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Crimes/Violence against Women

Namak_Halaal said:
Damini case is beyond vexing. I just get angry reading about such vile and inhumane acts.

Whether in India, UK, Pakistan, or Amreeka, no woman, regardless of race, colour, or creed, should ever have to face such barbaric actions.

This is a moment the Indian public must cease. Death for the perpetuators is an easy route out. My opinion, these animals should be castrated and be forced forced to pick up soap for the rest of their lives.
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Agree with u for the first time.i think they should be publicly be flogged,i'm not usually in favour of public flogging though but for this particular case we can make an exception
 
Not too long ago, general Indian public was almost insensitive to such news. Harassment of women was daily routine everywhere. At least for a short while now the criminals are being torn apart. One may say the society and media is going a little OTT but i am fine with it. This struggle should continue until such news are seen as shockers and not daily routine. India's growth as a country should occur in all aspects and not just in terms of GDP and all.
 
Heinous crimes against women are only possible if/when they are dehumanised. How women are percieved and what role(s) they are permitted to play in families, communities and societies, determines - to a large extent - how they are treated.

Men who rape women should recieve the death penalty. There never can be any mitigating circumstances or justification.
 
Jadz said:
Men who rape women should recieve the death penalty. There never can be any mitigating circumstances or justification.
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Rape is a terrible and horrific crime but the death penalty has no place in a civilised society. There are many cases of false accusations of rape against men and the death penalty legitimises an irreversible act of violence by the state and will inevitably claim innocent victims. As long as human justice remains fallible, the risk of executing the innocent can never be eliminated.

Statistically, it costs more to put people on death row and there is not enough statistical evidence to show that it is a deterrent. Taking for example, average homicide rates of all countries with and without the death penalty, there are 36.7 homicides per 100,000 amongst those with the penalty compared to 27.4 amongst those which abolished it.

System over emotions. India should be focusing on judicial reform, the number of rape convictions in Delhi, the capital, is minimal. There were more than 635 reported rapes in Delhi last year, but only one conviction.

That's where the focus must be, not death penalties or castrations which fails to tackle to the root cause of this issue.
 
All Indian women should carry a pepper spray in their purse. At least some can save themselves.

Male Chauvinistic society which treats women nothing but baby making machines or sex objects is the reason for this. Not all men rape. All it takes is one in 100000 and with India's huge population, it becomes hundreds of rape cases.

Change should come from the family structure of India. Boys and Girls should be treated as equals. Importance of females in the society should be taught right from the childhood.

How many men cook in India? How many share household responsibilities? It all starts at home. Boys see females as someone inferior who cannot survive outside of the walls. They think that females are there only to cook/clean or have sex. When they grow to be old, they will transform into eve teasers and in extreme cases, they become rapists and murderers.

Disgusted with all the religious nuts saying that the girl was asking for it by going to a movie with her friend, She had no reason be at the bus stop at that hour, She should not have worn skirts or She did not cover up completely. Typical stone age men mentality.

Why no one sets any rules for men? Why should not they cover up? Why are they not asked to control their urges? Why are they not asked to leave the home after 8pm?

Most men who rape are ugly cowards. If a man is interested in a female, he should approach her and ask her name and number. If her response is -ve, then men should learn to accept the rejection and leave her alone. Not harass them (Bollywood style) or rape them or throw acid on them.
 
Markhor said:
Rape is a terrible and horrific crime but the death penalty has no place in a civilised society. There are many cases of false accusations of rape against men and the death penalty legitimises an irreversible act of violence by the state and will inevitably claim innocent victims. As long as human justice remains fallible, the risk of executing the innocent can never be eliminated.

Statistically, it costs more to put people on death row and there is not enough statistical evidence to show that it is a deterrent. Taking for example, average homicide rates of all countries with and without the death penalty, there are 36.7 homicides per 100,000 amongst those with the penalty compared to 27.4 amongst those which abolished it.

System over emotions. India should be focusing on judicial reform, the number of rape convictions in Delhi, the capital, is minimal. There were more than 635 reported rapes in Delhi last year, but only one conviction.

That's where the focus must be, not death penalties or castrations which fails to tackle to the root cause of this issue.
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I understand the point you are making, and to some extent agree with it.

However, I do not view a society or nation as civilized - in the true sense of that word - if rape is an endemic aspect of it.

Every man-made system is bound to have emotional aspects to it, given human nature. Which is why I would never advocate recourse to a man-made judicial authority for the worst criminal offences, such as rape and intentional homicide.

Divine Law, circumscribing human frailties, emotions and flaws, permits the death penalty - but only in the most heinous of crimes. Rape falls into that category. The sentence must also reflect the impact/effect of the crime upon the individual concerned, so her voice must be heard.

The problem with judicial systems in India or the US, or indeed, in any country, is that the law is very selectively applied. The wealthy, influential and powerful, have the means by which to evade the consequences of their crimes. Often, minorities, the poor and defenceless are disproportionately subjected to the full force of the law, so that justice is slanted in favour of those who design and implement the system.
 
