Are the Indian cricket team bottlers in Test cricket?

[PakLFC]

Struggle to defeat even Zimbabwe??

WI series was 2-0 in 2015, and if not for washout, it could have been 3-0.

So we have to go back to 2015 now!!!

 

[PakLFC]

Pak lost the 2nd test by an innings i.e not able to match Eng 1st innings score of 363 by batting twice. 174 and 134 is their score in each innings. If you think they would have won the 5 match test series, well I dont know. We cant debate on would have...could have. But Pak never won a test series in Eng since 1998 so I would not be optimistic.

SL won the test match in 2014 with all their Sangas and Mahelas. But it was 1 match win and win the series. Thats how flukey 2 test series are. As I said before, if India series in 2014 was also 2 test series, they also would have won 1-0.

Not sure if Indian team would struggle in Zimb but I think I know a certain team dropped a test in Zimbabwe...lol.

So what if we lost by an innings? You are really scratching the bottom of the barrel now seeking cheap excuses. It is not as if India have never lost by an innings that you seeking such excuses to hold on to some pride now. I don't know how many times have Pak toured England since 1998.

We can go back in history all we want instead lets stick to India losing to England in a series you guy's were boasting of how easy it would be. That is what makes it so sweet that England made easy work of your boys!! 3-1 to England at the moment is no fluke if that is what you are suggesting. You have been outplayed good and well in fact it's Kohli who has saved you from complete humiliation. Without hime you'd be a bigger mess.

Shows your desperation when your talking about past Pak losses to make yourself feel better. Remember, what we did to you in last years CT final if you want to talk about the latest Indo-Pak match!!

 

[Ab Fan]

So we have to go back to 2015 now!!!

Yes because India played WI last in 2015. This team has got stronger than it. Anyone can see that India will easily defeat WI in WI, let alone beating Zimbabwe in Zim.

However, I do agree that India havent been able to take the hard yard and turn the series on its head against other top teams like other great teams do. In comparison, Pakistan, who is a terrible team, seems to punch above their weight, and end up showing decent results overall.

 

[the_outsider]

So we have to go back to 2015 now!!!

July, 2016 actually.

And the 2-2 draw of Pak that everyone has mentioned on this thread was also in 2016 so if that's on the table it makes sense that other tours will be too.

I know you have great hatred for India and can't wait to see them "humiliated" but maybe educate yourself a little about cricket before coming to a cricket forum? Otherwise India won't be the only one being humiliated, alright?

 

[Ab Fan]

So we have to go back to 2015 now!!!

July 2016 it was.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Yes because India played WI last in 2015. This team has got stronger than it. Anyone can see that India will easily defeat WI in WI, let alone beating Zimbabwe in Zim.

However, I do agree that India havent been able to take the hard yard and turn the series on its head against other top teams like other great teams do. In comparison, Pakistan, who is a terrible team, seems to punch above their weight, and end up showing decent results overall.

How is said team terrible, if they show decent results overall? What did I just read?

 

[the_outsider]

How is said team terrible, if they show decent results overall? What did I just read?

His point was that a decent team, that drew in England really shouldn't be losing test matches to Zimbabwe.

 

[Ab Fan]

How is said team terrible, if they show decent results overall? What did I just read?

Because you guys punch above your weight, which is why you managed to drew a series in England twice in three years. Your team gets smashed in Aus, SA and NZ and you end up losing matches to WI both home and away and got whitewashed by SL in UAE. However, you did punched above your weights in England tour and twice in three years, so full credit for that and that's what makes you quite a decent team.

In contrast, India is a team which has got one of their best ever bowling attack, and it is arguably the second greatest Indian team ever but unfortunately they are bottlers and which is why unable to take hard yards. So, to their credit, they will demolish every one at home and beat the likes of Sri Lanka and WI away as well and create moments of happiness in the other tough overseas tours but just not capable enough to turn the tough away series on its head.

 

[PakLFC]

Yes because India played WI last in 2015. This team has got stronger than it. Anyone can see that India will easily defeat WI in WI, let alone beating Zimbabwe in Zim.

However, I do agree that India havent been able to take the hard yard and turn the series on its head against other top teams like other great teams do. In comparison, Pakistan, who is a terrible team, seems to punch above their weight, and end up showing decent results overall.

