Do you believe that the Pakistan General Elections will be held in a fair manner?

[MenInG]

We are already hearing noise from certain quarters about the integrity of these elections but do you believe that the Pakistan General Elections be held in a fair manner?

 

[Loralai]

Shadow of 'engineering' hangs over Pakistan election (Al Jazeera Article)

Good article from Al Jazeera which is worth reading (https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/f...-hangs-pakistan-election-180715221809868.html)

Shadow of 'engineering' hangs over Pakistan election

16 Jul 2018

Mastung, Pakistan - Surrounded by the arid mountains of the Chiltan range, Aslam Raisani's voice rises in anger as he speaks of the political forces aligned against him.

Pakistan's general election is less than two weeks away, on July 25, and the tribal chief and political leader from the impoverished southwestern Balochistan province says he is facing a playing field tilted by an old enemy.

"There is an element of pressure going on to divert voters to the candidate that has been fielded by the establishment," he says, using a common euphemism for Pakistan's powerful military and intelligence agencies.

The military has ruled Pakistan for roughly half of its 70-year history, since independence from the British in 1947, and has been at the centre of allegations of "political engineering" before an election that would see the country's second civilian-to-civilian handover of power.

In Raisani's rural district of Mastung, he alleges that the military has intimidated voters and offered incentives to switch loyalties, from installing electricity transformers to offering to release relatives allegedly "disappeared" by the intelligence services.

Aslam Raisani, a tribal chieftain and former chief minister of Balochistan province, says the military is involved in election engineering.

Pakistan's military denies any involvement in politics, saying it supports the democratic process.

The military's press wing did not respond to Al Jazeera's request for comment on the allegations that it has influenced the political process in the run-up to the polls.

But last week, military spokesperson Asif Ghafoor held a press conference to respond to the accusations, saying the military has "no direct role" in the elections.

He said that 371,388 soldiers and paramilitary personnel would be providing security at more than 85,000 polling stations for the vote.

Last week, a suicide attack on an election rally in Mastung killed at least 149 people. It was the third such attack in the span of a week, stoking fears of a spike in violence ahead of the polls.

Raisani's brother, Siraj, a candidate for the rival party that politicians claim is backed by the "establishment", was among those killed in the Mastung explosion.

Allegations of 'engineering'
Raisani is the latest politician to allege the military is threatening candidates and voters.

Nawaz Sharif, the PML-N leader, has named the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) directly as having threatened candidates from his party to switch loyalties.

The PML-N has been foremost among those raising the allegations after Sharif was removed as prime minister over corruption claims last year. On Friday, Sharif and his daughter Maryam were arrested as they returned to Pakistan from England, having been convicted of corruption a week earlier.

Sharif's party says the charges are politically motivated, and that the military engineered his removal after pressuring the judiciary, a charge both deny.

Other parties, too, have alleged misconduct by the military in the run-up to the polls.

On Tuesday, Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP) politician Farhatullah Babar told a press conference that at least three PPP candidates had been threatened by people identifying themselves as military officers.

'Fabricated election'
In Balochistan, the Balochistan Awami Party (BAP) is suspected to be the face of the alleged engineering.

Saeed Ahmed Hashmi, the party's founder, is a diminutive man, but the 69-year-old politician from Quetta, the provincial capital, is said to have the power to bring down governments.

In March, Hashmi formed BAP, a collection of political leaders who two months earlier had overthrown the PML-N's government in the province through a no-confidence vote.

It was the third time Hashmi had been involved in the fall of a provincial government.


Aslam Raisani, right, a tribal chieftain and political leader, speaks to supporters at a meeting in Mastung [Asad Hashim/Al Jazeera]
Raisani and six other political leaders told Al Jazeera they believed BAP was a front for the military's involvement in the elections.

"They are threatening people who have votes, to vote for [BAP] candidates [or] to switch loyalties themselves," said Hasil Bizenjo, chief of the National Party (NP), listing members of his party who have received such threats.

"This is not just a pre-poll rigged election, it is a fabricated election in Balochistan," he alleged.

BAP went from inception to fielding 58 candidates across the province within weeks. Leaders of other parties say this is evidence the scales were tipped in its favour.

"Political parties don't just come about in a day, it's a struggle, it takes a long time," says Akhtar Mengal, chief of the Balochistan National Party (BNP). "To make a political party so quickly, to distribute tickets and make office bearers - cinema tickets have not been distributed as quickly as they have done this."

Mengal said that political allies were being threatened to drop the BNP and back BAP candidates, "or face the consequences".


Saeed Hashmi, the chief of the Balochistan Awami Party, says other party leaders envy his success.

Hashmi denies military backing and says his opponents are simply concerned by his party's popularity.

"Our enemies see our strength and that's why they raise these allegations," he says, adding that he formed the party to unify politicians who reject ethnic nationalism.

He says the timing of the BAP's revolt against the PML-N, as Sharif's party started openly criticising the military, was unplanned.

"The timing was coincidence," he says, smoking a cigarette. "We as a group had been looking for a long time to launch a new party."

The allegations, however, are persistent.

In Mastung, near Raisani's home, the BAP has taken over a government hospital as a campaign office, in contravention of Pakistan's electoral code.

Political leaders across the province say it is not the first time BAP candidates have used government resources.

"Right now, if you go into the bazaar, you will see a few Balochistan Awami Party banners - other than that, these people don't need to do any real work," says Jehanzeb Jamaldini, a senator and BNP leader. "They are fortunate people, a party has been made for them … the money has been arranged for them … the votes have been found for them and will even be deposited in their ballot boxes for them."

Jehanzeb Jamaldini, a BNP leader and sitting senator, claims party workers have been threatened.

Jamaldini said his party workers had been threatened in Noshki, Khuzdar, Makran and Chagai districts of Balochistan, and advised to support BAP.

Sitting in his ancestral home, Raisani is quietly confident.

"My supporters are quiet. They are going about their business," he says. "They may even go to BAP rallies, but on polling day they will vote for me."