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Women will be punished like Sita if they cross their limits: BJP's Kailash Vijayvargiya - The Times of India


Talking to mediapersons here on Thursday night, the minister drove home his point with an example from mythology. "Ek hi shabd hai- Maryada. Maryada ka Ulanghan hota hai, toh Sita-haran ho jata hai. Laxman-rekha har vyakti ki khichi gayi hain. Us Laxman-rekha ko koi bhi par karega, toh Rawan samne baitha hai, who Sita-haran karke le jayega. (There is a moral limit, which should not be breached, and if it is breached, one must understand that Ravana is watching and then Sita is bound to be abducted), the minister said quoting the Ramayana.
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Rapes occur in India, not Bharat: RSS supremo Bhagwat

SILCHAR: RSS supremo Mohanrao Bhagwat criticized 'western' lifestyle of people in urban areas and said, without empirical evidence to back such a claim, that rape is prevalent mainly in cities where Indians are deeply influenced by western values and not by rural India. Various women's NGOs and even police records suggest rapes in rural areas largely go unreported.


Addressing a citizens' meet here on Tuesday during his four-day visit to Silchar, Bhagwat said, "Such crimes hardly take place in 'Bharat', but they occur frequently in 'India'.

"You go to villages and forests of the country and there will be no such incidents of gang-rape or sex crimes. They are prevalent in some urban belts. Besides new legislations, Indian ethos and attitude towards women should be revisited in the context of ancient Indian values," Bhagwat said.
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http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2013-01-04/india/36148282_1_sita-hai-industry-minister
 
Lord Ram himself abandoned Sita. The religion itself is sexist. Sita's life was a tragedy. :(
 
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Markhor said:
Rape is a terrible and horrific crime but the death penalty has no place in a civilised society. There are many cases of false accusations of rape against men and the death penalty legitimises an irreversible act of violence by the state and will inevitably claim innocent victims. As long as human justice remains fallible, the risk of executing the innocent can never be eliminated.

Statistically, it costs more to put people on death row and there is not enough statistical evidence to show that it is a deterrent. Taking for example, average homicide rates of all countries with and without the death penalty, there are 36.7 homicides per 100,000 amongst those with the penalty compared to 27.4 amongst those which abolished it.

System over emotions. India should be focusing on judicial reform, the number of rape convictions in Delhi, the capital, is minimal. There were more than 635 reported rapes in Delhi last year, but only one conviction.

That's where the focus must be, not death penalties or castrations which fails to tackle to the root cause of this issue.
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Great post. Totally Hitchslapped.

Meanwhile Jadz just wondering why you consider your society civilised when your state has sanctioned itself as an unanswerable killer.
 
James said:
Great post. Totally Hitchslapped.

Meanwhile Jadz just wondering why you consider your society civilised when your state has sanctioned itself as an unanswerable killer.
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But why not death penalty in the rarest of rare cases like this one??there has to be a tolerance level!!
 
battler said:
But why not death penalty in the rarest of rare cases like this one??there has to be a tolerance level!!
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Their sex drive, evil opportunity, lack of policing.. their are multiple factors... And for once think about the family members of these rapists... Can India as state take care of them..What are they getting out of this. what was their fault..

And Society.... Isnt society also responsible? It took so many days for Jyoti's dad to come up openly... Why????

Clearly their are a lot of other factors to be considered before hanging someone.....
 
bin_pendi_ka_lota said:
Their sex drive, evil opportunity, lack of policing.. their are multiple factors... And for once think about the family members of these rapists... Can India as state take care of them..What are they getting out of this. what was their fault..

And Society.... Isnt society also responsible? It took so many days for Jyoti's dad to come up openly... Why????

Clearly their are a lot of other factors to be considered before hanging someone.....
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But if an indian has committed terrorism on his own country,would u hang them or not?even they might have a family right?in this way u can get away with anything!!
I'm not saying hang them in every rape case,but in the rarest of rare cases,and that is only for the judges to decide themselves.all i'm saying is that the option of death penalty should be kept open and should only be exercised in the rarest of rare cases.
 
Three Delhi gang rape suspects to plead not guilty

Three of the five men accused of the abduction, gang rape and murder of a 23-year-old woman in Delhi will plead not guilty to all charges against them, their lawyer has said.

Manohar Lal Sharma told the BBC the three - Mukesh Singh, Akshay Thakur and Ram Singh - should get a fair trial.

The five accused were charged on Monday. The next hearing in the case will he held on Thursday.

The case has shocked India and prompted a debate about the treatment of women.

A sixth suspect, who is thought to be 17, will be tried separately in a youth court if it is confirmed he is a minor.

On Thursday, a magistrate is expected to transfer the case for trial to a special fast-track court.

If convicted, the suspects could face the death penalty. Prosecutors have said they have extensive forensic evidence.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-20949038
 
Some statistics to ponder:

http://blogs.wsj.com/indiarealtime/...-rates-for-rape-across-india/tab/interactive/

OB-VX195_AIBY19_NS_20130107230744.png
 
It's UP, Bihar and Madhya Pradesh mainly, a lot of crimes occuring in other states are done by workers coming from those 3 poor states as well, Don't just hate me for this comment, i know it sounds like a typical Shiv Senik remark but its kinda true.
 
James said:
Great post. Totally Hitchslapped.

