Could an Indian Test team beat a World XI like Australia did?

[InziRules]

Many seem to compare India's current team to the best Australian team of the early noughties and the nineties. The question is, could this Indian team do what the Australian team did and beat a World XI on home soil? I won't talk about away as they can't beat New Zealand and England away, let alone a World XI, but I thought this would be an interesting topic.

 

[Titan24]

Interesting. Lets make a world XI first considering everything including where they are touring:

Ummm...

Latham
Karunaratne
Williamson/ Labuschane
Smith
Babar/ Root
Stokes
QDK
Shakib/ Yasir/ Maharaj
Cummins
Lyon
Wagner

Taking everything into account I think it will be a really good series. India is no 1 by making home an unconquerable fortress which I think this world xi can give tough time to and has the ability to conquer if it plays upto it’s potential. Still I would expect a good contest.

 

[tyron_woodley]

in india they would beat Aussies of 2000 and west indies of i0s confrtably let alone world 11.

in SENA they will lose.

 

[tyron_woodley]

come to india.

 

[Junaids]

Many seem to compare India's current team to the best Australian team of the early noughties and the nineties. The question is, could this Indian team do what the Australian team did and beat a World XI on home soil? I won't talk about away as they can't beat New Zealand and England away, let alone a World XI, but I thought this would be an interesting topic.

So in India?

Well, just as England defeated an India containing Pujara and Kohli and Ashwin in India - because of Swann and Panesar - the answer would come down to the quality of the World XI’s spinners.

We would presumably be looking at:

Tamim
Latham
Williamson or Bravo
Smith
Root or Babar (I would pick Root for his bowling)
Shakib
Paine (wk)
Stokes
Yasir Shah
Cummins
Lyon

If you needed a third quick, Latham could keep wicket and you could then add Starc.

 

[HappyWarsFan]

India will look like minnows against a World XI. Come at me Indians.

 

[sweep_shot]

Potential World XI:

Warner
Babar
Root
Smith
Williamson (c)
Stokes
Butler/Mushfiq/Latham/QDK (wk)
Starc
Cummins
Rashid Khan
Lyon.

 

[InziRules]

So in India?

Yes, because there's no chance they win away from home, since they lost to England and NZ away and only beat a very under-strength Australian team.

 

[MMHS]

So in India?

Well, just as England defeated an India containing Pujara and Kohli and Ashwin in India - because of Swann and Panesar - the answer would come down to the quality of the World XI’s spinners.

We would presumably be looking at:

Tamim
Latham
Williamson or Bravo
Smith
Root or Babar (I would pick Root for his bowling)
Shakib
Paine (wk)
Stokes
Yasir Shah
Cummins
Lyon

If you needed a third quick, Latham could keep wicket and you could then add Starc.

I believe, once Bobby Mughabe’s ZIM best Misbah’s Pakistan, therefore one odd game or two is hardly indicative. Eight years back, what happened has hardly any significance now. That series was won by the batting of KP & Cook; a younger Jimmy was also outstanding.

If it’s a six Test series like olden days, this will be my 15 for both sides

1. Shaw
2. Agarwal
3. Pujara
4. *VK
5. KL
6. R Sharma/Vehari/Rahne
7. Saha+
8. Ashwin
9. Jadeja
10. Shami
11. JB
12. Ishant/Kuldeep

Depending on conditions, they’ll decide to play 5 bowlers or 4; and if 5 bowlers - 3 spinners or two.

Rest of the world
1. Karuna/Tamim
2. Warner
3. *Williamson
4. Smith
5. Root/ Babar
6. Stokes
7. Shakib
8. Watling/Mushi
9. Cummins
10. Rabada/Anderson/Shaheen
11. Lyon

India is just not the place for touring leggi - even a peak Yasir isn’t going to trouble Indians at their home, therefore he misses. There is a major crisis of quality spinners - had he played few more games, Rakeem Cornwall had a chance!!!! I probably will play Shaheen over Rabada, Jimmy or a Leggi for a diversity and he might be lethal with old ball. I would have liked to fit in Mushi somewhere as a batsman keeping Watling with gloves, because he is among best players of spin, but he doesn’t open and other 3 middle orders are better batsman than him.


It’ll be a great contest - both sides winning three tosses each, I’ll say 3-2 or 4-2 India. A peak Steyn (or Anderson) could have altered the result, but RoTW attack is just not that potent against Indian batting in India.

Away (in UK or Australia), it’ll be like 5-1 RoTW; could be even 6-0!!!!!!!

 

[hur rizvi]

I believe, once Bobby Mughabe’s ZIM best Misbah’s Pakistan, therefore one odd game or two is hardly indicative. Eight years back, what happened has hardly any significance now. That series was won by the batting of KP & Cook; a younger Jimmy was also outstanding.

If it’s a six Test series like olden days, this will be my 15 for both sides

1. Shaw
2. Agarwal
3. Pujara
4. *VK
5. KL
6. R Sharma/Vehari/Rahne
7. Saha+
8. Ashwin
9. Jadeja
10. Shami
11. JB
12. Ishant/Kuldeep

Depending on conditions, they’ll decide to play 5 bowlers or 4; and if 5 bowlers - 3 spinners or two.

Rest of the world
1. Karuna/Tamim
2. Warner
3. *Williamson
4. Smith
5. Root/ Babar
6. Stokes
7. Shakib
8. Watling/Mushi
9. Cummins
10. Rabada/Anderson/Shaheen
11. Lyon

India is just not the place for touring leggi - even a peak Yasir isn’t going to trouble Indians at their home, therefore he misses. There is a major crisis of quality spinners - had he played few more games, Rakeem Cornwall had a chance!!!! I probably will play Shaheen over Rabada, Jimmy or a Leggi for a diversity and he might be lethal with old ball. I would have liked to fit in Mushi somewhere as a batsman keeping Watling with gloves, because he is among best players of spin, but he doesn’t open and other 3 middle orders are better batsman than him.