 

[GoUgandaCranes]

Pakistani elections are always like this.

 

[the Great Khan]

The ISI is behind everything...I mean they forced Nawaz sharif to buy those Avenfield apartments and take his money outside of the country. I hear the ISI also forced Zardari and his goons to loot the nation during his tenure too. It is also alleged that the ISI with its army of social media warriors, is criticisng Dawn reporters. What we need to do is replace the ISI and the army with the awami tehreek militant group that will man our borders and allow nawaz sharif and the rest to rule for a thousand years.

I also hear the ISI has recently developed invisible stealth technology that allows them to influence law firms abroad and force them to reveal their tax dodging secrets. The ISI is truly a khala makhlooq..perhaps they are shape shifters from another world?

 

[Loralai]

HRCP: 2018 Elections 'dirtiest' in Pakistan's history

Pretty big assertion to make given the history of rigging in Pakistani politics.

 

[Slog]

1977 and 1997 say hi

 

[Mian]

I would recommend to read about 1997 and the 2/3 majority of PMLN while bibi had to sit with 17 seats only. Also read about recent 2013 and 1977 to get the idea what is dirtiest.

 

[Minnowbasher]

97, 08, 13 say asalamualaikum

 

[Minnowbasher]

97, 08, 13 say asalamualaikum

77 too

 

[Mian]

77 too

Bhutto was going to win 77 anyway but he wanted to prove a point by taking a massive lead with rigging and from there his fall started.

 

[Mamoon]

Good article from Al Jazeera which is worth reading (https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/f...-hangs-pakistan-election-180715221809868.html)

You are wasting your time with these people. When you see an ostrich with its head in the sand, you let it be.

Pre-election rigging is already in full-swing, and we all know who is behind it.

 

[DeadBall]

You are wasting your time with these people. When you see an ostrich with its head in the sand, you let it be.

Oh, the irony.

 

[Loralai]

You are wasting your time with these people. When you see an ostrich with its head in the sand, you let it be.

Pre-election rigging is already in full-swing, and we all know who is behind it.

PTI candidate who used COAS, CJP's photos on campaign posters allowed to contest polls by LHC
The Lahore High Court (LHC) on Tuesday gave permission to contest the July 25 elections to a Pakistan Tehreek-i-Insaf (PTI) candidate who had used the pictures of the chief justice of Pakistan and the army chief in his campaign advertisements and posters.

The Elec*tion Commission of ******tan (ECP) had earlier this month disqualified Nasir Cheema, a candidate from Gujranwala's PP-53 constituency, after he was found to have violated the electoral code of conduct by using photos of two heads of institutions on his election posters.

The lawyer for Cheema, who had challenged the ECP decision in the high court, informed a two-judge bench today that his client had been ruled ineligible to contest the polls over alleged violation of the ECP code of conduct.

However, he asked why the ECP had disqualified Cheema on the basis of election posters that were put up on April 18, 2018, while the code of conduct had been issued on June 14, and the election schedule was published on May 31.

The counsel also complained that the person who had filed the complaint against Cheema never personally appeared before the ECP. "The complainant also doesn't belong to the PTI candidate's constituency but is a resident of Karachi," he pointed out.

The lawyer also asked why the commission had not revealed the specific law under which the candidate was disqualified.

The LHC should therefore allow Cheema to contest the elections, he maintained.

After hearing the arguments by the lawyer and ECP legal adviser Imran Arif Ranjha, the LHC bench, comprising Justices Aminuddin Khan and Sajid Mehmood Sethi, ruled that Cheema was eligible to contest the elections.

The ECP had earlier in July quizzed Cheema over the controversial posters and asked him to submit a reply explaining as to why he should not be disallowed from contesting the polls.

“Are they related to you? What is the army chief’s and CJP’s link to the elections? On what basis did you put up their pictures?” an infuriated Chief Election Commis*sioner (CEC) Sardar Mohammad Raza Khan had asked the PTI candidate.

Before Cheema was disqualified, the CEC had emphasised that it was not a question of when the posters had been put on display, but why these images had been put up at all.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1420639/p...paign-posters-allowed-to-contest-polls-by-lhc
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=101697]LegendInzi[/MENTION]

It seems that this candidate wanted to put out into the open what we already know (that GHQ is orchestrating soft coup through PTI)

 

[Bewal Express]

https://www.dawn.com/news/1420639/p...paign-posters-allowed-to-contest-polls-by-lhc
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=101697]LegendInzi[/MENTION]

It seems that this candidate wanted to put out into the open what we already know (that GHQ is orchestrating soft coup through PTI)

Can [MENTION=142451]Mian[/MENTION] add the Zaeem Qadri statement about elections being rigged in 2013

 

[Syed1]

https://www.dawn.com/news/1420639/p...paign-posters-allowed-to-contest-polls-by-lhc
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] [MENTION=101697]LegendInzi[/MENTION]

It seems that this candidate wanted to put out into the open what we already know (that GHQ is orchestrating soft coup through PTI)

More power to GHQ.... I hope their soft coup is successful.

 

[Mian]

Can [MENTION=142451]Mian[/MENTION] add the Zaeem Qadri statement about elections being rigged in 2013

Here you go bro. If Nooras win election on 25th everything is fine otherwise it's establishment ki saazish you know

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x6owzcz" allowfullscreen allow="autoplay"></iframe>

 

[Bewal Express]

Here you go bro. If Nooras win election on 25th everything is fine otherwise it's establishment ki saazish you know

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x6owzcz" allowfullscreen allow="autoplay"></iframe>

Just for you my Noora friend [MENTION=142317]Loralai[/MENTION]

 

[Pakistanian]

I think dominant tribes/communities will rig the election which will ultimately benefit the Sharifs.

 

[Loralai]

Just for you my Noora friend [MENTION=142317]Loralai[/MENTION]

I am not a PML (N) supporter (I actually support AWP).

Also, I do not deny that the 2013 election would have been dirty. The same people who are the kingmakers now were the kingmakers then.

