Angelo Mathews vs Virat Kohli - Who is the better Test Batsman?

[cricketjoshila]

Mathews in UAE and in England has been outstanding scored in pressure situations. Kohli was great in SA but was average in NZ. Kohlis Test Career has been unimpressive so far bar that SA series. for a batsman of his calibre and talent.

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Unimpressive?How?

The same place where Matthews flopped and rolled in AUS and SA and avgd in 20s Kohli avgd 38 and 60 plus.

Just because your opinion is biased you cannot bin the stats by claiming test runs to be meaningless.

 

[cricketjoshila]

scoring in dead rubbers and going missing in the games where the series is alive is a really big factor in defining a Top Batsman.

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So you mean that there are free runs in dead rubbers?Bowlers bowl half volleys?Fielders escort the ball to the boundary?More useless excuses.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I know im being harsh on Kohli but when people are comparing as a successor to Sachin he has to match Sachins standards

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There isnt another Sachin Tendulkar and there isnt going to be another one.There is a reason why every cricketing expert puts Sachin among the top 2 batsmen of all time.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Indian fans should stop reacting as if Kohli is some Bradman, he doesnt even average 50 in Tests . He has been nothing exceptional as of now.

So Matthews is Bradman or does he avg 50 in tests?

 

[Adil_94]

So you mean that there are free runs in dead rubbers?Bowlers bowl half volleys?Fielders escort the ball to the boundary?More useless excuses.

s in dead rubbers there is much less pressure than when the series is alive. if you cash in when the pressure is off and fail when the pressure is on. it does play a big factor in my opinion in determining a Top Clasd Batsman

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[cricketjoshila]

s in dead rubbers there is much less pressure than when the series is alive. if you cash in when the pressure is off and fail when the pressure is on. it does play a big factor in my opinion in determining a Top Clasd Batsman

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You have a gadget to measure pressure on batsman?

Is there no pressure on a young man playing first time in AUS when his team is getting hammered left right and centre?

Or is there no pressure on a batsman when he comes into bat at 2 for 10 which becomes 3 for 54 while trying to save a test match?

 

[vandokkum]

Kohli's hundred in SA and NZ came in draws where hundreds and double hundreds were scored with ease.

 

[thivaakar]

Mathews by far in test and he bats with bowlers. I'f i had to choose between Mathews and Kohli in my team, Id still choose Kohli since more teams plat ODI than test

 

[Random Aussie]

Hmmm. Ahhhh. Errrrr. No.

Kohli.

 

[Aman]

Kohli is the better batsmen, he'll only get better from here.

 

[desi_launda]

Matthews has played twice the number of tests virat has.let virat play 40-50 tests

 

[Eye_Done]

Ask who is better

 

[desi_launda]

Ask who is better

He would say Rohit Sharma

 

[Bilal7]

Both are on equal footing in the third tier of the top batsmen today.

 

[Aman]

Ask who is better

It's embarrassing to even have the two in the same sentence.

One is on his way to becoming in ATG while the other is fast becoming another one series wonder

 

[Batman_DB]

Virat will be beast in tests as well he is more focused and dedicated than his peers and gives test wins in overseas priorities

 

[SL_Fan]

Yes he has improved because he has scored two centuries in england.Really?

Kohli has centuries in NZ/SA/AUS already.

Matthews is another SL FTB and these kinds of thread on PP are dime a dozen.Earlier it was Tendulkar/Sehwag/Dravid etc now its Kohli.

Man you really do take insecurity to a whole other level! )

Seriously how old are you? somewhere around 10 I’m thinking?

 

[Khaseer]

Forget Matthews, Steve Smith is better than Kohli in tests atm.

 

[cricketindiafan]

Mathews has in the last 12 months completely overturned his test batting form. And the series winning performances with the bat in England will give him the slight edge over Kohli right now.

In the long run, Kohli most likely will turn out to be a better test batsman but Mathews will also be someone who will average 50+ IMO. The England series could be the turning point of his career as a test batsman.

 

[hafeezrocks]

Mathews just won a series for his team in England something which Kohli cant do in a million years.

 

[Electron]

Mathews just won a series for his team in England something which Kohli cant do in a million years.

Ajit Agarkar has won us Test in Australia, which Wasim and Waqar didn't do in a billion years.

 

[tempus123]

Ajit Agarkar has won us Tests in Australia, which Wasim and Waqar didn't do in a billion years.

I think plural is a bit too much..

 

[tempus123]

Mathews just won a series for his team in England something which Kohli cant do in a million years.

