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Dear Kane Williamson, please do something of note in India, Australia and England

K

KP From India

Tape Ball Regular
Joined
Jun 30, 2017
Runs
464
As much as he has achieved a no 1 rank in tests, away performances left lot to desire.
Quality sides build confidence from home dominance to be competitive a then few matches and then a series away against good opposition.
Nz's last test win in Aus was 2011 test that too by 7 runs, Kane need to do something there in the next tour.
I feel, he has a best chance in Eng because Nz does well there and the conditions suit their bowlers, a series win is a must.
As much as I like our home dominance to be intact, I wont mind Kane lifting a test match trophy or at least share the trophy with Indian captain after completion of test series.
When and how many of these would happen?
 
Kane still has many years to go as batsman. 5 at least. He can easily pad his away average in coming years, he has the best technique in the world right now.
 
What about series results? Can he take NZ to a seies victory or at least a draw in Aus, Eng and Ind?
 
TBH His away averages are pretty poor.
I still think that he is technically correct and has the ability to score everywhere but somehow its not materializing
 
KP From India said:
What about series results? Can he take NZ to a seies victory or at least a draw in Aus, Eng and Ind?
Click to expand...

In India- there's no chance in hell, their best spinner is Santner :yk.
Southee and Wagner won't do zilch. Not sure about Jamieson though.

In Aus- Very difficult but still not impossible, Jamieson is 6'7 and has great control so there's a good chance of him succeeding in Aus. Jamieson, Wagner(good in Aus), Boult and Ferguson. Solid bowling lineup.
But there batsman aren't good enough, even Kane is mediocre in Aus.

In Eng- Yes.
 
jeeteshssaxena said:
In India- there's no chance in hell, their best spinner is Santner :yk.
Southee and Wagner won't do zilch. Not sure about Jamieson though.

In Aus- Very difficult but still not impossible, Jamieson is 6'7 and has great control so there's a good chance of him succeeding in Aus. Jamieson, Wagner(good in Aus), Boult and Ferguson. Solid bowling lineup.
But there batsman aren't good enough, even Kane is mediocre in Aus.

In Eng- Yes.
Click to expand...

Kane has 140 and 166 in Aus. So he just had a bad tour
 
Kane is young when compared to the other top batsman. So he has lot of time to set things right
 
This is a fair call. I expect him to improve his numbers on his next tours to these countries.
 
Thunderbolt14 said:
Kane still has many years to go as batsman. 5 at least. He can easily pad his away average in coming years, he has the best technique in the world right now.
Click to expand...

His technique is solid against pace, but he is hardly tested against spin in New Zealand. He is a good player of both, but in my mind, his bigger weakness is against spin.

He will truly be tested in the subcontinent whenever New Zealand tour, given that he'll have to bat against the likes of Ashwin, Jadeja, Shakib, Yasir, and more.

That will be something interesting to watch.
 
Kane couldnt do much against India even at home last year. His scores were 89, 3 and 5....so pretty avg compared to the Bradman he turned this season against Pakistan and WI.
 
Not particularly about Kane but Nz needs to do well as a team in Ind, Eng and Aus. Need to win at least 1 of these series and draw other.
 
Kane although is a very good batsman but IMO he is massively overrated, lets have a look at his record in away matches.

1st of all his average overall is 54.31 which goes down drastically to 45.57 when it comes to away matches

2nd his record in Eng, Ind, SL & SA is quite poor for a player who is talked-about alot.
In England his average is 30.87
In India 35. 46
In SL 26.71
In SA 21.16
 
ChTab said:
Kane although is a very good batsman but IMO he is massively overrated, lets have a look at his record in away matches.

1st of all his average overall is 54.31 which goes down drastically to 45.57 when it comes to away matches

2nd his record in Eng, Ind, SL & SA is quite poor for a player who is talked-about alot.
In England his average is 30.87
In India 35. 46
In SL 26.71
In SA 21.16
Click to expand...

Surprising, NZ batters often do well here.
 