Talk about today. Never mind ancient history that you Indian fans are obsessed with. Today's West Indies are so poor that even India can defeat them which is no great accomplishment. You may have won in 2015 that is not to suggest you'll be doing it again. Pak ain't no "terrible side" at all only that you are discrediting them by referring to their victories as "punching above their weight". That coming from an Indian fan whose team only wins at homes is real weird!

 

[PakLFC]

July, 2016 actually.

And the 2-2 draw of Pak that everyone has mentioned on this thread was also in 2016 so if that's on the table it makes sense that other tours will be too.

I know you have great hatred for India and can't wait to see them "humiliated" but maybe educate yourself a little about cricket before coming to a cricket forum? Otherwise India won't be the only one being humiliated, alright?

What 2-2 draw of Pak are you talking about here boy? You are being humiliated but what makes it even better is seeing Indian fans weep. You are right when saying how I feel about your country that I will not at all deny. You lost two crucial series in the RSA and England that makes me coz it's a fact as much as it lights a fire under Indian fans! Why talk about 2016 when we can about last years CT final??

 

[barah_admi]

I'm trying to think if India have ever had a great second innings batsman or if, when needing wickets, a good enough bowler who was not a spinner?

I think the answer to both is no.

 

[Ab Fan]

Talk about today. Never mind ancient history that you Indian fans are obsessed with. Today's West Indies are so poor that even India can defeat them which is no great accomplishment. You may have won in 2015 that is not to suggest you'll be doing it again. Pak ain't no "terrible side" at all only that you are discrediting them by referring to their victories as "punching above their weight". That coming from an Indian fan whose team only wins at homes is real weird!

You are missing the context. If I am an Indian fan, how come I make a thread like this where I call my team a bottler??

On WI, well, you were the one who said they are so poor overseas that they will struggle to beat Zim in Zim. Surely WI of 2016 were superior team to Zimbabwe(or will you disagree on that part as well) and India thrased them absolutely in their backyard. So, that was the context there.

On Pakistan, yes, they are punching above their weight because it is an average team who has lost matches to West Indies and New Zealand at home(UAE) and lost series to weak SL in UAE as well. Their performance at home has been mediocre in recent times and with no Younis Khan,things dont look any good for them. However, they punched above their weight in the England tour and came up with a series draw twice in three years, which means although they are underdogs but still unpredictable.

On other hand, India is like the older South African team. As great as it looks and the ruthlessness with which it dominates mid-level or lower level team away and everyone at home, unfortunately when the battle is tougher, they bottle it out.

 

[Xoib]

You are missing the context. If I am an Indian fan, how come I make a thread like this where I call my team a bottler??

On WI, well, you were the one who said they are so poor overseas that they will struggle to beat Zim in Zim. Surely WI of 2016 were superior team to Zimbabwe(or will you disagree on that part as well) and India thrased them absolutely in their backyard. So, that was the context there.

On Pakistan, yes, they are punching above their weight because it is an average team who has lost matches to West Indies and New Zealand at home(UAE) and lost series to weak SL in UAE as well. Their performance at home has been mediocre in recent times and with no Younis Khan,things dont look any good for them. However, they punched above their weight in the England tour and came up with a series draw twice in three years, which means although they are underdogs but still unpredictable.

On other hand, India is like the older South African team. As great as it looks and the ruthlessness with which it dominates mid-level or lower level team away and everyone at home, unfortunately when the battle is tougher, they bottle it out.

you are a bitter Indian fan who probably cries himself to sleep every night. Pakistan historically has the best away record from sub cont we do well in England and in NZL our series lost to Nz last time was our first loss in NZ in 32 years one series loss does not make us a poor traveler to that country. Yes our record is poor in SA and Aus but even India sucks when they travel away mostly their record since 2011 in Aus Nz,Eng,SA is 21 defeats and 3 wins this is with your so called best ever fast bowling.

 

[Ab Fan]

you are a bitter Indian fan who probably cries himself to sleep every night. Pakistan historically has the best away record from sub cont we do well in England and in NZL our series lost to Nz last time was our first loss in NZ in 32 years one series loss does not make us a poor traveler to that country. Yes our record is poor in SA and Aus but even India sucks when they travel away mostly their record since 2011 in Aus Nz,Eng,SA is 21 defeats and 3 wins this is with your so called best ever fast bowling.