It was Eranga who won the series though.

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

Mathews atm he has lead by example in this series a matchwinning all round contribution. Kohli has scored a lot of meaningless Test runs his ton in Aus at home vs England and in NZ had no impact on the result of the series.

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He can only bat for himself can't take wickets on behalf of our rubbish bowlers

I can remember 1 innings of Kohli against NZ in Bangalore on an overcast day when we were 4 down for 60/ 80, i suppose we won that match

First test in SA where we should hv won after setting 450 target (zak/ishant n co.... )
Last test in NZ where baz scored a triple after a huge first innings lead (zak/ishant n co.... )

 

[Electron]

I think plural is a bit too much..

Yeah, thats right.

 

[hafeezrocks]

It was Eranga who won the series though.

Man of the Series was Angelo Mathews.

 

[tempus123]

Man of the Series was Angelo Mathews.

Angelo would have been MOS even if SL didn't win the series. The series was won by Eranga, You get my point, right?

 

[hafeezrocks]

He can only bat for himself can't take wickets on behalf of our cr** bowlers

I can remember 1 innings of Kohli against NZ in Bangalore on an overcast day when we were 4 down for 60/ 80, i suppose we won that match

First test in SA where we should hv won after setting 450 target (zak/ishant n co.... )
Last test in NZ where baz scored a triple after a huge first innings lead (zak/ishant n co.... )

Right and what did he do in that match ? Scored 38 in first innings , it was Dhawan and Rahane who got India the big lead.

And when after Mc Cullum triple ton India were out of contention for the series , with only around 50 overs to bat , he scored a useless ton to boost his tour averages. No benefit whatsoever to the team but only himself.

 

[cricketindiafan]

Mathews just won a series for his team in England something which Kohli cant do in a million years.

Number of tests won - Kohli 10 out of 24, Angelo 11 out of 40.

Not sure if you'll call Angelo a better match winner yet. Both of them have a long way to go

 

[tempus123]

Right and what did he do in that match ? Scored 38 in first innings , it was Dhawan and Rahane who got India the big lead.

And when after Mc Cullum triple ton India were out of contention for the series , with only around 50 overs to bat , he scored a useless ton to boost his tour averages. No benefit whatsoever to the team but only himself.

What should he have done ? Not score that hundred ?

 

[tempus123]

I started rating Kohli seriously after his twin centuries in 1st Test in SA (2nd innings was near century, so counting it).

 

[hafeezrocks]

What should he have done ? Not score that hundred ?

No but he must score those runs when they might have a bearing on the scheme of the match or the series . He had the opportunity to make it count in the first test , he could have scored a ton while chasing but he gave away his wicket. Dhawan fought in that match as well , Kohli didnt.

Kohli didnt even made any useful contribution during the first innings of the 2nd test but yes when the series was all but over , he comes up with a ton to boost his averages.

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

Right and what did he do in that match ? Scored 38 in first innings , it was Dhawan and Rahane who got India the big lead.

And when after Mc Cullum triple ton India were out of contention for the series , with only around 50 overs to bat , he scored a useless ton to boost his tour averages. No benefit whatsoever to the team but only himself.

He has been super consistent in all 3 formats and definitely better to Mathews in terms of batting .... Mathews is an all rounder hence is more useful to the team especially in seaming conditions

 

[Abhilash93]

Kohli's hundred in SA and NZ came in draws where hundreds and double hundreds were scored with ease.

By your logic, Matthews' hundred in the 1st test should be discounted as it came in a draw where 100s and 200s were scored with ease??
Btw, the Joberg track where the toothless Indian bowling attack got SA dismissed for 244 was certainly not easy to bat on (atleast for the first 2-3 days).

 

[tempus123]

No but he must score those runs when they might have a bearing on the scheme of the match or the series . He had the opportunity to make it count in the first test , he could have scored a ton while chasing but he gave away his wicket. Dhawan fought in that match as well , Kohli didnt.

Kohli didnt even made any useful contribution during the first innings of the 2nd test but yes when the series was all but over , he comes up with a ton to boost his averages.

You are just talking about his failures.. if he had also scored a century in 1st Test, it would have been a dream series for him.

No one is praising Kohli for that 2nd innings hundred though. But to cite a few failures in earlier Test matches is not a good logic.

 

[Indiafan]

I would say Matthews, then daylight (not the kind on a sunny day but the small beams streaming through the bars of a cobwebbed window) then Sachin Tendulkar, then the width of a narrow door (where a desi aunty is likely to get stuck unless turned sideways) and then Kohli

 

[tempus123]

By your logic, Matthews' hundred in the 1st test should be discounted as it came in a draw where 100s and 200s were scored with ease??
Btw, the Joberg track where the toothless Indian bowling attack got SA dismissed for 244 was certainly not easy to bat on (atleast for the first 2-3 days).