It’ll be a great contest - both sides winning three tosses each, I’ll say 3-2 or 4-2 India. A peak Steyn (or Anderson) could have altered the result, but RoTW attack is just not that potent against Indian batting in India.

Away (in UK or Australia), it’ll be like 5-1 RoTW; could be even 6-0!!!!!!!

Well put indians are invincible at home right now and a big reason is dearth of world class spinners. Nathan Lyon is best spinner in the world and that shows how much quality of spin bowling has deteriorated

 

[Danyaalr01]

I believe, once Bobby Mughabe’s ZIM best Misbah’s Pakistan, therefore one odd game or two is hardly indicative. Eight years back, what happened has hardly any significance now. That series was won by the batting of KP & Cook; a younger Jimmy was also outstanding.

If it’s a six Test series like olden days, this will be my 15 for both sides

1. Shaw
2. Agarwal
3. Pujara
4. *VK
5. KL
6. R Sharma/Vehari/Rahne
7. Saha+
8. Ashwin
9. Jadeja
10. Shami
11. JB
12. Ishant/Kuldeep

Depending on conditions, they’ll decide to play 5 bowlers or 4; and if 5 bowlers - 3 spinners or two.

Rest of the world
1. Karuna/Tamim
2. Warner
3. *Williamson
4. Smith
5. Root/ Babar
6. Stokes
7. Shakib
8. Watling/Mushi
9. Cummins
10. Rabada/Anderson/Shaheen
11. Lyon

India is just not the place for touring leggi - even a peak Yasir isn’t going to trouble Indians at their home, therefore he misses. There is a major crisis of quality spinners - had he played few more games, Rakeem Cornwall had a chance!!!! I probably will play Shaheen over Rabada, Jimmy or a Leggi for a diversity and he might be lethal with old ball. I would have liked to fit in Mushi somewhere as a batsman keeping Watling with gloves, because he is among best players of spin, but he doesn’t open and other 3 middle orders are better batsman than him.


It’ll be a great contest - both sides winning three tosses each, I’ll say 3-2 or 4-2 India. A peak Steyn (or Anderson) could have altered the result, but RoTW attack is just not that potent against Indian batting in India.

Away (in UK or Australia), it’ll be like 5-1 RoTW; could be even 6-0!!!!!!!

Good World XI, but I would never pick Warner outside Australia, let alone in India. I would rather have Latham as opener who can play spin well. For keeper I would go for Watling. I would also prefer Babar over Root as Babar would be more familiar with the conditions, also Babar is in much better form.

FOr the 3 pacers you are split between I would lean towards Shaheen as he gives that left arm option, also he is more familiar with bowling in unhelpful conditions. Starc is another option.

 

[Mamoon]

Any potential World XI would get slaughtered in India.

 

[Pakhs]

Any potential World XI would get slaughtered in India.

We don't need World XI we just need England with Monty and Swan. LOL sorry to humiliate you again but could not resist.

 

[Mamoon]

We don't need World XI we just need England with Monty and Swan. LOL sorry to humiliate you again but could not resist.

If you do not see the difference between the 2012-13 past it Indian side and the current one, you are only humiliating yourself.

 

[Pakhs]

If you do not see the difference between the 2012-13 past it Indian side and the current one, you are only humiliating yourself.

What is the difference? its the same bowling attack for India and lesser batsmen than they had before.

 

[Rana]

Cringe Pant quotes to be released daily behind the stumps

 

[Danyaalr01]

Any potential World XI would get slaughtered in India.

Australia won a test in India a couple of years back. A side with Smith, Kane, Babar and Root in the middle order; along with Cummins, Shakib, Lyon, Stokes would have a really good chance of beating India.

I would get Kane to open. As a number 3 in NZ, he is practically an opener.

1. Karunaratne
2. Kane Williamson (C)
3. Root
4. Smith
5. Babar
6. Shakib
7. Stokes
8. Watling (+)
9. Cummins
10. Lyon
11. Shaheen/Starc

Please don't tell me this team wouldn't even have a chance against India. Watling is all the way down at 8, that shows a lot of batting depth. You can't have a more solid middle order than this.
[MENTION=31948]hur rizvi[/MENTION], what do you think of this team.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

If you do not see the difference between the 2012-13 past it Indian side and the current one, you are only humiliating yourself.

Too you all Indian teams are on-par with 2000s Aussie team so does it really matter?

 

[Mamoon]

What is the difference? its the same bowling attack for India and lesser batsmen than they had before.

The difference is very obvious.

The 2012-13 Indian team that lost 2-1 England at home had the following bowlers:

Ashwin
Harbhajan/Ojha/Chawla
Zaheer
Ishant

Ashwin today is better than Ashwin of 2012-13.

Jadeja is much better than Ojha and Chawla, also as better than the 2012-13 version of Harbhajan.

Bumrah and Shami are better than 2012-13 version of Zaheer.

Ishant today is miles ahead of Ishant of 2012-13.

There is virtually no comparison between the two bowling attacks.

Now let’s get to the batting:

India had a washed up pair of Sehwag and Gambhir. Rohit and Rahul of 2020 are superior to Sehwag and Gambhir of 2012-2013.

Pujara and Kohli of today are much better than their 2012-2013 versions.

Kohli at number 4 today is better than Tendulkar of 2012-13.

Rahane is a much better Test batsman than Yuvraj.