LMAO, why are you going historically?? Did India had the so called best fast bowling all these years. India's best team was between 2007-11(till WC) who went on to win series in England, New Zealand and drew in SA and should have drawn/won in Aus as well if not for some terrible umpiring.Also, the fast bowling attack wasn't good since 2011 as you are taking that phase into consideration, not sure why. It got bettee only in last few years.

On topic, we are talking about present. And currently, Pakistan is a mediocre team. They got whacked completely in Aus, SA and NZ and lost matches to the likes of WI home and away and just got whitewashed by SL in UAE.

Not sure how many times I have to repeat this. But yeah, you punched above your weight in England series while we bottled. That's the point and there is no other way of looking to it. It is as simple as one can understand.

Now , you tell me what you want me to call, "A team that loses series to SL and matches to WI at home"? A great team just because they punched above their weight in two tests England series?? Atleast I am not labelling that series as a fluke one.

 

[Xoib]

LMAO, why are you going historically?? Did India had the so called best fast bowling all these years. India's best team was between 2007-11(till WC) who went on to win series in England, New Zealand and drew in SA and should have drawn/won in Aus as well if not for some terrible umpiring.Also, the fast bowling attack wasn't good since 2011 as you are taking that phase into consideration, not sure why. It got bettee only in last few years.

On topic, we are talking about present. And currently, Pakistan is a mediocre team. They got whacked completely in Aus, SA and NZ and lost matches to the likes of WI home and away and just got whitewashed by SL in UAE.

Not sure how many times I have to repeat this. But yeah, you punched above your weight in England series while we bottled. That's the point and there is no other way of looking to it. It is as simple as one can understand.

Now , you tell me what you want me to call, "A team that loses series to SL and matches to WI at home"? A great team just because they punched above their weight in two tests England series?? Atleast I am not labelling that series as a fluke one.

On present India has a 3-21 away record we might be garbage but that does not mean you are not crap.Case closed.

 

[Ab Fan]

On present India has a 3-21 away record we might be garbage but that does not mean you are not crap.Case closed.

Oh god!, you are mixing things up here. Why are you including those 2011 tours to England and Australia which has no connection with the present team? That team was playing with some of post expiry date players which is why they ended up losing so many matches between 2011-2013.

The correct indication for this team is when we begin since 2015. It will be the ongoing overseas tour that will give an indication of how this team performs away. They have missed out golden chances of winning in SA and England but still this team won't have been this competitive enough if they were crap. They just didnt took the hard yards and weren't able to change the course of the game.

I am sorry to say but it is a very poor understanding of cricket if we are calling a team that wins everything at home, beats mid to low-tier teams away and are competitive against the top teams, although fails to get the results going towards their side as "a crap team".

 

[Xoib]

Oh god!, you are mixing things up here. Why are you including those 2011 tours to England and Australia which has no connection with the present team? That team was playing with some of post expiry date players which is why they ended up losing so many matches between 2011-2013.

The correct indication for this team is when we begin since 2015. It will be the ongoing overseas tour that will give an indication of how this team performs away. They have missed out golden chances of winning in SA and England but still this team won't have been this competitive enough if they were crap. They just didnt took the hard yards and weren't able to change the course of the game.

I am sorry to say but it is a very poor understanding of cricket if we are calling a team that wins everything at home, beats mid to low-tier teams away and are competitive against the top teams, although fails to get the results going towards their side as "a crap team".

at the end of the day if the best ranked team in the world is going to SA and England playing against their worst teams for this decade and still entering the final test of the series as a dead rubber shows they have been mediocre over the course of that series you can paint brush it
anyway you like not doing hard yards or loosing key moments blah blah fact is come final test series has been over for India. Infact India has been lucky that they were not up against Eng-Sa Circa 2010-2013 or they would have been whitewashed in to oblivion.

