Are Indian fans genuinely unsupportive of Pakistani cricket?

[Rana]

Pakistani rarely frequent indian forums. I was on one of the biggest indian cricket forums a few years ago and it barely had any Pakistani posters. The few were largely fans of Kohli and dhoni

So why so many indian posters on here ?

Because they want Pakistanis to know their place is below the indian cricket team and will continue to remind us at any given opportunity. The recent slump in form and results plus the rise of Indian cricket has to be highlighted by Indians who get annoyed when Pakistan rave about emerging talent in a hope that it may change the fortunes of the nation and restore it back to a dominating stature above India

 

[Sidilicious]

For people complaining about the Indian posters, i actually read a post from a Pakistani poster (possibly even a mod, can’t recall the poster) in the last couple of days actually wanting bumrahs injury to be so bad that he is not able to get his previous skills back.

That is the lowest of lows. However, I have never read of an Indian poster wishing such bad luck or injury to a Pakistani player.

 

[Rana]

Lol very whiny thread. We are rivals so what do you expect ? Just get over it. The amount of diss directed towards Indian cricket here is on the same level and we just move on. Naseem is a good potential , no doubt. But if you continue calling him a 16 year old then that will only move the conversation away from his bowling.

Why does this even matter??????

 

[Itachi]

Like, is this canon now?

I'll leave it to other PAKISTANI posters whether I have insulted Pakistani cricket or was there any genuine concerns behind it.

What you are portraying is just another side of victim mentality.

You are acting like that over protective mother who gets irritated when there's slight insult to her son however truth may there be.

 

[praveen]

Why does this even matter??????

Being called the youngest to take a five wicket haul ? Is that fair?

 

[Abdullah719]

That is the stupidest, most moronic argument I have ever heard here. So one post in a random forum is enough for you to conclude that kids aren't raised right in our part of the world?

I think that was part of the quoted post...

 

[hitthestump]

Oh please, this is the internet don't take it so seriously! I live in the West and have plenty of Indian friends. The main thing they seem to feel is sadness that Pakistan cricket has stooped so low in recent times. And even they're the first to speak fondly of the 80's/90's Pakistan team and how scared they were of Wasim etc. at the time.

There is plenty of mutual respect here in the Western diaspora and that's probably because we're all saved from the government influenced poison dished out through the media back home. I imagine it's largely the same over there too but that the idiots on internet forums just stand out more.

Any Indians reading this - i've got love for you and i'm glad you here participating on PP.

 

[warcry]

does it really matter what they think, and why do we crave their attention?

I for one, believe that we should be treating them the way we would treat an israeli since they act and speak in their language.

 

[Hitman]

The bigger question is why are there so many Indians on PakPassion?

Best cricket forum on the web, simple. That's like asking why do so many Pakistanis use Facebook, something developed by a Jew. Just look at the post above me.

 

[praveen]

Oh please, this is the internet don't take it so seriously! I live in the West and have plenty of Indian friends. The main thing they seem to feel is sadness that Pakistan cricket has stooped so low in recent times. And even they're the first to speak fondly of the 80's/90's Pakistan team and how scared they were of Wasim etc. at the time.

There is plenty of mutual respect here in the Western diaspora and that's probably because we're all saved from the government influenced poison dished out through the media back home. I imagine it's largely the same over there too but that the idiots on internet forums just stand out more.

Any Indians reading this - i've got love for you and i'm glad you here participating on PP.

I play cricket in US with and against many Pakistanis. There is only friendly banter at best , nothing unlike what the internet shows you. OP doesn’t seem to get it. Many folks including me supported Pakistan and was crazy about their cricketers in the late 90’s and early 00’s. The current set up is however so bad it deserves all the jokes and insults directed towards them.

 

[Saj]

The bigger question is why are there so many Indians on PakPassion?

I'd like to think it's because of the fair moderating, quality of discussion and the opportunity to express views without abuse as responses.

 

[leg-side-flick]

I'd like to think it's because of the fair moderating, quality of discussion and the opportunity to express views without abuse as responses.

Agree with this... The discussion here, especially on cricket is v good.... And since India has lot of crazy cricket fans, they will flock here....

 

[tyron_woodley]

For people complaining about the Indian posters, i actually read a post from a Pakistani poster (possibly even a mod, can’t recall the poster) in the last couple of days actually wanting bumrahs injury to be so bad that he is not able to get his previous skills back.

That is the lowest of lows. However, I have never read of an Indian poster wishing such bad luck or injury to a Pakistani player.

it was the great Abdullah. I don't know why he would say that. But who cares. Don't think he wanted to see him get terminally Injured. Just not back to his best form. His point was a bit misconstrued.

 

[MenInG]

Have been on this forum for years and I note 2 types of fans from India

1. No interest in Pakistan cricket but here to gloat if a problem in Pakistan - easy to spot those
2. Genuine lovers of the game and criticize when appropriate - to those we are grateful for their presence here

Problem nowadays is that their is spillover of politics into the game and that is diluting cricket discussions which should not be the case.

PP moderation has always been FAR superior than any I have seen elsewhere and that is what makes this place so special.

 

[khozema]

After reading your piece, I couldn't help but wonder if you were genuinely misinformed or were guided by an unfounded bias against Indian fans. Nevertheless, your premise that Indian fans are "unsupportive" of Pakistan cricket is flatly wrong and the 4 points you cite as evidence to support your premise can be easily re-butted as follows:

1) Naseem Shah: The so called age issue with regards to Naseem Shah was propagated by Pakistani media personalities and ex-cricketers who to this day roll their eyes or smirk openly on TV shows when he's referred to as a 16 yr old. The person who started it all was Naseem Rajput who on his show disclosed that Naseem Shah was banned from the U-16 team back in 2016 because of being "over-aged." Naturally, when such claims are made by known personalities in Pakistan, don't you think that a firestorm of debates would ensue on social media platforms? Nevertheless, despite the joke about his real age, he has been lauded and appreciated by cricket fans around the world as a special talent, including widely by Indian cricket fans.