That's true, his 1st innings hundred was a class innings.. the first time I really took him seriously. This goes to show an example where 1st innings batting is more difficult than 2nd innings.

 

[Electron]

Hafeez Rocks has been too quite over Agarkar Vs Wasim+Waqar. LOL

 

[Aman]

I would say Matthews, then daylight (not the kind on a sunny day but the small beams streaming through the bars of a cobwebbed window) then Sachin Tendulkar, then the width of a narrow door (where a desi aunty is likely to get stuck unless turned sideways) and then Kohli

Why do Indian's feel the need to bring into every discussion?.. He has retired #Getoverit

 

[Indiafan]

Why do Indian's feel the need to bring into every discussion?.. He has retired #Getoverit

I thought I was complementing Matthews there. But ok

Matthews>Ashraful(Who is banned not retired)>Masakadza (who is also not retired)>Kohli

 

[boomboomcheema]

Indians as usual ruining another thread by raising unrelated issues and diverting the topic.

 

[Bilal7]

Indians as usual ruining another thread by raising unrelated issues and diverting the topic.

So insecure about their batsmen, lol.

 

[Indiafan]

Indians as usual ruining another thread by raising unrelated issues and diverting the topic.

So insecure about their batsmen, lol.

You mean this was a serious thread to begin with?

Also when in doubt, use the Indians are insecure card while making up stats and numbers. I would expect Sri Lankans to defend Matthews to the death but some Pak posters seem to have a bigger stake in it. Wonder who are the insecure ones here

 

[Random Aussie]

Number of tests won - Kohli 10 out of 24, Angelo 11 out of 40.

Not sure if you'll call Angelo a better match winner yet. Both of them have a long way to go

There is an old thread of mine around here called Ricky Ponting versus the nation of India. Some interesting arguments by your compatriots on this theme.

 

[Bilal7]

You mean this was a serious thread to begin with?

Also when in doubt, use the Indians are insecure card while making up stats and numbers. I would expect Sri Lankans to defend Matthews to the death but some Pak posters seem to have a bigger stake in it. Wonder who are the insecure ones here

Yes, this was a serious thread because both are on the same level. Kohli isn't the new Sachin yet, no matter how hard you try to convince yourself. I personally like both batsmen and have already said that they're on the same level with nothing to separate them.

Talking about aunties fitting through doors and all that rubbish is proof enough. You'd think Matthews averaged under 10 instead of 70+ with the way some you are talking about him.

 

[Indiafan]

There is an old thread of mine around here called Ricky Ponting versus the nation of India. Some interesting arguments by your compatriots on this theme.

I have always proclaimed that the "match-winner" thing is used by people who never understood how the game works. Surprisingly the same guys claim cricket is a thinker's game involving lots of permutations and combinations

 

[Bilal7]

There is an old thread of mine around here called Ricky Ponting versus the nation of India. Some interesting arguments by your compatriots on this theme.

That was a fun thread. Remember to bump it when the Indians come over to Australia to lie down and roll over.

 

[Indiafan]

Yes, this was a serious thread because both are on the same level. Kohli isn't the new Sachin yet, no matter how hard you try to convince yourself. I personally like both batsmen and have already said that they're on the same level with nothing to separate them.

Talking about aunties fitting through doors and all that rubbish is proof enough. You'd think Matthews averaged under 10 instead of 70+ with the way some you are talking about him.

Didn't look very serious to me when every serious reply was met with "Indians are insecure" and lots of subjective efforts were made to demean one player's innings instead of solely relying on facts to compare

 

[samplepiece]

Kohli is quite simply a better batsman.

 

[Haz95]

Kohli for the fact that he can hit more hundreds and can convert his runs better. Hundreds in NZ, Aus, SA are superior to 2 in England. Kohli takes it by an inch

 

[cricketjoshila]

8

You mean this was a serious thread to begin with?

Also when in doubt, use the Indians are insecure card while making up stats and numbers. I would expect Sri Lankans to defend Matthews to the death but some Pak posters seem to have a bigger stake in it. Wonder who are the insecure ones here

Ofcourse few Pakistanis have a big stake.First Lara vs SRT then Ponting then Kallis now Sanga.

Next is Kohli vs Akmal now Kohli vs Matthews

You know the trend here.