 

[the_outsider]

Why India is the number 1 side in the world right now

The win-loss ratio in home Tests from 1 Jan 2015:


15.0 - India (W15/L1)
6.00 - Australia (12/2)
3.50 - South Africa (14/4)
3.33 - New Zealand (10/3)
1.88 - England (17/9)
1.38 - Sri Lanka (11/8)
1.33 - Pakistan (4/3)
0.63 - West Indies (5/8)
0.50 - Bangladesh (2/4)


The win-loss ratio in away Tests from 1 Jan 2015:


1.50 - India (W9/L6)
0.90 - Pakistan (9/10)
0.75 - Australia (9/12)
0.60 - Sri Lanka (6/10)
0.44 - South Africa (4/9)
0.43 - New Zealand (3/7)
0.29 - England (4/14)
0.27 - West Indies (3/11)
0.13 - Bangladesh (1/8)


The win-loss ratio for Asian Teams outside Asia and non-Asian teams in Asia from 1 Jan 2015:


0.80 - India (W4/L5)
0.55 - Pakistan (5/9)
0.33 - Australia (2/6)
0.25 - West Indies (1/4)
0.14 - England (1/7)
0.11 - Sri Lanka (1/9)
0.00 - New Zealand (0/3)
0.00 - South Africa (0/5)
0.00 - Bangladesh (0/6)


The win-loss ratio for Asian Teams in SENA and non-Asian teams in Asia from 1 Jan 2015:


0.40 - India (W2/L5)
0.37 - Pakistan (3/8)
0.33 - Australia (2/6)
0.25 - West Indies (1/4)
0.14 - England (1/7)
0.00 - New Zealand (0/3)
0.00 - Bangladesh (0/4)
0.00 - South Africa (0/5)
0.00 - Sri Lanka (0/8)

 

[Ab Fan]

at the end of the day if the best ranked team in the world is going to SA and England playing against their worst teams for this decade and still entering the final test of the series as a dead rubber shows they have been mediocre over the course of that series you can paint brush it
anyway you like not doing hard yards or loosing key moments blah blah fact is come final test series has been over for India. Infact India has been lucky that they were not up against Eng-Sa Circa 2010-2013 or they would have been whitewashed in to oblivion.

India toured SA and drew SA in 2010 in SA 1-1.

 

[Ab Fan]

at the end of the day if the best ranked team in the world is going to SA and England playing against their worst teams for this decade and still entering the final test of the series as a dead rubber shows they have been mediocre over the course of that series you can paint brush it
anyway you like not doing hard yards or loosing key moments blah blah fact is come final test series has been over for India. Infact India has been lucky that they were not up against Eng-Sa Circa 2010-2013 or they would have been whitewashed in to oblivion.

SA were hardly a weak team. They had AB de Villiers back who had a point to prove to his critics.

Anyways, I am not here to defend any team. I just illustrated the facts. India is still the best team in the world without any shadow of doubt.

 

[PakLFC]

You are missing the context. If I am an Indian fan, how come I make a thread like this where I call my team a bottler??

On WI, well, you were the one who said they are so poor overseas that they will struggle to beat Zim in Zim. Surely WI of 2016 were superior team to Zimbabwe(or will you disagree on that part as well) and India thrased them absolutely in their backyard. So, that was the context there.

On Pakistan, yes, they are punching above their weight because it is an average team who has lost matches to West Indies and New Zealand at home(UAE) and lost series to weak SL in UAE as well. Their performance at home has been mediocre in recent times and with no Younis Khan,things dont look any good for them. However, they punched above their weight in the England tour and came up with a series draw twice in three years, which means although they are underdogs but still unpredictable.

On other hand, India is like the older South African team. As great as it looks and the ruthlessness with which it dominates mid-level or lower level team away and everyone at home, unfortunately when the battle is tougher, they bottle it out.

So you are not an Indian fan? In that case enjoy there hammering as much as I am Being a fan does not mean your can't criticise your team like I do Pak. India defeated West Indies some years back I believe where as I am saying this team with it's overrated bowlers may not do the same. Why go back years over Pak's performance when recently we are doing okay. Drew here in England where India is being dropped like a bad habit! Overall Pak has a splendid record in the UAE in case it missed you. Also remember that massive handicap Pak is suffering by having not played at home for many years. I would like to see how other teams perform when being forced to play home away from home.

As for India I have repeated said that it's a lion that only roars at home. Away it becomes a ***** cat!

 

[Xoib]

India toured SA and drew SA in 2010 in SA 1-1.

And that was a high quality Indian team this team is nowhere close to that team

 

[Xoib]

SA were hardly a weak team. They had AB de Villiers back who had a point to prove to his critics.

Anyways, I am not here to defend any team. I just illustrated the facts. India is still the best team in the world without any shadow of doubt.

AB was back in test cricket after 2 years Steyn bowed in just one innings current SA side would get demoslished by most past Sa sides it is there weakest side in years.India is the best side in the world but it is also the weakest ever best side in the world