2) Haris Rauf: His name gained prominence outside of Pakistan after Kohli came out and praised him after having faced him in the nets in Australia. So, while he's being largely ignored in Pakistan, until recently, it was Kohli whose mention brought attention to Rauf. As a result, Indian cricket fans started following him & largely appreciate his fast bowling skills. The way to gauge public opinion about an issue is to examine views across a large section as opposed to taking views of a small minority and blowing it up as though it was consensus opinion.

3) Babar Azam: This is the flimsiest of your evidence points. Babar is largely followed and admired in India and his innings are largely followed and appreciated by Indians just as they are by others. In fact recently when Babar was battng in Australia, Ashwin tweeted about how he hussled back to his room to catch a glimpse of Babar batting. Don't be insecure about Babar. Relax and enjoy his batting.

4) Bangladesh tour of Pakistan: Please give some credit to touring teams and don't dismiss their apprehensions as "pressure from India." You may recall the same type of rhetoric did the rounds in the Pakistani media when the Sri Lankans were going through a similar decision making process. The same foundation-less arguments are being propagated now with Bangladesh. Bangladesh recently went through a scare in NZ. It is understandable that they would be cautious to tour Pakistan. Give them space and let them decide in their own interests rather than insult them. That's not a good way to gain friends. Respect others making decisions in their interests just as you'd expect them to respect you.

So, my friend, the roots of all problems are not as a result of Indian fans' criticisms. Some are homegrown and others are happenstance. That's life. Enjoy your cricket and have an open mind. Indian fans love cricket and they appreciate good cricket & cricketers from Pakistan as well.

 

[Mamoon]

No one is asking for support, but it needs to be made clear that Indian hysteria against Pakistani cricket is as bad as the Indian media's war hysteria when it comes to issues in Kashmir. Being unsupportive due to a sporting rivalry is fine, at the end of the day you acknowledge that your opponent has some gun players who were better than your players. Being in complete denial of the existence of your opponent is something else. This is what I am alluding to.

None of this means anything. You are using a lot of words but you are struggling to make your point, and I am still not sure where you are going with this self-righteous rant.

Should India support Pakistan against other teams? Not make fun of our mediocrity? Criticize BCCI for not playing us?

What do you want?

 

[andy0204]

Have been on this forum for years and I note 2 types of fans from India

1. No interest in Pakistan cricket but here to gloat if a problem in Pakistan - easy to spot those
2. Genuine lovers of the game and criticize when appropriate - to those we are grateful for their presence here

Problem nowadays is that their is spillover of politics into the game and that is diluting cricket discussions which should not be the case.

PP moderation has always been FAR superior than any I have seen elsewhere and that is what makes this place so special.

Hats off to you and other mods to manage the workload.

 

[light]

So now I am being moronic? I did not write this. I dont think I would be allowed to curse a country because one of its citizens did a controversial celebration out of innocence.

Take your own advice and drop the victim mentality part. Like you stated, just because couple of our citizen in a random forum said something negative about your player, apprently the whole nation is as you stated, against pak cricket.

 

[Rana]

After reading your piece, I couldn't help but wonder if you were genuinely misinformed or were guided by an unfounded bias against Indian fans. Nevertheless, your premise that Indian fans are "unsupportive" of Pakistan cricket is flatly wrong and the 4 points you cite as evidence to support your premise can be easily re-butted as follows:

1) Naseem Shah: The so called age issue with regards to Naseem Shah was propagated by Pakistani media personalities and ex-cricketers who to this day roll their eyes or smirk openly on TV shows when he's referred to as a 16 yr old. The person who started it all was Naseem Rajput who on his show disclosed that Naseem Shah was banned from the U-16 team back in 2016 because of being "over-aged." Naturally, when such claims are made by known personalities in Pakistan, don't you think that a firestorm of debates would ensue on social media platforms? Nevertheless, despite the joke about his real age, he has been lauded and appreciated by cricket fans around the world as a special talent, including widely by Indian cricket fans.

2) Haris Rauf: His name gained prominence outside of Pakistan after Kohli came out and praised him after having faced him in the nets in Australia. So, while he's being largely ignored in Pakistan, until recently, it was Kohli whose mention brought attention to Rauf. As a result, Indian cricket fans started following him & largely appreciate his fast bowling skills. The way to gauge public opinion about an issue is to examine views across a large section as opposed to taking views of a small minority and blowing it up as though it was consensus opinion.

3) Babar Azam: This is the flimsiest of your evidence points. Babar is largely followed and admired in India and his innings are largely followed and appreciated by Indians just as they are by others. In fact recently when Babar was battng in Australia, Ashwin tweeted about how he hussled back to his room to catch a glimpse of Babar batting. Don't be insecure about Babar. Relax and enjoy his batting.

4) Bangladesh tour of Pakistan: Please give some credit to touring teams and don't dismiss their apprehensions as "pressure from India." You may recall the same type of rhetoric did the rounds in the Pakistani media when the Sri Lankans were going through a similar decision making process. The same foundation-less arguments are being propagated now with Bangladesh. Bangladesh recently went through a scare in NZ. It is understandable that they would be cautious to tour Pakistan. Give them space and let them decide in their own interests rather than insult them. That's not a good way to gain friends. Respect others making decisions in their interests just as you'd expect them to respect you.

So, my friend, the roots of all problems are not as a result of Indian fans' criticisms. Some are homegrown and others are happenstance. That's life. Enjoy your cricket and have an open mind. Indian fans love cricket and they appreciate good cricket & cricketers from Pakistan as well.

Read my points of criticism again. You make a valid response to point number 1 if this is accurate, however it did not stop the uninformed Indian fans to use this as a premise to criticise Pakistani management for being known cheats.

As for your response to all other points, plenty of Indians are burning for his success and cannot seem to find a way to vent it out other than mock his celebration or the legality of his action (which is a non issue).

Being eager to watch Babar play was not my point, the point was about the value he holds in the eyes of Indian fans who cannot admit that he is actually in the same tier as Kohli. Yet the response for this is that he isnt even in the same tier as Shubman Gill according to one poster.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Read my points of criticism again. You make a valid response to point number 1 if this is accurate, however it did not stop the uninformed Indian fans to use this as a premise to criticise Pakistani management for being known cheats.