The only advantage that Indian team had over the current one is Dhoni. However, he was never an ace Test player, and a vastly inferior Test captain to Kohli.

The current Indian side would whitewash their 2012-13 counterparts at home, and the 2012-13 England would also get thumped by Kohli’s India in India.

 

[Mamoon]

Australia won a test in India a couple of years back. A side with Smith, Kane, Babar and Root in the middle order; along with Cummins, Shakib, Lyon, Stokes would have a really good chance of beating India.

I would get Kane to open. As a number 3 in NZ, he is practically an opener.

1. Karunaratne
2. Kane Williamson (C)
3. Root
4. Smith
5. Babar
6. Shakib
7. Stokes
8. Watling (+)
9. Cummins
10. Lyon
11. Shaheen/Starc

Please don't tell me this team wouldn't even have a chance against India. Watling is all the way down at 8, that shows a lot of batting depth. You can't have a more solid middle order than this.

[MENTION=31948]hur rizvi[/MENTION], what do you think of this team.

The Australian tour of India in 2017 perfectly illustrates why Kohli’s India is practically unbeatable at home.

It was by far India’s worst home performance under Kohli who was completely out of touch and barely scored, while Smith had the series of his life.

Even then, India won the series 2-1.

Your world XI would get pasted in India. Williamson is overrated against quality bowling and has a very poor record in India.

Root is better than Williamson against quality bowling, but he doesn’t get enough big runs. His inability to convert his 60s and 70s in India in 2016 was a major reason why England failed to compete in spite of batting first.

Firstly, Babar does not deserve to be part of the World XI yet, even if it is a non-Indian World XI.

Secondly, he is unproven against quality spin bowling. He has often struggled against spinners that are deemed inferior to Ashwin and Jadeja.

Babar is a top player, a terrific player, but just because he is the only good thing about Pakistan cricket at the moment does not mean that he has been sent from the heavens.

Babar’s presence or absence does not impact any team’s chances of beating India in India.

Cummins and Starc looked ordinary against India in Australia, so forget about them helping the World XI win in India.

Shaheen? Again, a top bowler, but he might not even the second World XI.

Stokes is a brilliant player but he is not going to have that big of an impact to help his team beat Kohli’s India in India.

Your lineup would lose a 5 match series 4-0 or at best 4-1, and only if Smith once again has the series of his life.

 

[Mamoon]

Too you all Indian teams are on-par with 2000s Aussie team so does it really matter?

I don’t think so at all. That Australian team could lose in India, but overall, they are miles ahead of this India and would beat them everywhere outside Asia with ease.

 

[Pakhs]

The difference is very obvious.

The 2012-13 Indian team that lost 2-1 England at home had the following bowlers:

Ashwin
Harbhajan/Ojha/Chawla
Zaheer
Ishant

Ashwin today is better than Ashwin of 2012-13.

Jadeja is much better than Ojha and Chawla, also as better than the 2012-13 version of Harbhajan.

Bumrah and Shami are better than 2012-13 version of Zaheer.

Ishant today is miles ahead of Ishant of 2012-13.

There is virtually no comparison between the two bowling attacks.

Now let’s get to the batting:

India had a washed up pair of Sehwag and Gambhir. Rohit and Rahul of 2020 are superior to Sehwag and Gambhir of 2012-2013.

Pujara and Kohli of today are much better than their 2012-2013 versions.

Kohli at number 4 today is better than Tendulkar of 2012-13.

Rahane is a much better Test batsman than Yuvraj.

The only advantage that Indian team had over the current one is Dhoni. However, he was never an ace Test player, and a vastly inferior Test captain to Kohli.

The current Indian side would whitewash their 2012-13 counterparts at home, and the 2012-13 England would also get thumped by Kohli’s India in India.

LOL kohli is better than Sachin - this kind of things clearly shows you are not serious in what you say and just here for a laugh which is fair enough

 

[Ab Fan]

LOL kohli is better than Sachin - this kind of things clearly shows you are not serious in what you say and just here for a laugh which is fair enough

He is right. That Indian team was a washed up team with a lot of players at 37-38 age. We had forced Dravids and Laxmans to retire till that time. Sachin was holding up only for that 100th century and Indians just can't ask a player like Sachin to retire. Sehwag was also no longer the force and that's why a couple of laters, he was playing IPL by wearing specs and looked like a 40+ guy.

Kohli was young and yet to find a feat in test cricket. Pujara was the only one at its peak. Bowlers were also pretty much washed up.

 

[RamLakhan]

It is extreme stupidity to combine random players from different countries and ask them to beat Indian team at home! Such team will find it hard even against a Ranji team! The way to go about is form a nice team (hunt in pack like Hyenas - plan properly & hit the target accurately! Something like Pune test match by Australia!) It is the unknown & least expected commodities like N.Boje, O'Keefe... who could do the damage! (Could you believe N.Boje is the only guy who played a decisive role in a Test Series win against India for South Africa in India!)

 

[Pakhs]

He is right. That Indian team was a washed up team with a lot of players at 37-38 age. We had forced Dravids and Laxmans to retire till that time. Sachin was holding up only for that 100th century and Indians just can't ask a player like Sachin to retire. Sehwag was also no longer the force and that's why a couple of laters, he was playing IPL by wearing specs and looked like a 40+ guy.

Kohli was young and yet to find a feat in test cricket. Pujara was the only one at its peak. Bowlers were also pretty much washed up.

These are excuses any team can give when they lose a series but in general there is no way one can say Kohli was better than Sachin at any point in time in tests. Kholi is obviously a better LOI player.

The fact is in that series Swan and Monty out bowled Indian counter parts and that has not happened since. India or most subcontinental side are one trick pony at home they generally rely on their spinners out bowling their overseas counter parts but that did not happen that series.