 

[Greenstorm]

I am not a PML (N) supporter (I actually support AWP).

Also, I do not deny that the 2013 election would have been dirty. The same people who are the kingmakers now were the kingmakers then.

Now who is this AWP ?

 

[Savak]

It was rigged in 2013. Why will it be any different now?

And lol at the Nooras who defended the 2013 elections which they rigged whole heartedly and are now blaming the GHQ for the 2018 elections.

 

[Loralai]

Now who is this AWP ?

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...ers-Party-A-new-player-in-the-political-arena

 

[Savak]

And if the GHQ is indeed launching a soft coup against the PML-N and PPP via the ballot then I salute them for once again protecting the national interest of Pakistan.

 

[LegendInzi]

I don't care what the outcome of this exercise is.

However, it's good that the civilian struggle in last few years especially from N-League and PTM has highlighted the ugly maneuverings from military to the Pakistani public as well as to the international media. Not that it will impact much in the short-run, however at least this is coming into the mainstream discussion. The puppeteers and their puppets stand naked in front of the bloody civilians.

 

[Bewal Express]

I don't care what the outcome of this exercise is.

However, it's good that the civilian struggle in last few years especially from N-League and PTM has highlighted the ugly maneuverings from military to the Pakistani public as well as to the international media. Not that it will impact much in the short-run, however at least this is coming into the mainstream discussion. The puppeteers and their puppets stand naked in front of the bloody civilians.

Or more like the corrupt are crying for AC's and better beds. And talking about naked, i see the duffers lies on open heart surgery have been exposed, you must feel that you have really been played by the duffer.

 

[Greenstorm]

I don't care what the outcome of this exercise is.

However, it's good that the civilian struggle in last few years especially from N-League and PTM has highlighted the ugly maneuverings from military to the Pakistani public as well as to the international media. Not that it will impact much in the short-run, however at least this is coming into the mainstream discussion. The puppeteers and their puppets stand naked in front of the bloody civilians.

Pak fauj Zindabad !

 

[Mian]

Fauji boots over maalshiya of House Sharif/Bhutto any day of the week!

 

[Mamoon]

Time for Pakistan’s generals to stop meddling in politics - The Economist

“Can Mr Khan really be happy? Although he and Pakistan’s army deny foul play, the match has been rigged.

The army is ensuring that the PTI enjoys privileged access to media, endorsements from powerful people and defections from rival parties. Nawaz Sharif, a three-term former prime minister, and his daughter, Maryam, were arrested as they stepped off a plane from London on July 13th.

A campaign of harassment and arrest has affected other parties’ workers far more than the PTI’s.”

__________________________

https://www.economist.com/leaders/2...kistans-generals-to-stop-meddling-in-politics

The article lacks some depth because a lot more could be said, but it does raise some pertinent points as I have highlighted above.

Also, it is very important that the military establishment and Imran Khan’s boot-licking is highlighted and exposed in international media.

Looks like the savior hasn’t been made aware of this article yet. One tweet and Insaafians will take The Economist to the cleaners like Dawn and Hameed Haroon.

Also, it is surprising to note that The Economist is in PML-N’s pocket as well. Or perhaps the international media is fearful of a Pakistan spearheaded by the great Khan and his champions of Naya Pakistan?

 

[Napa]

Nawaz Sharif, a three-term former prime minister, and his daughter, Maryam, were arrested as they stepped off a plane from London on July 13th.

Actions like this usually backfire in elections and help the candidates the public feels is being persecuted. PML-N is likely to sweep Punjab unless there is widespread rigging.

 

[KingKhanWC]

I read this article last night. I may be wrong but the journalist is Indian? We know Indians wants Nawaz to remain as he against the armed forces.

To accuse the military of bomb attacks to help IK is just typical Indian script writing, always harping on about Pakistan army supporting terrorists.

From what I've heard, nobody has mentioned India in their election speeches. India is obsessed with Pakistan.

 

[HussainRx8]

I read this article last night. I may be wrong but the journalist is Indian? We know Indians wants Nawaz to remain as he against the armed forces.

To accuse the military of bomb attacks to help IK is just typical Indian script writing, always harping on about Pakistan army supporting terrorists.

From what I've heard, nobody has mentioned India in their election speeches. India is obsessed with Pakistan.

Economist doesn't name its journalists on articles.

 

[Mamoon]

Actions like this usually backfire in elections and help the candidates the public feels is being persecuted. PML-N is likely to sweep Punjab unless there is widespread rigging.

The difference is that this time, it is Punjab vs Punjab.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Economist doesn't name its journalists on articles.

When I read it on my phone, it had a link which took me to WSJ and it was an Indian named journalist.

 

[slipcatch]

Actions like this usually backfire in elections and help the candidates the public feels is being persecuted. PML-N is likely to sweep Punjab unless there is widespread rigging.

Rest of the world is allow to put corrupt politicians behind bar but Indian want Pakistani to keep electing corrupt politician? Okay buddy

 

[IMMY69]

Rest of the world is allow to put corrupt politicians behind bar but Indian want Pakistani to keep electing corrupt politician? Okay buddy

That’s right!
If anything, on the alleged intervention of the army, people should be thanking them!!!
Am I missing something?

 

[Loralai]

They have already done enough damage to the country in the last seventy years. They have caused us more embarrassment and humiliation than can be described in words and are probably more corrupt than Nawaz Sharif and Zardari combined.

It would be better for all involved to acknowledge that they are using PTI as a vehicle for a soft coup and therefore destroying the credibility of PTI in the process.

 

[Manager101]

Time for Pakistan's Monarchs to stop meddling in Politics.

 

[Greenstorm]

Pak fauj zindabaad.

 

[Mian]

NRO and CoD was ok for western media it's just that they hate it when their pathus are not the front runners in game. I will say thank you Pak Army for not siding with the Sharifs for the first time. India and West is in tears because their assets are exposed.

 

[IMMY69]

“Can Mr Khan really be happy? Although he and Pakistan’s army deny foul play, the match has been rigged.