As for your response to all other points, plenty of Indians are burning for his success and cannot seem to find a way to vent it out other than mock his celebration or the legality of his action (which is a non issue).

Being eager to watch Babar play was not my point, the point was about the value he holds in the eyes of Indian fans who cannot admit that he is actually in the same tier as Kohli. Yet the response for this is that he isnt even in the same tier as Shubman Gill according to one poster.

are you saying babar is as good as kohli and smith? he has potential to get there but he isn't quite there yet. t20 absolutely he is better than smith in shorter formats infact. As good as kohli in t20.
in odi? probably similar.

in tests? not yet.

 

[Rana]

None of this means anything. You are using a lot of words but you are struggling to make your point, and I am still not sure where you are going with this self-righteous rant.

Should India support Pakistan against other teams? Not make fun of our mediocrity? Criticize BCCI for not playing us?

What do you want?

Ive got you right where I wanted,

"He is already better than any Pakistani batsman playing international cricket. Another Indian batting legend in the making." 30.01.18

This is what you said about Shubman Gill before his international debut, check the date and recall some of the names of Pak cricket at the time. I am never going to let this one pass, who do you think you are making claims as such? To me you are equally responsible for spreading uninformed bias against Pakistan

 

[Rana]

are you saying babar is as good as kohli and smith? he has potential to get there but he isn't quite there yet. t20 absolutely he is better than smith in shorter formats infact. As good as kohli in t20.
in odi? probably similar.

in tests? not yet.

yes in Tests he is not even in the same tier as Marnus Labushagne let alone the great Steve Smith. In other formats the guy holds his own as one of the best.

If kohli and Smith are limited overs Messi and Ronaldo (upper echelons), then I have no doubt that Babar is like the Neymar or Mbappe of limited overs as well.

 

[cricket.mad]

A strong and competitive Pakistan cricket team is must for world cricket..much needed

 

[tyron_woodley]

Ive got you right where I wanted,

"He is already better than any Pakistani batsman playing international cricket. Another Indian batting legend in the making." 30.01.18

This is what you said about Shubman Gill before his international debut, check the date and recall some of the names of Pak cricket at the time. I am never going to let this one pass, who do you think you are making claims as such? To me you are equally responsible for spreading uninformed bias against Pakistan

dint you guys say the same thing about bumrah in reverse. He wouldn't get into our bench team that had hasan ali, junaid khan and a bunch of other fodders of the highest order like mohammed irfan. What about the speed discussions lol. he will become a trundler soon?

 

[tyron_woodley]

yes in Tests he is not even in the same tier as Marnus Labushagne let alone the great Steve Smith. In other formats the guy holds his own as one of the best.

If kohli and Smith are limited overs Messi and Ronaldo (upper echelons), then I have no doubt that Babar is like the Neymar or Mbappe of limited overs as well.

I would put babar top 3 in t20
top 5 in odi
top 7 in tests.

 

[Hyperion66]

So now I am being moronic? I did not write this. I dont think I would be allowed to curse a country because one of its citizens did a controversial celebration out of innocence.

Again, why are you judging a country of billion plus people based on some internet posts? You realize your logic is getting more child like with every post? Unmoderated platforms are cesspools, your can't just use filth from those boards to prove your point. That is not how you engage in a civilized discourse. BTW you conveniently ignored my other point that Pakistanis are equally capable of making comments like that, you are acting as if one side slinging shitz and the other responding with potpourri and water lilies.

We all have thresholds, we all get carried away and are capable of making moronic statements without being morons ourselves. I didn't call you ***** btw, thought I will make it clear.

 

[Mamoon]

Ive got you right where I wanted,

"He is already better than any Pakistani batsman playing international cricket. Another Indian batting legend in the making." 30.01.18

This is what you said about Shubman Gill before his international debut, check the date and recall some of the names of Pak cricket at the time. I am never going to let this one pass, who do you think you are making claims as such? To me you are equally responsible for spreading uninformed bias against Pakistan

You think you have got me where you wanted because you are expecting a politically correct answer. However, if you want the truth, I will give you the truth in explicit terms.

If I didn’t have the misfortune of being a Pakistani and if I were a cricket aficionado in some other country, Pakistan would have been the last team that I would have supported.

I despise everything about Pakistan cricket - I think the team is completely garbage, our cricket culture is rotten to the core, and I hate how deluded are fans are. Moreover, I have no love or respect for our cricket history.

If you expect positivity, passion and love for Pakistan cricket, you are looking at the wrong person.

 

[Hyperion66]

I think that was part of the quoted post...

I think he misplaced the quotation mark. Look at his replies. I think that "kids not being raised proper" part is his own statement.

However if you are right, I am ready to apologize for calling him a hatemonger.

 

[Mesozoic]

I think he misplaced the quotation mark. Look at his replies. I think that "kids not being raised proper" part is his own statement.

However if you are right, I am ready to apologize for calling him a hatemonger.

No. You misunderstood it.

That "kids not being raised properly" comment was a quote not his statement.

 

[Hyperion66]

No. You misunderstood it.

That "kids not being raised properly" comment was a quote not his statement.

Alrighty then [MENTION=2016]Rana[/MENTION], looks like my bad, I am sorry that I called you hateful.

But that doesn't change the fact that this thread is to PP what Justin Bieber is to music.

 

[Itachi]

i believe it ultimately boils down to being "politically correct". OP wants PP forum to be "poilitically correct" as it is the trend now a days.

Let's check one by one.

The constant negative propaganda against Naseem Shah and his age. There is no way he could be 16 according to them. Does it really really matter what his age is? There is a young man with a sublime action and express pace bowling for Pakistan but their is a consistent narrative trying to undermine this gem of a selection for Pakistan.

Already explained multiple times so not going to repeat.

Harris Rauf’s bowling action is illegal according to Indian fans on Indian forums, and now this issue has been cited by a prominent pro Indian fan on this forum as well.

"Indian fans on Indian forums"? Then why you are ranting here since you could mention only one poster here which creating chaos? Even then, it's his OPINION. Just because one has a different opinion which doesn't follow yours, doesn't make it Invalidate. Learn to Debate.

