level, competition, technology in sports is not the same that was ten years back. We had to move forward which we didn't. We thought we would keep on getting a Shahbaz, a Jansher or Akram every now and then that would make us world beaters. We didn't do our homework and now we are on the decline. To make things worse sports has never been the Government's priority and this current joker at the helm is no exception and probably worse

 

[Zakaz]

Some people are saying that cricket won't suffer same fate as hockey as its the only sport our people actually follow but I am afraid to say, if international cricket doesn't return any sooner, and Pakistan continue producing such miserable results, cricket will definitely lose interest too. Pakistan will just become a sportless country

 

[skureishi]

Is Pakistan Cricket going down the Hockey and Squash Route?

The ongoing Australia tour seems to have confirmed the notion that Pakistan cricket is dead and is going down the Hockey and Squash Route