The army is ensuring that the PTI enjoys privileged access to media, endorsements from powerful people and defections from rival parties. Nawaz Sharif, a three-term former prime minister, and his daughter, Maryam, were arrested as they stepped off a plane from London on July 13th.

A campaign of harassment and arrest has affected other parties’ workers far more than the PTI’s.”

__________________________

https://www.economist.com/leaders/2...kistans-generals-to-stop-meddling-in-politics

The article lacks some depth because a lot more could be said, but it does raise some pertinent points as I have highlighted above.

Also, it is very important that the military establishment and Imran Khan’s boot-licking is highlighted and exposed in international media.

Looks like the savior hasn’t been made aware of this article yet. One tweet and Insaafians will take The Economist to the cleaners like Dawn and Hameed Haroon.

Also, it is surprising to note that The Economist is in PML-N’s pocket as well. Or perhaps the international media is fearful of a Pakistan spearheaded by the great Khan and his champions of Naya Pakistan?

I think it’s time now to term people like you a Traitor!

This is an extremely harsh term and I hate to use it. But frankly all your posts only show that you don’t give two hoots about the country.

Anyone who calls themselves a Pakistany and yet,

Furthers India’s propaganda

Disappears when asked simple a question regarding Shabaz Shariffs’s corruption

Disappears when asked to clarify another point, I.e billion tree tsunami...

who is prepared to back corruption, complicit by your continuos support of leaders who have raped the country.

Who would back the person who is sitting in jail for corruption. Backing proven liars...

Who backs democracy and yet still backs crooks over a party that hasn’t even tasted power.,,

Who is not willing to accept the decison of the highest judiciary.

Uses the argument about army involvement without any evidence whatsoever despite that jailed crook having been created and proped up by the army in the first place.

Coming back to democracy. You said 18 months ago that in order for democracy to prosper and hence for the country to prosper you have to let democracy takes it course and that protests should not take place. If you truly believe in this and if you take the view that the PMLN and PPP are inherently corrupt then why not vote for change? Like i’ve Said before, if the PTI fails to deliver then you get another vote in 5 years time.

I’m sorry but everything points one thing one thing only... traitor.

 

[IMMY69]

They have already done enough damage to the country in the last seventy years. They have caused us more embarrassment and humiliation than can be described in words and are probably more corrupt than Nawaz Sharif and Zardari combined.

It would be better for all involved to acknowledge that they are using PTI as a vehicle for a soft coup and therefore destroying the credibility of PTI in the process.

You could argue, and there is evidence to back this up, but weak corrupt governments propped up by the military is why we are where we are now...

So really knowing the facts that you do then surely you’ll vote for something other then the PPP and the PMLN..

Any thing else is just insane, surely?
What is the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result...

 

[Loralai]

You could argue, and there is evidence to back this up, but weak corrupt governments propped up by the military is why we are where we are now...

So really knowing the facts that you do then surely you’ll vote for something other then the PPP and the PMLN..

Any thing else is just insane, surely?
What is the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result...

I do not support either PPP, PMLN or PTI.

 

[Greenstorm]

I think it’s time now to term people like you a Traitor!

This is an extremely harsh term and I hate to use it. But frankly all your posts only show that you don’t give two hoots about the country.

Anyone who calls themselves a Pakistany and yet,

Furthers India’s propaganda

Disappears when asked simple a question regarding Shabaz Shariffs’s corruption

Disappears when asked to clarify another point, I.e billion tree tsunami...

who is prepared to back corruption, complicit by your continuos support of leaders who have raped the country.

Who would back the person who is sitting in jail for corruption. Backing proven liars...

Who backs democracy and yet still backs crooks over a party that hasn’t even tasted power.,,

Who is not willing to accept the decison of the highest judiciary.

Uses the argument about army involvement without any evidence whatsoever despite that jailed crook having been created and proped up by the army in the first place.

Coming back to democracy. You said 18 months ago that in order for democracy to prosper and hence for the country to prosper you have to let democracy takes it course and that protests should not take place. If you truly believe in this and if you take the view that the PMLN and PPP are inherently corrupt then why not vote for change? Like i’ve Said before, if the PTI fails to deliver then you get another vote in 5 years time.

I’m sorry but everything points one thing one thing only... traitor.

Calm down bro. Try to ignore such people if you can instead of wasting your time and energy.

 

[KingKhanWC]

When I read it on my phone, it had a link which took me to WSJ and it was an Indian named journalist.

Im pretty sure it's Sadanand Dhume .

If you read his twitter feed, he is hardly impartial but is supportive of NS.

 

[Bewal Express]

Im pretty sure it's Sadanand Dhume .

If you read his twitter feed, he is hardly impartial but is supportive of NS.

The Indian trolls favouring the Noora king are out in force these days, just look at the comment sections on Dawn or Tribune. Nearly every other comment is from an Ind, whereas i have never been on a single Ind site to comment on Ind Domestic politics or the size of Modis 200 inch chest

 

[Greenstorm]

The Indian trolls favouring the Noora king are out in force these days, just look at the comment sections on Dawn or Tribune. Nearly every other comment is from an Ind, whereas i have never been on a single Ind site to comment on Ind Domestic politics or the size of Modis 200 inch chest

This fact alone should tell us that Nawaz is someone's asset.

 

[enkidu_]

Indians and Westerners should stop meddling in Pak politics.

 

[Mian]

Indians and Westerners should stop meddling in Pak politics.

This!

 

[KingKhanWC]

The Indian trolls favouring the Noora king are out in force these days, just look at the comment sections on Dawn or Tribune. Nearly every other comment is from an Ind, whereas i have never been on a single Ind site to comment on Ind Domestic politics or the size of Modis 200 inch chest

Indians and Westerners should stop meddling in Pak politics.

Im beginning to wonder if NS is an asset of India? We dont know what he has told his Indian friends and it would be a big disappointment for them if he was to be gone.
[MENTION=137893]enkidu_[/MENTION] Off topic mate but what are you views on Ayub Khan, regarding this thread?