 

[Pakhs]

It is extreme stupidity to combine random players from different countries and ask them to beat Indian team at home! Such team will find it hard even against a Ranji team! The way to go about is form a nice team (hunt in pack like Hyenas - plan properly & hit the target accurately! Something like Pune test match by Australia!) It is the unknown & least expected commodities like N.Boje, O'Keefe... who could do the damage! (Could you believe N.Boje is the only guy who played a decisive role in a Test Series win against India for South Africa in India!)

These are just hypothetical scenarios and assume that the team will be able to gel and every player will perform to potential and take it seriously.

 

[Mamoon]

LOL kohli is better than Sachin - this kind of things clearly shows you are not serious in what you say and just here for a laugh which is fair enough

I don’t think I have the energy to explain basic cricket to you. Anyway, I will oblige out of the goodness of my heart.

Kohli is in his prime today, and a prime Kohli is a better Test batsman than a past his prime Tendulkar (2012-13).

 

[Mamoon]

Haha India will not bowl out Pakistan twice with Bumrah and Shami hovering around 135kmh for the vast majority of the day. Jadeja and Ashwin will be decent and most likely get some breakthroughs on day 1-2-3 but Day 4 and 5 is anyone’s game.

You can’t predict a Test match before it’s actually taken place. I was mildly surprised with India’s performance on Day 1 of the 2nd Test against New Zealand. For a minute I thought they were on their way and causing an upset but I guess they have themselves to blame.

You can do haha and hehe as much as you want and pretend that India will not beat Pakistan in Test cricket, but hope and pray that such a series does not happen any time soon.

People like you were doing haha and hehe at the thought of a Kohli-less India smacking the Champions Trophy winners all over UAE in the Asia Cup 2018, but unfortunately, that series did happen and we were humiliated like no tomorrow, much to the regret of our fans.

If you want to think that Pakistan will not lose to India at home, be my guest. That is why we have the wonderful gift of imagination. We can think anything we want, even if it will not materialize in real life.

 

[Ab Fan]

Since it will be in India, here we go.

A rest of world XI today will be:-

Latham
Karunaratne
Williamson
Smith
Roooooooot/ Benchmark
Shakib
QDk/Watling(wkt)/ Mushi( any one)
Cummins
Starc
Shaheen/Rabada
Lyon

In comparison, an Indian XI will be:-

1)Mayank Agarwal(8 matches and already has double hundreds for fun)
2)Rohit Sharma( In India he averages 88)
3)Cheteswar Pujara ( In India must be averaging around 60)
4)Virat Kohli(averaging around 60)
5)Karun Nair( a triple centurion)
6) Prithvi Shaw( the next Sehwag)
6)Ravindra Jadeja( averages 38 with the bat and 21 with the bowl at home, lol- that's Imran-esque)
7) Rishabh Pant / Wridhimann Saha
8)Ravichandran Ashwin( averages 22 with bowl, 21 5-fers in 50 innings at home)
9) Mohammad Shami( averages 21 with bowl at home)
10) Umesh Yadav( averages 24 with bowl at home)

Don't see rest of world XI beating Indian current XI in India.

 

[Ab Fan]

Umesh and Shami averages under 25 on flat Indian wickets- Shami 21, Umesh 24. There is a difference to the way you bowl in sub continent and outside that.

In Asia, you gotta attack the stumps. Mohammad Shami averages 19 with the bowl in Sri Lanka also. Ishant averages very well in SL. There is no reason these fast bowlers won't do well anywhere in Asia with the bowl. Ashwin and Jadeja have always created havoc in Asian conditions. Look at Ashwin's figure in Asia.

In India, these are the averages of Indian bowlers.

Shami 21
Umesh 24
Ashwin 22
Jadeja 21

 

[Dulex9]

Warner
Babar
Williamson
Smith
Root
Stokes
Latham (wk)
Starc
Cummins
Wagner
Lyon

 

[Mesozoic]

Will be a great series. India may start as favourites but anything can happen if the world XI team finds one more decent spinner to assist Lyon.

Karunaratne
Latham
Root
Smith
Babar
Stokes
De Kock
Cummins
Rabada/Boult
Lyon
Leach

 

[hitthestump]

I don't think there any way India's bowling attack takes 20 wickets against a world XI given the names who'd be in the top order. Plus, when you've got the ROW to choose from you can pick any combination of bowlers to counteract any home advantage pitch India can come up with.

Any neutral venue and obviously it's a no contest, unlike the Aus team who could have competed and won anywhere in the world.

 

[Hasan123]

In India I think India and in Asia would beat a world 11. But outside of Asia it would be the world 11.

 

[gazza619]

In India I think India and in Asia would beat a world 11. But outside of Asia it would be the world 11.

Agreed!

 

[Hasan123]

My world 11 would be

Latham
Karunaratne
Williamson
Smith
Root
Stokes
De Kock
Rabada
Cummins
Hazelwood
Lyon

2nd spinner would be Maharaj. Archer was close to being in the line up.

 

[tyron_woodley]

These are excuses any team can give when they lose a series but in general there is no way one can say Kohli was better than Sachin at any point in time in tests. Kholi is obviously a better LOI player.

The fact is in that series Swan and Monty out bowled Indian counter parts and that has not happened since. India or most subcontinental side are one trick pony at home they generally rely on their spinners out bowling their overseas counter parts but that did not happen that series.

India's lace bowlers are the best in Asian conditions. India's pace attack will crush any opposition team in India. Their r3cord suggests so. Even umesh who is the worst one of our bowlers has an average of under 22 at home.

india don't only rely on spinners at home. I fact since 2014 india rely on pace bowlers to so the damage.