Meanwhile Jadz just wondering why you consider your society civilised when your state has sanctioned itself as an unanswerable killer.
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Sorry for sounding dense - what society and state are you referring to?
 
freelance_cricketer said:
It's UP, Bihar and Madhya Pradesh mainly, a lot of crimes occuring in other states are done by workers coming from those 3 poor states as well, Don't just hate me for this comment, i know it sounds like a typical Shiv Senik remark but its kinda true.
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Do you have any source to prove this
 
freelance_cricketer said:
It's UP, Bihar and Madhya Pradesh mainly, a lot of crimes occuring in other states are done by workers coming from those 3 poor states as well, Don't just hate me for this comment, i know it sounds like a typical Shiv Senik remark but its kinda true.
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Migrant daily laborers are a good source of work force for construction companies.

But when these guys are out of jobs, they resort to bad things.

All of the Delhi rapists are from UP/Bihar area. Even the raped girl si from UP.

Govt should do something about these migrant workers. Everyday thousands of these people flock to cities. They have no place to live. This is making the slum problem even worse in all big cities. These slums are breeding grounds for all kinds of mafia, land grabbers and worse rapists.
 
Ambi said:
Do you have any source to prove this
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Let's not get there. As a Punjabi, i am not really trying to score points over the Biharis or something. We have our own issues and they are female foeticide and honour killing. I am fully ashamed of that. But as far as public safety is concerned, those 3 states i mentioned are by far the worst. You are free to drive through their cities after sunset if you don't believe me, i would suggest carrying a gun or a security guard with you however. Don't worry about the arms license, you will get plenty of willing gun sellers over there. lol Dessi ghatta ftw. :afridi
 
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freelance_cricketer said:
Let's not get there. As a Punjabi, i am not really trying to score points over the Biharis or something. We have our own issues and they are female foeticide and honour killing. I am fully ashamed of that. But as far as public safety is concerned, those 3 states i mentioned are by far the worst. You are free to drive through their cities after sunset if you don't believe me, i would suggest carrying a gun or a security guard with you however. Don't worry about the arms license, you will get plenty of willing gun sellers over there. lol Dessi ghatta ftw. :afridi
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I visited few places in MP and UP,majority of the people were friendly.I know few migrant labours from these states are involved in various crimes in different states including my state.But its responsibility of labour department in state goverments to verify the details of these migratory workers before appointing them
 
Majority of them are friendly? Of course they are. Don't jump the gun yar, understand what i said.
 
Markhor said:
Some statistics to ponder:

http://blogs.wsj.com/indiarealtime/...-rates-for-rape-across-india/tab/interactive/

OB-VX195_AIBY19_NS_20130107230744.png
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Thanks for those stats...its interesting to see the breakdown by state however those rates aren't particularly high...and those conviction rates aren't that low either...

Using stats to make an argument to suggest India has a problem doesn't hold cos the results themselves are low...

Western nations have worse looking statistics...this isn't to say they are worse...cos high reportage such as Sweden may actually be a positive sign...it reflects the fact that more women feel comfortable making a complaint...something which isn't existent in many other countries...

In regards to rape...statistics are generally flawed cos essentially one doesn't know how many women have actually been raped...in Britain for instance we can only make estimates...80,000 a year is an estimate while 15,000 have made reports...it is entirely possible that states with the highest reported rapes don't actually have the most actual number of rapes...they have the most number of reports...

Frankly we don't know how bad India's problem is but I find it silly that people are using statistics to show the problem...papers have discussed the apparently low 26% conviction rate...this when Britain has a 6% conviction rate...if one is going to use a measure as a means of criticism then at the very least it should be used correctly...

Even then high conviction rates aren't always a good sign...some of those stats look very odd...Manipur with a 100% conviction rate??...
 
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freelance_cricketer said:
It's UP, Bihar and Madhya Pradesh mainly, a lot of crimes occuring in other states are done by workers coming from those 3 poor states as well, Don't just hate me for this comment, i know it sounds like a typical Shiv Senik remark but its kinda true.
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Stupid post..you are indeed talking like a shiv sainik ...post a proof else stop generalizing.
 
Jadz said:
Sorry for sounding dense - what society and state are you referring to?
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Your state that you have created hypothetically, where every 'rapist' is executed.

How can a state that has sanctioned itself as an unanswerable killer claim to preside over a civilised society?

State and government has to act on a higher moral plain to set an example and prove that it is better, or else how can the citizens be expected to behave?

As Markhor has suggested, the higher murder rates in many countries which still feature harsh physical punishments including the death penalty support our side of the argument.
 
battler said:
But if an indian has committed terrorism on his own country,would u hang them or not?even they might have a family right?in this way u can get away with anything!!
I'm not saying hang them in every rape case,but in the rarest of rare cases,and that is only for the judges to decide themselves.all i'm saying is that the option of death penalty should be kept open and should only be exercised in the rarest of rare cases.
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If hanging can only help in cleansing of thinking of Indian society and stigma attached to it....
If hanging can only help in successful conviction rate in rape cases...
If hanging can only help help in attitude and morael upliftment of Indian police , administration towards dealing with women..
If Hanging can only eradicate eave teasing....
Hanging will clearly neither achive nor help towards achieving either of the above objective which we as a society should be striving to.... If we really want to make a example we need to work towards that