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...es-the-President-of-Pakistan-Ayub-Khan-(1966)

 

[IMMY69]

This fact alone should tell us that Nawaz is someone's asset.

You are absolutely right.
I refrained from replying or commenting to any of these people’s posts. I will have to do so again

 

[IMMY69]

I do not support either PPP, PMLN or PTI.

That’s good.

 

[Mr.Q]

Wait wait. I wanted to share a news article here. Didn’t post it as I don’t want to spoil the ongoing party. But since [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] started a thread on the issue and you guys have started calling him a traitor for doing so, I’m posting it here.

 

[Mr.Q]

IHC tells army, ISI chiefs not to intrude in other depts

ISLAMABAD: The Islamabad High Court (IHC) explicitly asked on Wednesday the army chief and the top spymaster to stop meddling in affairs of other departments.
Expressing serious concerns over the perception that a state within state existed in the country, IHC’s Justice Shaukat Aziz Siddiqui said that as such, these elements conspired to manipulate the government and the judiciary.
Justice Siddiqui directed the secretaries of the ministry of interior and defence to place the court’s order before the chief of army staff (COAS) and director-general of the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), wherein he emphasised that secret agencies need to realise that they have to confine themselves within the boundaries of the constitution.
Citing the manner in which these elements marked specific cases to different judges, Justice Siddiqui said. “Everyone knows how (court) proceedings are manipulated, from where strings are pulled, and when power (is) wielded and manoeuvred to achieve the desired results.”
Pakistan hosts spy chiefs from Russia, China, Iran
“It is a matter of great concern that even [after] benches are constituted, cases are marked to different benches on the direction of such elements.”
Persons at the helm of affairs of all institutions need to protect the hard-earned independence and take remedial steps to stop the invasion by personnel of any particular institutions or intelligence agencies, the judge observed.
He believed that it was high time to save the institution of the judiciary from all sorts of influence. “Otherwise we may not be able to answer to Almighty Allah about our authority and responsibilities, which will obviously be a big loss.”
According to him, playing the role of a silent spectator was in contradiction of the oath sworn by all judges under the Constitution.
If they (judges) fail in this regard and do nothing, the Pakistani nation and history would not remember them as good judges.
“It is expected from the top echelon of Pakistan Army that by appreciating the delicacy, sensitivity, and alarming situation, some remedial steps to stop their agencies from interfering in the affairs of other departments and to refrain from assuming roles not assigned by law shall be taken,” Justice Siddiqui’s order stated.
“Otherwise, these practices shall ruffle the people of Pakistan which, by no stretch of the imagination, is good for the prestigious institution of the Pakistan Army as well as Pakistan.”
This order was authored during the hearing of an application filed on behalf of a missing person, Rabnawaz.
Interestingly, Rabnawaz appeared before the court on Wednesday and testified that he had not been abducted by any person, but rather he had gone to Vehari of his own volition to visit his lands.
The judge noted that from his mannerism, body language and complexion, Rabnawaz appeared to be fearful and under immense pressure, therefore, his statement did not inspire confidence.
Sharifs file appeal in IHC against their conviction
Citing Rabnawaz’s brother’s contention, the judge noted that the petitioner submitted that his brother was lying and he had been abducted by personnel of the agencies and subjected to physical and mental torture.
The court also acknowledged that the petitioner actually knew that his brother was being harassed and threatened with dire consequences and told to follow the exact orders of his abductors without any deviation.
Regretting what he termed a “sorry situation”, Justice Siddiqui stated that it was a challenge to the state of Pakistan that the police appeared to be tight-lipped, “helpless and not in a position to divulge the truth.”
“Abductions of ordinary citizens…have become routine in [Islamabad], but instead of performing its statutory duty, local police comes up with a stereotypical stance that [these] persons may have disappeared on their own…such statements are always made in cases in which allegations are levelled against agencies.”
The order adds that “local police is in league with the mighty agencies who have disrupted the civic fibre of the country by establishing a state [within a] state,” the order read.
Everyone, the judge noted, needed to rise to this challenge, otherwise, Pakistan would face a crisis and disastrous situation if such practices persisted.
Kulbhushan Jadhav case: Pakistan files counter-memorial in ICJ
“The (secret) agencies are of the state of Pakistan, therefore, (they) need to realise that they have to confine themselves within the limits of the organic law – the Constitution – and the parameters of the law of the land and must stop interfering in the affairs of other institutions (such as the) judiciary, executive, media, and other departments … (who) have nothing to do with the defence and or the security of Pakistan,” he maintained.
Moreover, Justice Siddiqui stated, “It is a matter of shame that allegedly persons [working for] the ISI are involved in corrupt practices.”
The court order also noted that SP Investigation Zubair Ahmed Sheikh had miserably failed to discharge his duty and appeared to be under pressure from “a particular corner”, as he withheld truth before the court.
“Such police officers do not deserve to be on such high ranks and must not be assigned any delicate investigation…Even today, he did not answer [any of] the questions of the court based on truth and facts.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/1761157/1-ihc-tells-army-isi-chiefs-not-intrude-depts/

 

[enkidu_]

Im beginning to wonder if NS is an asset of India? We dont know what he has told his Indian friends and it would be a big disappointment for them if he was to be gone.

[MENTION=137893]enkidu_[/MENTION] Off topic mate but what are you views on Ayub Khan, regarding this thread?

http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...es-the-President-of-Pakistan-Ayub-Khan-(1966)

Yes, Nawaz Sharif is an Indian asset

 

[Mian]

Yes, Nawaz Sharif is an Indian asset

The way Indians come to defend corrupt and convicted Nawaz Sharif on social media and the way their main stream media while abusing our Army it clearly shows they are protecting their asset.

 

[Pakpak]

I think it’s time now to term people like you a Traitor!

This is an extremely harsh term and I hate to use it. But frankly all your posts only show that you don’t give two hoots about the country.

