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Bhuvneshwar Kumar is the most gifted quick since Wasim Akram

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bujhee kom

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Not the best by returns or anything, but simply by talent. This guy seams and swings the ball a mile each way. I am shocked his record is so poor- he lacks pace and aggression - that can be the only explanation.

He bowls 75-85mph range, Wasim was 85-93 range. That makes a huge difference.

Each time I watch Bhuvi bowl I am amazed at his acumen and skill. Any insight as to why he doesnt wreck sides?

More skills than any current pacer - including Starc, Amir, Fizz or Anderson. Not as successful as them but more gift.
 
Yeah right!!!! He is worse than any of those players you mentioned. I will take even Rubel Hasan than him.
 
Stuart Binny has a 6/4 in favourable conditions as well.. just saying. Bhuvneshwar is as pedestrian as it gets when conditions aren't favouring him. I'll take Yadav over him on most occasions.
 
Shafi said:
Yeah right!!!! He is worse than any of those players you mentioned. I will take even Rubel Hasan than him.
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Yes I made that clear - he is not as successful than them but he is more gifted. He seams/swings it a mile. If he had pace he'd be a demon. No doubt.
 
Proactive_ said:
Stuart Binny has a 6/4 in favourable conditions as well.. just saying. Bhuvneshwar is as pedestrian as it gets when conditions aren't favouring him. I'll take Yadav over him on most occasions.
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That sort of ability and skill must be backed and nurtured. He is more skillful. Yadav has speed so he has that all condition impactibility.
 
lol


This the Pakistani equivalent of comparing every young batsman to Sachin

Bhuvi is good and perhaps on the world stage, by Indian standards he is great, but in a full strength Pak lineup he would be 3rd seamer at best. In odis i dont think he would make our team


Look how maligned Junaid Khan is by Pak supporter, yet he has comparable record with Bhuvi despite having a career destroyed by injuries
 
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pakistanigoneaussie said:
lol


This the Pakistani equivalent of comparing every young batsman to Sachin

Bhuvi is good and perhaps on the world stage, by Indian standards he is great, but in a full strength Pak lineup he would be 3rd seamer at best. In odis i dont think he would make our team
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Bhai it is merely a matter of accepting the ability he has. He hasnt lived up to his potential but I think that is owing to a lack of speed.
 
Bhuv isn't fit enough to polish the shoes of the guy who polishes Waz's shoes.
 
bujhee kom said:
Bhai it is merely a matter of accepting the ability he has. He hasnt lived up to his potential but I think that is owing to a lack of speed.
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so clearly he doesn't have the ability of others than, if he did he would have the pace to go with the swing?

Can you say he has more talent than Amir, Rabada, Starc etc?

they do all do the same things and they do it quicker
 
bujhee kom said:
Bhai it is merely a matter of accepting the ability he has. He hasnt lived up to his potential but I think that is owing to a lack of speed.
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So what do you think about people with less pace like Asif, Philander, Stuart Clark, Pollock, Vass, Mc Grath and they are so much better than him that it is uncomparable.
 
pakistanigoneaussie said:
so clearly he doesn't have the ability of others than, if he did he would have the pace to go with the swing?

Can you say he has more talent than Amir, Rabada, Starc etc?

they do all do the same things and they do it quicker
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He has more skills as a bowler. They are more intense and quicker and speed matters at that level a lot. But he does more with the ball.
 
Mobashir said:
So what do you think about people with less pace like Asif, Philander, Stuart Clark, Pollock, Vass, Mc Grath and they are so much better than him that it is uncomparable.
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Different additional positive attributes with similar skill.
 
bujhee kom said:
He has more skills as a bowler. They are more intense and quicker and speed matters at that level a lot. But he does more with the ball.
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yeah well praveen kumar moved the ball in some ridiculous ways that one tour of England, guessing he had the skill of wasim then ?


You not what Bhuvi is , an average version of Mohammad Asif, thats the person you are looking for.

Even in the CT final, Amir was moving the ball more than Bhuvi let alone the pace

Personally I suspect you are trolling
 
Ok maybe a little hyperbolic in the first post, but Bhuvi does have impressive skills as a bowler. On seaming tracks or overcast conditions, I'd pick him in an Asian X1. If he could bowl his 10 overs in the first 30 of an innings (so each ball is only 15 overs old), I'd pick him in all conditions. He is a great new ball bowler.
 
bujhee kom said:
Ok maybe a little hyperbolic in the first post, but Bhuvi does have impressive skills as a bowler. On seaming tracks or overcast conditions, I'd pick him in an Asian X1. If he could bowl his 10 overs in the first 30 of an innings (so each ball is only 15 overs old), I'd pick him in all conditions. He is a great new ball bowler.
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in that case I would take amir , fizz , bhuvi and nuwan kulasekara
 
BK is a much improved bowler. He now swings the ball at pace.