Babar Azam. The less said the better! I had to argue tooth and nail with some deluded Indian fans on this forum who claim Babar would go unsold in the IPL because Indians have plenty of Babar type batsmen in their local player category. The guy is No.1 in T20i for quite some time now but he cannot break into IPL for some, or will break in for an average and not a high caliber contract for others.

Again, difference of opinion. There are plenty of reasons which has been written why Babar wouldn't be picked up. If you disagree that's fine. But what's up with the constant urge to force someone to agree with your view?

Test cricket returning to Pakistan. Please go through the recent threads in which Indians seem to have more justification for Bangladesh’s reluctance to tour and the ridiculous claims/ hypothesis provided by delusional Indian fans which seemed to influence the naive Bangladesh cricket fans in their posts. I mean why does it bother them so much?

"Rediculous claim/hyposthesis" i.e. according to you. You yourself are undermining the IQ of a bangladeshi poster by calling them naive. How insulting is THAT to a bangladeshi poster? Let them decide whether they want to agree with your narrative or someone else's. Learn to respect their judgement, their calls instead of calling them "naive".

As it is evident, OP has a "Holier than thou" attitude where he believes only his opinion holds strength and any difference to that is insult to pakistan and its cricket.

 

[GrandMaster]

I will keep it simple and short.

1. I don’t understand the reason for fudging Naseem Shah’s age. He is not like 40 plus years trying to claim he is 20s. He is just 19-20, why he has to reduce his age and on top of that PCB supporting his claim? My question is - is it Naseem Shah or the PCB who is hiding his real age?

2. I have no clue about the point #2 so I won’t comment. BTW PP is the only cricket forum where I am active and I am pretty sure there are quite a few like me.

3. Babar is a great prospect and has improved miles, there is no doubt about it. He had a great 2019 and I hope he continues his great form in 2020. However, comparing him to fab 4 and particularly to Kohli is a bit frustrating. Kohli has been constantly performing since last 5 years where as Babar had a great last year and yet to prove his temperament in Test.

I don’t think Indians are jealous of Babar, may be a bit frustrated due to the above mentioned reason. Babar is very much like Kane and Steve Smith in T20s but the franchisees would prefer the Aussie and Kiwi solely due to their leadership skills which Babar lacks currently. I seriously don’t think any IPL team would pay him more than 500k.

4. I personally feel excited about the return of cricket in Pakistan. But PCB can’t force the BCB to play a test series until and unless they are satisfied with the arrangement. Yes, SLC were happy with the security and that’s when they sent their test team for a 3 match series. No board will send their team based on other boards comments and feedback. Let the Tigers play T20s, ask for a feedback and then react accordingly based on the feedback received. If the T20 series goes fine, I don’t see a reason why they can’t play a test series.

PCB need to be humble and amicable when approaching BCB. Arm twisting and treating them like a minnow and bullying them won’t help.

 

[Swashbuckler]

Can't generalize guys. I am sure many of us are here because we genuinely admire PCT, if not the present bunch but the teams that we all saw growing up in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s. This is the only forum I am a member of and enjoy my stay. Because of time constraints I can't post regularly but whatever I have seen here the quality of discussion and moderation is top-notch. Few posters can't get over their biases but if you see the larger picture most PPers are genuine cricket fans, easy going and knowledgeable as well. Don't take random forum comments to heart, webspace can be a cruel world especially when moderation is relaxed even a wee bit because of anonymity and the undeniable fact that many angry, frustrated, unemployed youth want an outlet for their daily problems. Thankfully PP moderation is excellent for most part especially in the cricket section, admins/mods are the real stars, have one look at Ind/Pak related youtube comments and be grateful for the stellar work the guys here are doing.

I enjoy following PCT, have learnt a lot about Pakistani culture, society, Islam etc from my stay here and some misconceptions have been put to rest. Truth be told this forum is not just about cricket, politics but an excellent representative of your country before a global audience. Your team may take a while to get to test number 1 spot or win a WC but PP will be the gold standard when it comes to cricket discussion for a significant period of time. Hope you guys can keep it that way and enrich the lives of die hard fans whilst at the same time attracting quality posters from around the globe. I don't know about other forums that are being discussed here, but aim should be to be to improve quality of PP than bicker about others, crown may wear heavy but that's the challenge, maintaining/bettering the quality of this forum irrespective of what others do and how the world changes around us.

PS- I definitely think the quality of discussion in TP&S can become better, more civil, less hate/divisiveness/anger but when it comes to cricket section no complaints.

 

[transparent opacity]

apart from a few posters others have been very appreciative. besides, constructive criticism should always be welcomed.
brother do not expect them to support pak given our geopolitics and history.

 

[FreePalestine]

As an Indian fan , the best matches I have seen are India pak and a strong pak team is necessary
Most support pak cricket - few points I dispute

Babar is a fine batsman but not at kohli level . But a very good player

Naseem age is immaterial - he is v v good

Harris Rauf is ok .

Test cricket coming back - it’s good but it’s risky and I fear going to any place where violence can occur - Delhi is my no go area for example just like some parts of pak ( I would love to visit Islamabad looks beautiful )

Finally - I see the biggest issue is pak fans not accepting the fact that the current indian team has the best bowling attack any asian team ever assembled . It’s proven by stats and by performance . Think pak fans need to be mindful of facts .

Haha, oh man, I am not accusing you of anything untoward in this reply but I cannot agree that current indian team has the best bowling attack any asian team ever assembled Wasim, Peak Waqar, Imran, Mushtaq / Qadir or Experienced Wasim, Peak Akhtar, Peak Saqlain, Waqar / peak Razzaq over Bumrah, Buvneshwar / Yadav, Ashwin any day! No amount of stats will convince me otherwise, specially if they don’t take into account the amount of games India play at home..

my hunch is that in all conditions, against quality batting, I would rather have either of those Pak attacks. Interesting thought though.. Indian bowling attack is the most proven of Asian teams currently, but not all time in my book.

 

[FreePalestine]

I will keep it simple and short.