Anyone who calls themselves a Pakistany and yet,

Furthers India’s propaganda

Disappears when asked simple a question regarding Shabaz Shariffs’s corruption

Disappears when asked to clarify another point, I.e billion tree tsunami...

who is prepared to back corruption, complicit by your continuos support of leaders who have raped the country.

Who would back the person who is sitting in jail for corruption. Backing proven liars...

Who backs democracy and yet still backs crooks over a party that hasn’t even tasted power.,,

Who is not willing to accept the decison of the highest judiciary.

Uses the argument about army involvement without any evidence whatsoever despite that jailed crook having been created and proped up by the army in the first place.

Coming back to democracy. You said 18 months ago that in order for democracy to prosper and hence for the country to prosper you have to let democracy takes it course and that protests should not take place. If you truly believe in this and if you take the view that the PMLN and PPP are inherently corrupt then why not vote for change? Like i’ve Said before, if the PTI fails to deliver then you get another vote in 5 years time.

I’m sorry but everything points one thing one thing only... traitor.

I also hate using the word traitor but this guy is it. There are people who don't like PTI ie [MENTION=135038]Major[/MENTION] but the guy makes his points well and I always enjoy debating with him. Mamoon is a disgrace.

 

[Savak]

Excellent stuff from the Pakistan Army to put the economic and political security of the country first by kicking the Nooras out of office. Salute to the Pakistan Armed Forces.

 

[Mian]

Yes, Nawaz Sharif is an Indian asset

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">All 4 articles have been written/co-written by Pakistanis in Islamabad (not independent statements of US/Brit observers outside Pak).<br>All info has been provided by local correspondents, who happen to be our own people.<br>That's how all elections of Pakistan are dissected, no? <a href="https://t.co/0jQ1s8J3Mi">https://t.co/0jQ1s8J3Mi</a></p>— Mehr Tarar (@MehrTarar) <a href="https://twitter.com/MehrTarar/status/1020352528813305857?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 20, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Mamoon]

[MENTION=491]IMMY69[/MENTION]

You can call me whatever you want, and I am surprised that it took you this long to call me a traitor, after all, your leader specializes in personal attacks.

The so-called “Indian propaganda” is a self-created problem, because since 1947, we have not come to terms with the fact that Kashmir is India’s internal issue, and we have absolutely no stake in it.

The only we are poking our nose in Kashmir is because hostile relationship with India is key military dominance in Pakistan.

The end the two governments join hands is the day the Pakistan Army loses relevance and influence.

Pakistan have had an obsession with becoming India, without realizing that it will never be a threat. We simply don’t have the resources and the size to compete with them.

Pakistan is an annoying little fly that is buzzing in India’s face, and I think India is quite patient to haven’t swatted it yet.

Nawaz Sharif is not an Indian asset, and nor does India care if he stays in power. That is what we believe to make ourselves feel important.

The reason why Indian commentators and political analysts appear to be pro-Nawaz is because they understand the fact that the reason why India is far ahead of Pakistan in terms of economic growth and institutional power is because it has not allowed its military to interfere in its politics.

India has managed to upheld civil supremacy, and that is why their democracy is so strong today.

As far as corruption is concerned, it is a problem, but it is always be there. Pakistan’s biggest problem is not corruption but rather, weak democracy and military supremacy.

Corruption exists in India as well, but because institutions are strong and autonomous, accountability is not selective, and politicians do not need to polish military boots to come or stay into power.

How do you justify the disqualification of Nawaz Sharif when Zardari is walking scot-free?

How is this not selective and bias accountability, and who is the driving force behind it?

How do you expect me to acknowledge the Supreme Court verdict when the Chief Justice is dancing to the tunes of the GHQ?

If all of the above makes me a traitor, I am happy to be called one. The military has also been very successful in planting ideas into the heads of our people.

They have made India this monster that is constantly trying to spread anarchy and chaos in Pakistan, but the biggest monster in Pakistan is the Army itself, and they are responsible for the conflict between the two countries today.

 

[Mian]

How do you expect me to acknowledge the Supreme Court verdict when the Chief Justice is dancing to the tunes of the GHQ?

Another long essay but totally against your own words from past you use to blame IK for crying if verdict is in favor of Nawaz but trust me you are doing exactly same. be a man accept the verdict just like IK did in JC2015 riggign case.

However, for the sake of democracy and in respect of the constitution, we all should respect the decision of the SC.

I have full faith in the judiciary system and I hope and pray that they make an impartial decision, even if it means the end of Nawaz Sharif.

 

[Mamoon]

Excellent stuff from the Pakistan Army to put the economic and political security of the country first by kicking the Nooras out of office. Salute to the Pakistan Armed Forces.

Economic and political security?

They have created terrorist organizations and militants, they have forcefully created a conflict with India, they launched the political career of Nawaz and then discarded him when they found a new puppet in Imran, who will one day suffer the same fate as Nawaz.

Big salute indeed.

 

[Mamoon]

Another long essay but totally against your own words from past you use to blame IK for crying if verdict is in favor of Nawaz but trust me you are doing exactly same.

I didn’t expect the Supreme Court to bow down to the military.

 

[Bewal Express]

I didn’t expect the Supreme Court to bow down to the military.

So where are the receipts? Did they disappear like you did from your own thread?

 

[Mian]

I didn’t expect the Supreme Court to bow down to the military.

Sorry Mamoon but this is hypocrisy you exactly do everything you accuse IK of doing be it UTurns or Narcissism. There is no shame in admitting that you are wrong (none of us are perfect) but you instead run away from those threads/posts and start a new debate to divert attention. I admitted BRT was a blunder when you tagged me because i am not here to defend every act of PTI they are not angels (just better than the others choices we have imo).

 

[Mamoon]

So where are the receipts? Did they disappear like you did from your own thread?

It was gift from Nawaz Sharif’s father who was more than rich enough to afford property in London. It is not always easy to provide money trail for assets that you have inherited.

The judgment was weak and the corruption was never proven. However, that was not a problem because the decision to disqualify Nawaz and put him in jail was taken long before they started to consider the evidence.