The problem is, most of his jaffas miss the edge of the bat. Looks good on screen. But nothing to show in Wickets column. His big swing his strength and also his weakness as it is not getting him enough wickets.

BK is an underrated death bowler. One of the best out there. Those yorkers and the deadly slower ones are hard to pick. He bowls economically most of the times.

I will have BK in the team any day. Some posters mentioning Rubel being better than BK have no clue.
 
he can swing the ball but doesn't have any pace and energy

just an updated version of praveen kumar
 
Leo23 said:
he can swing the ball but doesn't have any pace and energy

just an updated version of praveen kumar
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BK upped his pace in the last 1 year. He does not operate in high 120's anymore. He bowls in high 130's and even in 140's too.

People still have the image of BK from 2012-2015 where he used to trundle. Not anymore.
 
troodon said:
BK upped his pace in the last 1 year. He does not operate in high 120's anymore. He bowls in high 130's and even in 140's too.

People still have the image of BK from 2012-2015 where he used to trundle. Not anymore.
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his stats are still rubbish and he does not have any impact what so ever. merely looking good isn't enough.

his inability to take wickets cost india the champions trophy

he is light years below amir and hasan
 
Leo23 said:
his stats are still rubbish and he does not have any impact what so ever. merely looking good isn't enough.

his inability to take wickets cost india the champions trophy

he is light years below amir and hasan
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He has more raw talent even than Fizz. But he doesnt have the impact.
 
Joke of a thread by the OP.

Just to make him feel better, Bhuvi is a good bowler (nowhere near Akram level) the problem with him and LOI cricket are that batsmen just play him out and don't take the unnecessary risk against him because they know they can attack the other bowlers in the team.

Like they say bowlers hunt as a pack, especially pace bowlers.

But in saying that, still nowhere near Akram level, he is a Rao "The Constrictor" type bowler.
 
Proactive_ said:
Stuart Binny has figures of 4.4-2-4-6 while defending 105. Screw Bhuvi, Binny is the real deal and the heir to Akram's throne. Ain't it?
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You have to see the pitch that Binny played on.

This pitch is not a green one. But it had some assistance to the bowlers (both pacers and spinners) if they know how to use it.


Comparing duds like Binny to BK is laughworthy.

BK may not have great stats. He will improve them over time.
 
pakistanigoneaussie said:
lol


This the Pakistani equivalent of comparing every young batsman to Sachin

Bhuvi is good and perhaps on the world stage, by Indian standards he is great, but in a full strength Pak lineup he would be 3rd seamer at best. In odis i dont think he would make our team


Look how maligned Junaid Khan is by Pak supporter, yet he has comparable record with Bhuvi despite having a career destroyed by injuries
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Comparable? Mate, even if we just look at it statistically - Junaid Khan is leagues ahead of Bhuvi.
 
Bumrah is much better than BK. Taller, faster and great line and length. Oh and, .....wickets!
 
Still Bhuvi has better test stats than the present generation of Pakistani legends like amir, junaid khan
 
He's not gifted much but an extremely brave bowler who thinks very well

He is pretty content and consistent bowler who can give good momentum to the match by restricting runs in initial overs of his spell as well one of the best death bowlers at present

I would say him as a superior version of praveen kumar.If he gets his line and length right which he gets right mostly he will be a match winner
 
troodon said:
You have to see the pitch that Binny played on.

This pitch is not a green one. But it had some assistance to the bowlers (both pacers and spinners) if they know how to use it.


Comparing duds like Binny to BK is laughworthy.

BK may not have great stats. He will improve them over time.
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BK has horrendous stats and he has been around for 5 years. Let's look past him now, not doing that led us to endure Ishant Sharma for 10 years. Even Pandya already seems like a much better deal. Only place I can see BK in the team is in England, everywhere else he's almost a liability.
 
Proactive_ said:
Stuart Binny has figures of 4.4-2-4-6 while defending 105. Screw Bhuvi, Binny is the real deal and the heir to Akram's throne. Ain't it?
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Did I ask about Akram?
I asked about Rubel.
Anyway dont bother
 
Being economic isn't good enough for a frontline bowler, as an opening bowler, you need to be taking wickets, which he doesn't do that often, especially when conditions aren't in favor. Even if I restrict a team to 70 after 15 overs but they have wickets in hand they'll punish the bowlers for the other parts of the match.
 
since Wasim, Waqar, Mcgrath, the only two bowlers who were best and gifted were Asif and Amir. BK is not the most gifted bowler since Wasim.
 
aloo paratha said:
Being economic isn't good enough for a frontline bowler, as an opening bowler, you need to be taking wickets, which he doesn't do that often, especially when conditions aren't in favor. Even if I restrict a team to 70 after 15 overs but they have wickets in hand they'll punish the bowlers for the other parts of the match.
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Hence we have Bumrah at the other end getting wickets.