NZ can be competitive in Aus and Eng. Especially now that they have Jamieson in their side.

In India tho, they will need at least 1 world class spinner to remotely compete once the ball is older or there is no seam/swing.

Kane is a world class batsman, best of the best.
 
Among fab 4 Kane is a tier below Kohli and couple tiers below Smith. I rate Root higher than him due to Root's ability to perform against all types of attacks in any conditions while Kane is a bit of an OTB (Oceania Track Bully).
 
ChTab said:
Kane although is a very good batsman but IMO he is massively overrated, lets have a look at his record in away matches.

1st of all his average overall is 54.31 which goes down drastically to 45.57 when it comes to away matches

2nd his record in Eng, Ind, SL & SA is quite poor for a player who is talked-about alot.
In England his average is 30.87
In India 35. 46
In SL 26.71
In SA 21.16
Click to expand...

He averaged 40 in sri lanka before the horrible 2019 tour where he averaged 8
 
Hyperion66 said:
Among fab 4 Kane is a tier below Kohli and couple tiers below Smith. I rate Root higher than him due to Root's ability to perform against all types of attacks in any conditions while Kane is a bit of an OTB (Oceania Track Bully).
Click to expand...

Kane is at a disadvantage compared to the others when it comes to touring, as he plays almost exclusively short 2 (or sometimes even 1) test series that gives him less time to adjust to conditions. In away series where he has played 3 tests, he averages 68 (that includes tours of India - avg 42, UAE avg 60+, Australia - avg 80+ and WI avg 50+).
 
WhenSultansBowled said:
NZ can be competitive in Aus and Eng. Especially now that they have Jamieson in their side.

In India tho, they will need at least 1 world class spinner to remotely compete once the ball is older or there is no seam/swing.

Kane is a world class batsman, best of the best.
Click to expand...

Even if they got Warne and Murali they would still get their backside handed to them. They just don’t have batsmen to tackle Indian duo spinners in India. NZ are minnows in India
 
Uh, Kane was dominant in Aus in 2015.

Bahnz said:
Kane is at a disadvantage compared to the others when it comes to touring, as he plays almost exclusively short 2 (or sometimes even 1) test series that gives him less time to adjust to conditions. In away series where he has played 3 tests, he averages 68 (that includes tours of India - avg 42, UAE avg 60+, Australia - avg 80+ and WI avg 50+).
Click to expand...
Exactly, by the time he acclimatizes the series is over.
 
2019 he was poor and in his first tour of Aus were played on literal green tops when he was still young.
 
He needs better partners than Nichols type players who need the opposition to drop their chances half a dozen times to be able to hang around. It helps the star batsman bat with more ease knowing the entire line up isn’t relying on him alone to make it count with the bat.

IIRC he’s smashed a double ton in UAE too.
 
Hes performed very well in Australia before but the last tour he was very sick much of the time.

I expect him to improve his average in England he is well suited to the conditions there but India will probably remain a kryptonite
 
Its tough for NZ batsman touring because we usually only get 2 tests with no warm matches. They jump straight in the deep end.

A lot of our recent tours we have lost the first test then improved to draw the series or win in the case of last UAE tour.
 
Can't believe nz cricket boards faced a 900,000 usd loss in 2019 despite reaching the wc final.

I thought the 2015 wc would have done wonders for nz cricket
 
Another failed innings in England. But it's okay we will not talk about it because he is nice and talks well.
 
9 innings in England, average of 28.88. 132 of his 260 runs in England have come from one innings, meaning he's scored just 128 runs in the other 8 innings.
 
He is like Mahela Jayawardene. Aesthetically pleasing, scores clutch runs but when you look at stats, you find mediocre record in several countries.
 
Ab Fan said:
He is like Mahela Jayawardene. Aesthetically pleasing, scores clutch runs but when you look at stats, you find mediocre record in several countries.
Click to expand...
This!

He is nowhere near the likes of Kohli & Smith despite being ranked batsman in world.
 