 

[tyron_woodley]

I don't think there any way India's bowling attack takes 20 wickets against a world XI given the names who'd be in the top order. Plus, when you've got the ROW to choose from you can pick any combination of bowlers to counteract any home advantage pitch India can come up with.

Any neutral venue and obviously it's a no contest, unlike the Aus team who could have competed and won anywhere in the world.

lol india has one of the best attacks in the world and you win think they will take 20 wickets. That too at home. Bring any ATG team to india and Virat's india would pump them. Even at their absolute worst form they conquered australia in 2016.

 

[tyron_woodley]

I don’t think so at all. That Australian team could lose in India, but overall, they are miles ahead of this India and would beat them everywhere outside Asia with ease.

they will get thrashed anywhere in subcontinent vs india. India will lose in SENA to them comfortably.

pakistam with asif managed to draw vs australia in England. In a 3 match series back in 2010. Aussies under clarke were still good. They had Ryan Harris, siddle, hilfenhaus and a young pre prime cummins etc. That team isn't much worse than the 2000 era aussie side.

2000 era aussie team is a tad overrated because they were the only fit team ou there. No other team barring a few SENA countries took fitness seriously.

 

[RamLakhan]

India's lace bowlers are the best in Asian conditions. India's pace attack will crush any opposition team in India. Their r3cord suggests so. Even umesh who is the worst one of our bowlers has an average of under 22 at home.

india don't only rely on spinners at home. I fact since 2014 india rely on pace bowlers to so the damage.

What people have not learnt is (especially in PP) that there is an ART to fast bowling in Indian Conditions which only Indian fast bowlers have mastered and "they" are the actual difference between the touring sides & the Indian side, and not necessarily the "turning tracks" or "flat tracks" (accusing us based on convenience! In fact pure turning tracks have backfired us at times, just like how pure movement-tracks backfired England and gave us the lone test victory last tour! Hence home sides don't go to the extreme of their strength, they actually want to play around with a bit of "range" of their strength so that opponents don't exploit!) It is not the spinners or home-track bully batsmen who are necessary for our domination (in fact we have a weakish batting lineup currently and that's why we are failing overseas, but our other departments are making us stronger!)

In my opinion these are the reasons for our complete home domination in tests:

1) Pace Bowling (absolute fact which even experts have not figured out yet! Strangely)
2) 5 bowler bold strategy - this ensures that opponents can never draw the match
3) Depth in batting (this has helped us so many times, even when opponents have scored like 400+ batting first, our batting depth has surpassed it & reached like 600 and have demoralized the opponents! Jadeja, Ashwin, etc have done this damage!)
4) Spinners come last - They are smart! But they are immensely helped by the above 3 factors! Otherwise even they would have required to bowl like 50 overs in an innings and opposition batsmen blocking them off! But since the pacers also pick wickets, it helps them & they complement them! But for that to happen, the added attribute of batting & allowing to pick 5 bowlers have helped immensely! Our previous spinners (like Kumble, Harbhajan, Maninder, Hirwani, Rajesh Chouhan, etc) were not giving this confidence to add a 3rd seamer/5th bowler! The presence of 3rd seamer (and 3rd spinner or too spin-friendly tracks with 2 seamers) has made all the difference! It has helped them to bowl with same intensity & accuracy throughout the day...

So you can see that its a total team work & there is certain concrete strength jelling their! But its unfortunate that the same thing is not happening overseas... Sometimes I wonder why we don't go with same plan (like 5 bowlers) even overseas, they may lose some games badly, but now it seems like they still lose the test match & our team is not interested in draws and we don't get any flat pitches either! So why not go bold, this at least gives us a chance to win some matches and we can improve on that! Instead of 2-0, 4-0 whitewashes, we may see like 3-1, 3-2, 1-1 and can improve...

But once we get back the weakish link in the current team (Batting, which was strangely our main & probably the only strength a decade or two back!) then we can imagine the even more improvement & an answer to the question marks being put across our overseas record!

 

[tyron_woodley]

What people have not learnt is (especially in PP) that there is an ART to fast bowling in Indian Conditions which only Indian fast bowlers have mastered and "they" are the actual difference between the touring sides & the Indian side, and not necessarily the "turning tracks" or "flat tracks" (accusing us based on convenience! In fact pure turning tracks have backfired us at times, just like how pure movement-tracks backfired England and gave us the lone test victory last tour! Hence home sides don't go to the extreme of their strength, they actually want to play around with a bit of "range" of their strength so that opponents don't exploit!) It is not the spinners or home-track bully batsmen who are necessary for our domination (in fact we have a weakish batting lineup currently and that's why we are failing overseas, but our other departments are making us stronger!)

In my opinion these are the reasons for our complete home domination in tests:

1) Pace Bowling (absolute fact which even experts have not figured out yet! Strangely)
2) 5 bowler bold strategy - this ensures that opponents can never draw the match
3) Depth in batting (this has helped us so many times, even when opponents have scored like 400+ batting first, our batting depth has surpassed it & reached like 600 and have demoralized the opponents! Jadeja, Ashwin, etc have done this damage!)
4) Spinners come last - They are smart! But they are immensely helped by the above 3 factors! Otherwise even they would have required to bowl like 50 overs in an innings and opposition batsmen blocking them off! But since the pacers also pick wickets, it helps them & they complement them! But for that to happen, the added attribute of batting & allowing to pick 5 bowlers have helped immensely! Our previous spinners (like Kumble, Harbhajan, Maninder, Hirwani, Rajesh Chouhan, etc) were not giving this confidence to add a 3rd seamer/5th bowler! The presence of 3rd seamer (and 3rd spinner or too spin-friendly tracks with 2 seamers) has made all the difference! It has helped them to bowl with same intensity & accuracy throughout the day...