BK applies pressure and Bumrah gets some easy wickets. Batsmen have to go after someone.
 
BK has immense talent increased his pace to 135kmph ; very economical in ODI and T20's swing both sides with control also performed well consistently in IPL even wasim and waqar would be tonked hard if bowling in this era of cricket
 
BK is a big inflated balloon waiting to burst soon. Shami and bumrah are better. BK can be used in helpful conditions where he becomes a magician.
 
troodon said:
Hence we have Bumrah at the other end getting wickets.

BK applies pressure and Bumrah gets some easy wickets. Batsmen have to go after someone.
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Brah is not a new ball bowler either and doesn't pick much wickets at the start.
 
The gifted bowler that was taken apart by Hafeez in his death overs of CT final, Hafeez of all people, every pacers bunny :)))
 
waleed88 said:
The gifted bowler that was taken apart by Hafeez in his death overs of CT final, Hafeez of all people, every pacers bunny :)))
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Ajay Jadeja had smoked mighty Waqar to oblivion in 1996 WC.Does that make him any less.Though I dont agree to what OP said.Bhuvi is one of the best pace bowlers we have at the moment.
 
waleed88 said:
The gifted bowler that was taken apart by Hafeez in his death overs of CT final, Hafeez of all people, every pacers bunny :)))
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Really not cashed fully in final overs good bowling by BK and Bumrah in death pak should have scored above 360
 
Dingolfy said:
Ajay Jadeja had smoked mighty Waqar to oblivion in 1996 WC.Does that make him any less.Though I dont agree to what OP said.Bhuvi is one of the best pace bowlers we have at the moment.
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Yes but people still troll Waqar over it, and he says to have left a mark over him as a bowler.
Chetan Sharma's career probably ended with that Miandad six, does it make Sharma a great bowler?
 
ego-gambit said:
Really not cashed fully in final overs good bowling by BK and Bumrah in death pak should have scored above 360
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Pak didn't have any hard hitters, you must ask your bowling how a batting order with no batsmen who can strike it big score 330 in 50 overs (remember no fahim ashraf), when this was their highest runs scored in 3 years...
 
www787 said:
since Wasim, Waqar, Mcgrath, the only two bowlers who were best and gifted were Asif and Amir. BK is not the most gifted bowler since Wasim.
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Yes, the likes of Steyn Anderson Starc Rabada Hazlewood are all less gifted than Asif and Amir. :))
 
waleed88 said:
Pak didn't have any hard hitters, you must ask your bowling how a batting order with no batsmen who can strike it big score 330 in 50 overs (remember no fahim ashraf), when this was their highest runs scored
One man army left handed opener fakhar zaman
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Let's say Bhuvi is a good thinking bowler. Few pacers in the history would have made an effort an increased their pace to 90 mph, 145-146, which Bhuvi touches now in almost all matches atleast in 1-2 delieveries. Thats pretty good.

Wasim was arguably the best left armer ever. So, we can't compare bhuvi to wasim, but if bhuvi continues improving and keeps on contributing 20's and 30's to the scoreboard, he would do enough for team India. We just want him to be a better version of bhuvi, no need to become wasim.
 
Lol at being more skillful than Starc.

Pace is a skill also which not everyone has.
 
Bhuvneshwar Kumar is the most gifted quick since Wasim Akram : bujhee kom

Ahmed Shehzad is more talented than Sachin Tendulkar ever was : Abdul Razzaq
 
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I actually agree that Buvi is a very talented bowler. But that is all. He just lacks the pace & height to be as dangerous as consistently at the top level. It's not impossible- Chamind Vaas springs to mind as a classy operator at that pace/height- but it's hard.

He must be 5 inches shorter than Wasim easily, if not more. And doesn't have an extra gear of speed. That makes a difference. Both have skills but when needed, Wasim could rely on or get increased value from a bouncy pitch or even more dramatic variation from an uneven pitch.

Also affects the lengths you can bowl- Michael Slater tells stories of sometimes Wasim would just bowl 2 overs of bouncers at him if it wasn't swinging. He thinks this was done to a) rough the ball up quicker by banging it into the pitch, b) unsettle him because Wasim could be quick and his left arm angle made it a very awkward prospect & c) he noticed Wasim did this often on late test pitches when the bounce was hard to predict because the pitch is worm so you didn't know what to play at and what to leave as easily. He got out once or twice this way and said he always found it challenging.

That's an example of where a shorter bowler can't get away with that length for 2 overs & just has to bowl dry or suffer until the ball gets older & starts to reverse. But a guy with Wasim's speed & height could all of a sudden instead of having to bowl a few "dead" overs turn that on its head & rough the ball up faster whilst still presenting a fresh & genuine challenge & wicket taking option. Simply because he had a couple of extra tools in pace & height to work with, plus the confidence & brains to conceive of the plan to bowl bouncers at an Aussie who normally loved the short stuff & still make it a threat on a day 3/4/5 pitch.