Ghar ka sher.

Most of the cricket nerds who are his fans and are not from NZ, only like him because he is a “nice guy”, the same type who don’t think Pandya is a good player because he comes across as a d bag. Or Kohli (till his face turn in 2019). Or Stokes.
 
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He is comparable to Joe root.He is nowhere near virat and Steve Smith.He is alright player nothing spectacular.Never liked him.
 
He is a top quality batsman. difficult to understand what happens to him on tours.
 
Suleiman said:
Ghar ka sher.

Most of the cricket nerds who are his fans and are not from NZ, only like him because he is a “nice guy”, the same type who don’t think Pandya is a good player because he comes across as a d bag. Or Kohli (till his face turn in 2019). Or Stokes.
Click to expand...

Pandya is not a great example tbh :yk.

He is simply nowhere in the elite league as Kohli, Williamson or Stokes.
 
He's so overrated, least talented out of fab 4. Has scored tons of runs against weak sides & at home. He fails all the vs strong teams on away tours.
 
Kane is someone everyone wants to succeed. But he needs to get his act together and play an important role in this series. those averages will look pretty bad at end of his career.
 
Just a matter of time before he comes good - English conditions aren’t that different than what he gets at home. Hope he plays a series winning role this tour
 
Averages in all major countries:-

NZ- 65
<B>India- 35</B>
Aus- 42
<B>Eng- 26</B>
<B>SA- 21</B>
<B>SL- 26</B>
UAE- 64
WI- 51
 
Biggest home bully and minnow basher ever arguably. The fact he's included in Fab 4 is nauseating. Pujara is much, much better than him, and I would even pick Warner over Williamson.
 
Ab Fan said:
Averages in all major countries:-

NZ- 65
<B>India- 35</B>
Aus- 42
<B>Eng- 26</B>
<B>SA- 21</B>
<B>SL- 26</B>
UAE- 64
WI- 51
Click to expand...

Those are some poor numbers in England, South Africa and Sri Lanka.
 
Hitman said:
Those are some poor numbers in England, South Africa and Sri Lanka.
Click to expand...

Babr is definitely no.3 after Smith and Kohli in tests. Root 4th and Labu 5th , Williamson is 6th at best.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Zeshan547 said:
Babr is definitely no.3 after Smith and Kohli in tests. Root 4th and Labu 5th , William ka beta is 6th at best.
Click to expand...

I am a massive babar fan but Williamson and root are ahead as they have maintained it longer babar is stil a new starter
 
Just have a feel Williamson's peak is yet to come. Their players tend to play longer than other SENA players. He's played the least no.of Tests compared to the other three, and he may well be the most inferior of them but he has time to turn it around.

In Tests, Smith is comfortably ahead of others,
In ODIs, Kohli is comfortably ahead of others.
In T20is, Kohli is marginally ahead of others. Dynamics of their batting are changing now as they are entering their 30s, so adjusting to t20is is going to be tough for them, Smith has evidently been struggling to find his space in t20s.
 
Joseph Gomes said:
Biggest home bully and minnow basher ever arguably. The fact he's included in Fab 4 is nauseating. Pujara is much, much better than him, and I would even pick Warner over Williamson.
Click to expand...

Warner:-

Aus - 63
<B>Eng - 26
Ind - 24
NZ - 13
SL - 27</B>
SA - 63
UAE- 59
<B>WI - 26</B>

Pujara:-

Ind - 56
Aus - 47
<B>Eng - 29
NZ - 20
SA - 31</B>
SL- 90
UAE - N/A
<B>WI - 20</B>

Country- wise failures:-

Williamson(4) - India, England, SA, SL
Warner(5) - India, England, NZ, SL, WI
Pujara(4) - Eng, NZ, SA, WI
 
Against top 8 opponents :-

Smith - 62
Kohli - 51
Root - 50
Williamson - 49
Warner - 47
Pujara - 46

Smith is in a league of his own as far as test cricket is concerned.
 
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This sort of thing gets tedious.