1. I don’t understand the reason for fudging Naseem Shah’s age. He is not like 40 plus years trying to claim he is 20s. He is just 19-20, why he has to reduce his age and on top of that PCB supporting his claim? My question is - is it Naseem Shah or the PCB who is hiding his real age?

2. I have no clue about the point #2 so I won’t comment. BTW PP is the only cricket forum where I am active and I am pretty sure there are quite a few like me.

3. Babar is a great prospect and has improved miles, there is no doubt about it. He had a great 2019 and I hope he continues his great form in 2020. However, comparing him to fab 4 and particularly to Kohli is a bit frustrating. Kohli has been constantly performing since last 5 years where as Babar had a great last year and yet to prove his temperament in Test.

I don’t think Indians are jealous of Babar, may be a bit frustrated due to the above mentioned reason. Babar is very much like Kane and Steve Smith in T20s but the franchisees would prefer the Aussie and Kiwi solely due to their leadership skills which Babar lacks currently. I seriously don’t think any IPL team would pay him more than 500k.

4. I personally feel excited about the return of cricket in Pakistan. But PCB can’t force the BCB to play a test series until and unless they are satisfied with the arrangement. Yes, SLC were happy with the security and that’s when they sent their test team for a 3 match series. No board will send their team based on other boards comments and feedback. Let the Tigers play T20s, ask for a feedback and then react accordingly based on the feedback received. If the T20 series goes fine, I don’t see a reason why they can’t play a test series.

PCB need to be humble and amicable when approaching BCB. Arm twisting and treating them like a minnow and bullying them won’t help.

Babar = Williamson, Smith in T20’s? He averages about 20 more runs than them per innings! To be honest, some quite condescending views here, dressed in polite language.. Your view on BCB-PCB argument are also uninformed insofar as you think we are ‘treating them like a minnow’. But refer to other threads to see why that argument falls flat.

 

[MenInG]

apart from a few posters others have been very appreciative. besides, constructive criticism should always be welcomed.
brother do not expect them to support pak given our geopolitics and history.

Think this is logical.

Aim of PP is not to make all friends but its also a place where people should have the patience to listen to other povs without losing their cool.

 

[Hyperion66]

Haha, oh man, I am not accusing you of anything untoward in this reply but I cannot agree that current indian team has the best bowling attack any asian team ever assembled Wasim, Peak Waqar, Imran, Mushtaq / Qadir or Experienced Wasim, Peak Akhtar, Peak Saqlain, Waqar / peak Razzaq over Bumrah, Buvneshwar / Yadav, Ashwin any day! No amount of stats will convince me otherwise, specially if they don’t take into account the amount of games India play at home..

my hunch is that in all conditions, against quality batting, I would rather have either of those Pak attacks. Interesting thought though.. Indian bowling attack is the most proven of Asian teams currently, but not all time in my book.

[MENTION=133760]Abdullah719[/MENTION] Sirji, don't wanna bother you or anything but is it possible to get a stat table for the part in bold? I am just curious to know how many matches they played together, the average and SR of that bowling unit and their individual stats as well. If possible a country-wise breakdown would be great.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

Indians fans were able to predict Babar’s capability before Pak ones though, in this forum many Pak fans were asking him to be dropped lol..

In all honesty Babar doesn’t bother me as much Naseem , its more envy than being threatened by SSA Naseem combo .. no idea abt Rauf other than Undertaker slit throat.. but lets see only time will tell how it pans out.

I'm not talking about guys like you. The ones I'm talking about know who they are. If Babar becomes the best batsman in the world, they are gonna be stressed out.

 

[transparent opacity]

Think this is logical.

Aim of PP is not to make all friends but its also a place where people should have the patience to listen to other povs without losing their cool.

sir, i did not lose my cool. i was just surprised by the comments. but i see your point.

 

[FreePalestine]

Can't generalize guys. I am sure many of us are here because we genuinely admire PCT, if not the present bunch but the teams that we all saw growing up in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s. This is the only forum I am a member of and enjoy my stay. Because of time constraints I can't post regularly but whatever I have seen here the quality of discussion and moderation is top-notch. Few posters can't get over their biases but if you see the larger picture most PPers are genuine cricket fans, easy going and knowledgeable as well. Don't take random forum comments to heart, webspace can be a cruel world especially when moderation is relaxed even a wee bit because of anonymity and the undeniable fact that many angry, frustrated, unemployed youth want an outlet for their daily problems. Thankfully PP moderation is excellent for most part especially in the cricket section, admins/mods are the real stars, have one look at Ind/Pak related youtube comments and be grateful for the stellar work the guys here are doing.

I enjoy following PCT, have learnt a lot about Pakistani culture, society, Islam etc from my stay here and some misconceptions have been put to rest. Truth be told this forum is not just about cricket, politics but an excellent representative of your country before a global audience. Your team may take a while to get to test number 1 spot or win a WC but PP will be the gold standard when it comes to cricket discussion for a significant period of time. Hope you guys can keep it that way and enrich the lives of die hard fans whilst at the same time attracting quality posters from around the globe. I don't know about other forums that are being discussed here, but aim should be to be to improve quality of PP than bicker about others, crown may wear heavy but that's the challenge, maintaining/bettering the quality of this forum irrespective of what others do and how the world changes around us.

PS- I definitely think the quality of discussion in TP&S can become better, more civil, less hate/divisiveness/anger but when it comes to cricket section no complaints.

Wise thoughts on the nature of online discourse and how not to take things to heart.

I agree, the 2010’s haven’t been quite as good as earlier generations. Who knows what the future will bring? Inshallah this crop of bowlers continue to grow. Naseem, Shaheen, Shinwari, Abbas, Amir, Rauf. Got some other quick young, erratic ones like Musa and Hasnain. Batting still has major concerns though. Selection will play a big role in how these guys develop, I feel. Misbah has performed a bit inconsistently. Some frustrating selections in Australia.

 

[Abdullah719]

[MENTION=133760]Abdullah719[/MENTION] Sirji, don't wanna bother you or anything but is it possible to get a stat table for the part in bold? I am just curious to know how many matches they played together, the average and SR of that bowling unit and their individual stats as well. If possible a country-wise breakdown would be great.