 

[KingKhanWC]

The Indian trolls favouring the Noora king are out in force these days, just look at the comment sections on Dawn or Tribune. Nearly every other comment is from an Ind, whereas i have never been on a single Ind site to comment on Ind Domestic politics or the size of Modis 200 inch chest

Indians and Westerners should stop meddling in Pak politics.

[MENTION=491]IMMY69[/MENTION]

You can call me whatever you want, and I am surprised that it took you this long to call me a traitor, after all, your leader specializes in personal attacks.

The so-called “Indian propaganda” is a self-created problem, because since 1947, we have not come to terms with the fact that Kashmir is India’s internal issue, and we have absolutely no stake in it.

The only we are poking our nose in Kashmir is because hostile relationship with India is key military dominance in Pakistan.

The end the two governments join hands is the day the Pakistan Army loses relevance and influence.

Pakistan have had an obsession with becoming India, without realizing that it will never be a threat. We simply don’t have the resources and the size to compete with them.

Pakistan is an annoying little fly that is buzzing in India’s face, and I think India is quite patient to haven’t swatted it yet.

Nawaz Sharif is not an Indian asset, and nor does India care if he stays in power. That is what we believe to make ourselves feel important.

The reason why Indian commentators and political analysts appear to be pro-Nawaz is because they understand the fact that the reason why India is far ahead of Pakistan in terms of economic growth and institutional power is because it has not allowed its military to interfere in its politics.

India has managed to upheld civil supremacy, and that is why their democracy is so strong today.

As far as corruption is concerned, it is a problem, but it is always be there. Pakistan’s biggest problem is not corruption but rather, weak democracy and military supremacy.

Corruption exists in India as well, but because institutions are strong and autonomous, accountability is not selective, and politicians do not need to polish military boots to come or stay into power.

How do you justify the disqualification of Nawaz Sharif when Zardari is walking scot-free?

How is this not selective and bias accountability, and who is the driving force behind it?

How do you expect me to acknowledge the Supreme Court verdict when the Chief Justice is dancing to the tunes of the GHQ?

If all of the above makes me a traitor, I am happy to be called one. The military has also been very successful in planting ideas into the heads of our people.

They have made India this monster that is constantly trying to spread anarchy and chaos in Pakistan, but the biggest monster in Pakistan is the Army itself, and they are responsible for the conflict between the two countries today.

1. You do realise India claims all of Kashmir? If they can swat Pakistan away why haven't they taken back their land (Azad Kashmir)?

2. The Kashmiris under Indian control call India a monster, are they wrong?

 

[waqar goraya]

It was gift from Nawaz Sharif’s father who was more than rich enough to afford property in London. It is not always easy to provide money trail for assets that you have inherited.

The judgment was weak and the corruption was never proven. However, that was not a problem because the decision to disqualify Nawaz and put him in jail was taken long before they started to consider the evidence.

I won't write an essay here. But

Why don't they provide sale deed to court then? There must be some record of these properties? At least the document that establishes the gift element?

Why did Hasan say in his interview that these are on rent?

Why Maryam claimed in her interview that neither she nor his family owns London properties?

Why Maryam submitted forged documents?

If this was a gift to grandchildren then why did they submitted Qatari letters? without any legal decorum?

So, they had nothing to hide yet they lied in media, assembly and then in court.

Stop this farce now.

 

[waqar goraya]

Actions like this usually backfire in elections and help the candidates the public feels is being persecuted. PML-N is likely to sweep Punjab unless there is widespread rigging.

Maybe Indian part of Punjab. He seems more popular in India than Pakistan.

 

[DeadBall]

It was gift from Nawaz Sharif’s father who was more than rich enough to afford property in London. It is not always easy to provide money trail for assets that you have inherited.

You're talking like he bought the daily groceries and lost the receipt. However you do unintentionally make me laugh though.

 

[Mian]

Maybe Indian part of Punjab. He seems more popular in India than Pakistan.

Hilarious these Indians like [MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] are telling us the local Punjabis here about the current popularity of PMLN in Punjab ) It's like me commenting on Tamil Nadu politics

 

[Mian]

You're talking like he bought the daily groceries and lost the receipt. However you do unintentionally make me laugh though.

Mamoon was a decent poster once and talked with facts but now he is just like those people finding saazish behind everything. I truly believe his dislike for IK (he mentioned multiple times) is the reason he is trying to side with anyone who oppose IK or PTI be it criminals, corrupt politicians, convicts, indians or the africans

 

[Bewal Express]

It was gift from Nawaz Sharif’s father who was more than rich enough to afford property in London. It is not always easy to provide money trail for assets that you have inherited.

The judgment was weak and the corruption was never proven. However, that was not a problem because the decision to disqualify Nawaz and put him in jail was taken long before they started to consider the evidence.

I bet you didnt even have a straight face or should i say a clean heart when you wrote those words "it was gift". You were always a guy that enjoyed i debating with, even though i have always disagreed but debating with you now is akin to clubbing a baby seal- no contest. You have respect anymore!

 

[Napa]

I read this article last night. I may be wrong but the journalist is Indian?

You are making us stuff. This is just another example of your paranoia about India. The article by Dhume appeared in the WSJ, the Economist article is different.

Believing that India is responsible for all of Pakistan's problems is the surest way of keeping Pakistan backward.

 

[waqar goraya]

Some battles can't be won. Mamoon

 

[Napa]

Hilarious these Indians like [MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] are telling us the local Punjabis here about the current popularity of PMLN in Punjab ) It's like me commenting on Tamil Nadu politics

I just follow the polls:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_Pakistani_general_election,_2018#Punjab

If you have polls about Tamil Nadu, of course I would also consider them.

 

[IMMY69]

It was gift from Nawaz Sharif’s father who was more than rich enough to afford property in London. It is not always easy to provide money trail for assets that you have inherited.

The judgment was weak and the corruption was never proven. However, that was not a problem because the decision to disqualify Nawaz and put him in jail was taken long before they started to consider the evidence.