So you can see that its a total team work & there is certain concrete strength jelling their! But its unfortunate that the same thing is not happening overseas... Sometimes I wonder why we don't go with same plan (like 5 bowlers) even overseas, they may lose some games badly, but now it seems like they still lose the test match & our team is not interested in draws and we don't get any flat pitches either! So why not go bold, this at least gives us a chance to win some matches and we can improve on that! Instead of 2-0, 4-0 whitewashes, we may see like 3-1, 3-2, 1-1 and can improve...

But once we get back the weakish link in the current team (Batting, which was strangely our main & probably the only strength a decade or two back!) then we can imagine the even more improvement & an answer to the question marks being put across our overseas record!

well said. India are too good in Asian conditions. period. PP can moan about it All they want but no ATG team can beat india in India unless India are actually stupid enough to prepare turners which can backfire.

 

[Ab Fan]

well said. India are too good in Asian conditions. period. PP can moan about it All they want but no ATG team can beat india in India unless India are actually stupid enough to prepare turners which can backfire.

Can this Indian team beat a SL team of 2008 away in SL?

A team with a middle order, lower order and bowling attack of

Sangakkara
Mahela
Samaraweera
Dilshan
Keeper
Vaas
Kulasekara
Mendis(debutant)
Muralitharan

 

[tyron_woodley]

Can this Indian team beat a SL team of 2008 away in SL?

A team with a middle order, lower order and bowling attack of

Sangakkara
Mahela
Samaraweera
Dilshan
Keeper
Vaas
Kulasekara
Mendis(debutant)
Muralitharan

dont think dhoni's india did? did they? Cant remember. Man that Lankan teams looks strong for Sri Lankan conditions. I believe Virat's india would but I am not sure really. India's bowling is far superior but if it's turners then I would say 50 50. Jadeja and ashwin are gods in Asian conditions plus we bat deep.

 

[Ab Fan]

dont think dhoni's india did? did they? Cant remember. Man that Lankan teams looks strong for Sri Lankan conditions. I believe Virat's india would but I am not sure really. India's bowling is far superior but if it's turners then I would say 50 50. Jadeja and ashwin are gods in Asian conditions plus we bat deep.

Dhoni's India didn't. But I think that was the only loss India suffered from 2007 to 2011 till WC if you discard the daylight robbery of Sydney '07. Mendis was such a nightmare, so hard to pick. But India got back the revenge in 2010 at home.

I think Kohli's team will also beat them at home but away will be a big challenge with Murali and Mendis (of course the debutant one not the one who got owned later) operating and a batting lineup of Sanga, Mahela, Samaraweera, Dilshan.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Dhoni's India didn't. But I think that was the only loss India suffered from 2007 to 2011 till WC if you discard the daylight robbery of Sydney '07. Mendis was such a nightmare, so hard to pick. But India got back the revenge in 2010 at home.

I think Kohli's team will also beat them at home but away will be a big challenge with Murali and Mendis (of course the debutant one not the one who got owned later) operating and a batting lineup of Sanga, Mahela, Samaraweera, Dilshan.

Lanka have done really well vs some strong Pakistani sides. I believe they beat them at home several times.

 

[Ab Fan]

Lanka have done really well vs some strong Pakistani sides. I believe they beat them at home several times.

Against Sri Lanka, it's a different game for India and Pakistan. India have never lost to Sri Lanka at home but couldn't beat the SL side with Vaas, Murali, Sanga and Mahela on their side.

Pakistan, in contrast, have lost to weaker SL sides home or away as well.

We have a much superior record over Pakistan vs Sri Lanka.

 

[Pakhs]

India's lace bowlers are the best in Asian conditions. India's pace attack will crush any opposition team in India. Their r3cord suggests so. Even umesh who is the worst one of our bowlers has an average of under 22 at home.

india don't only rely on spinners at home. I fact since 2014 india rely on pace bowlers to so the damage.

LOL some people are blinded by team success fine lets not play any spinners and see if pacers can do it. Let not twist the facts last time Indian spinners were out bowled they lost.

 

[Pakhs]

Against Sri Lanka, it's a different game for India and Pakistan. India have never lost to Sri Lanka at home but couldn't beat the SL side with Vaas, Murali, Sanga and Mahela on their side.

Pakistan, in contrast, have lost to weaker SL sides home or away as well.

We have a much superior record over Pakistan vs Sri Lanka.

Pakistan and SL are the same quality teams. Both teams are unpredictable they can win against anyone and also lose against anyone specially SL who had very variable results in recent times.

 

[tyron_woodley]

LOL some people are blinded by team success fine lets not play any spinners and see if pacers can do it. Let not twist the facts last time Indian spinners were out bowled they lost.

You need both. Both have been equally effective. Ofcourse you need a spinner in a test match unless the pitch is a complete green mamba.

 

[Manunited18]

I don't think they will, even if its in india ,like I've stated before this Indian batting line up is overrated, and it's a shadow of the former gun batting line ups it's had, that said they have a strong bowling group all be it being a ageing one

 

[Pakhs]

You need both. Both have been equally effective. Ofcourse you need a spinner in a test match unless the pitch is a complete green mamba.

If the spinners dont do it - they wont win nothing at home. Lets see next time Indian spinners get out bowled.

 

[tyron_woodley]

If the spinners dont do it - they wont win nothing at home. Lets see next time Indian spinners get out bowled.

not under kohli. pace has been more important than spin even at home. India has quality pace bowling.