Replied here to avoid derailing: http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...g-attack-in-the-world&p=10607570#post10607570

 

[Hyperion66]

Replied here to avoid derailing: http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...g-attack-in-the-world&p=10607570#post10607570

Many thanks

I really appreciate it.

 

[Savak]

The sentiment works both ways.

India's loss in World Cup semi finals was pretty widely celebrated in Pakistan from what I recall.

As it should be. It is a rivalry.

That defeat was celebrated because of the blatant way India underperformed against England to have Pakistan kicked out of the WC

 

[Saj]

apart from a few posters others have been very appreciative. besides, constructive criticism should always be welcomed.
brother do not expect them to support pak given our geopolitics and history.

The vast majority of cricket fans around the world are part of the cricket family and respect others viewpoints and appreciate opposition players. However there is a small minority from all nations who have a nasty streak in them and will never respect or appreciate the opposition, no matter how good the opposition is as a team, or even individual performances.

 

[ahsan17]

It's not about rivalry and whatnot. The way some Indians have been propping up BD as the next NZ in terms of cricketing prowess (not saying it outright, but suggesting it as much) and the next Turkey in the economic sense, while Pakistan going down to the level of Zimbabwe or Somalia, that shows a mix of delusion and malicious intent.

 

[Hasan123]

Most fans on here are not supportive of Indian cricket lol. The way our fans play down anything an Indian achieves is hilarious.

The Indian fans on on this forum are no a problem. It’s the ones on other platforms who mock and do not support Pakistan cricket.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Haha, oh man, I am not accusing you of anything untoward in this reply but I cannot agree that current indian team has the best bowling attack any asian team ever assembled Wasim, Peak Waqar, Imran, Mushtaq / Qadir or Experienced Wasim, Peak Akhtar, Peak Saqlain, Waqar / peak Razzaq over Bumrah, Buvneshwar / Yadav, Ashwin any day! No amount of stats will convince me otherwise, specially if they don’t take into account the amount of games India play at home..

my hunch is that in all conditions, against quality batting, I would rather have either of those Pak attacks. Interesting thought though.. Indian bowling attack is the most proven of Asian teams currently, but not all time in my book.

in all conditions? I would choose indian attack over any Pakistani great attack. They has too many big names but performance never truly reflected that.

best trio would be imran, bumrah and wasim. I would pick ashwin over saqlain in tests.

so yes pakistan have the best pace bowlers from Asia.

 

[PakLFC]

And you expect India to WANT Pak national side to overtake India???

India fans identified and appreciated Babar at the time many Pak fans were looking were Shahid Afridi Boom Boom kind of batters and were totally unimpressed with Babar.

India always were fans of Wasim, Shoaib, Imran, Waqar. They are not very appreciative to the current crop because there are not many who are really good. There are a couple of teen bowlers who are probably better than the previous crop but have not proven anything except in one match against a poor travelling team. Prior to that they lost T20s at home against SL and took a sum total of 3 wickets in the last test against Australia.

It’s time Pakistan starts beating India in world cups, SENA teams in or out of Asia. Otherwise; Pakistan has not really given enough reasons for Indian fans to appreciate them.

That is not the point. The question was not the reason but is India unsupportive of Pak Cricket? The rest of what you blabbering on about is irreverent to the thread.

 

[barah_admi]

Best cricket forum on the web, simple. That's like asking why do so many Pakistanis use Facebook, something developed by a Jew. Just look at the post above me.

Why would a Pakistani have something against a Jew as opposed to a Brit, American, Ghanian, Nigerian have against Jews?

When it comes to India v Pakistan there is a clear divide and as we often see from almost all the Indian posters on here, almost every single post is anti- Pakistan cricket, anti-Pakistan cricketERS and anti-Pakistan in terms of politics, society and religion. This is mere fact and you can see it with your own eyes on here.

Now, the question is, why would an Indian, join a Pakistani forum, to do that ?

 

[Mamoon]

Let’s make something clear - Pakistan and India are not active cricket rivals anymore. Indian cricket is lightyears ahead of Pakistan cricket now.

You cannot really have a rivalry when one team is so overwhelmingly stronger and dominant. It is probably worse than the Ashes of the 1990s.

However, Pakistan vs India matches are now hyped up and grab attention because of the political enmity between the two countries and also because of the history, but there is no active cricket rivalry anymore.

England vs Australia and India vs Australia are the two big active rivalries today.

 

[MenInG]

Lets make this clear - Pakistan and India are great rivals - every game they play is a sell out; you dont need to look too far down the line for that, just see what happened in the WC encounter.

Its fine to have needle between both sets of fans and we really should not expect any sympathy for each other but what can be expected is appreciation for good cricket. That is all that is needed and expected.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Lets make this clear - Pakistan and India are great rivals - every game they play is a sell out; you dont need to look too far down the line for that, just see what happened in the WC encounter.

Its fine to have needle between both sets of fans and we really should not expect any sympathy for each other but what can be expected is appreciation for good cricket. That is all that is needed and expected.

Its a sell out only because of political and historical reasons. Just look at that WC encounter . Did it look like any rivalry when one team won in such a clinical fashion?

 

[MenInG]

Its a sell out only because of political and historical reasons. Just look at that WC encounter . Did it look like any rivalry when one team won in such a clinical fashion?

Not sure how you define rivalry. And that's a different discussion.

If you want to call it "intense interest in the affairs of each other in the field of sport"- that's fine with me.

I had Indian friends saving all year to fly out to England to watch that game or plane loads going to see game in Dubai in Asia Cup too.

In this thread we are not discussing head to head records - we are talking about why Indians (and some living in Pakistan) are so anti-Pakistan

 

[tyron_woodley]

Its a sell out only because of political and historical reasons. Just look at that WC encounter . Did it look like any rivalry when one team won in such a clinical fashion?

yes overall h2h in the 2010era has favoured india by a huge margin but they still destroyed us in 2017. It's still a too rivalry. Unpredictable rivalry. Pakistan can show up when it matters.

 

[JattMaula]

Its a sell out only because of political and historical reasons. Just look at that WC encounter . Did it look like any rivalry when one team won in such a clinical fashion?

Rivalry don't need equally weighted opponents.