Why do you remain in denial and continue to spout rubbish?

A rich millionaire steel baron who didn’t keep paperwork is unbelievable. There are records such as bank accounts, title deeds, loan agreements, tax returns etc etc etc that can and should be available, going back decades.

Then, as others have already mentioned, the lies from father, sons and daughter but yet you still think it’s some deep state military PTI conspiracy!!

What are you smoking?

 

[Bewal Express]

I bet you didnt even have a straight face or should i say a clean heart when you wrote those words "it was gift". You were always a guy that enjoyed i debating with, even though i have always disagreed but debating with you now is akin to clubbing a baby seal- no contest. You have respect anymore!

It should say you have no respect anymore. When you get to my age you make these mistakes when you have to make small talk about how her day went

 

[Bewal Express]

Why do you remain in denial and continue to spout rubbish?

A rich millionaire steel baron who didn’t keep paperwork is unbelievable. There are records such as bank accounts, title deeds, loan agreements, tax returns etc etc etc that can and should be available, going back decades.

Then, as others have already mentioned, the lies from father, sons and daughter but yet you still think it’s some deep state military PTI conspiracy!!

What are you smoking?

Whatever it is, it doesnt give you a moral compass.

 

[enkidu_]

The so-called “Indian propaganda” is a self-created problem, because since 1947, we have not come to terms with the fact that Kashmir is India’s internal issue, and we have absolutely no stake in it.

So why India talks of "Pakistan occupied Kashmir", and not "Pakistan occupied Punjab", for instance ? Because it considers AJK & GB to be its own.

As for "Kashmir being India's internal issue", guess who disagrees with you, apart from international organizations ? A certain Modi and his govt

Kashmir a bilateral issue with Pakistan, India tells Turkish President Erdogan

https://www.hindustantimes.com/indi...ent-erdogan/story-cgV9TTPgrbIQwBnOYfFjYJ.html

The only we are poking our nose in Kashmir is because hostile relationship with India is key military dominance in Pakistan.

The military dominance is due to the anthropology of the largest province, Punjab, where the biraderi system was used by the British to control that area, by giving incentives to the landowners while equating social mobility with a career in the army. Being a supporter of PML-N and having an army tradition not only is not contradictory, but complementary.

Let me digress a bit on my own modest personal life : my own family is a good case, being both into the military and campaigning for PML-N in the local politics of AJK (the Raja Razzaq guy in the following link is my mother's cousin : https://tribune.com.pk/story/207281/ajk-elections-re-polling-in-mirpur-la-6-underway/) My father is also fanatic Noora (apart from this family matter, his longest business partner is an acquaintance of Khwaja Asif back in Sialkot), even if I do not feel obliged to follow him or others in praising crooks.

It's the same with many big names in PML-N, those from north Punjab. Why do you think that Chaudhry Nisar Ali Khan, who's brother is a general I think, said that "those who advised Nawaz to criticize the Army did a bad job for him", in a recent jalsa ?

The Sharif's, being from business family from the Valley, are just outliers, but PML-N just CANNOT do without the Army. It's in its political DNA. That's like asking PPP to do without the waderas in Sindh.

And do you want a breaking news ? You can be for fighting corruption in BOTH the political parties AND the Army.

The end the two governments join hands is the day the Pakistan Army loses relevance and influence.

Yeah and you'll see Hindu influence spread and hordes of baniya who will control your economy like they did pre-Partition. You'll live like a Dalit/Adivasi.

Pakistan have had an obsession with becoming India, without realizing that it will never be a threat. We simply don’t have the resources and the size to compete with them.

Pakistan is an annoying little fly that is buzzing in India’s face, and I think India is quite patient to haven’t swatted it yet.

So Pakistan has an obsession of becoming India despite embracing the two nation theory ? How does you re-conciliate the TNT with that ? And what's cool in Indians that we would love to be like them ? Aren't there other economic models in the world ? Like Turkey or Malaysia that Showbaz Sharif keep referring to ?

Nawaz Sharif is not an Indian asset, and nor does India care if he stays in power. That is what we believe to make ourselves feel important.

The reason why Indian commentators and political analysts appear to be pro-Nawaz is because they understand the fact that the reason why India is far ahead of Pakistan in terms of economic growth and institutional power is because it has not allowed its military to interfere in its politics.

Nawaz Sharif is totally an Indian asset.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/zpRsjRPyjzg" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

And I'm not sure you genuinely believe that Indians want to see economic growth for Pak.

India has managed to upheld civil supremacy, and that is why their democracy is so strong today.

As far as corruption is concerned, it is a problem, but it is always be there. Pakistan’s biggest problem is not corruption but rather, weak democracy and military supremacy.

Corruption exists in India as well, but because institutions are strong and autonomous, accountability is not selective, and politicians do not need to polish military boots to come or stay into power.

Like Pak's military dominance India has its own problems with the caste system. Dalits/Adivasis (25% of the pop) are under-represented in every sphere of life in India because the upper castes, who yes are not into the "military" mood, but still uphold a supremacy.

Compare the economic rise of India with that of China, same population, went from more or less the same position as victims of Western imperialism, but Mao Zedong destroyed traditional China to uplift 100s of millions out of poverty, while India's Congress hid the caste system behind slogans of "secularism, democracy, etc". The rising Hindu nationalism is a revenge on this farce in a way.

How do you justify the disqualification of Nawaz Sharif when Zardari is walking scot-free?

How is this not selective and bias accountability, and who is the driving force behind it?

He'll get in jail as well, hopefully both will share the same room.

How do you expect me to acknowledge the Supreme Court verdict when the Chief Justice is dancing to the tunes of the GHQ?

Speculations.

 

[KingKhanWC]

You are making us stuff. This is just another example of your paranoia about India. The article by Dhume appeared in the WSJ, the Economist article is different.

Believing that India is responsible for all of Pakistan's problems is the surest way of keeping Pakistan backward.

Who is the writer of this article? I said I might be wrong and if in India this means a person is lying then Jai Hind.