And finally this is a rape and murder case, difference is we know the victim and brutality she had to go through....
 
bin_pendi_ka_lota said:
If hanging can only help in cleansing of thinking of Indian society and stigma attached to it....
If hanging can only help in successful conviction rate in rape cases...
If hanging can only help help in attitude and morael upliftment of Indian police , administration towards dealing with women..
If Hanging can only eradicate eave teasing....
Hanging will clearly neither achive nor help towards achieving either of the above objective which we as a society should be striving to.... If we really want to make a example we need to work towards that

And finally this is a rape and murder case, difference is we know the victim and brutality she had to go through....
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Ok if u dont want to hang them then what are the other options we have?lets take a hypothetical example
In india life imprisonment is 14 years right,unlike western countries where life imprisonment is for their 'actual life' like 100 years or 150 years or something like that.now if a guy is 20 years old and he rapes/muders another person he will only be in jail till 34 years max and then can migrate somewhere and start a new life.
So now the question is that we either change the meaning of life imprisonment and make the punishment to actual life in such cases or simply hand over the death penalty.because fact of the matter is only a 14 year jail term for such a crime is simply not enough!
 
battler said:
Ok if u dont want to hang them then what are the other options we have?lets take a hypothetical example
In india life imprisonment is 14 years right,unlike western countries where life imprisonment is for their 'actual life' like 100 years or 150 years or something like that.now if a guy is 20 years old and he rapes/muders another person he will only be in jail till 34 years max and then can migrate somewhere and start a new life.
So now the question is that we either change the meaning of life imprisonment and make the punishment to actual life in such cases or simply hand over the death penalty.because fact of the matter is only a 14 year jail term for such a crime is simply not enough!
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Really... 14 years... Thats a bit of shame... It is so age old... May be when the law was made, average life expectancy of Indan may have been around 40-50 years....
Duration definitely needs changing
 
bin_pendi_ka_lota said:
Really... 14 years... Thats a bit of shame... It is so age old... May be when the law was made, average life expectancy of Indan may have been around 40-50 years....
Duration definitely needs changing
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Yeah that's why i was in favour of death penalty in such cases.because we just dont have strong enough laws!for such cases rigourous life imprisonment in the true sense of the word should be implemented!
 
James said:
Your state that you have created hypothetically, where every 'rapist' is executed.

How can a state that has sanctioned itself as an unanswerable killer claim to preside over a civilised society?

State and government has to act on a higher moral plain to set an example and prove that it is better, or else how can the citizens be expected to behave?

As Markhor has suggested, the higher murder rates in many countries which still feature harsh physical punishments including the death penalty support our side of the argument.
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James, I appreciate your explanation as well as opinion. However, I do not wish to approach this extremely serious matter as a my/mine/our argument. There are no sides to such issues, just a sincere attempt to arrive at the right course, in order to achieve the best result. Human beings are inventive, and so are quite capable of reaching compromises.

My mention of the death penalty for the most heinous of crimes is founded upon Divine Law - I do not create nor live in hypothetical realms.

Perhaps there are extenuating circumstances in some rape cases: couples involved in relationships, stormy and passionate, where a man permits his emotions to dictate to him. The death penalty may not be appropriate here.

I think we need to remove emotion from this issue, and examine the facts of the case at hand: the details are harrowing and already present in the public domain, so I will not repeat them here. Suffice to say, the 23 year old woman was subjected to:

abduction
rape
torture
humiliation
murder

She was a constructive and productive member of society - the wanton destruction of this beautiful work of living, breathing art by evil-doers deserves the harshest punishment. The young woman has been rendered speechless: her family have spoken not only for her, but for themselves. The public too have made their voices heard. The state is not an inarticulate or inanimate body - it is supposed to be representative of the society which formed it. Thus, it is not unanswerable at all, but rather responsive and protective.

At the present moment in time, girls, women and families live in fear of this type of terrible crime affecting them. Whereas the potential perpetrators have no fear - living in prison is preferable to the death penalty.

As mentioned earlier, the wealthy, powerful and influential design and implement laws - which are slanted in their favour, and are employed, primarily, against the poor and minorities. Thus, the law in the US or India or Pakistan - or Sau'di or wherever - has little, if any, credibility. If the laws were applied equally perhaps the statistics would tell an entirely different story. Who knows?

If you will forbear with me, the following is an extract from an email I sent to DHONI some time ago, during exchanges regarding crime and punishment - it may be relevant here:


A crime affects 4 parties directly -

1) Allah SWT - any crime, particularly so serious a one as murder, is a transgression against HIS Laws and the limits HE has set to human behaviour/conduct;

2) The victim of the crime - he/she is not in a position to forgive, seek payment as a means of recompense, or to call for the maximum penalty. He/she will have their say on the Day of Judgment. Thus, his/her decision in respect of punishment for the crime is held in abeyance, until that Day;

3) The victim's family - they act, as it were, not only on their own behalf, but also on behalf of the victim. They may choose any one of the options open to them;

4) Society - of which the victim was a part. Crimes affect the condition of societies adversely. It makes them fearful and insecure. Thus, it is the role of the State to ensure society is protected from criminal elements, enabling it to attain prosperity and peace.