 

[shean1990]

Mathews is better imo

This insecurity of indians is getting ridiculous..lol..They are talking like Virat is next Bradman when even Steven Smith is better than kohli as a test batsman..They are fans who said Ifran Pathan is next Wasim Akram , Munaf Patel is next Mcgrath and Rohit Sharma is next Viv Richards..so nothing to be surprised here

 

[Electron]

Mathews is better imo

This insecurity of indians is getting ridiculous..lol..They are talking like Virat is next Bradman when even Steven Smith is better than kohli as a test batsman..They are fans who said Ifran Pathan is next Wasim Akram , Munaf Patel is next Mcgrath and Rohit Sharma is next Viv Richards..so nothing to be surprised here

Giving raw, irrefutable facts about Mathews being a nobody is insecurity ?

Secondly, Virat doesn't have to be a Bradman to be better than Mathews. Even if he stays Virat, he is miles ahead. One Good innings from Mathews could be a new beginning, but to call it a progress, he will have to stop failing outside Asia for a length of time.

 

[AamchiMumbaikar]

Mathews is better imo

This insecurity of indians is getting ridiculous..lol..They are talking like Virat is next Bradman when even Steven Smith is better than kohli as a test batsman..They are fans who said Ifran Pathan is next Wasim Akram , Munaf Patel is next Mcgrath and Rohit Sharma is next Viv Richards..so nothing to be surprised here

He doesn't need to be a bradman to be called better to Mathews .... he is already better just by being himself

 

[Haz95]

Lankans vs Indians

 

[hur rizvi]

I like Mathews, but Kohli has much more potential and talent with the Bat.

 

[Romali_rotti]

imo Matthews is better than any Pak batsmen currently however Kholi is a better bat than Matthews...

 

[Romali_rotti]

There is an old thread of mine around here called Ricky Ponting versus the nation of India. Some interesting arguments by your compatriots on this theme.

and to be fair Ponting got owned badly in India, probably has the worst record any star batsmen can have in a foreign country

 

[leatherface58]

Kohli is yet to improve in tests but is progressing well. People are bashing him here as if he has failed in England. Let him play first.

 

[anakin]

this is one of the Akmal brothers and Dhoni threads!!

Not enuff and data and people loudmouth each other

 

[Kiri]

Guys, I'll try and keep this unbias as possible. He has now scored 946 runs as Sri Lankan captain at an average of 78.83. Mathews' batting average as a non-captain for Sri Lanka was 39.71. Among players who have captained their country in at least five Tests, Mathews' average is the second highest.

His form has improved so much since he took over the captaincy and his batting has flourished. Only player to average higher with the bat as a captain is Donald Bradman himself. Just remember that Mathews has helped Sri Lanka clutch so many trophies over the past year or so.

What separates Kohli from Mathews is that it's Kohli's job to accumulate as much runs as possible where as Mathews will have to be calculated and make sure he scores as much runs as possible while shielding the tail. He did this to great effect in the 2nd Test. That 160 is something I rate as the best Sri Lankan test innings in a while.

More importantly, that innings of 18 (92) was seriously crucial to Sri Lanka getting the draw. He took the short balls from Broad, Plunkett and Anderson and made sure no wickets fell from one end while he was batting with the tail.

Mathews is in hot form, so as of now I'd have to go with him. Kohli may have all these centuries overseas but he hasn't changed a game on it's head like Mathews has.

 

[eradicator]

Guys, I'll try and keep this unbias as possible. He has now scored 946 runs as Sri Lankan captain at an average of 78.83. Mathews' batting average as a non-captain for Sri Lanka was 39.71. Among players who have captained their country in at least five Tests, Mathews' average is the second highest.

His form has improved so much since he took over the captaincy and his batting has flourished. Only player to average higher with the bat as a captain is Donald Bradman himself. Just remember that Mathews has helped Sri Lanka clutch so many trophies over the past year or so.

What separates Kohli from Mathews is that it's Kohli's job to accumulate as much runs as possible where as Mathews will have to be calculated and make sure he scores as much runs as possible while shielding the tail. He did this to great effect in the 2nd Test. That 160 is something I rate as the best Sri Lankan test innings in a while.

More importantly, that innings of 18 (92) was seriously crucial to Sri Lanka getting the draw. He took the short balls from Broad, Plunkett and Anderson and made sure no wickets fell from one end while he was batting with the tail.

Mathews is in hot form, so as of now I'd have to go with him. Kohli may have all these centuries overseas but he hasn't changed a game on it's head like Mathews has.