We heard it about Tendulkar for years not scoring a 100 at Lords in his many attempts.

If there's an obvious weakness in a players game, state what that is. But let's not play this stupid game pretending that just because Williamson hasn't scored a lot of runs in England that means there's something deficient with his game when there's no evidence of that.

What is the actual point people are trying to make here? Be precise.

Do they think he struggles when the ball is swinging and seaming? No, he has a much better game against swing and seam than the likes of Kohli, he just hasn't scored runs in England.

That's cricket, especially when someone plays a few 2 test series here in there in one place.
 
Snatch said:
This sort of thing gets tedious.

We heard it about Tendulkar for years not scoring a 100 at Lords in his many attempts.

If there's an obvious weakness in a players game, state what that is. But let's not play this stupid game pretending that just because Williamson hasn't scored a lot of runs in England that means there's something deficient with his game when there's no evidence of that.

What is the actual point people are trying to make here? Be precise.

Do they think he struggles when the ball is swinging and seaming? No, he has a much better game against swing and seam than the likes of Kohli, he just hasn't scored runs in England.

That's cricket, especially when someone plays a few 2 test series here in there in one place.
Click to expand...

Williamson hasnt scored in England,India,SA and SL. Thats 4 of the top 8 countries. His avg has gone beyond 50 on basis of bashing teams at home.

Kohli outscores Willamson in SA ENG and AUS. So no, Williamson doesn't have a better game than Kohli against any kind of fast bowling.

If the trend holds,Kohli will go onto be a ATG and Williamson a HTB.
 
Average in England after 10 Test innings
Steve Smith - 28.1
Kane Williamson - 26
Virat Kohli - 13.4
Kane Williamson is the only one who scored a Hundred in his first 10 Test innings in Eng
 
Nothing to worry about. He will score 237 at home against a substandard attack and his fans will go crazy.

Some players are above criticism and he is one of them. Comfortably the most overrated cricketer on the planet today, but it is a crime to criticize him.
 
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Snatch said:
We heard it about Tendulkar for years not scoring a 100 at Lords in his many attempts.
Click to expand...
Poor analogy!

This is nothing like Tendulkar not being able to score a test ton at Lords which imo is nothing special. Also, I see you didn't mention Lara, Sunny, Ponting who all didn't score a test ton at Lords.
 
Also, he is very poor in SA and SL as well. In India, he averages just 35. That's 4 test nations he has poor records against.
 
He's a good guy.
He's a great batsman.

But he will not be remembered as the front running batsman of a generation.

Much like Sangakkara, Kallis back in the day.
 
Snatch said:
This sort of thing gets tedious.

We heard it about Tendulkar for years not scoring a 100 at Lords in his many attempts.
Click to expand...

Not scoring runs in 3-4 major away countries becomes the same as another batsman not scoring a ton in one specific ground? Not sure why you see a parallel here.
 
Kane should be scoring runs. He has the skills to do so. I think we will see runs from him in those away venues in the future.
 
Williamson needs to perform away.

Pujara should be included among the top bats.

Fab 5.

What kind of ghatiya marketing is this to exclude one of the greatest clutch batsman in the history of test cricket.
 
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sensible-indian-fan said:
Williamson needs to perform away.

Pujara should be included among the top bats.

Fab 5.

What kind of ghatiya marketing is this to exclude one of the greatest clutch batsman in the history of test cricket.
Click to expand...

There's no such thing as big 3

The term exists so that some respect could be given to Steve Smith, James Root like players etc since they remain in Kohli's shadow always.

In all honesty, Virat Kohli is by far and away the generation defining batsman of this era. No one is even close..You could compare Lara to Sachin even though Sachin's mountain of achievements were a level above but with Kohli, there is no Lara like competition. Steve Smith is that guy who can even bring the stars and moons to a girl but will still remain friendzoned because he ain't a playa.
 
There are only two legendary batsman in this generation.