So, we need to examine the role of the State a little more closely. The State MUST act in order to ensure the perpetrator recieves the punishment which is his due - it has to be commensurate with the crime. This scenario provides for the criminal and the victim's family to arrive at an agreement, it means he/she may repent - but this is a matter between him/her and Allah SWT. The State still needs to impose the penalty for that crime. And this is in order to prevent society from descending into chaos through fear or vigilante crusades. In other words, the State is responsible for ensuring the safety of its citizens, and its laws must be reflective of that role.

This, however, in no way deprives the family of its inalienable right to have a say in what form of penalty - if any - is to be imposed upon the perpetrator. It simply means that all the 4 affected parties to the crime have been granted the justice which is due to them. In respect of Allah SWT, it translates into adhering to HIS Law and implementing it as best as possible.

An important point to note here: the Law of Islam is descriptive and not prescriptive. In other words, it describes Laws, provides the tenets and boundaries, and gives the guiding principles. If it were prescriptive, it would mean that each Law would have been described in minute detail, every specific matter clearly delineated. However, this would have made the Law of Islam too rigid, stern and unbending. So the Law is flexible and liberal, to be adjusted according to circumstances, and adapted in light of the changing times. This is because Islam is a Religion for all times and all peoples. The universality and timelessness of the Message is clearly reflected in the Law - as is the Grace and Mercy of Allah SWT.
 
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http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ble-lands-in-trouble/articleshow/17976694.cms


RAIPUR: Two days after a Chhattisgarh minister blamed "planetary influence" for sudden spurt in sexual crimes, a senior BJP MP and former Union minister Ramesh Bais kicked up a controversy saying, "One can understand rape of an adult; but rape of a minor is a heinous crime and those committing such crime ought to be hanged."

In Hindi, Bais was quoted as saying, "Barabari ya bade logo ke sath balatkar samajh me ata hai, lekin nabalig bacchiyon ke sath is tarah ka jaghanya apradh karma, inko to phaansi par latka dena chahiye." He had to be told that rape, under no circumstances, can be defended, justified, or explained.

State Congress spokesman Shailesh Nitin Trivedi said, "Such remarks are unacceptable as these lower the dignity of women. We condemn the statement and demand a public apology from the BJP MP"

The controversial remarks came when Bais, who was once the BJP's chief whip in the Lok Sabha, was talking to a few reporters about the on-going row over the Kanker incident in which minor tribal inmates of a girls' hostel, being run by the state's tribal welfare department, were sexually exploited and abused by a contract teacher and a watchman for months.

Stressing that rape of minors was the most heinous crime, Bais said most incidents like the one in Kanker go unreported but the government has taken prompt action against the accused. "But will termination or suspension of employees help bring back honour of the victims?" he asked, adding that all the accused should get stringent punishment. "Kanker incident has brought shame to the state," Bais concluded.
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:facepalm: :facepalm:
 
Delhi rape accused found dead in prison

A suspect in the notorious rape and murder of a female student in India's capital, Delhi, has been found dead in prison, his lawyer has confirmed.

Police say Ram Singh hanged himself in Delhi's Tihar jail, but defence lawyers and his family suspect he was murdered.

Home Minister Sushilkumar Shinde described his death as a "major lapse".

Mr Singh, 33, was one of five men being held in the case, which outraged India and sparked debate about the treatment of women. They all deny the charges.
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“Start Quote

The death in prison of a man accused in the gang rape and murder of a student in Delhi has raised questions about security in South Asia's largest prison ”

image of Soutik Biswas Soutik Biswas India correspondent

Read more from Soutik

A sixth suspect is being tried by a juvenile court.

The BBC's Sanjoy Majumder, in Delhi, says Mr Singh's death comes as a huge embarrassment for the authorities who are already under enormous pressure over the case.

"It is a major lapse in security, certainly it is not a small incident. Action will be taken," Mr Shinde is quoted by the Agence France-Presse news agency as saying.

Tihar jail spokesman Sunil Gupta told the BBC that Ram Singh appeared to have hanged himself with an improvised rope made from a blanket at about 05:00 local time on Monday (23:30 GMT Sunday).

He said an inquiry had been ordered and Ram Singh's body would be taken for a post mortem examination later on Monday.

VK Anand, defence lawyer for Ram Singh: "There has to be some foul play here"

The spokesman denied Indian media reports that Ram Singh had been on suicide watch, and said three people were sharing his prison cell.

Ram Singh's lawyer, VK Anand, told the BBC he was informed about his client's death by police.

"This is shocking news. There were no circumstances to suggest that he would commit suicide. He was happy with the trial, it was going on smoothly," Mr Anand said.
'Threatened'

Mr Singh's father, Mangelal Singh said his son had a badly injured hand and could not have hanged himself.

He also said his son had been raped in prison by other inmates and repeatedly threatened by prisoners and guards.

"My son has not committed suicide," he said.

Ram Singh and the four other adult defendants - his brother Mukesh, Pawan Gupta, Vinay Sharma and Akshay Thakur - have been on trial in a fast-track court.
Ram singh Ram Singh's death in India's most secure jail is a huge embarrassment for the authorities

The case was due to resume on Monday. Reporting restrictions mean few details of the trial have been made public.