Completely agree with the point. Mathews is a game changer.

In the first Test, he secured a draw for his team.
In the 2nd Test , he secured a win for his team.


The manner in which his performances have influenced the outcome of the series is phenomenal.

LOL@ Quality runs scored by Mathews being compared with meaningless centuries scored by Kohli in NZ and Australia.

 

[giri26]

A batsman is as good as his team....It is funny when people rate batsman based on the ability of their team able to win matches. Kohli's hundred in Adelaide was a very good innings when you consider the situation he scored his runs. People say it was a dead rubber but again, he was just at the start of his career and had a poor start to his test career prior to that. A failure in Australia meant that he might have been dropped from the team. India were struggling in that series and the greats were not performing. India were 87/4 with Gambhir, Sehwag, Sachin and Dravid back in the pavilion. Considering the situation it was a really good innings.

As far as his hundred in SA goes, he cannot do anything if his teams inept bowlers cannot even win a game where the opposition was down on the mat facing a 450 runs deficit. You need a team to play together to convert a hundred into match winning one....you can score 100's and 200's but if your team cannot bowl the opposition out, your innings will go in vain.

The current crop of Indian batting is going to go through the same disappointments which Sachin went through in the early part of his career. The only silver lining is that the top teams aren't as good as they were in the 90's, so there is a chance of a slip up once in a while to give the Indian bowling a chance. Unless Shami, Bhuvi or Yadav/Aaron realise their potential and become decent bowlers, Kohli will always be ridiculed as scoring meaningless runs and not scoring enough runs to win matches as his bowlers are going to waste lots of the runs he is going to score in the future.

 

[spiderreddy]

is a wanna be :ahmed . Plz keep the clown only for IPL tamasha and pyjama ODI games. Test cricket is for real men like Mathews

exactly.Not a surprise that lala retired so early

 

[Hawkeye]

Again fighting like a lone warrior, against Steyn and co. when his team let him down.

67* when SL 240/7.

 

[eradicator]

Mathews is twice the Test Batsman that Kohli is. again playing a special fighting knock and has almost saved the follow on for his team.

 

[DrSchultz]

On current form Mathews way ahead of Kohli.

 

[eradicator]

Follow on Saved. Mathews is just toying with the bowling.

 

[DrSchultz]

Misbah should learn from Mathew on how to bat with the tail.

 

[hafeezrocks]

Kohli's average in England so far - 11.33 LOL

Kohli in England so far - 1, 8 , 25

Mathews in England - 102, 18, 26 , 160

 

[Haz95]

Forget Kohli, mathews is probably the best in the world out of the youngsters however he's been playing way longer and has 40+ matches, its about time he's in his zone.

 

[Kiri]

Mathews shouldn't be recognised as a batsman now. He's been batting since 2007 me thinks. He also had the help of people like Sanga and Jayawardene while others haven't.

 

[Adil_94]

Remember a lot of the abuse i got on here the comparison doesnt look so preposterous now does it.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Nope. Its not preposterous.

Kohli has a lot to prove.

Score when his team needs him. Apart from Joberg, he hasn't done that overseas.

 

[Mamoon]

At the moment Mathews definitely.

onting

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

Its boring to compare players with little sample data (in this case - Kohli whose data is too low).

If I have to absolutely pick, I would say Mathews as of now.

But that's if I absolutely have to choose. Let sufficient data arrive and we can have a fun debate.

 

[Straight_Drive]

Kohli is out of form, mathews is in form, of course this comparison is gonna be tilted in mathews favour at the moment....but kohli is a future ATG whereas mathews would dwindle away after his form is over ,so in the long run this is an absurd comparison

 

[Adil_94]

Nope. Its not preposterous.

Kohli has a lot to prove.

Score when his team needs him. Apart from Joberg, he hasn't done that overseas.

Yeah thats what i was trying to say. I rate Kohli highly but apart from the SA tour he hasnt scored in proper pressure situations in the big Tests yet.

 

[OZGOD]

I would pick Virat Kohli any day, every day. I don't need to worry about class or form when I have seen both players play.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Kohli is out of form, mathews is in form, of course this comparison is gonna be tilted in mathews favour at the moment....but kohli is a future ATG whereas mathews would dwindle away after his form is over ,so in the long run this is an absurd comparison

Unfair.

Kohli is probably going to end up ATG but Matthews won't.

But Matthews is one of the better talented players now in the world, and will still always be a gun player for Sri Lanka and probably end up a Sri Lankan great.

He won't dwindle away.

Much better than that overrated Akmal or Afridi anyways.