 

[Mesozoic]

Indo-Pak cricket rivalry is very much alive and kicking. Anyone who says otherwise is kidding themselves. The only good thing that has come out of not playing bilaterals is that it has kept the intensity from going down due to the evident gap between the two sides. I'm pretty sure that an Ind-Pak game will attract more attention than an Ind-Aus game or any other fixture as a matter of fact.

 

[BaankeJi]

Why would a Pakistani have something against a Jew as opposed to a Brit, American, Ghanian, Nigerian have against Jews?

When it comes to India v Pakistan there is a clear divide and as we often see from almost all the Indian posters on here, almost every single post is anti- Pakistan cricket, anti-Pakistan cricketERS and anti-Pakistan in terms of politics, society and religion. This is mere fact and you can see it with your own eyes on here.

Now, the question is, why would an Indian, join a Pakistani forum, to do that ?

Not correct. There are many Indian posters posting pro Pakistani stuff here.

 

[BaankeJi]

Lets make this clear - Pakistan and India are great rivals - every game they play is a sell out; you dont need to look too far down the line for that, just see what happened in the WC encounter.

Its fine to have needle between both sets of fans and we really should not expect any sympathy for each other but what can be expected is appreciation for good cricket. That is all that is needed and expected.

Rivalry is alive. Rivalry is built upon the basis of history and won't vanish just because one side is better.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Not sure how you define rivalry. And that's a different discussion.

If you want to call it "intense interest in the affairs of each other in the field of sport"- that's fine with me.

I had Indian friends saving all year to fly out to England to watch that game or plane loads going to see game in Dubai in Asia Cup too.

In this thread we are not discussing head to head records - we are talking about why Indians (and some living in Pakistan) are so anti-Pakistan

I might be wrong but this thread is only about cricket . Indian fans on pp atleast rarely desire the destruction of PAK cricket or anything related to it . We celebrate Pakistan losses and troll yall but that's part and parcel of what defines a sporting rivalry. It just seems to me that far too many Pakistani fans assumed that Pakistan 's dominance over India was the 'natural' state of affairs and they were happy to dish it out. Now that the tables have turned somewhat , they can't seem to take it on the chin. Not all mind you. Just a few.

 

[Darkrai]

This sort of thing happens in sports, especially between teams that are rivals or have a history, like Barcelona and Real Madrid fans or Man City and Liverpool fans for example.

When it comes to Pakistan and India, some fans tend to take things personally, especially us Pakistani fans. We have suffered through many years of mediocre players and an unprofessional cricket board, but now Babar Azam and some promising upcoming players have given us hope. When some Indians find faults even in those players or try their utmost to degrade them, Pakistani fans take it personally-and perhaps rightly so, given that seems to be the purpose of few posters, not all.

Anyways, it's best to avoid posters that make ridiculous claims like Babar Azam is not a T20 player or will never be an impact player.

 

[Itachi]

That is not the point. The question was not the reason but is India unsupportive of Pak Cricket? The rest of what you blabbering on about is irreverent to the thread.

That was actually the point. Someone showed you the reason but you disregard it because it doesn't fit your agenda.

Its time people not only complain but also analyze why it is happening.

 

[Itachi]

Not sure how you define rivalry. And that's a different discussion.

If you want to call it "intense interest in the affairs of each other in the field of sport"- that's fine with me.

I had Indian friends saving all year to fly out to England to watch that game or plane loads going to see game in Dubai in Asia Cup too.

In this thread we are not discussing head to head records - we are talking about why Indians (and some living in Pakistan) are so anti-Pakistan

Because it's a loop. A initiates B and in return B initiates A.

I think what most Pakistani posters don't realize is, they are doing the same but since, it's a pakistani major community, that makes it acceptable and they continue doing it without even realizing it. The few times where they are at receiving end, threads like these pop up.

I'll ask OP to post unsupportive comment from Indian posters here and I am promising that I'll post equally unsupportive comment from Pakistan here about India. Let's see where the hatred is bigger.

 

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

Most Indians who follow cricket hate Pakistan. It's not that hard to understand. Does that bother you? Why do you want Indian support?

 

[barah_admi]

Not correct. There are many Indian posters posting pro Pakistani stuff here.

Tag them all, providing quotes with all of them.

 

[MenInG]

Tag them all, providing quotes with all of them.

No need to do this here.

We can assume that there are some who post good things about Pakistan and move on with the discussion.

 

[Saj]

Most Indians who follow cricket hate Pakistan. It's not that hard to understand. Does that bother you? Why do you want Indian support?

Where does anyone say they are desperate for Indian support?

 

[Rana]

Because it's a loop. A initiates B and in return B initiates A.

I think what most Pakistani posters don't realize is, they are doing the same but since, it's a pakistani major community, that makes it acceptable and they continue doing it without even realizing it. The few times where they are at receiving end, threads like these pop up.

I'll ask OP to post unsupportive comment from Indian posters here and I am promising that I'll post equally unsupportive comment from Pakistan here about India. Let's see where the hatred is bigger.

I may not like Indian arrogance but I sure do appreciate a good Indian cricketer when I see one.

 

[Rana]

Let’s make something clear - Pakistan and India are not active cricket rivals anymore. Indian cricket is lightyears ahead of Pakistan cricket now.

You cannot really have a rivalry when one team is so overwhelmingly stronger and dominant. It is probably worse than the Ashes of the 1990s.

However, Pakistan vs India matches are now hyped up and grab attention because of the political enmity between the two countries and also because of the history, but there is no active cricket rivalry anymore.

England vs Australia and India vs Australia are the two big active rivalries today.

You avoided me popping up the Shubman Gill remark. Let’s go past the first hurdle and then we will hear your thoughts on what is rivalry

 

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

Where does anyone say they are desperate for Indian support?

The OP sounds like he wants Indians to support Pakistan cricket.

 

[Saj]

The OP sounds like he wants Indians to support Pakistan cricket.

I suggest you read the OP again....slowly.

 

[Mamoon]

You avoided me popping up the Shubman Gill remark. Let’s go past the first hurdle and then we will hear your thoughts on what is rivalry

What hurdle? 99% of the Indian players are better than their Pakistani counterparts, and Babar is the only Pakistani player who will get into the Indian side at the moment.