They face 13 charges, including murder, gang-rape, kidnapping and destruction of evidence. If found guilty they could face the death penalty.

The maximum sentence the juvenile would face if convicted would be three years in a reform facility.

The 23-year-old rape victim, who was not named for legal reasons, was with a male friend when she was attacked on a bus and thrown from the vehicle on 16 December.
Continue reading the main story
Case Timeline

16 December 2012: Student gang-raped on Delhi bus
17 December: Bus driver Ram Singh and three others arrested
18 December: Uproar in parliament, street protests in Delhi and elsewhere
21-22 December: Two more arrests, including a minor
29 December: Victim dies in Singapore hospital
7 January 2013: Suspects charged in court with abduction, gang rape, murder
21 January: Trial of five accused begins in special fast-track court
2 February: Five accused plead not guilty
28 February: Sixth accused charged in juvenile court
11 March: Ram Singh found dead in Tihar jail

She died in a Singapore hospital on 29 December from massive internal injuries.

Ram Singh was accused of being the driver of the bus.

The case provoked nationwide protests and demands for tougher penalties for rapists, as well as greater protection for women.

Tihar prison, which authorities say is the largest in Asia, is India's most high-security prison.

The 55-year-old jail houses more than 12,000 inmates although it has an official capacity of about 6,000.

The complex includes nine separate prison facilities.

Media reports quoting the chief of Tihar prison Vimla Mehra say there were 18 deaths in the jail last year, of which two were cases of suicide
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21737748
 
I think in some parts of india its a cultural issue but in northern eastern parts where free sex is allowed incidents of gangs rapes are very rare.But in my state kerala,which is the most secular and 100% literate state in india from where incidents of incest rapes and incest gang rapes are reported frequently in which hindus,muslims and christians are equally involved.
 
India definitely needs to get their house in order. I am not saying this for the sake of cockiness across the border; but because this is becoming way too common and it is depressing. Tourism has all but stopped in Pakistan, and if India dont check themselves then it might end up saying goodbye to tourism as well.

But even more important than tourism, if a country cannot provide basic security to it's women, then it is a failure of the state of the lowest kind.
 
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The treatment of women in India is getting ridiculous:facepalm:. Something should seriously be done soon on this to control, otherwise they may well fall into further mess. It is really depressing to read a new case every other day:(.

The blame game on different communities, states etc. is not going to help you either. On top of all, there are some amazing-minded politicians etc. in India who have it in their gutter mentality to blame it on the women themselves, that is, what they wear etc.
 
If such vile acts took place in Pakistan, I guarantee ppl would blame the religion.
 
DHONI183 said:
The treatment of women in India is getting ridiculous:facepalm:. Something should seriously be done soon on this to control, otherwise they may well fall into further mess. It is really depressing to read a new case every other day:(.

The blame game on different communities, states etc. is not going to help you either. On top of all, there are some amazing-minded politicians etc. in India who have it in their gutter mentality to blame it on the women themselves, that is, what they wear etc.
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Mr. Dhoni183, you're absolutely right. We are in a mess & don't have a solution either.
 
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mani1 said:
British tourist breaks leg as she jumps out of the window of Indian hotel room to escape manager who 'tried to rape her'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...n-hotel-man-tries-rape-her.html#ixzz2NzsLZTHS
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
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Another one. Just that when I thought villages may be slightly safer, Swedish woman raped while on a biking trip.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...2302e0-8e54-11e2-adca-74ab31da3399_story.html
 
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Most of the rapists do not have the guts to ask out a lady. The only way they can get a women is by marriage or by raping them.

I already posted this before, it all starts at home. Males are given higher priority over females when it comes to education, food etc. Females are taught to cook, clean and be subservient to males at home.
When these young males grow up, they see every girl out on the street as some kind of prostitute waiting for him to have sex with him.

Solution to this rape problem is long term. It will take a whole new generation to change the attitude. But with Grandma's at home preferring male kids, this situation is only getting worse.
 
Senman said:
Mr. Dhoni183, you're absolutely right. We are in a mess & don't have a solution either.
Click to expand...

As someone who wishes the best for all people, I myself wonder about the solutions to it and the way out. It is not much that I have been able to come up with, sadly:(.... I can only hope and pray for the safety of women over there in India.

mithun_minhas said:
I already posted this before, it all starts at home. Males are given higher priority over females when it comes to education, food etc. Females are taught to cook, clean and be subservient to males at home.
When these young males grow up, they see every girl out on the street as some kind of prostitute waiting for him to have sex with him.

Solution to this rape problem is long term. It will take a whole new generation to change the attitude. But with Grandma's at home preferring male kids, this situation is only getting worse.
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In general, not bad points, but it makes me ponder over something: All that you have mentioned happens in our Pakistan too, and I am an eye witness to some of what you have pointed out, and neither is Pakistan the best country in world about the treatment of women, but why are things happening this often in India? I don't think Pakistan have 'competed' well against India in this particular case at least.
 
mithun_minhas said:
Most of the rapists do not have the guts to ask out a lady. The only way they can get a women is by marriage or by raping them.