 

[tyron_woodley]

I don't think they will, even if its in india ,like I've stated before this Indian batting line up is overrated, and it's a shadow of the former gun batting line ups it's had, that said they have a strong bowling group all be it being a ageing one

anywhere in Asia let alone india. Virat's team is the king of these conditions. Just too much quality all round. Unless it's a turner pitch, India will win. Actually even on turners india would due to depth in batting for Asian conditions plus the spin and pace attack.

 

[Thomaskutty]

It depends on where they play.

India are the favorites in their own country and subcontinent conditions and maybe even in Australia on the flatter tracks like MCG/Adelaide/SCG ... but in England, SA and NZ, I put their chances at 30%

 

[Manunited18]

anywhere in Asia let alone india. Virat's team is the king of these conditions. Just too much quality all round. Unless it's a turner pitch, India will win. Actually even on turners india would due to depth in batting for Asian conditions plus the spin and pace attack.

Ok, if the wicket is flat in any Asian conditions and a world 11 bats and scores 450 then India are history, the batting is not strong specially under pressure against some gun quicks and decent spin

 

[ishtiaq_ctg]

rather than a world XI, The dream series would be the Current Indian side(probably the greatest home team) against the 2000s Aussies(statistically the goat side of all time).
This would be my Aussie side to face India
1. Hayden
2. Langer
3. Ponting(was wasted at 6 & couldn't put a bat to bowl against spinners. But would do better against pacers so i would put him in @ 3)
4. Mark Waugh
5. Steve Waugh
6. Martyn
7. Gilchrist
8. Warne
9. Gillespie
10. Kasprowicz
11. Mcgrath

I didnt combined teams of 01 & 04, rather went for players who actually played in the same team. I still think the 01 team was better than 04 aussie team. The difference was ponting didnt played in 04 & warne was also better in 04.
But that 01 team just had an aura about themselves. last team to have that I think. Im not saying they would beat India but they would do a better job than world XI

 

[ishtiaq_ctg]

they will get thrashed anywhere in subcontinent vs india. India will lose in SENA to them comfortably.

pakistam with asif managed to draw vs australia in England. In a 3 match series back in 2010. Aussies under clarke were still good. They had Ryan Harris, siddle, hilfenhaus and a young pre prime cummins etc. That team isn't much worse than the 2000 era aussie side.

2000 era aussie team is a tad overrated because they were the only fit team ou there. No other team barring a few SENA countries took fitness seriously.

You cant win 16tests in a row just by being fit. Even if I take your point, they did revolutionize the game by upping the physical side of the game & improving the fielding standards immensely. They gave a new direction to tests by batting aggressively(targeting a rr of 3.5 to 4) & going for wins no matter what in whatever conditions. they whitewashed SL in 04 where in all tests they conceded leads. Its unfair to call a side overrated which had players who would most probably walk into All time XIs(Gilchrist, Warne, Mcgrath)

 

[big_gamer007]

In India, we should win the series. Would.
be a good contest.

I wouldn't mind whoever wins the world test championship plays a 3 test series at home against world XI. Would be an interesting series.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Ok, if the wicket is flat in any Asian conditions and a world 11 bats and scores 450 then India are history, the batting is not strong specially under pressure against some gun quicks and decent spin

if**. massive if. Even if they did, India can easily score 600 plus to counter. In Asian conditions Asian Virat's team is a behemoth. They also bat real deep for those conditions. Will be carnage. At their best there is absolutely no chance. You got to catch them when they are off their peaks like England did in 2012.

 

[Pakhs]

not under kohli. pace has been more important than spin even at home. India has quality pace bowling.

These were same pace bowlers who couldnt do anything last time so facts are facts. On another note I am note sure which quality bowler you talking about none of them are quality like steyn or the ones gone before them. They are just good enough to form a good bowling attack and their stats show the same. Indeed both Indian spinners have better records than their pace bowlers in terms of wickets taken and averages etc.

 

[Dingolfy]

Ok, if the wicket is flat in any Asian conditions and a world 11 bats and scores 450 then India are history, the batting is not strong specially under pressure against some gun quicks and decent spin

Lol.Check the scores England made in their last tour. They made 400 and 470 in First innings and still lost by an INNINGS. They had decent fast bowlers and spinners.

 

[Dingolfy]

These were same pace bowlers who couldnt do anything last time so facts are facts. On another note I am note sure which quality bowler you talking about none of them are quality like steyn or the ones gone before them. They are just good enough to form a good bowling attack and their stats show the same. Indeed both Indian spinners have better records than their pace bowlers in terms of wickets taken and averages etc.

Dude, the same Southee who got smoked in Australia bamboozled Indians at their home.
Check the averages and wickets of Shami and Umesh against SouthAfricans in the recent series.

 

[Asifnow]

Is this world XI playing tests or limited over? I think a world XI limited overs team would completely overwhelm India but it would be closer in tests I think. Especially as you say it is being held in India.

A world XI for tests would probably be -

Latham
Williamson c
Labauschange
Azam
Smith
QDK wk
Stokes
Starc
Lyon
Cummins
Rabada/Archer

 

[Manunited18]

Lol.Check the scores England made in their last tour. They made 400 and 470 in First innings and still lost by an INNINGS. They had decent fast bowlers and spinners.

A world 11 consists the best in the world not just from one specific country

 

[Dingolfy]

A world 11 consists the best in the world not just from one specific country

So who are these gun spinners and fast bowlers who can trouble Indian batsmen in India?

 

[Manunited18]

if**. massive if. Even if they did, India can easily score 600 plus to counter. In Asian conditions Asian Virat's team is a behemoth. They also bat real deep for those conditions. Will be carnage. At their best there is absolutely no chance. You got to catch them when they are off their peaks like England did in 2012.