But Babar has not been sent from the heavens. He is a world class batsman but he is not in the league of someone like Kohli, who is among the top 5 batsmen of all time.

The dynamics of Pakistan and Indian cricket are completely different today. If Babar was India, he wouldn’t have made his debut before 2017-18 and he probably would still be waiting for his maiden Test cap.

On the contrary, someone possessing the talent and class of Gill would already be a star for Pakistan.

There is actually no evidence that Babar is a better player than Gill, just because Babar is an established world class player while Gill has only played 2 ODIs so far.

You can only conclusively call Babar a better player if (a) they were of the same age and Babar would have bypassed him or (b) after they play a similar number of games at the international level.

However, you cannot call player A better than player B when player B hasn’t had the same chances because he plays for a vastly superior team.

Babar did not have to compete with the likes of Kohli and Rohit to get into the side, two ODI batsmen miles better than anyone Pakistan has ever produced.

Similarly, there is no evidence that Babar is better than Shaw either. We need to understand that the standards of batting between the two countries are completely different, and it does not take much for a young Pakistani batsman to establish himself in Pakistan.

In India, batsmen who score triple-hundreds in their only second Test, that too against England, cannot even maintain their place in the squad because of the competition. In comparison, a Pakistani batsman who scored a triple-hundred in his second Test would milk that performance for a decade.

 

[Rana]

What hurdle? 99% of the Indian players are better than their Pakistani counterparts, and Babar is the only Pakistani player who will get into the Indian side at the moment.

But Babar has not been sent from the heavens. He is a world class batsman but he is not in the league of someone like Kohli, who is among the top 5 batsmen of all time.

The dynamics of Pakistan and Indian cricket are completely different today. If Babar was India, he wouldn’t have made his debut before 2017-18 and he probably would still be waiting for his maiden Test cap.

On the contrary, someone possessing the talent and class of Gill would already be a star for Pakistan.

There is actually no evidence that Babar is a better player than Gill, just because Babar is an established world class player while Gill has only played 2 ODIs so far.

You can only conclusively call Babar a better player if (a) they were of the same age and Babar would have bypassed him or (b) after they play a similar number of games at the international level.

However, you cannot call player A better than player B when player B hasn’t had the same chances because he plays for a vastly superior team.

Babar did not have to compete with the likes of Kohli and Rohit to get into the side, two ODI batsmen miles better than anyone Pakistan has ever produced.

Similarly, there is no evidence that Babar is better than Shaw either. We need to understand that the standards of batting between the two countries are completely different, and it does not take much for a young Pakistani batsman to establish himself in Pakistan.

In India, batsmen who score triple-hundreds in their only second Test, that too against England, cannot even maintain their place in the squad because of the competition. In comparison, a Pakistani batsman who scored a triple-hundred in his second Test would milk that performance for a decade.

This is my point!! Why do you disregard that which is a fact over fantastical theories? It’s the equivalent of Pakistanis claiming Bumrah would not have been picked to represent Pakistan in the Wasim/Waqar/ Akhtar era as a fast bowler. We don’t know if this is true but you seem to be absolute in your assessment of anything negative about Pakistan.

 

[tyron_woodley]

This is my point!! Why do you disregard that which is a fact over fantastical theories? It’s the equivalent of Pakistanis claiming Bumrah would not have been picked to represent Pakistan in the Wasim/Waqar/ Akhtar era as a fast bowler. We don’t know if this is true but you seem to be absolute in your assessment of anything negative about Pakistan.

current indian attack has results to prove how good they truly are in test cricket.

in saying that imran and wasim are hard to displace from an Asia 11 even in test cricket.

bumrah would be in the top 11 for sure based on his ability but he still has some way to go in terms of longevity.

shami probably could make it too. Better than akthar. waqar underperformed vs the best teams so I dint include him.

 

[MenInG]

Guys - keep discussions related to cricket and also to comments which are on PP only.

 

[barah_admi]

The funniest part about this thread is indian fans proving just what OP is alluding too

 

[Itachi]

This is my point!! Why do you disregard that which is a fact over fantastical theories? It’s the equivalent of Pakistanis claiming Bumrah would not have been picked to represent Pakistan in the Wasim/Waqar/ Akhtar era as a fast bowler. We don’t know if this is true but you seem to be absolute in your assessment of anything negative about Pakistan.

Reality is, if Bumrah was a pakistani and played in the 90s, he wouldn't have gotten the exposure that he got in indias case. He would have played 1 or 2 odd games here and there but competing with the legendary bowlers would have been so much that there would have been a psychological disadvantage. This isn't disregarding anything. These are just reality checks.

Babar got the opportunity as there aren't even good pak natsman around and better late than never, he is utilizing it which is good for him. But he has a long way to go.

These aren't attitudes. These are just logics.

A system tends to prefer an old player with established quality as it is easier to build a team. If there are legendary players around, however talented the new guy may be, he will have to wait for his turn. And if there isn't, then even a mediocore gets the opportunity.

Pakistan names are top in these lists because let's be frank, quality of pakistan cricket has gone way backward since early 2000s. And this isn't just me claiming it but the rankings itself reflects it (whatever criticism the ranking system may have, you can't justify the slump of pakistan team for that).

 

[praveen]

I suggest you read the OP again....slowly.

That is exactly how OP’s post sounds, requiring validation and well wishes for Pakistan talent from Indian fans. But he fails to understand that the current team is very poor for rival fans to hold them in higher regard. Prove it on the field and respect will follow, like it’s always been the case.

 

[Saj]

That is exactly how OP’s post sounds, requiring validation and well wishes for Pakistan talent from Indian fans. But he fails to understand that the current team is very poor for rival fans to hold them in higher regard. Prove it on the field and respect will follow, like it’s always been the case.

He's not asking for that at all. What he's saying is that some are just full of hatred and will never respect Pakistan players and will always look for negatives, which is what we see from some here on PakPassion.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

The funniest part about this thread is indian fans proving just what OP is alluding too

Funny is them trying to justify their bigotry.