I already posted this before, it all starts at home. Males are given higher priority over females when it comes to education, food etc. Females are taught to cook, clean and be subservient to males at home.
When these young males grow up, they see every girl out on the street as some kind of prostitute waiting for him to have sex with him.

Solution to this rape problem is long term. It will take a whole new generation to change the attitude. But with Grandma's at home preferring male kids, this situation is only getting worse.
Click to expand...

Mithun, rape is a world wide problem and not restricted to India. So our culture or the lack of cannot be cited as the reason.

I think alcoholism is the main reason, it turns otherwise sane human beings in to monsters. There needs to be a limit set on how much one can consume outdoors.
 
Senman said:
I think alcoholism is the main reason, it turns otherwise sane human beings in to monsters. There needs to be a limit set on how much one can consume outdoors.
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Interesting point. Do people in India drink a lot:13:?
 
trying to westernize indian culture is the main problem. no indian will admit this. poor women. :(
 
DHONI183 said:
Interesting point. Do people in India drink a lot:13:?
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Alcohol market in India is estimated to cross the USD 39 billion mark by 2014.People in the state of Kerala are the heaviest drinkers in India followed by punjab.As per medical research Alcohol and Smoking affects Men's sex Drive and causes erectile dysfunction
 
The death penalty feels deserved in this case, but the real worry is whether or not it will cause more rapists to kill their victims, so there are no witnesses left.
 
Let us not engage in details. Please refrain from posting any latest news article etc. We all know what I am referring to.

Should not women from foreign countries think twice before visiting India? No, I am not blaming them for might happen to them, definitely not, as my thinking is quite different to those who say that such and such things happen to women because they tempt men into it by not covering themselves properly:facepalm:. However, I am saying this in their interest as we are all aware of what India is most famous for of late. Why risk one´s self?

Was thinking about this following a discussion with a female friend of mine who used to visit India quite often and now her attitude about this now is like, "No, never!"
 
Wow, shocked!

Indian actress Rhea Chakraborty reported on Twitter some six hours ago that some man tried to do 'something' with her in the building she lives (in Mumbai). She says that she managed to make him run away by kicking him hard and then screaming loud.

Pathetic stuff:facepalm:!
 
^ I hope she files a complaint, Most of the apartments have CCtvs So it Will be easier for the police to identify the man.
 
Ambi said:
^ I hope she files a complaint, Most of the apartments have CCtvs So it Will be easier for the police to identify the man.
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She has. Tweets that the police has been very supportive and helpful. So yeah, I hope the man is caught. CCTV camera is available she says.
 
Felt physically sick listening to the rapist justify his deeds. And the defence lawyers were almost as bad.

According to Jyoti Singh's mother, who took part and gave her permission for the documentary in question, her daughters last words in hospital before her heart stopped beating were 'sorry mum, to have brought you so much grief'. :(

*Guys/Girls please stick to the rules in the opening post so that this thread doesn't get removed too*


Delhi rapist says victim shouldn't have fought back

In 2012 an Indian student was violently raped on a moving bus in Delhi and died of horrific internal injuries. Leslee Udwin spoke to one of the rapists on death row while spending two years making a film about the case. She came away shocked by India's treatment of women - but inspired by those seeking change.

The horrifying details of the rape had led me to expect deranged monsters. Psychopaths. The truth was far more chilling. These were ordinary, apparently normal and certainly unremarkable men.

On 16 December 2012, the 23-year-old woman had been to see a film, the Life of Pi, with a male friend. At 8.30pm they boarded an off-duty bus, with six men on board, five adults and a juvenile. The men beat the friend and each raped the woman in turn, before assaulting her viciously with an iron instrument.

Mukesh Singh, the driver of the bus, described to me every detail of what happened during and after the incident. While prosecutors say the men took turns to drive the bus, and all took part in the rape, Singh says he stayed at the wheel throughout.

Along with three of the other attackers, Singh is now appealing against his death sentence. In 16 hours of interviews, Singh showed no remorse and kept expressing bewilderment that such a fuss was being made about this rape, when everyone was at it.

"A decent girl won't roam around at nine o'clock at night. A girl is far more responsible for rape than a boy," he said.

"Housework and housekeeping is for girls, not roaming in discos and bars at night doing wrong things, wearing wrong clothes. About 20% of girls are good."

People "had a right to teach them a lesson" he suggested - and he said the woman should have put up with it.

"When being raped, she shouldn't fight back. She should just be silent and allow the rape. Then they'd have dropped her off after 'doing her', and only hit the boy," he said.

Chillingly, he went on: "The death penalty will make things even more dangerous for girls. Now when they rape, they won't leave the girl like we did. They will kill her. Before, they would rape and say, 'Leave her, she won't tell anyone.' Now when they rape, especially the criminal types, they will just kill the girl. Death."

I had the long and shocking list of injuries the young woman had sustained, read out to him. I tried, really hard, to search for a glimmer of regret. There was none.

It would be easier to process this heinous crime if the perpetrators were monsters, and just the rotten apples in the barrel, aberrant in nature. Perhaps then, those of us who believe that capital punishment serves a purpose, and I am not among them, could wring their hands in relief when they hang.