Your making India as if they are invincible, far from it.

 

[Manunited18]

So who are these gun spinners and fast bowlers who can trouble Indian batsmen in India?

He said any WHERE in Asia, it doesn't have to be in india

 

[Dingolfy]

Your making India as if they are invincible, far from it.

When was the last time India lost a series in India? No country has a formidable home record in the last 10 years like India.

 

[Dingolfy]

He said any WHERE in Asia, it doesn't have to be in india

I think by Asian conditions he meant conditions similiar to typical Indian wickets-no conventional swing and spin in last 2 days. Indian batsmen thrive in such conditions. Thats why someone like Nair has a triple hundred and Mayank already has two double hundreds and he just debuted in 2018.

 

[Manunited18]

When was the last time India lost a series in India? No country has a formidable home record in the last 10 years like India.

They a have a excellent record at home, bit that's no difference from the past India teams, strong at home and bang average away

 

[Dingolfy]

They a have a excellent record at home, bit that's no difference from the past India teams, strong at home and bang average away

We are talking about home conditions here. I thought that was obvious in OP’s question.

 

[tyron_woodley]

They a have a excellent record at home, bit that's no difference from the past India teams, strong at home and bang average away

they are invincible at home. India never won all games at home like they did under virat. They literally can't lose at home or Asia in general.

They are invicble in these conditions.

best indian away touring team was the 2006-2011 version of dhoni's team. Won in many nations. Best Asian travelling team ever.

 

[Pakhs]

Dude, the same Southee who got smoked in Australia bamboozled Indians at their home.
Check the averages and wickets of Shami and Umesh against SouthAfricans in the recent series.

None of these SAs players would make the World XI - I was speaking of facts India usually wins at home because noone of overseas teams can out bowl indian spinners regardless of pace attack. A lot of teams came to India with better pace attacks with better record than indias in the past but still did not win. And this glorifying India has a quality pace attack etc is rubbish they just have an acceptable pace attack otherwise they would be world beaters all over the world.

 

[Pakhs]

they are invincible at home. India never won all games at home like they did under virat. They literally can't lose at home or Asia in general.

They are invicble in these conditions.

best indian away touring team was the 2006-2011 version of dhoni's team. Won in many nations. Best Asian travelling team ever.

Best Asian traveling team ever was Pakistan 80s team and 90s who beat England regularly. The Indian team of the past 2 decades have won one series in England 1-0 and one series in Australia 2-1 and we all know that series won because Australia banned their best players for whatever reason.

Indians have always been good at home only GOAT teams have beaten them at home previously but this team has a distinction of getting beat by an ordinary England side which were definitely not GOAT team.

 

[tyron_woodley]

Best Asian traveling team ever was Pakistan 80s team and 90s who beat England regularly. The Indian team of the past 2 decades have won one series in England 1-0 and one series in Australia 2-1 and we all know that series won because Australia banned their best players for whatever reason.

Indians have always been good at home only GOAT teams have beaten them at home previously but this team has a distinction of getting beat by an ordinary England side which were definitely not GOAT team.

uhm Virat's team beat England 4 0.
England were trash in 80s. Best travelling GOAT team is the 2006-2011 indian team. They drew vs GOAT saffers side, beat GOAT Aussies at home and also drew away. Best a strong English team and n.z away.

pakistan never beat GOAT west indies at home.

 

[tyron_woodley]

None of these SAs players would make the World XI - I was speaking of facts India usually wins at home because noone of overseas teams can out bowl indian spinners regardless of pace attack. A lot of teams came to India with better pace attacks with better record than indias in the past but still did not win. And this glorifying India has a quality pace attack etc is rubbish they just have an acceptable pace attack otherwise they would be world beaters all over the world.

our bowlers are the best. out batsmen can't play swing.

Indian pace attack has been good everywhere. only one bad series vs n.z

far better than the impotent Pakistani attack.

 

[Pakhs]

uhm Virat's team beat England 4 0.
England were trash in 80s. Best travelling GOAT team is the 2006-2011 indian team. They drew vs GOAT saffers side, beat GOAT Aussies at home and also drew away. Best a strong English team and n.z away.

pakistan never beat GOAT west indies at home.

What we are not talking home performance to justify away performance are we? Beat your own point. Just for your information Pakistan had the best Home win percentage of all teams until 2003. Thats how good they were at home during those days but I would agree current Indian side results at home are better but I cant remember the last time India was not strong at home and nothing has improved overseas

 

[Pakhs]

our bowlers are the best. out batsmen can't play swing.

Indian pace attack has been good everywhere. only one bad series vs n.z

far better than the impotent Pakistani attack.

Pakistan are ranked 7th in test ranking so current team cant be compared with Indias I guess you did that because you have lost the argument. Indian pace bowling record is poor and were out bowled regularly overseas. Indian batting line-up is the best in the world and their records suggest so but overseas team openly make swinging pitches etc knowing Indian bowlers will not be able to out bowl theirs and that's a FACT.

 

[Ozeirk]

The 99 team of Pakistan will beat them both at home and away. Shoaib Akhtar at his prime and Wasim with Saqlain as the spinner, this team will have no chance.

 

[RamLakhan]

The 99 team of Pakistan will beat them both at home and away. Shoaib Akhtar at his prime and Wasim with Saqlain as the spinner, this team will have no chance.

Hahaha, Any team/player combination at their prime will definitely going to perform and win matches even against best sides! Even Agarkar or Irfan or Sunil Joshi or Binny or Karun Nair at their prime can win matches! So when you are choosing such arbitrary teams you got to only consider their normal/average prime! At the moment Kohli's test team is on supreme-prime at home for quite a long period of time!