One is Virat Kohli and the other is, without any guess, Babar Azam. Only these two batsman will maintain an average of 50+ in Tests, 55+ in ODIs and 40+ in T20s. Rest are there for just filling the numbers.
 
Ab Fan said:
Warner:-

Aus - 63
<B>Eng - 26
Ind - 24
NZ - 13
SL - 27</B>
SA - 63
UAE- 59
<B>WI - 26</B>

Pujara:-

Ind - 56
Aus - 47
<B>Eng - 29
NZ - 20
SA - 31</B>
SL- 90
UAE - N/A
<B>WI - 20</B>

Country- wise failures:-

Williamson(4) - India, England, SA, SL
Warner(5) - India, England, NZ, SL, WI
Pujara(4) - Eng, NZ, SA, WI
Click to expand...

I suppose Warner is slightly worse then. However Pujara is much more clutch than Williamson in Test cricket at least. Williamson in test is so overrated it's mindboggling.
 
freelance_cricketer said:
There's no such thing as big 3

The term exists so that some respect could be given to Steve Smith, James Root like players etc since they remain in Kohli's shadow always.

In all honesty, Virat Kohli is by far and away the generation defining batsman of this era. No one is even close..You could compare Lara to Sachin even though Sachin's mountain of achievements were a level above but with Kohli, there is no Lara like competition. Steve Smith is that guy who can even bring the stars and moons to a girl but will still remain friendzoned because he ain't a playa.
Click to expand...

Nah bro.

Steve Smith is too special in tests.

Genuine GOAT contender which Kohli never is.

Also in ODIs, he has played clutch knocks in QF and SF to win a WC.

He is special in different way.

Inferior to Kohli as an overall bat sure.

But superior in the most prestigious format.

Agreed about Root and Williamson who are too limited in some ways. Potentially Root is up there but he never kicks on.
 
An iconic knock in WTC Final can do a whole lot of good to Kane Williamson's legacy because a win in WTC Final would probably go down as one of NZ's greatest ever win of all-time.
 
Yeah, coming across as a Michaels Clarke/Hussey type player now.
 
Varun said:
Yeah, coming across as a Michaels Clarke/Hussey type player now.
Click to expand...

Michael Clarke averages 40 in Engalnd and South Africa.

KW will have to work hard to average 40 in both countries by the end of his career
 
Be careful what you wish for. He could turn the tide in WTC final, much to our chagrin. Kane is too good a batsman to not be averaging higher than 45 in SENA. He still has time, he will come good.

For me, in tests, Kane, Babar, Root, Virat, Pujara and Labuschagne are of a similar caliber (note that I said caliber, not achievements). Smith is at a different level, although the recent tour against India brought that down a little.
 
sharmaji said:
Be careful what you wish for. He could turn the tide in WTC final, much to our chagrin. Kane is too good a batsman to not be averaging higher than 45 in SENA. He still has time, he will come good.

For me, in tests, Kane, Babar, Root, Virat, Pujara and Labuschagne are of a similar caliber (note that I said caliber, not achievements). Smith is at a different level, although the recent tour against India brought that down a little.
Click to expand...

I don't see anyone wishing against Kane. Everyone wants him to succeed but bat is not talking as expected
 
He has an elbow injury at the moment and may not play in the 2nd Test versus England.
 
What if NZ goes to WTC Final without Kane Williamson? I wouldn't write them off even then.
 
Ab Fan said:
What if NZ goes to WTC Final without Kane Williamson? I wouldn't write them off even then.
Click to expand...

NZ batsmen are actually good players of swing, Kane Williamson's record aside. They will still remain good without him.
 
As excpected, NZ are winning the second test without him (NZ players are generally excellent players of swing, Williamson aside)
 
Ab Fan said:
What if NZ goes to WTC Final without Kane Williamson? I wouldn't write them off even then.
Click to expand...
Will young has done better than Kane so far.
But Williamson will definitely play vs india.
He might be useful for negating ashwin and jadeja. The rest of the nz batsmen will negate the Indian seamers
 
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