You can have talent but to compare to an atg you need to have something freakish like a Wasim combo or a Waqar level speed & action or Malcolm Marshall level skill/speed/intelligence or a McGrath control/height/intelligence.
 
He is an excellent bowler in helpful conditions but he needs to do the same on flat batting tracks. I am fan, his skill set is great but still needs to toughen up mentally.
 
Mohammad asif and mohammad amir(at 18 age) are far far more gifted bowlers than bhuvneshwar tundler after wasim akram...bhuvneshwar doesn't come close even..
 
Not the most gifted pacer since wasim but certainly the most gifted asian pacer playing right now
 
If he either had some height (like McGrath) or a bit more pace he would be a great bowler. At the moment he just lacks one too many natural weapons, despite his ability to swing/seam it with accuracy.
 
Can I just reiterate that I didnt say best bowler or best quick, just most gifted meaning natural talent in terms of seaming and swinging the ball. I mentioned from the jump that he lacks speed and height and so cannot be as effective as others. But he has immense skill and a high bowling IQ.
 
Bewal Express said:
He is an excellent bowler in helpful conditions but he needs to do the same on flat batting tracks. I am fan, his skill set is great but still needs to toughen up mentally.
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In Kolkata ODI, Bhuvneshwar Kumar was the best bowler 3 for 9 from 6 overs and Kohli was the best batsman- 92 runs. By the collective wisdom of this forum, Bhuvneshwar can only succeed in helpful condition and Kohli can only succeed on flat tracks, so make up your mind- was the track helpful for bowling, or was it flat track. :srini
 
squarecut said:
In Kolkata ODI, Bhuvneshwar Kumar was the best bowler 3 for 9 from 6 overs and Kohli was the best batsman- 92 runs. By the collective wisdom of this forum, Bhuvneshwar can only succeed in helpful condition and Kohli can only succeed on flat tracks, so make up your mind- was the track helpful for bowling, or was it flat track. :srini
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There are some fair posters here but too much rabble (and the odd 'stuck in 18th century white man's burden type poster) - Bhuvi isnt the best (I never said that) but he is a seriously good bowler. The fact that his returns are poor needs analysis - why does he fail to pick up wickets despite every gift?
 
Lol. Not even the most skilled pacer in India, let alone the whole of Asia and the World. People who have grown up watching trundlers with zero skill bowl for them or those that haven't watched Amir, Starc, Boult, Hazlewood, Rabada and The Fizz in action might be wooed by Kumar though.
 
bujhee kom said:
Can I just reiterate that I didnt say best bowler or best quick, just most gifted meaning natural talent in terms of seaming and swinging the ball. I mentioned from the jump that he lacks speed and height and so cannot be as effective as others. But he has immense skill and a high bowling IQ.
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You said since Wasim so you in your wisdom have concluded that Kumar is more talented than Steyn, McGrath, Akhtar, Waqar, Bond and Anderson? Wow. :facepalm:

You know why he hasn't picked up many wickets? It's because he's nowhere near as good as you are making him out to be. He's an average pace bowler who is deadly in helpful conditions. Nothing more.
 
squarecut said:
In Kolkata ODI, Bhuvneshwar Kumar was the best bowler 3 for 9 from 6 overs and Kohli was the best batsman- 92 runs. By the collective wisdom of this forum, Bhuvneshwar can only succeed in helpful condition and Kohli can only succeed on flat tracks, so make up your mind- was the track helpful for bowling, or was it flat track. :srini
Click to expand...

For me Kohli is not a flat track bully, he is an excellent player. Kumar is brilliant in helpful condition and a good bowler in most conditions. To go to the next level, he will have to consistently produce against the better batsman in foreign conditions.
 
He's a good bowler who I rate but he certainly isn't the most gifted quick since Wasim. OP may not have seen the likes of Steyn, Jimmy,Starc,etc.

He isn't even the best bowler in his team lol.
 
bujhee kom said:
Not the best by returns or anything, but simply by talent. This guy seams and swings the ball a mile each way. I am shocked his record is so poor- he lacks pace and aggression - that can be the only explanation.

He bowls 75-85mph range, Wasim was 85-93 range. That makes a huge difference.

Each time I watch Bhuvi bowl I am amazed at his acumen and skill. Any insight as to why he doesnt wreck sides?

More skills than any current pacer - including Starc, Amir, Fizz or Anderson. Not as successful as them but more gift.
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Ridiculous. He's the best bowler ever.

I do actually like this thread.
It takes to its absurd extreme the logic that says Akram is a better bowler than McGrath.

In the Pakistani imaginary Swing = Talent, Pace = Excellence

Control = Boring
 
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