For me the truth couldn't be further from this - and perhaps their hanging will even mask the real problem, which is that these men are not the disease, they are the symptoms.

My encounter with Singh and four other rapists left me feeling like my soul had been dipped in tar, and there were no cleaning agents in the world that could remove the indelible stain.

One of the men I interviewed, Gaurav, had raped a five-year-old girl. I spent three hours filming his interview as he recounted in explicit detail how he had muffled her screams with his big hand.

He was sitting throughout the interview and had a half-smile playing on his lips throughout - his nervousness in the presence of a camera, perhaps. At one point I asked him to tell me how tall she was. He stood up, and with his eerie half-smile indicated a height around his knees.

When I asked him how he could cross the line from imagining what he wanted to do, to actually doing it - given her height, her eyes, her screams - he looked at me as though I was crazy for even asking the question and said: "She was beggar girl. Her life was of no value."

These offences against women and girls are a part of the story, but the full story starts with a girl not being as welcome as a boy, from birth. When sweets are distributed at the birth of a boy, not of a girl. When the boy child is nourished more than the girl, when a girl's movements are restricted and her freedoms and choices are curtailed, when she is sent as a domestic slave to her husband's home… If a girl is accorded no value, if a girl is worth less than a boy, then it stands to reason there will be men who believe they can do what they like with them.
Continue reading the main story
“Start Quote

In our culture, there is no place for a woman ”

ML Sharma Lawyer

I spoke to two lawyers who had defended the murderers of the 23-year-old student at their trial, and what they said was extremely revealing.

"In our society, we never allow our girls to come out from the house after 6:30 or 7:30 or 8:30 in the evening with any unknown person," said one of the lawyers, ML Sharma.

"You are talking about man and woman as friends. Sorry, that doesn't have any place in our society. We have the best culture. In our culture, there is no place for a woman."

The other lawyer, AP Singh, had said in a previous televised interview: "If my daughter or sister engaged in pre-marital activities and disgraced herself and allowed herself to lose face and character by doing such things, I would most certainly take this sort of sister or daughter to my farmhouse, and in front of my entire family, I would put petrol on her and set her alight."

He did not disown that comment when I put it to him. "This is my stand," he said. "I still today stand on that reply."

Gender-inequality is the primary tumour and rape, trafficking, child marriage, female foeticide, honour killings and so on, are the metastases. And in India the problem is not lack of laws - after all, India is a democracy and a civilised, rapidly developing country. The problem is implementation of them.

Article 14 of the Indian Constitution confers absolute equal rights on women. The giving of dowry is a legal offence, but many families maintain the custom nonetheless. Until and unless the mindset changes, the cancer will thrive and continue to spread.

But what compelled me to leave my family and go to Delhi to make this film was not the rape itself, nor the horror of it. It was what followed.

Starting on the day after the rape, and for over a month, ordinary men and women came out on to the streets of India's cities in unprecedented numbers to protest. They braved a freezing December and a ferocious government crackdown of water cannons, baton charges, and teargas shells. Their courage and determination to be heard was extraordinarily inspiring.

There was something momentous about their presence and perseverance - reminiscent to me of the crowds that had thronged Tahrir Square in Cairo - a gathering of civil society that demanded a conversation that was long overdue.

It occurred to me that, for all its appalling record of violence against women and relentless rapes, here was India leading the world by example. I couldn't recall another country, in my lifetime, standing up with such tenacity for women, for me. And I knew at once that I simply had to use whatever talents and skills I had, to amplify their cries of "enough is enough!" which were reverberating across the whole world.

As is often the case with extremely challenging endeavours where the human stakes are high, the main struggle for me was the emotional and psychological toll the work imposed.

When you look into the blackest recesses of the human heart, you cannot but be depressed and deeply disappointed. I woke one morning on the shoot, wet from head to toe, bathed in sweat and fear and my heart knocking against my ribcage. This was a panic attack. I phoned home thinking my husband would answer, but my 13-year-old daughter, Maya, did.

She immediately sensed I was in trouble. And when I told her, in tears, that I was coming home because this was too big for me, the mountain was just too high to scale, she said: "Mummy, you can't come home because I and my generation of girls is relying on you."

What carried me through, apart from Maya, was what had inspired me in the first place: the new-thinkers, especially among the youth, in India who want change and are clamouring for it. And I am absolutely optimistic that we are now on the cusp of change.

India's Daughter will be broadcast on Storyville on BBC Four on Sunday 8 March at 22:00 GMT. It will be shown in India on NDTV at 21:00 local time
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-31698154
 
What do you expect from a culture that embraces the dowry system, aborts 1 million female fetuses annually, and collectively treats women like garbage?
 
^ Wow thanks dhump for editing it late. I watched the whole documentry..:)
 
Female Saraiki singer tortured by husband

A local Saraiki singer, Aliya Baloch, was tortured by her husband apparently over a domestic dispute in Rahim Yar Khan. The singer filed a complaint with police, claiming that her ‘greedy’ hubby thrashed her after she refused to give him money. Watch this report for further details…

https://www.samaa.tv/entertainment/2017/01/female-saraiki-singer-tortured-by-husband/


[UTUBE]yj8CZvtwgWY[/UTUBE]
 
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